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First Move with Julia Chatterley

Senate Panel: Credit Suisse still helping Ultra-Wealthy Americans Evade Taxes; King Charles Arrives in Germany for First State Visit; Lyft's new CEO Plans Fight back in Tough Ride-Hailing Market; Impact of Strikes Plague European Airlines; Chipper Cash CEO: Exposure to SVB Collapse was Insignificant; King Charles in Germany for First State Visit. Aired 9-10a ET

Aired March 29, 2023 - 09:00   ET



JULIA CHATTERLEY, CNNI HOST: A warm welcome to "First Move", great to have you with us this Wednesday and what a week so far? Congress probing the

Silicon Valley Bank collapse caused lawmakers blaming bank management and regulatory flaws.

Taiwan's President visits North America giving China more diplomatic pause and attack triumph Valley Beavers six weeks split gets investors applause.

Meanwhile, global stocks are higher after Tuesday's snores that mean no change. U.S. futures in the meantime, higher and Europe as you can see in

the green too.

The CAC are on over in France, the outperformer, UBS is contributing though to sentiment after announcing the return. A former CEO Sergio Ermotti he

presided over UBS his own crisis recovery after the rogue trader scandal if you remember back in 2011, and he is now going to be the man to oversee the

Credit Suisse consolidation.

But of course beware the ghost of Credit Suisse scandals of the past. A new U.S. Senate report says the firm continues to help wealthy investors evade

taxes. The very latest on that report just ahead. Chinese tech out on top in Asia in the meantime, after the Ali Baba split announcement with the

HANG SENG jumping more than 2 percent.

Lots of talk over whether a less imposing sizable Alibaba will become a less enticing Chinese regulatory target also, as we discussed on the show

yesterday might and Alibaba breakup trigger and Ant Group IPO makeup. The Chinese government has already given tentative approval for the offering

after putting the kibosh on it more than two years ago.

Alibaba, of course owns more than 30 percent of Ant financial. Now from FinTech to fin put in check, hearings into the recent U.S. bank failures

continues today in Washington, D.C. Fed Vice Chair Michael Bob bashing Silicon Valley Bank Officials Tuesday, calling the collapse of the

institution a textbook case of mismanagement.

Though, admittedly, he also came under fire himself. We've got all the details coming up and later in the program. We'll talk with the CEO of

payment firm Chipper Cash about the new reality for tech startups in a tighter lending environment. The Capital Management arm of Silicon Valley

Bank is also an investor in Chipper.

So plenty to talk about on that but first, off the shotgun wedding of UBS and Credit Suisse, UBS is getting engaged again, this time with an old

flame Former CEO Sergio Ermotti will take over the reins of the bank again next month. The bank said its current CEO Ralph Hamers agreed to step down

to serve the interests of the new combination the Swiss financial sector, and the nation.

But the problems keep piling up for Credit Suisse. And as I mentioned in the last few hours, a U.S. Senate Finance Committee investigation has

concluded the Swiss bank is complicit in ongoing tax evasion by super wealthy Americans. Clare Sebastian joins us on this.

Clare, this was something that we learned, I think from bank consolidation during the financial crisis that you can absorb a bank but you also have to

absorb their legal liabilities along with it. What more do we know about this investigation and the potential consequences for Credit Suisse and

therefore UBS?

CLARE SEBASTIAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes and unfortunate welcome back to the job whether he officially starts next month for Sergio Ermotti. This

relates to a plea deal, a guilty plea that Credit Suisse made in 2014, pleading guilty essentially, to helping wealthy Americans evade taxes by

hiding their wealth overseas.

The plea deal meant that they could keep the U.S. banking license, but this two-year investigation by the Senate committee found that essentially they

have kept doing it to the tune they say of around $700 million, found in undeclared accounts including 100 million.

And what they say is an ongoing, previously unknown and potentially criminal conspiracy involving the failure to disclose nearly 100 million

owned by one family in secret offshore accounts and Senator Ron Wyden, who leads this committee, did not pull his punches.

Look at this he says, "At the center of this investigation are greedy Swiss bankers and cat-nipping government regulators, and the result appears to be

a massive ongoing conspiracy to help ultra-wealthy U.S. citizens to evade taxes and rip off their fellow Americans."

They also say that this was because of lax oversight; he says cat-nipping government regulators lax oversight by the Department of Justice. Credit

Suisse, though says that it is cooperating with the U.S. authorities its policy is to close undeclared accounts when they are discovered.

But of course, this does mean that Credit Suisse, which has now to be swallowed up by the end of the year by UBS. They will assume this liability

as well.


We don't yet know exactly what kind of penalties they could face over this. But as I say they are cooperating with the U.S. authorities, Julia.

CHATTERLEY: Yes, just quite frankly, add it to the list. Clare at this stage for Sergio Ermotti, but he did guide the bank for what nine years

from 2011 to 2020 understands what rebuilding culture, I think requires and was very successful at UBS. I think is perceived to be a safe pair of hands

and oh, boy, do they need some?

SEBASTIAN: Yes, I mean, I think the most striking comments that came out of the Press Conference that they held today came from the Chairman of UBS

Colm Kelleher said, look, this isn't about whether Ralph Hamers the currency Euro can do a good job, they then he could get the job done.

This is about finding the very best person for this because of the scale of the task at hand. He said this isn't just the biggest transaction of its

kind since 2008. This is bigger even than what we saw back then. This is two of the world's biggest banks combining.

He said that this involves really sort of an unprecedented amount of financial engineering, which comes with he said, significant execution

risk. I think it's telling, the statement says that Ralph Hamers is stepping down not just for the good of the company, but for the good of the


That is how they view this and Sergio Ermotti for his part thing that he felt that he had a duty to take this on, Julia. So that is really why a

couple of weeks or even less into looking at this deal they are realizing just the scale of the task at hand.

CHATTERLEY: Yes, not the end of this conversation certainly. Clare Sebastian, thank you for that. Now, new tensions over Taiwan, China voicing

concern is the Taiwanese President Tsai Ing-wen heads to New York.


MAO NING, CHINESE FOREIGN AFFAIRS MINISTRY SPOKESPERSON: It is not the Chinese side that overreacts, but the U.S. side that keeps conniving to

support Taiwan independence separatist forces.


CHATTERLEY: And just to be clear, the President will merely transit through New York before heading to Central America for diplomatic talks. She is

however, scheduled to meet with U.S. House Speaker Kevin McCarthy in Los Angeles, on her way back to Taiwan.

Marc Stewart joins us on this. Marc, you and I often talk about the optics of this. I do sort of feel some meringue here in the same way that

President Xi went to Russia and said, look, we're not going to be influenced by other nations views on how we behave feels like similar

treatment from the Taiwanese President too.

MARC STEWART, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Indeed, Julia, there's no question that Taiwan operates as an independent actor it always does what it wants to do,

at least in most cases. Yet, there is still some caution over this transpacific trip, if you will. For example, Taiwan has not acknowledged or

confirmed that any kind of meeting will take place between President Xi and House Speaker Kevin McCarthy.

In addition, a lot of caution is being used in in language not to describe this potential meeting as an official diplomatic visit or an official visit

because the U.S. and Taiwan do not have diplomatic ties as we see in the global arena. Yet there is a lot of conversation. It's coming from Beijing,

as you just reported, but also from Taiwan. Take a listen to President Tsai speaking from Taipei in anticipation of this trip.


TSAI ING-WEN, PRESIDENT OF TAIWAN: External pressure won't stop our determination from moving towards the international society. We're calm,

confident, uncompromising and unprovoked.


STEWART: It is not this trip; it is not only this trip to North America that is making news, which again, has been described as a transit point.

The President's trip to Central America is also very significant. There will be meetings with a number of nations in Central America, because

Taiwan clearly feels a need to have allies around the world.

And Julia, we can't dismiss what happened last week when Honduras cut ties with Taiwan, and instead created a relationship with Beijing. So there's no

question. It's a very fragile; it's a fragile moment with the rest of the world looking at Asia.

CHATTERLEY: Yes, a fragile moment among many. Marc Stewart, thank you so much for that. I want to speak with him Ukrainian President Zelenskyy

inviting Chinese leader Xi Jinping to visit his country for talks. Those comments made during an interview with the Associated Press.

Just last week, Xi made a state visit to Russia as I just mentioned meeting with Vladimir Putin. And in the meantime, the Head of Russia's Wagner

mercenary group admitting the battle in Bakhmut has quote, "Battered" his military group. Ben Wedeman joins us from Eastern Ukraine.

Ben, I want to start there actually because the Head or the Chief of the Wagner group saying and talking about the symbolism of that fight in

Bakhmut and the important historical role that his group is playing. Sort of echoing what President Zelenskyy said about the importance of this

spackle for what comes next.


BEN WEDEMAN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, certainly both sides that Julia has invested a lot in terms of blood into this battle

that's been going on for seven months. Now, yesterday, the Head of Ukrainian land forces said that their tactic in Bakhmut is to try to

destroy as much as the enemy as possible in preparation for a possible offensive.

Now, Yevgeny Prigozhin, the Head of the Wagner group, he did say that their group had been battered. The Wagner group had been battered in Bakhmut, but

he also added that they had battered the Ukrainians as well. And since the 21st of February, Bakhmut has been off limits to journalists.

I spent much of January there and we had a pretty good idea of what was going on. But since then, it's sort of a black hole. We don't know what's

going on. We're dependent upon what little information is actually coming out of there. But it does appear that both sides are taking very heavy

casualties at this point, and it's not clear. For instance, the Ukrainians are saying that their lines have been stabilized. This comes after several


CHATTERLEY: Ben, I'm just going to interrupt you forgive me because we are seeing images of King Charles approaching the Brandenburg Gate, of course

meeting the German President. Thank you, Ben for that as you can see there, King Charles, Queen Consort Camilla, beautiful blue dress, meeting with the

President of Germany.

President Steinmeier and his wife Elke Budenbender there smiles and handshakes you can see the security in here, there's sirens, of course lots

of people around in the famous Brandenburg Gates. Just in the shop there, I can just see gently, the cars now driving away, a very important meeting

part of a three-day tour.

Of course, beginning in Germany, having bypassed the French part of this due to the pension strikes just going to take a walk now, I think I've got

Max Foster, he of course uses them traveling with King Charles and Queen Consort Camilla as well, just standing by I think now for photographs. But

I think Max, the obvious thing to point out here is the broad smiles and the handshakes a very welcome greeting.

MAX FOSTER, CNN ROYAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, this is a big operation that put on here. This is the first official state visit by the King anywhere in the

world. Of course, he was due to go to France earlier this week. But that had to all be canceled because of the demonstration.

So this becomes the first official state visit of King Charles his reign. And we are here by the Brandenburg Gate. Another piece of history, this is

the first time we think things since the Second World War, that there has been a full ceremonial welcome of any Head of State here at the Brandenburg


So it is, you know, history playing out here right now. And the couple over there with the President and his wife in front of the cameras, they're

going to come down here to the red carpet and inspect the guard of honor. So he's on his way over here now.

He's here until Friday, King Charles and the Queen Consort as well, a Camilla, a country that they have deep ties with, but it's always the

government, the Foreign Office that leads these events. And it's interesting that they chose France and Germany as the first two countries.

Post-Brexit, of course, to try to, you know, uses the diplomatic power of the royal family to perhaps build those relationships after a pretty

fraught period under Boris Johnson, of course. So Charles is about to head over, Julia, and inspects the guard of honor.

CHATTERLEY: Yes, full military honors the welcome there to your point, too, and yes, there at the behest of the government, as important as it is to

see King Charles on his first official state visit, of course, since becoming King as well. Can you talk us through not only what we're seeing

now, and it's actually quite nice to see all those flags being waved in the background?

Look at that all the German flags and the Union Jacks as well. But what we're going to go on to see later today as well, a full state banquet as

well, too, as you pointed out, this really is rolling out the red carpet, for the British King.

FOSTER: Really is, yes that need to get the Presidential palace as well and then a series of engagements where they tried to tie in. What the German

government wants, what the British government wants, but also what King Charles wants as well. And the Duchess says, well, the Queen Consort as she

is now.

So there's a series engagement seeking environment as you'd expect, also a Ukrainian refugee center over the next couple of days really recognizing

what Germany is doing to support Ukraine militarily and in terms of humanitarian work, and then taking a look at the cultural aspects of the

country as well.

These photos will go down immediately into history. This video will go down to history as the first state visit and these moments really reflect the

British-German relationship as much as anything else.


But across all of this, of course, the relationship with the European Union as well which is some I know the Prime Minister of the United Kingdom wants

to deepen ties on and this is a key relationship and part of that process as well. You saw how Ursula von der Leyen was afforded a meeting with King

Charles when she went over to the U.K.

She's not a Head of State that was a special honor. This is very much what Rishi Sunak wants to promote as a deep and lasting relationship between the

U.K. and Germany post-Brexit the national anthem now playing for the United Kingdom here by the German band.

CHATTERLEY: Just wrapping up the two national anthems there in Berlin. I think that we can underscore enough the importance of the imagery of seeing

that famous landmark and the Brandenburg Gates that you were just looking at there a symbol of the country's divisions, of course, during the Cold

War and the subsequent unification in October of 1990.

And, Max, to your point, I think this is a chance to renew ties, to renew partnerships to discuss what the relationship between the two nation's

looks like post-Brexit and the United Kingdom, of course, leaving the European Union. It is a very important moment.

FOSTER: It really is and to underscore that really, even on the way in I flew in on the King's aircraft, and we were accompanied by German fighter

jets as we came in, which is something I've never seen before. And that's an honor that the Germans wanted to bestow on the King as he came in.

Of course, there are family links between the British Royal Family as well Queen Victoria's husband was of course German, there's German blood in

these veins and Prince Philip had lots of family here as well. The last time I was here with the royal family was with the Queen and Prince Philip.

And there are many parallels between this visit and that one. So that was her last state visit. This is King Charles's first state visit. So

interesting that it's all playing out here in Germany today, you can see that the King and the President the two Heads of State on the red carpet,

right behind me are taking the guard of honor.

And, you know, big smiles on everyone's faces. I think everyone is very pleased with how everything's playing out today. I can't tell you how many

notes I've got intricate notes, Julia, from both the German side and the British side about every single detail of this trip, a huge amount of work

over a period of months.

And there was a last minute jig of course, because the first leg of this European tour to France had to be cancelled on Mr. Macron's advice. The

King going up there to meet a group of German well wishes, love them with German flags and love them with the British flags as well so interesting to

see who's in the crowd and what he'll be saying to them on his first visit here as King.

CHATTERLEY: Yes, as you point out a full stop it now well underway and a jolly feel. I think a positive feel to this meeting too and plenty of

smiles. Max, so we will leave you there as he's greeting well wishes and the flags are waving and we'll come back to you later on in the show.

For now, Max Foster, thank you for that and that is the British Monarch King Charles there meeting well wishes over in Berlin and we will take you

back there later on in the show. For now, we're back after this.



CHATTERLEY: Welcome back to "First Move", with a change at the top is ride hailing firm Lyft ready to change gear. Investors certainly hope it has the

ability to close the gap with Uber in the ride hailing stakes after going public back in 2019.

Lyft has struggled to recover from a pandemic slump and it's also lost ground to its bigger rival. Despite cost cutting, it's failed to turn a

profit with projections this year below expectations while strapping himself into the driving seat is Incoming CEO David Risher.

He started at Microsoft went on to become one of Amazon's first employees as Head of product and 13 years ago founded a nonprofit to improve child

literacy and he joins us now. David, I tell you what you've been, you've been pretty busy. Welcome to the show. You've been on Lyft board.

DAVID RISHER, INCOMING CEO OF LYFT: Thank you it's great to be.

CHATTERLEY: Welcome, you've been on the Lyft board, I believe since 2021. What do you think is the most fundamental misunderstanding of Lyft's

potential by investors today?

RISHER: Well, I think Lyft has enormous potential and at the end of the day, it's because we're really good at what we do. You know, over a third

of the American population has taken a Lyft since its founding about 15 years ago every single week, hundreds of thousands of drivers.

People make billions of dollars on the platform. And so it's a very, very strong and successful. Our service and it's great for customers, it picks

you up on time, and we're competitive on price and so forth. So I think there's enormous upside. I just think people have gotten, everyone

distracted by sort of a particular competitive dynamic we're in rather than thinking about the potential of the whole sector.

CHATTERLEY: Yes, we'll come back to that. I think one of the obvious things you ask when its Founders handing over their baby, to a new person, you

asked how involved they're going to be, how much free rein are you going to have? So I guess that's my first question. David, do you have free rein to

make even the toughest of decisions if necessary?

RISHER: I do and I can tell John and Logan are very sincere about that. They've been incredibly supportive, but at the same time, they're super

clear, you know, their best move right now is to give me the space I need to give the company the space it needs to really move forward, become a

great profitable company.

CHATTERLEY: Will go to the end and work backwards. You've rolled out a sale, even if that's what ultimately is best for shareholders. Can I ask if

it's even being discussed at this stage as a potential option?


I know you're not there yet.

RISHER: I'm not and I appreciate that's a great point. Yes, it's not so much that I've ruled it out, I simply said, it's not our focus. Our focus

is on making sure that we provide a great customer experience. We also have to provide a great experience for our shareholders.

I'm very aware of that. So of course, look, our shares are available on the NASDAQ every day, they're sort of on sale right now, you might say, but our

focus isn't so much on that it's really on customers right now, and building a great profitable business for the long term.

CHATTERLEY: You know, when I read between the lines on all the analysts notes that flow out on this, and most frequently, what I see is that you

need to cut costs, you need to improve profitability or focus on profitability. But you also at the same time need to improve pricing for

customers and attract more drivers.

And I sort of look at those two things and I say they're sort of diametrically opposed. How do you achieve all of those things?

RISHER: I think you focus. We had an all employee meeting yesterday, and there was so much energy in the room. But there were questions around cost

and we said, look, we have to be careful with costs. It's we're not alone in this, but we in particular, need to be very, very careful that we're

spending our money well.

And that's something I learned a world leader, it's sort of funny, but in the nonprofit world, you try to take on huge problems with very small

budgets. And we've done a good job of that. And we'll do a good job here at Lyft so that we can pass that right back to drivers and passengers.

CHATTERLEY: How do you increase market share without buying it?

RISHER: So I think the first thing you do is you remind people, you're a good option. And it sounds maybe a little funny, but I think it's really

important. The world has gotten to a point through you know, a number of years and different steps along the way of almost feeling like Uber is the

default and I recognize that.

So we've got to fight really hard to remind people why Lyft to pick people up on time, to give them a competitive price to make sure they get where

they're going do all the basics, right. And I think if you see, you know markets like that, where there are two players.

You often see sort of a shift in share over time, you know, a funny example is, you know, the SAT and the ACT here in the United States, for those of

you who have a kids going through that, you know, these things tend to shift over time. And I think customers and drivers really want the choice.

So we're here to remind them, they've got a great choice in Lyft, and we're going to make the experience better.

CHATTERLEY: I think you make a great point about the default being Uber simply because people forget that there's an alternative option. But when

I've seen one estimate of the market share, it's 74 percent to Uber, 26 percent to Lyft; it's sort of more of a landslide.

And I guess we'll go back to the question again, how do you bring down wait times if you're not attracting drivers because they have an alternative

option? And how do you attract customers, if perhaps, the alternative option is cheaper, too. It's sort of it's a circular argument, but it sort

of goes back to the first one I asked without spending more money you're doing it.

RISHER: Yes, it's a great point, but the nice thing about that circle is it can kind of unwind and go the other direction, too. If we focus on

customers, if we focus on providing a great service, and really focus on it and I understand that sounds a little generic.

But there's a lot of work we can do with that laser focus on that one person who wants to get picked up right now at you know, 6:40 in the

morning. If we focus in on one person and make sure that driver is getting paid fairly and well, that tends to take care of itself. As long as people

remember that Lyft is a great option.

So to a certain extent, and I know it's a little repetitive, but it's focused on those basics with such laser precision, not get distracted by

delivering pizzas or packages or all sorts of other things that other companies are doing really focused on that I've got a lot of optimism. And

then over time, you'll see us differentiate in different ways.

CHATTERLEY: Do you reserve the right to change your mind on the diversification options? Yes.

RISHER: Well yes, of course, never say never and I do. But I will tell you that if you have a business model that competes with what customers want,

you often find that the business model wins and in this case riders lose. So for example, you know, I don't really want to get in the same car that,

you know, just delivered the tuna sandwich.

And if you talk to drivers, they say, Gosh, I don't make as much in food delivery and it's more frustrating. I get tickets when I'm double parked in

front of the restaurant and so forth. So, you know, I think that the Uber has its challenges, too. I really do and well, you know, obviously, the

situation right now is one where we've got to fight really hard to be a strong number two, and maybe even better than that someday. I think they'll

going to have some challenges on their hands, too.

CHATTERLEY: There are so many great points now and I completely agree with you on the tuna sandwich point, by the way. But I'd love your opinion on

whether you think the business model works. I mean, I know, your sort of reluctant to keep making this comparison because Lyft stands on its own

right relative to Uber.

But, you know, Uber is being celebrated now and it's approaching profitability. I just wonder whether you fundamentally believe as great as

it is for the consumer and for drivers perhaps that are making money for this the facility to have ride hailing whether the business model actually

works unless it's a monopoly.

RISHER: Well, I don't think it should be hoping that a monopoly is the way this ends out. You know, I think it's not good for customers; it's not good

for drivers. So in a sense, you know, I'll put it this way.


I think it has to work. And it's my number - it's my only focus. And let's be clear, I really want to get paid. And you know, if it doesn't, our

shareholders get a great return at that point. So, you know, I understand your question. It's reasonable to sort of speculate about this.

But you know, if one company can make it work, and if you're saying what's required to make it work is monopoly pricing? I don't think that's where

anyone wants to end up. But I also don't accept that I think it's going to be a great to service this world.

CHATTERLEY: Yes, I mean, you have to encourage more people to use ride- hailing, and you have to encourage more drivers, everybody can benefit if the whole pie is bigger, I guess is the answer. David, you can use that?

RISHER: I appreciate that. Well, not there's so much more, I want to use this, right, we're kind of out of COVID, we're coming back to work, we're

going to the movie. So let's not forget also, you know, there was a certain trajectory, pre-COVID.

And then obviously, momentum shifted, and so on and so forth. But think about in the biggest picture where the magic happens? When we all get

together, I think that's actually a real purpose that companies like ours can help with, and it will over time, expand the market, there's just no


CHATTERLEY: And David, I've run out of time, but I did want to make the point that I know you've got a sign on bonus, and the vast majority of it

you gave to World Reader, which is this child literacy a nonprofit that you founded.

So I wanted people to understand that not only about split focus, but about the focus on very important other things going on in the world. David,

please come back and talk again soon. You're going to have a fun time, I think.

RISHER: Thank you so much. We're going to make a great company. I appreciate it.

CHATTERLEY: Thank you. Bye! We're back up to this.


CHATTERLEY: Welcome back to "First Move"! U.S. stock markets are open for business this Wednesday and it's a positive start. Take a look at that.

Fresh comments from Chipmaker Micron Technologies helping the need in the tech sector too. It says major customers are finally in the process of

reducing chip inventories positive for their business.


Bitcoin also resilient currently up from 4 percent over $28,000 per Bitcoin. Investors currently shrugging off U.S. regulatory action against

crypto exchange giant Binance they're eyeing regulation on mainstream banks I think.

As a result, the effects of strike action in the meantime, continue to plague the European airline sector. It's one of a series of headaches

facing CEOs and policymakers who've gathered in Brussels for the airlines for Europe Summit. So what can European holidaymakers expect this year?

Well, Richard Quest is at the summit, and he's been talking to top CEOs today. Richard, always fantastic to have you on the show! I think I was

just looking at the potential strike action over the Easter holidays and I think holidaymakers have to be prepared to swim or drive based on what I


RICHARD QUEST, CNN EDITOR-AT-LARGE: Oh, absolutely. I think it's going to be a difficult year, but it's going to be much better than last year.

Behind me is the airline for Europe Summit. And the interesting thing about this summit is it brings together all the CEOs of all the major European


Low Cost Legacy, Ryanair, Lufthansa, they're all here. And they're all here in a sort of non-competitive way, because there are key issues that hit

them all. And the number one issue, Julia is how summer 2023 will go after the debacle of last year when it was chaos because airport security

airlines, nobody was fully prepared for the ramp up? This year, according to Michael O'Leary, who is the CEO of Ryanair, which is Europe's largest

single carrier 2023, will be better.


MICHAEL O'LEARY, CEO OF RYANAIR: I don't think so. But I mean, certainly the unions are exercising what muscle they have, particularly in the run up

to Easter. You're generally speaking this summer I think will be materially better than last summer was where a lot of the airlines in the airports

were short staffed, but it's going to be a very busy summer.

The Americans are coming to Europe in their droves because the strong dollar. We're seeing the return of the Asian traffic beginning to return to

Europe. And I think we're going to have a very strong summer but it's going to be froth particularly where the French air traffic controllers are

rebelling are revolting.


QUEST: The point about the French air traffic controllers, he made the point the number of strikes that have been and the issue Julia, which is

technical but crucial. It's the ability to overfly if you will over fly French airspace if there are problems on the strikes on the ground.

Why can you not fly over France? You then add in for example, the German strikes over the pay and the cost of living in Frankfurt or Munich and you

realize and of course the British 10 week strike from the passport office and you start to see it's going to be a difficult year.

CHATTERLEY: Richard, can we have another flyover please?

QUEST: Of course we may. I'll get in trouble.


CHATTERLEY: Whose plane is this?

QUEST: Lyft heading nicely. Oh, I knew you're going to don't ask because I don't have to show the other one and it'll all get very, very, very


CHATTERLEY: Strategic and pleasing nicely done. Richard Quest, thank you for that! OK. The Washington Post reporting today that the White House

wants to get tougher on mid side financial institutions after the failures of the Silicon Valley Bank and Signature Bank.

The Biden Administration reportedly set to demand new regulations on regional's to help bolster customer confidence. All this as the U.S. House

gets set to hold new hearings into the banking terminal today. Rahel Solomon joins me now. Struggling to read that Rahel, half because I'm

laughing and half because there seems to be lots of B's and T's in there.

What we heard yesterday was three top regulators think that they wanted to see more stringent regulations on banks that have assets above $100

billion. I think that makes sense, in light of what we've seen, but was there any pushback? What more did we hear?

RAHEL SOLOMON, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, it does make sense, right? Because on the one hand, what we saw with this is those regulators execute the

systematically risk exception, right, the systemic risk exception, rather.

So it's, on the one hand, there was systemic risk, on the other hand, that they were not considered systemically important which is why they weren't

subject to those increased regulations as you point out. Look, Senator Elizabeth Warren asked each of them pretty pointedly would you support do

you think we need more stringent regulations.

And ultimately, each regulator said yes. And this was a 2.5 hour hearing Julia and yet questions still remain. One of the big questions of course,

is even if SVB had been stress tested, which had wasn't would current stress have actually caught this.

Because Julia as you know, Current stress test as they remain test for things like unemployment spiking 6 percent to about 10 percent for example

they test for things like market volatility, they test for things like falling GDP.


Those were not the primary issues here. Those were not the issues for SVB. Senator Kennedy of Louisiana put it, you didn't test for SVB's problem on

the other hand, and there was another question about the timeline of all of this.

Julia, as you and I spoke about on yesterday's program, the Fed said that they essentially were aware that SVB began to have these problems had these

problems as early as late 2021. So if that is the case, why was it more done to prevent this? Take a listen to these questions.


SEN. TIM SCOTT (R-SC): I hope to learn how the Federal Reserve could know about such risky practices for more than a year and failed to take

definitive corrective action.


SOLOMON: Right. And so that's the other part of this. If you say actually, no, we did not actually, we did sound the alarm. We did communicate this to

SVB executives, why did this still happen? And so that's still a big question in terms of what happens next?

The next hearing on the House set to begin in about 20 minutes and then Julia, we know that SVB executives have also been asked to testify that

it's expected to happen at a later date, but you can bet there will definitely be fireworks when we hear from that testimony when we hear from

those witnesses.

CHATTERLEY: Yes, absolutely and yet more pointing the finger at everyone else and their feelings. Rahel Solomon thank you so much for that! OK so to

come on "First Move", chipping away at the banking barriers in Africa one app at a time. I speak with the CEO of Chipper Cash after the break.


CHATTERLEY: Welcome back to "First Move"! Back in 2018 Chipper Cash set out to improve Africa's antiquated banking system and grant more access to the

unbanked. Their platform allows customers to transfer money pay bills and invest in both U.S. stocks and crypto all on their cell phones.

The app now has over 5 million users across Africa including Ghana, Nigeria, Uganda, South Africa and Zambia. Unlike many startups Silicon

Valley Banks investment arm was an early investor in Chipper Cash and remain so.

CEO Ham Serunjogi said the bank was the only one willing to help with Chipper's first bank account and after SVB collapsed the company said their

exposure was insignificant and would have no customer impact.


And joining us now Ham Serunjogi, CEO of Chipper Cash! Wow! Ham, you've had a busy time to say the least. Talk to me about operations today the

conversations that you're having with customers. It's a tough time anyway. SVB was complication?

HAM SERUNJOGI, CEO OF CHIPPER CASH: Julia, it's great to be back with you today. Thank you for having me. And indeed, it's been an eventful and busy

time. And you know you're always this for us in our world.

I think one thing that probably goes unsaid is that there's always a lot of stuff that we're working on and developments and we constantly have to

navigate interesting challenges. So in the last 12 months, six months have definitely been no different in that sense. But they've been unique.

I think, you know, one thing to say is that, for Chipper, our mission, and you know, our long term, vision for building hasn't changed. And if

anything, I think times like this underscore the importance of what we're building.

When does, you know, stress in the global economy, people rely on our products and services more, they support each other more, they need tools

to store their money safely, the need to transfer money safely.

And now with you know features that we've been building and rolling out the last couple of months, like our cards and our stocks product, even more so

interact with the global economy is of the highest importance.

So I think, you know, these times further underscore the importance of what we're building. And we know with regards to what happened with SVB, as I

said in my statement, fortunately for Chipper, there was very little impact.

And I think more importantly, SVB's capital arm, which is the one that invested in Chipper, was largely unaffected. So that's a very different

pool of capital from SVB, the bank, which is the one that collapsed. So for us, even with the people that we deal with it SVB those relationships are

so strong and as vibrant as ever. So, you know, fortunately, we came out on the right end of what happened with SVB.

CHATTERLEY: Yes, and I think it's important when, for people to understand that when an investor invests they give you the money, so you've got the

money, you've taken the money, and that's a good thing.


CHATTERLEY: Sometimes that gets forgotten in this conversation, too. To your point, I think--

SERUNJOGI: Very important.

CHATTERLEY: --yes, starting in 2019, you've been battle tested pandemic, and then banking, volatility. We'll dig into the business and growth, but

just at a top level, does it change the conversation that you're having with investors about profitability, about choices over expansion and how


I mean, any of this, not just specifically SVB, but just the environment we're in today in a greater discernment, I think over where money goes, and

how willing people are to provide it?

SERUNJOGI: Absolutely. I think you put it quite well. You know, we started with the pandemic very early on in our company's history. And we had to

deal with that. And that was a huge unknown. And then obviously, now this, you know, global economic crisis that we're going through right now.

And you know, there's a wave and at the same time, there's just a lot of uncertainty and fear in the world right now. And those are all things we

have to navigate as well, I think, generally speaking, because our vision of our mission remains unchanged.

And all the investors that we have who are highly supportive, subscribe, that vision and that mission, there's really very little change in the long

term prognosis and the subscription of what we're doing.

I think what really changes in times like this more than anything, is that not just for Chipper, but for everyone, there's probably more emphasis on

efficiency, and having to do more with less. So if there is an adjustment in how we think about our business.

Or how we think about where we are looking at resource in the short term? It's more focused on alright, what do we do now, with tighter resources in

terms of less capital in the markets probably less fundraising activity going on across the industry?

How do we make sure that our business is operating as efficiently as possible? And what are the most important areas that we need to double down

on and focus on as a business? And we've done that work ourselves as a business; we constantly try to do it.

But I think in times like this, with the buyers raise a little higher, and everyone to make sure that every single dollar of investment that the

company is making is good when the most important thing.

So you will tend to see less aggressiveness in terms of expansion, and more focus on doubling down on products have been launched under the scaling and

growing quite strongly. And that's quite true for us as well as a business.

CHATTERLEY: Yes. And we've seen that across the tech sector. And it's probably quite healthy to be frank.


CHATTERLEY: Since we last spoke to you, you've launched the Chipper Card, I believe in Uganda and Nigeria which is allowing users to access cash

without a bank account? I just wonder very quickly, how did that fare during the recent sort of physical cash crunch in Nigeria that we saw in

the lead up to the elections?

SERUNJOGI: Yes, that's something we're excited to talk about. Because last time I spoke with you about maybe a year ago, it was heavily around the

core P2P product. And we've since expanded our platform quite a bit in terms of product offering.


The card is one of the most exciting products that we've launched. And the reason why it's important in addition to the cash crunch and people rely on

physical cash less is that it also allows a lot of our users to interact with the online economy. And you know, whether they previously couldn't.

One thing that I think people take for granted, generally speaking in the West is your options to buy something online or via an online process are

plentiful. But if you live in countries where most of your money is either held in a mobile money account or in cash, something as simple as paying

for Netflix subscription, or Spotify, or buying something online via Amazon isn't as easy.

And so our card allows people to take that money that they have in mobile money or in Chipper, and spend it online in a very easy and safe way. And

that product has grown quite strongly we've issued over 600,000 cards across Africa today with the largest virtual card issuer in Africa today.

And we're aiming to issue very many more and launching more markets. But it's been exciting to see how that product has really enabled people to do

very important things you know, paying for, you know your deposit for college or pay for your SAT or test preparation fees or buying a ticket to

travel somewhere, things that are crucial for everyday life that would otherwise be very, very difficult. That product has enabled people to be

able to interact the online economy in a very easy way.

CHATTERLEY: I have about a minute left. You publish analytics on all of these things. So in one minute, you have to ask me why women aren't using

this card. And actually, it's the same with crypto investments on the platform that the ratio of men using your products to women is way higher.

What's going on there? Do you need more targeted advertising towards women?

SERUNJOGI: I think it's definitely something that the whole industry has to focus on.


SERUMJOGI: We have to do a little walk in educating and trying to onboard as many women as possible. It's a reflection of what's on the ground right

now. Unfortunately, there are more men than women that have access to formal services like Chipper and mobile money.

But it's an area that we're working aggressively on and trying to invest aggressively into, to make sure that we have a platform that everyone can

use and benefit from. So more work to do on that and I'm excited to come back and tell you more about our progress that area. Next time we catch up.

CHATTERLEY: Perfect. Yes, we'll focus on the business purely I promise. But we were just showing some of the stats there and it's quite fascinating so

yes, plenty to work on Ham. Great to chat to you, the CEO of Chipper Cash there! Thank you. OK, stay with us more up to this.


CHATTERLEY: Welcome back to "First Move"! King Charles making his first state visit since taking the throne. Just moments ago the King and Queen

Consort Camilla met German President Frank-Walter Steinmeier to kick off their three day state visits.

Later the Royal Couple will be the guest of honor at a state banquet smiles and handshakes there. And finally there's a good reason this Australian is

smiling in his hands is an enormous gold nugget worth around $160,000.


It weighs nearly five kilograms and was discovered in the State of Victoria in an area known as the Golden Triangle well named. Darren Camp who valued

it and who you can see there says the once in a lifetime discovery was found using an $800 gold detector. Now that is an investment.

And that's it for the show. If you've missed any of our interviews today, they will be on my Twitter and Instagram pages you can search for

@jchatterleycnn. "Connect the World" with Becky Anderson is up next.