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Erin Burnett Outfront
W.H. Contradicts Russian's Account Of Trump-Putin Meeting; Trump, Putin Agree To "Move Forward" Despite Election Meddling; Trump Engages In Twitter War During High-Stake. Aired 7-8p ET
Aired July 07, 2017 - 19:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[19:00:07] ERIN BURNETT, CNN ANCHOR: OutFront next, he said he said. The White House has one version of the Trump/Putin meeting and the Kremlin another. Who's telling the truth?
Plus, Trump wants to move on from Russian meddling, but how does the United States move on when more Russian spies are moving in. And Rick Perry mocked for his Econ 101 lesson. What's that supply and demand theory again? Who's right? Let's go out front.
Good evening. I'm Erin Burnett. OutFront tonight, Trump versus Putin, who is telling the truth. President Trump in a major surprise opening his first ever sit down with the Russian President Vladimir Putin, by raising the issue of Russian meddling in the 2016 election.
Now, according to the Secretary of State, Rex Tillerson, who was the only other American official in the room, Trump raised the issues citing "the concerns of the American people."
Now, Putin denied the meddling and the Russian Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov who was the only other Russian official in the room said Trump, "heard and accepted Putin's denial." So if true this is obviously stunning, right? I mean did the president of the United States accept Putin's word against that of America's top intelligence officers? It is a fair question because here's president Trump just 24 hours ago.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I think it was Russia, but I think it was probably other people and/or countries and I see nothing wrong with that statement. Nobody really knows. Nobody really knows for sure.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: Except for they do. And tonight a senior White House official is firing back at Putin's version saying it's not true. Trump didn't accept the Russian president's denial. Here's one thing we do know, that Trump says it was an honor to meet Vladimir Putin.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: President Putin and I have been discussing various things, and I think it's going very well. We look forward to a lot of very positive things happening to Russia and the United States and for everybody concerned and it's an honor to be with you. Thank you.
VLADIMIR PUTIN, PRESIDENT OF RUSSIA: Thank you.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: OK. The meeting between the two lasted for two hours and 15 minutes, which is a really important point. And I say that because it was only scheduled to last about 40 minutes. So, it is very significant that it went so long.
Jeff Zeleny is out front. He is traveling with the president in Hamburg, Germany tonight. And Jeff, look, obviously two very different versions. And I think it's really important for the American people to know which one is true. But no matter which is, the Trump Administration is saying this meeting was a great success.
JEFF ZELENY, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, good evening, Erin. I mean, it's not always that unusual after a bilateral meeting like this, a meeting between two leaders, there to be different versions of events, particularly when there are only six people in that room, the two presidents, their secretaries of state and translators, that is it.
But the White House without question is explaining this as a win. And I think in some respects it is in the sense that they had that long of a meeting. There is no doubt that relations are at, you know, at very low levels between these two super powers. So the fact that these presidents are talking together, that is certainly a good thing.
But when you break down what they talked about, about Syria, of course, there are some developments there, a potential cease fire in parts of Syria. But on that election interference, the fact that the president brought it up certainly will, you know, kind of get rid of the elephant in the room, if you will. But how he brought it up is still going to be dissected in many ways here. He used the language that this concerns the American people. He never said as far as we know that this concerns him.
And the reality here is that he, you know, has reacted with so much more vigor and so much more anger in his attacks against virtually everyone else than Vladimir Putin over this. So, once Republicans in Congress and Democrats as well start dissecting this, that will be one issue we're already hearing some concern about that the president was not forceful enough about this election meddling.
And the reality here is I was at that briefing with Secretary of State Rex Tillerson. He said they agreed to work forward to sort of eliminate cyber attacks and election hacks in the future. But unless the president says he is concerned about it and he is taking this seriously, hard to imagine Vladimir Putin will as well. But so interesting Melania Trump.
She came into the meeting about a minute an hour in and was sort of seeing how it was going, trying to get them to wrap up. They ended up going for an hour longer than that. But tonight she was sitting at dinner next to Vladimir Putin at dinner at the G20 summit dinner. Who knows if not just by (INAUDIBLE) of if Melania Trump is now playing a key role in this key diplomatic dance. Erin?
BURNETT: All right. Thank you very much Jeff. Matthew Chance is in Moscow tonight. And Matthew, look, it is really important which of these versions is true, and the Russians say that what happened in that meeting between Putin and Trump was Trump acknowledged and accepted that the Russians didn't meddle in the 2016 election, right?
[19:05:04] MATTHEW CHANCE, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Right. Well, what Sergey Lavrov, the Russian foreign minister says that President Trump accepted the statements made by Vladimir Putin, the Russian president, that Russia was not involved in the hacking in the involvement in disruption of the U.S. political system, the U.S. election.
He went on, and he's been quoted in state media saying that actually Trump said that the involvement, the extent of the involvement by Russia in the election hacking had been exaggerated in some circles. So that's what's being reported here in the state media in Russia. That President Trump actually sort of made that additional concession during that meeting with President Putin as well saying, look, you know, Russia's role has been exaggerated. And you know what, that kind of tallies with what President Trump has been saying all along. I mean we both know he's never fully accepted what U.S. intelligence agencies say --
BURNETT: Right.
CHANCE: -- which is that these election hacks were the responsibilities of the work of Russia.
BURNETT: All right. Thank you very much, Matthew Chance. As you point out he hasn't. Everyone heard the president say nobody really knows. Nobody really knows for sure, except for his own intelligence agencies which all say beyond a doubt they do know for sure.
OutFront now, the Democratic Congressman Eric Swalwell, member of the House Intelligence Committee. Congressman, look, these are two extremely different versions of the Putin/Trump meeting. Putin's version Trump accepts that Putin didn't do anything. Trump's version he did not accept President Putin's claim. Who do you believe, congressman?
REP. ERIC SWALWELL (D), HOUSE INTELLIGENCE COMMITTEE: Good evening, Erin. I think there is an opportunity now. The ball is in the president's court to refute what the foreign minister has said. It's true that the president accepted Vladimir Putin's account, then we should know that. And if the president doesn't believe that what they are saying is true, he should say no, I confronted Vladimir Putin, I told him we know what they did and it's not acceptable. But the president's silence as far as I'm concerned tells us what we need to know, which is the Russian account is the only account that's out there right now. BURNETT: Right. And we certainly know that he has no fear of putting his own account out himself. He (INAUDIBLE) do it. He can go on Twitter on do it himself. And maybe he will. But to this point, as you point out, congressman, he has been silent. But it wasn't even clear, as you know, that Trump would even bring Russian meddling up, right? A lot of people thought he wouldn't. The White House indications were that he probably wasn't going to.
But according to Secretary Tillerson, Trump opened the meeting with Putin and I want to just read you Tillerson's words here by, "raising the concerns of the American people", regarding Russian interference in the 2016 election. Actually, that's where the quote ends. Are you satisfied with that description, raising the concerns of the American people?
SWALWELL: He's right that it is a concern of the American people. Three-quarters of the American people believe there should be an investigation into what Russia did. But what's troublesome is that id does not appear it is his concern. Erin, I have to ask. What are we getting as a country out of this relationship or this meeting with Russia? They attack our democracy. They have made a mess of our country over the past six months. They have been given secrets in the Oval Office. They haven't changed their behavior in Syria or in Ukraine, so what is the United States getting and right now it looks like this was just another win for Vladimir Putin.
BURNETT: As we reported the Russians feel embolden because the lack of retaliation from both President Trump and President Obama. I mean, there is another important thing here from the meeting today, congressman. According to Secretary Tillerson, the Russians asked for "proof and evidence" that Russia was behind the election meddling. Here is Secretary Tillerson.
(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)
REX TILLERSON, U.S. SECRETARY OF STATE: The Russians have asked for proof and evidence. I'll leave that to the intelligence community to address. The answer to that question.
(END AUDIO CLIP)
BURNETT: I'll leave that to the intelligence community to address. What do you make of that response, congressman?
SWALWELL: Well, the intelligence community both put out a lot of evidence on this. They could go to my website, Erin, Swalwell.house.gov, I can make all the dots as to Russia's interference in our election. But the real issue here if you put aside the questions around whether people on the Trump team worked with Russia, let's just put that aside, no one disputes that Russia is going to do this again. And that's what I'm really concerned about is the president doesn't seem to want to do anything to protect or secure future elections. And If you are a Republican or a Democrat, that should really worry you as we go into the November 2018 election cycle. BURNETT: So, you know, you just heard the president say nobody really
knows. Nobody really knows for sure. Those are his words whether the Russians meddled in the election, right? In response, the former chief of the DNI, James Clapper, said on CNN that that comment through the intelligence community under the bus. So when the Russians asked for proof today and Tillerson's response was well that's up to the intelligence community, did he humiliate America's intelligence leaders directly to the Russian leader by not defending them?
SWALWELL: It certainly didn't look he was standing with our intelligence community. And Erin, I also want to point out that the president's statement yesterday at the press conference where he said that, you know, the Russians did it. Perhaps there were others. We'll never know.
[19:10:06] That sounded a lot like a statement he had made back in May of 2015 when he was confronted about evidence that the Russians shot down the Malaysian airlines flight over Ukraine. All of the evidence in the world showed that the Russians were a part of that. But candidate Trump at that time said maybe the Russians did it. Maybe Ukraine did it. We'll never know. And that we'll never know throw- away statement is really -- that's exactly what Russia wants him to say, and that plays right into the Russian playbook. It is just really so doubt and make people question what is so obvious.
BURNETT: All right, Congressman Swalwell, I appreciate your time. Thank you.
SWALWELL: My pleasure, Erin.
Next, Melania Trump, the one sent in to try to end the meeting to try to end it as it went on and on and on and. And the one thing right next to Putin at dinner tonight. You'll see.
Plus, Hillary Clinton's campaign chairman John Podesta rips into Donald Trump calling him a whack job president. And Energy Secretary Rick Perry on supply and demand. He's (INAUDIBLE) of the theory is getting mocked tonight. Was it another oops moment or not?
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BURNETT: New tonight, President Trump and Russian President Vladimir Putin agreeing to, "move forward" despite Russia's interference in the presidential election. Here's how the Secretary of State Rex Tillerson put it.
(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)
TILLERSON: What the two presidents I think rightly focussed on is how do we move forward, how do we move forward from here because it's not clear to me that we will ever come to some agreed upon resolution of that question between the two nations. So the question is what do we do now?
(END AUDIO CLIP) [19:15:13] BURNETT: Is the question what do we do now? Because here is what's happening right now. Current and former U.S. intelligence officials tell CNN, Russia has ramped up its spy activity in United States since the election. Nearly 150 spies in the united states right now. They say Russia is emboldened because of the lack of retaliation to its meddling in the U.S. election. And here's wha the nation's top former spy had to say.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JAMES CLAPPER, FORMER DIRECTOR OF NATIONAL INTELLIGENCE: They are going to stretch the envelope as far as they can to collect information and I think largely to, if I could use the military phrase, prep the battlefield for 2018 elections.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: OutFront tonight the former Chief of Staff and Director of Policy Planning for the former Secretary of State John Kerry. John Finer, he spent many meetings with the Russian president, former CIA director under Bill Clinton, former senior advisor with the Trump campaign, director James Woolsey and Editor-in-Chief of the Daily Beast, John Avlon. So John, let met start with you. Is the president rightly focused as Rex Tillerson says on moving forward?
JOHN AVLON, EDITOR-IN-CHIEF, DAILY BEAST: Not remotely sufficient. This is a meeting where he had a chance to sit down, not only show strength, but stand up for the integrity of the American system and it seems like he got rolled. Because whether or not you accept Lavrov's, you know, rhetoric that he accepted the results, Tillerson himself said it's time to move on. Basically this is an agree to disagree. That means that we're not going to inflict any pain upon the Russians going forward. That is an incitement to further incursions and the fact that we have announced a cyber working group is invitation to further mischief. This is a disastrous meeting from that result with the American people.
BURNETT: Director, you know, last night we just saw James Clapper, right. He also said Russia is preparing the battlefield. That is what they were doing. The 2016 was they were testing a lot of things out. And 2018 is going to be real battlefield. So, should President Trump have accepted that what is gone is by gone, let's just move ahead.
JAMES WOOLSEY, FORMER CIA DIRECTOR: What he should have done was what Ronald Reagan did in the early 1980s when the Soviets were detected stealing some really sensitive and very important technology. Reagan and Casey said not a word. They just let the CIA fix it that high- tech gear and let the Russians continue to steal it. And about two or three years later, as it started blowing up and taking out the entire Soviet pipeline all over Euroasia, Reagan and Casey smiled. That's the way to do it.
BURNETT: You're saying don't mention anything about?
WOOLSEY: If don't mention anything, if you can retaliate otherwise much more effective. Now, if you have to mention something, I think you should be a bit grumpier than they were here. But mentioning something with the Russians doesn't do much good unless you are in a circumstance like the one I was lucky enough to be in '79, '80, '81 when their empire was collapsing because the Berlin wall had fallen. I was running some negotiations.
So let met tell you, the Russians were really nice when their empire collapsed.
BURNETT: Yes.
WOOLSEY: That's what you want. And the best way to get that to happen now is probably to drive down the price of oil, that's the thing they care about the most.
BURNETT: So John, you know, you have been in the room with Vladimir Putin many times, (INAUDIBLE) obviously Secretary Kerry. The last time that President Obama and Putin met there was the memorable icy stare, right. That was sort of the moment. We'll show it to everybody. That everybody remembers, which is, I mean, there's something about this or maybe it was just a moment but the time it was pretty nasty looking. A very different than today, OK. Trump and Putin laughing, smiling, big handshake, patting him on a back. I mean It was a very, very different tone. Could Trump though actually be the one getting Putin right?
JONATHAN FINER, FORMER CHIEF OF STAFF, U.S. STATE DEPARTMENT: So I think we'll have to see. I think you're exactly right that the tone was completely different from the last few meetings that President Obama had with President Putin and not only in what we saw in the camera, but in Secretary Tillerson's description of the meeting he went out of his way. And this is, you know, the U.S. side characterizing the meeting as if fit (ph) to its own advantage --
BURNETT: Right.
FINER: -- as warm as lots of good chemistry between the two leaders. That might not have been the way I would have chosen to characterize this meeting if people were already suspicious that there was something going on with President Trump and President Putin. But the fact they chose to do it that way I think is quite telling. And now we got to see what the U.S. does in the aftermath.
AVLON: This is, look, you know, we've seen this movie before with different presidents. Vladimir Putin is been the constant with four presidents now. And both Bush and Obama began with an attempted reset. Remember, I look at his eyes I saw his soul. A big reset button. Well, John McCain got it right. I looked in his eyes and I saw three letters, KGB.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Right.
AVLON: So, thinking that you can charm your way to a better relation or that his fundamental interest as a nation or nature as an individual (INAUDIBLE) is going to change is totally naive and dangerous for the American people. BURNETT: So director, you know, this is something that Trump has embraced. I think it seems as if he's seen it in a competitive way. Putin didn't like the other leaders of the United States, but he's going to like me and that's going to change things, right. Here's President Trump on his own words.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: He hates Obama. Doesn't hate us. I think he liked me. I'd get along great with him.
If Putin likes Donald Trump, I consider that an asset, not a liability. It would be great if we could get along with Russia, just so you understand that. Tomorrow you will say Donald Trump wants to get along with Russia. This is terrible. It's not terrible. It is good.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
[19:20: 13] WOOLSEY: It all depends on why the Russians want to get along with you. If they want to get along with you because you just destroyed your empire as we had effectively in a lot of ways in 1989, then that is fine.
BURNETT: Well that doesn't seem to be what it is now. You have an embolden --
WOOLSEY: well, no, because we have --
BURNETT: -- trying to x up and down his empire again, Ukraine, Crimea.
WOOLSEY: We are sitting on our hands and have been for long time, just kind of smiling and nodding and some meetings go better. It doesn't matter. What you have to do is undermine their power. You do that, you'll get along really nicely with them. They have -- people talk about the 150 new spies. Pacepa, the head of Romanian intelligence defected back in '79, and he had with him a huge amount of materials which got Ceausescu who hanged in Romania.
But one of the things he had was their complete plans for disinformation, disnformatia (ph), which is essentially a massive lying program. They have more -- Pacepa was the head of their intelligence service. They have more people involved in disinformation than they do have men and women in uniform.
BURNETT: And you think that's still true with the Russians?
WOOLSEY: I see no reason to believe that it's not. They are absolutely committed to a massive lie about the United States --
BURNETT: Yes.
WOOLSEY: -- which they call their great enemy. And we basically need to undercut that strategy and that approach. BURNETT: But the way that these meetings go, I would assume, is Putin
says what he's going to say. I didn't do it. I didn't do it. They have this personable meeting and does Trump know that's a lie.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You can't start with the meeting.
FINER: The question isn't whether he can get along with Russia. In some ways that's the easy part. If you're doing what they want you to do the same kinds of things publicly that they want you say like, you know, who knows who hack the election. You'll get along with well fine. The question is what he can get out of Russia.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Right.
FINER: I mean we really have to be looking forward. You know, the Secretary Tillerson, the most disturbing part of his comments was that this thing that happened is a matter of history.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Right.
BURNETT: Right.
FINER: That we want to understand about the past. The reason we want to understand what happened in that election is so we can protect the country now from 2018 to 2022.
BURNETT: Let's be clear. We know that they were trying to access sensitive voter data.
AVLON: Yes.
BURNETT: It could have been trying to (INAUDIBLE).
AVLON: At least 21 states.
BURNETT: There is no evidence they effected any kind of vote itself. But clearly that was among the goals.
AVLON: Yes.
BURNETT: So if you didn't get it right the first time maybe you get it right the second time.
WOOLSEY: Especially since they have 16 months only to get through figuring out how to hack into the machines.
BURNETT: yes.
AVLON: But more importantly, I mean the horse they backed, what they wanted to advance for whatever reason succeeded, right? And I think it's one of the reasons the administration has discomfort in confronting this issue is because they were unwittingly the beneficiaries of this.
BURNETT: Yes. AVLON: But more importantly, as the director keeps pointing out, the Russians respond to leverage, to pain points. And the question is is there any evidence at all that this administration is going to try to inflict a degree of pain within diplomatic spears to change the Russian's behavior. The answer is none, none that we've seen, not hat we've heard specially from the president.
WOOLSEY: I think the president has the right temperament to do that, but I haven't seen it yet. I don't think you have either.
BURNETT: Well, thank you very much. Pretty sobering words. I appreciate it. Next. Why was President Trump talking about John Podesta and the 2016 election when he was getting ready to meet with world leaders here in 2017 at the G20.
And remember when Rick Perry forgot one of the government agencies he wanted to cut?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP
RICK PERRY, UNITED STATES SECRETARY OF ENERGY: The third one I can't -- sorry. Oops.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: Did Perry top that moment or not?
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[19:27:30] BURNETT: President Trump sparking a new fight in the midst his high stakes overseas trip. This time taking to Twitter of course to attack Clinton's former campaign chair just before he sat down with the Russian President Vladimir Putin. So, at a time when Trump was trying to get praise for being presidential, why go on Twitter just spark a new feud with someone from the past? Alex Marquardt is out front.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ALEX MARQUARDT, CNN SENIOR NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): President Trump has prided himself on being a nontraditional American president. But few things are more traditional than foreign visits. At his first stop in Europe, Trump won praise for new lines in his speech supporting NATO and calling out Russia.
TRUMP: We are encouraging Russia to cease its stabilizing activities in Ukraine and elsewhere and it's support for hostile regimes including Syria and Iran.
MARQUARDT: But the old Trump was still there, railing on the media.
TRUMP: They have been fake news for a long time.
MARQUARDT: And tweeting today out of the blue about Hillary Clinton's campaign manager, saying "Everyone here is talking about why John Podesta refused to give the DNC server to the FBI and CIA. Disgraceful." Podesta responding calling Trump a whack job adding, "Dude, get your head in the game. You are representing the U.S. at the G20."
DOUGLAS BRINKLEY, CNN PRESIDENTIAL HISTORIAN: I think Donald Trump is becoming a more of a world leader. He clearly has a lot of the protocol down path. I think he enjoys getting out of the Washington, D.C. At times he does well at these events, but he ends up ruining things by an odd tweet or using the word honor when meeting Putin. And then that becomes the headline. It seems like a botched job.
MARQUARDT: That handshake with Putin the most highly anticipated meeting of the year. Then the more formal sit-down.
TRUMP: It's to be an honor to be with you.
BRINKLEY: I think it's kind of strange that President Trump talks about what an honor it is to meet Vladimir Putin. Putin is somebody who has ordered a hacking of our elections in 2016, who is a global menace to American interest. So the danger for Trump is in meeting of Putin, wanting to show an amount of respect. He tends to perhaps overdo it.
MARQUARDT: The upbeat mood in stark contrast with Putin's last meeting with an American president just as the U.S. was accusing Russia in meddling in last year's presidential election. On the global stage with the eyes of the world watching, the stakes are higher.
[19:30:01] The dance a delicate one. Trump's international learning curve has been a mine field, accused of curtsying or bowing to the king of Saudi Arabia, while in Israel telling its president --
TRUMP: We just got back from the Middle East.
MARQUARDT: -- prompting a face palm from Israel's ambassador to the U.S. According to sources, he shared classified information to Russian adversaries in the Oval Office, while ignoring the outreach of the friends.
Then, the shove seen around the world, pushing aside the prime minister of Montenegro.
DOUGLAS BRINKLEY, CNN PRESIDENTIAL HISTORIAN: This has gotten him to the White House. Whether it will get him to be seen as a successful president is what we're all sitting and waiting to see.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
MARQUARDT: But few are waiting to see whether President Trump dramatically changes that behavior, whether at home or abroad. Instead, he seems to want to change what presidential means. He recently defended his use of social media which as he did today has so often gotten in the way of the bigger message, saying on Twitter, of course, that the way he uses social media is not presidential, it's modern day presidential -- Erin.
ERIN BURNETT, CNN HOST: All right. Alex, thank you very much. Well put.
And now, let's go to the former Republican Congressman Jack Kingston, who is also a former senior advisor for the Trump campaign, and Van Jones, former special adviser to President Obama.
Congressman, let me start with you and this Podesta fracas. The president tweeting, everybody is talking about John Podesta. Our Jeff Zeleny is traveling with the president says that nobody is talking about Podesta over there, which makes sense because why would you be? What does the president -- what's he gain by tweeting that?
JACK KINGSTON, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: I think, Erin, he has the ability to play games or, you know, on lots of different levels. And I don't mean a game necessarily. Although Van might say it is a game. But I think he does keep people off balance.
He's unpredictable. It is something the American people are captivated by. And they enjoy the fact that he is like the rest of us, when we get in our own Twitters, we say emotional things. We say spontaneous things.
In this case, I have to say, it is a substantive question.
BURNETT: Or we consider it unprofessional and we don't. But that's some of us.
KINGSTON: Well, yes, some would. But look at Podesta's response to him. He got down in the gutter immediately --
BURNETT: Fair.
KINGSTON: -- and called the president of the United States a whack job. So, but I think it is a substantive question, why isn't there an investigation about Podesta when he was on the government payroll sitting on the board of a company that was doing business with Russia?
BURNETT: OK. Fair to raise that question today, right before the Putin meeting, Van?
VAN JONES, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: No, it's not. You know, part of what's so sad is that this is a summer when the United States is facing probably it's gravest threat since World War II. We have an actual madman in North Korea with actual nuclear missiles who is apparently now able to hit Hawaii and Alaska, American soil. That should be full stop the agenda for the United States, to rally the world to stop the threat.
I have no love lost for George W. Bush, but when he just thought that Saddam Hussein might have weapons of mass destruction, he rallied the world. He tried to at least.
We are in a situation where somebody who -- listen, on Saddam Hussein's worst day, he could be the psychiatrist for Kim Jong-un. This guy is totally crazy. And we're not talking about real threats.
We're talking about John Podesta? We're talking about John Podesta this summer? It's nuts.
KINGSTON: But, Van, that's the genius of Donald Trump.
JONES: No.
KINGSTON: He's not talking about John Podesta. His critics are. What he's talking about is selling Patriot missiles to Poland, he's talking about NATO putting in more money in their defense budget.
JONES: No.
KINGSTON: He's the guy dropped 59 tomahawk missiles in Syria on Russian backed troops.
(CROSSTALK)
JONES: Listen, when you are in your little bathtub with your rubber ducky and telling yourself these stories, that's wonderful. I'm sure it sounds great to you, but the rest of the country is looking at --
KINGSTON: Van, I don't have any rubber ducky.
(CROSSTALK)
KINGSTON: Speaking of pulling a debate to the high ground.
JONES: The rest of the country is looking at what they're actually seeing, which is somebody who one he is given a script and something to say and to do, he apparently can do a decent job. But the minute he runs to the rest room or to closet and could get his phone out, he starts doing nutty stuff. And it's not good for America.
And you can't pretend it's good for America. There's nothing genius about it. If this is genius, we got a bunch of genius kindergarteners.
KINGSTON: Van, I was thinking about you yesterday, and I'm absolutely being serious about this. You said during his State of the Union Address that he became the president of the United States.
I think yesterday his address to Poland, which was just as important, I think it was a magnificent speech. Even Democrats on some of the charts showed that they gave him a C. Republicans, of course, gave him an A-plus. But independents gave him a B on it. That's what multiple focus groups said that because I think it was such a great speech.
JONES: I'm glad that you're proud of that speech. I think he has been presidential the whole time. Nixon, Nixon was president the whole time and he was -- he had very little respect for that office.
[19:35:02] And I think Donald Trump, when he does stuff like this, shows little respect for the office. He shows little respect for the American people. And I'm going to tell you -- I want to say one last thing -- the summer before 9/11, we spent the whole summer talking about Gary Condit and Chandra Levy and distracting ourselves while enemies plotted and gathered. And I'm telling you, right now, you've got a plot gathering against this country from North Korea and we're talking about everything but that because of your president.
BURNETT: OK, hold on. Let me just get in here. The headlines Trump got just from today, on the day of the tweet, right, Trump confronts Putin on election hacking. U.S. and Russia reach a deal on Syria ceasefire. U.S. labor market roars back.
I mean, these are from CBS News, "The Washington Post", "The New York Times", I mean, I guess they're all fake news, right? So, it must be all untrue, Congressman. Although, I bet the president would be happy to accept these headlines because they flatter him.
Go ahead.
KINGSTON: Well, I think he will. I think this is just part of Donald Trump, and those who dislike him and those who love him just have to accept it is part of him. But I do think what he is doing right now in Europe is very important and I agree with Van. North Korea should be an international focal point. And that's why sitting down with President Putin is so important and yet, the American press seems to -- some of the people that were on your last panel, for example, Erin, who did not think he raised the Russian issue enough, I would have hoped that --
(CROSSTALK)
BURNETT: One of those people was former CIA director and Trump advisor, Director Woolsey. So, a far cry from a natural Trump critic.
KINGSTON: But they should be equally concerned about how much time in this two hour meeting, which was supposed to be a 30-minute meeting, how much time was dedicated to North Korea and how much was dedicated to terrorism, how much was dedicated to Syria? And I think that should be more of a focal point than did he press enough?
And, by the way, I can't believe they're going to accept Lavrov's word over Tillerson. It's just unbelievable to me.
BURNETT: OK. Go ahead, Van. Final word.
JONES: Well, I just think we have to respect the fact that, yes, the president did -- got some stuff right on this trip. That's great. People, listen, I think most Americans would love to see him do that kind of stuff.
But nobody can look at only one side of the sandwich. You got to look at both sides. And when the other side has a whole bunch of crap in it, it is hard to eat that meal.
BURNETT: All right. Thank you both very much. I appreciate it.
And next, the Energy Secretary Rick Perry gave a lesson on economics. Did he have another oops moment or not?
And Trump and Putin agree on a ceasefire in Syria. We go to the ground in Raqqa to find out if it's really happening, an exclusive look at the battle against ISIS.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[19:41:14] BURNETT: New tonight, the Energy Secretary Rick Perry being mocked for saying this in response to a question about the American shale gas boom.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
RICK PERRY, SECRETARY OF ENERGY: Here's an economic lessons that supply and demand. You put the supply out there and the demand will follow that.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: So, again, that was about shale gas. He made the comment during a visit to a coal plant in West Virginia. So, was it another oops moment for Perry, or is he actually right?
OUTFRONT now, former senior economic advisor of the Trump campaign and CNN senior economics analyst, Stephen Moore, and John Avlon also back with me.
So, Steve, let me start with this. Secretary Perry says, you put the supply out there, demand will follow. Obviously, with lots of things in the economy, that's a pretty silly thing to say. He's talking about shale gas and the energy market. Are people right to mock him or not?
STEPHEN MOORE, CNN SENIOR ECONOMICS ANALYST: I don't really see why there is any controversy here. Sure, any time you have an increase in supply, what happens to the price, Erin, when you have an increase in supply?
BURNETT: Right. So, well, it plunges, as we've seen with shale gas.
MOORE: It goes down, right? So we had a big increase in the supply, a huge increase, 75 percent in American production. And remember, here is a number for you. In 2014, the price of oil hit a high at $105 a barrel. Today, the price of oil is $45 to $50. We've seen a 50 percent decline in the price of oil.
So, what does that do? It means, the increase -- you've got a huge surge in demand for oil because it's cheap. In fact, what's happening in the energy markets right now is that huge boom in the shale oil and gas are really decimating all the other areas. Everybody is using shale gas. It is hurting nuclear. It's hurting wind. It's hurting solar.
BURNETT: So, you are making the case, right, Steve, that when it comes to energy markets, and obviously, some of them might be different than others. Coal obviously is more complex. He was at a coal plant. But again, the question was about shale gas, that at increase in supply because people want to drive. They will buy more gas and drive more.
So, you are saying in the case that Rick Perry is talking about, he's right and not ridiculous?
MOORE: Yes, so what happened was the big increase in the supply over the last five or six or seven years has led to a reduction in price and a big increase and people are using more on gas and less of the alternative. So, I think he got his economics exactly right. I'm going to give him an A.
JOHN AVLON, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: Great. Thank you, professor. Let's see if we could find some common ground here, right?
MOORE: Yes.
AVLON: Let's filled it up. First point, you acknowledge that he got the basic equation, when he said, let me give you a basic lesson in economics that he got the equation backwards. As a general rule, you acknowledge that, right?
MOORE: What do you mean? Explain.
AVLON: Look, you're making the argument that the laws of supply and demand are inverse when it comes to energy because increased supply will lead to lower costs which will increase demand. Now, that may be a fair, smart, nuanced point with regard to energy.
(CROSSTALK)
MOORE: Hold on. That's true of every industry.
AVLON: Everything?
MOORE: Yes. And when you have an increase in supply of something, then the price goes down because it's more affordable and people will buy more of it.
AVLON: Look --
BURNETT: Well, assuming they want it. I mean, there is some products. But something like that --
MOORE: Yes, they have to want it. That's true. That is true.
AVLON: I think, look --
BURNETT: They want energy. That's the point. And the question was about shale gas. Just to be clear. It was about shale gas.
AVLON: We're bending over backwards to be fair here, folks, but let's also just acknowledge the obvious, the man misspoke. He screwed it up. He got it backwards. And so, I think when you try to spin it to make him look like a secret genius, it doesn't exactly ring true.
BURNETT: Do you think that's true, Steve, or do you think, look, he's a governor of Texas, and he knows the oil and gas market, and he meant what he say?
MOORE: Erin, that's what I was going to say. If there is anybody knows the oil market, it's the guy who is the governor of Texas during this boom. And you just saw so many jobs created in Texas.
Look, I don't know exactly the point that he was trying to make there, but it is true that we've had a big, big increase in jobs. We've got a big increase in -- you know, the great thing that's happening in the energy market right now is that we're now exporting oil for the first time, a big story in "The Wall Street Journal" about that.
[19:45:07] You know, that's all good and the increase of supply and the technology has made that all possible.
AVLON: Right. But, Steve, you'd acknowledge also that in the last decade when we had the shale gas boom, which has had enormous positive economic impact, the price of oil and gas at the pump hasn't consistently gone down, right? I mean --
MOORE: It has the last four --
AVLON: It has fluctuated over periods.
MOORE: Yes, it's been down now for three years. Three years ago, we were at almost $4 a gallon. Now, in most states, we were down to $2. That's a big saving to the American consumer.
BURNETT: You know, part of this, though, John, is political in the sense it was Rick Perry.
AVLON: Sure.
BURNETT: OK? And that's part of the reason it is getting so much attention. He has been accused of -- well, not accused. He has committed the gap before.
MOORE: Well, you're talking about when he couldn't name the cabinet --
(CROSSTALK)
BURNETT: For those watching television for the last few years, let us replay it.
AVLON: Oh, the greatest.
MOORE: Oh.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PERRY: The third agency of government I would do away with the Education, the Commerce and -- let's see. I can't. The third one I can't. Sorry. Oops.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: Is he a victim of being stereotyped, John?
AVLON: Yes. Yes, he is. You know, you screw up your own cabinet position in that public a forum, that's going to leave a mark, folks. BURNETT: And that's part of why we're seeing what we're seeing now.
All right. Thank you both very much. I appreciate.
And OUTFRONT next, on the verge of what they say, the Putin and Trump has a ceasefire in Syria, we are on the ground. Rare and exclusive access to the ISIS stronghold.
And then on a much lighter note, this.
Do you remember this? The countdown to CNN series, "THE NINETIES", one of the stars of 90210 comes OUTFRONT.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BURNETT: President Trump striking a deal with the Russian President Vladimir Putin.
[19:50:03] They are agreeing to try and stop the violence that has ravaged Syria. And tonight, in an explosive report, CNN takes you to the heart of the deadly war against ISIS tonight.
Nick Paton Walsh is OUTFRONT in northern Syria.
And, Nick, you are actually there. They can talk about making a deal, but you are actually seeing what it means. U.S. Secretary of State Rex Tillerson says there is a ceasefire now in southwest Syria.
You have been covering this war and you are there now. Will it hold?
NICK PATON WALSH, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Unclear really at this point, Erin. We've seen so many ceasefires come and go in this five-year war in Syria. In the south, we're talking about some of the lesser tense areas. It's tense, yes, and it's their conflicts there, particularly between Syrian regime militia and Syrian rebels with the U.S. backing down there. We've seen a lot of tension there. Often even with U.S. trainers in the midst and there have been requirements between Moscow and Washington to talk to try to calm that kind of thing down.
So, this deal when it comes into effect, we learn more detail about it, may well go further to calm that down to and perhaps as well reduce some of the tension with jihadists in their midst as well. They will also make key U.S. allies to the south, Jordan, more comfortable, too. But does it hold? No.
The key takeaway, though, is the first time Trump and Putin meet and talk Syria, they seem to get on the same page quite quickly. Remember, the Obama administration, they wanted Bashar al-Assad out. Well, Secretary Tillerson today saying he will leave eventually, Bashar al-Assad. But that's not the tenant of their policy here, Erin.
BURNETT: It certainly isn't, and, of course, every leader will leave eventually, sort of doesn't say anything at all from the U.S. to make that statement. You know, also tonight, Nick, you are aware international forces have
been tightening their grip around the ISIS declared capital of Raqqa. What is the situation there?
WALSH: Well, it is extraordinary how fast the progress seems to be in the outskirts of Raqqa. I mean, the area we went through today to travel through the old city, about three or four kilometers that appear to have fallen to the Syrian, Kurdish and Arab forces that are backed by U.S. air power and even at some point distance artillery, too. That seemed to fall in the last three weeks or so.
It was the last few days that a coalition air strike punch two holes in the ancient wall around the old city of Raqqa. That itself is a dense area. But remarkably, those coalition-backed forces have pushed quite quickly into the old city, about three or four hundred meters inside already so far.
And that means really that the part of Raqqa that ISIS still hold is about one-and-a-half miles across as far as we can tell by some of the maps we saw. That isn't particularly big at all. Yes, it is a very dense urban area they told. They are slowed down these coalition- backed forces by the fact they can't do much fighting in the day. It's too hard. They are pinned down by ISIS snipers.
At night, though, we saw ourselves a lot of air power in the skies moving in towards that city. That's when the coalition's main advantage comes into play. They are moving quite fast. Whether or not the thousands of civilians supposed to be in that city slow the further advance, now they get into more dense urban areas, we will have to see. Raqqa very symbolic for them, their capital, but it is it seems falling quicker than personally I expected in the outskirts, possibly though nastier work ahead, Erin.
BURNETT: All right. Thank you very much, Nick Paton Walsh, from there on the ground actually seeing what's happening. Thank you.
And next, back to the '90s with a preview of this awesome new series. I'll talk to one of the stars of "Beverly Hills 90210".
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She's cute.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes. It's my ex-girlfriend.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What happened?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I dumped her.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[19:56:57] BURNETT: Tonight, we are counting down to CNN's next original series "THE NINETIES," a decade home to one of the most popular teen soaps of all time, "Beverly Hills 90210." (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You know what you are, Wilson?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No, big man, why don't you tell me.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You're a has-been.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: OUFRONT now, Ian Ziering, who, of course, played Steve Sanders on "90210." That was a funny moment.
Look, to many, you're still known, you're forever known as Steve Sanders. Did you have any idea when "90210" first started that it would take off and become such a cultural phenomena the way it did?
IAN ZIERING, ACTOR, "BEVERLY HILLS, 90210": I never could have imagined it would have achieve the success that it ultimately found. The premiere episode didn't get such great reviews. So, I thought pretty shortly after that, I was going to be looking for more work. Fortunately, the fans really picked up the baton and ran for ten years with it.
BURNETT: I mean, when you watch these clips, you know, "90210" inspired -- look, it captured the moment of how teenagers feel, but it also inspired teen fashion at the time and had its own album. What do you think the lasting impact of "Beverly Hills 90210" was?
ZIERING: It was an original concept. It was a teen drama that dealt with reality, all the struggles that we deal with during teenage life. We dealt it with in very real topical ways. And it kind of bridged a gap. I mean, there's even whispers now of getting the cast back together and doing it all over again.
BURNETT: Now, I have to ask you also, because you were on "Celebrity Apprentice", among many things that you've done, and I just wanted to play, Ian, one clip, obviously a pretty important clip, from the board room. Here it is.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: I did your jingle go, can you remember it?
ZIERING: I can. Margarita, (INAUDIBLE), it might sound crazy, but it's true, it's a new thing, cool zing from the king of beers to you --
TRUMP: That's like "Cucaracha." You're copying it. Ian, you're fired.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: Fired for "La Cucaracha". Hopefully you have recovered from the scarring experience that must have been. What was your experience with Trump on the show, Ian? ZIERING: I found him to be very friendly, very nice, funny. You
know, this is before any of the -- any of his aspirations, or known aspirations for political office. He was a nice guy.
BURNETT: All right. Well, Ian Ziering, thanks so much. I appreciate it. Thanks for being with me.
ZEIRING: Thank you so much, Erin. Bye, everybody.
BURNETT: And you can also catch Ian Ziering on "Sharknado Five." And don't miss the premiere of "THE NINETIES", Sunday night at 9:00, only here on CNN. Have a great weekend to all of you. See you next week and thanks for joining us.
"AC360" starts right now.
