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Early Start with John Berman and Zoraida Sambolin

Hostage Terror in Sydney; New Detail: Lights Off in Coffee Shop

Aired December 15, 2014 - 05:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: We did hear from the police commissioner of New South Wales who wanted to send, it seems, a very clear message to the people inside, maybe in response to those messages they're posting on social media.

He said, "Our only goal is to get you out safely." That was interesting to hear. He also spoke to people who have been receiving some of these messages on social media, whether it be Twitter or Facebook or elsewhere saying, hey, look, put us -- put the police in touch with those inside. It is the police, the trained negotiators, who should be speaking with the people inside that room particularly the hostage taker.

The police there seemed to have the situation at least under control in the sense that they are going about this in an organized fashion. Is that your sense on the ground there?

TIFFINY GENDERS, 2GB POLICE REPORTER (via telephone): Yes, they are. They are going through it meticulously. Early this morning, one of the hostages actually made contact with my radio station 2GB radio. That was, I guess, the first line of communication between the outside and those being held inside.

From that moment on, we actually had police brought into your office. I guess manning the phones with all the producers, you know, who were taking these calls. I had contact with several family members. We are all trying to go about this the right way.

But the gunman is using media, I guess, to try and spread his message and putting these hostages forcing them to contact media outlets, not just ours, TV stations and our public broadcaster. They are all getting in contact with journalists and announcers and trying to get these demands out.

CHRISTINE ROMANS, CNN ANCHOR: So interesting the demands. He wants an ISIS flag and speak directly with Tony Abbott, the prime minister. From the police press conference, I'm not at all clear, Tiffany, have negotiators spoken directly with him or are they speaking with him through the hostages?

GENDERS: Early on in the picture, we knew police did not have any direct contact with the gunman who is holding we believe more than 20 people still against their will. We know they have made contact with the gunman. Police are keeping pretty tight-lipped on details obviously for operational reasons. They don't want to give too much away and jeopardize all of the good work the negotiators have been doing with this man and with all of the hostages inside. We know the hostages have been able to text a message of their loved ones to let them know that they are OK, but obviously it is a very difficult and a very dicey situation.

BERMAN: And indeed one of the developments that is taking place over the last several hours, overnight, here in the United States and into the evening where you are is these five hostages managed to get out.

Now police won't reveal any details even about that. They wouldn't say whether they were released or whether they escaped or simply fled. We saw pictures of it, the people just sprinting and looking terrified.

Tiffiny, what are your sources telling you? What are the circumstances of these people getting out?

GENDERS: From what I understand that those five people actually managed to get out of the building and escape on their own. And Channel 7, one of our broadcasters here, their office and network is directly across the road from the Lindt Building.

So they have a camera directly on the building. They are choosing not to broadcast a lot of the footage because it is simply just harrowing and very confronting for people to see. They were able to tell us when the hostages did manage to escape.

The captor became agitated and very aggressive towards the other hostages inside because some of the people we know they came and adding two different lots. It was five people. Two women and three men were able to escape him.

ROMANS: Two women wearing Lindt aprons. It looks like they may have been employees of the coffee shop. You wonder if they knew a different way to get out or they would have a very good familiarity with that building and all of the locations.

Now it is heading into evening. The lights are off in the coffee shop and police are at this point waiting. Is that where we stand now, Tiffiny?

GENDERS: That's right. Police have the best negotiators in the world working on the case. They warned it may take time. Their priority is to get everyone inside that building out safely. From what we know at the moment, no one has been harmed. One of the freed hostages has been taken to hospital.

We know that was for a pre-existing condition. Police warning us it could take a long time to resolve this and of course, it is heading into -- t is 9:30 p.m. local time here.

Heading into the fight and police and everyone, all the reporters, I guess, who have been keeping constant rolling coverage are all there and expect to be there in the night. Actually I just come home to get a couple hours sleep and I'll be heading back to the scene. BERMAN: Tiffiny Genders, thank you for that update. Please go rest up tomorrow could be a long day. The politicians and leaders there are saying people should go about their lives. Go to work tomorrow in Sydney unless you live or work in that immediate area surrounding --

ROMANS: CNN's Anna Coren joins us live from the scene. She has been there all day. Anna, interesting new detail that we're hearing that the lights in the coffee shop are now off. Recap for us what is happening here and the new development.

ANNA COREN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, I thought that was a really interesting development also, Christine. They are allowed to use social media. They are allowed to use their phones. Whether this is, you know, the gunman telling them to send these messages whether this is under duress.

I mean, clearly these people would be distressed with the siege going into the 12th hour. We just don't know what the relationship is between the hostage taker and the hostages. We don't even know how many hostages are inside the building.

Police are refusing to let us know. Certainly, the scene as it stands now. We are still in the location. Police won't let us go any further. It is cordoned off. Several blocks cordoned off the Lindt Cafe, which is 100 meters, 200 meters as the crow flies from where I am standing.

You can see the ambulances behind me. They have been here for many hours now on standby. Obviously police hoping that this would have been resolved by now, it is 9:30 p.m. in the evening.

We heard from the new South Wales Police Commissioner Andrew Scipione a little bit earlier saying that they are going to do everything, you know, in their power to ensure this ends peacefully.

That they get the hostages out safely and that, you know, tomorrow is just a normal day. There will be exclusion zones set up around the cafe, but for workers to go about their business as if it was a normal day. This does suggest that this siege, this crisis, could continue into the wee hours of tomorrow.

BERMAN: Anna, it is about 9:30 p.m. where you are. It's about 5:30 here in the United States. People are just waking up, I think, and getting the first sense of what is going on there. I wonder if you can walk us through the last 11 or 12 hours as this coffee shop in one of the main business areas in Sydney, Australia, was taken under the control of an armed gunman with people now being held hostage.

COREN: For sure. Setting the scene, we are in the heart of the Sydney CBD. If you have visited Sydney, I'm sure they have come to this area, Martin Place. It is a major thoroughfare. It's a financial district, a business district and commercial district, a big shopping area.

All those shops closed down. All of those buildings evacuated. You are talking about the U.S. Consulate is based there, the Reserve Bank of Australia. This Seven Network, this TV station sits up right across the road from this cafe.

According to police and local reporters around 9:30 a.m., a local person saw this gunman carry a bag, looked suspicious, and alerted authorities. Next thing he is walked into the Lindt Cafe.

At 10:00 a.m., that is when he took the cafe and the people inside it hostage. He had them have their hands up against the window. That is when we saw the distressing images of the people.

Later, they unfurled this black flag that read there is no other god than god. It was an Islamic phrase. It is not an ISIS flag. That is interesting. To hear him now demanding an ISIS flag, I don't know where he is finally focusing his direction, but certainly he would seem to be a sympathizer of the ISIS cause.

This has unfolded throughout the day, obviously hundreds of police on location. We have seen police snipers take up positions. Obviously, we were closer to the cafe earlier.

We had a visual of the cafe. Police then moved us back. They were concerned about, you know, security whether the gunman would start firing or explosives or a bomb.

Now there are reports and I think this is worth noting, that he has told through his hostages that he planted two bombs inside the cafe and he also planted two bombs within the Sydney CBD. Well, earlier today, there was a bomb scare at the Sydney opera house directly down the road.

A kilometer that way, a mile that way, and you hit the Sydney opera house. That did not happen. That was a false alarm. Authorities are on alert.

We heard from the prime minister and police commissioner for the public to be vigilant and look out for suspicious parcels. At the moment, their focus is purely on this cafe and those hostages inside.

BERMAN: All right, Anna Coren, thank you for that. The two recent developments, five hostages managed to escape or let go. It looks like they managed to escape. The lights are now off. We don't know why or who did it, but the lights are off in the cafe.

BERMAN: And the demands of this hostage taker, apparently, he wants to speak to the Prime Minister Tony Abbott and he wants an ISIS flag delivered to the coffee shop.

ROMANS: All right, Sydney, Australia, clearly harrowing 12 hours here. A hostage situation unfolding just steps from the American consulate in the heart of the commercial and tourism district in Sydney, Australia. We will hear from a radio host who spoke with some of those hostages next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BERMAN: Breaking news this morning, a gunman holding hostages in Sydney, Australia's central business district in a Lindt Chocolate Shop. Police are not saying how many people are being held hostage. They are withholding that information right now as they are withholding most operational details.

But there was a development over the last several hours overnight. Five people did manage to get out of that shop. Police were not saying if they were released or escaped.

We spoke to a local police reporter. It was her understanding they managed to escape this siege. Now it began about 11 hours ago. We heard from a man sitting outside the chocolate shop when it all began.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I was in the cafe getting a take away coffee and I sat outside the cafe to chat on the phone. In those few minutes I was on the phone, this unfolded. I don't know if the gunman was in there when I was in the cafe or went in a minute or two afterwards.

Either way, this unfolded very, very quickly at about 9:35 or 9:40 this morning. Inside the cafe, there was no hint. People were sitting down chatting among their coffee going about their normal business.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BERMAN: Not a great deal known about the man you're looking at right there, the man holding the hostages inside that chocolate shop. Police now do have contact with him over the last several hours though apparently he has also forced people inside that shop to contact media on his behalf issuing demands through the media.

Apparently he is calling himself "The Brother." What he wants is a flag, an ISIS flag, to be delivered to the coffee shop. He also wants to speak with Australian Prime Minister Tony Abbott.

ROMANS: All right, earlier, an Australian radio host managed to communicate with the hostage taker through some of the people he was holding. Here is what he said about some of that conversation.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED CALLER: I talked to Ray on air. I made an editorial decision I would not talk to him on air. I was fearful I was being dupe or put people at risk. I came off air during a three-minute commercial break and spoke to the young man.

I rang him back and confirmed he was in fact a hostage. I've spoken to police and they had a list of some hostages and he was one of one of the hostages. His name was given to me by the young man so then I was talking to him.

In the background, I could hear the hostage taker. The instructions about wanting to talk to the prime minister and calling me a scum bag and the media scum bags for reporting ISIL is a group of murderous bastards who have no regard for human life. So I heard all of this in the background and then I went back on air. I didn't report what I have been told. I just told them I had a call from the hostage and he called back again and left the number. I rang him back.

This happened three times. At the end of three or four conversations and these demands were made and he wanted to talk to the prime minister, Mr. Abbott. I said, I know someone with a bit of expertise.

A negotiator came over to take the call. He since then had contact with four or five hostages through the course of the last two hours.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ROMANS: We know the hostage taker has been trying to reach out to the media through these hostages. Interesting how he is ranting how ISIL has no regard for human life.

BERMAN: To his credit, that guy, the one thing he did was bring police and negotiators in right away. He didn't try to talk to the people inside there or the hostage taker himself.

ROMANS: One big story obviously dominating the headlines. This is the breaking news. "NEW DAY" is covering it all. Chris Cuomo joins us now with the preview of how they are handling it. Hi, Chris.

CHRIS CUOMO, CNN ANCHOR, "NEW DAY": I won't take you away from it. We will following the coverage of what is going on their right now as this standoff goes into the full day there. It is nighttime in Australia.

We will bring in our experts to figure out who this man is and what he represents in terms of what is going in Australia and larger concerns. We will follow this and any other big news for you this morning. Back to you guys.

BERMAN: Chris, thanks so much. I lost you there for a second. I'm just seeing a report right now out of Belgium. We are hearing that one person is being held hostage after some gunman stormed an apartment building there.

I know this is going to sound like it is connected to what is going on in Australia. We have no idea if it is connected. We have no idea at this point who these gunmen are who entered the apartment building in Belgium.

We know one member of the authorities say we don't think this is related to ISIS or ISIL or anything happening in Sydney. Someone held hostage in the Belgium city of Ghent. We will get to that situation and the latest going on in Sydney right after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BERMAN: It's almost 6:00 a.m. here in New York. Before 10:00 p.m. in Sydney, Australia. It is getting dark there, a gunman is holding hostages inside a Lindt Chocolate Cafe in the city's central business district. The police will not tell us how many hostages this man is holding.

What we do know is that five people were able to get out overnight. Police reporter for Sydney radio station told us that the lights are now off in the cafe. We do not know if that is something that the police or authorities have managed to do or if they were turned off by gunman.

Now the police reporter we spoke to a short while ago, Tiffiny Gender tells us that some of the hostages have been communicating with local media using their mobile phones Facebook and Twitter.

BERMAN: The reporters in Australia are trying to get what information they can including the name of the gunman who is still yet to be officially identified. Now the offices of Seven News were evacuated when the crisis began.

Those offices down the street from the Lindt Chocolate Cafe. One reporter was allowed to return to his newsroom. Listen to him speak about the situation.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

CHRIS REASON, 7NEWS CORRESPONDENT: Let's start with what we can see of the gunman. He has been clearly identifiable as he paces his way back and forth through the four plate glass windows at Lindt Cafe. He is wearing a white shirt and black cap and he is unshaven and he is carrying a pump action gun.

That gun is often coming into the frame of the windows, often close and menacingly close to the hostages themselves. Let's talk about the hostages, Mel. We have counted 15 different faces being forced up against the windows over of the last eight or nine hours.

Not the 50 that had been speculated earlier. I think that number is wildly inaccurate. We are talking about that number, 15 people. Combination of men and women and young people, but thankfully no children involved as far as we can tell from our vantage point up here.

Now the gunman seems to be rotating these people through the positions on the windows with their hands and faces up against the glass. One woman, we counted, was there for at least two hours, an agonizing time for her.

People are there with their hands like this in the windows, Mel. Others look so visibly upset. One woman whose eyes were blood shot red, obviously being -- crying her eyes out for some time. Who knows what has been going through their minds the last few hours, but just a terrifying ordeal for them.

I have to speculate here, but even more terrifying just two hours ago when we saw that rush of escapees. We could see from up here at this vantage point, the gunman got agitated as he realized those five had got out.

He started screaming orders at the people inside, the hostages remained behind. We did not see any more than that. We cannot swing our camera from this position to show you those windows directly live, Mel. The police are good enough to let us get up here. We will not interfere with the tactical operations. That is little detail about what can be seen at this time in the siege.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

ROMANS: A harrowing 12 hours now. It is dark heading into night. Another radio host told us he was on the phone with one of the hostages and could hear in the background the hostage taker ranting about how the media misrepresented ISIL or ISIS as inhumane and with no regard for human life. That was one of the things that was really irritating this hostage.

BERMAN: What has happened overnight, five people did managed to get out, escaped from the hostage standoff inside the Lindt Cafe, those five people now safe. Others are still trapped inside.

We have learned from a reporter on the ground, the lights have been recently turned off inside that chocolate shop. Whether it was done by the hostage taker or authorities, we don't know that either.

The demands stand at this. The hostage taker wants to speak to Australian Prime Minister Tony Abbott and an ISIS flag delivered to the cafe.

ROMANS: Again, five people managed to escape and there are still maybe 15, we don't know how many people are inside that shop, but clearly a harrowing night that will continue here.

BERMAN: We are going to follow developments all morning here on CNN. Some of the key questions are what are the motives of this man? What are the ties to international terror? Those are some of the lines we are following on "NEW DAY" which starts right now.