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Erin Burnett Outfront
Senate Intel Committee Subpoenas Flynn's Businesses; DNI Chief Won't Say If Trump Asked Him To Deny Russia Collusion; U.K. Raises Terror Threat After Attack at Ariana Grande Concert; Trump Calls Manchester Attack Perpetrators "Evil Losers"; Remembering the Manchester Bombing Victims. Aired 7-8p ET
Aired May 23, 2017 - 19:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[19:00:05] ERIN BURNETT, CNN HOST: OUTFRONT next, breaking news. New subpoenas just issued involving Michael Flynn. Is he about to be held in contempt? Plus the former CIA Director John Brennan testifying, saying publicly for the first time, Trump campaign associates were interacting with Russian officials during the campaign. And Russians clearly try to recruit Trump campaign aide. Did they take the bait?
And in the wake of the deadly terror attack that killed 22 and injured dozens. The British warn of another imminent terror attack. Let's go OUTFRONT. And good evening. I'm Erin Burnett. OUTFRONT tonight, the breaking news. The news tightens, new subpoenas for General Michael Flynn tonight. Senate investigators serving two of the former national security adviser's businesses with subpoenas for Russia- related documents.
This news tonight as the former CIA Director John Brennan speaks out today testifying the House Intelligence Committee, Brennan for the first time publicly saying Trump campaign associates were interacting with Russian officials during the campaign. Brennan telling lawmakers in a stunning statement that the Russians try to recruit multiple members of the Trump campaign during the election. Brennan saying there was clear contact between Trump associates and Russian operatives.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JOHN BRENNAN, FORMER CIA DIRECTOR: I was aware of intelligence and information about contacts between Russian officials and U.S. persons that raised concerns in my mind about whether or not those individuals were cooperating with the Russians either in unwitting or unwitting fashion and it serves as the basis for the FBI investigation to determine whether such collusion or cooperation occurred.
BURNETT: Now just to be clear, right? Brennan there testifying Russian operatives try to get Trump associates to collude with them and the big question then is, did Trump associates collude knowingly or unknowingly. We have more on CIA Director Brennan's bombshell words in a moment. But first, Phil Mattingly on Capitol Hill. And Phil, General Flynn tonight with the breaking news, stonewalling, lawmakers now threatening to hold him in contempt. How significant is this? PHIL MATTINGLY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Erin, if there's any sense
whatsoever, any thought that General Flynn invoking his fifth amendment privileges would brushed back the Senate Intelligence Committee, that was blown apart today this evening as both the top republican and democrat on the committee said they were going to move forward pursuing any in all options to try and obtain the documents that they're seeking.
Documents laying out the details of any meetings between General Flynn and members of the Russian government. Now they have, as you noted, issued two new subpoena directly targeting Michael Flynn's businesses. They're rationale, they said is they don't believe legally that you can cite the fifth amendment in trying to avoid business records. So they are going to pursue that. But they also noted all options are on the table.
And as you noted, Erin, that means they are willing to pursue contempt as things currently stand if those subpoenas are not complied with. And there's something else that's not on the table and this isn't insignificant. The top republican on that committee Richard Burr saying at this point, any talk of an immunity deal when Michael Flynn's lawyers in the early stages of this brought to the table, forcing that investigators is now off the table. So all contempt is on the table.
Immunity clearly is not on the table and also another note, we were told the tonight, the House Intelligence Committee's request for records was also declined. Subpoenas will be following there as well. So when it comes to the former national security adviser in what he has to say or details or documents he may have, it's very clear that both investigations in the house and senate are ramping up and not showing any signs of slowing down anytime soon, Erin.
BURNETT: All right. Thank you very much, Phil Mattingly. And the other breaking story of course, the revealing testimony from the former CIA Chief John Brennan on Capitol Hill. Elise Labott is OUTFRONT.
ELISE LABOTT, CNN GLOBAL AFFIARS CORRESPONDENT: Today, the former CIA Director described in new detail what he called Russia's brazen interference in the U.S. election.
BRENNAN: I encountered and aware of information of information and intelligence that revealed contacts and interactions between Russian officials and U.S. persons involved in the Trump campaign, that I was concerned about because of known Russian efforts to suborn such individuals and it raised questions in my mind again whether or not the Russians were able to gain the cooperation of those individuals.
LABOTT: And while John Brennan stopped short of saying he saw clear evidence that collusion took place between Russia and the Trump campaign, he did say what he saw demanded serious investigation into whether Trump campaign officials were working on Russia's behalf either wittingly or unwittingly.
BRENNAN: Frequently individuals who go along a treasonous path do not even realize they're along that path until it gets to be a bit too late
LABOTT: Brennan who left his pose when Trump took office, even called the head of Russia's intelligence agency to warn him against meddling. Across the Capitol, senators grilled President Trump's Intel Chief Dan Coats about reports President Trump asked him and Admiral Mike Rogers, the director of the National Security Agency to publicly deny evidence of collusion. An apparent attempt to undercut the FBI investigation.
DAN COATS, DIRECTOR OF NATIONAL INTELLIGENCE: I don't feel it's appropriate to characterize discussions and conversations with the president.
LABOTT: But when pressed on whether he would ever succumb to such request --
COATS: Any political shaping of that presentation or intelligence would not be appropriate.
LABOTT: A U.S. official tells CNN the White House was unsure about the president's power over the FBI which could speak to why he appeared to be trying to quash the investigation, including during a private Oval Office meeting in which Trump asked Comey to drop his probe of former National Security Adviser Michael Flynn, telling him, I hope you can let this go, according to a memo Comey wrote afterwards. Trump denies the charge but the top democrat on the Intel Committee said the allegations if true are troubling.
SEN. MARK WARNER (D-VA), VICE CHAIRMAN, INTELLIGENCE COMMITTEE: When you see a pattern of this administration that anybody gets close to this Russia investigation loses their job or ends up in a difficult position. This is just not the way an American president should act.
LABOTT: And you wouldn't have known today that Admiral Mike Rodgers was also at the center of this controversy from his appearance before the House Armed Services subcommittee earlier today. He was there in his capacity as the head of U.S. cyber command to talk about budget and cyber issues but not one question from lawmakers about his conversations with the president, Erin.
BURNETT: All right. Thank you very much, Elise. And OUTFRONT now, someone who questioned the former CIA Director today. Democratic Congressman Terri Sewell of Alabama, sits on the House Intelligence Committee. Congresswoman, I appreciate your time. You know, you just heard --
REP. TERRI SEWELL (D-AL), INTELLIGENCE COMMITTEE: Thank you.
BURNETT: -- look, the former CIA Director, you were in the room for the first time publicly acknowledging the former director of the CIA that there were multiple interactions between the Trump campaign and Russian officials. And going on to say Russian officials try to recruit multiple people in Trump associates to cooperate with them. Look, this is the former director of the CIA saying this publicly. What's your reaction?
SEWELL: Listen, I think it's really important that the American people deserve to have a transparent and thorough and deliberate investigation. So look, today I think there were two takeaways. You cited the first one which is that he confirmed that this is not a witch hunt, that there is in fact intelligence evidence that suggests both contact and interaction between the Trump administration or Trump campaign and Russia.
And the second thing is that he talked extensively about how Russia does this. This is what they do about their disinformation campaign and how they influence elections, so I think that he talked about their tactics and methods and people can unwillingly be subjected to their --
BURNETT: Obviously intent, Congresswoman, it could be very crucial here. From what you have heard, right? You're on the House Intelligence Committee, you are getting briefed, you sat there with the former CIA Director today, do you think associates to President Trump cooperated with the Russians?
SEWELL: Listen. I think that there's lots of circumstantial evidence that may lead to that conclusion but I actually think that we are -- it's too premature to prejudge. We have to follow the facts and where they lead and not try to prejudge this.
BURNETT: So, on this issue of collusion, outright collusion, right? The former CIA Director was asked directly about this, right? And here is that important exchange.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REP. MIKE TURNER (R), INTELLIGENCE COMMITTEE: If someone left this hearing today and said that you had indicated that those contacts were evidence of collusion or collaboration, they would be misrepresenting your statements, correct?
BRENNAN: I would say that it was not an accurate portrayal of my testimony, absolutely.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: So, you're saying circumstantial evidence leads you in that way but you don't want to prejudge. But the former CIA Director --
SEWELL: No, I don't.
BURNETT: -- obviously, Congresswoman spent months looking at this. When he is saying that he wouldn't go so far to say collusion at this point from what he saw. Does this mean case close, Trump is exonerated?
SEWELL: No, it doesn't. I think we can tell by the -- by the, you know, daily we're getting information or allegations about this interaction. So I think that -- I just want our committee to function. And I was very happy that we were able to have Former Director Brennan in front of us today. I think it's important that transparency, you know, that the American people deserve transparency. So, I think that while we cannot prejudge the conclusion of -- that there was collusion but I do believe that there is lots to be investigated and I think it's important that we take politics out of the investigation.
I believe that as a member of the House Intelligence Committee that we have a duty of oversight and we should be able to function and do that and perform that duty.
BURNETT: So, we're reporting President Trump asked the director of National Intelligence and the director of the NSA to publicly deny that there was collusion between his campaign and Russia and they we're reporting they refused to do that in public testimony today. The director of the DNI did not deny this report. If this is true, if he asked them to do this, we know of course that he also asked the FBI Director according to the reporting to stop the investigation of General Michael Flynn. Is this obstruction of justice, if there was no underlying crime, we don't yet know if there was collusion but yet there was an as an effort to stop the investigation itself, would that in your view be obstruction of justice?
SEWELL: So, Erin, I think that if those facts are true and if that conversation occurred, at the very minimum it was unethical and definitely troubling and disturbing but at most it would be evidence of an obstruction of justice.
BURNETT: Now, the other thing is and I'm mentioning these stories, right? As you know, Congressman, obviously very significant today, the former CIA Director confirming publicly what has been reported out there in terms of multiple transactions with the Trump campaign, and throwing something completely new that there was an actual effort to recruit members of the Trump campaign. But some of the stories we've heard have come from anonymous leaks, we all know that. This is something the president says as criminal. Here he is.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: Things are being leaked. It's criminal action. We're going to find the leaks. They're going to pay a big price for leaking.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: And the Former CIA Director today said the biggest issue with Trump sharing classified information to Oval Office, Congresswoman wasn't actually that he shared it. It was the fact that it was leaked to the press. Here's Director Brennan.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BRENAN: These continue to be very, very damaging leaks and I find them appalling and they need to be tracked down. So, that was where the damage came from, I think that it was released in the press.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: Should these leaks be tracked down criminally prosecuted?
SEWELL: Yes. I think that it's important that we maintain the classified information. So, if in fact, people disclose classified information and leak that out to the press, they should -- they should adhere -- you know, they should be prosecuted. But I also know that it's important not to just investigate the leakers but to investigate the information that the leakers provided. If there's --
(CROSSTALK)
BURNETT: Right. So just before we go, I want to make sure I understand. The leaks have come out, they have informed the public. But in your capacity, right? As part of an investigation, the House Intelligence Committee, would you have gotten that information anyway or do you actually think that these leaks to the press are pushing this investigation forward?
SEWELL: I do believe the leaks to the press are pushing this investigation forward. But I also know that it is illegal to, you know, provide classified information. So, look, at the end of the day, I think the American people just want to know the truth. And I tried to say that this morning, that we should really be getting to the truth of the matter and not play all these games. I know that every day, a new -- a new fact comes out. And I think it's really important that we maintain our independence and really try to not be partisan.
BURNETT: All right. Congressman Sewell, I appreciate your time. Thank you so much. And next, the breaking news. The White House responding at this hour to Brennan's testimony. We have that for you. Plus breaking news about Manchester, the U.K. raising their terror level. Warning another attack would be imminent. And children and teenagers, sons and daughters, we are just beginning to learn about the victims.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BURNETT: Breaking news. The White House at this hour firing back at the Russia investigation, claiming former CIA Director John Brennan exonerated the president and his campaign from colluding with the Russians to rig the election. Their statement reads in part. This morning's hearings back up what we've saying all along that despite a year of investigation there is still no evidence of any Russia-Trump campaign collusion. Meanwhile, the former CIA Director used the word treason to describe what may have happened when Russian officials try to recruit Trump associates.
BRENNAN: Frequently, individuals who go along a treasonous path do not even realize they're along that path until it gets to be a bit too late.
BURNETT: OUTFRONT now, John Kirby, former press secretary at the state department and the Pentagon. Juliette Kayyem, former assistant secretary of Homeland Security, also under President Obama. Former Senator Rick Santorum that was a republican presidential candidate and then supported Donald Trump and Mark Preston, our senior political analyst. Senator Santorum, the CIA Director -- the former CIA Director using the word treason to describe the broad situation. What do you say? RICK SANTORUM, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Well, I think he's
said, you know, those who go on a treasonous path, I don't think it was -- I think he's made it clear that he wasn't accusing the Trump campaign that they were going out that anyone from the Trump campaign was creating treason, in fact I think he stood by his previous statement that he saw no -- saw no record of collusion and that's what the White House was responding to.
The fact that the Russians have, you know, reached out to the -- to people in the Trump campaign, tried to recruit people, that is new news. Although I'm not too sure it's great news, it's really unusual. I mean, I think the Russians for a long time have been trying to influence elections and wouldn't be surprised if they have tried to recruit to people on lots of campaigns in the past.
BURNETT: Although, the CIA Director to be fair, Senator, did say when he saw all this, it was enough to make him go to the FBI and say that investigation should be started.
SANTORUM: Agreed. And look, I'm not saying --
BURNETT: Which doesn't happen with other campaigns -- and other (INAUDIBLE) name.
SANTORUM: I'm not saying that there isn't evidence here to be investigated and there -- and there should be an investigation but I don't think we need at this point as the director said, we need' to be drawing conclusions that there -- that were some criminal behavior here or some real collusion.
BURNETT: So let me ask you, Juliette, because this issue of treason and intent, right? This is -- this could end up to be crucial depending on the facts here. Brennan said the question is whether Trump associates helped the Russians knowingly or unknowingly, OK? And let me just play exactly how he said it.
JULIETTE KAYYEM, FORMER ASSISTANT SECRETARY OF HOMELAND SECURITY: Yes.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BRENNAN: I had unresolved questions in my mind as to whether or not the Russians have been successful in getting U.S. persons involved in the campaign or not to work in their behalf, again, either in a witting or unwitting fashion.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: Juliette, witting or unwitting, does it matter which it is when you start talking about collusion, treasonous behavior?
KAYYEM: It does matter. And in particular collusion would be the standard that you're -- that is a high legal standard but what he was -- what John Brennan was trying to describe was how someone who did not set out to do something bad can be manipulated by a very sophisticated intelligence agents in Russia. To begin to disclose information that they don't even know that they're disclosing and shouldn't be disclosed. But in its totality, Brennan's testimony was really bad for the White House.
There's been a couple bad days on Russia-Trump, some of the articles that have come out but Brennan who -- those of us who have known him is, you know, is -- like I can't describe it but he's just sort of -- he's just sort of there, he's just sort of tells the truth. For him to say that an investigation that they're doing at the CIA, in counterintelligence was worrisome enough that he wanted the FBI to look at it is unique. I mean, you can't -- that's not happening all the time.
In fact, the CIA generally wants to keep these investigations to themselves because they don't want to give up sources and methods. So in its totality, I thought even though he said I didn't see collusion, he was clear to say that collusion was a legal standard to be set and determined by the FBI and a court and he was not -- that wasn't his job.
BURNETT: And we did, Mark Preston, today for the first time have the CIA Director say not only that there were interactions between Trump campaign associates and the Russians but that the Russians were actively trying to recruit people from the Trump campaign, Trump associates more broadly.
MARK PRESTON, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: Yes. No doubt about that. And what's interesting too is that I don't think we can look at that recruitment tactics solely, meaning what they might have done to try to get Carter Page on board might be entirely different than what they try to get, you know, somebody else on the campaign to come into the fold. I mean, if you look at the cast of characters, Carter Page seems to be this unknowingly unwittingly person who does go down in that path, didn't know what he was getting himself into.
Yes. There may be other on the campaign that played a more direct role in talking to the Russians about the release of information. I also think to just go off which Juliette said, I don't think it's pretty heady to have the former CIA Director saying that he picked up the phone and called his counterpart in Russia and said, knock it off as far as interfering with our election. Now, it didn't work but the fact that he did so just shows you how big of a problem that they thought this was.
BURNETT: And would you -- what do you say, Admiral? In terms of how big this was? That the call was made, that the call was made to the FBI to look into this.
JOHN KIRBY, FORMER STATE DEPARTMENT SPOKESPERSON: It's extremely significant. You're talking about John Brennan here who has worked for both republican and democratic administration and whose character is beyond reproach. And for him to feel that serious about this, that he would not only call his FBI counterpart but call the Russians as well and tell them to stop this. That speaks volumes. And I think, you know, look, the -- when the Russians do intelligence operations, they try to weave a fabric. So they -- you know, Mark is right, they may do something different to go after a guy like Carter Page and something completely different to try to glean information and intelligence out of Michael Flynn. They are good at this, they are exceptionally good at this and they start sometimes just by trying to build a level of trust and that trust can sometimes then get the information and then the information to Intel. So, it doesn't surprise me what he said today although I do -- I do agree with everybody else about the seriousness of it.
BURNETT: And Admiral though, in terms of the timing, did the Russians have enough time during the span of this campaign to recruit a willing spy from the Trump campaign in terms of the time it takes time to build that relationship and rapport on a willing, witting basis.
KIRBY: It depends on the target, right? I mean, some people are more susceptible to intelligence activity than others. I mean, if they're going to go after somebody who they believe is sort of, you know, going to be hard to corrupt, it could take months, it can take years but others, maybe not so much. And so -- and they're -- and they're smart about this and they know how to play personalities. So, is it possible that they could have started with somebody unwitting and gotten them on board in a span of the campaign, yes, it is possible depending on the target, how much information that person had or how willing they might be.
BURNETT: All right. Thank you all very much. Sorry. And next, breaking news from the U.K. We have just gotten news of another warning of an imminent terror attack, raising their threat level as investigators are learning more about the suicide bomber who targeted children. And President Trump today using these words to call out terrorists.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: So many young beautiful innocent people murdered by evil losers in life.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BURNETT: Breaking news. Tonight imminent attack, the U.K. raising it's terror threat level to critical which is the highest its been in nearly a decade. The British Prime Minister warning another attack may be imminent after last night's bombing in which at least 22 people were killed at an Ariana Grande concert in Manchester, England. Right now investigators scrambling to determine what drove a 22-year old terrorist to blow himself up. Salman Abedi is believed to have lived in the house you see there, stormed by police today. Sources tell CNN Abedi was a business student at a nearby university.
We also know he was a Libyan descent. And tonight, ISIS claiming responsibility. Clarissa Ward is OUTFRONT with more on the breaking details.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Oh, gosh. CLARISSA WARD, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIOAN CORRESPONDENT: The moment of
terror that took at least 22 lives, injuring dozens more, many of them just young girls. Today Manchester police revealed the name of the man they believe was responsible for the attack.
IAN HOPKINS, CHIEF CONSTABLE, GREATER MANCHESTER POLICE: I confirm that the man suspected of carrying out last night's atrocity is 22- year-old Salman Abedi. We believe the attacker was carrying an improvised explosive device which he detonated.
WARD: Overnight, more than 400 police rushed to respond to the attack in Manchester. One of England's largest cities. Today multiple raids were carried out and a 23-year-old man was arrested. Police quickly labeled the bombing a terrorist attack and ISIS was equally quick to claim responsibility.
[19:30:01] But so far, British authorities have discovered no evidence of a link between Abedi and any terrorist group.
It was around 10: 30 p.m. local time as Ariana Grande sang a final song. Pink balloons floated down on to the thousands of concert goers inside Manchester arena. The bomb exploded in a public space just outside the hall as people were screaming out, many heading to the adjacent train station.
ALEX GRAYSON, WITNESS TO ATTACK: When we left there was -- like downstairs there was probably like early teenagers laying on the floor covered in blood. It was horrifying, really.
WARD: A visibly angry Prime Minister Theresa May, her voice breaking at times, addressed the nation.
THERESA MAY, BRITISH PRIME MINISTER: All attacks of terrorism are cowardly attacks on innocent people. But this attack stands out, for its appalling, sickening cowardice.
WARD: And the toll could rise. Earlier today, one mother spoke out. Her daughter's still missing hours after the explosion.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Please, I just want her home. I want her back in my arms.
WARD: Late today, thousands gathered at Manchester's Albert Square. The vigil ending in a spontaneous show of solidarity.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
WARD: Authorities now Erin are really focused on trying to work out whether this young man was operating alone or whether he was part of a larger network. Clearly there are some real fears that there is a larger network out there.
As you mentioned the British prime minister has elevated the terror threat here to critical. That means attack may be imminent. The last time we saw this was back in 2007, when a man tried to ram his flaming car into the doors of Scotland's Glasgow Airport. So, a very serious threat here tonight -- Erin.
BURNETT: All right. Clarissa, thank you very much. Police right now in desperate attempt to see if there is a broader network are scouring the home of the suicide attacker.
I want to go to straight to Atika Shubert, who is in the bombers neighborhood in Manchester.
And what is happening there, Atika?
ATIKA SHUBERT, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes. Earlier today, police used a controlled detonation to force their way into Salman Abedi's house or at least the address he was last known to be at. Forensics put t-police went in, searched the house, took out a number of material, including documents, and we also note that a second site which we also saw today was also searched by police.
Now, we spoke to one of the neighbors and a family friend there who confirmed to us it was the apartment of Abedi's brother. Now, in addition to that, a 23-year-old man was also arrested in the neighborhood. We spoke to one eyewitness who described really quite a dramatic arrest, with armed police almost plucking him from the sidewalk as he was walking from the tram station and bringing him in cuffs.
So, those are the developments that have happened. How they all link together exactly is what we're still waiting for from police and also, of course, to find out more about how the explosives are actually put together. That will be a critical clue.
BURNETT: All right. Atika, thank you very much.
Paul Cruickshank is OUTFRONT, our terrorism analyst, and Ali Soufan, former FBI supervisor special agent, author of "Anatomy of Terror: From the Death of Bin Laden to the Rise of the Islamic State".
Paul, from the U.K., first, the breaking news. The threat level being raised to critical, a warning of imminent attack. This only happened twice before in the past decade. What does this tell you?
PAUL CRUICKSHANK, CNN TERRORISM ANALYST: It's a stunning development. This is set by JTAC, the Joint Analysis Center. It's an independent body under the British system.
The prime minister suggesting that investigations today have raised the possibility of a wider group of individuals that were behind this attack. That contributing towards this raising the alert level to a maximum level, meaning an attack could be imminent.
But other factors also came into play, including the historically high nature of the terrorist threat right now in the U.K. For some time, this system already has been blinking red in terms of an uptick of terrorist activity here in the U.K. And, of course, this is two weeks before the British general election, and in the past, we've seen terrorists try to launch attacks before big elections. We saw it in Spain, the Madrid bombings just before an election in
2004. Recently in France, with that attack on the Champs-Elysees. And, of course, on Friday is the start of Ramadan, and last Ramadan in the last year, ISIS called for a month of hurt. They told their followers around the world that they would be awarded ten times in paradise.
[19:35:00] BURNETT: So, Ali, this threat level, you also think is extremely significant for a very specific reason?
ALI SOUFAN, SERVED IN THE FBI'S JOINT TERRORISM TASK FORCE: Yes. I believe that most of the British investigators found something. And it might be forensic evidence. It might be investigative evidence. It might be intelligence.
For example, let's say the bomb -- if the bomb was a vest, suicide vest, that means somebody had to make that vest. This 22-year-old person did not make the vest and detonate himself. You know, this is something you cannot do just by reading "Inspire" magazine or watching ISIS video.
So, it seems that the British investigators are looking into a wider network, unfortunately. And as you know, we have more than 800 people from the U.K. who are connected in a way or another to ISIS and other extremist groups. Those people who are -- the 800 actually traveled to conflict zones in places like Syria and in places like Libya and places like Iraq.
So, I think the fact that the prime minister raised the threat into critical indicates that they fear a bigger network is at play here.
BURNETT: Which, of course, incredibly concerning and terrifying tonight.
SOUFAN: Absolutely.
BURNETT: Paul, you know, in terms of what they chose to do, though, this man, whether there was a network around him or not, went into a place that was full of children, that was full of children. And some people watching might say is that where even people who might be sympathetic to the cause would say this goes too far? Why did they target children?
CRUICKSHANK: They wanted to create a maximum media impact. They wanted to shock the world. They wanted to change the conversation away from the fact they're losing territory in Syria, Iraq, Libya, or Afghanistan, and other places. So, for their most hard line supporters, this is something that very much energizes them.
They're a huge amount of anger from their point of view that children are being killed in British strikes and Western strikes, U.S. strikes in Syria and Iraq. And for them, it's an eye or an eye, it's retaliation. And this is seen by their supporters as a show of strength.
BURNETT: Children purposeful, Ali? SOUFAN: Yes. I think he intentionally targeted that. And remember,
Hamza bin Laden, and he's not ISIS in any way, shape or form, but just last Saturday, he issued a statement asking for suicide attacks to revenge the death of the children in places like Iraq and in places like Syria, and places like Afghanistan.
He asked for a martyrdom operation which is suicide operation that create a lot of damage in the West. So, this is something not only ISIS are putting out, something also al Qaeda are putting out.
You know, we are fighting a narrative. We are fighting an ideology. We're not fighting organizations anymore.
BURNETT: A group or an identity of this versus that.
SOUFAN: No. The terrorism threat mutated over the years, and mutated with al Qaeda and mutated with ISIS. And a lot of times when we see these kind of people who are inspired or acting on behalf of terrorist organizations, especially in the West, we see a very blurry boundaries between, you know, the way they view ISIS and they view al Qaeda. Rahami here in New York for example, who was the Chelsea bomber, he referenced al-Awlaki's statement. He referenced AQAP.
BURNETT: Yes.
SOUFAN: And al-Adnani.
So, they're all over the map. We are fighting a narrative and I think we have to start focusing on that narrative, choking it, drowning it, discrediting it. That will be the first step in making our societies more secure.
BURNETT: All right. Thank you both very much.
And next, the victims as young as eight years old. What happens when children are the targets of terror? Sanjay Gupta is OUTFRONT.
And President Trump spoke out today. His message to the terrorists.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I won't call them monsters because they would like that term.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[19:42:47] BURNETT: Tonight, President Trump responding to the horrifying terror attack in an Ariana Grande concert in Manchester, England, calling the terrorists responsible for the loss of 22 lives and dozens more injured evil losers.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: So many young beautiful innocent people living and enjoying their lives murdered by evil losers in life. I won't call them monsters, because they would like that term. I will call them from now on, losers, because that's what they are, they're losers. And we'll have more of them. But they're losers. Just remember that.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: Jim Acosta is OUTFRONT with the president in Rome.
And the term evil losers, this obviously came from the president himself, right? No speechwriter, no one around him, this was him.
JIM ACOSTA, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: That's right, Erin.
We were told that was something he wanted inserted into the speech that he delivered early today and definitely conveyed his view that these terrorists like the one that carried out the attack in Manchester needs to be summed up in no uncertain terms. You heard the president do that earlier today.
Now, we should point out that the president's going to be meeting with the pope tomorrow but then he goes off to NATO meetings in Brussels later on in the week. That is interesting because the president has said that NATO needs to take on a more active role when it comes to counterterrorism. And so, you may hear the president speak of that when he gets up to Brussels later this week.
Now, one other thing that has coming up during the president's travels here. It happened earlier today. The White House officials were asked is the president distracted, bothered by the noise back home with the Russian investigation. They said no, they're focused on their objectives.
But, Erin, a new development happening tonight. We're told by a senior administration official that the president is expected to hire trial lawyer Mark Kasowitz as an outside attorney, as his outside attorney, not for White House counsel, but an outside attorney to deal with the special counsel investigation. That's something that has just come up that we've been able to confirm here at CNN in the last several minutes.
But it does show you how this Russian investigation has taken on a new dimension and will occasionally from time to time intrude on the president's travels here overseas as he tries to stay on message, tries to stay focused on what they want to accomplish on this trip, Erin.
[19:45:12] BURNETT: All right. Thank you very much, Jim Acosta.
I want to go to our senior political analyst Mark Preston. Mark, in this reporting, Jim Acosta and I each with sources here. We are confirming that Mark Kasowitz is expected to be hired for the Russia inquiry close to Trump, confirming that to me, another one to Jim Acosta.
I understand that the president himself actually called Mark Kasowitz I'm told this afternoon to talk to him. How significant is this development, having a private attorney now to representing him with the Russia probe?
MARK PRESTON, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: Well, a couple of things. One, it's significant in the fact that he feels he needs to do so. But we shouldn't be surprised that he is doing so. He does need to protect himself in his own legal interest.
So, we see Bill Clinton do the same thing, you know, back when we had the Monica Lewinsky scandal. We shouldn't be surprised. What we should be looking at though is how Donald Trump acts in public about this investigation, because that is really the telltale signs I think of where the investigation is going and what he's hearing as we see former FBI Director Mueller look into these Russia ties or alleged ties between the Trump campaign and, of course, the meddling in the U.S. elections there -- Erin.
BURNETT: All right. Mark Preston, thank you very much.
And OUTFRONT next, Dr. Sanjay Gupta talking about the injured in the bombings, says the number will likely rise, the physical devastation coming in waves. He is OUTFRONT.
And the victims, we're learning about those who lost their lives in the attack, including an eight-year-old girl.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[19:50:39] BURNETT: Breaking news in the investigation into the deadly terror attack outside an Ariana Grande concert. The U.K. is just raising its threat level to the highest level, that means an attack is imminent. That's the highest that level has been in nearly a decade.
Right now, this is the Empire State Building in New York, tonight, going dark as a way to pay tribute to the victims of last night's attack, the victims that were overwhelmingly young.
Our chief medical correspondent, Dr. Sanjay Gupta, is OUTFRONT.
And, Sanjay, we were just talking -- you know, terror experts saying that this was purposeful, that they targeted such young children. It was completely intentional. Nearly 60 people are recovering right now, some fighting for their lives. What can you tell us about the injuries that they likely suffered given that we don't yet know exactly what sort of bomb this was?
DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN CHIEF MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, yes, and we're talking about the physical injuries here. Obviously, there's all sorts of injuries, psychologically as well. But, you know, when it comes to what medical professionals are sort of looking for when they hear about an incident like this, which typically was on battlefield, you hardly ever heard about this in civilian settings.
But they will look for this pattern of injury that sort of focused on three waves. The first wave after an explosion is this concussive blast which people said they heard and they felt. As you know, Erin, inside the stadium. That can cause a blast lung, for example. The second wave of injury usually comes from shrapnel, and anything can be shrapnel in a situation like this. Glass, for example, that's flying and the third wave which is typically bodies into bodies. And, again, these are horrific injuries. The first responders are typically thinking of trying to take care of patients based on these waves of injury.
What often happens is that there's a population of people that don't know that they have been injured, Erin, that they may have had an injury to their lungs or their intestines not recognized and they will in the next hours and days still be going to the hospital. So, likely, the number is going to go up.
BURNETT: Of people who are injured. And in terms of the type of explosive device this was, obviously, in Boston, we saw so many leg injuries, right, and people who lost their legs because of those pressure cooker bombs on the ground. If this were a suicide vest at a different level, would that create a different set of injuries?
GUPTA: Yes, no doubt, it really does sort of follow suit with what kind -- where the explosive was, where exactly the source of the explosion was, in this case outside in that area. So, you would see a different pattern of injuries, but they still sort of follow those three patterns, those three waves that we described. And that's important because they're trying to figure out which hospitals in the area are going to be able to care for these patients, how significant the injuries likely to be, all that comes into play here.
BURNETT: All right. Sanjay Gupta, thank you very much. And next among those killed, an 8-year-old child, a teenaged super fan, we remember them tonight.
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[19:57:00] BURNETT: Twenty-two people lost their lives in the vicious terrorist attack in Manchester. So many of them were young and so excited to just go see a pop superstar like Ariana Grande.
And now, we are learning who they are. Brynn Gingras is OUTFRONT.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
BRYNN GINGRAS, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Unifying voices and then a silent pause, in the heart of Manchester. Those in Albert Square remembering the 22 people killed and 59 others injured in the terrorist attack that followed Ariana Grande's concert Monday night.
BISHOP DAVID WALKER, MANCHESTER: You cannot defeat us, because love in the end is always stronger than hate.
GINGRAS: The youngest of the victims identified so far, 8-year-old Saffie-Rose Roussos. Her describes her as, quote, simply a beautiful girl in every aspect of the world.
Eighteen-year-old Georgia Callander was an Ariana Grande super fan. She met the pop star in 2015 and looked forward to the concert so much, the day before she tweeted at Grande, so excited to see you tomorrow.
Callander was studying health and social care in school, which issued a statement saying: Georgina was a lovely young student who was very popular with her peers.
Friends almost immediately expressing their heartbreak on social media. To my beautiful best friend, I hope you rest in peace, my darling. I will always miss you, one wrote.
The Facebook page of 26-year-old John Atkinson turned into a memorial page after news of his death spread. A dance studio in his hometown expressing their condolences: John was always an amazingly happy, gentle person and a real pleasure to teach when he came to our adult classes.
Dozens of others are being treated in hospital. Officials say at least 12 children are among those seriously injured.
Then, there are families waiting in anguish, receiving no word yet on what happened to their loved one.
Olivia Campbell is among those missing.
CHARLOTE CAMPBELL, MOTHER OF MISSING GIRL: She's my baby, and I miss her so much. If she's out there, just know I'll be there.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
BURNETT: Today, thousands gathered in Albert Square in Manchester to remember the victims, to hope for those who have not yet come home, there were speeches and tears. As you can see, so many gathering in solidarity. It was also, though, a celebration of the city's resilience.
Poet Tony Walsh read a poem that he wrote about Manchester called, 'This is the Place".
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TONY WALSH, POET: There's hard times again in these streets of Manchester, but we won't take defeat and we don't want your pity, because this is the place where we stand strong together with a smile on our face, Mancunians forever.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: And tonight, the world stands with Manchester in its moment of sorrow.
Thanks for joining us.
Anderson is next.
