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Early Start with John Berman and Zoraida Sambolin

President Obama in Estonia; White House Confirms Authenticity of ISIS Video

Aired September 03, 2014 - 05:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: So, we're going to have to make sure that the international community stands behind the Ukrainian economy in the short term. Even as we encourage and advise and work with Ukraine to carry out some of the basic reforms that are going to be required in order for them to achieve the kinds of models of success that we've seen in Estonia, Poland and other places. And that's a tough road to hoe. It took a couple of decades for some of the countries who are currently in the E.U. to achieve the sort of market-based reforms that have led to such great prosperity.

Ukraine is not going to be able to do that overnight but we have to make sure that we are helping build a bridge towards that new future. And you know, if we combine those efforts with a commitment to continuing the NATO/Ukraine military relationship. They are not a member of NATO, but we have consistently worked with their military in terms of training and support. Then, you know, I think that not only will Ukraine feel that in words we are behind them, but they'll see that, indeed, we are working with them as well.

Steve Holland of Reuters.

STEVE HOLLAND, REUTERS: Thank you, sir. Just following up on Ann. Will you have this military strategy on ISIS ready for discussion with NATO allies this week? And in your view, what should NATO be prepared to do to take on Islam State? Lastly, how much stock do you put in this reported cease-fire between Ukraine and Russia? How do you assess Putin's motives?

OBAMA: It's too early to tell what the -- the cease-fire means. We haven't seen any details. We've just seen a couple of wire reports. We have consistently supported the effort of President Poroshenko to achieve a meaningful cease-fire that could lead to a political settlement of the conflict. So far it hasn't helped. Either because Russia has not been serious about it or has pretended that it's not controlling the separatists.

And that the separatists, when they thought it was to their advantage, have not abided by the cease-fire, so we haven't -- we haven't seen a lot of follow-up on so-called announced cease-fires.

Having said that, if in fact Russia is prepared to stop financing army, training, in many cases, joining with Russian troops, activities in Ukraine, and is serious about a political settlement that is something that we all hope for. I've said consistently, our preference is a strong, productive,

cooperative Russia. But the way to achieve that is by abiding to international norms. To improving the economy. To focusing on how they can actually produce goods and services that other people want and give opportunity to their people and educate them. That's not the path that they've been pursuing over the last several years.

Certainly, not in evidence when it comes to their strategy in Ukraine. I'll leave it up to others to interpret Mr. Putin's psychology on this. But in terms of actions, what we've seen is aggression and appeals to, you know, national sentiments, that have historically been very dangerous in Europe. And rightly a cause of concern. So there's an opportunity here, let's see if there's follow-up.

In my discussions with President Poroshenko, I've consistently said that he needs to follow up on the kinds of reforms that he proposed so that eastern Ukraine feels as if it is fairly represented. And that Russian language speakers are protected against discrimination. These are all things that are part of his platform. We encourage them to move forward.

But no realistic political settlement can be achieved if effectively Russia says we are going to continue to send tanks and troops and arms and advisers under the guise of separatists who are not homegrown. And the only possible settlement is if Ukraine cedes its territory or its sovereignty or its ability to make its own decisions about its security and its economic future.

With respect to Iraq, we will be discussing this topic even before ISIL dominated the headlines. One of the concerns that we've had is the development of terrorist networks and organizations, separate and apart from al Qaeda, whose focus oftentimes is regional and who are combining terrorist tactics with the tactics of small armies. And we've seen ISIS to be the first one that has broken through. But we anticipated this a while back and it was reflected in my West Point speech.

So one of our goals is to get NATO for work with us to help create the kinds of partnerships regionally that can combat not just ISIL, but these kinds of networks as they arise and potentially destabilize allies and partners of ours in the region. Already, we've seen NATO countries recognize the severity of this problem. That is, it's going to be a long-run problem. You know, immediately, they've dedicated resources to help us with humanitarian air drops, to provide arms to the Peshmerga and to the Iraqi Security Forces.

And we welcome those efforts. What we hope to do at the NATO summit is to make sure that we are more systematic about how we do it. That we're more focused about how we do it. NATO is unique in the annals of history as a successful alliance, but we have to recognize that threats evolved. And threats have evolved as a consequence of what we've seen in Ukraine. But threats are also evolving in the Middle East that have a direct effect on Europe.

And to go back to what I said earlier, to Ann, you know, we know that if we are joined by the international community, we can continue to shrink ISIL's sphere of influence, its effectiveness, its financing. Its military capabilities to the point where it is a manageable problem. And the question is going to be making sure we've got the right strategy, but also making sure that we've got the international will to do it.

This is something that is a continuation of a problem we've seen certainly since 9/11, but before. And it continues to metastasize in different ways. And what we've got to do is make sure that we are organizing the Arab world, the Middle East, the Muslim world, along with the international community to isolate this cancer. This particular brand of extremism that is first and foremost destructive to the Muslim world and the Arab world and North Africa. And the people who live there.

They're the ones who are most severely affected. They're the ones who are constantly under threat of being killed. They're the ones whose economies are completely upended to the point where they can't produce their own food and they can't produce the kinds of goods and services to sell in the world marketplace. And they're falling behind because of this very small and narrow but very dangerous segment of the population. And we've got to combat it in a sustained effective way. And I'm confident we're going to be able to do that.

All right. Thank you very much.

Appreciate it, Mr. President. Thank you so much.

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: You've been watching the news conference from Estonia, President Obama and the Estonian president right there addressing many, many questions.

Major developments this morning. The White House confirming the authenticity of the video showing the execution of Steven Sotloff. There had been word of a possible cease-fire in Ukraine. The president answering questions on both of those subjects.

CHRISTINE ROMANS, CNN ANCHOR: He did. And he said that -- you know, he gave kind of the clearest words yet about what the U.S. goal is with ISIL, as he calls it, or ISIS, Islamic State. He says the strategy is clear, we will degrade and -- we will destroy ISIL. Of course, he said the United States -- the United States government and the events, the people in America grieve with the family of Steven Sotloff.

BERMAN: Yes. And as for the people who killed Steven Sotloff, the president said, we will not forget. Our reach is long. Justice will be served.

I want to bring in Matthew Chance who's live from the Estonian capital right now, Tallinn.

Matthew, you watched that along with us. The president addressing again these major, major developments this morning. He talked of Steven Sotloff as a devoted, courageous journalist, and his death, a horrific act of violence. MATTHEW CHANCE, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes,

absolutely, condemning that slaying of that American journalist, saying also that whatever the Islamic State thinks it will achieve in doing this, it has already failed, committing again to try to build an international coalition to remove the threat that ISIS or Islamic State poses.

This is what he said, "Our objective is to make sure that ISIL," as he calls it, "is no longer a threat to the region." Now the means by which that will happen obviously will be a matter of discussion amongst allies at the NATO summit that's taking place in Wales tomorrow.

So yes, one of the issues there. That's obviously going to come to the fore with these horrific developments. President Obama saying that essentially the nation is grieving along with the family of Steven Sotloff right now.

ROMANS: Matthew, let me ask you this. Does it seem to you as though he gave a clearer strategy for what the United States prepared to do inside Syria? This has been the question over the past week, really week and a half, when he famously said he did not have a strategy inside Syria. He's clarifying it today saying, you know, again, saying, look, I was talking about military strategy, that we'd potentially have to have the approval of the Congress of the United States.

He said that, you know, the goal here is get an Iraqi government in place, you know, blunt ISIL's movement and then have a regional strategy in place. Was he more clear about his strategy inside Syria?

CHANCE: Well, really, I mean, I think besides that issue, as far as -- as far as I heard, anyway, but he's been very clear on this, which is this is not something that the United States is going to undertake on its own. Very clear that this was part of a strategy that he was going to lead as the -- as the president of the United States. An international coalition that would gather together and together prevent ISIL becoming a threat in the region.

And so, yes, no clarity that I heard at least about whether or not there would be airstrikes against ISIL in Syria, although that would continue just in Iraq.

ROMANS: I think we're in agreement on that.

BERMAN: He didn't go there at all. He's saying he wants to build a coalition.

And, Matthew, the other major news this morning, there had been some word coming out of Ukraine, the office of President Poroshenko there, that a cease-fire deal had been reached between the Ukrainian president and the Russian president.

President Obama was asked about this, he said it's simply too early to tell. He obviously hopes there's some kind of deal. Too early to tell. But you have some news on this. You have been speaking with people inside Russia.

CHANCE: Yes, I have. I've just been to the presidential spokesman inside of Russia, Dmitry Peskov, his name. He's the sort of right- hand man of Vladimir Putin. He told me that despite the -- the tweet or the announcement that had been made by the president of Ukraine, Petro Poroshenko, he said that there had been a telephone conversation, but no such cease-fire agreement had been actually made.

Because -- and this is part of the whole Russian denial that it's involved in Ukraine. Because Vladimir Putin is not party to the conflict, he said. It's not for him to negotiate a cease-fire. It's for the rebels and the Ukrainian government to negotiate a cease-fire. All that was agreed was a sort of roadmap, a regime for a cease-fire to actually take root.

Now we can take this at face value or not.

BERMAN: Right.

CHANCE: But it seems that some kind of agreement has been made. It's just that the Russians want a degree of distance from that.

BERMAN: Yes. We got to see how this unfolds.

ROMANS: Yes.

BERMAN: Because that's not, no, there is no cease-fire. It's just that President Putin couldn't agree to it technically because he still denies that he's fighting inside Ukraine. We'll have to see how that unfolds.

CHANCE: Exactly.

BERMAN: All right. Matthew Chance for us in Tallinn, thank you so much for discussing all these issues.

ROMANS: Meantime, the president of the United States said that those separatists are Russian trained, Russian financed, Russian armed, Russian supported and directed by Russia. So the president being very clear who he thinks is responsible for the unrest.

BERMAN: Yes. As I said, a lot of news this morning. President Obama has authorized the deployment of additional 350 troops to be sent to help protect American diplomatic facilities and personnel in Iraq. This news coming as ISIS beheaded a second American journalist Steven -- Sotloff.

Here's what the president said about that just a short time ago.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

OBAMA: Whatever these murderers think they'll achieve by killing innocent Americans like Steven, they have already failed. They've failed because, like people around the world, Americans are repulsed by their barbarism. We will not be intimidated. Their horrific acts only unite us as a country and stiffen our resolve to take the fight against these terrorists. And those who make the mistake of harming Americans will learn that we will not forget and that our reach is long and that justice will be served.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BERMAN: "We will not forget, our reach is long, justice will be served." The message from President Obama to ISIS this morning.

Joining us now from London is Haras Rafiq, Quilliam Foundation, outreach officer who was part of a British government task force that looked into counterterrorism training.

Haras, thank you so much for being with us. I was struck by one aspect of the president's message this morning. He tried to juxtaposed Steven Sotloff, this American journalist, whom he called devoted and courageous. He juxtaposed Sotloff against ISIS, whom he called barbaric, evil among other things. He said that ISIS says they stand up for religion, well, it was Steven Sotloff who loved the religion of Islam and went to meet the Islamic people.

He says that ISIS says they stand up for the oppressed yet it was Steven Sotloff who traveled around the Middle East to report on the oppressed.

I was struck by that juxtaposition.

HARAS RAFIQ, OUTREACH OFFICER, QUILLIAM FOUNDATION: Absolutely. First of all, I'd like to offer my condolences to Steven Sotloff's family. This is tragic, barbaric act. The way that President Obama actually described ISIS is actually correctly, how he contrasted ISIS to Sotloff. ISIS is not an organization -- and I refuse to call them Islamic State because as a Muslim I refuse to recognize the fact that they are Islamic and that they're a state because the way that they're behaving and the way that they set up the Islamic caliphate, the inverted (INAUDIBLE), is not Islamic.

In fact, recently one of my colleagues, Sheikh Usama Hasan this weekend launched the British fatwa which has been signed up to by a number of leading clerics in the UK actually condemning ISIS, and actually calling it, making it unlawful for any Muslims around the world to actually join them, and never mind undertake any terrorist activity.

So yes, absolutely, President Obama is right. They're not Islamic and Sotloff actually was behaving in a manner that I, as -- you know, somebody who was born in some Muslim traditional classical Islam, Sotloff was actually behaving in a much more Islamic manner than ISIS have ever done.

I think it's also important that the president said that. A couple of things that struck me were that first of all that he talked about a strategy with the Syria. Now what's very interesting is that, we're actually starting to see some of these regional alliances that he's talked about coming into play. We've had -- last night there were reports that there were Turks, the Turkish army were fight alongside the Kurds. Well, we know of course the Turks and the Kurds have had their

problems for a while. And also that there was a delegation and a meeting that took place between the Saudis and the Iranians. And this is interesting because the whole issue and the whole civil war within Syria has been supported by Qatar, Saudi Arabia, et cetera, versus Iran who supported Assad. So we are starting to see the developments of some new regional alliances and I think this is key.

If we're going to defeat ISIS, if we're going to defeat them militarily and in the region that needs to happen. But also as I've said before, on the wider level, we have to tackle the ideas, we have to recognize that the hearts and minds of people around the world have to be won. And we certainly have a number of people here in the UK, British Muslims and non-Muslims that have come together to combat this and certainly there are people in the U.S. like, as I mentioned before, Sheikh Kabbani and a number of others, that certainly are ready and willing and able to do this.

ROMANS: And the president calling this barbaric and empty, the ideology of ISIS. But you're very right, there are people in the United States and in the UK who will be inspired by the hellish propaganda that has been out with this second murder.

How do you confront that? The fact that what we see as barbaric is inspiring to other people?

RAFIQ: I think it's inspiring for a very small number of people. If we look at why the foreign fighters and why people are fighting for ISIS, they actually believe that it is their political duty to fight for the state. And it is their theological duty underpinned by Salafi jihadi mentality that god wants them to do that. And of course, these videos -- the timing of these videos is very important. There has been some chatter that this video was actually leaked prematurely, and I suspect it may well be that they wanted to release this video today because of the -- obviously, the NATO conference.

So you're right that some people will be inspired but it's a small minority. We have to combat these people from a media perspective. First of all, I want to congratulate mainstream media for not showing this video. For not giving the video some of the air time that previous videos have had. And secondly, it's up to our society, as a whole, to combat these ideas. We have to stop people from going out there, from the West to fight.

One of the things that was interesting was, according to the latest figures, half of ISIS fighters are foreign fighters. So we have to stop people from going out there. We have to identify who these people are. And then we have to tackle their ideology, we have to counsel the narrative. And actually even in many cases if not all of them, mentor them back to a state where they fit into society.

BERMAN: It was interesting to me, Haras, that whenever the president spoke about what the United States has done against ISIS, it was very specific to Iraq. He talked about protecting Americans in Iraq, he talked about the humanitarian efforts to help the Yazidis and the Turkmen Shiites in Iraq. He talked about humanitarian missions, as I said, in helping the Iraqi government form.

ROMANS: Yes.

BERMAN: And he seemed very reluctant to talk about how he was going to take on ISIS inside Syria. He only spoke about it in regional terms.

Can you defeat and roll back ISIS without taking them on inside Syria?

RAFIQ: The answer to that question is no. Unless, unless we -- unless President Obama and the allies come up with a solution on how we're going to deal with the issue in Syria, because let's not forget that the tactics that ISIS are using now, especially with the Kurds coming down from the north and with Damascus -- well, Baghdad actually coming in -- coming up from the south is that they are retreating back into Syria and then launching offensives from Syria itself, obviously from Raqqah.

Now the problem we've got with Syria is that first of all in the past, both Obama, President Obama and David Cameron and others have not supported Assad. In fact we've been supporting the rebels, the Free Syrian Army, in actually trying to overthrow Assad. So that's the first consideration.

The second consideration is that we have Iran, Iran is backing Syria. And one of the things we don't -- sort of it seems to be little appetite for it is to actually invoke Iran into a wider conflict within the region and Hezbollah, certainly, and we all know their capabilities. And the third aspect is we have countries like Russia and China who also have an interest within Syria and certainly at odds with the U.S. and its allies going into the region.

BERMAN: Right.

RAFIQ: So I think there's a lot of diplomacy that needs to take place before the Syrian problem can be resolved. And I think that's what's being done right now.

ROMANS: It's this whole the enemy of my enemy is my friend, when you're talking about the Middle East, I mean, enemies have been enemies for centuries. And sometimes it's so complicated, that chess board.

What's the U.S. role in trying get these people together to form this regional alliance to fight ISIS or should U.S. not be a center stage here?

RAFIQ: Well, I think that the U.S. has a humanitarian duty to be center stage. If we are -- if President Obama is the leader of the free world as it were, he has a duty to protect or help to protect innocent minorities like the Yazidis, Sunni Muslims that are being killed by ISIS, Shias, Christians, et cetera. But not necessarily by putting boots on the ground.

I think that the local regional alliances that he talked about are key. And some of these alliances I think may well be short term because if you look at the theology, the Salafi theology that underpins the jihadi mentality, and it's at odds and always has been at odds with the rest of Islam, never mind one of its key enemies, which is the Shias and vice versa. So I think any short-term alliances will just be that shorter.

But I think they all recognize that if they don't combat this phenomenon that is ISIS now, the potential is that ISIS could grow into something that establishes a base and we may well be actually taking on or talking about this region as being the sponsor of terrorism around the world.

BERMAN: Right.

RAFIQ: So I think it's important that the U.S. plays a part. It's important that Britain plays a part. And it's also important that the regional countries play a part now before ISIS becomes such a force that we can't do anything about it.

BERMAN: Haras Rafiq, always great to talk to you. Thanks so much for being with us this morning, following all these developments.

We've been following the breaking news of what's going on inside Syria. Also the president's trip to Eastern Europe. "NEW DAY" has complete coverage of all these important developments right after the break.

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