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Erin Burnett Outfront
New Search for AirAsia Plane About to Begin; Seven-Year-Old Sole Survivor of Plane Crash Returns Home; Interview with Senator Rand Paul of Kentucky
Aired January 06, 2015 - 19:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
ERIN BURNETT, CNN HOST: OUTFRONT tonight, breaking news, a new search for AirAsia flight 8501 getting underway at this moment. We're learning the crew never picked up the official weather report before taking off into a severe thunderstorm. This report, was it a fatal mistake.
Plus, the miraculous story of a 7-year-old who was the only one to walk away from a plane crash. We'll hear tonight from another sole survivor whose commercial jet flew into a mountain, she cheated death.
And a time capsule buried by Paul Revere. No joke. Its contents revealed today after 220 years. We're just finding them out at this moment. We'll tell what was inside. Let's go OUTFRONT.
Good evening. I'm Erin Burnett. OUTFRONT tonight, the breaking news. A new search for AirAsia flight 8501 about to start as we're learning new details of a possible mistakes right before takeoff. We are learning tonight that the crew failed to pick up copies of the weather report. This weather report here, complete with the pictures and all of the details of the storms. And passed on an opportunity for a face-to-face briefing by government meteorologists just before taking off into a deadly double cell thunderstorm. Now this is according to Indonesian officials.
This is dozens of ships and aircraft picked up the search for bodies and the plane's fuselage, among the findings, rows of seats still attached. The USS Fort Worth is using sonar detective, two metal objects that maybe parts of the plane. While 97 drivers were in the search zone, none at this time have been unable to follow up under water because of high seas and start up mud in the bottom resulting in near zero visibility, despite the fact that it is not that deep.
One hundred twenty-three people are still missing from flight 8501. Thirty nine bodies are now recovered. And one theory people are talking about is the large pieces of debris, as well as the bodies that have been found intact. That indicates to some that the plane probably descended horizontally when it crashed into the sea. What could that mean?
Paul Hancocks is OUTFRONT tonight in -- Indonesia. And Paula, we now know sonar has picked up two very large objects, divers haven't been able to confirm that. What more do you know now?
PAUL HANCOCKS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Erin, we know of those large metallic object, the larger of the two is 56 by 13 feet so quite a significant size. But of course what they want to do at this point, the USS Fort Worth has detected them, is to get under the water and see exactly what they are. And the hope is today the weather will be better. Certainly we understand it will be. But of course it is the underwater currents that are important. Will they be able to get divers into the water which they weren't able to on Tuesday? Will they be able to get the submersibles down to be able to find out exactly what these objects are?
Now of course, they will be cautious until they know whether or not they are related to this plane. Remember, just a couple of days ago, one of the large pieces of debris that they found, they announced was actually part of a ship wreck. So it is not just a plane that is down there at the bottom of the Java Sea. At this point, they have to be very careful because obviously there is a lot of other things that could be mixed up with this. But certainly there is hope that this could be a break-through that they have been looking for. The side scan sonar from the U.S. picked it up on Tuesday and certainly that is going to be one of the main priorities today, to find out exactly what these two metallic objects are -- Erin.
BURNETT: Paula, thank you very much.
HANCOCKS: And tonight we're also learning new information about the weather report. All right. I've got it here. Here are the details that are provided, it also has maps as can you see and then all of the details of the pressure and all of the locations as you can see, about nine or ten pages. This report was not picked up by the pilots of AirAsia flight 8501. Now, we have been told that the report may have been e-mailed to pilots though. So the airline is saying something a little bit different than we are hearing from the Indonesian government. The eight pages include a satellite image, showing the storms and wind speed and direction as well.
And Kyung Lah is OUTFRONT now in Jakarta. Kyung, the information about this weather report, it seems to be another example of potential series of missteps that were taken by AirAsia.
KYUNG LAH, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Missteps by AirAsia also and more importantly here, suggests that there may be real cracks, real problems with the entire infrastructure of Indonesia's aviation system. There have been questions race about the rules here, how lax are they, does anyone follow them. So, a lot of internal discussion about the overall safety of planes landing and taking off from this country. While this discussion is happening here. The investigation, trying to find pieces of the plane, well we got an inside look at the hub running the search and rescue effort.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
LAH (voice-over): The nerve center and the intense search for AirAsia 8501. Eighteen aircraft, 38 ships in the Java Sea and real-time reporting into the command control center.
(SPEAKING FOREIGN LANGUAGE)
Moments after we walked in --
(on camera): What is happening?
UNIDENTIFIED MAN: We have another two bodies.
LAH: The plane just spotted two bodies.
(voice-over): Two more bodies says Bambang Soelistyo but he won't know for sure until the ship reached the coordinates and picks them up. Soelistyo is the head of the Indonesia Search and Rescue, the public face in the recovery. The man calling the shots, a life-long military officer trained for restraint and completing the mission.
(on camera): You want to find these bodies for the family?
BAMBANG SOELISTYO, INDONESIA SEARCH AND RESCUE: Yes. As much as possible.
LAH (voice-over): What is possible is becoming more challenging, as the search stretches into double-digit days. Indonesia expanded the search zone further east. Officials at the Command Control Center believe many passengers will likely be found on the sea floor still inside the plane. One clue for that theory, search teams already found three passengers all from one row still strapped to their seat belts. But others are drifting. A personal nightmare for the man charged with bringing them home.
(on camera): You are sleeping here?
UNIDENTIFIED MAN: Yes.
LAH: You are eating here?
UNIDENTIFIED MAN: Yes.
LAH: You have not left here. Why?
UNIDENTIFIED MAN: I can't. Because of the responsibility and the situation and I am an officer and I'm a pilot.
LAH (voice-over): The ship radios back. It has the bodies.
(on camera): Do you think you will find all of the bodies?
UNIDENTIFIED MAN: I'm not sure. But I'll try.
LAH (voice-over): Two more returning. More than 100 still lost at sea.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
LAH: So the main strategy here that we are hearing from the headquarters is to try to find those large sections of the plane. They think that many of those passengers may still be strapped to those seats. As we said, Erin, but also they are hoping that they will be able to find a black box in those large sections of the tail -- Erin.
BURNETT: All right, Kyung. Thank you very much.
And out now, we have our aviation analyst Miles O'Brien and Richard Quest, along with our safety analyst David Soucie, author of the upcoming book "Malaysia Airlines Flight 370: Why It Disappeared and Why it's Only a Matter of Time Before it Happens Again."
All right, Miles, the Indonesian is saying AirAsia pilots didn't pick up this weather report that I'm holding here, the airlines say the pilots got some documents though about the weather via e-mail. So, how do we know who is telling the truth and whether the pilots actually were aware of and fully understood the weather situation?
MILES O'BRIEN, CNN AVIATION ANALYST: It is hard to imagine a 20,000 hour captain not checking the weather before he begins an airline flight. That would be really beyond the pale. It is hard to imagine. But let's assume that that happens just hypothetically. I've looked at that weather report, and by the way, it speaks for itself, whether there is somebody communicating it to you, you read it, it is all very clear what is there. There is nothing in there that says to the pilot or anybody who knows about aviation that you shouldn't fly. It is perfectly safe to take off given what is in that report in the context of the time and the location.
So really, when you look at the accident, the thing to look at is the decision-making in the air, 40 minutes later. The thing we do have to think about here is, if the airline was cutting corners on the rules, what does that say about the culture of the airline, what does that say about maintenance, what is that say about any number of other things you might be concerned about.
BURNETT: Right. And when we talk about cutting corners, of course, we do know that this plane was flying on a day it was not even authorized to fly. Richard, here is the question, as Miles points out, when you look at the weather report, people were flying, there were other people flying. We've looked at this. Thirty two thousand feet was where this plane was flying. There were at least five other planes that were affected by the storm. One of them an emirates flight as you pointed out on its way from Melbourne Australia to Malaysia over to Dubai. Those five planes obviously all got to their destination safety. So does this suggest to you that it was pilot error?
RICHARD QUEST, CNN AVIATION CORRESPONDENT: Well, I'm not going to go there. I'm absolutely not going down that road until we know a lot more about it. What it suggests is -- an incident happened, that the flight deck couldn't cope with. Now that is obvious. The plane fell out of the air.
BURNETT: Whether it is mechanical or lack of training or something, we just don't know.
QUEST: Right. We don't know that area. I've looked at the weather report and again it doesn't matter whether you get it face-to-face, you know, they knew what the weather was. And anyway, there is a weather radar on the aircraft. He can see x number of miles ahead of what the weather is going to be like. I think what will be crucial in this investigation is the relationship between Indonesia, AirAsia and the parent company AirAsia in Malaysia. As I've said before, you know, it's an extremely reputable well run main line airline based out of key out. Now, whether Indonesia AirAsia was sort of not as tight on certain things as it should have been -- because the really significant point is running a plane when you haven't got permission.
BURNETT: And that does that show on some level, a corner was being cut by somebody somewhere. Not the particular pilots or this plane, but somebody at that airline. David, when you look at the new pictures of the debris, we are seeing rows of seats. And I was just talking a moment ago about some are talking about how important this could be. The man in charge with the French investigation into the air French crash which went down of course over a very serious set of thunderstorms off the coast of Brazil told NBC that the impact was probably in his words, quote, "not very violent and that the jet was probably a horizontal position when it crashed."
We are showing everyone the seats. Again this is hard to look at, but I think it is important to make the point about how this might have landed. David, do you have a sense as to whether that is true? His words, not very violent and probably horizontal?
DAVID SOUCIE, CNN SAFETY ANALYST: I don't know if I would go that far because there is no way to figure out what happened on the aircraft from one set of seats. But if you look at the structure underneath the seat, that is where it is extremely telling because it will tell you whether it was a straight impact straight down or whether if the seat is crooked, it's going forward or forward impact. There is a lot of information that can be gained from the structure of the seat, how it was attached, if the pins that hold the seat into the rail were ruptured and that will tell you whether it went forward, whether it went back. When you talk about landing in a horizontal position, Air France did that as well.
But what happened there is that it landed on the back of the aircraft and most of the impact was absorbed by the back of the aircraft. So throughout the aircraft, not knowing where these seats came from, whether it was from the back or the front.
BURNETT: You can't tell.
SOUCIE: It could be significantly different from the back to the front.
BURNETT: Richard.
QUEST: When we hear this phrase not very violent, I think what he's talking about is, it didn't blow up in the sky, it didn't sort of fall from the air.
BURNETT: Because it creates the possibility those words that maybe it landed and they weren't in pain and they had a chance to survive. I mean, that is what you think as a human being. QUEST: I suspected that, you know, there is a tons of issue in terms
of that. I think what you are looking at is a sort of hitting of the water, if you look at the compression area, if you look at the way the seats and the bending of the --
BURNETT: So they slammed down.
QUEST: It is similar to what I think. I don't think anybody disagrees to 447.
BURNETT: Very quickly Miles.
O'BRIEN: I think somebody must be lost in the translation. Not very violent. That what's the stupidest things I've ever heard. This is an airplane that was flying in terms of velocity, probably in a flat spin, the smack into the water, to say that's not very violent, why doesn't he try it.
BURNETT: All right. Thanks very much to all of you. Point clearly made. OUTFRONT next, 7-year-old Sailor Gutzler's remarkable survival skills, she walked away from a crash which her whole family died. What gave her the strength to survive?
And another sole survivor of a plane crash, this woman survived eight days in the jungle, multiple broken bones. Her amazing story, OUTFRONT next.
And police tonight warned to be on alert for gang members targeting officers as two more New York City officers are shot chasing down a suspect in an armed robbery. This is all caught on tape. We'll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BURNETT: The miracle sole survivor, tonight 7-year-old Sailor Gutzler is with family in her home town of Nashville, Illinois. Funerals preparations are under way for her parents, her sister and her cousin, who were all killed in a plane crash in Kentucky. How did Sailor survive the crash and that long trek to safety? George Howell begins our coverage tonight OUTFRONT in Nashville.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
GEORGE HOWELL, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): As this small town prepares to bury one of her own families, the grief that many feel here is only surpassed by a great sense of responsibility to take care of one 7-year-old survivor.
MICHAEL BRINK, NASHVILLE SUPERINTENDENT OF SCHOOL: Obviously from the story, what has happened with her coming out of that wreckage and in the spirit that she has, it is just unbelievable. The resiliency that she showed and the determination and the courage most adults don't have that.
HOWELL: Michael Brink is the superintendent of the school that sisters Sailor and Piper Gutzler attended and he knew the family well. BRINK: Simply put. One of the nicest families I've ever met. You
know, pillars of the community. Everybody knew Marty and Kim, everybody loved them.
HOWELL: He last saw the girls in school just before Christmas break. And then this past Friday, the small plane carrying Marty, Kimberly, Piper, Sailor and their cousin Sierra Wilder crashed in Kentucky killing everyone in the family except for Sailor.
BRINK: You just think about Sailor walking away from that bare foot, in shorts, through freezing weather, you know, walking close to a mile, it's just unbelievable.
HOWELL: What she saw and what she went through is a story that only she can tell best when she's ready. But like Sailor, AC Morgan survived a crash when the plane he was on went down due to engine trouble. He and one other person survived. He can relate to what she went through.
AC MORGAN, PLANE CRASH SURVIVOR: As far as how is that done, physically it's impossible, It is 100 percent internal and I'm sure Sailor had that same experience.
HOWELL: Moving forward, people in Nashville know the road ahead will be challenging for all. For Sailor, without her family and for this school superintendent who expects to someday see Sailor back in school but without her sister at her side.
BRINK: What I of Sailor, I think of Piper. They were always together. And that's a very hard reality to accept. But that is something that we are going to have to prepare for and, again, we will rally around Sailor.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
HOWELL: And can you imagine how difficult it must be to explain what happened here to many of the school children at that school. We do understand that the superintendent will have grief counselors on hand next week for children there and this community does plan for a funeral. And several funerals. We know that Sierra Wilder's funeral services are set for tomorrow and Sailor's mother, father and sister, those services are set for Friday -- Erin.
BURNETT: George, thank you.
When a Vietnam airlines commercial jet with 31 on board crashed into a mountain, only one person survived in 1992. Not only was she was seriously injured, broken legs, a collapsed lung among other injuries, and she managed to survive eight days in the jungle until she was rescued. She wrote a book about the ordeal, called "Turbulence: A Survival Story."
And Annette is OUTFRONT. Annette, you know, I saw you putting your hand on your heart when you hear about Sailor, her sister and what has happened to her life. In your situation, your life changed also from what you expected. You were with your fiance on that plane, you're in a romantic getaway when that plane crashed. What happened?
ANNETTE HERFKENS, SOLE SURVIVOR IN 1992 VIETNAM AIRLINES PLANE CRASH: We were going to a beach resort in Nha Trang, my fiance set up to two branches ING Bank, I was also a business banker in Spain and we went for three days and when I saw the size of the plane, actually I didn't want to get in because I was claustrophobic. He convinced me to go in, he said it was only 20 minutes and he lied to me and it was 55 minutes.
And so, I was so really very nervous about the flight already and in the 50th minute, the plane began to drop. People screaming. I didn't think much of it, because it was a little plane like that will feel with such -- to feel such drop. And then he was scared. We kept on flying another giant drop. He grabbed for my hand, I grabbed for his. And everything went black.
BURNETT: And so you were holding his hand and then it just -- do you remember the impact? Or then all of a sudden, what is your next memory? And obviously that bang was flying into the mountain.
HERFKENS: Yes. And what happened is that the plane lost a wing and kept on flying and bump into the other mountain. I was unconscious then and I woke up. The airplane has broken in two and the fuselage continued downward and I was stuck under seat with a dead person as it turned out. At my left, I saw my fiance and he was dead. I could see he was dead.
BURNETT: And then you went into shock and then you managed somehow in that shock and that unconscious state to get off the plane?
HERFKENS: Somehow, I must have done it. I was severely injured but it must have been mind over matter but I don't remember now. Next memories, I'm out on the jungle floor with a few more people out and the most of the fuselage was behind me with dead people inside and people were moaning. And next to me there was also a Vietnamese man speaking in English even, mostly about when the rescuers would come.
BURNETT: But when they came, in eight days, you were gathering water I guess and some -- found some way to gather water?
HERFKENS: The other day he died and I stayed next to him at first and mark the hours on his watch and then I moved away from him and I made a plan to collect rain water.
BURNETT: And so do you know what it was that made you able to survive? I mean, your lung was injured, you couldn't walk, your legs were broken, your arm, your hip, your jaw. I mean, you were severely injured.
HERFKENS: Yes. What I did, I was controlling my mind in order to listen to my heart. That's what I did. I listened to my instinct. I did not get emotional but nor did I let my mind run off in scenarios. I just focused on what is right in front of me and I did what I had to be done.
BURNETT: And were you grieving for your fiance at that time? HERFKENS: Well, at the time like this what was the one thing I
suppressed. I told every time I thought of him, I had to stop thinking of it, otherwise I would start crying and it would make me more thirsty and weaker. So I forced myself not to think of him and I forced myself to look at the beauty of the jungle and that is what in the end got me through. I have totally focused on the beauty of the leaves, of the sun, and the rain and the canopy.
BURNETT: I mean, and it was such a tragedy and yet your life did move on. You have a daughter, who would not be your daughter, have that not happened. And you flew over the crash site with her on that airline and showed that to her. Your life changed and you somehow made it a beautiful thing. What would you tell Sailor?
HERFKENS: More than anything, I would ask the people around Sailor, I hope she has a loving family of course first, but also not to treat her -- she did something extraordinary but not to treat her like someone who is extraordinary because for her, everything has changed and that is horrible enough as it is and you want everything else to stay the same as much as possible and then people treat you like you are --
BURNETT: Different.
HERFKENS: She does something extraordinary, but she doesn't want to be treated like someone extraordinary, she wants to be treated the same. Because you don't know when you do something extraordinary. For you, and when you come back it will put excess stress on her. She wants everyone to treat her normal.
BURNETT: Well, Annette, thank you so much for sharing your story.
HERFKENS: Thank you for having me.
BURNETT: And I want to bring in Ron Nielson, a former airline captain who runs a program for people who have a fear of flying and those who suffer traumatic events in the air. Captain Ron, you just heard in that story. And I know one of the reasons and we didn't get to talk about it right now, but one of the reasons Annette have thought perhaps that she survived, was she actually did not have her seat belt on. And in the small planes people are claustrophobic, what is your reaction to that? Is that possible that something like that could help?
CAPT. RON NIELSON, FORMER AIRLINE PILOT: Absolutely. The thing that we're talking about, Erin, is extreme forces in a crash that -- and that was experienced there. So I'm certainly not going to try to convince her that the safest way to travel is with your seat belt but the odds are with you and I would hope that people don't get the message, that you know, okay, if I'm in a traumatic crash that I'll undo my seat belt. You are still better if you are securely fastened in the airplane. And routinely, you know, the odds of crashing at all are very, very slow -- small. So most people get hurt in turbulence because they didn't have seat belts fastened.
BURNETT: Right. And obviously seat belts are for turbulence. I mean, it's not designed to really deal with the crash any way. Sailor was very small. Annette obviously is also a very, you know, a thin person. Does size matter possibly do you think, for Sailor?
NIELSON: Again, it is so difficult to tell, Erin. But, you know, the one thing you can say about both of them, they were in what I would call a cocoon from which their survival happened. You know? And again, no one could predict that before the crash in either case. And they were just in the right place at the right time. And everything worked for them.
BURNETT: I guess perhaps, you know, maybe being sheltered by the seat in Annette's case or, you know, who knows what is it that might protected your body from death. Thank you very much, Captain.
And OUTFRONT next, police on alert. A new warning that gang members may be targeting officers as more violence strikes New York City police. Two officers were shot during a holdup.
And Britain's Prince Andrew named in a suit with allegations of underage prostitution. Fergie his ex, standing by him tonight. Ahead, a full report.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
ERIN BURNETT, CNN ANCHOR: Breaking news, there has been a shooting at an El Paso, Texas, V.A. clinic.
Details are sketchy at this moment. Here's what we know though: multiple law enforcement officials are telling us that two people were wounded as the facility was in lockdown for hours. Now, the extent of the injuries this time we don't know. But the shooter then reportedly turned the gun on himself. We don't know whether he successfully killed himself or was injured.
We're going to have more on this story, though. We are awaiting a press conference that could begin at any time. As that happens, of course, we're going to update you on everything we are able to find out on this developing breaking story.
All right. Our other breaking news is authorities in Baltimore are warning police to be on alert of possible attacks after a gang member allegedly brought a loaded handgun into a police station. That warning comes after another two New York City police officers were shot overnight. Three men, after a manhunt, are now in custody after that.
And we are learning new details about the moments that lead up to that shooting. Police say that the surveillance video that I'm going to show you right now shows a gunman robbing a grocery store, as you see, but just before he allegedly opened fire, injuring these two officers.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
OFFICER: Shots fire, 187 Tiebout, 187 Tiebout, white Chevy Camarro going northbound. Shots fired. Shots fired.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: Miguel Marquez is OUTFRONT.
Miguel, what more are you learning about the shooting and officer's condition?
MIGUEL MARQUEZ, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, the officers are doing OK. One of them was shot in the arm and the chest, the other in the arm and the back and they are in stable condition, they're expected to make a full recovery, luckily enough.
One of the questions is whether or not they were wearing their protective vests because they were off duty when they responded to this thing. The chief of police here, the police commissioner here in New York talked about where exactly these police officers were when they heard about this robbery in progress.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
WILLIAM BRATTON, NYPD COMMISSIONER: Those officers last evening were ending their tour of duty, and were in fact beginning to change out of their clothes when the call came in about a robbery and they immediately, all five ran out of the station and got into a police vehicle and began to canvass the area in the vicinity of the robbery location.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MARQUEZ: Now, the officer got off three shots, one of the individuals was hit in the leg. He later checked into a hospital with some bogus claim. Police were able to get on to him very quickly and his claim unraveled. He led them to somebody else who led them to the third person.
So, three people were picked up, two arrested, the other one remains in custody. But very, very important to note, though, this was not a targeted killing. These were offered who were getting off work, heard about a robbery and then responded -- Erin.
BURNETT: All right. Miguel, thank you so much.
And OUTFRONT tonight, Republican Senator Rand Paul.
Senator, thank you so much for being with us.
Police across the country on a state alert. As you hear, two more New York City police officers have been shot.
After the shooting death of an unarmed black man in Ferguson, Missouri, you were the only 2016 hopeful to meet with black leaders in Ferguson. You were lauded for doing so by the NAACP. You have criticized the, quote, "militarization" in our law enforcement and you wrote that there is -- again, quoting you, "a systemic problem with our law enforcement."
Are you concerned that statements like that may now be being used by people to justify shooting and killing police?
SEN. RAND PAUL (R), KENTUCKY: Well, you know, there is absolutely no justification for killing our police. My heart goes out to their families. I think that our police do by enlarge an excellent job. They are like the rest of the public -- 98 percent, 99 percent are doing a great job. They are out every day risking their lives.
And so, I think there are just separate issues. I do think that there is an unease in our country, though. The violent people are an aberration. The violent people killing cops and things like that, which is awful, that's an aberration. But there's a lot of also just peaceful people out there that are -- they feel unhappy and feel like that justice is not color blind.
You know, Martin Luther King talked about there being two Americas. There are still people who feel like they are poor, they are unemployed and that they -- everywhere they turn, there is a civil fine for this or for that.
In fact, I said repeatedly in New York, I blame the politicians. So, the same way the police are unhappy with de Blasio, I'm unhappy with de Blasio also because he was the one telling the police to get involved with people selling cigarettes that were not taxed properly.
BURNETT: And let me ask you this, when you talk about being unhappy with the politicians, including Mayor de Blasio, of course, the mayor of New York, the biggest city in this nation. There is a tremendous amount of tension between him and his police force, which is also the largest force in this country. Officers turned their backs on the mayor when he attended the funerals for the two officers that were killed in December, and an unprecedented act, even though they were asked not to do so, they felt so passionately, they did it anyway.
And this tension traces back to a very specific remark by the mayor, speaking about his son who is biracial. Here's Mayor de Blasio.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MAYOR BILL DE BLASIO (D), NEW YORK: We have had to literally train him as families have all over this city for decades and how to take special care in any encounter he has with the police officers who are there to protect him.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: And no doubt he spoke from the heart as a father. But you are a possible presidential candidate, a leader in America. Is the mayor of New York showing proper leadership by talking like that?
PAUL: I think he mistakes cause and effect here. I've said over and over again that there is a racial outcome to the war on drugs. But I've also said over and over again, I don't think the police are targeting black kids. What I say is that the war on drugs has led the over-enforcement in certain communities.
So, far example, white kids are using illegal drugs, so are black kids. I don't think the police said, oh, let's go arrest black kids. I think because of where people live and where crime occurs, that there had been a disproportionate amount of black kids arrested.
So, I understand the sentiment of people in the African-American community who feel like justice is not color blind. But I don't blame the police officer for saying, oh, the police officers are targeting them. I blame the politicians for writing these laws such that we've gone overboard with nonviolent crime.
BURNETT: And today, Senator, is the first day of the 114th Congress, your party, GOP, now has control in both houses in Capitol, for the first time in nearly a decade, it's a big moment. John Boehner just got elected to speaker for the third time. He did have a lot of opposition, though. Twice as much as last time. You even received a vote, even though you are not in the House.
And my question for you, obviously, he is an important leader for your party. Is he the right choice?
PAUL: It's not really my job to choose the speaker of the House, although, you know, you realize by getting one vote, I was only 217 votes short of being the speaker of the House. And so, that is an interesting wrinkle.
But no, I think that it is most important what we do now that we're in charge. And I think there are some unhappiness, obviously. But the thing is, is the only way we're going to move forward and do something is to actually put bills on the desk of the president.
I'm for using the power of the purse. And I think most conservatives that were unhappy in the House want to use the power of the purse. We now do have the power of the purse in both the House and the Senate. So, I'm for attaching hundreds, if not thousands of rules on how the money can be spend. And what I mean by rules is, that's how you try to fix waste and fraud.
BURNETT: According to our latest CNN poll, it's pretty sad. Only 28 percent of Americans think Republicans will run the Senate better than Democrats. Look, you know, a lot of them think there will be no difference. I just don't like any of you guys.
All right. "TIME" magazine today, though, has you listed as one of the ten members of Congress to watch in 2015. You are one of the people in charge.
How are you going to prove the American public and the world, frankly, who have given up on Capitol Hill in the United States, wrong?
PAUL: Proof will be in the pudding. So, what I will say to the American people is watch what we do. If Republicans will pass all 12 appropriation bills and try to slow down the accumulation of debt by controlling waste and fraud, then we will have done our duty. So, the proof will be how do we act and what can we do over the next year.
BURNETT: All right. Senator, always good to talk to you. I appreciate your time. Thank you. PAUL: Thank you, Erin.
BURNETT: And OUTFRONT next, Prince Andrew's ex, Fergie, standing by her former man, defending him after he was named in allegations of a child sex ring.
And unveiled moments ago, the content of a time capsule buried by Paul Revere in 1795. This is an incredible story we're just finding out at this moment. It's coming out more about what's in it. We're going to tell you and how much it's worth.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BURNETT: Sara Ferguson, the Duchess of York, is standing by Prince Andrew after allegations surfaced about her ex-husband's involvement in a major sex scandal. The Duke of York is one of the prominent people named in a sexual abuse lawsuit in Florida, but alleges sex contact with underage girls who are part of a ring.
Fergie had been vacationing with her ex-husband and one of their daughters when she came to his defense, telling "The London Telegraph", quote, "The York familiar is a tight unit. Prince Andrew is the greatest man there is. He is a great man, the best in the world."
This is not the first time the friendly exes has been involved in controversy.
Jean Casarez is OUTFRONT.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JEAN CASAREZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: As the fifth in line to the throne, Britain's Prince Andrew is no stranger to the limelight.
PRINCE ANDREW, DUKE OF YORK: I, Andrew Albert Christian Edward --
CASAREZ: From a story book wedding to Sara Ferguson in 1986, to a scandalous divorce in 1996.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: If you live in that goldfish bowl and you are a public figure, they you have to expect somebody to throw a stone and you just have to live with it.
CASAREZ: His past relationship with convicted sex offender Epstein is surrounding the prince, with new legal allegations he engaged in sex crimes with an underage minor during encounters document say were set up by Epstein, between 1999 and 2002. Andrew has not been charged with any wrongdoing and Buckingham P has denied the allegations.
Even Sara Ferguson coming to his defense, saying, "He is the greatest man there is."
VICTORIA ARBITER, CNN ROYAL CONTRIBUTOR: I think they cover each other's backs. They've both made grave errors. They suffered from severe judgment issues. CASAREZ: In 1992, their marriage publicly imploded in embarrassing
detail. With the tabloids exposing images of Fergie having her toe sucked by another man, while topless in southern France. When the duchess of York found herself swimming in debt, Prince Andrew was in the tabloids again. After his ex was filmed allegedly trying to sell access to Prince Andrew, then-Britain's local trade ambassador. The financier was a "News of the World" reporter.
In 2011, yet another embarrassment when Fergie accepted more than $20,000 from Jeffrey Epstein, who had been convicted several years earlier of solicitation of prostitution. "Once again, my errors have impacted on the man I admire most in the world, the duke. I would throw myself under a bus for him."
ARBITER: It is a notable position that he has. I mean, he hasn't just embarrassed himself, he's embarrassed his family, the monarchy and the country. I could go on.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
CASAREZ: A tangled web.
BURNETT: I mean, the fact that Epstein is a convicted pedophile, had she taken money from him, and not just Prince Andrew being his friend.
CASAREZ: Yes, she admitted that because she was so in debt. That is true.
Now on a legal front, I've got to tell you this, it is heating up. Alan Dershowitz, so respected defense attorney, has been named in this motion in federal court that he participated in legal sex acts.
BURNETT: In detail.
CASAREZ: In great specific detail. He countered that, asking to join that suit for limited basis, saying I did none of that. Furthermore, the alleged victims' attorneys, no, I didn't do it and they didn't investigate to see if it was true.
Now, the attorneys for the accusers have minutes ago filed a defamation act against Alan Dershowitz saying our careers and reputations are at stake because of Alan Dershowitz.
And I've got to tell you --
BURNETT: So, they are standing by the allegations and standing by their client and what she said.
CASAREZ: Victoria Roberts, the accuser's attorney, she's got two high profile attorney, but one is a former federal judge in the state of Utah, and he clerked for major judges in this country and an immense record of integrity.
BURNETT: All right. Well, thank you very much, Jean, as we continue to cover the story. Obviously, a lot more to come on it. And next, this is the incredible story of the day. All right. Two
hundred and twenty years ago, Paul Revere had his midnight ride. He did more than that. Anyway, 220 years ago, he buried a time capsule and tonight, in the past hour we found out what was in it. Next, we're going to tell you how much it's worth.
And Jeanne Moos with two guys who really need to get a grip.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BURNETT: Tonight, a discovery, 220 years in the making. We just got a look inside a time capsule buried on July 4th, 1795. The contents unveiled to the public just moments ago. This time capsule buried by Paul Revere and Samuel Adams.
The artifacts were buried at the Massachusetts state house and inside the box, silver and copper coins, an engraved silver plate, newspapers. It took officials 4 to 5 hours to initially loosen the screws at the top of the capsule. They describe it as truly hermetically sealed.
The capsule was actually uncovered during repairs for a water leak at the state house.
OUTFRONT tonight, Sebastian Clarke, an appraiser for "Antiques Roadshow" on PBS.
This is just -- this makes my skin tingle, it's so exciting. Just imagining the history coming alive.
So, let's start with what's in it overall. You've got coins. We have a half cent coin, one cent dime, half dine, dime, three cent coin all dated 1775 and a silver pine tree shilling dated 1652.
How much is this stuff worth?
SEBASTIAN CLARKE, APPRAISER, PBS'S "ANTIQUES ROADSHOW": So, if these things do come up for sale, but not with this story. I mean, the story is fantastic. George Washington was still the president of this country until 1795.
BURNETT: Paul Revere and Samuel Adams touched these coins as they put them in the capsule.
CLARKE: Yes.
So, a coin -- you know, the 17th century coin is maybe a $5,000 or $6,000 coin. But with this story, the value increases tenfold.
BURNETT: Tenfold.
CLARKE: I could only imagine.
BURNETT: Fifty to sixty thousand dollars a coin.
CLARKE: Easily. BURNETT: Unbelievable. OK, now, let's get Paul Revere, specifically,
he was a silversmith. We know that. There is an engraved silver plate in here. It says in part, I'm going to read the quote for everybody, the cornerstone of this building, because everyone, that's when it was found, intended for the use of legislative and executive branch of the commonwealth of Massachusetts was laid by His Excellency Samuel Adams Esquire, governor of said commonwealth, assisted by the Most Worshipful Paul Revere on the 4th day of July, 1795, being the 20th anniversary of American independence.
All right. So, we know Paul Revere was a silversmith. They're not sure that he made this piece. Maybe he did. He certainly placed it in there.
What could it be worth if they could link it that he actually engraved it?
CLARKE: So, based upon examples of silver that Paul Revere had sold. About 5 years ago, a set of five, six actually, teaspoons sold for $50,000 made by Paul Revere. A silver tea pot two years ago, January 2013, sold for $230,000, at auction.
I can only imagine he made or had a hand in making this plate if his name is on the plate. The value has to be in the hundreds of thousands of dollars.
BURNETT: Hundreds of thousands of dollars for the plate.
CLARKE: It's magnificent.
BURNETT: It's just so amazing. Again, I keep getting to the fact that they actually placed it in there. There's something momentous and magnificent about that.
There are newspapers in there, apparently very well-preserved. Are those meaningful also?
CLARKE: Again, it's the sum of all parts. You know, we don't know what to say because they don't want to open it until it's in the right environment.
BURNETT: Right, understood.
CLARKE: It's the entire contents of the box together placed there on the 20th anniversary of the birth of the nation. That's where the value lies. It's fantastic.
BURNETT: It is. It is fantastic. And just a great moment, sometimes, just take stock of the incredible things. Paul Revere and the midnight ride.
Thank you so much, Sebastian.
CLARKE: My pleasure.
BURNETT: And OUTFRONT next, Jeanne Moos on why these men attempt the world's hardest rock climb during the slipperiest, slidiest, iciest, coldest time of the year.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BURNETT: So, two men are attempting to climb Yosemite's El Capitan without help up to the top. This is the first time this has ever happened. So, for them, a day off means napping in a tent hanging higher than the Empire State Building. Definitely not a safe job for a sleepwalker.
Jeanne Moos has more.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JEANNE MOOS, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Don't look down, don't look up. You are looking at climbers who have fallen. Something called the down wall on the vertical rock formation El Captain at Yosemite National Park.
KEVIN JORGESON, PROFESSIONAL CLIMBER: Yesterday was day eight.
MOOS: It's easy to lose track of time when you're climbing a 3,000 foot wall, a free climb, meaning using your hands and feet finding minuscule ledges, occasionally jumping from hold to hold, using ropes not to climb but to catch you when you fall. After several years of planning and training, Tommy Caldwell and Kevin Jorgeson, they do their dreaming on the wall each night when they pitch their tents suspended.
JORGESON: There's this crazy arctic wind storm happening today.
MOOS: Kevin and Tommy chose to climb in winter so their hands won't sweat and there will be more friction between rubber soles and rock.
Wonder why Kevin is staring at his hands?
JORGESON: We're taking a rest day today because our skin took a beating.
MOOS: The edges can be razor sharp. They've resorted to tape for protection.
(on camera): Tommy said he wakes up twice a night to apply lotion to his hands and forget filing your nails with an emery board.
(voice-over): Climbers sand their fingertips to keep them smooth. The route is divided into pitches. They've triumphed over the hardest one, pitch 14.
JORGESON: It kind of gives the fits because you'll feel totally fine and then your foot will just unexpectedly pop off.
MOOS: They'll do a lot of falling over the total of two to 3 weeks, they estimate the climb will take.
(on camera): And what's on the menu up there?
JORGESON: Little breakfast sandwich with cream cheese, and salmon and cucumber.
MOOS (voice-over): You're going to eat with those fingers?
Jeanne Moos, CNN, New York.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
BURNETT: Miraculous, terrifying, crazy, all of the above? Inspiring?
Thanks so much for joining us. Be sure to DVR OUTFRONT so you can watch us anytime.
Anderson starts now.
