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Erin Burnett Outfront
Trump Blames Democratic Governor For Attacks On Water Systems In Seven States; Trump Presses RFK Jr. On "Autism Research", Wants Child Vaccines Cut; GOP Nominee Dodges Questions On Ties To White Nationalist Son-In-Law. Aired 7-8p ET
Aired July 31, 2026 - 19:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[19:00:23]
ERIN BURNETT, CNN HOST: OUTFRONT next:
Breaking news, new details just in about fresh American strikes on Iran, as officials say Iran could be responsible for the attacks on water systems in at least seven American states. So why is the president of the United States tonight blaming Tim Walz?
Plus, RFK Jr. telling Trump today he'll get an answer on autism and vaccines soon after Trump reportedly pressed Kennedy to find that link between vaccines and autism, a link that has long been scientifically debunked. Kerry Kennedy, RFK Jr.'s sister, is our guest tonight.
And a major GOP Senate nominee shutting down a press conference after reporters confront him with our own KFILE's investigation.
Let's go OUTFRONT.
(MUSIC)
BURNETT: And good evening. I'm Erin Burnett.
And OUTFRONT on this Friday, we begin with breaking news. A growing attack on multiple states in America. And President Trump blames Tim Walz. The FBI says hackers have carried out a sweeping, coordinated attack on water systems in at least seven American states. Federal and state officials are now treating Iran as one of the suspects.
President Trump is dismissing the idea of Iran's involvement, instead attacking Democrats in Minnesota, one of the states that was targeted.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I blame it on Minnesota because they're grossly incompetent. There was a cyberattack of 30 water plants, and I would blame it on Minnesota and the governor, the corrupt governor of Minnesota. They like to say, oh, it was Iran. Iran should be so lucky. Iran's got bigger problems than worrying about Minnesota.
(END VIDEO CLIP) BURNETT: Now, I guess on one hand it is not surprising that Trump would quickly try to rule out Iran's involvement, because he has spent the past five months saying that Iran's military has been obliterated, wiped out, and totally destroyed. So, to admit that it is even on the table that Iran could be hacking into the water systems in multiple American states -- well, that would sure not really fit with the whole obliteration narrative.
But U.S. officials say that this attack on seven American states is very serious, and across the country cities are scrambling to secure facilities. It is just one of the many challenges facing America tonight.
But if you watched Trump's cabinet meeting at Camp David today, you wouldn't know. You simply wouldn't know about any of the challenges.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
J.D. VANCE, VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: It's an honor to be on the team.
PETE HEGSETH, DEFENSE SECRETARY: They will look back at Donald Trump and the buildup that he has done, and that will be the deterrence of the future will be established because of your investment.
MARCO RUBIO, SECRETARY OF STATE: There's some other issues happening around the world, Mr. President, that you've shown great leadership in that have not gotten nearly as much attention.
SCOTT BESSENT, TREASURY SECRETARY: You've done it again. Our founders was -- President Washington, Thomas Jefferson, Alexander Hamilton could not have imagined the economy that we would have created. It is the envy of the world.
ROBERT F. KENNEDY, JR., HHS SECRETARY: My uncle prided himself on being the most open, transparent administration in history. You, Mr. President, have press conferences every day. Every time you leave office, assuming that's in 2028 --
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: Well, I guess if you could get all through all of that, you would then listen to the words of RFK Jr. at the end there, assuming that's in 2028. After all of that, RFK Jr. went ahead and said it, right? Trump might not leave after his second term. Some in the room laughed.
A term in which Trump has received right now, reaching his lowest approval rating among the American people so far, 34 percent approval rating. That is lower than any president in recent history at this point in a term. This is as low as it gets, 73 percent of Americans, 73 percent, three-quarters of the American people say that the president of the United States is not paying attention to the country's most important problems.
That is a stunning number. Three-quarters of Americans? And Trump's not hearing it. It's an incredible cognitive dissonance. He says that America is in the best shape it's ever been.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: America is safer and stronger and far more successful than it was two years ago. I don't think it's ever been anything like this. We're going to leave this country in very, very good shape, better shape than it's ever been. This is the golden age of America.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: Now, Trump obviously very frequently talks about it as a golden age, but even in his own party, right, the Republican base that supports him, they don't believe it. 19 percent say they're enthusiastic about the rest of his presidency.
Those are his core base supporters, and 19 percent of them are excited about the future of his presidency.
[19:05:03]
It's down almost 20 points from last year. I mean, that's a cut in half. These are stunning numbers. They're unprecedented.
And I want to go straight to Kristen Holmes. She's OUTFRONT at the White House with breaking news -- because, Kristen, we talk about Trump not engaging even though the FBI is looking at Iran as a perpetrator in this water attack. Trump not engaging there. The war's very unpopular and a big reason for the plummet in some of those polls.
But you're learning that Trump is on the verge of major escalation this weekend?
KRISTEN HOLMES, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, that's right. So, we're hearing that the United States is planning as early as this weekend for a fresh round of strikes in Iran. Now, the immediate scope and the sites that would be hit is not completely clear, but U.S. Central Command has been preparing for a number of different scenarios.
One of them is expanding the war, and it would include a two-week bombardment of Iran's missile sites. Another option that they are looking at and preparing for is hitting energy facilities and energy sites across Iran. The third, hitting nuclear sites like Pickaxe Mountain -- not limited to Pickaxe Mountain and there are a lot of experts who believe that any kind of strikes on Pickaxe Mountain are not likely to be that successful given how deep underground it is, but these are all things that the U.S. military is considering and making plans for.
This as President Trump is growing increasingly more frustrated he really believed that this would be over by now and as you noted there are a lot people within the White House and likely President Trump himself, but certainly the US officials I've spoken to who believe that these low poll numbers are because of the war in Iran. You could hear the frustration in President Trump's voice today during
that cabinet meeting as he was kind of previewing some of this military action, saying that they're going to strike Iran so hard that at a certain point, Iran's going to say we can't take this anymore, indicating that they would then come to the negotiating table.
But we've been doing this now for five months. We've heard this kind of escalation, this rhetoric before there were 14 days of consecutive strikes in Iran that did not bring them to the table. Although the White House said they did, it was just a few days later that Iran launched a surprise attack on U.S. military forces, which then again cascade the entire thing back into where we are now, which is this plan for the U.S. military to potentially launch these fresh round of strikes as early as this weekend.
I do want to say one thing though, Erin. This isn't finalized until it's finalized. We know we've seen this before from President Trump where he walks all the way up to the line and then walks back. But right now, there is a plan in place for those fresh strikes.
BURNETT: All right, Kristen Holmes, thank you very much, live at the White House.
And I want to go now to Democratic Congressman Madeleine Dean, who is on the House Foreign Affairs Committee.
And, Congresswoman, I appreciate your time tonight.
So, you hear Kristen's reporting that Trump is planning to launch fresh strikes on Iran and that, you know, he could do so at such a level that Iran would, you know, cave, come to the table, negotiate. So, we've heard this many times before. Do you think that it could happen this time?
REP. MADELEINE DEAN (D-PA): Sadly, Erin, I'm very upset with that kind of reporting. Take a look at where we are, February 28th, the president launched into this reckless, ill-partnered war with Mr. Netanyahu on Iran. He never came to the American people. He never went to Congress, because it is Congress, of course, who has the authority, the responsibility to declare war.
Guess how many briefings we have had? One phone conversation, not classified, where people just were able to get on and get off. And when I got on, Secretary Rubio literally cut me off, calling me stupid or something. I wouldn't answer the questions that I asked that happened to be serious questions.
Where are we? Eighteen American service members are dead. Five hundred, if the numbers are at all accurate, are wounded. A hundred sixty-eight schoolgirls were killed on day one. Sadly, it appears by an American misappropriation of a missile of a target. We haven't taken responsibility for that.
And here, the president is talking today about these attacks on water systems in the United States. How unserious is this cabinet? How unserious is this president? Why doesn't the president say, I will get to the bottom of these
attacks on American water systems instead of worrying about Iran being pointed at? A very unserious president who's gotten himself into a war he doesn't know how to get out of.
BURNETT: So let me ask you about those attacks, because Trump is saying, and I was saying perhaps to be consistent with, although we know it to be false claims of obliterating Iran's military, to be consistent with that, he doesn't want to put it on the table that they could be responsible for the attacks on the water systems in seven states. But we know that U.S. intelligence agencies are looking into it, that they have said Iran is a possible perpetrator of it, that these are extremely serious.
[19:10:07]
The president's response, such that it is, other than to, as you point out, brush any concern about Iran aside, was to actually blame the governor of Minnesota, specifically to blame Tim Walz for attacks on water systems in his state. I'm deeply confused by this.
Do you do you have any idea what's going on here, why Trump would blame a sitting governor for hacking into U.S. water systems and hurting the United States and dismissing his own intelligence agency, saying they're looking at Iran?
DEAN: It's a very strange knee-jerk reaction by the president, but the president is under such pressure because of his ill-begotten war. He doesn't know how to get out of it. And, of course, what happened in Minnesota with ICE killing American citizens in the street. So, he would love to shine a light on Minnesota and somehow reflect on Tim Walz.
I don't -- Erin, trust me, I don't get the connection whatsoever. But what I do get is this president doesn't know what the heck he's doing. You just saw some of that coverage of Camp David, the sycophants around him, the unseriousness of all of this, people praising him.
What we need is a serious president. What we need are serious secretaries. What we need are smart negotiators, diplomats in Iran and in the area to make sure that we actually get ourselves out of this war without spending another $100 billion, without losing any more American lives.
I want to say the names, if please allow me to do this, of the last four service members who died, because the president doesn't do it. And in fact, has changed the classification of their deaths, moved them to a different part of the Pentagon website.
So, Private First Class Isabella Gonzales, 19 years old. First Lieutenant Tyler Feehan, 25. Army Sergeant Michael Emmanuel Swinton, 30. Staff Sergeant Angel Rampersad, 28.
Why isn't the president focused on lives lost and ending a war instead of shooting at a governor in the United States when somebody is attacking -- cyber attacking our water systems. The president has an obligation to have the people around him get the evidence, get the facts, and not leap to these strange accusations. And sadly, the people around him are not capable.
BURNETT: Congresswoman Dean, I appreciate your time very much and thank you.
I want to go to former Congressman Charlie Dent now and Karen Finney. They are both OUTFRONT.
And Karen, we've got some more breaking news here just coming in as I was speaking with the congresswoman. The Justice Department has just announced it is dropping its criminal case against former Olympian David Hearn that accused him of damaging the Lincoln Memorial reflecting pool, right? So, this is the reflecting pool, right, that Trump had spent $14 million to renovate and then, you know, he accused people of going and sabotaging it, specifically Mr. Hearn.
U.S. Attorney Jeanine Pirro's office admitted in a new filing -- this is really important -- that they learned after filing the charges against Hearn that, quote, "damage to the Lincoln Memorial reflecting pool in 2026 was the result of flawed installation by the contractor, Atlantic Industrial Coatings, and the rush to complete the project prior to events associated with the America 250 celebration".
Karen, wow. Wow, they're actually saying it. They're dropping it. There's all this stuff that this guy went out there and slashed it and cut it, and that was all a load of B.S., and they're actually not just admitting it by pulling the case, but they're saying it was shoddy construction.
KAREN FINNEY, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Which, you know, Erin, indeed, and I started to hear some of our reporting on this. I think it goes to something that the congresswoman was just saying, and boy, you could really feel her anger and frustration, the lack of seriousness. with which this president and his administration approaches everything from the most mundane fixing of the reflecting pool, which has admittedly been a problem for some time, all the way to the loss of life in the conduct of this war with Iran. It's staggering.
And I'll tell you what's interesting specifically about this particular case. It is shocking, but it makes you think, what evidence must Norm Eisen, who is the attorney for the former kayaker, what evidence must they have had and what lack of evidence must the government have had to be -- I mean, this is a real embarrassment. So, it must be much worse in terms of how evidence must the government have had to be, I mean, this is a real embarrassment.
So, it must be much worse in terms of how poorly prepared they were to prosecute this case and how bad the evidence was.
[19:15:03]
It's just not in their favor.
BURNETT: Yeah. I mean, Congressman, it is pretty stunning, right? Because it's one
thing to just pull the charges. But they didn't just do that. They actually did something really stunning, which is to say that it was a load of B.S. and it was shoddy construction, which is going in the face of everything the president always says.
I mean, just to remind everybody, this is what some of what Pirro said when the original charges were filed.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JEANINE PIRRO, UNITED STATES ATTORNEY FOR THE DISTRICT COLUMBIA: The National Park Service employees observed Hearn actually forcefully and violently pulling up and removing the bottom liner with both hands.
I mean, Congressman, they said these things with the weight of the United States government behind them, and now they're coming out and saying, actually, no, it was shoddy construction. I'm sorry, I'm just stunned.
CHARLIE DENT (R), FORMER U.S. REPRESENTATIVE: You should be, because in this country we have a tradition of investigating incidents like this prior to making charging decisions. And in this case, it's clear that charging decisions were made prior to any kind of a thorough investigation. And now they've admitted it.
I mean, it's amazing you would think that somebody would be fired over this maybe the U.S. attorney in Washington, D.C., that could actually put her name out there and announce charges against this individual only to announce several weeks later that there's no "there" there.
So I am -- again, I'm astounded that that this is how law enforcement and our Justice Department is operating and it's not just in this case we've seen it in many other cases where they've engage in malicious prosecutions of people for what appear to be politically motivated purposes.
BURNETT: Yeah, it is stunning, though, because, you know, there's a party, as any American, who when someone comes out and says someone observes someone doing this, you give them the space to say, OK, well, if they're going to come out and say that with the weight of the U.S. government behind them, maybe there's some truth to it. But then they come out and say, no, it's just shoddy construction, sorry.
FINNEY: Well, also, Erin, remember when this first came out, it was so unnecessary. It would have been so easy at the time to just admit it was so obvious what was happening as we were seeing chips, you know, coming up. We had our own reporters there. It would have been so easy to just have brushed it off and I don't think anybody would even be paying attention.
But to the point you're making to then use the force of the government to go after an American kayaker, representatives at the Olympics or anybody, it's outrageous.
BURNETT: Yeah. Can ask you one more question here, Congressman, about another story that the president's talked a lot about today, and that is the mass migrant surge into the small Spanish territory in North Africa, right, really coming around on a jetty, from the Moroccan side to the Spanish side of a Spanish territory in North Africa, as I said.
There are remarkable images of these crossings, 50,000 migrants in one day alone. Now, there have been surges like this before, none this so large, though. Trump today brought it up in his cabinet meeting, and he vowed that he's going to use it to his advantage in the midterms. Here he is.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: It looks like an invasion of a country by hundreds of thousands of people. And that same thing's going to happen to us if the Republicans don't get elected, except worse, much bigger. If we're not in office or a country, we'll be invaded at levels that make Spain look small-time.
And when I watched it, I said, boy. I said, I'm going to say it because I knew you were going to be at Camp David. And I say, that's going to be a talking point for the midterms.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: Congressman, 19 percent of the president's base are excited or enthusiastic about the remainder of his term. Do terrifying threats like that that have worked before for him work now?
DENT: Well, let's face it. The politics of migration have been very powerful, not only in North America and the United States, but also throughout Europe. And this has been a playbook that the president has used before. He thinks he's better off talking about subjects like this than the economy or the Iran war.
So, I think it's largely a deflection. And frankly, I think he's doing this to help give more energy to the illiberal populist movements, not just in the United States through MAGA, but also through Europe.
So, I'm not surprised that he's doing this. You know, it's all part of that whole MAGA, you know, nativism, protectionism, isolationism. That feeds the narrative, and that's why he did it today. Change the subject.
BURNETT: Charlie, Karen, thank you both very much. I appreciate it.
And next, Trump publicly questioning RFK, Jr. about autism and vaccines after reportedly urging the HHS secretary in private to dig into the unfounded link to vaccines and get it done.
[19:20:05]
RFK, Jr.'s sister, Kerry Kennedy, joins us next.
Plus, investigators revealing the full ransom note sent to Nancy Guthrie's family, possible clues they contain as the search for Guthrie in nears six months. And a Republican nominee in one of the most closely watched Senate races abruptly ending a press conference after he's questioned about exclusive reporting from our KFILE, what he's saying about his son-in- law, a social media influencer who has shared Nazi propaganda, and a whole lot more.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BURNETT: Tonight, President Trump turning up the pressure on Health and Human Services Secretary Robert F. Kennedy Jr.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ROBERT F. KENNEDY, JR., HHS SECRETARY: At the time you leave office at so many that's in 2028, 95 percent of the drugs -- at the time you leave office at so many that's in 2028, 95 percent of the drugs that are available to Americans, they will be paying the lowest prices in the world.
[19:25:00]
Thank you, Mr. President.
TRUMP: How are you doing on the autism research?
KENNEDY: We will have an answer for you. We just got --
TRUMP: It's so important.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: It comes after "The Wall Street Journal" is reporting that Trump confronted RFK Jr. at his Virginia Golf Club, demanding to know why RFK Jr. wasn't doing more to probe the unfounded link between autism and vaccines. Trump told RFK Jr. -- that RFK Jr. had the, quote/unquote, "yips" over the issue.
And then Trump told aides that RFK, Jr. will be a failure if he doesn't intensify his push to link vaccines to autism, which every time we talk about this it is important to say that that claim has been scientifically disproven.
OUTFRONT now, Kerry Kennedy, the daughter of Robert F. Kennedy and RFK Jr.'s sister.
So, Kerry, look, this is an issue that has been put to bed repeatedly by scientists. The original allegations in scientific paper had all sorts of issues with it. It's been it had to be retracted. It's false.
So, what do you make of the fact that it's the president of the United States now telling your brother to again stir up this debate and give fuel to the fire?
KERRY KENNEDY, DAUGHTER OF ROBERT F. KENNEDY; RFK JR'S SISTER: Well, you know, Erin, I think one of the reasons that America is great is because starting in the early 1900s, we invested heavily in science and many of our scientific breakthroughs were made by immigrants or the families of immigrants. And today, our national health is at risk and it's at risk because of an administration that is more focused on gut instinct and headlines research.
And people are dying as a result. We've seen that with the vaccine skepticism leading people not to give their little children the measles vaccine and seeing those children die. This is heartbreaking and extremely dangerous, so we must stop the reliance on gut instincts and rely instead on proven scientific methods.
BURNETT: I mean, it is stunning. More measles cases in the past year than in the past 25 combined. It is a stunning and sad statement about society.
The Senate Homeland Security Committee, led by Senator Rand Paul, has scheduled a vote to hold Dr. Anthony Fauci in contempt, as you know after the hearing this week. And in that testimony, it was ugly, okay? It was ugly all the way around. Fauci repeatedly invoked the Fifth Amendment. It was more than 100 times, 112, I believe. Three hours of Republicans battering him with questions, even down to, you know, what color is your tie to get him to plead the Fifth again, but also with some really nasty insults.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. BERNIE MORENO (R-OH): Do you feel like you're in deep shit?
Here I am sitting in front of you six years later saying, who the fuck do you think you were for doing that?
SEN. JOSH HAWLEY (R-MO): You called yourself the most famous scientist in the world. You've done more to harm science than anybody in my lifetime. And I hope you'll go home and write that in your diary.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: So, as I mentioned, Fauci did invoke the Fifth Amendment 112 times. But, you know, you heard there from Senator Hawley and Senator Bernie Moreno the way some Republican senators chose to handle themselves. What did you think of the whole sorry scene?
KENNEDY: Well, first of all, I just can't stand hearing those terrible words. Just stop that. Have some dignity is my first reaction.
And then think about this. If you're alive today, if you didn't die from COVID, HIV, AIDS, SARS, swine flu, Ebola, anthrax, tuberculosis, malaria, or other diarrheal diseases, you have one man to thank and that man is Anthony Fauci. He is a national hero.
And in the midst of the COVID crisis killed 1.2 million Americans, Anthony Fauci was the director of NIAID, which worked with Moderna to develop the first mRNA vaccine and saved our country and saved our world.
He is not an elected official. He is a doctor who has devoted his entire life to public health and along with millions and millions of Americans.
When I think of Tony Fauci, I say thank you, thank you, thank you. And that's what the United States Senate should be saying.
[19:30:00]
BURNETT: You mentioned the diarrheal diseases. Right now, there is an outbreak of just that, that parasite outbreak, the cyclospora. And that is, you know, in the context of a lot of other public health crises in this country right now. There are other outbreaks that have been right now listed on the CDC. There's the measles situation that I mentioned, right, more measles cases in the past year than the past 25 combined.
In the context of all of this, the president of the United States is asking your brother to say that vaccines and autism are related, which they're not. And your brother actually has launched a cooking show. I wanted to play a clip.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KENNEDY, JR.: Hi, I'm Robert F. Kennedy Jr., your HHS secretary. Welcome to the Real Food Show. Thanks to President Trump, we flipped the food pyramid and put real food back where it belongs at the center of the American plate.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: Are your brother's priorities where they should be right now?
KENNEDY: I mean, I love Bobby. I truly do. He's my brother, and I've loved him my whole life, and I still do.
But I just disagree with him on so many of these issues and how he's choosing to spend his time. I look forward to Bobby teaching us all how to cook, but I think, you know, I don't know. I grew up around people who were in the cabinet. My husband, my former husband was in the cabinet. I spent a lot of time with those people and they were working 24/7 on the issues that they were appointed to direct on behalf of our country.
And I think he probably might spend a little bit more time on stopping these outbreaks. on teaching us to cook, but I look forward to the show.
BURNETT: Well, a very thoughtful answer. And I thank you so much for taking the time to talk.
And before we go, Kerry, I don't know if anyone can see it behind you, but there's a book. It is your upcoming book, a beautiful book about your mother, Ethel, and it comes out in October. And I just want to remind everybody about that because I know it matters so deeply to you and there's going to be a lot of people in this time who want to read that.
So, thanks so much, Kerry. It's good to talk to you. KENNEDY: Thanks, Erin. Take care.
BURNETT: And next, we have breaking news in the Nancy Guthrie case, what investigators are now revealing about the ransom notes sent to her family and growing fallout after our KFILE's exclusive reporting on one of the most closely watched Senate races. Hear how a Republican nominee is now responding to questions about his son-in-law's racist and anti-Semitic comments blasted out to over a million followers.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[19:36:56]
BURNETT: Breaking news, investigators are releasing the full contents of two ransom notes sent to Nancy Guthrie's family after she was kidnapped from her home six months ago. Okay, I have both of them here tonight.
The first note was sent on February 2nd, a day after her disappearance, and addressed to her daughter, Savannah.
It says, quote, "Hello, Savannah. We have your mother, Nancy. She is safe but scared. She will be held for ransom, and once payment is received, she will be released unharmed.
We will be holding her for a maximum of seven days. You will need to send bitcoin in the amount of $4 million US dollars before 5:00 p.m. on Thursday the 5th. If payment is not received, the ransom will be increased to $6 million, which will need to be paid by 5:00 p.m. on Monday the 9th.
Once payment is received to the Bitcoin address below, she will be released within 12 hours of deposit to a safe drop-off location back in Tucson. If payment is not received by the last deadline on Monday the 9th at 5:00 p.m., she will be killed.
Your mother is aware of this and her life is in your hands. It is in best interest of everyone to have this completed as soon as possible. You will not be able to contact me from here on out. There will be no negotiation. Do not play games. Law enforcement will not be able to help you."
And then the note ends with, quote, "She had a white smartwatch on the floor of the foot of her bed, and the white floodlight in the backyard was destroyed." And that's sort of at the end, almost like a P.S. type of delivery there.
Ed Lavendera is OUTFRONT.
And, Ed, of course, you were there in Tucson during the early days of this still unfolding tragedy. We still don't have answers. And this is just one of the notes that was released. What did the second note say? And where does all of this now that we're actually seeing them and can read them for ourselves, what does it do to the investigation tonight?
ED LAVANDERA, CNN SENIOR NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: We'll get to that second part here at the end, but I want to kind of remind people of the timeline here. That note you just read came on February 2nd. Remember, it was two days later that Savannah and her siblings put out a lengthy first video on Instagram where they said, we are ready to talk and asked for proof of life.
So, clearly, communicating to the person who sent that note. And then two days after they put out that video, there was this second note that came into the family and it said, "Guthrie family, we did not fully grasp the serious of her physical condition. We never intended to hurt her. That was not our intention.
She perished shortly after she was taken. We believe it was heart related. She is buried in nature now. Nothing you could have done could have changed the outcome. We want your family to know this and hope you all can find peace. We are truly sorry."
And then it was the next day where Savannah and her siblings put out another Instagram video where they said we received your message and we understand.
Now, that was some of the timeline on the early part of that investigation and the search for Nancy Guthrie. But Pima County officials and FBI officials today, Erin, are saying that the reason they're putting this out now is that they're hoping that perhaps people, if they read this, that they can notice some of the syntax, the style of language, the way these notes are written. to see if that might spark some sort of recognition in somebody and all of this.
[19:40:12]
Of course, if all of this was written by AI, all of that is kind of thrown out the window. But that's why authorities say they're releasing these notes now. It's been more than six months since Nancy Guthrie disappeared -- Erin.
BURNETT: Yeah, Eddie, it's funny, just as you say that, that it could have been A.I. Oddly, I had not thought of that.
Ed, thank you very much.
I want to bring in the former FBI deputy director, Andrew McCabe.
And Director McCabe, it's interesting, he mentions we don't know whether this was written by A.I. and does that change everything? Because you can tell it I want this sort of a tone or that sort of a tone.
So I guess that's a caveat now that we can't ignore. But when you look at these notes now and you're actually able to see every single word, the way they were written, do they give you a picture of who's responsible, right? The first note has that list of demands and so specific to this by this day, you know, does anything jump out to you about that first note?
ANDREW MCCABE, CNN SENIOR LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: Yeah, Erin, a couple of things do jump out to me and I and I would expect they're impressing the investigators the same way. It certainly doesn't identify who wrote these letters. It could if they were written by person and not A.I. and someone who's out there recognizes this sort of syntax, the way they're written, the very short sentences, very direct and to the point, very business like somebody might recognize that could lead to identification.
But it will tell beyond that, it will tell investigators a couple of things. The note to me, and this is based on my experience with other notes, there is an arm's length distance here. It's like the writer is going to some length to kind of make this seem like a business transaction rather than something that they are directly responsible for.
And this is odd because it's not typically the way that extortionists or kidnappers deliver for a ransom though. Typically, those people want to control the communication, and they want to overwhelm the recipient of the communication with like, these are the rules. This is what I'm doing. This is what you have to do. No arguments with me, no negotiation, that sort of thing.
Here you have, it's very different. It's like if payment is not received, the ransom will be increased. Not "You better pay me or I'm going to take more money". It's like making it seem like it's --
BURNETT: Yeah.
MCCABE: -- the person who wrote this note is like not responsible.
And then, of course, there's the reference to she will -- if the ransom is paid, she'll be delivered to a drop-off spot back in Tucson. That certainly implies that the person writing this note is not in Tucson at that moment and likely that they have moved Ms. Guthrie out of Tucson as well, which would make sense.
BURNETT: And then the second note saying that they use the word perished shortly after being taken, and then they say that they're truly sorry. In fact, they say there's nothing that you could have done that would have changed this outcome, which actually, to me, would indicate they're saying she died before even the first deadline, because that would mean there's nothing you could do that would change it.
I'm just reading that into it, obviously, personally. But what do you see in that second note?
MCCABE: The second note is remarkable to me because, first of all, it's completely unnecessary. If you are a professional kidnapper and you're a victim, you're-- you're-- the person whose life is going to deliver you the money you've demanded expires, there is no reason to recontact the family and express some sort of remorse or regret.
But that's, in fact, what the note does. And, again, you have-- you know, it's very -- we didn't grasp what would happen. It happened because of her heart condition. They're taking no responsibility for any of this. Let's be clear, Nancy Guthrie died because she was kidnapped by the
person who wrote this letter, likely. So, what I think it does show, though, is some degree of regret and remorse. And that is what I believe Savannah's video last week was trying to appeal to.
BURNETT: Right, right, to someone to some sort of morality or personal you know, they want closure. They want their mother, of course.
All right, thank you very much, Director McCabe. I always appreciate talking to you.
MCCABE: Thanks.
BURNETT: And next, a Republican Senate nominee dodging questions about his son-in-law's extremely disgusting posts and comments, first uncovered by KFILE.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REPORTER: Could you address the question regarding anti-Semitism? What role has your son-in-law played in your campaign?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: KFILE's Andrew Kaczynski, who broke all of the reporting sparking those questions, joins us next.
[19:45:00]
And James Carville versus Hasan Piker, two influential figures on opposing ends of the fight inside the Democratic Party right now see the party's future.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BURNETT: Tonight, the growing fallout over KFILE's exclusive reporting on a Republican Senate candidate's relationship with his controversial son-in-law. Georgia Republican Senate nominee Mike Collins abruptly ending a press conference after repeatedly refusing to answer questions about his son-in-law, David Alan Scheer II. Scheer, as a KFILE investigation revealed, is a social media influencer who has promoted white nationalist ideology, circulated anti-Semitic conspiracy theories, and shared Nazi imagery.
Mike Collins was at a Georgia hospital yesterday to discuss health care when reporters asked whether Scheer had performed work for Collins' campaign and businesses. Collins said the matter had already been addressed and then attacked his Democratic opponent, Senator Jon Ossoff.
(BERGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REP. MIKE COLLINS (R-GA): You know, we fully address that. But John Ossoff refuses to disavow these Democrat socialist movements in our country.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: Collins went on to repeatedly attack Ossoff while reporters continue to press him on his son-in-law.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REPORTER: Could you address the question regarding anti-Semitism? What role has your son-in-law played in your campaign?
REPORTER: You don't want to talk about your son-in-law at all? You want to -- do you embrace him in the family? Share his views.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: Well, you saw Collins there, waving and walking off. He did not respond. He ended the press conference.
OUTFRONT now, Andrew Kaczynski, who broke the original reporting, which is sparking all of these questions now at the center of this crucial must-win race, frankly, in the Senate for both parties, Andrew.
So, Collins said that the questions about his son-in-law have been fully addressed. But that's not the case at all, is it?
[19:50:02]
ANDREW KACZYNSKI, CNN KFILE SENIOR EDITOR: Well, no, it's not. And for some context, Scheer is married to Collins's daughter Summer, and he explicitly promoted white nationalists. He blamed Jews for 9/11, shared Nazi imagery, and said America could rebuild community only by clearing our land of other people. That was during discussion about racial and ethnic minorities. Here are just a few of those examples.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DAVID ALAN SCHEER II, REP. COLLINS' SON-IN-LAW: The only way we can reestablish community is by clearing our land of other people. I want to enjoy my slice of this world with my people to be an American in my opinion is to be of the founding stock or to be related to the founding stock, meaning you may not have directly descended from people who came here as European pilgrims and Puritans. but you may be related to them in your European ancestral heritage.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
Now he has appeared in Collins' campaign family photos. He attended Collins's primary night victory party.
We also found that he's been registered since 2024 at a Collins owned house, which is next to the congressman's large estate. We also identified in our investigation several videos that he appeared to have filmed either on or near Collins's property We found that he appears to have helped produce videos for Collins' personal business, which is a trucking company. So, there are several basic questions that Collins still has not
publicly answered. We asked, did Scheer have any role in his campaign? Did he work for Collins' trucking company as an employee, contractor, or in any capacity? Was he paid by Collins, the campaign, or any of Collins' business? Did he use Collins' property to produce this white nationalist content that we uncovered at CNN.
We asked Collins whether he condemned Scheer's specific remarks, the anti-Semitic material he shared, and the campaign did not answer, Erin, any of those questions when we asked.
BURNETT: I mean, it's all really jaw-dropping, and just to hear him say what you played there is stunning. So, what has Collins actually said publicly, given that, you know, when he's gotten the questions from you he hasn't answered, and now other reporters are asking we saw him just walk off in that press conference?
KACZYNSKI: Yeah, well, first off, Erin, when we asked about Collins about our investigation two weeks ago, he really declined to address any of it. A spokesperson said this instead to us. They said, Rep. Collins' lifelong support for Israel is unquestionable and backed by his consistent record in Congress of standing up for Israel and her people. That was the quote a spokesperson gave us.
The campaign did then remove a photo of Scheer from its website about 10 days ago. "The Atlantic Journal Constitution" caught up with Collins and asked about our reporting, and he said, quote, "Nobody speaks for me. I don't speak for anybody else. I think it's pretty clear on where I've always -- on where I've always stood with Israel."
He called removing his photo a personal decision, and he added, well, you know, you love your family.
His campaign also then told a local news outlet, Rep Collins has always condemned forms of anti-Semitism, always will, regardless of the source.
But again, Erin, none of those statements answered whether Collins' son-in-law has any role in his business or any role in his campaign, and they haven't told us.
BURNETT: No, no, it doesn't. And I guess he thinks he's addressing perhaps some of the anti-Semitism. But then these comments about that the only people who belong in America are people descended from the Puritans or people related to the Puritans, that obviously doesn't address anything like that in any way, shape, or form.
All right. Incredible reporting, Andrew, and thank you very much.
KACZNYSKI: Thank you.
BURNETT: Next, James Carville blasting the far left figures that are surging in his party. Wait until you hear it.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[19:56:58]
BURNETT: Tonight, polls showing Abdul El-Sayed, the Bernie Sanders- backed progressive candidate in Michigan -- in the Michigan Senate race, is leading moderate Democrat Haley Stevens by a sizable lead, and there's been several polls showing that in recent days. In Stevens's corner is Senate Leader Chuck Schumer and Michigan Governor Gretchen Whitmer.
This is leading to an epic battle within the party that is playing out in real time. Our Donie O'Sullivan talked to two influential figures in the Democratic Party. They have polar opposite views. Here's what Donie found.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
HASAN PIKER, DEMOCRATIC SOCIAL ACTIVIST AND STREAMER: I think these guys have failed so publicly and so spectacularly that it has caused people to seek out alternatives.
JAMES CARVILLE, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: I see challenges from the, quote, "progressive left," unquote. And these people are too hot- headed to know that they're not popular. People don't like them.
They don't win elections. They never run against Republicans. They just run against other Democrats. And their only message is, we're going to blow everything up.
DONIE O'SULLIVAN, CNN SENIOR CORRESPONDENT: James Carville says this is all going to implode at the general election.
PIKER: Yeah, as opposed to previous neoliberal Democratic candidacies that have been spectacular successes so far -- Hillary Rodham Clinton in 2016 and Kamala Harris in 2024.
There are a lot of people who are just like, this is not working. Cost-of-living crisis is completely out of control. Democrats haven't done anything about it. Republicans haven't done anything about it. There has to be a different alternative.
CARVILLE: I have one simple philosophy about politics -- winning is everything, stupid.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: Donie O'Sullivan is OUTFRONT now.
And, Donie, you know, fascinating to watch this and Hasan Piker sort of laughing at James Carville. I mean, Carville says winning is everything stupid. But CNN's new poll shows one in three Democrats identify as Democratic socialists. So, I guess the question is, as you see it here in these conversations, which of these men is out of touch?
O'SULLIVAN: Yeah, I mean, this is why Michigan on Tuesday is going to be so critical, right, because that's the exact fight that is happening, is whether the party needs to move toward the left and go with a candidate like El Sayed or stay more in the center, established as they are with a Haley Stevens, and how that will play out in November. I think seeing how that plays out, and especially if it is an El Sayed that wins and then wins the primary and then maybe goes on to win the general election, that is obviously something that will inform process for the presidential election.
I will just say, you know, something obviously is changing and happening. You point to that polling. And I think you really see this generationally where whether it comes to how people view Israel and U.S. policy toward that country, and also just the idea of being a Democratic socialist.
The word "socialist" used to be a bad word in this country, but for a lot of young people, it's not so much anymore.
BURNETT: No, it's not. It's not. Thank you very much, Donie.
And keep in mind, that was just a little clip. Donie's full report, "THE WHOLE STORY", "The Left Insurgency", premieres this Sunday at eight o'clock.
Thanks for joining us.
"AC360" starts now.
