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First Move with Julia Chatterley
Joe Biden to Sign Executive Orders Focusing on the Economy; U.K. Minister Says Government Could Close Borders; Japan Officials Scrambling to Deny Reports that Tokyo Olympic Games may be Canceled. Aired 9-10a ET
Aired January 22, 2021 - 09:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
JULIA CHATTERLEY, CNN BUSINESS ANCHOR: It's Friday. Let's make a move.
Welcome once again to FIRST MOVE. It certainly feels like a Friday and it is and it's another day where it's all about the power of the presidential
President Biden will sign Executive Orders focused on delivering food aid to millions of Americans and a $15.00 an hour minimum wage for Federal
workers and contractors. Executive orders, well, that's the easy part, getting congressional buy in for his $1.9 trillion relief bill is much
Republican Susan Collins, a moderate is the latest senator to question the size of the price tag. Moody's chief economist, Mark Zandi is predicting
just half of this sum will get done. We'll discuss all the details with him shortly. There are encouraging signs though, too, in the U.S. COVID fight.
Dr. Anthony Fauci says cases may be finally plateauing. Hospitalizations, meanwhile, are falling, more than one million Americans are now being
vaccinated each day, but of course, it's the short-term challenges versus the medium to longer term tug of war.
But for now, at least as far as the markets are concerned, those short-term challenges dominate. Stocks seeing further consolidation after a record run
that is reality, too as you can see for much of Europe. New data today showing Eurozone business activity falling to two-month lows, lockdowns
across the continent hitting the services sector increasingly hard.
It's a similar story if we take a look at Asia, too. Hong Kong shares falling more than one and a half percent of reports that tens of thousands
of people there could also soon be placed under lockdown. As we keep saying on the show, you can't fully heal the economy until the control of the
virus is found, and in the absence of that you have to buy the recovery.
Let's get to the drivers because in the coming hours, President Biden as I've mentioned, will sign two new Executive Orders to ease the burden on
struggling Americans. One increases food aid to the most vulnerable such as children reliant on free school meals, the other aims to increase the
minimum wage for Federal workers to $15.00 an hour.
John Harwood joins us now. John, great to have you with us. I do like the way that President Biden has framed this. He has talked about rescue and
then he's talked about recovery and rebuilding.
And when I look at these Executive Orders, these are well and truly about rescue for the most vulnerable in society that are suffering at this
JOHN HARWOOD, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: They are for sure, Julia, although I think we need to be realistic about the impact of these orders.
The order on food aid will make some material difference for some people, recalculating for example, the way food stamp benefits or SNAP, as we call
them, are calculated. That is a formula that hasn't been updated in a while and the updating of the formula, the so-called Thrifty Food Plan, which the
food stamp benefits are based on will raise by a modest amount, maybe 15 percent of what some families get in food aid.
The order on the Federal minimum wage does not raise the Federal minimum wage for contractors. It does begin the process of exploring what Federal
contractors are now paying their workers, trying to figure out what the impact would be if they ultimately do implement that minimum for Federal
contractors. And of course, that's meant to show the way toward a Federal minimum wage nationally for all businesses of $15.00 now, but we're a long
way from those things happening.
These are largely about the President's desire to show some momentum toward his economic goals while he waits for that big rescue package that you've
talked about from Congress.
That's really the key, getting that that package or some facsimile of that package through the Congress to put money directly in the hands of workers
to bolster their unemployment benefits to fund vaccine distribution and get shots into people's arms, which is the key thing to getting the economy
really back on track.
CHATTERLEY: And half of that money, a good chunk of it, at least is money for state and local governments. It's also the $1,400.00 checks, the bump
up to the $600.00 that was agreed back in December, John, contentious issues and despite calls for unity in Congress, it looks like that's
illusory at this stage. This price tag seemingly looking like it's going to come down.
HARWOOD: Yes, it will come down. But I think President Biden is willing to let this process play out a while longer to try to see if he can get 60
votes, meaning, 10 Republican votes for this package. A state local aid you mentioned is critical as you know, for the economic recovery because states
had their revenues hemorrhage as a result of lockdowns during coronavirus and if they don't get some aid, they're going to have to lay off people and
that's going to deepen the economic pain that Americans are feeling.
State local aid is something that Republicans who tend to be the anti- government party have resisted. Joe Biden is putting that squarely on the table. It does have bipartisan support among governors. People like Larry
Hogan of Maryland, who last year was the co-chair of the National Governors Association, he had been calling consistently for that aid.
So, there is some support for it, and I suspect that at the end, President Biden will get some of that aid. Maybe not all of it, but some of it.
CHATTERLEY: Yes, we'll have to see. John, great to have you with us. Thank you so much for that.
To the U.K. now, where the U.K. is considering closing borders to foreign travelers as Britain approaches 95,000 deaths from COVID-19 with fatalities
in the past week, averaging more than 1,000 per day. Only four other nations have recorded more coronavirus deaths. That's according to data
from Johns Hopkins.
Scott McLean joins us now Scott, good to have you with us. We are expecting to hear from the government I believe later today. But what can you tell us
about how seriously they are considering these firmer border closures?
SCOTT MCLEAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, so certainly we'll find out more today when Prime Minister Boris Johnson holds a press conference in just a
couple of hours from now. It's important to remember though, right now, every single person, Julia, who comes into the U.K. from abroad has to not
only be tested negative before they get on their flight, but they also have to quarantine for 10 days once they get here.
This morning, though, a British Cabinet Secretary said on Sky News that the government is considering a plan which would expand border regulations to
essentially bar foreign visitors from coming in at all. All of this is in the name of trying to keep new variants that they are finding abroad from
getting into the U.K. because remember, this country is already dealing with its own mutated strain of the virus that spreads more easily. And so
the last thing that they need here is something that either spreads even easier or is even resistant to a vaccine.
The good news though is that a new preprint study out of the U.K. this week showed that just added to the growing pile of evidence really that suggests
that these vaccines will in fact be effective even on this mutated U.K. variant of the virus. This study looked particularly at the Pfizer-BioNTech
vaccine and found that it was effective though a little bit less, so in those 80-plus, though, I did speak with the author by phone yesterday who
said that that should not be alarming because virus effectiveness generally starts to wane a little bit as we get into our later years -- Julia.
CHATTERLEY: Yes. And I will say that variant identified in the U.K., there will be viewers watching this going, hang on a second, it didn't
necessarily come from the U.K.
Scott, talk to me about the situation there because there is debate about the relative number of lives lost, about the number of cases, about the
hospitalizations. What is the U.K. scene? What can you tell me about the data?
MCLEAN: Yes, you really have to strain a little bit to find signs that things are getting better here, Julia. As you mentioned in your intro, well
over a thousand people are dying on average per day from COVID-19. You still have hospitals that are jam-packed, and you also have this study that
suggests that, at best, the infection rate is actually remaining flat.
That contradicts the government's data, which seems to show infections going down though the government only actually tests people who have
coronavirus symptoms. This study tested almost 150,000 people randomly selected from across the country earlier this month.
Now, London is the worst affected area in the country. The head of the National Health Service in London said that while ICUs are undoubtedly
filling up, the beds that have patients in acute care or the regular beds, or even just emergency calls in general are starting to drop. So that is
the glimmer of hope here that we're seeing.
The government though is also trying to get tougher with new fines on people who attend large gatherings just to try to do everything it can to
try to halt this new variant. Here's what the head of the health service in London said about those people. Listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DR. VIN DIWAKAR, REGIONAL MEDICAL DIRECTOR FOR LONDON, N.H.S. ENGLAND: This is the biggest health emergency to face this country since the Second World
War. For me and for my colleagues in the N.H.S., breaking the rules in the way that's been described today is like switching on our lights in the
middle of a blackout in the blitz.
It doesn't just put you at risk in your house, it puts your whole streets and the whole of your community at risk.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MCLEAN: So Julia, those fines that are being proposed actually total more than a thousand U.S. dollars equivalent. They won't come into effect until
Monday. That is too late to do anything about the 400 or so people who attended an Ultra-Orthodox Jewish wedding in London just yesterday.
Police said that many people fled when officers showed up. Leaders in the Jewish community in London were quick to condemn that wedding. Only a
handful of people though were actually fined in that case -- Julia.
CHATTERLEY: Yes, I'm all in favor of fines. We heard from Taiwan right early on in the crisis using monster fines to get people to stay-at-home
and to quarantine.
CHATTERLEY: Yes, I'm all for it. But you have to support them if they can't go to work, too. Scott, great to have you with us. Thank you, Scott McLean.
And later this hour, we'll be talking about how well the vaccines are being rolled out in the U.K. and lessons that are being learned, so don't miss
To Japan now where Olympic officials are scrambling to deny reports that the Tokyo Olympic Games may be canceled. The International Olympic
Committee tells CNN the story is quote, "categorically untrue."
Selina Wang joins us now from Tokyo. Selina, great to have you with us. I have to say it feels like a bit of a reality check when we look at what's
going on not only around the world, but of course in Japan, too. What more do we know?
SELINA WANG, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Julia, that's right. That strong reaction we heard was in response to a "Times" of London report stating that the
Japanese government has privately concluded that the Olympic Games will have to be canceled this year. This is according to a senior Japanese
government official. This person was unnamed.
Now in response, we saw an aggressive rebuttal from the Japanese government, the Prime Minister reaffirming that he is committed to hosting
these games. So at least publicly, there is this unwavering confidence that the games will go ahead.
But as you say, the reality is grim here. Tokyo is in a state of emergency. Japan is dealing with a severe surge in COVID-19 cases. Foreigners are
currently banned from coming into Japan, not to mention Japan is behind many countries in the vaccine rollout, not expected to even start until
I also spoke to the longest serving member of the IOC, Dick Pound who told me he is not a hundred percent sure these games will go on as planned.
Furthermore, there is growing public opposition here.
Nearly 80 percent of people in Japan now think these games should be canceled or further postponed. That's according to a recent survey by
national broadcaster, NHK. And Julia, when I'm speaking to people on the ground here, they largely feel that there is of course, hope that the games
will go on, but it's not very realistic at this point.
CHATTERLEY: Yes, it's fascinating, isn't it? The fear of bringing the virus in, you have to wonder what the athletes involved are also thinking at this
stage, too, despite all the planning that they've done. As planned was the key phrase there. What might the games look like if they do end up taking
WANG: Well, if these games do actually end up moving forward, they will look nothing like we've seen before. There are still many questions that
remain unanswered. Specifically, can international fans come? Can any fans come at all?
The officials have said that they will make that decision by the springtime. We so far also know that the opening and closing ceremonies are
going to be simplified. They're going to be pared back, athletes are going to be asked to limit their mixing and mingling in the Olympic Village,
athletes will also be asked to come and leave within a specific window around their competition time. So really trying to enforce these COVID
precautions in social distancing.
But I just want to re-emphasize again that if these games are actually canceled, this would be a sort of catastrophic scenario for Japan from an
economic perspective and from loss of face.
Japan has already sunk more than $25 billion into preparing for these games and Japan wants to be the first country to host the Olympics after the
coronavirus pandemic. The Prime Minister has said that he hopes Japan can host the Olympics to show the world humanity's victory over the pandemic.
The question is, we're probably not going to get to that point in time -- Julia.
CHATTERLEY: Yes, beacon of light for all, but time is slipping away. Selina Wang, great to have you with us there in Tokyo. Thank you.
All right, still to come here on FIRST MOVE, build back better. President Biden wants to realize his campaign slogan, it is going to need to get the
country's manufacturers on board. We've got the head of the National Industry Group on with his next talk about what that's going to take.
And high velocity vaccinations. The U.K. approved a vaccine first and its rollout is fast. We're joined by one of the architects of the country's
strategy. Stay with us.
CHATTERLEY: Welcome back to FIRST MOVE live from New York where U.S. stocks look set to take a Biden breather. A lower open it seems after the S&P and
the NASDAQ closed at record highs yesterday. IBM not helping here. The big blue set to fall some eight percent after reporting a fourth consecutive
quarterly revenue drop. Weak sales in the company's all-important Cloud division a problem, too.
However, some clouds may be clearing for the Biden economic team. The Senate could confirm Janet Yellen as Treasury Secretary today. Yellen, of
course made a full-throated plea for the President's $1.9 trillion emergency aid plan during her confirmation hearings Tuesday. The President
hoped to win bipartisan support for the bill, but unity on stimulus at least remains elusive.
Mark Zandi joins us now. He is the Chief Economist at Moody's Analytics. Mark, great to have you with us. You think around half gets done?
MARK ZANDI, CHIEF ECONOMIST, MOODY'S ANALYTICS: Yes, I do. $1.9 trillion is a very large package and given that the Senate is still very evenly split,
I mean, it favors the Democrats, but it's about as -- it is as even as it possibly can get. I think it'll be difficult to get that full package
So, I'm expecting something about half that size, which would still be sizable still. I think it would go a long way to helping the economy get to
the other side of the pandemic. So, it would do a lot of good, but $1.9 trillion is probably a bridge too far.
CHATTERLEY: I mean, on top of the $900 billion that they managed to agree as well in December, so we have to add that in. The fact is, though, and
you did the analysis on what that $1.9 trillion could do for the U.S. economy and it was pretty astonishing to me, eight percent real GDP growth
this year, four percent potentially or near to GDP growth next year, and actually, around seven and a half million of the 10 million jobs that
remain down in the U.S. economy since the pandemic began could also be recovered this year. I mean, that would be an astonishing recovery.
ZANDI: Yes, that would be fantastic. I mean, I do think, ultimately, we do need a lot more fiscal support. So let's just say we get half the $1.9
trillion in this next package. I do expect the Biden administration to come back later this summer or fall with another package, that one will be a bit
different. Hopefully, we're on the other side of the pandemic and that'll be not just about relief, but that will be about getting the economy back
to full employment, getting those jobs back, getting unemployment back down closer to four percent.
And if we get all of that, and I think that we have a fighting shot to do that, then yes, I think this economy can come roaring back and I think we
can get back to a place we all feel pretty good about by let's say the end of 2022, early 2023, a couple of years from now.
CHATTERLEY: Wow. But we're still talking years, of course. I like the way the President did this, too. He talked about rescue and then recovery.
There's two separate things here. There's trying to hold up those that have been most impacted by the pandemic and then there's how do we rebuild and
rebuild better and tackle some of the inequalities?
CHATTERLEY: On the rescue side, you've looked at effective bang for buck in terms of where you put the money, and then it has the most impact and
nutritional assistance, unemployment insurance. These have some of the greatest impact, I'm assuming because they get spent, they get used.
ZANDI: Yes, Julia, that's exactly right. They have the biggest bang for the buck, because they go to the folks that are most distressed, you know,
folks that are unemployed, people are having a hard time putting food on their family's tables. People who face eviction from their homes, because
they haven't been able to make rent payments.
So getting money to those people is particularly efficacious, really. They have -- they need it. As soon as they get the check, they're going to go
out and they're going to use it because they have no other choice.
CHATTERLEY: And right up there, aid to state and local governments, which we know is a contentious point, and one of the things that you're saying
actually may be lost, at least in the first part of this package if they do break it down into two pieces.
Surely, that's going to impact things like vaccine rollout, as well, and how quickly we bring these jobs back. It's some self-harm.
ZANDI: Yes, I mean, aid to state and local governments that's very tried and true fiscal support, we do this every recession, because as you know,
state and local governments have budget constraints. They're not able to go out and borrow money to fund their daily operations. So they have no choice
if revenues are down, and they're obviously down because the pandemic, they have to cut jobs, and that's teachers and fire and police, emergency
responders, folks, we need at any time, but particularly in a crisis.
They cut programs, they cut services, and you know, these are, again to folks that are under a lot of distress. So helping state and local
governments is very, very important, but very politically contentious, as you know. There's a great deal of pushback, particularly from Republican
So politically, that's going to be tough to get through. I think they'll get some of it through, but not nearly as much as they are hoping to get
through, at least what they propose.
CHATTERLEY: So we're not going to get our eight percent real GDP growth this year if we don't get it done. What's your base case, Mark?
ZANDI: Well, I do expect we'll get it -- if it be a good year, of course, I'm assuming that the vaccination rollout does kick into a higher gear
here. I think with President Biden focused on this and putting more resources to it. He's got good people running the rollout. Now, I think we
should be able to vaccinate at least half the American population as we get to Memorial Day, early summer.
If we stick to that script and we do get that fiscal rescue and support that I'm anticipating, I expect we'll get GDP growth this year, about five
percent about the same next year, and we'll get back to full employment. That's four percent-ish unemployment rate by early 2023.
So it's a long road ahead, Julia. But fortunately, we're going down that road now and at a much faster pace than we were, you know, just a couple of
CHATTERLEY: Yes, we need to make a concerted effort. Mark, great to have you with us. Mark Zandi, the Chief Economist at Moody's Analytics.
Now, exactly to Mark's point there, Dr. Anthony Fauci, the Chief Medical Adviser to President Biden told CNN he believes the U.S. will do better
than the President's goal of 100 million vaccinations in 100 days.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DR. ANTHONY FAUCI, DIRECTOR, NATIONAL INSTITUTE OF ALLERGY AND INFECTIOUS DISEASES: You know, I mean, obviously, you want to do as best as you
possibly can. I'd like it to be a lot more. The goal was set, but you don't want to get fixated on: was that an under shoot or an overshoot? You go for
100 million over a hundred days. If we do better than that, which I personally think we likely will, then great.
I just don't want to get fixated because I saw that yesterday, there was that back and forth between that. We're just going to go for it for as much
as you possibly can. When you set a goal, if you do better than the goal. That's terrific. I hope we do.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CHATTERLEY: CNN senior medical correspondent, Elizabeth Cohen joins us now. Great to have you with us. I do feel this is the art of expectation
I was looking at some of the numbers and I believe, the U.S. averaged 940,000 vaccinations per day last week. So this does look unambitious. I
don't think that's a word, lacking in ambition, there we go, compared to what we're already doing. Friday.
ELIZABETH COHEN, CNN SENIOR MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, I think that there probably are discussions in the Biden administration, gee, do we sort of
shoot for the moon here and maybe fall short, or do we kind of name a number that we think is relatively easy to do and go beyond it? I think
those conversations are happening, but I think as Dr. Fauci said, the main thing here is just to do as many as you possibly can.
And obviously, the U.S. needs to ramp up. There have been problems with -- not with getting the vaccine where it needs to be, but some vaccine is
frankly kind of sitting around getting those shots into arms.
COHEN: The other piece of that is manufacturing. There -- you know this is a tough vaccine to manufacture. This is not sort of your normal vaccine,
and there's a lot of nitty-gritty details that the Biden ministration needs to delve into to make sure that manufacturing ramps up -- Julia.
CHATTERLEY: Yes. I mean, there's supplies. There's actually distributing the vaccines and then getting them into people's arms. There's also
willingness to accept the vaccine. Fascinating to see some data from Walgreens this morning saying that up to 80 percent of long-term care
facility workers have declined the vaccine.
Elizabeth, what can you tell us about this?
COHEN: That's right, Julia. Julia of all the steps you just named, making the vaccine, getting it out. The hardest part, I think, is going to be this
vaccine hesitancy. I mean, if we just take these long term care facility, these nursing home workers, as a snapshot, as a microcosm of American
society or a certain sector of American society, if up to 80 percent of them are saying, no, that's really a problem. That means that we need a
good vaccine education program.
You need people talking about why this is good, why it's safe, and get trusted voices in various communities to talk about it. And you know,
Julia, you and I have been talking about this really since last spring. It's been well known. Chelsea Clinton has talked about this. Others have
talked about it, and it never quite happened.
There is one that is in the planning stages, and hopefully that will get out soon and hopefully that will help.
CHATTERLEY: Yes, there's a great deal of skepticism. You have to wonder whether as they see more and more people get vaccinated as time passes,
they get a little bit more comfortable with a lack of side effects perhaps that these people will come on board, but it isn't getting more vulnerable
than that, and still people are choosing not to take it.
Elizabeth Cohen, great to have you with us. Thank you.
All right, the market open is next. Stay with us.
CHATTERLEY: Welcome back to FIRST MOVE. U.S. stocks are up and running for the last trading day of the week and as expected, a softer open and the
concerns over Washington's stimulus stall. We've heard that once or twice before. It's looking increasingly likely that the Biden team will have to
scale back its emergency aid plans in the face of Republican resistance.
We should hear more about stimulus chances later in the day when senators meet to vote on Janet Yellen's nomination as Treasury Secretary and now,
the risk of mood reflected in the oil markets, too.
I'm just taking a look. Both Brent and U.S. crude down by more than two percent. Bond yields also a little bit softer as well. Weak numbers from
the year of its own show the extent of the global economic crisis. Business activity there, the index falling to a two-month low. Manufacturing
activity actually fell to its weakest level in seven months.
Now, the U.S. National Association of Manufacturers has welcomed President Biden calling it a time for healing. The industry group represents 30
million U.S. jobs across 15,000 companies and calls on the President to focus on U.S. jobs, on wages and investment.
Joining us now is Jay Timmons, President and CEO of the National Association of Manufacturers. Jay, great to have you with us. How can the
manufacturing sector help promote this healing?
JAY TIMMONS, PRESIDENT AND CEO, NATIONAL ASSOCIATION OF MANUFACTURERS: Well, first and foremost, we are laser focused like the Biden
administration on literally healing our country through a very aggressive response to the COVID pandemic, something we have not seen here in this
country for the last year.
And we're very excited to work in partnership with the Biden administration to get this under control. So, you think about what manufacturers
contribute to the effort. We make the PPE. We make the medical supplies. We are certainly manufacturing the vaccines and all of the components that go
Now our job is to work with the administration to get shots in arms, so we can get this under control, and we've been actually working directly with
them since the day they were declared the victor of the presidential contest.
So, we look forward to continuing that partnership.
CHATTERLEY: Jay, would use of the Defense Production Act here to coordinate that response and a greater control I think at the Federal level, rather
than it just being a greater responsibility for the state's help, even at this moment.
TIMMONS: So, we've been disappointed over the past several months that there has not been a coordinated effort, including no plan for distribution
of the vaccine as we've seen. That is certainly getting under control now under the leadership of Jeffrey Zients, who we're very pleased is heading
up the COVID response.
The Defense Production Act, which you referenced, is something that can be used to create a partnership between the private sector and the government
to deal with really critical issues. You know, we are the arsenal of democracy, manufacturing is. We are now the arsenal of health in the United
Through a strategic and cooperative use of the Defense Production Act, we can ramp up production of PPE and medical supplies and the vaccine. And so
we look forward to working with the Biden administration doing exactly that. And we've spoken to them, and their goal, of course, is to expand the
availability of all of those things, but they want to do so in a way that is cooperative.
Rather than using DPA as a weapon, which we saw over the past year, we need to use it in a cooperative way that benefits manufacturing and benefits the
people of this country.
CHATTERLEY: But just to be clear, Jay, you can already see that vaccine distribution is going to be improved as a result of the positioning, the
conversations that are already being had.
TIMMONS: Absolutely. I mean, let's face it, it was a low bar. Right? So we've been very -- we've been very pleased with the work of the new
administration. I mean, they've only been there for 36 hours and they have ramped up the focus on distribution of the vaccine and getting shots in
arms as quickly as possible.
It really is a new day for America, and I think we can all feel very, very confident that this administration has a plan or will be rolling out a plan
to get this done in a very expeditious manner. It's the only way we're going to heal this country, as Dr. Fauci said yesterday, and so we're
working as hard as we can as manufacturers alongside the Biden administration to get it done.
CHATTERLEY: Jay, it has been an incredibly challenging time as manufacturers across the country have battled with demand issues. We
already had the situation with tariffs, of course, with Chinese goods, in particular.
The President this morning signing an Executive Order to try and lift the minimum wage for Federal workers and for contractors or at least laying the
path. But he has talked about having a national minimum wage of $15.00. It's currently $7.25. What impact would that have on the manufacturing
sector? And particularly the smaller businesses, can they afford a $15.00 minimum wage even if workers need it?
TIMMONS: So that's a great question, Julia, because it really depends on where you are in this country and what the standard of living is. So for
manufacturers overall, I mean, quite candidly, our wage base is usually much, much higher than what the President and others are proposing for a
standard Federal minimum wage.
But I think the real question is, how does it affect the broader economy? So for instance, I'm from the Midwest, what might be applicable in the
Midwest for a higher standard of living may be completely different in, say, Northern California.
So I think as the administration rolls out their plan for a minimum wage, I think they have to be very careful to take into account the differences in
various areas of our country so that they don't have unintended consequences that do as you kind of suggest, could actually cost jobs in
the long run.
We need to do this or they need to do this in a very smart and strategic way so that they don't harm business's ability to grow and compete in this
CHATTERLEY: So not in favor of a Federal $15.00 minimum wage, Jay, just to be clear.
TIMMONS: Well, I'd like to see what the plan -- look again, I understand all of the pressures on a new administration, they've been in office 36
hours. Let's just see what they plan to roll out. Let's see if they have differentiation between various economic zones in this country.
I'd like to see what their thoughts are. I don't think it's fair at this point to judge something that hasn't been proposed.
CHATTERLEY: I like the idea that President Biden has brought -- that is building back better, stronger. From a manufacturing perspective, what's
critical here? Because again, manufacturers in this country have had to deal with a shift in digitization, e-commerce. Is that part of what would
help and be instrumental in helping short term 5G infrastructure? What would you like to see, Jay?
TIMMONS: Well, infrastructure is clearly a priority for the National Association of Manufacturers. It's been something that we've been pushing
for many years. Our building to win proposal lays out how we can create jobs and how we can improve the United States through a very targeted and
robust investment in infrastructure.
You bring up 5G, clearly, for manufacturers we have -- we are grappling with the digitization of our processes, and manufacturing 4.0. We need that
type of investment in America. But we also need kind of traditional investment.
But President Biden, I think, is trying to model his administration after the Roosevelt administration, because of all the many crises we find
ourselves dealing with. Think about what the Roosevelt administration was able to do with the WPA programs and kind of that beginning, it didn't
happen until the Eisenhower administration, but the beginning of a national network of transportation with 55,000 bridges in this country that are
structurally deficient. That's not the America that I think we think of as the strong and resilient country that we all love.
So we need to really get serious about this and we've got a very strong proposal in place. We look forward to working with the Biden administration
to enact as many of those proposals as we can.
CHATTERLEY: It's such a great point. Infrastructure spending doesn't have to be new builds. That's complicated. It can upgrade the infrastructure
that we already have. And it's so important.
Jay Timmons, great to have you with us, sir. Thank you. The President and the CEO of the National Association of Manufacturers.
All right, after the break, ambitious targets to vaccinate the most vulnerable in Britain. A key figures in the battle is next, don't go away.
CHATTERLEY: Welcome back to FIRST MOVE. In Britain, cinemas like this one and mosques are being converted into vaccination centers. The target is to
vaccinate 14 million people by the middle of February.
But just bear in mind, the U.K. population is nearly 67 million people. So far, around eight in 100 have had a shot.
Professor Anthony Harnden is Deputy Chair of the Joint Committee on Vaccination and Immunization in the U.K. and joins us now. Professor,
fantastic to have you on the show. It's clearly a government target, how confident are you based on what you're seeing that that target will be met?
ANTHONY HARNDEN, DEPUTY CHAIR OF THE JOINT COMMITTEE ON VACCINATION AND IMMUNIZATION IN THE U.K.: Well, I think this is a monumentous national
effort in the U.K. We made a really, really good start.
We've immunized five million individuals in the at-risk groups with their first dose of the vaccine. The Prime Minister set a target of us immunizing
all four top priority groups by mid-February, which is 13 million people. And it also, of course includes those that are most vulnerable and those
that are most at risk.
So our first four priority groups which are basically the over 70s, care home residents, frontline healthcare and social care workers include about
88 percent of all hospitalizations and deaths in the U.K. So if we can get to this target group by mid-February, then we will start to see in the
weeks to come after that, and of course the immunization doesn't kick in for a couple of days, we would start to see a sharp fall offs in deaths and
hospitalizations in the U.K.
So I am very optimistic.
CHATTERLEY: What's the greatest challenge that you're facing at this moment when you look at trying to get people in? As you said, you're basically at
this stage and the decision has been made by the government to give vaccinations to those most at risk of dying. What's been the greatest
challenge so far?
HARNDEN: Well, of course, one has to remember that these are elder -- very elderly population, a lot of them that we are immunizing at the moment. So
there are challenges. There's been initial challenges with the Pfizer- BioNTech vaccine, which had difficult transport and storage difficulties. And so we weren't able to get that out as quickly as we would like to, to
care home residents and their carers who have been disproportionately affected by this pandemic.
But actually, when the AstraZeneca vaccine came online, we were able to reach those care homes and reached those elderly house bound, and of
course, as we move down the cohorts in terms of age, it becomes a little bit easier because people are more mobile, they can get to the city easily
and be immunized.
And so the whole thing becomes a little bit easier the further we go.
HARNDEN: And of course, the other thing is like with any mass immunization program like this with a massive logistical exercise, you get better as you
go along with it. And, you know, as the weeks roll on, we're getting better at delivering these immunizations.
The teams are becoming more familiar with it, the routine -- capacities increase, the governments are working hard at increasing mass vaccination
centers. So capacity is increased there. The whole supply chains become a little bit smoother.
So everything should work better, the more experience we get at it. But I think it's been a great start.
CHATTERLEY: Professor Harnden, how concerned are you about using this vaccination or for people that may be watching in the U.K. and saying, with
this variant that's been identified in the U.K., is this vaccine still okay, even if it's a little bit efficacious? And the other question I think
that people are having and it's being talked about sort of behind the scenes is, is it okay for someone to get perhaps a shot of Moderna vaccine,
and a shot of a Pfizer vaccine and combine the two? Where do you stand on both of these things?
HARNDEN: Well, let me take the questions in sequence. The question about variant. From the data that we've looked at so far and tested on it, it is
very early. The fact that the vaccines that we've delivered so far seem to be protected against the variant strains, which are circulating in the U.K.
at the moment.
Of course, that doesn't mean to say we shouldn't be cautious about this, because certainly, the Brazilian-Amazonian strain and the South African
strain are different varieties all together, and have no information on whether they will be susceptible to the vaccine at the moment.
So we are very cautious about that. But we're confident that with the strains circulating in the U.K. at the moment, they are sensitive to these
Now, the second question is an interesting question, we at the JCVI have given a very strong steer that you should receive the same vaccine for the
second dose as the first dose. However, there may be exceptional circumstances where that vaccine isn't available, or for whatever reason,
the individual can't get hold of it, in which case, it's better to have a second vaccine of a different type than no vaccine at all.
Now, there are studies going on in the U.K. at the moment about mixed vaccine schedules. Theoretically, there should be no reason why you
couldn't mix these vaccines because even though the Moderna and the Pfizer vaccines are a different technology than the Oxford-AstraZeneca vaccine,
they all act against the spike protein inducing immunity against the spike protein of the virus.
So there seems to be no theoretical reason why you can't mix. But our advice at the moment, until we get further information would be to keep to
the same vaccine type for the second dose as the first dose wherever possible.
CHATTERLEY: Professor Harnden, I'm going to put you on the spot. And I apologize for this, but just based on your knowledge and understanding,
which is clearly far greater than most of ours. There's been a discussion as well about the possibility of closing the borders, due to concerns about
some of these variants.
And as you mentioned, we don't have the data yet, the science to understand whether these vaccines are efficacious enough on Brazilian and South
African identified variants. Based on that, would you be in favor of closing the borders to protect the British people?
HARNDEN: Well, clearly, that's a political decision outside my pay grade.
CHATTERLEY: From your point of view of the science --
HARNDEN: But, you know, these viruses are a live threat, these -- and we will -- the Brazilian and the South African viruses will not be the only
new variants we see. This virus mutates quite quickly, and we will see new variants emerging all over the world, I suspect.
And so we'll have to get used to this to actually -- used to new variants - - and how we deal with them and how we deal with them and the vaccination process. Maybe, in the future that we do have to edit these vaccines or
tweak them a little bit so that they became -- so that the new variants are susceptible to the protection from the vaccination.
And it may be that actually we're looking to live in a world where we have to have an annual coronavirus vaccination, which is edited to the type of
the variant strains which is predominant within the world at that time, much as we do with the influenza immunization each year.
So yes, these viruses at the moment are a real danger and until we get our population vaccinated, we will be in a much, much better position. I think
that we need to be very, very cautious as a country about potential transmission from these other parts of the world.
CHATTERLEY: Yes, Professor Anthony Harnden, thank you so much for joining us. And we look forward to talking to you soon. Thank you for the work that
you're doing, too.
All right, we're going to take a break here. Coming up on FIRST MOVE, semiconductor giant, Intel reporting record annual sales, but why do some
investors continue to worry? That's next.
CHATTERLEY: Welcome back to the show. Shares of Intel are lower after its incoming CEO's comments on chip production. Pat Gelsinger said that by
2023, the majority of Intel's products will still be manufactured internally. The company is slowly moving away from making all its chips in-
house as well as designing them.
Intel was forced to rush out its quarterly results yesterday after potentially unauthorized access to its earnings report.
Paul La Monica joins us now. That's always uncomfortable, Paul, so we can talk about that. But I feel like the financials here and they beat on the
top and bottom lines belie what's been an incredibly challenging year whether it's sort of Apple dumping them for their chips or being pushed by
activists. It's been a tough one.
PAUL LA MONICA, CNN BUSINESS REPORTER: Yes, Intel obviously has had a challenging 2020 and I think that was the reason why the company pushed Bob
Swan who hasn't been CEO for that long to retire and have now brought in Pat Gelsinger, formerly of VMWare and also an ex-Intel executive as well,
to return to Intel and try and restore this company to its former glory.
Intel clearly is facing a challenge from smaller rivals that aren't that much smaller. I mean, NVIDIA now has a market value that's worth more than
Intel, and AMD has done a phenomenal job of increasing its market share under the leadership of Lisa Su as CEO. So I really think that Intel is
going to try and do everything it can to get back in the good graces of Wall Street, as well as customers who are increasingly finding that other
chips are just as attractive, if not more so with their products.
CHATTERLEY: And that's the challenge. I mean, the CEO also said, look, we're a national asset crucial for the United States at a time when we've
seen chip making shift to Asia as well. But the problem is the competition here whether it's NVIDIA or AMD is incredibly fierce. So where do you
LA MONICA: Yes, exactly. I think that Intel can only play the National Security card for so long, especially now that we're in a different
political environment where we presumably will have a little bit less of a toxic relationship with China, for example. So I think that there will be
more pressure from activists, from other shareholders for Intel to ship some of its production to Chinese chip manufacturers because it will cut
costs, make things more efficient for Intel and obviously they need that shot in the arm because you just look at Intel stock over the past couple
of years versus AMD and NVIDIA and that's the bottom line, what investors care about.
AMD and NVIDIA have done much better than Intel. If they had been, then Bob Swan would still be CEO.
CHATTERLEY: Yes, we wouldn't have had a Swan song. The PC business of course, is sort of supported in this year in light of COVID. But it's a
lower margin business as well. So yes, plenty of challenges. At least the incoming CEO I mean, he was there for three decades, I think, so he knows
LA MONICA: Exactly. And yes, like I was about to say, they definitely are more in mobile, which they're trying to do, but I think they just need to
be become an even bigger player in the mobile device market.
CHATTERLEY: Absolutely. Paul La Monica, thank you so much for that.
All right, that's it for the show. Keep on watching FIRST MOVE. I'm Julia Chatterley. Stay safe. Have a great weekend, and we'll see you next week.