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White House: Mistakenly Deported Man Won't Be Returned To U.S.; Trump Says He's "Looking" At Pausing Tariffs On Carmakers; Judge Denies Bail For Suspect In Arson At Pennsylvania Governor's Mansion. Aired 7-8p ET
Aired April 14, 2025 - 19:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[19:00:25]
JIM SCIUTTO, CNN HOST: OUTFRONT next:
Breaking news, Trump teams up with El Salvador. The two now refuse to return a Maryland man who was mistakenly deported to a notorious prison. So, what options does he have now?
Plus, Trump piling on the exceptions. The president now looking at possibly bailing out automakers from his sweeping tariffs. As one top Wall Street strategist warns investors, quote, prepare to be fooled.
And also breaking, the man accused of attempted homicide after setting fire to the Pennsylvania governor's mansion just appeared in court. How did he get past security in the first place?
Let's go OUTFRONT.
Good evening. I'm Jim Sciutto, in tonight for Erin Burnett.
And OUTFRONT tonight, breaking news: Powerless. Trump and his administration tonight claiming they no longer have the power to bring home a Maryland father that the administration openly admits it mistakenly sent to that notorious prison in El Salvador. In a new court filing, the Trump administration writes, DHS does not have authority to forcibly extract an alien from the domestic custody of a foreign sovereign nation.
This comes after the Supreme Court ordered Trump's team to, quote, facilitate Kilmar Abrego Garcia's return home. But during an Oval Office meeting between Trump and El Salvador's president, it is clear that is not going to happen.
Listen to Bukele.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REPORTER: Do you plan to return him?
NAYIB BUKELE, PRESIDENT OF EL SALVADOR: Well, I'm not suggesting that I smuggle a terrorist into the United States, right? How can I smuggle? How can I return him to the United States? Like I smuggle him into the United States? Or what do I do? Of course, I'm not going to do it.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCIUTTO: A lot of helplessness going around.
It's clear Trump and his team are not about to pressure the authoritarian president to release someone who, a judge ruled, should not have been deported in the first place.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PAM BONDI, ATTORNEY GENERAL: That's up to El Salvador if they want to return him. That's not up to us.
TOM HOMAN, WHITE HOUSE BORDER CZAR: El Salvador had to agree to release him. It doesn't sound like they're going to.
STEPHEN MILLER, WHITE HOUSE DEPUTY CHIEF OF STAFF FOR POLICY: That would be kidnaping. That we have to kidnap and El Salvadorian citizen against the will of his government and fly him back to America, which would be an unimaginable act and an invasion of El Salvador's sovereignty.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCIUTTO: Interesting use of kidnaping.
It is striking to hear this administration suddenly claim it is so powerless, especially when all that we've heard from Trump is that he has the power to do really whatever he wants.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We have to have Greenland. We have to take back the Panama Canal.
We're going to have Gaza.
Canada would be great as our cherished 51st state.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCIUTTO: Suddenly, now, Trump is powerless when it comes to El Salvador, a country where Trump is now suggesting he may send Americans, U.S. citizens to that notorious prison.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: If it's a homegrown criminal. I have no problem. Now, we're studying the laws. Right now, Pam is studying. If we can do that, that's good.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCIUTTO: Jeff Zeleny is OUTFRONT live outside the White House.
And, Jeff, remarkable outbreak of helplessness in the White House today.
What are you learning about Trump's not only refusal to bring Garcia home? It seems like they're -- they're going to make no effort, but also a threat to expand this by deporting U.S. citizens.
JEFF ZELENY, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: You're stepping back. It was a pretty extraordinary scene in the Oval Office, which, of course, has been the setting for so many meetings that the president has had with foreign leaders, but none quite like this.
There is a business relationship between the U.S. and El Salvador. The U.S. is paying millions and millions of dollars for El Salvador to house these deportees. But the idea of this Maryland man, the 28-year- old, the 29-year-old father -- excuse me -- who the administration. Just a couple weeks ago acknowledged was wrongfully deported. They called it an administrative error.
From there to this scene in the White House this afternoon was extraordinary. Official by official, by official from the attorney general to the secretary of state, to the deputy chief of staff for the White House. All saying for various reasons that the -- the president conducts foreign policy. The Supreme Court cannot weigh in on that.
Jim, there's been a lot of talk about constitutional crisis. Is this a moment of a constitutional crisis or not? If the administration ignores a court order, this talking to a variety of officials, this is the closest it seems to have gotten with the administration outright, essentially ignoring what the Supreme Court has said.
[19:05:04]
They said that -- that they need to facilitate the return of this Maryland man. They didn't say how specifically.
So if this goes forward, this is certainly worth watching. But the president also, for the very first time, said he likes the idea, kind of smiled as he said it. He said his attorney general is looking into sending U.S. citizens to El Salvador as well.
All immigration officials, of course, say that U.S. citizens, regardless of the crimes they commit, should be incarcerated here in the U.S. so taken together, this is one of the most extraordinary Oval Office meetings we've seen. Smiles all around, but so serious underneath -- Jim.
SCIUTTO: No question.
Jeff Zeleny at the White House, thanks so much.
OUTFRONT now, David Culver, who's been reporting exclusively from that prison, one of the only American journalists allowed inside, and Jonathan Blitzer, award winning immigration reporter for "The New Yorker", including the story, "The Rise of Nayib Bukele, El Salvador's authoritarian president". David, I want to begin with you, because I know you've been speaking
to sources in El Salvador. In fact, inside that prison, there, are they saying the same thing as we heard from Trump and Bukele in the White House today?
DAVID CULVER, CNN SENIOR NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: What I'm hearing from them, Jim, is tracking with what we saw play out today in the Oval Office.
But I want to go back to the oval office and point out somebody who didn't speak today, but is nonetheless a very significant figure in all of this. And it's -- the public security and justice minister named Gustavo Villatoro. He was just to the right of President Bukele.
So, President Bukele holds the power. Gustavo Villatoro holds the keys literally to CECOT. He oversees this infamous prison, the terrorism confinement center.
What's interesting about Villatoro is, is this is somebody who has years of history, some 20 plus, that he has put together all the data and criminal records. He's made a gang book that deciphers graffiti, that looks at decoding language of gangs and looks at tattoos very closely. And he shared that with law enforcement, including here in the U.S.
Now, one thing that stands out to me is El Salvador is not passively accepting these deportees from the U.S. its not as though they get a list and say, okay, here's who's coming in today. But according to Villatoro, they are actively requesting certain deportees, specifically those who have a history in El Salvador, to be returned to El Salvador.
Now, he would not speak specifically to me about Abrego Garcia case, but he did say that they look at a criminal record. Jim, they send that to the U.S. and they say, this is the person we want. And so, this is how this is currently playing out.
SCIUTTO: I mean, that's them working hand in hand, is it not, El Salvador and the U.S.
Jonathan, so you have the man who runs the prison sitting there in the Oval Office. And of course, you have the man who leads the country of El Salvador sitting in the Oval Office, both throwing up their hands and saying, we can't do this. We just don't have the power to do this, do that. I find that hard to believe. What's the truth?
JONATHAN BLITZER, STAFF WRITER, THE NEW YORKER: You know, it's funny because they claim to be powerless, but in fact, more than anything else, that is precisely the kind of showcasing of the power that they have that they want.
I mean, this is -- this is how someone like Nayib Bukele operates. He is in his element here, meeting with the president. He wants to be front and center. He wants to be seen as being aligned with Donald Trump. He wants to do whatever it is that Trump asks. This was true of his
first of Trump's first term. You know, Trump makes this very easy for foreign leaders and particularly for leaders in the region, because Trump has such obvious kind of unwavering obsessions, the immigration obsession, the kind of demonizing of immigrants by suggesting that all of them are somehow criminal elements. It makes it very easy for someone like a strongman himself just to take his cues from the president and to really bask in the glow of this kind of special relationship with the U.S. president.
SCIUTTO: David, you're able, of course, to gain access to CECOT.
Trump posted video today, which seems to show just quite aggressive, demeaning treatment of those there. So far, more than 200 Venezuelans deported there from the U.S. and now you have this idea of deporting Americans there.
Can you describe exactly what the treatment is like inside?
CULVER: Harsh, certainly. I mean, its unrelenting at times. I think militant in the order. But the thing is, you got to put this in context. I mean, CECOT was built for El Salvador and those who for many years were essentially running that country, and that is the gangs. And so, there was a level of brutality that was extreme, especially when you talk to locals, they look at CECOT and they almost hold it with -- with hope in their minds, as though it gave them their freedom.
You know, you heard President Bukele today say it liberated them. Thats what people in El Salvador, the vast majority of whom we've spoken with, have said to be true. The question is, though, Jim, does that level of brutality and perhaps the harshness that we see implemented within CECOT applied to deportees?
[19:10:03]
And that's where I think a lot of concern has started to grow in that, are they to be really put forth in this facility that is unlike any other in the world?
SCIUTTO: I mean, it's hard to look at that treatment. It almost looks like something out of a dystopian movie.
Jonathan, Bukele, of course, an authoritarian strongman self advertised and like Trump right now, he's -- he's popular, as David was talking about. There so many people in El Salvador support this prison. He won reelection last year, which was previously forbidden by the Salvadorian constitution. But they made a special allowance.
Trump seems to be impressed by him. Have a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BUKELE: We actually turned the murder capital of the world, that was the journalists call it, right, murder capital of the world into the safest country in the western hemisphere. And, you know, they -- sometimes, they say that we imprison thousands. I like to say that we actually liberated millions. So, you know, like --
TRUMP: It's very good.
(LAUGHTER)
TRUMP: Who gave him that line? Do you think I can use that?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCIUTTO: Smiles and laughs.
But I wonder, Jonathan, does Trump appear to envy that power?
BLITZER: Oh, I don't think there's any question. And, you know, important context around this too. It should be said in El Salvador for the last three years, the country has been in what the president has called a state of exception, meaning that he has suspended parts of the Constitution in a wide-ranging crackdown on these gangs.
El Salvador, no one disputes it has a long history of gang problems, much more dramatic than anything the United States has ever faced. But in the last three years, in the name of cracking down on these gangs and it's true, it's generated all kinds of popularity for Bukele. He has imprisoned over 80,000 people, close to 85,000 people.
The lion's share of them, without any measure of due process. People have languished in prison without charges, without trial, for years. Every month since 2022, the Salvadoran legislature, which is dominated by the party that Bukele founded and represents, has renewed his authority to basically suspend these aspects of the Constitution.
Since that time, over 300 people have died in custody, in government custody, in some of these prisons. And so, you know, when someone like Bukele speaks about liberating the population, you have to ask, at what cost?
SCIUTTO: Listen, there are questions about enforcement of due process in this country right now.
David Culver, Jonathan Blitzer, thanks so much.
So, joining me now is Ryan Goodman.
Ryan, just a few moments ago, let's begin with this. The Trump administration told a federal judge, quote, they do not have the authority to forcibly extract Garcia.
So, you have a lot of hands being thrown up in the air by the strongman leader of El Salvador. I can't do anything about it. And by the leader of the free world, Donald Trump, saying he can't do anything about it.
As relates to President Trump, is that legally accurate?
RYAN GOODMAN, FORMER SPECIAL COUNSEL AT DEPARTMENT OF DEFENSE: So, it might be legally accurate that they shouldn't be forced to extract somebody. But that's beside the point. What the Supreme Court said is in its ruling, without any dissent, that the government must facilitate the -- must facilitate the release of Mr. Abrego Garcia from the custody in El Salvador. So, "facilitate the release" means take all efforts that you can to do so.
So, say to the El Salvador government, can we have him back? Maybe pressure them, say, you know, were paying $6 million for this arrangement. We don't want to pay for this particular individual. Or the arrangement was apparently set up for just one year.
So, for this particular individual, we want him back sooner. All sorts of things they could do to facilitate his release.
SCIUTTO: President Trump has always said he will abide by the courts. Is he defying that Supreme Court order here, or was that order written in such a way that it allowed loopholes for Trump to do this?
GOODMAN: So, I've been very reluctant to ever make the claim that the government is acting in defiance of a court order, because we haven't necessarily seen that yet. This, to me, is either the closest or they've crossed the line. The Supreme Court was very clear when they said, facilitate the release from custody. What the Trump administration has done in court filings starting on Sunday is to say, oh, we don't have to do anything with respect to getting him out of custody. All we have to do is domestically change policies in order to allow him into the country.
Thats not what the Supreme Court said. It is crystal clear what the Supreme Court said. And the court also said you need to keep the district court updated on the steps you have taken since that date. They have not done so.
They have just said, oh, we'll tell you where he's located, but we're not telling you anything about any steps we've taken.
[19:15:02]
SCIUTTO: It's a test. We'll see if the country passes it. One of several.
Ryan Goodman, thanks so much.
GOODMAN: Thank you.
SCIUTTO: OUTFRONT next, breaking news. Morgan Stanley is now warning investors prepare to be fooled, as Trump says he is now looking to exempt even more companies from his once sweeping tariffs.
Plus, the man accused of trying to burn down the Pennsylvania governor's mansion has just appeared in court. You see the pictures there, as we're now learning he was on the property for several minutes before breaking into the home.
Where was security at the time? The D.A. is my guest, and a special report on how main street is now feeling the pain of Trump's trade war.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I was reading it and I about -- had a heart attack.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[19:20:09]
SCIUTTO: Breaking news: Prepare to be fooled.
That is the warning tonight from Morgan Stanley, as Trump may hand out new exceptions to his tariffs. First electronics now suggesting he might ease tariffs for some automakers.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: I'm looking at something to help some of the car companies. Look, I'm a very flexible person. I don't change my mind, but I'm flexible and you have to be.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCIUTTO: Sounds contradictory.
Ever since Trump launched his trade war, he has in fact changed his mind. Whether it's on reciprocal tariffs, a pause on smartphones and computers, and now possibly cars as well.
That is why a strategist for Morgan Stanley writes, quote: Investors should prepare to be fooled many more times. If a master plan exists, its unlikely to work in the way the U.S. administration envisions. And Trump's plan is evolving as the markets swing. Here was Trump today.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: Stock markets up. The stock markets up today. We had the largest gain in the stock market in history on every single category last week.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCIUTTO: They went down a lot. Before that the markets may have been up today but they're still down more than 4000 points since Trump threatened his trade war.
And today, China's president sent Trump a message in a new editorial, writing, quote, trade war and tariff war will produce no winner and protectionism will lead nowhere.
OUTFRONT now, Dan Ives, veteran tech stocks analyst, Peter Tuchman, a longtime Wall Street trader, and Rana Foroohar, CNN economic analyst and "Financial Times" columnist.
Good -- good to have you all on.
Peter, if I could begin with you. So, so the market went up today, but the dollar dropped again. Still, those concerning signs in the bond markets. Is it correct to say, as Trump claims, that well the markets fine with this now?
PETER TUCHMAN, TRADER AT THE NEW YORK STOCK EXCHANGE: I don't believe so at all. I really -- I really want to be upbeat. Right. You know last week den and I were here with you with, Erin, and you know, it was it was a dismal week.
You know, I know Mr. Trump said the market did go up and we did have one day in the midst of a down week, I would call it, where the market was, in fact up. But if we go back to Monday, Tuesday, those days were down severely.
And so, I'd like to stay a little more, more upbeat. Yes, today was down, but it was. That was after we started the day with a nice rally, you know, and the market was up overnight. We came in this morning and the market had a reasonable rally, but by midday, we were -- we had, we had broken. Right.
And it's a function of just, look, I think the market has lost some confidence over the last six weeks, the last one week and the last couple of days in this fact that we are sort of its a bit of a bipolar, you know, passive aggressive approach to these things.
We don't really know. Theres still no clarity around the whole tariff story were given. It's like a pull and a pull. It's like I was joking with Dan.
It's sort of like an old uncle who you used to drive around with when you were a kid who used to drive with his foot on the gas and the brake, and you're constantly going like this.
That's kind of where we are. And so, the market is, you know, I think about it. We've got traders in the market since COVID, 50 million new young traders, retail traders, they're -- their hedge funds. They're institutions, you know.
And so, everybody's trying to position themselves on how to navigate this market still. And you know, I don't know if there's much confidence in this thing. People are -- they're trading. You know the market is trading.
This morning, we were up, you know, 800 or 900 points and we sold off. Broke down midday. And then we rallied back into the close.
SCIUTTO: Right.
TUCHMAN: I think that's what were in store for -- for a while until there's some defined clarity of policy, which we've still yet to see.
SCIUTTO: Right. In fact, we've seen a lot of defined confusion.
Rana, you've written that the U.S. is taking on the qualities of an emerging market now, because of that confusion and back and forth, explain how.
RANA FOROOHAR, CNN GLOBAL ECONOMIC ANALYST: Well, you know, typically in historical terms, emerging markets have been seen as markets that have difficult politics. They're volatile, they're less stable. There's corruption.
You don't know what's going to happen from one day to the next. And often they're run by a kind of cult of personality figure. And frankly, that's kind of what we're seeing in this administration. It's interesting, too, that quantitatively, there's data to show now that, the U.S. political risk levels, as measured by a variety of analysts, are correlating with asset prices and with the dollar in the way that emerging market values often run.
You know, typically the fact that this was the USA and the dollar is the reserve currency kind of gave us a get out of jail free clause. You know, even when politics were -- were rough and more partisan as they have been in the last few years. But in Trump two, that's starting to change. And you really are seeing investors start to say, wait a minute. This is not the America we've known for the last half century. This is a different country.
[19:25:03]
SCIUTTO: Dan, hours after trade exemptions for electronics like laptops, smartphones were announced, the commerce secretary then said they're only temporary, noting they're still subject to a 20 percent tariff. I wonder how tech investors are seeing this, right, because I've been reading about questions about Apple. I mean, Apple stock recovered, but it seems like some investors wonder what the long-term outlook is if these -- if these exemptions indeed are temporary only.
DAN IVES, GLOBAL HEAD OF TECHNOLOGY RESEARCH, WEDBUSH SECURITIES: Yeah. Well, it was a dizzying weekend, right, in terms of news because you start with exemptions and then ultimately, you know, what Lutnick and others talked about in terms of the different brackets or buckets.
Look, I think the reality is, is that the China reciprocal, the 145 percent, that would have been the gut punch, the Amageddon for tech teams, they needed to separate them out. They did. In terms of this other bucket. And that's viewed as a net positive because it basically got them off the cliff.
But now in terms of the next month or two, in terms of what those semi -- what those tech tariffs are going to be, that's a question mark. But look, our view is you're going to have to have negotiations. And the reality is the ten-year, you talked about the ten-year and the weaker dollar, and the markets are going to dictate ultimate policy. And they're going to have to get some sort of negotiation.
SCIUTTO: The thing is, though, Peter, businesses need clarity, not just for the next 72 hours, right? They need it for months and years so that they could figure out what it's going to cost me to make a car, right? Like where -- where am I getting the pieces for this? And therefore, I could figure out what to charge for it and what my profit margins are going to be, et cetera. I mean, how can investors settle with this kind of one day? It's this.
Next day, it's that -- I may have -- I may make 70 trade deals in the next 60 days. I mean, it doesn't it just doesn't add up for anybody who writes stock reports, I imagine.
TUCHMAN: Well, look, we started to see that last week. I think it was Delta Airlines. A number of these larger companies, listed corporations are not able to give guidance. You know, and the last time we saw this was COVID, right? Where there's no way to predict the next quarter, the next half, or what's going to happen at the end of the year.
For investors, this is a hard time, right? For traders, this is the lifeblood of, you know, of day traders. And there are -- there are many millions of day traders who are taking advantage of this market. And, you know, we're seeing that all the way to the top where people are, you know, are trading this market aggressively on the upside and the downside and making money doing it.
But from an investing point of view and -- and from guidance for big companies, I mean, that's where you start to see things break down.
Dan and I have talked about it for a number of days. You know, where, you know, you're seeing where the United States and China are, have been in a race for a while in A.I. and in tech and, you know, and for a while there as, as Nvidia was the flavor of the moment and the stock of the year. And Dan has been touting it for the longest time, and he's a master in the tech sector. There's nobody like him.
And you've been talking about capex and how -- how that sector has been, you know, the high flying master of the last couple of years, it's really -- it's not been the only thing, but its helped the market come through. 2023 and 2024, we're up double digits, you know, respectively. And now, you know, we're -- we're getting -- I was joking with Dan.
We were -- we were looking like we were going to head towards being hanging out with the jetsons. You know, anybody who's my age will remember the jetsons. You know, flying around with George and Elroy.
And now it seems like we may be hanging out with the Flintstones and, you know, because we're just getting knocked back down and not all the way to the --
SCIUTTO: Yeah, I get it.
TUCHMAN: But, you know, so this clarity is can be problematic for the investors and surely for the corporations.
SCIUTTO: I mean, it's moving trillions of dollars in the market seems to be problematic to some investors. Before we go, Dan, Chinese President Xi Jinping, he's in Vietnam signing deals -- I mean, the concern has been that that trading partners of the U.S. are like, actually, I'd rather trade even with China under these circumstances. I mean, even -- even the E.U. was talking to China about EVs.
Is that where this is going? Does China fill that void?
IVES: This is a game of high stakes poker. And ultimately, when you look at Vietnam and other countries, that's what's going to be playing out here between China and the U.S. and ultimately, it's the economy and the consumers. And obviously, these tariffs front and center.
But this is -- look, this is going to be a volatile as Tuchman talked about. There's going to be a volatile few weeks, few months. No company is going to really give guidance. Buckle the seat belts. Thats our opinion. But at least a step forward today versus some dark days last week.
SCIUTTO: Rana, quickly, can Donald Trump kind of charm his way out of this one? Or does he need to announce some bill of goods, right, for how this is going to go going forward?
FOROOHAR: Oh, man, he definitely can't charm his way out of it. I mean, you know, waging a trade war on the entire world, adversaries and allies all at once. The trust is gone.
I mean, and the fact that, you know, you had him pulling back the tariffs as his USTR Jamieson Greer was in congress arguing for them.
[19:30:05]
Other countries look at us and they just say, what the heck is going on? You know, they are moving. China is going to be the winner here. It's the long and short of it.
I mean, this is now their game to lose. And it's you know, I'm not optimistic about the U.S. economy right now.
SCIUTTO: Dan, Peter, Rana, thanks so much.
OUTFRONT next, new details just emerging about the man accused of trying to burn down the Pennsylvania governor's mansion while he and his family were sleeping inside. What was his motive? How did he get past security? The district attorney is next.
Plus, Trump blames Ukraine for Russia's invasion of Ukraine as Putin launches another just devastating strike on civilians.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[19:35:00]
SCIUTTO: Breaking news, a judge has denied bail for the man accused of trying to kill the governor of Pennsylvania. Authorities say Cody Balmer admitted to breaking into Governor Josh Shapiro's mansion, saying he wanted to beat him with a hammer. Thankfully, that didn't happen.
However, police say he managed to scale a security gate in the middle of the night undetected and then was able to set fire to the home while Shapiro and his family were inside.
The damage, as you can see there, is extensive. Thankfully, no one was hurt.
Danny Freeman is OUTFRONT outside the governor's mansion in Harrisburg.
And, Danny, tell us, what do we know about the attackers motive?
DANNY FREEMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: You know, Jim, motive is really still the big unknown question at this point. How this man got from hatred of the governor to actually walking to his home in the middle of the night over this weekend and setting fire to his residence.
But we did learn quite a lot more about the suspect himself, and about how police believe he carried out this attack. But let's start with that arraignment hearing that just took place a little while ago. It was a bit of a circus out there. You noted the top line that 38-year- old Cody Balmer was denied bail.
The judge said that while she appreciated that he ultimately turned himself in, she decided that she wanted to recommend imprisonment for the safety of himself and the community. And you're looking at this video right now, Him, as he got out of that state police squad car. He stuck his tongue out at one point seemingly bored while reporters were peppering him with questions including, why do you hate Governor Shapiro so much? He didn't answer any of those questions or say anything as the cameras rolling, but we did learn some more from actually inside the courtroom when that hearing began.
The hearing was relatively short, but the judge actually asked a series of interesting questions, including when he was asked if he had a history of mental illness. Balmer said, that's the rumor, but no, ma'am. He also denied having any alcohol or drug abuse, but when he was asked if he was taking any specific medication, he said -- Balmer responded, medication that led me to different types of behavior, but he kind of mumbled, so it's a little unclear exactly what he meant by that.
He also said he lives with his parent, and he's been working as a welder. And remember, Jim, the charges that he is now currently facing include attempted homicide, terrorism, aggravated arson, and aggravated assault.
Now, Jim, this all comes, as I noted, after we learned a lot more information about how police believe he got into the residence. They believe that he took a bag with him that was full of beer bottles with gasoline inside of him. He ultimately took those beer bottles, basically homemade Molotov cocktails, lit the governor's residence on fire with them, and ultimately was able to escape.
But you noted at the top, Jim, perhaps the scariest detail that we learned from court filings today was when police asked him, what were you planning to do if you encountered Shapiro? He said, I was planning to, quote, beaten him with his hammer.
Now, Jim, Balmer left the courthouse a little while ago. His next court appearance is next week -- Jim.
SCIUTTO: Yeah, the damage is able to do to the home while they were sleeping there.
Danny Freeman, thanks so much.
So OUTFRONT now, Fran Chardo, the district attorney of Dauphin County, Pennsylvania.
Thanks so much for coming.
FRAN CHARDO, DISTRICT ATTORNEY OF DAUPHIN COUNTY, PA: Thanks for having me.
SCIUTTO: I know it's early. Balmer did admit to, quote, harboring hatred for Governor Shapiro. Of course, as we noted there, threatened to attack him with a hammer, was willing to burn the house down with his family inside.
Do we have any indications now as to what his motivations were?
CHARDO: Well, the state police and our other investigators are looking into that, and were working hard to identify a motive and we're getting evidence to that. I can't speak to it directly because it's not of record, but we're getting a picture of what his intentions were and that they were geared towards -- towards the governor.
SCIUTTO: The -- Trump said today that Balmer, in his words, was not a fan of Trump. Let me play his comments. I want to get your thoughts on the other side.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: The attacker was not a fan of Trump. I understand just from what I read and from what I've been told. The attacker basically wasn't a fan of anybody. He's probably just a whack job, and certainly a thing like that cannot be allowed to happen.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCIUTTO: Is that statement true based on what you know?
CHARDO: Well, I can say that he had all his actions were geared towards getting at the governor and causing harm to the governor, and he was methodical and his actions were well-planned out and -- and were all geared towards taking action at the governor.
And, you know, he brought weapons with him. He brought the gasoline, he brought the sledgehammer that allowed him to -- to break into the residence, breaking two windows and creating these Molotov cocktails, using three of them to cause tremendous damage to the residence.
[19:40:01]
And it could have been much worse but for the quick actions of the Harrisburg Bureau of Fire.
SCIUTTO: No question. I mean, look at that damage there and you're sleeping. You don't know. You don't know how quickly you can react in those circumstances.
This did take place, we should note, just hours after the governor and his family hosted a Passover Seder, it was the Passover holiday then.
Are there any indications? Were there any statements or postings that would indicate this could be an antisemitic attack?
CHARDO: So, we're looking at that. Under Pennsylvania law, there is an ethnic intimidation statute that just raises the level by one of by grading of an offense. But the five most serious offenses he's facing are already the maximum grading. So, it wouldn't have an effect here. As far as the grading of the offenses, they're already first-degree felonies. But we are looking at it because for the sentencing guidelines purposes, it would make it more serious. And, of course, for the judge's discretion.
But we're looking at it because we want to know why he did it. And were looking at the possibility that it was geared towards the governor's -- well, his religion and his, his views on Israel.
SCIUTTO: CNN learned that the attacker was on the property for several minutes before he then broke those two windows and started that fire inside. So, he got over a fence inside the house.
Do you see or have you identified any security failures at this at this point?
CHARDO: Well, that's not for me to say. I mean, I know that the Pennsylvania state police, who are responsible for guarding the governor, are going to do a complete look at their procedures. And I'm certain that they will correct any failures in their procedures. But certainly, that's not something that should happen.
SCIUTTO: Final question. You say he could face federal charges as well. How -- how could they be laid out?
CHARDO: Well, you know, I can't speak as an expert in in federal charges, but the federal authorities were present during our time at the mansion on Sunday, and we are proceeding cooperatively with both the state and federal authorities. And if there's going to be two, prosecutions, that's fine, but we're going to operate independently, and there may be two separate prosecutions.
SCIUTTO: District Attorney Chardo, thanks so much for joining tonight.
CHARDO: Thanks for having me.
SCIUTTO: OUTFRONT next, breaking news. Putin targets Ukrainian civilians, killing scores of them on their way to church on Palm Sunday. And yet, Trump once again takes Putin's side.
Plus, we'll take you to one community that relies on steel. And they like what they're seeing when it comes to President Trump's trade war.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[19:47:02]
SCIUTTO: Breaking news., despite the facts, the obvious facts, President Trump blamed Ukrainian President Zelenskyy for starting the war once again refusing to hold Vladimir Putin solely accountable for the fact that it invaded Ukraine.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: When you start a war, you got to know that you can win the war, right? You don't start a war against somebody that's 20 times your size, and then hope that people give you some missiles.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCIUTTO: Once again, Ukraine did not start the war. I was there. And Trump's comments coming just hours after Russia launched its deadliest attack so far this year as. At least 35 civilians killed after Russia fired two ballistic missiles into a residential neighborhood.
Fred Pleitgen is OUTFRONT.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
FREDERIK PLEITGEN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice- over): Sumy, Ukraine, Palm Sunday, shortly after 10:00 a.m., as folks were heading to mass, two missiles struck, killing and wounding scores.
We live in the city center, this eyewitness says. There is no military base. There are no soldiers here. It is simply a genocide. It is genocide.
After the explosions, mass carnage, first responders trying to help any survivors.
Ukrainian officials said preliminary information indicates Russia used a missile with a warhead packed with cluster munitions, weapons designed to harm people in a wide area.
Ukraine's president, livid.
Only filthy scoundrels can act like this, he said. Today, many state leaders, diplomats, regular people with big hearts expressed their sympathy towards Ukraine. They condemned the Russian attack.
But while many world leaders denounced the attack from President Donald Trump, a muted response.
TRUMP: I think it was terrible, and I was told they made a mistake. But I think it's a horrible thing. I think the whole war is a horrible thing.
PLEITGEN: As mourners gathered in Sumy, laying flowers for the many victims, Moscow claims its army does not go after civilians and was instead targeting a high-level military meeting. There was another meeting of Ukrainian military leaders with their
Western colleagues, the foreign minister says, who were either masquerading as mercenaries or I don't know who. There are NATO servicemen there and they are in direct control.
All this as the fighting on the front lines remains as brutal as ever. Russia, claiming its forces continue to make steady progress while President Trump's diplomatic efforts to broker a ceasefire appear to have hit a roadblock.
Unclear if any progress was made when Trump envoy Steve Witkoff met Russian leader Vladimir Putin on Friday.
The Kremlin downplaying expectations.
[19:50:03]
The whole journey consists of small steps to recreate an atmosphere of at least minimal trust, the Kremlin spokesman says. To strengthen this mutual trust.
But the Ukrainians say they are losing faith in the Trump administration.
VOLODYMYR ZELENSKYY, UKRAINIAN PRESIDENT (through translator): I believe, sadly, Russian narratives are prevailing in the U.S. How is it possible to witness our losses and our suffering to understand what the Russians are doing and to still believe that they are not the aggressors, that they did not start this war?
PLEITGEN: And there are few signs the war could end soon. Just hours after the attack in Sumy, drones struck the port town of Odesa, wounding several people and causing major damage to scores of buildings.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
PLEITGEN (on camera): And, Jim, just to give you an idea about how sluggish things seem to be going, the Kremlin's not even willing to say anymore that a face to face meeting between President Trump and Russian leader Vladimir Putin could happen in the near future. They are now saying that it will happen in due time, and that meetings like that need to be well-prepared -- Jim.
SCIUTTO: Don't seem to be in a hurry.
Fred Pleitgen, thanks so much.
OUTFRONT next, Wall Street may not like Trump's trade war, but we take you to steel country where they're all in on Trump's tariffs.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
NORMAN ZEITER, OWNER & CEO, SWANTON WELDING: I'm very optimistic and I agree --
JASON CARROLL, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: You're optimistic.
ZEITER: I am. I'm extremely optimistic.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[19:56:15]
SCIUTTO: Breaking new: President Trump is defending his 25 percent tariff on steel imports, claiming they're bringing trillions of dollars of businesses back to the U.S.
This comes as the impacts of those tariffs are already being felt in places like Ohio, where many workers rely on the steel industry.
Jason Carroll is OUTFRONT.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
NORMAN ZEITER, OWNER & CEO, SWANTON WELDING: I'm very optimistic and I agree --
JASON CARROLL, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: You're optimistic.
ZEITER: I am. I'm extremely optimistic.
CARROLL (voice-over): Optimistic, not the word some might use to describe their outlook on the economy, given all the back and forth with tariffs. But here at Swanton Welding, just outside Toledo, Ohio, the company's owner, Norman Zeiter, says thanks to Trump's tariff tactics, he and his workers are feeling good about the future of the business. Despite all the ups and downs on Wall Street.
ZEITER: Wall Street affects us to a certain extent, but not a lot.
CARROLL: Welders like Ethan Sanderson also feeling bullish. Hoping all that is happening with tariffs will eventually mean more work and income for people like him, which cannot come soon enough given he's about to be a new father.
ETHAN SANDERSON, WELDER: Once everything gets sorted out that it will, it'll help us out in the long run.
CARROLL: Swanton Welding has been a part of this community since Zeiter's grandfather, a World War II veteran, started it back in 1956 with just $100 in his pocket.
Maintaining it has been tough. The U.S. steel and wide swaths of the manufacturing industry have been on the decline for decades due to factors such as declining demand and the inability to compete in global markets. Toledo once buzzed during the steel manufacturing heyday in the 1950s. Now the unemployment rate is 6.6 percent, compared to the national average of 4.1 percent.
ZEITER: We're one of the last standing ones in this area. CARROLL: Still standing and getting a boost from Trump's tactics.
Zeiter says five international companies have already reached out to do business.
ZEITER: We had Italy, we had France, we had great Britain, we had a Canadian company reach out to us.
CARROLL: You had a Canadian.
ZEITER: Yeah.
CAROLL: He says it's the first time in 70 years a Canadian company has called wanting to work with them.
Across town at Wersell Bike Shop, owner Jill Wersell also has heard from an overseas distributor.
JILL WERSELL, OWNER, WERSELL BIKE SHOP: I just got that a few minutes ago before you came in and I was reading it and I about had a heart attack.
CARROLL: Wersell received an email from a Taiwanese company informing her if tariffs do go into effect, she may have to pay an increase of up to 79 percent.
WERSELL: That's a huge, huge impact on a small business.
CARROLL: She buys from China, Taiwan and Cambodia and worries how tariffs would impact cost to customers and her ability to maintain her staff.
WERSELL: Payroll would be reduced, and somebody might lose their job, or a full-time person will be part-time.
CARROLL: The Wersell family has been in the bike business for 80 years, since her grandfather founded it in 1945. The threat of tariffs, now a concern for a new generation of employees. Wersell's nephew and his wife just quit their jobs a few weeks ago to join the family business.
JORDYN ZAKFELD, MARKETING DIRECTOR, WERSELL BIKE SHOP: We're a little bit nervous, but we trust in Jill. We know that she knows this business really well.
CARROLL: Back at Swanton Welding, also a new generation, one hoping Trump's tactics will benefit their industry.
Alison Fingerman (ph) is an 18-year-old welder who works with her father.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I'm hoping that it gets better and I'm sure it will. It's -- I feel like were on a bumpy road and eventually we'll get to a smoother road.
CARROLL: Jason Carroll, CNN, Toledo, Ohio.
(END VIDEOTAPOE)
SCIUTTO: Lots of family ties through the years in those businesses there.
Thanks so much for joining us tonight. I'm Jim Sciutto in Washington.
"AC360" starts right now.
