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Erin Burnett Outfront
"No Time": Russia Races To Turn Basements Into Bomb Shelters; New Audio: Moments After Fiery Plane Crash, Germany Floats Sabotage; Border Czar Versus Denver Mayor; The Dems' Joe Rogan? Aired 7-8p ET
Aired November 26, 2024 - 19:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[19:00:33]
ERIN BURNETT, CNN HOST: OUTFRONT next:
The breaking news, Russia raising to build and fortify bunkers tonight. Ukraine hitting deeper inside Russia again.
Also breaking this hour, fingers pointing to Putin in a deadly cargo jet crash. Is Russia sabotaging jetliners?
Plus, Trump's new border czar threatens to put the Denver mayor in jail. Why? Well, the Denver mayor is my guest OUTFRONT.
Plus, is he the Democrats answer to Joe Rogan? Seven and a half million followers tuned in to him on election night, and he says he knows how the party can win back men.
Let's go OUTFRONT
Good evening. I'm Erin Burnett.
OUTFRONT tonight, the breaking news preparing for war. Russia tonight scrambling to build and fortify new emergency bunkers as their war with Ukraine enters a dangerous escalatory phase.
Just listen to the governor of Russia's Leningrad region.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GOVERNOR OF RUSSIA'S LENINGRAD REGION (through translator): We must bring all underground rooms, all basements that meet the shelter requirements to at least this condition so that it is dry. There are benches and a supply of water, the ability to go to the toilet in order to temporarily wait out some emergency situation.
There's no time for talk. The deadlines are extremely tight. We already need to make radical decisions.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: Radical decisions. Just to be clear here, I said Leningrad. It is a region north of Moscow, 500 miles at the closest from Ukraine now though, a target. And that's because Ukraine is now using America's powerful longer range missiles -- missiles that Russia claims again, were used to hit twice Russian military targets in an airfield today.
We're also learning that Ukraine's air assault has reportedly injured a North Korean general and killed a number of the more than 10,000 North Korean troops that Putin has brought to help fight his war, and now, of course, in this case in the Kursk region of Russia.
And tonight, Russia is seeking revenge for the onslaught, overnight, unleashing a record number of killer drones as the current deputy chairman of Putin's security council and the former Russian President Dmitry Medvedev, fires off a new warning tonight at the United States. Medvedev, claiming that the transfer of nuclear weapons to Ukraine isn't it would be considered an attack on Russia by the U.S., he writes that, quote, the consequences are obvious.
Now, just to state the obvious, of course, there is no talk of the U.S. sending Ukraine nuclear weapons, but that is not stopping this rise in rhetoric and the fearmongering on Russian state TV.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (through translator): I don't know when it will end, but I know that it will end with some kind of missile ultimatum.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: Missile ultimatum. It comes as the as a NATO military official is warning companies in both the U.S. and Europe to prepare for a, quote, wartime scenario. And then this Germany is hinting that Russia is behind a deadly fiery DHL cargo plane crash in Lithuania overnight. Let me just play for you the chilling new air traffic control audio just into OUTFRONT from moments after the plane went down.
(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)
AIR TRAFFIC CONTROLLER: Cancel your start-up. Go back to your stand number. We just got a crash of an aircraft on the final so we will need some time.
(END AUDIO CLIP)
BURNETT: All right. So that plane crashed. And "The Wall Street Journal" is reporting that incendiary devices, explosives, which ignited in Germany and the United Kingdom over the summer, were part of a secret Russian plot designed to start fires on board cargo and passenger flights heading to the United States and Canada, fires on board planes, planes over oceans.
This would mean a terrifying, fiery death for hundreds on a passenger jet is impossible to even contemplate such a thing. If such a thing were to happen, the consequences would be devastating. And these sobering details come as U.S. intelligence officials are now warning American defense companies to increase security precautions following several additional acts of sabotage in Europe that officials have blamed on Russia.
Nick Paton Walsh begins our coverage OUTFRONT tonight, live in Eastern Ukraine.
Nick, there are reports of air sirens again going off in Kyiv, 24 hours ago, as we were talking, that was when the massive drone attack hit Ukraine. What are you seeing where you are?
NICK PATON WALSH, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Yeah. Look, these are large scale drone attacks increasingly regular. And in fact, if some of the tallies suggest a multiple of 3 or 4 larger numbers of drones being fired, sometimes nightly against vast regions, all across of Ukraine, including where I am in the east here.
[19:05:07]
But while a lot of the focus has been on the sophisticated missiles flung at both sides by each other in this increasingly global war, the real fact about how the outcome is determined is going to be happening near where I'm standing on the eastern front, where the news is persistently bad for Ukraine, seeing Russia advancing on multiple different directions, potentially encircling key towns for Ukraine, pointing to a bleak winter ahead.
Here are some of the stark assessments we heard from Ukrainian troops serving there.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
WALSH (voice-over): They're running out of time, space and people. Night is killing time for drones.
They've switched on the anti-drone device because of the threat around here.
This Ukrainian drone unit of just two hunting, but also hunted.
I think I hear a drone inside, inside, inside.
Is that a Russian drone? Is it one of theirs? They don't know, but they have to carry on.
Dogs are not friends. Their heat signals can give their launch spot away to Russia's thermal cameras. They close in on the target. A house jamming hits the signal but they fire anyway.
Russia advancing too fast here, south of Pokrovsk in the east to miss any chances.
The skyline speaks of how Pokrovsk is in Russia's crosshairs. Ukraine is short of manpower, but it is so bad here. They say they must rely on drones, not infantry, to slow a brazen Russian daylight assault like this one.
"EAST", DRONE COMPNAY COMMANDER, 15 NATIONAL GUARD (translated): The situation is very critical. We lack infantry to fight and hold out for some time wile the attack drones do their job. That's why we often see the enemy uncomfortably penetrating vulnerable areas. WALSH: Watch how the first Russian tank here is relentless. A Trump
presidency and possible peace talks loom. Do they even have time for that here?
"KOEHEI", RECON UNIT, 15 NATIONAL GUARD (translated): I cannot say how much time we have. If there is ay time at all. Because now they are pushing their troops to the front as much as possible. At then at one point they will go for an assault. They can go very far in one moment.
WALSH: Talk here is abnormally negative, with weeks of costly and chaotic retreat on film, like these Ukrainians hit when they're mistakenly told this building didn't have any Russians in it.
This house has an encircled Ukrainian drone unit without any infantry to help fight advancing Russians. So they send a drone to fly just 30 meters across the street.
"KOTYA", RECON UNIT, 15TH NATIONAL GUARD (translated): I'm (EXPLETIVE DELETED) alone. I'm (EXPLETIVE DELETED) tired. Our country is awake, but people in it are (EXPLETIVE DELETED) not. Guys are dying here. This is trash. Freezing this war is a double-edged sword. If these two old me (Trump and Putin) start measuring dicks, Ukraine will be the middle of it all.
WALSH: Russian troops savage in the assault. This footage shows a local in orange who's shown Russians where Ukrainians were hiding. They are led out -- and shot while face down.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
WALSH (on camera): Now, prosecutors today said that they would be investigating that execution of what it looks like surrendering Ukrainians. About two weeks ago, in a village called Petrivka, south of Pokrovsk where we filed that report from one of a number of instances in which surrendering Ukrainians appear to be killed by advancing Russians.
But we heard consistently chilling reports of Ukrainian fresh recruits being sent to the front line without training, hoping they'd get training there on the ground. A lack of fresh Ukrainian soldiers able to assist Ukraine on the front lines and Russia moving so fast that even some of the maps we were shown were out of date because the Russians have moved further forwards, it is bleak on those front lines, increasingly so, Erin.
BURNETT: All right, Nick, thank you very much, from Eastern Ukraine tonight.
Let's go now to military and intelligence expert Seth Jones and retired Army Major General Spider Marks.
Appreciate both of you very much.
So, Seth, you know, trying to understand what the situation is here, that the world is in. You know, you've got a NATO military official warning companies to prepare for wartime scenarios. Germanys deputy defense minister, foreign minister warning that Russia's outproducing 4 to 1 on ammunition nuclear bunkers in Russia. Germany saying they're getting bunkers ready.
I mean, this is a scenario that were in right now. And then you add to that this reporting that that its possible that Russia was behind taking down this plane, this DHL plane that we played that air traffic control audio from.
Do you think it's possible that that's the case?
SETH JONES, PRESIDENT, DEFENSE & SECURITY DEPARTMENT, CENTER FOR STRATEGIC & INTERNATIONAL STUDIES: Well, Erin, it's not entirely clear whether the Russians were behind this specific incident. But I think what is clear and a range of U.S. officials that I've spoken to have confirmed is that the Russians are involved in a much more aggressive campaign of sabotage and subversion across Europe, particularly Western Europe. They've been involved in assassinations strikes against weapons depots, fuel depots, targeting of oil pipelines and underwater telecommunications networks.
So this is in a sense, this is an escalation of Russian activity, mostly GRU, the main intelligence directorate of the Russian military, and the SVR, Russia's foreign intelligence agency, in Europe, really as a sign that that -- that they can escalate in the -- in the areas in the kind of the asymmetric domain.
BURNETT: Right. And, General Marks, to that front, you know, "The Wall Street Journal" talking about incendiary devices that did ignite in Germany, in the UK over the weekend were part of a secret Russian plot designed to target not just cargo planes, but passenger flights heading to the United States and Canada.
I mean, such a thought is really stunning to contemplate if that were to happen, what that would mean.
How concerned are you, general about wider Russian acts of sabotage?
MAJ. GEN. JAMES "SPIDER" MARKS (RET.), CNN MILITARY ANALYST: Well, there's no reason that we should assume that they're not going to try to take advantage of some real tradecraft that they have. They're not bound by any legalities. And so they will engage at multiple levels, as Seth indicated, lots of asymmetric activities ongoing, but very precise and devastating kinetic activities as well we should not be surprised.
Again, we don't know what the facts are surrounding the crash of the DHL. We do know. We do know that there were those explosions that took place in the UK and Germany this past summer.
So I think it's -- it's important for us to realize that Russia very much -- and let's be frank, there's a lot to unpack here from the reporting that you've just laid in front of us. I mean, Russia now has the narrative that the entire nation is under threat and under assault. They've got -- they've increased the threat of nukes. That's not new.
You've got the concern about war crimes that we just saw that horrendous video.
BURNETT: Horrendous video, yeah.
MARKS: So, we should -- yeah, we shouldn't be surprised by any of this. So, of course, there's the concern about escalation. But I don't know that the escalation necessarily will increase direct a decision to be made that there would be direct involvement by NATO and to include U.S. forces in Ukraine.
BURNETT: So let me ask you, Seth, you know, just you've got the Russians, obviously, with their nuclear -- nuclear bunkers that they've been building in mass, right? And maybe some of that is real. Maybe some of that is for propaganda purposes.
But the governor of the Leningrad region, you know, bring all underground rooms, underground basements, everything that could be used in some sort of a, you know, an incoming missile situation. Make sure you have bathroom access to get ready, you know, you have the same thing being said in Germany, right? Being said in Germany about trying to make sure that they have bomb shelters ready for use.
Seth, you know how fraught is this moment?
JONES: Well, Erin, I think the Russians and particularly Vladimir Putin are certainly trying to instill a sense of fear in Ukraine and then also in other areas of Western Europe. They have tried to manipulate the fears of U.S. and European officials since the beginning of this war.
I think a lot of it has proven fruitless and groundless in a range of cases. They have they have threatened to escalate to use tactical nuclear weapons. That has not happened so I think some of this is really it's a manipulation of a psychological effort.
I think it is important to note that the Russians are in a tough spot, too. They've lost 600,000 to 700,000 wounded and killed in this war. So, I mean, it's not like they're -- they're -- there are low costs on the Russian side. They suffered tremendously.
BURNETT: General, do you think that the talk we hear from Medvedev at this point, right. And he has been won with aggressive nuclear saber rattling all the way along, former president but obviously now deputy chairman of the Putin's security council.
How impactful is that talk in terms of scaring Russia's foes?
MARKS: Well, it's not only an internal message -- I mean, an external message. It's internal as well. I mean, as Seth laid out, not only are they trying to instill some legitimate concern with NATO partners and elsewhere, but also internally.
[19:15:05]
They want -- they want to gin up the notion that this nation is under assault. We all need to galvanize and coalesce and come together. That's the real recipient. I think of these messages right now because there has been -- look, the threat of nukes is like music in the background.
It's been there since the outset. Every step of escalation has included a threat of nukes. We have to take that seriously. We have to be very mindful of that, and our nuclear capacity and our readiness is not at risk at all.
But I really think that the recipient of all these messages are Russians.
BURNETT: All right. Well, thank you both very much.
And to your point, I'm glad Seth said it, 600,000 to 700,000 young Russian men have been horribly wounded or killed in this war, an incredible cost for them. Thank you both.
And also breaking tonight, the Israeli military issuing new evacuation orders in Lebanon with just a few hours left until a ceasefire. A ceasefire deal is supposed to go into effect. Israel's security cabinet approving the deal with Hezbollah today after months of deadly attacks. It comes after Israel bombarded central Beirut today for the first time in the war, killing at least 10 people, according to the ministry of health in Lebanon.
Nic Robertson is OUTFRONT live from Jerusalem.
So, Nic, you know how much do we know about this ceasefire and really how much it matters in the context of an ongoing war in Gaza where the hostages mass of hostages still are being held.
NIC ROBERTSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL DIPLOMATIC EDITOR: Yeah. Look, it could have a significant impact on -- on how quickly a ceasefire and hostage deal emerges in Gaza to the point of what does the deal look like? Sixty-day temporary ceasefire, President Biden says he thinks there should be a permanent ceasefire.
Both the Israelis and Hezbollah pull back. The Hezbollah go about 30 miles north of the Lebanese-Israeli border, within those two months, the Israeli forces pulled back inside of Israel proper. The U.N. and Lebanese army go in to fill that military vacuum.
But I think there's an aspiration here that Hezbollah, because it's so beaten down so defeated, so decimated at a leadership level that it will not be able to grow back. I think that's an aspiration that's borne out of hope more than reality over a period of time. But how it applies to Gaza significantly, because Hezbollah got out of this fight with Israel and signed or got into this ceasefire because it has decided not to support and continue to support the Hamas war.
So the message to Hamas is you're on your own. You don't have -- you don't have Hezbollah shooting into Israel, supporting you on the northern border. So a reality check for Hamas now, you've got to make a deal. Where are you going to go? What are you going to do? There's no way out.
The bombardment, the military efforts are going to continue. And President Biden said he's going to -- he's going to work with the Qataris, with the Turks, with others to hasten that deal. So it's significant.
But Hamas has to bite. They have to go for it.
BURNETT: All right. Well, Nic, thank you very much in Jerusalem tonight.
And next, a face off between Trump's new border czar and the mayor of Denver. Team Trump threatening to jail the mayor if he tries to stand in the way of mass deportations. Well, Denver's mayor will respond next.
Plus, is he the Democrats' secret weapon to winning back young men? Our Donie O'Sullivan finds out.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I thought you legitimately were going to work out.
DONIE O'SULLIVAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: So this is that whole masculinity thing people are talking about, huh?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: So who is he?
And then Congresswoman Nancy Mace now calling transgender people mentally ill, but not very long ago, she had a totally different message. And guess what? KFILE has the tapes.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[19:23:12]
BURNETT: Tonight, Trump's border czar Tom Homan threatens to put the Democratic mayor of Denver in jail. This comes after the mayor, who's my next guest, talked about resisting federal forces trying to carry out mass deportations, saying, quote, more than us having -- more than us having the Denver Police Department stationed at the county line to keep them out. You would have 50,000 Denverites there. It's like the Tiananmen Square moment with the rose and the gun.
Homan firing back on Fox News.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TOM HOMAN, TRUMP'S NEW "BORDER CZAR": Me and the Denver mayor, we agree on one thing. He's willing to go to jail. I'm willing to put him in jail. We're going to enforce the law, period. And they're not going to stop us.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: All right. Joining me now, the Denver Mayor, Mike Johnston.
So, Mayor Johnston, you heard what he said. You got something in common. You're willing to go to jail. He's willing to put you there. He says he's going to enforce the law.
Are you willing to go to jail over this?
MAYOR MIKE JOHNSTON, DENVER, COLORADO: You know, I think there are thoughtful ways to solve this problem if they want to focus on violent criminals, we would be happy to help support pursuing, arresting, and deporting them. We've helped past administrations. We do that again.
If they want to focus on adding more judicial capacity, so folks with asylum claims can have those cases heard more quickly, we would support that.
What we're not going to do is support deploying the 101st Airborne into American cities to pull ten year old kids out of their classrooms in handcuffs. I think that is immoral. That's unconstitutional. And that's un-American.
And so I think if that's what they're proposing, they will find us resisting. If they want to partner on common sense solutions, we'll always be happy to partner.
BURNETT: So if Trump were to order ICE agents, you know, for example, right, Immigration and Customs Enforcement agents to go into the state of Colorado, to enforce federal law, would you order Mayor Johnston, your police department, to resist them, or are you speaking at this point more of just an act of, you know, protest resistance? Or would this actually be an order to your police department?
[19:25:04]
JOHNSTON: Yeah, we won't use our law enforcement and we don't think we need to. That's not what we're after. I think America is not after another conflict on this issue. They're after a way to find pragmatic solutions to this problem.
And so, to quote Lincoln, you know, we don't think here that that might makes right. We think that right makes might. And so, if they are going to send the U.S. Army or the Navy Seals into Denver to pursue folks to pull them off the job at hotels or restaurants where they're working or pull kids off the soccer field, I think we will see Denverites and folks around the country who will nonviolently resist that, because I think that doesn't represent our values and doesn't represent the Constitution.
BURNETT: So has your view on the broader situation change, though, and I understand you're trying to draw a distinction between violent criminals and people who are in the country illegally, but are contributing to society, right? Going to school, working jobs, but is Denver, Mayor, going to remain a sanctuary city where you do not enforce federal immigration laws? Is there going to be any change to how you are running the city?
JOHNSTON: We're not changing how we run the city, but it's important that people know what that status means, what that means is that if someone has committed a violent crime, has committed a felony. BURNETT: We do collaborate with federal law enforcement and we will.
What it means we don't do is if someone is driving to work and has a busted tail light on the way, we don't arrest them and connect them to ICE for deportation. We think that's disruptive for families and for residents.
I was a high school principal before this, and these were my students. These are kids who were Dreamers who are playing by the rules, getting jobs, trying to make a life. They're -- they have daughters who play on our soccer teams or sons who sit in your history classes.
We don't think that is the problem facing the country. These are 60 percent of them are working, 25 percent of them are children. I don't think that is the crisis the country is worried about.
BURNETT: So Trump is now threatening a 25 percent tariff on Mexico, which, of course, you've seen. He says he's going to do that until the invasion ends. That's the word he uses and he says he's going to sign this tariff on his first day. So presumably by his executive order in January.
So, you know, it -- let me just play what Mexico's president said today, because she responded and she said the tariffs are not going to do it when it comes to solving the migrant crisis. Here's how she put it.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CLAUDIA SHEINBAUM, PRESIDENT OF MEXICO (translate): President Trump, threats and tariffs are not the way to address the migration phenomenon or drug use in the United States.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: I know, Mayor Johnston, you're fluent in Spanish, so even though you couldn't see those the translation on the bottom of the screen, you understood what she said.
Is it possible though, that the threat of such tariffs of a 25 percent tariff of such a massive and seismic thing to Mexico would force Mexico to way more forcefully address the drug and migrant flow than it has up until now?
JOHNSTON: I don't think that's going to solve the problem any more than no Denver business is asking me to pull folks off the job as a way to solve their economic crisis. We have open jobs we're trying to fill. We have more business we're trying to do more imports and exports we want.
That would hurt, I think, American farmers and ranchers and it would hurt American retailers. And so I don't think that is the solution. I think there is a way to work collaboratively with Mexico and other countries in Central and South America to try to solve this problem, and that's what we're looking for.
What are pragmatic ways to help people get to work that want to work, help employers hire them if they want to hire them, and help folks get a fair hearing in court and let the courts decide if they get asylum or not. That's all folks are asking. They're not running from the law. They're actually running towards the law.
They want to get their cases heard. They have a seven year wait because the bipartisan bill that would have added more administrative and judicial capacity to hear these cases, Trump opposed. So there's commonsense ways to have these cases heard that are constitutional, that are consistent with American values, that would keep the American economy going. These won't do that.
BURNETT: All right. Mayor Johnson, I appreciate your time. Thank you very much.
You said Mayor Johnston, the mayor of Denver.
And next, meet the social media superstar who claims he can win over young men from Trump.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UINIDENTIFIED MALE: It would be very self-serving for me to say I'm the left's Joe Rogan. The Democratic Party should give me millions of dollars.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: Plus, Congresswoman Nancy Mace firing off a number of attacks on transgender women yet as our KFILE uncovered, mace once said this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REP. NANCY MACE (R-SC): I'm pro transgender rights. I'm pro-LGBTQ.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[19:33:46]
BURNETT: Tonight, Donald Trump Jr. telling his podcast co-host that his father may replace some reporters in the White House briefing room with Trump-supporting podcast hosts. Here he is.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP JR., SON OF PRESIDENT TRUMP: So, we're going to break some news here because I literally had this conversation. I was flying back, I was on the plane I guess, with my father either. I think it was coming back from the SpaceX launch with Elon last week and I was sitting there and we were talking about like the podcast world and some of our friends and Rogan and guys like you.
But we had the conversation about opening up the press room to a lot of these independent journalists. We've had that conversation. Like, that's a great idea. Don, I was like, I think we should do this. And so that may be in the works. Let's see. That's going to blow up
some heads so you know we'll see.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: All right. This comes as Democrats right now are pinning their hopes tonight on this man Hasan Piker, the left's biggest influencer. In fact, 7.5 million people tuned in to his live stream on election night, 7.5 million.
So who is he? And is he getting young men to swing left?
Donie O'Sullivan went and talked to him and he is OUTFRONT
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
HASAN PIKER, SOCIAL MEDIA INFLUENCER: Donie O'Sullivan!
DONIE O'SULLIVAN, CNN SENIOIR CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): This is Hasan Piker.
PIKER: This is my dog Kaya. I thought you legitimately were going to work out.
[19:35:01]
O'SULLIVAN: I could do some weights.
He's a social media superstar with almost 3 million followers on the video streaming platform Twitch.
TRUMP: They're eating. They're eating the pets.
O'SULLIVAN: So this is that whole masculinity thing people are talking about, huh? And he's part of a growing group of streamers and podcasters reaching young men online, a space Trump tapped into to reach young male voters.
PIKER: You punch in, then you won't be able to see that he's not doing any weights.
O'SULLIVAN: But Hasan is not a Trump supporter. He's a progressive, a fan of Bernie and AOC. The Democratic Party even invited him to the DNC in August.
One thing we've been hearing for weeks now is that the left needs a Joe Rogan.
PIKER: Yeah. I don't think that the Democratic party can podcast itself out of this issue. Joe Rogan endorsed Bernie Sanders in 2020. Maybe they should do an autopsy on why he left the party.
O'SULLIVAN: I've heard you say when it comes to stuff that guys like, you seek that stuff out online, whether it's watching a streamer, whether its watching guys talking about working out and fitness. You say that the right wing just dominates that space. PIKER: Yeah.
O'SULLIVAN: Why?
PIKER: Well, I think that's why I started on Twitch right? I know for a fact that the video game space is like people who consume this, this culture people who are a part of this culture are not all right wing. I wanted to showcase the people that are like, no, you can be a progressive person. You can be a leftist and like, have fun at the same time.
O'SULLIVAN: How many people are watching your live stream on election night?
PIKER: The total unique number was 7.5 million.
O'SULLIVAN: There's a general sense that when it comes to the world of podcasts, alternative media, I don't even know what you want to call it. That Trump did a much better job with that than Democrats, and Harris.
PIKER: Absolutely. I think that's true. When I saw the Aidan Ross collab, I thought, this is not -- this doesn't have motion. It was awkward. It was weird.
But then I saw Trump on Theo Von, and he started talking about cocaine and I was like, uh, oh, this -- this humanizes him.
TRUMP: So you're way up with cocaine more than anything else you can think of.
THEO VON, HOST: Cocaine will turn you into a owl, homie. You know what I'm saying?
O'SULLIVAN: Harris did consider going on Joe Rogan.
PIKER: Yeah, but she didn't.
O'SULLIVAN: What is this that the Democrat party has to do differently?
PIKER: Well um, I think that they need to change their policies.
O'SULLIVAN: It's a policy thing.
PIKER: Yes, it's 100 percent a policy thing.
O'SULLIVAN: Because I'll say boring.
PIKER: Which is the boring answer, although it would be very self- serving for me to say I'm the left's Joe Rogan. The Democratic Party should give me millions of dollars. That's not going to solve this problem.
What will solve this problem is if the Democratic Party actually adopts real left wing economic populist messaging instead of purposefully avoiding that stuff because they're terrified of upsetting their corporate donors.
I think Trump speaks to male insecurities better, and I think Trump speaks to the anger that people have. Whereas the other side of the political spectrum does not speak to that anger at all.
O'SULLIVAN: There's been a lot of controversy around you.
PIKER: Yes.
O'SULLIVAN: The way you talk about Israel is viewed by some as antisemitic.
PIKER: Yeah.
O'SULLIVAN: Are you antisemitic?
PIKER: Of course not. The real problem here is that I'm an anti- Zionist. The real problem here is that I'm extremely critical of Israel and all of the information that's readily available especially on social media, for so many people that don't necessarily rely on mainstream media any longer to get their information.
And that's why you see this generational gap. If you're over the age of 35, you're still operating on the old boundaries. You're like, no, Israel is the most moral democracy in the Middle East, maybe in the world, right? Like -- and I think that the major generational divide that is, I think in a very damaging way, feeding into the mistrust overall that people have with mainstream news in general is coming from that.
O'SULLIVAN: Donie O'Sullivan, CNN, Los Angeles.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
BURNETT: Yeah. It's so thoughtful and important to hear that.
Ken martin is OUTFRONT. He is running to be the next chair of the DNC. He's the current chairman of the Minnesota Democratic Farmer Labor Party.
And I really appreciate your time, Ken.
So, you know, you hear Hasan Piker, 7.5 million people watched him on an election night. He's all in as a Democrat. But then he's talking to Donie about how the video game and fitness space online is dominated by right wing people talking about it, right, not necessarily everyone into fitness, right?
That there's that gap, and he says that Trump speaks to male insecurities better. He speaks to the anger that people have and that Democrats don't speak to that anger at all. I'm quoting Hasan here.
He's very direct about the problem. Do you agree with him?
KEN MARTIN, DNC VICE CHAIR RUNNING FOR CHAIR: Well, first off, Erin, thanks for having me on tonight. And actually, I think Hasan's right and most of what he says there and
particularly as it relates to the fact that the Republicans have been since the 2000 election, 2020 election, a constant drumbeat of misinformation disinformation and lies on platforms that the Democratic Party really wasn't competing.
And we live in a 24 over seven, 365 day information environment now that we have to be competing in in a much better way. Podcasts streaming services, TikTok social media, of course.
My two boys, 22 and 20, they get their information from TikTok, right? And so, we have to start realizing that we have to be where the voters are. That's half the battle, of course, and I do think we also have to use micro-influencers like Hasan and others who are already trusted validators and messengers in these spaces to help push these messages out and to have conversations with voters and people who are feeling frustrated and angry and left behind.
You see, when we send people into these spaces, it tends to be politicians or talking heads people like Hasan have deep influence and certainly have a voice and a following.
BURNETT: So, you know, there has been a lot of focus and he sort of touches on that because he's talking about the dominance of right wing voices in very male spaces, like video games or, fitness. And there has been, though, broadly speaking, can so much focus right now, and as you're looking to run the DNC, this is at the center of it on whether the Democratic Party needs to move aggressively away from certain social positions like DEI right or, from issues where Democrats certainly seem to be in this election and certainly were successfully branded as much to the left of American voters.
For example, Kamala Harris's support of taxpayer funded surgeries, transgender surgeries for illegal migrants, the heads of the Trump and Harris campaigns see the impact of that issue of that now famous ad very differently.
I wanted to play each of them for you we targeted black men, Hispanic families, white families, suburban women.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CHRS LACIVIATA, TRUMP CAMPAIGN: We targeted Black men, Hispanic families, White families, suburban women. We ran that ad because it also got to the point about boys and girls locker rooms, which suburban moms don't like.
DAVID AXELROD, PODCAST HOST: So no, listen -- I would -- I will say that will go down as one of the most ruthlessly effective negative ads in the history of presidential politics.
DAVID PLOUFFE, FORMER HARRIS CAMPAIGN SENIOR ADVISER: This trans ad was not driving voters. There's a belief that if only we had responded to this trans ad with national and huge battleground state ads, we would have won. I don't think that's true.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: So, Ken, how do you see it? One of the most ruthlessly effective negative ads in all of history or this trans ad was not driving the vote, even if they'd responded to it more effectively, they wouldn't have won. Which point of view is right?
MARTIN: Well, I don't know at which point of view is right. What I do know is we don't have to abandon our values here. We can stand up for the oppressed and marginalized and people who are being pushed out of this conversation, while also at the same time centering this conversation around people's economic pain and their frustrations with what was happening in this country these last several years.
It's not about left or right to me. It's about making sure we focus squarely on a working class agenda that centers the struggles of this multiracial, multigenerational working class that is feeling left behind. That's working harder than they ever have before, that's struggling to get ahead and feeling like no one gives a about their lives.
At the end of the day, that's the thing that unites all parts of our broad coalition in the Democratic Party and we need to focus back on basics here, right? And so, but at the same time, we do not need to abandon our values. We will stand up and protect and fight for people who are being pushed out of this conversation in this country and bullied and attacked like we see in Congress right now.
BURNETT: All right. Well, I really appreciate your time, Ken Martin, as I said chairman of the Minnesota Democratic Farmer Labor Party and I know, sir, you are running to run the DNC, and that decision for the Democratic Party is going to be crucial. So much is at stake. So thank you for your time.
And you mentioned what's going on in Congress. Well, that comes down to this. The Republican Congresswoman Nancy Mace, now leading the charge when it comes to attacking transgender women. But wait until you see what she used to say about the trans community. This gives about face a whole new name. KFILE has the tapes.
Plus, Harry Enten with what's become the most Googled term for the first time in more than 20 years.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[19:48:46]
BURNETT: Tonight, Republican Congresswoman Nancy Mace just moments ago with another attack on transgender women saying, quote, real women stick together posting earlier today, your mental illness will not become my new reality.
Mace, who has been vocal about being a survivor of rape and domestic violence, making it her mission to bar incoming Congresswoman Sarah McBride from using female bathrooms at the Capitol, reportedly posting more than 300 times on the subject in just 72 hours. It leaves no time for sleep. And making videos like this one, you can see her here, ripping down transgender flags around Capitol Hill. And the thing about this is, you would think this would just come from a deep place within, but it doesn't appear to. It's a stark contrast to what KFILE has uncovered from her past. Just listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MACE: I'm pro-transgender rights. I'm pro-LGBTQ.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: You saw the date on there last year.
Andrew Kaczynski of KFILE joins me now.
I mean, it's pretty incredible. Someone who's posting. What did you say 300 times in a couple in a, you know hours of anti-trans content just a year ago was saying, what she said right there. And saying, actually, I know that she supported children deciding their own gender identity.
[19:50:03]
ANDREW KACZYNSKI, CNN KFILE SENIOR EDITOR: Yeah. That's right. As recently as just last year, right, she was saying that she was pro transgender rights. She was saying she was open to children exploring their gender identity. And she said she was open to, you know, male children using female pronouns, wearing dresses, or basically you know, exploring their gender identity.
And this was sort of striking like, a moderate tone for Republicans because she was saying at the same time that she was against things like hormone blockers and surgery but she was open to them exploring their gender identity in many ways, and her being a moderate on this issue really goes all the way back to 2021, when she first came into Congress. Now her district when she first got elected in 2020, was sort of a moderate district. Then it got changed to a more conservative district in 2022. And that's where you saw her shifting her rhetoric on a whole bunch of issues.
But at that time, she sponsored the fairness for all act and that was essentially a Republican bill that would have outlawed or banned discrimination based on sexual orientation or gender identity. It did have carve-outs for religious institutions.
And I want to read what she said at the time because it is just so different than what she said today. She said, quote, I strongly support LGBTQ rights and equality. No one should be discriminated against. I have friends and family that identify as LGBTQ. I understand how they feel and how they've been treated is important.
Having been around gay, lesbian and transgender people has informed my opinion in my lifetime. That was her in 2021. Take a listen to what she was saying in 2023 as well.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MACE: I'm pro-transgender rights. I'm pro LGBTQ, just don't go to the extreme with our kids. Now, if they want to take on a different pronoun or a different gender identity or grow their hair out, or wear a dress, or wear pants, or do those things as a minor. Those are all things that I think most people would support.
Be who you want to be, but don't make those permanent changes when it's a child, they may decide as an adult hey, instead of being Johnny, I want to be Jill. That's okay. But let them figure that out and make that decision when they can consent.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: You know, it's just an incredible shift to see what she's saying there and what she is saying now in recent days. When did her position start to shift?
KACZYNSKI: It's really unclear. It's sort of all over the place because even a month after that interview she spoke out against transgender woman in women's sports. So she's sort of been all over the place.
Obviously, the catalyst for this was Sarah McBride getting elected, like you said, hundreds of anti-transgender tweets. That is something that we did not see from her at all until just this week. Listen to her just a couple of days ago.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MACY: I just spoke at an event with a couple hundred people, some trans lunatic tried to rush the stage and attack me, and he is just making the case for me that we don't want penises in women's spaces. F off. And I just had a woman come up to me and get in my face about it, and I told her to F right off.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KACZYNSKI: So I was texting with Nancy Mace. I was like, how do you square all this stuff? And here's what she told me. She said, I voted for gay marriage twice. I would do it again. I voted for pro-LGBTQ legislation but I draw the line at women being forced to undress in front of men or men using our bathrooms or any private spaces.
So that's how she's sort of squaring with what she said then versus what she said now.
BURNETT: All right. Andrew Kaczynski, thank you very much of KFILE.
And next, what's the one issue, a majority of Americans are okay with when it comes to higher prices on everything from food to cars? They're okay with this reason for it. Harry Enten has your answer.
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[19:57:58] BURNETT: New tonight. Not backing down, Mexico and China warning Trump to think twice about his pledge on new tariffs. Mexico's President Claudia Sheinbaum vowing to respond with tariffs of her own. The Chinese embassy saying, quote, no one will win a trade war.
And Harry Enten is OUTFRONT.
So, Harry, what's so fascinating on this issue? You know, some on the on the -- well, economics, you know, they'll say, oh, well everybody knows that tariffs are bad. So why do they not go up in arms about them?
But you have found some surprising views as to how Americans view tariffs, even though they do know that they will increase prices.
HARRY ENTEN, CNN SENIOR DATA REPORTER: Yeah. What we see right now is that the majority of Americans, in fact, favor new tariffs -- favor as opposed to opposed. And this is such a difference from where we were six years ago when Trump was trying to impose new tariffs back then, favoring was underwater by nine points. More Americans opposed than favored new tariffs. We've seen a switcheroo over the last six years at this point.
BURNETT: Which is -- and that's a dramatic shift, right?
ENTEN: Yeah.
BURNETT: I mean, you're talking about, you know, close to 15-point swing.
So you know, when you look specifically to the extent that you can among people who do know that, you know, everyone is told that tariffs will result in higher prices. How do those people see tariffs?
ENTEN: This is like the amazing thing, right? There's the whole argument. Oh, well, if people only knew that tariffs raise prices, they would be against tariffs. Uh-uh, uh-uh. In fact, the majority of the American public in that same poll that showed that folks favored new tariffs actually argue and believe that they will increase prices, they will not drop them. Only 18 percent believe that they would lower prices, 23 percent say no effect.
So the bottom line is the folks are tuned in to what tariffs will actually do to prices, even so, they believe that new tariffs are a good idea.
BURNETT: All right. And that's important, right? You can't -- you can't say that that people don't know. They know and they support it. So informed.
All right. Before we go, Harry, tell me something I don't know.
ENTEN: How am I supposed to tell you something that you don't know about? You know far more about tariffs than I do.
But I went to Google, and this is so interesting. So I looked at how many people were searching on Google for tariffs we have reached a 20 year high in November of 2024 compared to the 20 year average. Look at that rise up nearly 1,200 percent.
So the bottom line is you may think that tariffs are a bore if you're out there. But the American people think that tariffs are quite hot at this point.
BURNETT: Wow. I mean, that's -- that's a huge increase. And it's not just off a small base. It's a 20-year high.
ENTEN: Correct.
BURNETT: Wow.
All right. Thank you so much, Harry.
ENTEN: Thank you.
BURNETT: And happy Thanksgiving.
And thanks so much to all of you as always for being with us.
"AC360" starts now.
