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Erin Burnett Outfront
Trump Not Ruling Out Ground Troops In Iran; Protests Growing Across U.S. After ICE Killings In Maine & Texas; Trump Address To Focus On What He Calls "Free & Fair Elections". Aired 7-8p ET
Aired July 14, 2026 - 19:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[19:00:21]
ERIN BURNETT, CNN HOST: OUTFRONT next:
Breaking news, Trump threatening Iran's power plants and bridges, not ruling out ground forces as Iran claims it targets U.S. fighter F-18s.
Also breaking, new details in the deadly shooting of a 26-year-old man in Maine. CNN has analyzed the video and the photos of the incident, every one that we have from every angle, and we're going to show you exactly what they reveal. A special report coming up.
And an OUTFRONT exclusive tonight, an American teacher held for three and a half years in Russia, including in one of Putin's most brutal prisons, now speaking out here in his first national interview.
Let's go OUTFRONT.
(MUSIC)
BURNETT: And good evening, I'm Erin Burnett.
And OUTFRONT tonight, the breaking news -- President Trump not ruling out ground troops in Iran tonight. Just moments ago, warning in an interview with Fox that attacks on civilian infrastructure could be next.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TREY YINGST, FOX NEWS CHIEF FOREIGN CORRESPONDENT: Do you anticipate that the strikes we're seeing this week against Iran will expand? Are you considering hitting energy targets or other locations inside of Iran?
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES : It's going to expand. I'll save the energy targets for last. But ultimately, we'll hit energy targets, yeah.
But we're going to hit them very hard tonight. We're going to hit them very hard tomorrow night. We're going to hit them very hard the night after.
And then next week, it gets really bad for them because next week comes the power plants. Next week comes the bridges. We're going to knock out all their power plants. We're going to knock out all their bridges unless they get to the table and negotiate.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: An ominous threat.
It comes as the United States military is once again enforcing a naval blockade, they say blocking all traffic entering and leaving Iranian ports. Now, according to the U.S. military, there's now a massive U.S. show of force across the Middle East with more than 20 U.S. Navy warships and hundreds of military aircraft there.
At the same time, Iran's armed forces now claim they targeted an airbase in Jordan where U.S. F-18 fighter jets are stationed. The Iranian army also claiming drone operations against U.S. bases in the region will continue until, in their words, final victory is achieved.
We have some new video of Iran firing their missiles and drones. What does this mean on the receiving end? Well, in Kuwait, they say that they intercepted a ballistic missile, that five cruise missiles and 33 drones in just the past 24 hours. They also say four Kuwaiti service members were injured after an attack on a Navy vessel.
And the war is now again impacting civilians. Commercial airlines have been told to avoid the airspace over the Gulf, Bahrain, Qatar, Kuwait, the United Arab Emirates. There are major disruptions and cancellations, once again bringing traffic to a standstill at the world's busiest airport in Dubai. And in light of President Trump's threats against bridges and power plants, civilian infrastructure.
Iranian state TV reportedly claiming that air defenses have been activated in the city of Bushehr, near the country's only functioning nuclear power plant. And it comes as there is one thing, though, that the United States military is not doing tonight, which just a day ago, Trump had said he was going to do, and that is to collect a 20 percent fee from ships traveling through the strait.
That's a day after Trump detailed the plan, right? He said this is what he was going to do. The U.S. was going to take over the strait, control it in full, and get 20 percent. But now he's retreated.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REPORTER: Wondering if you could explain your changing thinking on the strait of removes applying a 20 percent fee.
TRUMP: I was called by different people, different countries, kings and emirs and all of the people that we all know and we all love. And they've been, frankly, they've been very strong partners. And they said we'd love to do it a different way. We would like to invest tremendously in the United States as opposed to charging a fee. And I like that actually, because I don't think anybody should be able to charge a fee for the strait.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: Which of course is a stunning statement. Since yesterday he had said that the US was in fact going to charge a 20 percent fee.
Kevin Liptak is OUTFRONT live outside the White House.
Kevin, what more are you learning about -- well, frankly, how shocked, outraged, stunned U.S. allies, and frankly, some of Trump's own aides. I mean, if you look at what Marco Rubio has said about this topic in the past, he's been as black and white about it as you can be.
I mean, what was the reaction to Trump's announcement of a 20 percent toll in the straight to get him to do a complete reversal like this?
KEVIN LIPTAK, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Yeah, they were caught off guard. It led to this enormous scramble, in part because there had been no internal meetings about one who exactly would be paying this fee, but also how the administration planned to go about collecting it.
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And it also sort of ran in face of what the president's own advisors had been telling him in the past about the prospect of the United States doing this. One, they said that it could put pressure on energy prices and, of course, by extension, pressure on Republicans ahead of the midterm elections. But they also warned that this could undercut the US's own warnings against Iran charging tolls in the Strait of Hormuz. And so, there was a scramble over the last 24 hours to try and figure out how this would be implemented.
Of course, the president then reversed himself after what he said interjection from the Gulf, from the kings and emirs, as he put it, who he said came up with this alternative plan whereby they would invest in the United States and that would act as reimbursement for U.S. security in the Strait of Hormuz.
Now, how new those investments actually are, we don't know at this point. Remember, the president's own telling, he says those countries have already invested or committed to invest $2 trillion in the United States. They made those commitments during his trip to the Middle released very early in his term.
I think this all adds up to the president really kind of casting about, looking for ways to try and unblock what is essentially a stalemate. You know, he's tried the carrots in the form of incentives and sanctions relief. Now he's back to trying the sticks in the form of the blockade of the Iranian ports, in the form of these threats against bridges and power plants. How effective that will be in a way that it was not previously, I don't think we know at this point.
And the president is not providing any clear picture of how long this will take. He's saying tonight that the strikes on Iran will, quote, "continue until I say it's enough."
BURNETT: All right. Kevin Liptak, thank you very much at the White House.
Brett McGurk and retired Brigadier General Mark Kimmit are with me now.
And, Brett, you heard Trump tonight threatened to knock out all of Iran's bridges and power plants. By the way, this is a threat that he's made before, right back when he was talking about wiping a civilization off a map. In that -- in that era of this rhetoric, he had made specific threats against the bridges and power plants. But now here we are again with this sort of a threat, what's your reaction to it now?
BRETT MCGURK, CNN GLOBAL AFFAIRS ANALYST: I think Kevin just said casting about. I think that's a pretty good way to put it, both the United States and Iran. I think you just see casting about on both sides.
I think the problem with that threat is problematic on its face, but also, I'm not sure the Iranians take it seriously. But if they do take it seriously, Erin, again, it is the Revolutionary Guard that is in charge in Tehran, and they will strike infrastructure in the Gulf. I mean, that's basically what they said. I think they've proven that demonstrated willingness and capacity to do that.
So, then you're in a war targeting each other's civilian infrastructure, and that can really damage the global economy. That's the -- that's the problem of one of many problems here.
BURNETT: Yeah, yeah, and as we all remember, right, when desalination plants were suddenly on the table, right, when that's sort of what brought this whole thing to a halt, that that would be a global economic catastrophe with an incredible loss of civilian life. General Kimmitt, Trump was asked tonight about the possibility of a ground campaign, right? So once again, bridges and power plants being threatened, but also ground troops.
Here's the exchange.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
YINGST: Are you really not a ground campaign in a limited capacity?
TRUMP: I don't want to say that either, but I would say no if I thought it was appropriate. Sometimes you need a ground campaign, but we have other people that will do the ground campaign for us.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: Okay, General, I have -- I have many questions from this, but I guess let's just go with two of them. First of all, what would a ground campaign at this point for the U.S. actually mean, right? We're now in month five. And when he says someone's going to do it for us, I mean, who is that? Are we back to the Kurds again?
BRIG. GEN. MARK KIMMITT (RET.), FORMER DEPUTY ASSISTANT SECRETARY OF DEFENSE FOR MIDDLE EAST POLICY: Well, first of all, I'd just like to make a comment about bridges and infrastructure. In fact, I think it's important to note that bridges and infrastructure that are primarily being used to support military forces are legitimate military targets. I didn't hear anything about civilian infrastructure. I didn't hear anything about civilian bridges. So let's hope we're going to stay focused on the military targets.
Ground campaign? Certainly, I don't think the president is talking about attacking into Tehran, but a ground campaign could certainly be something like going into Kashmar (ph), could be going into Kharg Island. I certainly hope we don't do that. I think they're better alternatives, but it's also important to note that what the president was doing was not ruling in. He was just not ruling out ground forces to keep his options open.
BURNETT: Right, I mean, and in a sense, I guess that's back to casting about Brett right at keeping everything on the table.
I want to play for you, Brett, some of what Trump said about this issue with the toll, right? Because yesterday, that really stunned the world, right?
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After the U.S. had said it's international waters, you can never do it, it's against all international law. Rubio has been completely clear on this issue. Then suddenly, Trump comes out and says he's going to charge every ship a 20 percent fee, and now he's changed his mind.
Here's part of why he said he's doing that.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: I put it out yesterday. I thought it was good. I was called by different people, different countries, kings and emirs and all of the people that we all know and we all love. And they've been, frankly, they've been very strong partners. And they said, we'd love to do it a different way.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: So, Brett, what do you think happened to make the president, in less than 24 hours, reverse course on something as specific and major as a 20 percent toll on every ship going through the strait and the U.S. taking over the strait and providing all the security so those ships could transit.
MCGURK: Well, I'd say two things. I think the one thing -- all the Gulf states, including, like, Oman that works a little closely with Iran, they are totally opposed to Iran's claim of sovereignty over the strait and Iran's claim that they will charge a fee. So, the Gulf is united kind of with us against that.
So then for the president to come out and say, actually, we're going to protect it, and we'll charge an even higher fee, was completely contradictory and counterproductive to everything we're trying to do.
I'd secondly say, Erin, that kind of that'd be a good problem to have if we were able to guard the strait and protect shipping. The issue here is that Iran is using the kind of ancient advantage of terrain. and the modern advantage of drone warfare. And these drones can be fired from 1,000 kilometers away, even farther away, and hit a slow- moving tanker. And that is what they're doing to hold the strait hostage.
It is very hard to stop. I dealt with this in the last White House in the Red Sea when the Houthis and Iranian proxy group was targeting ships in the Red Sea.
BURNETT: Yeah.
MCGURK: We had a naval coalition. It's very difficult to stop.
So, I'd like to know how we're going to be the guardian of the strait. I think that would be great if we could do it, but it's a very difficult equation, as General Kimmitt, I think, knows extremely well.
BURNETT: And, General Kimmitt, the Iranian Army is also saying they're going to respond, okay? And they've already claimed, again, I'm not sure what of this has been true, but they've obviously shown an ability to do real damage to U.S. bases, U.S. missile interceptors, and aircraft. They now say they struck a U.S. base in Jordan, where F- 18 fighter jets are stationed, and that they're going to continue doing this until final victory is achieved.
General, you know, it can be it can almost sound like a tit for tat until suddenly people die. I mean, how concerned are you tonight, given where this is at this moment, about the risks to the tens of thousands of U.S. troops that are in the Middle East now.
KIMMITT: Well, I think both Brett and I are concerned about that significantly, because, again, all we need is one mistake made by an air defense artilleryman who misses a missile coming in. I mean, we saw that in Al-Assad inside of Iraq, where we luckily did not lose a significant number of troops. But when you have a large concentration of them, as we do in Kuwait, Al-Udeid in Qatar, and some of the other bases in UAE, that could certainly happen.
Listen, I think it's important to go back to Brett's comment. It is clear that if the United States is the unilateral protector of the Gulf, of the Strait of Hormuz, that will not work. The fact is, we are belligerent in this conflict, and for us to try to control it is a war situation. Either they have it or we don't.
But as we did with the Counter-Piracy Coalition, and we did in the tanker war in 1981 to 1988, we used non-belligerents in that operation. This is a great opportunity for the British, the French, the Germans to come in and run a maritime escort operation through the Strait of Hormuz.
It tells the Iranians, you have a choice. You can either let these people take the commercial traffic through, or you can fire on them. And at this point, you now have a war with Germany, the United Kingdom, and France.
Now, I think we all understand why the Allies have not been rushing to our assistance in this, but there are options other than a unilateral operation.
BURNETT: All right. Well, I appreciate both of you taking the time very much. Brett McGurk and General Kmitt, thank you so much.
And we are learning new details now about the deadly ICE-related shooting in Maine. We've analyzed the photos and videos going frame by frame to determine exactly what happened. And as I said, we'll show you what they reveal.
Plus, Trump saying what he plans to talk about during his primetime address this week, election security. So, is this what Americans want to hear about now that Trump has formally notified Congress that the war with Iran is back on?
And an OUTFRONT exclusive, Marc Fogel, the American teacher, held for three and a half years in Russia, speaking out right here.
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And he talked about what the Russians constantly reminded him of in his 14-year prison sentence.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MARC FOGEL, AMERICAN TEACHER: So that -- that is just-- was always pounded in me, which, You know, 60-year people don't live 14 years in Russian prisons.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BURNETT: Breaking news, protests this hour in Maine and Houston, where ICE officers killed two men in shootings days apart, a source telling CNN that ICE has instructed agents to suspend vehicle stops nationwide. A significant development, but Trump's border czar Tom Homan stresses that the suspension is only temporary.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TOM HOMAN, BORDER CZAR: I think it's going to be a short pause, and I'm confident that ICE is well-trained with vehicle stops, and you're going to see us keep moving forward.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: This comes as we're learning new details about the 26-year- old man from Columbia who was shot and killed in Maine.
Priscilla Alvarez is OUTFRONT.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
PRISCILLA ALVAREZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): A 26-year-old Colombian man, Joan Sebastian Duran Guerrero, was shot and killed in an ICE-involved shooting Monday morning in Maine. A CNN review of photos and videos of the scene offers new insight into the timeline of the deadly incident. It's the second fatal shooting involving ICE agents within a week, coming just days after a Mexican man was killed in Houston.
The latest shooting happened at this intersection in the city of Biddeford. Duran Guerrero was driving this white Kia. It's just feet from the apartment building where Duran Guerrero lived.
There is still a lot that's unclear about what led to the shooting, but here's what we do know: 7:17 a.m., a doorbell camera from a nearby home captured the sound of gunshots. You can hear five shots fired in just over a second in the distance.
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(EXPLETIVE DELETED)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Is that a car?
ALVAREZ (voice-over): Another video which caught the sound of gunshots is timestamped to 7:17 and 52 seconds. Then this surveillance video picks up 3 seconds later, showing Duran Guerrero's car entering the intersection and then slowly moving in circles.
In another angle, you can see two federal agents standing outside the car, as one of them has his hand on the driver's side door, apparently trying to bring it to a stop. Behind the circling car are at least two federal law enforcement vehicles blocking the road with their lights flashing. They're in front of Duran Guerrero's apartment, indicating where the incident may have started.
Duran Guerrero's car spins for over a minute, making four-and-a-half revolutions. Federal agents finally try to stop it with one of their unmarked vehicles, first appearing to strike the front left side and then pinning it from the side.
In this photo, you can see four bullet holes in the car's windshield on the driver's side. Two federal agents approached Duran Guerrero's door, one with his gun drawn. Upon reaching the door, he holsters it. They break the window and open the door from the inside. One of them pulls Duran Guerrero onto the street. He appears limp, and his head hits the ground. Then officers appear to handcuff him.
In other footage, one of the agents can be seen wearing a vest that indicates he's an ICE agent. the other, a border patrol agent. Three other agents, all wearing ICE vests, could also be seen around the car. Then at 7:21 a.m., local police arrive on the scene as one ICE agent kneels over Duran Guerrero. By 7:23 a.m., about six minutes after the shots were fired, both local and federal officers are seen providing medical care to him.
In a statement, the Department of Homeland Security said that ICE was conducting targeted surveillance of an illegal alien. Then it says an illegal alien departed the residence in a vehicle. Notably, they don't specify whether that is the same person they were targeting. DHS says that the vehicle attempted to flee the scene, and fearing for
public safety, an officer discharged his weapon. The statement did not explain why the ICE officer thought the driver was a threat.
U.S. Senator Angus King says DHS Secretary Markwayne Mullin told him Duran Guerrero was not the target of the operation. According to a neighbor, Duran Guerrero was a quiet and reserved person who had a wife and a three-year-old daughter. He was authorized to work in the U.S. and had a Social Security number, according to the Maine Immigrant Rights Coalition.
The Maine Attorney General's office is conducting an investigation into the shooting. The DHS Inspector General and FBI are also investigating.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
ALVAREZ: Erin, what's missing from this incident, of course, is those body worn cameras. These agents did not have that on their person, so we do not have that footage to have a clearer understanding of what happened during the shooting.
However, a Homeland Security spokesperson now telling me that ICE arrest teams will have one person, one agent who will be equipped to the body camera as they work on distributing these cameras to the rest of the agents. White House border czar Tom Homan telling our colleague Kaitlan Collins that there is a timeline in place for these cameras, but did not share more details on when everyone will have one.
BURNETT: All right, Priscilla, thank you very much.
And OUTFRONT now is Ryan Fecteau, the Democratic speaker of Maine's House of Representatives.
Speaker, I appreciate your time.
So, ICE has instructed agents to suspend vehicle stops until further notice, but you heard Tom Homan saying it's not a policy change, it's a temporary pause, in his words, just for training. So, is that enough that they're saying they're just pausing it, they're going to restart it as soon as possible?
RYAN FECTEAU (D), MAINE HOUSE SPEAKER: It's not enough. There needs to be way more change in this agency. I mean, what we're seeing in communities like my own, we saw yesterday here with a young man, a father, a husband being gunned down in our streets, which doesn't happen here, by the way. This is -- just doesn't happen here and for this to occur shows just the massive lack of professionalism and training that exists within this agency.
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And I think we need to go much further than to just put a temporary pause in place of vehicle stops. We have hundreds of vehicle stops that occur every single day in my state that are done by state and local police. No one ends up dead at the end of those stops. BURNETT: Yeah, it's really incredible, as you say, first of all, just that, but also the fact in a certain sense that they're even pausing them at all indicates. some sort of a realization that something went horribly wrong. And a neighbor who witnessed the shooting is now sharing some new details about what he heard afterwards.
I wanted to play that for you, Speaker. Here he is.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DANIEL BOUCHER, WITNESSED SHOOTING: I clearly heard the victim say, I tried to stop. Clearly heard him say that. The ICE agent that shot him walked right in front of me. And of course, I was emotional, and I just let him have it.
And he looked at me, and he said he tried to run me over or something to that effect. I don't remember his exact words. There was another ICE agent with him that was trying to comfort him, and they walked away.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: Now, Speaker, just to be clear, the DHS statement did not say that he tried to run over the officer, as they have claimed in multiple other cases, right? We all know that.
So, they didn't-- they're not trying to make that case in this situation. All they said was, the vehicle attempted to flee the scene, and fearing for public safety, an officer discharged his weapon.
So, I just have to ask you, Speaker, is it clear to you what they're referring to as a public safety threat in this case?
FECTEAU: No, it's not clear to me and it's -- it -- what's clear to me that, Erin, is that they changed their -- they changed their tune. At one point during the course of the day, we were hearing that someone's -- someone within in law enforcement's life was at risk. The vehicle posed a risk to law enforcement and therefore it was -- it was necessary to discharge a weapon.
And at the end of the day, we get this statement from DHS that states that public safety was at risk. I don't -- I don't know what was going on at 7:30 in the morning here in our community, but I can assure you that a vehicle making a circular motion in an intersection was not putting public safety at risk, certainly not to the extent that discharging weapon would be necessary.
BURNETT: And also, you know, as we saw that just in Priscilla's reporting, right? I mean, it was going in slow motion in that circle. It was obviously -- not from anybody watching that would see that particular clip as a threat.
We understand the victim's father told a radio station in Colombia, Speaker, that he was in the United States trying to build a better future for his family. As you said, he was married with a young child, a young girl, a cleaner at a vet clinic, and another as a delivery driver.
And, you know, he talked about his three-year-old daughter, which a neighbor said she believes was near the scene, saying that she was still in her bluey pajamas was the description. You know, just how much has the shaken your community, when you think about this, a family, a young 26-year-old man with a toddler child.
FECTEAU: Yeah, it's heartbreaking. It's devastating. It has definitely shaken our community to its core.
We look out for one another here. We are a neighborly community that has been welcoming immigrants for a very long time. You can't see it, but I'm standing near textile mills in the center of our community that were built by immigrants. My family moved here in 1964, a little late to the game, but moved here in 1964 to work in those textile mills alongside other immigrants.
This is a community that's been welcoming immigrants for a very long time. We will continue to do so, but it's just incredibly heartbreaking that a young a daughter as young as three years old was potentially witness to her father's life being taken right before it.
It's unconscionable and what I've seen from an outpouring of folks who are talking about their memories of Mr. Guerrero is heartening. He was a DoorDash delivery driver and I've seen some posts from folks who worked at restaurants. He said he always had a smile on his face, was always a calming and positive present presence when picking up food for DoorDash.
I think that's how we want to remember this life. But we now have to make sure that his loss is not in vain, and that those who perpetrated this kind of violence on behalf of the government are held to account.
BURNETT: Speaker Fecteau, I appreciate your time, and thank you very much for being with me tonight.
And next, we have breaking news. The House just voting to make Daylight Saving Time permanent, which would mean no more changing of the clocks. Wow, that's something they've never been able to do before. I guess that's something everybody can agree on.
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Is the Senate about to follow suit?
Plus, Georgia's Democratic Senator Jon Ossoff saying this about his Republican colleagues today.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. JON OSSOFF (D-GA): Privately, most elected Republicans in this building think the president has lost it.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: Jamal Simmons and Maura Gillespie have a lot to say, and they're next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BURNETT: Tonight, President Trump revealing why he is asking networks for airtime to give a primetime speech on Thursday. As the U.S. is in the middle of the war with Iran, Trump says he's going to talk about election security issues, among other things.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: It's really, really big news. And our country has to shape up.
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But that's -- what we're going to be talking about Thursday is it doesn't get bigger, because without free and fair elections, you don't have a country.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: So the speech comes as Trump has repeatedly pushed Republicans to pass his SAVE America Act, which is a federal elections overhaul bill that would limit voting by mail and require various forms of ID, a bill that some Republicans are opposed to. They say it is too restrictive and discriminatory.
Jamal Simmons and Maura Gillespie are both OUTFRONT.
And, Maura, Trump says he's going to talk about election security issues. He says there's nothing bigger. which, of course, is in the context of quietly informing Congress that the war with Iran is back on and, you know, talking about massive strikes day after day in that war.
Do Republicans want him to be focused on election security right now?
MAURA GILLESPIE, REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST: Absolutely not. I think when you're coupling this with what's going on with these ICE raids and ICE attacks on American citizens, but also just people being killed by ICE agents, That, plus the Iran war, which is very unpopular. We know not only just with Republicans, but Americans at large, it's large and unpopular.
So, to me, this feels a bit like a distraction and a deflection to something that he knows his MAGA stronghold base loves to talk about and loves to hear that he actually won in 2020. They love that. To give him this airtime, I think, is doing what a lot of people did in 2016 and gave him unfettered access because he makes news, but really what he's doing is pushing conspiracy theories about election fraud that has no basis.
Now, granted, I don't know what he's going to produce in this speech, if he has some sort of evidence, but thus far, there's been nothing in six years.
BURNETT: Yeah, it's been nothing in six years, and of course, audit after audit after audit, and state after state after state. Jamal, on June 4th, Trump said his acting national intelligence director, Bill Pulte, who, of course, comes from the homebuilding industry, would look into the rigged elections, okay? That was specifically a reason they gave for him in that role, as national intelligence director.
Since that particular day, June 4th, okay, best we could find, Jamal, Trump has talked about rigged elections in at least 18 different interviews or speeches, 18, okay, which is just stunning. And then he fired three independent bipartisan members of a federal election commission that was charged with helping states run their, administer their elections.
So, when you connect the dots there, you know, it's easy to say Trump's obsessed with this. Those are the facts, the data.
JAMAL SIMMONS, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Yeah, the president of the United States has been using his position to make political statements that are going to make it harder for people to vote. He's looking not to enable people to vote, which is what we usually expect the Justice Department to do when the Justice Department goes in to a community to monitor an election. It's to help people vote. This looks like he's trying to keep people from voting.
Here's the thing: the president keeps saying that the election was rigged, but rigged against him. Everybody else in the country thinks that the economy is rigged against them. What they're looking at is a trillionaire friend of the president. They're looking at people making more and more money at the top of the income ladder while they're making less and less.
And all the time, the president's talking about himself and one election that he lost, instead of thinking about how much the American people are.
And when he talks about rigged elections, I mean, I go back to what Thomas Massie recently said, who when Trump turned against him, because Trump does have incredible power, the MAGA base, right? Massie's now out.
But Massie's like, what are we talking about rigged elections for? We have the White House, we have the House, we have the Senate, we have the Supreme Court. I mean, if it's rigged, it's rigged for us.
GILLESPIE: And not only that, but if it's rigged, that means that Barack Obama's administration rigged it and let Trump win in 2016, and then Biden's administration rigged it to let him win in 2024. So, I don't understand where his thought process is that if there's some corruption there deep-seated, because then that means that --
SIMMONS: Oh, you're still trying to make sense of this?
GILLESPIE: Forgive me for trying.
No, it's one of those things where I wonder, one, Republicans are already noticing that it's bad for them. It does not poll well for them, only polls well in the MAGA base there. But I do think that people are tiring of this. Yes, the SAVE Act, SAVE
America Act, the idea behind showing identity, showing proof of citizenship, identity to vote doesn't seem so far-fetched until you break down with the SAVE America Act has included in it and it does create barriers to voting and that can be problematic.
And that's why there's been such pushback and Republicans as well saying this will not pass through our chambers, but the president only looks at it through his lens of what he wants and what helps him.
BURNETT: So I want to bring up one other thing, though, that just happened, I guess something bipartisan. Just nothing these days, nothing. But I guess it's daylight savings town. It's Daylight Savings Time, I'm sorry, that the House has now passed 308 to 117.
I would have been with the 117 because I like fallback. I look forward to that that Sunday morning every fall. But nonetheless, it's going to go to the Senate.
SIMMONS: They're really taking care of the big, important issues that people are on the streets trying to figure out, right? I mean, you mentioned a minute ago. Protests that are happening on really important things.
[19:40:02]
And so, again, the president's focused on things that I think most Americans aren't. So, if I'm a Republican who's running for office right now, I've got to be really frustrated because I know the American people have real problems and concerns, and they control the majority. They could do something about it. It doesn't look like they don't think they can --
BURNETT: You don't think they can campaign on "I got daylight savings".
GILLESPIE: Maybe in some areas. But I would say they're probably going to put on the housing bill and push that. But also, what they need to do is separate themselves from Donald Trump and his egomaniacal kind of lane and remind their constituents why they are serving them in the first place.
BURNETT: All right. Thank you both very much. Great to see you.
And next, Trump claims there are cuts in the reflecting pool lining that measure 300 yards, but that is not what we found.
And an OUTFRONT exclusive, American Marc Fogel, who was held for three and a half years in Russian prison, speaks out tonight in his first national interview. And he told me what he came to realize while behind bars.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MARC FOGEL, AMERICAN DETAINED IN RUSSIA: It was very clear as time went on, I was an asset, and they were going to do things to make sure that I was going to get through and manage.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BURNETT: New tonight, CNN observing no evidence of any gashes or slashes, as Trump says in the Lincoln Memorial reflecting pool, despite Trump's repeated claims that vandals cause cuts in the lining that are 300 feet long.
Tom Foreman is OUTFRONT.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
TOM FOREMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): With most of the water drained from the reflecting pool, new questions are arising about President Trump's claims of vandalism. after the $14 million spruce up devolved into a green swamp of algae and the newly installed blue sealant started peeling up fast.
In May, the president claimed the lining would last for decades.
TRUMP: If you had a knife, you can't even cut it. So strong, so powerful, powerful rubber.
FOREMAN (voice-over): But by June, he was backpedaling.
TRUMP: We have 100 and we have a, I think, 290, 300 foot slit right through it, probably a box cutter or a knife of some kind.
[19:45:07]
FOREMAN (voice-over): His administration has offered no proof and there is no obvious sign of such damage. No fencing and security are keeping the curious away from a close inspection, but at least four people have been charged for allegedly doing something wrong, including a former Olympian who says he was just reaching into the pool to inspect the project when he was caught wet handed.
NORM EISEN, DAVID HEARN'S DEFENSE ATTORNEY: It is not a crime. to touch the reflecting pool, to touch water in the United States of America.
FOREMAN (voice-over): Yet the president steams on, insisting the problems have nothing to do with the rushed no-bid contract or the part of the deal that reportedly went to Greenwater Services, a company co-owned by J.J. Cafaro, a Trump supporter and donor.
No, Trump and his team claim vandals are to blame, that the lining was pulled upward with great force by these thugs, these country-hating sleazebags.
JEANINE PIRRO, U.S. ATTORNEY: This is not the way of a civilized society. It is anarchy.
(END VIDEOTAPE) FOREMAN: For all of this kerfuffle, we still don't really know what caused the problem or if it's just a normal maintenance thing that now has to be solved. All we know is that the reflecting pool right now, Erin, is basically just reflecting badly on the administration.
BURNETT: All right, Tom Foreman, thank you very much, right by that pool in Washington.
And next, an OUTFRONT exclusive, Marc Fogel, the American schoolteacher held by Russia for three and a half years, is speaking out right here.
So, what was it like? What was it like inside one of Russia's most brutal prisons?
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BURNETT: Tonight, freedom. In his first national interview since his release from a Russian prison, American teacher Marc Fogel is opening up about the 1,277 days he spent behind bars in Russia. Fogel served part of that time in one of Putin's most brutal institutions. Now, he was sentenced to 14 years in a Russian penal colony for processing or for possessing medically prescribed marijuana. That was it, and then a 14-year sentence.
Marc Fogel joins me now for this exclusive conversation OUTFRONT.
And, Marc, so 1,277 days there. You came home. You've been home for 17 months.
[19:50:03]
And you have talked about how difficult the journey from coming home to now has been. What are some of the things that have been perhaps the hardest for you?
FOGEL: Well, you know, just readjusting to, you know, the first few months, you know, it was hard to leave the house sometimes. It was hard to just go out to be overwhelmed in a grocery store. I remember one time going and paying for some groceries that I bought. She wanted me to tap, and I had never done the tap with a credit card, and I could feel myself kind of being a bit angst-ridden and people behind me.
And that was just -- that's one that comes to my mind of, like, I didn't know how to do that. I wasn't doing that before. And the pressure of having to do those things just kind of were one of those kind of slaps to me of, like, a reminder of what I need to do to kind of be, you know, re-cultured into life as we all know it.
BURNETI guess to figure out who you are after 37 years. You have four decades of a teacher, right? You had an identity. You've been around the world and having to reclaim that.
So, when all of this started-- and you and your wife have been around the world, so many different places. You've operated in places where there would have been friendly and perhaps less friendly governments.
In Russia, you get sent to Rybinsk penal colony, which is one of the harshest ones in the entire system that Putin has. What can you share with us about your time there, those 1,277 days that you thought were just the beginning?
FOGEL: Yeah. Well, you learn very quickly, and having, you know, studied some Russian history, you know, their -- the way they use prisons and how their system works, it's really a normal fact of life for most Russians. A Russian friend of mine who came to visit me, she said, you know, when I told my friends I was going to visit you, they said, and I said, this is the first time I've been to a prison. And they were all surprised that she had not visited a prisoner before.
So, the society has a really clear-cut system of incarcerating people that dates back centuries, sending them to Siberia, the Soviets with the gulags. So, when you get into that system, you realize that they have a program that's really well-documented. They know what to do when to press buttons, when not to.
And it's a very systematic system that -- you know, a systematic system, but they know what they're doing.
BURNETT: So, when you were there, okay, and I know you moved different -- and during that, you were in the dark.
FOGEL: I was in 17, 18 different places.
BURNETT: And what was it like when you moved in between?
FOGEL: Those were the worst times. You know, we were herded in trucks with no windows, no seat belts. You were usually smashed in with, you know, without enough room. Like, everything is designed to be uncomfortable. That's part of that system.
BURNETT: Yeah.
FOGEL: So, you'd be in this truck, everybody's smoking, there's no windows. You're riding on bumpy roads, and you don't know where you're going. And that whole process of moving was, you know, it's really -- I could say diabolical. Like, it's like a programmed way to make people miserable. So, they do that on a regular basis.
BURNETT: Did you ever feel that you didn't want to get to the other end of it, that 14 years was too long? Did you ever lose hope?
FOGEL: Well, you know, that sentence is something that I wore in a name tag all the time. So, I was always confronted that I had a 14- year sentence, which, in my age --
BURNETT: It's on your --
FOGEL: Because it's on -- it's on your bunk bed. You know, that's something that they're always putting to you. Every time I would do one of these trips, when you got on the truck, you had to walk through that Mark Fogel, blah, blah, blah. And then you would have to say you have a 14-year sentence.
So that is just-- was always pounded in me, which, you know, 60-year people don't live 14 years in Russian prisons. So that was part of, I think, what they were looking to do in that they gave one of the harshest -- I knew nobody, murderers didn't get 14-year sentences.
BURNETT: But you knew it was intended to be a death sentence.
FOGEL: You know, and it became very apparent as, you know, I spent more time in the colony, that I knew people that had thousands of times more drugs that I had, worse drugs, not prescribed, who would be given half the sentence that I had with a thousand times more volume.
[19:55:02]
BURNETT: Because you were American, right? You were -- that was why it all to begin, but this was medically prescribed to begin with, so it wasn't something that would even cross your mind.
FOGEL: Right.
BURNETT: But as an American, did you -- was the -- were there palpable ways in which you were treated differently?
FOGEL: Every day. Every day, there were different ways that I was treated. Sometimes very negatively, sometimes positive -- more positively.
You know, I was given a looser leash at times. It was very clear as time went on, I was an asset, and they were going to do things to make sure that I was going to get through and manage. And they were doing things like, you know, where I was having many back problems, I would be sent to a prison hospital. which were usually about three or four weeks. I had done four sessions of that.
Most Russian prisons would have never been sent to that hospital, but I was because they were trying to take care of me.
BURNETT: So, two things from that. One, some of the people that you were with were very, very wealthy people who had gotten on the bad side of Putin.
FOGEL: Some -- some of the most, probably the most fabulously wealthy people I've ever met were in Russian prisons.
BURNETT: Which is incredible.
FOGEL: I, you know, I -- when I -- when I would recount some of the stories, it was just sort of levels of wealth that I -- you see on TV shows.
BURNETT: And I -- you mentioned that the special treatment on the positive side was that you could get care for your back.
FOGEL: Right.
BURNETT: Now, your sister, Anne, talked about that.
FOGEL: Yeah.
BURNETT: And she was, your entire family were incredibly worked. She came on the show, a lot of times, Marc, as you know, because she wanted everyone -- she didn't let anybody forget about you.
FOGEL: Right.
BURNETT: For you just to become a name of a guy that people forgot. She never let that happen.
FOGEL: How fortunate I am to have the sisters who work for me.
BURNETT: Here she is.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ANNE FOGEL, MARC FOGEL'S SISTER: By a sister that I am, he is a remarkable human being, and his friends know that, and his students know that, and his family knows that.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: Did you know how relentlessly --
FOGEL: I've never seen that.
BURNETT: You never saw that.
FOGEL: I have a hard time watching any of this, so I've never seen that. And, you know, she's my little sister, but she's become another big sister for me with what she did.
BURNETT: Did you know how your family was relentlessly fighting for you? Your sister, your mother, who's 97.
FOGEL: You know, it was really hard to know what was happening with the way I was able to communicate with people back home. When I was speaking on the official phones, which everybody could listen to, you know, there was an ability to say things that were happening, or everybody was uncomfortable.
I was later able to use burner phones, and I could have what we thought were more -- you know, secret conversations where I did find out things.
BURNETT: Burner phones that you could get through, I guess, because they were the rich guys.
FOGEL: Exactly, how the system works in Russian prisons, that --
BURNETT: Yeah.
FOGEL: -- you know, there's, they have two types of prisons, red and black. Red is the ones run by the government, black are the ones run by another type of system, with government connection.
BURNETT: Government connection has been more, but it's an organized crime of some sort.
FOGEL: I would think so.
BURNETT: So, when we watched you deliver a message, you were at this point being held in a cage, okay? You deliver it to your wife, Jane. So, this is back in 2021. At this point, you've heard your fate, okay? And here you are talking to Jane.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
FOGEL: Hi, Jane, I miss you terribly. I just want to be with our family. I've never seen that.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: Do you remember that moment?
FOGEL: Not exactly. You know, when I just watched that for the first time, I think what the trigger in me was how I was holding those bars. But I don't remember the words that were coming out, but I do remember that position I was in for some reason.
BURNETT: How do you ever get past that agony?
FOGEL: There's too many good things to look forward to, to be worried about what's behind me.
And, you know, I have a friend, Andre Khachaturian. I want him home. I hope everybody's working to get him home. His mother deserves to have him. His brother deserves to have him. Please help Andre Khachaturian.
BURNETT: Another American, Armenian American.
FOGEL: Yes, another wrongfully detained.
BURNETT: Imprisoned in Russia right now.
FOGEL: Right.
BURNETT: Well, Marc Fogel, it is a great pleasure to finally meet you. I will admit, as we covered it, we never knew if we would ever have that -- have this incredible opportunity. So that is a brightness for us and I thank you so much.
FOGEL: And obviously the pleasure is mine because I am. Thank you so much.
BURNETT: And thank you all so much incredible to actually see him back.
Thank you for joining us.
"AC360" begins now.
