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Erin Burnett Outfront

Source: Glove DNA To Be Sent For Genetic Analysis In Guthrie Case; Stephen Colbert Defiantly Calls Out CBS Months Before Show Ends; Remembering Rev. Jesse Jackson, Civil Rights Icon Dies At 84. Aired 7- 8p ET

Aired February 17, 2026 - 19:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[19:00:21]

KATE BOLDUAN, CNN HOST: OUTFRONT next:

The breaking news, no match. The Pima County sheriff saying the DNA found on a glove near Nancy Guthrie's home does not match anyone in the FBI's database. So, what's next?

Plus, the reward for Nancy Guthrie growing. A Milwaukee attorney now promising to put up $100,000 for information leading to the arrest of whoever kidnapped Guthrie. Why does he feel he needed to get involved? He's our guest.

And Colbert slams CBS, accusing his own network of blocking an interview from airing with a Democratic Senate candidate. Colbert says it's all over threats from Trump's FCC but CBS is pushing back.

Let's go OUTFRONT.

(MUSIC)

BOLDUAN: Good evening, everyone. I'm Kate Bolduan, in for Erin Burnett.

OUTFRONT tonight, the breaking news in the search for Nancy Guthrie, a law enforcement source tells CNN the DNA from a glove found near Guthrie's home will now be sent for genetic genealogy testing. This move comes after the much anticipated DNA results from that glove did not show a match to any records in the FBIs database, and there was also a lot of hope, as you know, that this could offer a big break in the case.

At the same time, the Pima County sheriff is providing more details tonight about what he believes happened to Nancy Guthrie.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

INTERVIEWER: You believe it was a kidnapping?

SHERIFF CHRIS NANOS, PIMA COUNTY, AZ: I believe it was a kidnapping.

INTERVIEWER: Targeted kidnapping?

NANOS: Yes. I believe whoever did that knew what they were up to.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BOLDUAN: So, there's that from the sheriff.

As the search is about to enter its 18th day, we're also learning more about the high tech efforts on the ground and in the air to try and track down Guthrie. The sheriff's office today confirmed the use of tools to detect her pacemaker.

And last night, I spoke with David Kennedy. He's a former NSA hacker who created the technology to use the pacemaker's Bluetooth signal to help locate it. And this is what he told us.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DAVID KENNEDY, INVENTOR OF PACEMAKER SIGNAL DETECTOR: I was able to confirm that, you know based on the pacemaker that she has, you know, it will broadcast every about three to four minutes or so with a very small transmission, that if authorities are able to capture, that can triangulate exactly where Nancy is directly off of her pacemaker.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BOLDUAN: Ed Lavandera is OUTFRONT, live in Tucson, Arizona, for us tonight.

Ed, what are you learning there?

ED LAVANDERA, CNN SENIOR NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, you know, this afternoon we saw a number of investigators coming back here to the neighborhood. A couple of them were inside Nancy Guthrie's home. We saw them leaving, they were wearing plastic gloves and carrying a bag at a nearby property. They were also working on a floodlight and a camera on the corner of a property there. Investigators would only say that they were coming back here to do a follow up -- follow up work, and wouldn't comment beyond that.

But we've also spent part of the day reaching out to a number of gun shops here in the Tucson area within a ten-mile radius or so, and we several of them would not talk to us they said that they were not at liberty to talk about what investigators had come asking for. But one of them did tell us that about a week ago investigators had come into come into their store and were showing them pictures of people they were interested in learning more about. The gun shop owner wouldn't say anything more than that, but clearly, investigators are interested and searching for information from gun shops across the Tucson area.

BOLDUAN: Ed, thank you so much. You're the best. Appreciate it.

Everyone is here with me now. Let's dig into this.

Wally, you heard Ed, a gun shop owner telling him that officials have come to the store, showed him pictures, and said a lot of people didn't want to -- didn't want to discuss. But what do you make of that? WALLACE ZEINS, FORMER NYPD HOSTAGE NEGOTIATOR AND HOMICIDE DETECTIVE:

Very important. Why? Because anyone who buys a gun from a gun shop, anyone who buys ammunition from a gun shop, must register with the ATF, Alcohol Tobacco and Firearms. And they keep meticulous records on everything that's done.

And if the store owner doesn't want to give information -- well, standard operating procedure, subpoena. Subpoena the records and go from there.

And the people that go into the gun stores in this particular person, as we saw in the video has a gun between his legs and a holster and they wanted also look around to see if there's any matching with the holster and possibly what type of gun.

BOLDUAN: Yeah. And let's play that video. Play more of this video as I ask you, Chip, the suspect wearing that gun and that holster throughout the video that a lot of people have noted and just kind of the usual nature from the beginning. But regardless, like Ed, Fox News spoke with one local gun shop owner. And I want to play for you what he said.

[19:05(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PHILLIP MARTIN, CO-OWNER OF ARMOR BEARER ARMS IN ARIZONA: I was able to look at the photos that he was showing me, and I told the FBI agent I was like, I no investigator but my intuition is telling me based on how his -- these peoples' facial hair looks like. It looks like the guy that was on camera at that house doing the kidnapping. He was like, yeah, that's why I'm here. He was like, we're going to be going to different gun shops, checking to see if any of these names that I'm showing you here. Any of these people have purchased a gun in the last year.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BOLDUAN: Look, if you go off what that gun shop owner says, it sounds like officials have -- he said names, not just pictures, but he says names and photos of people that they're looking for.

Are you surprised?

CHIP MASSEY, FORMER FBI HOSTAGE NEGOTIATOR: No, not at all. This is -- like Wally was saying. These are the kind of people that they do keep good records. They keep accurate information.

And this man, this gun -- this gun shop owner, this is the kind of thing that we're asking America to do. That's why we really believe that this case is going to be solved, not with somebody who has a badge but somebody who has this idea, a hunch and a telephone, and they want to make a call.

BOLDUAN: Just in general, if you're talking about, I mean lots of stores have surveillance -- surveillance video, gun shops have a lot of surveillance video. ZEINS: A lot and, you know, it's so interesting. Even the block where

that gun store -- gun store is, there's other stores. They may have cameras and they can take pictures of people walking out of that store, walking down the block, and it's great information and it really enhances the investigation.

BOLDUAN: It also, Casey, shows how there are a lot of avenues that this investigation, as they've said, that more avenues of this investigation is going than just basing it off of -- well, just say the glove with the news there.

How important are these interviews with these shop owners, do you think?

CASEY JORDAN, CRIMINOLOGIST, BEHAVIORAL ANALYST: We see this work all the time. The old-fashioned canvassing the neighborhood. Now, I'm sure all the viewers just assume that the entire country is obsessed with the Nancy Guthrie case. There are plenty of people out there who don't watch the news, are completely oblivious that this is going on.

So, we've all seen this -- this doorbell footage, but going door to door, not just with the neighbors, but with the gun shop, showing them these photographs. You're going to find people who are seeing it for the first time, and you never know when it's going to trigger a memory or just make them think, oh that looks like somebody let me think about that.

Remember, they're triangulating information right now. They've got names. They've got photos of people who bought that similar backpack at that Walmart. If they can get a match on that from a gun shop, the suspect pool gets narrower and narrower so that when the time does come to match DNA, you might be able to get a warrant to swab somebody's cheek and compare it to that which was found in the house or on the glove.

BURNETT: Yeah. I mean, and Jacqueline, when it comes to DNA, the Pima County sheriff announced today again, just to remind everyone that the DNA tested from the glove found near Guthrie's house does not have any matches in the national database. The glove is now going to be sent for genetic genealogy analysis. You oversaw at the FBI some high- profile cases that used this same type of analysis, including the Gilgo beach murders here in New York.

How does this process work? Can you take us inside a little bit?

JACQUELINE MAGUIRE, FORMER FBI EXECUTIVE ASSISTANT DIRECTOR, SCIENCE AND TECHNOLOGY BRANCH: Sure. The FBI has developed an expertise in investigative genetic genealogy, and like most all investigative processes, this is a very methodical process that they'll take that DNA profile, submit it into a public database, same databases that many people submit their DNA to learn more about their family history, their genealogy, and depending on the results of that submission, you know, that just is the start of more investigation to determine the likely match that there could be with other profiles in those public databases to identify those individuals to go out do a little more investigation on them. So, it's a great and logical next step in the investigation but again, its time intensive and it is methodical

BOLDUAN: And it clearly needs to be at this point because that's what they're up against. So, there's a new element that's come -- that came in late this afternoon. I want to run by you guys, both of you. The sheriff's office also spoke with NBC News today.

And in this interview mentioned -- I'll call it a new possible clue that could be coming from this surveillance video from Nancy Guthrie's home. Let me play what he said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REPORTER: Look here. You can see some kind of ring may be showing through the suspect's glove.

Have you noticed that the suspect may have a ring on something that looks like a ring?

NANOS: I look at the same photo you look at, and I get -- I see it, I see people have circled and said --

[19:10:01]

REPORTER: Yeah.

NANOS: -- I -- my speculation is -- I'm going to give that to my team. They'll look at that. They'll analyze it and we'll see. Maybe, maybe it is.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BOLDUAN: The sheriff there saying maybe, maybe it is. We're showing it on the screen for everyone. This in spot shadowed right there spotted so you can see what they're talking about, the part of the hand. What do you think, Chip?

MASSEY: Yeah, I mean, when we look at this, it's -- I'm sure the rest of the country is seeing the same thing, raised ring embossed. Perhaps, right? That would make sense. You know, a lot of people still wear, like, a class ring or something of that nature. That picture can definitely be enhanced. We can get more information from that.

BOLDUAN: Wally, what do you do with this if you're back in the job?

ZEINS: Back on the job? We take that picture and we take it to our crime lab, and we look at what we can do to enhance it as Chip just said.

BOLDUAN: Can you enhance it?

ZEINS: It can be --

BOLDUAN: A grainy photo.

ZEINS: In this day and age, with A.I. even, with all the technology that we have, things can be done and stranger than you might think we possibly can get some sort of impression out of that. And if it was a college ring or a high school ring, that's a great investigative step to go right to that school and start looking for pictures and names.

BOLDUAN: Yeah. I mean, talk about trying to narrow something down. If it would be a any kind of a class ring, school ring, anything that would certainly, certainly be something. Again, possible maybe they say that they're running it down.

Casey, the sheriff's office also said today that they are working with Walmart to gather more information about the backpack. You were talking about it, worn by the suspect, seen also in the video.

How critical could this be? Especially in also what any private business or big, big corporation like Walmart, what it can offer now here?

JORDAN: I have to tell you. I have a personal experience with Walmart and a burglar at my house who took a stolen credit card and used it at Walmart. They were amazing. I could not believe it. I got from the bank the amount and the time. They had a copy of the receipt. They could tell me exactly what the burglar bought.

They could tell me -- they had a picture of it. I got to interview the cashier and then they had pictures of this person getting into a car in the parking lot. And through this, I was able to catch the burglar faster than the police could.

I am really impressed with the amount of data that they will keep in their archives. They can go through and find everyone who has bought that similar backpack, that similar jacket, and even if they didn't buy it with a credit card, paid cash, they can still have, an amazing video system there. They could find pictures of people who purchased that backpack, perhaps in the last year. And start narrowing it down.

It's a -- it's a long slog, but it does work if you get the picture of the person buying that backpack and it works with a picture that we find at a gun shop, and we find that the credit card name matches and we get -- a driver's license at the gun shop. I mean, this is how it's called good old-fashioned detective work with a lot of high tech sprinkled in. And it does work.

BOLDUAN: I will say, one -- one thing I've learned with certainty today is I would never want to get sideways of Casey Jordan. I would not want you trying to track me down with anything, especially with your expertise.

Jacqueline, but on this -- you're talking about. So, you have this avenue of the methodical analysis that will go into the genealogy testing now. But talk to me about the process then, how involved and time consuming, how long because time is of the essence, of course, and officials that working with now with law enforcement to try to narrow this down further.

MAGUIRE: I think it depends on the results that come back. As Casey referenced, Walmart has a sophisticated security operation. So again, everything is methodical to determine who purchased that backpack. Again, did someone who purchased that backpack also purchase other items that are seen on the video? And depending on the time frame they're looking at, depending, just think of how many Walmarts are in the state in the country, the results of that could be vast and just poring through those, passing through one by one to see if there could be any connection and do that further investigation as appropriate.

BOLDUAN: Real quick, just one element, another element that came up today. It's not only that, the glove that was found two miles from the Guthrie's house, that it didn't match in the national database, but you also have that the glove recovered, did not match the blood that they were also, they say they're still analyzing at the house. How big of a -- how big of a blow is that? Everyone was hoping those two things matched, of course.

MASSEY: Well, one of the things that I'm thinking about, and I think that America is wondering about is that there was a struggle right on that stoop. We have Nancy's blood, but what happens inside that house?

[19:15:00]

BOLDUAN: Yeah.

MASSEY: Forty-one minutes is unaccounted for. Yeah, this guy that we see on this camera that we see seems to be unprofessional. And he's now inside that house. That guy is going to make a mistake. Every minute inside that house is a mistake he can make. Drop something out of his pocket. Does he take his glove off and touch something? It's not unusual.

And if you think about that 41 minutes spent in the house, what about Walmart? Like we were just talking about?

Walmart has one of the most sophisticated systems monitoring systems out there for retail and they know when somebody is lingering over a product, they know if they go back to it to touch it, between 40 to 100 cameras in any Walmart store, they've got the data. I think it's a huge find.

ZEINS: And that's what you see. It's what's hidden cameras that are also there.

BOLDUAN: Yeah. There is many more avenues that there are fortunately, clearly, it seems trying to track down right now.

Everyone, thank you so much. I really appreciate it. Thanks, guys.

OUTFRONT next, a Milwaukee attorney tonight putting up his own money for information on Guthrie's kidnappers, $100,000. He's my guest along with TMZ's Harvey levin, who has new reporting tonight.

Plus, investigators are returning to Nancy Guthrie's neighborhood seen checking security cameras. What could they find? The founder of Ring will be here.

And remembering a towering figure in the civil rights movement, a man former President Obama called a true giant, Reverend Jesse Jackson. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JESSE JACKSON, CIVIL RIGHTS LEADER: I was born in Greenville, South Carolina, in rampant, radical racial segregation

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[19:20:58]

BOLDUAN: Breaking news, more than 18,000 tips have been called in by people in the Nancy Guthrie investigation. This, as a new reward, is also now being offered $100,000 for information that leads to the arrest of whoever kidnapped her. That is, in addition to the FBI reward that we've talked about, also, at $100,000 that's been out there.

This new reward, which would let people remain anonymous, is being offered personally by my next guest, who says he already sent the money to the Pima County Crime Stoppers organization.

Michael Hupy, he's the president of Milwaukee Crime Stoppers, also an attorney. He joins us now.

Michael, thank you for being here. First why did you decide to do this?

MICHAEL HUPY, MILWAUKEE CRIME STOPPERS PRESIDENT: Well, I'm president of Milwaukee crime stoppers, and I've offered and paid rewards in other murder cases. And as I listen to this case unfold with an 84- year-old woman, I was just kind of appalled that they never enlisted Crime Stoppers' help at the beginning or much sooner. And I finally decided if no one else is going to do it, I'd better do it.

BOLDUAN: Have you approached or run this by anyone like the FBI or the sheriff in Pima County, or heard anything from them? Since you announced this.

HUPY: Called both of them. Called both of them. I talked to the FBI and I said maybe you should put your reward up through Crime Stoppers. I don't know if government regulations allow that. I called the sheriff's office and told them what I wanted to do. I didn't hear back, and I called Tucson Crime Stoppers, and they were very happy to have me join in.

BOLDUAN: We reached out to Pima County Crime Stoppers. We have not heard back yet. So, explain exactly how it would work if someone does submit a tip?

HUPY: If somebody submits a tip, it's anonymous. We don't ask what their name is, phone number, address. It's totally anonymous. If their tip pans out and we make an arrest, they get a reward anonymously. They're sent to a location where they're paid, and no one ever knows their name.

And if somebody has a phony tip, they're not going to get a reward in advance because there has to be an arrest.

BOLDUAN: Any idea how many tips your reward this on this has generated so far?

HUPY: Well, I sent the check today, so my reward hasn't been announced by Crime Stoppers in Tucson, but were hoping that we get the one right tip.

Somebody said he wanted bitcoin in advance. He knew who the perpetrator was. That's not the way it works. If you pay him in advance, he can take your money and run, and you could be a phony. So this is ironclad works.

BOLDUAN: Michael Hupy, thanks so much for coming in. Really appreciate the time.

HUPY: My pleasure.

BOLDUAN: Thank you.

HUPY: Have a good evening.

BOLDUAN: Thank you.

And TMZ founder Harvey Levin is now OUTFRONT.

It's good to see you again. He's been breaking news from the start of the investigation, also received the initial ransom note and multiple emails from someone claiming to know who kidnapped Nancy Guthrie.

Thanks for coming back on, Harvey.

This offer from the Milwaukee Crime Stoppers. I mean, he was just laying it out. He says -- he says it would give the person who, I guess potentially keeps emailing you another avenue to collect a reward anonymously. He says, have you heard anything else back from that person since we spoke last night?

HARVEY LEVIN, TMZ FOUNDER: So, we made a decision to not talk about anything we may or may not be getting from that person. Here's why, Kate. If we say yes, we heard something, and tomorrow you ask and we say, yes, we heard something. And then the next day we say, we're not going to comment. That's a tip that maybe we got the information and that tips off perhaps the kidnapper to move locations.

[19:25:02]

So, what we're going to do is not say anything about what we got from this person. At this point, we are going to forward whatever information we get to the FBI and they will do their thing. But the person who got the -- who is sending us this should know there'd be a record then that he was responsible for it.

I will tell you, Kate, without getting specific, the FBI is even more on top of both these reward letters and the ransom letter. We have had numerous communications, including an extensive one today. And so, they are really pursuing this thing, and they haven't cracked it, but they are really interested in it.

BOLDUAN: Also so interesting, everything that -- everything that you're hearing and trying to navigate here right now, Harvey. You've also been doing some reporting on what we were talking about just earlier in the show, the holster that we see the armed masked man wearing as he was outside Nancy Guthrie's door.

And how important that holster may now be to the investigation. What are you picking up?

LEVIN: Well, what we're being told by law enforcement is that the reason they went to these gun shops with those names are the names are people who bought that holster, and they have gone to these gun shops. I talked to one of the gun shop owners who said that they wanted to know over the last year if anybody purchased a gun there with those names, the names correspond to people in the area who bought that holster. So, they want to see if there's a match, because if there is, especially because it's unusual to put a semiautomatic handgun in that type of holster, it gives them a hot lead. That's what they're looking for.

BOLDUAN: Did the owner, the shop owner that you were speaking to say that they had any kind of they thought possible connections.

LEVIN: Not this person. They didn't see -- they didn't see a connection but they were asked and they were asked last week by an agent. She, she contacted the store and presented the list.

BOLDUAN: Super interesting. What do you know about the holster?

LEVIN: Well, it's -- you know, it looks like this is a Walmart holster. Look, I mean, we have talked about, you know, we found this backpack pretty quickly that what type of backpack it is. It hasn't really been out there a lot, but we believe that the jacket he's wearing in this, in the picture you're showing right now, is an athletic works fusion knit jacket from Walmart.

So, if they were able to find the jacket, the backpack and the holster you know, being purchased by one person, even over time, that's a big lead for them. So, you know, look, Kate, what I was told today is that we -- by a law enforcement official right in the middle of this, that we are doing gumshoe detective work. We are going in all directions right now. That they don't have anything specific that they can point to and say, this could be our person. They're just not there. You know, there -- there's a lot of frustration. I mean, the DNA so far is not helpful to them, although they are doing this gene -- I know they're doing this genealogy testing. And that could produce something.

You know, it could be that it's close where it's a relative, and they start fanning out saying, do they have anybody who's a relative who lives, you know in Tucson, who's five, nine, five, ten average build. So, you know, that might produce something.

But right now, the way it was told to me is we are doing gumshoe detective work, going in all directions, trying to figure this out.

BOLDUAN: Well, and, I mean, you've been doing -- you've really been getting a lot of this before anyone when you if you would add in and this is an if right. If you add in backpack bought obviously at Walmart, jacket bought likely potentially at Walmart. And then if you as you're picking up potentially the gun holster also picked up at Walmart, I mean those are three pieces of a puzzle that you would assume there aren't a lot of people out there that are buying those three items.

LEVIN: I don't have any indication that they've struck gold with that yet. But it's -- from what I understand not for lack of trying.

BOLDUAN: You mentioned how the FBI is really interested in the ransom note that you received, and has been spending a lot, and you even said last night spending a lot of time on it. What can you characterize at all --

LEVIN: Today, particularly.

BOLDUAN: Can you characterize at all what it is that is so interesting?

[19:30:02]

LEVIN: No. No. And again, you know you and I talked about this yesterday. This is a -- you know, a tightrope act where we're trying to help and at the same time, we're news operation and so the helpful part, I just -- it's not right for me to characterize that, but there -- and again, not just the ransom note, but they're clearly interested in that.

But they're also interested in this guy who has been sending us these emails saying he knows where Nancy and the kidnappers are -- and the kidnapper is. So, you know, it's not that they're only looking at one. They're looking at both of these things.

BOLDUAN: Do you -- do you think in what you heard from the gun shop owners? I find this a fascinating kind of avenue, and the fact that you said that they were contacted last week. There seems to be that that could be a really, like fruitful path to be investigating because we're talking about earlier with a couple with a couple others, gun shop owners. They take meticulous notes and records they're required to.

And so, there is a lot of information that could be gathered there that's different than just, you know, say looking for trying to find surveillance video in a neighborhood where a lot of things are kind of hidden.

LEVIN: Yeah, I think it's really an interesting angle, too. The guy that I spoke to, the gun shop owner said that they wanted to know in the last year, so they had a time frame with this guy. If anybody bought a gun that they were looking at to see if it matched. So, they were looking at this one-year time frame. I'm not sure why one year was significant and it may be arbitrary. I

just don't know. But that's what they asked him. There was a gun show in the Tucson area that I found kind of interesting. And I don't know, I'm assuming they've probably looked at that too.

But you know, there -- again, they are -- the way it was put to me is they don't have anything that's substantial enough to start pointing at somebody, but they are just fanning out in all directions, especially the FBI.

BOLDUAN: I'm sure. Seems like it.

Harvey, thank you so much for always bringing all of this information to us. I really appreciate it. Really, really do.

LEVIN: You bet.

BOLDUAN: OUTFRONT for us next, breaking news, investigators returning to Nancy Guthrie's neighborhood and appear to be inspecting surveillance cameras. What information can they still learn? The founder of Ring is next.

Plus, Stephen Colbert and CBS are at odds tonight after he accused his -- accused his own network, that -- the network -- of refusing to air his interview with a Democrat. CBS is now pushing back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[19:37:21]

BOLDUAN: Breaking news, investigators canvassing Nancy Guthrie's neighborhood again, checking security cameras and searching for new evidence. In this video, we're going to show you two officials appear to be inspecting an outdoor surveillance camera while also referencing a phone. This comes as Pima County sheriff's department vehicles were also seen in the driveway of Nancy Guthrie's home. CNN crews saw one person exit the house wearing blue gloves and carrying a bag before driving away.

A spokesperson for the sheriff's department tells CNN that investigators are in the area tonight. The way they put it conducting follow up investigations, the sheriff's department also issued this community alert last week, urging and requesting residents to turn over any surveillance video that they have from their homes. And tonight, Ring footage could be central to what investigators hope becomes the next major break.

OUTFRONT now is Ring founder and CEO, Jamie Siminoff.

It's good to see you, Jamie.

JAMIE SIMINOFF, RING FOUNDER AND CHIEF INVENTOR: Thanks for having me.

BOLDUAN: Thank you so much for coming in.

When you see and we'll show the video again, investigators up on a ladder and they say they're conducting follow up -- follow up investigations, or referencing a phone, looking at -- looking at a camera. What are they likely trying to confirm? Is there a range of possibility?

SIMINOFF: I mean, it's hard to speculate, the footage does appear to be a ring floodlight camera. Again, it's pretty small in the picture but it does appear to be one of our floodlight cameras. The footage would be in the Cloud, if it was there. So, I maybe they're looking at the angle of it or you know why --

BOLDUAN: That's what I was wondering, is, like, you don't physically need to be at that camera to get what would be in the cloud.

SIMINOFF: I'm not really sure like what the -- they're definitely -- I mean, they're doing something. And so, I mean, hopefully they're finding something out that will help in this investigation because it is definitely gone on too long.

BOLDUAN: Absolutely.

The sheriff, the Pima County sheriff tonight says that Google and he are working to recover more surveillance video from the Nest cameras that were in Nancy Guthrie's house. And I want to play for you how the sheriff talked about it with nightly news tonight.

Let me play this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

NANOS: They call it scratching. It's like the way it was described to me is you've got eight layers of paint, and you want to peel down to the sixth layer, but you get to that fifth layer you might tear the sixth layer. So it's a delicate operation for them.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BOLDUAN: And Ring -- how Ring works different than how Nest works. Not two very -- two different companies, two different technologies. But this idea of scratching and what he's talking about, what would you think? What is he describing here?

SIMINOFF: And again, not to describe how they would do it, but I would say just overall a databases and how storage is.

[19:40:00]

There sometimes remnant data that's stored if you don't run -- we run scripts. As soon as you delete a video it Ring, we run a script that basically takes it off of the server. If you're doing live view and you don't have a subscription, we actually don't record it.

So, for us, we don't have these remnant data, but remnant data in databases can exist if you don't run sort of a deletion script. So, it's almost like to me, it's more like putting trash in your can in the kitchen, and you just haven't taken it out to the street yet. So, it's still in there until you basically take it out. So -- but it is -- I think what they're describing is there's some

data that somewhere its hard. It's -- it is -- it could be in multiple places. It could be sort of broken. And they're trying to put it back together is what it sounds like they're doing.

BOLDUAN: One of the things that is starting to come to mind for me when it comes to video that's available, that's out there, is just the timing. We're now three weeks into the search. What does that mean in terms of ring footage and how long it stays in the cloud before it is overwritten, before it is deleted like, how urgent are we here in terms of people wanting to turn over finding something?

SIMINOFF: I mean, we're definitely getting there. You know, most -- so Ring customers can store their footage from 30 days. They can extend it in the app up to 180 days depending on the plan you have.

So, you can have longer storage with Ring. But we probably are averaging -- I mean, the average is around 30 days, which typically is long enough. When an incident happens you go back.

But yeah, we are now getting weeks out into this case. I know they did do an alert for a longer amount of time for video. They're definitely looking.

In prior cases, we have found that someone has been in the neighborhood. They have either canvass other houses, or working at other houses, or they've done something in that area its usually not the first time they've been there when it's something like this. So, it makes sense that they would be looking back. But -- yeah, this is -- at three weeks, you're starting to get into a -- you know, this is -- this is going long.

BOLDUAN: And also, with that request coming from law enforcement, as we see them inspecting a camera, Ring does not simply hand over private customer video to law enforcement. How does it work? What can -- what can and can't you do?

SIMINOFF: So, everything was built on that. Your video is your video. You know, it's your privacy so we do a community. They did community requests. So that's a system where they send a request out in the area the local police, our customers get it and they can -- if they don't do anything, they're anonymous, like no one knows who got it. Obviously, if they think they have some video, they can then click and have it sent off in a very efficient way to, in this case the sheriff, to have them look at it.

I think what's been so tough about this case is that the homes are just like they're far back from the road, the landscaping is very thick. They're like, it is a -- this is really a tough area. You know, I mean, I think we've gotten so used to that. Cameras are everywhere and video and --

BOLDUAN: The car drives by. Yeah.

SIMINOFF: And sort of like you'd find it, even in places where the homes are like bigger and on bigger lots, like they're big, you know, grass lots. Or this is like really thick, they're back from the road. And so, I think that's what we're seeing here is like, this is a -- this is really has been a tough one.

BOLDUAN: Absolutely.

Jamie, it's good to have you here.

SIMINOFF: Thank you.

BOLDUAN: Thank you very much for coming in. Really appreciate it.

SIMINOFF: Thanks for having me.

BOLDUAN: OUTFRONT for us next, Stephen Colbert blasting CBS, claiming his network refused to air his interview with the Democratic candidate because of Donald Trump.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

STEPHEN COLBERT, LATE NIGHT TV HOST: Then I was told in some uncertain terms that not only could I not have him on, I could not mention me not having him on.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BOLDUAN: What CBS's response? Bring that to you.

Plus, we remember Reverend Jesse Jackson, the civil rights leader who marched alongside Martin Luther King.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[19:47:42]

BOLDUAN: Tonight, Stephen Colbert goes off. The late night host slamming CBS and Trump's FCC, suggesting the network tried to censor an interview he did with the Democratic senate candidate. CBS is pushing back, though.

We should note CBS is pulling the late-night program in May after a 33-year run.

Brian Stelter is OUTFRONT.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BRIAN STELTER, CNN CHIEF MEDIA ANALYST (voice-over): Stephen Colbert saw this coming.

COLBERT: I got to watch what I say about Trump because -- because Johnny Law is once again coming after yours truly here.

STELTER (voice-over): Last month, Colbert warned fans about a looming crackdown by President Donald Trump's Federal Communications Commission.

COLBERT: So, let's talk about these new crackdown rules that my lawyer warned me not to talk about. The --

STELTER (voice-over): It was funny until it wasn't. This week, Colbert says, CBS lawyers intervened when he interviewed James Talarico, who is running in the Democratic Senate primary in Texas.

COLBERT: Then I was told in some uncertain terms that not only could I not have him on, I could not mention me not having him on.

STELTER (voice-over): Colbert told viewers everything, casting it as part of Trump's crusade to chill critical speech.

COLBERT: You might have heard of this thing called the equal time rule. Okay? It's an old FCC rule that applies only to radio and broadcast television, not cable or streaming, that says if a show has a candidate on during an election, they have to have all that candidates opponents on as well. It's the FCC's most time-honored rule right after no nipples at the Super Bowl.

STELTER (voice-over): And last month, the Trump aligned FCC chair, Brendan Carr, issued new guidance about that old equal time rule, saying stations should not assume that shows like Colbert's are exempt from it anymore.

BRENDAN CARR, FCC CHAIRMAN: If you're fake news, you're not going to qualify as bona fide news exception.

STELTER (voice-over): The FCC's actual enforcement powers are limited, so as a source at the agency told CNN, quote, "The threat is the point. The point is to force shows and networks to second guess their decisions."

CBS seems to be taking the threat seriously. The network said today that Colbert was not prohibited from airing the interview, but he was given, quote, legal guidance about the equal time rule. Since FCC rules don't apply online, Colbert shared the interview on YouTube showing that Talarico talked about this very topic, the government threatening free speech.

STATE REP. JAMES TALARICO, CANDIDATE IN DEMOCRATIC SENATE PRIMARY IN TEXAS: This is the party that ran against cancel culture, and now they're trying to control what we watch, what we say, what we read.

[19:50:03]

STELTER (voice-over): Talarico also mentioned a report that the FCC is, quote, investigating "The View" for an equal time violation, for booking him on that show.

TALARICO: They went after "The View" because I went on there. They went after Jimmy Kimmel for telling a joke they didn't like. They went after you for telling the truth about Paramount's bribe to Donald Trump.

STELTER (voice-over): Now, Talarico getting a big campaign boost thanks to all this attention, reminding everyone how the FCC's pressure against Jimmy Kimmel backfired last fall. JIMMY KIMMEL, LATE NIGHT TV HOST: This one was a bacon double dementia

burger with cheese. This is -- even for him, this one was nuts.

STELTER (voice-over): And Colbert last month predicting that his fellow comics will be feeling Trump's pressure after he signs off in May.

COLBERT: Good luck, Jimmy. So see ya. See ya, suckers.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BOLDUAN: Brian, you mentioned FCC is limited in their enforcement power.

STELTER: Yeah.

BOLDUAN: So do you know if they're actually trying to take action against these -- against these TV stations?

STELTER: Well, FCC chairman Brendan Carr hasn't commented on any of this today, but I was told by a source familiar with the matter tonight that, yes, ABC has been contacted by the FCC, that yes, there is an active investigation into "The View". Now I feel kind of funny saying those words like an investigation into "The View", right? It seems kind of ludicrous.

But it is true. The FCC sent some letters. ABC has responded. There is this back and forth, and I'm told that is what caused concern among CBS lawyers. That is what caused this chill at CBS.

But the FCC has very little actual enforcement power. Yeah, they can make ABC pay a fine, but they're not going to revoke a station license. So ultimately, the FCC didn't do this. The FCC created a chill, but the CBS lawyers did this.

And there is a term for what's happening at CBS. It's called obeying in advance.

BOLDUAN: And how that chill spreads is a huge concern. It's good to see you, Brian.

STELTER: Thanks.

BOLDUAN: Thanks for staying on top of it.

OUTFRONT for us next, we remember Reverend Jesse Jackson, a relentless and unwavering voice for justice.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[19:56:10]

BOLDUAN: Tonight, a true giant. That is how former President Barack Obama is remembering Reverend Jesse Jackson, the legendary civil rights leader, is being celebrated around the world after dying at the age of 84. Abby Phillip is OUTFRONT.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ABBY PHILLIP, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): From around the world tonight. An outpouring of tributes for the influential civil rights champion, Jesse Jackson, who carried on Martin Luther King Jr.'s dream for equality in America.

Former President Obama writing, quote, "He was relentless in his belief that we are all children of God, deserving of dignity and respect."

And former President Bill Clinton and Hillary Clinton writing, quote, "Reverend Jackson never stopped working for a better America with brighter tomorrows".

President Donald Trump sharing, quote, "Jesse was a force of nature like few others before him."

Every message sharing a similar theme -- Jackson's life was marked by an unwavering pursuit of justice and equality.

JESSE JACKSON, CIVIL RIGHTS LEADER: I was born in Greenville, South Carolina, in rampant radical racial segregation. Had to be taught to go to the back of the bus or be arrested.

PHILLIP (voice-over): Those early experiences drove Jackson to join the civil rights movement.

JACKSON: The fact is, against the odds, we knew there were great odds. We were winning.

PHILLIP (voice-over): In 1965, he began working for Reverend Martin Luther King, Jr.

JACKSON: I learned so much from him, such a great source of inspiration.

PHILLIP (voice-over): Both men were in Memphis in April 1968 to support striking sanitation workers. King and other civil rights leaders were staying at the Lorraine Motel.

JACKSON: He said, Jesse, you know, you don't even have on a shirt and tie. You don't even have on a tie. We're going to dinner. I said, Doctor, does not require attire, just an appetite. We laughed and said, doc -- the bullet hit.

Everything changed at that moment. It was a defining moment in the history of our struggle.

PHILLIP (voice-over): With King gone, his movement was adrift. Years later, Jackson formed Operation Push pressuring businesses to open up to Black workers and customers, and urging Black youth to rise above their circumstance.

JACKSON: I am somebody. I am somebody.

PHILLIP (voice-over): The reverend set his sights on the White House in 1984.

JACKSON: Milking cows and coming back to the inner cities. So, I learned a lot during that period.

PHILLIP (voice-over): Initially dismissed as a marginal candidate, Jackson finished third in the primary race with 18 percent of the vote.

That campaign almost went off the rails when Jackson used an ethnic slur to refer to New York Jews.

JACKSON: These mistakes, and they hurt.

PHILLIP (voice-over): He ran again in 1988, this time doubling his vote count and finishing in second in the Democratic race.

JACKSON: Keep hope alive, oh, tomorrow night!

PHILLIP (voice-over): At the time, it was the farthest any Black candidate had gone in a presidential contest.

JACKSON: But 20 years later, when President Barack ran, we were laying the groundwork for that season.

PHILLIP (voice-over): In 2017, Jackson had a new battle to fight, a neurodegenerative disease, but that didn't stop him.

JACKSON: If you hold on, if your cause is right and your grip is tight, you'll make it.

PHILLIP (voice-over): Late in life, he was still fighting. He was arrested in Washington while demonstrating for voting rights. His silent presence at the trial of Ahmaud Arbery's killers prompted defense lawyers to ask that he leave the courtroom. Jackson stayed.

JACKSON: I am somebody. I am somebody.

PHILLIP (voice-over): From the Jim Crow South, through the turbulent '60s and into the Black Lives Matter movement, Jesse Jackson was a constant, unyielding voice for justice.

Abby Phillip, CNN, New York.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BOLDUAN: Abby, thank you so much for that.

And thank you all so much for joining us tonight. I'm Kate Bolduan.

"AC360" starts now.