Return to Transcripts main page

First Move with Julia Chatterley

Urgent Rescues after Dam Collapse in Kherson Region; Smoke from Canada Wildfires Smothers U.S.; Thaggard: I get really Excited about Challenges; Central Banks Battle Stubbornly High Inflation; WCS CEO: Hudson Canyon is Crucial to NY Seascape; Lionel Messi Set to Play for MLS Club Inter Miami. Aired 9-10a ET

Aired June 08, 2023 - 09:00   ET




JULIA CHATTERLEY, CNNI HOST: A warm welcome to "First Move" this Thursday as always in another busy news hour on the show ahead, including the dam

disaster. Ukraine's President Zelenskyy touring flood ravaged parts of Southern Ukraine, where at least three people have died. Emergency

evacuations on an ongoing rescue are also threatened by continued shelling.

Plus, an appalling knife attack in Southeast France. Six people including children have been injured some seriously. We'll bring you the latest

details on that. And her growing health emergency smoke from Canadian wildfires still is blanketing the Northeast of the United States.

75 million people now suffering from poor air quality, some businesses also advising staff to work from home, take a look at that sky. Is this all part

of our globally warmed future? It's a fitting question to ask on World Oceans Day. Our waters provide half of the world's oxygen.

How can we protect them so that they can continue to protect us? We'll be discussing. In the meantime, stock market futures little changed on a still

very hazy as you could see that Wall Street's after Wednesday's pullback. Interest rate hikes remain a key thing with unexpected moves that's hikes

from the Bank of Canada and Australia this week.

The Federal Reserve, of course, is up next week too. And in the meantime, over in Europe a technical recession for the Eurozone with data showing two

straight quarters of slightly negative growth. It does look to be a shallow recession for now, to be sure, but coming in the face of high inflation is

an ongoing conundrum for the European Central Bank.

And Beijing, also trying to emerge from its recent period of slow growth reports says a number of state owned banks cut their deposit rates today to

help jumpstart lending so to push money out into the real economy. That could signal future stimulus measures from the central government too.

Asian markets, we're closing mixed on the day, but modest gains, as you can see there for the SHANGHAI COMPOSITE and the HANG SENG. So as always,

plenty to get to through the next hour, but we do begin with the latest from Ukraine. And Ukrainian commander says at least 600 square kilometers

of their Kherson region is underwater following that collapse of a vital dam on Tuesday.

Ukraine and Russia are still accusing each other of shooting at rescue teams working in flooded areas. And humanitarian groups saying land mines

such a drift and floating in the water are another huge threat to safety. Fred Pleitgen is in the City of Zaporizhzhia for us.

Fred, clearly hazardous conditions for those that live there, also as we're saying hazardous conditions for those that are trying to provide respite

and provide help and support in the rescue efforts.

FREDERIK PLEITGEN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, you're absolutely right. It definitely is very hazardous for all of those people,

for the people who are still stranded in their houses for the people in the City of Kherson, but also in general in that area. And of course, also for

the people who are trying to get everybody out.

In fact, yesterday, we were on the water with one of those rescue teams, and they told us that they face shelling pretty regularly out there. And

one of the things that we've heard today is that there was apparently shelling near one of the places where people were being evacuated.

So that is, of course, something that's extremely dangerous. You have those rescuers often coming on those areas with boats, trying to get people out

of their houses trying to get people's animals out of the houses as well. They're moving very slowly, they don't really have much in the way of

protection and they're just generally on the water.

So any sort of shelling that takes place, there is something that obviously is extremely dangerous. I want to get to those mines as well, because

that's something that the authorities down there told us when we were in the Kherson is a big issue was mines that were laid obviously between the

two sides between Russia and Ukraine.

And then when the flooding came, we just simply swept downstream and our big hazard in those areas, coastal areas that are underwater. So that's

something that the authorities there told us again and again to be very mindful of is that some of those landmines that were buried once on land

may have moved.

All of that, of course, as these rescue operations, Julia, are going on. The Ukrainian authorities are saying that on their side of things more than

2000 homes are still underwater. At the same time, they also say that the zone that was actually flooded, the majority of that is actually on the

Russian side.

At the same time, you still have that water gushing through the destroyed Kakhovka dam and hydroelectric plants. So certainly this is a situation

that is ongoing and that is going to continue to be ongoing.


But certainly over the next couple of days, the most recent that we heard from the local authorities there is they believe the water is going to peak

at some point, you know, probably today and then take at least five days to recede and of course after that, you will still have the massive aftermath

that needs to be cleaned up in a very, very dangerous situation to begin with, Julia.

CHATTERLEY: Yes, that's exactly what I was going to ask you next actually do we know when peak set to hit still going to be tough weeks and days to

come, Fred, thank you for that, Fred Pleitgen there. OK to France now, where at least six people have been injured in a knife attack four children

are among the victims.

It happened at a park in the City of Annecy. Police have arrested one person, but have not yet released his name or a motive. Melissa Bell joins

us now from Paris. Melissa, I think most importantly, have we had any more information about those that were injured including, as I mentioned


MELISSA BELL, CNN PARIS CORRESPONDENT: Children, very young children, Julia, this is what shocked France the most I think at this stage as the

country starts to come to terms with the horrific scenes that unfolded in this park in Southwestern France on the edge of a lake well known beauty


There would have been full of children, people out enjoying the hot weather at about 9:45 am local time this morning when this man went on the rampage.

And there is some Amateur footage that has now emerged Julia, that we're not showing just because it is far too troubling to watch in particular

because what you seem to see is this suspect this young man.

And we're expecting more on the details of who he is, in moments, this press conference is about to be held. Who very deliberately goes around the

park pushing adults out of the way to stab these children? And we're talking here about pre-school aged children, very young children, two and

three years old.

What we know for the time being is that there are six people in all, who were severely wounded, and a few of them are now said to be between life

and death. It is extremely traumatic for Francis as a part of the world where you simply don't get because of the gun laws, attacks that tend to

target children the last time anything like this happened here in France.

You'd have to go back to 2012 -- kicking off, that terrorist wave had gone on the rampage in Southern France, killing several children to its school.

So it's been more than 10 years since France has lived through anything quite as traumatic in terms of attacks on small children.

However, Julia, I think I should add that for the time being the anti- terror investigators have not been seized. There is no suggestion this is part of a wider terror plot. We wait to hear more about the man's motives,

who he is? Why he acted the way that he did? But for now anti-terror investigators are -- about keeping an eye but not seized.

And the French Prime Minister is headed down to the scene we're expecting, as I say a press conference in a moment to hear more about who the suspect

is and why he may have acted in the particularly frenzy and brutal way that he did this morning, here in France, Julia?

CHATTERLEY: Thanks, Melissa. And the moment we get further details on that we will bring them to our viewers. In the meantime, our hearts and thoughts

with everyone involved. OK, let's move on the Eurozone has officially in recession. But it's a shallow one growth for the 20 nations that use the

Euro currency known as the Eurozone has been revised.

It fell 0.1 percent in the first quarter following a similar drop in the final quarter of 2022. Anna Stewart joins me now. And that's all that's

needed for the claim of a technical recession. We always talk about this, Anna, its backward looking data. The question is what happens next?

And of course, you can ask this question better than most. What happens for the European Central Bank still in an inflation fight?

ANNA STEWART, CNN REPORTER: Well, exactly. I don't think this changes anything when it comes to the ECB. I also don't think this data was

surprising, given just two weeks ago, talking about Germany falling into a technical recession as well. The data does show that consumption is taking

a hit rate across the Eurozone.

That is a result of higher inflation. But also I think there are interest rates, which of course have a bit of a sub lagged impact really on

consumption. So there is a risk here that you could see this recession deepen. It won't change anything for the ECB time and time again pleased to

be present.

Christine Lagarde has made exceptionally clear that inflation is currently the top priority. We are expecting another hike next week at 25 basis

points expected and there's likely to be another one before the end of the year as well. And when we look at inflation, we can see how high it is.

And is this that risk of it getting sticky. I also counter anyone saying that maybe they should rollback on the rate hikes by saying that this

recession is barely recession currently -0.1 percent. The labor market is strong and also, Julia, if you strip out Ireland from all this, there

actually isn't a recession at all.

Ireland contracted by over 4 percent in the first quarter. You may remember last year it grew by over 12 percent. All those multinationals they've set

up based in Ireland.


Thanks to its low corporate tax rate really distort both the figure for Ireland but also for the Eurozone, so there's obviously that argument in

there as well, Julia.

CHATTERLEY: Wow, just remind me again, Ireland. Did you see down 4 percent?

STEWART: Contracted by over 4 percent in the first quarter but expanded by over 12 percent last year. So that's some distortion.

CHATTERLEY: Yes, contract is, key. I think that's the message there. OK, perfect. Anna Stewart, there thank you so much. All right, we're going to

take a quick break here. We're back right after this. Stay with us.


CHATTERLEY: Welcome back to "First Move", millions of people across the U.S. and Canada are being told to stay inside or wear masks is noxious

smoking gulfs, much of the Eastern seaboard. This time lapse that I'm showing you show the fumes blanketing New York City over a three hour

period on Wednesday, the skyline is vanishing behind the orange haze by 2 pm.

That smoke, is coming from wildfires in Canada, where more than 400 and are raging across the country. President Biden also spoke to his Canadian

counterpart yesterday. So that was Wednesday and offered additional support. Let's bring in Chief Climate Correspondent Bill Weir who's in

Brooklyn in New York.

And wearing appropriate face masks and masking, Bill, at this moment, I don't know how to describe what happened yesterday. It was other worldly it

felt like the end of days. The sky literally turned orange.

BILL WEIR, CNN CHIEF CLIMATE CORRESPONDENT: It was so bizarre, wasn't it, Julia?


WEIR: That it's so dark in Central Park that the streetlights came on in the middle of the day. Of course, grounding airplanes at LaGuardia and

cancelling baseball games. It's something that East Coasters even hard bitten New Yorkers, I think assume that's the price of living out west.

That's the price of living in California, among the grapevines in the mountains. But now we're seeing more and more on our overheating planet

that you can't escape this sort of thing. These are over 100 wildfires out of control up in Quebec. In a normal year that might be a dozen going but

that just that dry May that keep going desiccated the boreal forests up there, turning those pine cones into kindling.

And now we're getting the results of a new study shows that 60 percent of the wildfire smoke pollution that American breeze these days comes from

another state where it's the trees are burning far away.


So this is one that seems to be sort of an anomaly because of the way the wind held it close to the ground for so long. Now, it's headed down to

Philly and towards Washington and those folks will have the same advisors. I just I put on a mask after talking to a pulmonary specialist yesterday,

and who describes that the PM 2.5.

That's the stuff very tiny particulate matter that comes out of wildfires is 10 times more hazardous than the toxic pollution that comes out of your

tailpipe, for example.


WEIR: So a new lesson for East Coast owners to start thinking about smoke in different ways. But of course, this is really common in the big cities

across Asia, India, in particular, and as a result there, the lifespan is nine years shorter, just because of air. And it's sort of the invisible

hazard that we sort of don't think about as much.

CHATTERLEY: Wow! Well, there was so much in that, you know, it's interesting that you mentioned India, what it reminded me of actually was

traveling in China, I think 2015 where we saw it at the peak, and they recognized they had a huge problem in cities like Beijing and they did what

they could to tackle it and reduced it.

I mean, this is astonishing. I guess the big question I have for you now is, to your point about climate change, is this what we have to expect and

look forward to if we carry on in the vein that we're doing so at this moment, and not doing more to try and protect the planet?

WEIR: I think just common sense tells us that right?


WEIR: You know you can look at the U.N. projections that wildfires will go up by 15 percent by 2030 and maybe 35 percent by 2050. That really doesn't,

you know, click with us emotionally on the idea that trees burning 500 miles away. And come back now we have to worry about with your children as

you're getting them out the door and deciding, you know, how am I going to get a mask on this kid?

Lost work days, asthma attacks? Yes, these are things these are the costs of inaction. And the costs of not doing anything as this get worse. You

know, you can't do the math and the numbers are just too big.

CHATTERLEY: Yes, one planet. And if this doesn't make people think and think harder about taking action than I don't think anything. Well, Bill,

stay safe out there. Please keep that mask on. And thank you very much for joining us, Bill Weir in Brooklyn there.

OK, now keep your eyes on the skies, but for a different reason, because we're talking about sun protection and in Monte Carlo in Monaco.

Entrepreneurs are squaring up for what organizers called the ultimate competition for business leaders. The countdown is now on for who will be

crowned the EY Entrepreneur of the Year.

And we've got just a few more hours to wait and one of those contenders the team behind sun care brand Supergoop! It won the U.S. title with that

philosophy of getting the whole family to wear sunscreen every single day. This is not just about summer, and it would crown a busy past year for the

brand as they expand into 16 new EU markets through retailer Sephora.

Supergoop sold $250 million worth of products in 2022. And I'm pleased to say Supergoop! Founder Holly Thaggard joins us now from Monaco, Holly,

fantastic to have you on the show. Let's just take a step back and explain how you came up with the idea not just of sunscreens that people actually

want to use versus avoid, but the importance of doing this all year round.

HOLLY THAGGARD, FOUND OF SUPERGOOP! : Yes, Julia. Well, thanks for having me. As you can see, the weather is beautiful here in Monaco today, I've

been on the Supergoop journey for over 18 years to change the way the world thinks about sunscreen. And that happened really after a good friend of

mine was diagnosed with skin cancer.

My college roommate was going through a residency and she said, Holly, it's not about beaches and bikinis. It's about that every single day, little bit

of exposure that's cumulative. And for most people doesn't turn into cancer until much later in life. But for your friend, it happened at a young age.

I looked at the industry it was incredibly sleepy there was no innovation and product. And I literally started to dream about SPF, and thinking about

unique ways to get it into everyone, everywhere, every single day routine.

CHATTERLEY: To your point wearing it every single day. But they're maybe the mindsets changed now, but I think and you've said it, what you found

was the greatest resistance to people wearing it was that it feels icky that it smells weird. And you tried to design and have designed a whole set

of products that get around some of the reasons and excuses people find for not wearing some protection.

THAGGARD: That's right, and I mean, there's no one right size fits all SPF. Our skin is very different. It's different at age 10 and 40. It's different

in Hong Kong as it is in New York City and there are different climates to think about too. And what's right on Sunday isn't necessarily right on

Monday because we all do different things right?

We wear different shoes on every day of the week depending on what we're going to do. So when we think about SPF and innovation in this category,

we're really thinking about every which way we can kind of sneak the SPF in that broad spectrum, UV protection into a formula.


And then give it additional benefits like vitamin C, which helps with hyperpigmentation or deliver it and what I think men mostly say they have a

hard time putting on lotions. And so like NC and sunscreen, which has a cult following is completely weightless and texture -- .

And so we're really thinking about SPF a different way and creating a new category. And along the way, we're DC's analyzing an industry that 18 years

ago was incredibly summer driven and beaches driven.

CHATTERLEY: Yes, and also, that's good for business too, because if people are thinking about this all year round, it makes your business less

cyclical as well. We're just showing an advert for unseen screen which I have to pull this fully disclose, I use this. And I think the product is


I believe an unseen screen is sold once every 14 seconds, or at least was in 2022. So talk to me about growth. Talk to me about the EU expansion

drive that you're on right now. And you've had some help from some pretty impressive investors, Holly, that you've attracted along the way too.

THAGGARD: We do, our capital partners that at Blackstone have really been helpful. And SPF is regulated and thought of differently from country to

country. So expanding is not necessarily an easy thing to do in this category. And so we launched Sephora Europe, in 16 countries.

I've been spending a lot of the year in Paris and getting my team we have a small office of six or seven there now and I getting it off the ground and

really remembering that the foundation of Supergoop!, is in education and so we have to start with why SPF and why SPF every single day.

And then you know we have the trust from the consumer having built this for over almost two decades. And they rely and come to Supergoop! knowing that

they're going to get the protection that they need from our brand.

CHATTERLEY: Yes, it's funny and overnight success has taken you 18 years to build. We should always remember that when we're celebrating entrepreneurs

like this at this moment. What about profitability, Holly, how is that conversation had within the company, but also with your investors? I

appreciate you're in growth mode, but yes.

THAGGARD: We are in growth mode. But we are very profitable. We're scaling very fast, which is nice and even though we do have JP Morgan behind us

with a floating revolver that should we need to lean into that. We're scaling so fast, and we're growing so fast and we're profitable. So we're

really, you know, we have a positive cash flow.

CHATTERLEY: You were so eager to tell me that -- we're talking over each other. But profitability is vitally important, particularly this moment in

time, so nice work on that too. We were just showing a banner that said you had 65 percent sales growth?


CHATTERLEY: Is that sustainable? What kind of growth? Are you expecting sort of this year? Particularly given how quickly you're expanding?

THAGGARD: In 2023, or 2024?

CHATTERLEY: Yes, you tell me.

THAGGARD: We work -- ahead in our planning? Yes, so in 2023, we're looking at another increase a 60 percent, maybe.


THAGGARD: So 2024, we're working on our next three years now. So but we have a long way to go and changing the way the world. We have a lot of

growth with our current retailers, even if we weren't going to open another door across the world. So with the support of our retail partners, and then

Blackstone has given us the resources that we need in order to get through regulatory, and continue we'll be expanding into the Middle East this Q4.

So going to Dubai, I'm super excited about that. And I think that you know, as we do this, and as we grow the global market, which is another reason

I'm so excited to be here with EY and they've been incredibly hospitable this week. And it's just been so inspiring to hear how everyone wants to

change the world in their own category.

CHATTERLEY: No, I'm going to ask you, but I'm going to keep saving for my final question about who you think is going to win and whether you expect

to take it but what's been the hardest challenge? Because you're clearly incredibly optimistic growth happening you've attracted great investment.

Holly, what was the hardest moment and for those that out there that are watching these that want to be an entrepreneur are and perhaps a

struggling? What's your advice?

THAGGARD: You know, I'm just, I'm an eternal optimist. And so I think that the struggles for me along the way have been only credit to the fact that

we're on to something really big. So I get very excited when we have to pivot and turn and find another way. And I know that this is all part of

the journey.

So I don't look at the challenges as really anything negative, I just look at them as like we're doing something really great or otherwise someone

else would have done it already. So I get really excited about challenges and I think for future entrepreneurs or inspiring entrepreneurs.


We really have to think about grit and you have to be so passionate about your idea and make sure that your idea is authentic and you're transparent

about your reason for being and that it's something new and different. The world has plenty of, you know don't give it more of the same think of

things differently.

And then make sure that you literally can't sleep at night. And that's going to be testament to the grit, which is, you know, 9 times out of 10,

how everything gets solved, if you just say to my team all the time, stop won't stop.

CHATTERLEY: Sleeps overrated, it might not be politically correct to say that as a boss. Now, I've got a challenge for you, Holly, my Producer Chris

is saying to me, why are men so useless with sunscreen? What percent of men and women of your clients? And can you answer that question?

THAGGARD: Yes, of course. And I think the men that have found our brand have found it through the women in their life.


THAGGARD: As a marketer, you know, we have to timing is everything. And honestly, to this point, we haven't really marketed to men in this world,

the men that have found us through the women in their life. But I think that's really good. When you have such a huge category, you have to stay

laser focused on your audience. There's just not enough marketing dollars to spread to everyone, everywhere.

So you have to really think about it in chunks of time and to this to up until today, we've really been talking to women and young women, through

our school program, ounce by ounce. We of course reach children in the classroom we have a giving program that puts free super up into any school

classroom in America that wants it. We're going to continue expanding that because we do believe that we have to teach this healthy habit at a young


CHATTERLEY: Yes, and educate young boys as well so that we sort of take any form of stigma out of it. Just work on the sunscreen and protect yourself.

Holly, fingers crossed that you end up the global winner. We'll find out in a few hours' time. So thoughts are with you. Thank you for joining us. Good

luck. Holly Thaggard there, Founder of sunscreen brand Supergoop!

THAGGARD: Thank you, Julia.

CHATTERLEY: Thank you. We'll speak again soon, more "First Move" after this.



CHATTERLEY: Welcome back to "First Move". And let me give you another look at New York City's skyline. We are bracing for another day of poor air

quality here due to the ongoing Canadian wildfire emergency, the skies around the city taking on a Martian dystopian hue on Wednesday.

And as for today's Wall Street trading view, well, not a lot of hullabaloo a quiet start to the session after Wednesday's pullback. Look at that

completely unchanged. It was actually the worst session for tech stocks in more than a month but they've been doing incredibly well.

Tech investor is perhaps and often nervously watching rising bond yields. That said in context is key. The S&P 500 remains near nine month highs and

are actually not that far away from closing in on bull market territory. Once again, that's a 20 percent rise from recent lows. Look, you can see

that in the chart there.

Now, as we've been discussing this week surprise interest rate hikes in both Canada and Australia, highlighting the continued challenges facing

central banks as they battle stubbornly high inflation. It's also a risky period for Fed Chair Jerome Powell and the U.S. central bank, ahead of that

important policy meeting next week.

Decisions, even if Powell hits pause on interest rate hikes this time around, the Fed will shortly hint that its work on the inflation front will

continue. As we discussed earlier, the ECB is also holding a policy meeting next week too.

Now IMF Managing Director Kristalina Georgieva has been speaking at the Astana International Forum in Kazakhstan, about the path of inflation and

the way central banks need to respond. And Richard Quest is there first to Richard, welcome. The good news is inflation is coming down the bad news is

not quickly enough. And the IMF chief saying, hold the line.

RICHARD QUEST, CNN BUSINESS EDITOR-AT-LARGE: Yes, you see, what everybody's focusing on is headline inflation, when you have numbers of 10, 11 percent,

which are now down to much more moderate five, 6 percent. But as Kristalina Georgieva has pointed out, it really is all about core inflation. And that

is to use that phrase you'll be well familiar with, that is sticky.

It's now become embedded in the global economy in different countries, the wage cycle has now or is now on an upward spiral, people wanting more

wages, prices, going up, manufacturing, costing more, et cetera, et cetera. So when I sat down with the MD of the fund, I needed to know whether she

believed sticky inflation was going to lead to even higher rates.


KRISTALINA GEORGIEVA, MANAGING DIRECTOR, INTERNATIONAL MONETARY FUND: I believe we are at the point when central banks are looking at data and

likely for some of them to pause. But let me be very clear until it is irreversibly a process of bringing inflation to target. Central banks

cannot let go.


QUEST: So they don't let go. And really, as you're familiar, the test is going to be when is low enough. 4 percent, 3.5 percent, 3 percent, when are

they going to give up the ghost? So before you ask, and whether you were going to ask or not, I'll tell you they don't.

It's a sort of, I haven't quite discovered what's in it. But it's the expo building with a shopping mall around it. Kazakhstan, I mean, Astana, which

is in sort of in Kazakhstan, the capital, flat land, as far as you can see, and I mean, seriously, flatland, as far as you can see, and a very warm


CHATTERLEY: A balmy temperature, I was going to suggest it was your crystal ball, Richard. So you could tell the future it looks like a giant crystal

ball. Not that you need one, of course.

QUEST: That divides the vibes, the vibes. Look at the vibes from it, it's extraordinary building. In fact, the architecture in this city is quite

remarkable one way from the former president, who seemed to have a thing for sort of building buildings in unusual shapes that cost a great deal of


Kazakhstan is very much a country in transition. But as we'll talk about tonight, on Quest Means Business, plug, plug, plug. As we'll talk about

tonight, the country landlocked and on one side, you have the bear of Russia. On the other side, you have the dragon of China. Strategic

neutrality is what they're all about.

CHATTERLEY: Yes. And Richard, who's coming up on the show later, am I allowed to, am I allowed to ask more opportunity to Ts, Ts, Ts.

QUEST: You're going to hear from Jose Manuel Barroso of Goldman Sachs. And of course he'll be giving us a view of the former EC president on exactly

where the strengths and weaknesses are in the system.


The EBRD you're lending money left, right and center about Ukraine and the deputy foreign minister of Kazakhstan. Because Kazakhstan is the strict

this neutrality, but at the same time is not supporting Russia and there is a constant fear that Russia could turn its attentions to crossing the


You really feel it here. You absolutely feel a tension, that a geopolitical tension of neutrality, but don't get it wrong, or it'll all come crashing


CHATTERLEY: Yes, a delicate diplomatic dance fascinating time to be there, fascinating place in general. Richard cannot wait for that. We'll be, we'll

be checking out the show later on. For now, I'll let you go on prep, because that's a lot of work to do. Enjoy the weather.

QUEST: Thank you.

CHATTERLEY: Crystal ball time. Thank you.

QUEST: You too.

CHATTERLEY: OK. It's been a challenging week too, for two of the leading crypto currency exchanges, Coinbase and Binance. The U.S. Securities and

Exchange Commission filing suit against both firms for violating numerous federal laws.

The CEO of crypto exchange Coinbase, Brian Armstrong is defending his firm's dealings with the government. He says the case against Coinbase will

ultimately be good for the crypto community. He spoke with our Matt Egan.


BRIAN ARMSTRONG, CEO, COINBASE: We started to see conflicting statements from the CFTC chair and the SEC chair. We tried to engage with the SEC, we

tried to come in and register. We tried to actually, we acquired a broker dealer license, it's still dormant, they haven't been able to get it


We've informally petitioned the SEC for clarity around a bunch of rules. And unfortunately, we were just met with silence, we never got any feedback

from them, we never found a path to register. And so when they came in and shared with us that they believe every asset in crypto is a security other

than Bitcoin.

You know, it kind of made the decision easy; we have to go to court to go challenge this because that's not what the law says. And also, if that were

to be the case, it would mean sort of the end of the crypto industry in the U.S.

And so we feel like this is an opportunity for us to avail ourselves of the court to get some case law created, that finally starts to bring regulatory

clarity, since the SEC is not providing it.

MATT EGAN, CNN REPORTER (on camera): So you want it to get sued?

ARMSTRONG: No, but our first choice would be just to have the regulator published a clear rulebook. You know, that's how it's supposed to work.

They publish the rules, and we all follow them. But if they're not doing that, you know, and then the court is the next best option to go get some


And the other big option we have, by the way, is Congress. You know, Congress, I think generally is aligned now that there needs to be more

clear regulation in the U.S. around crypto to protect consumers, but also preserve the innovation potential. And there we've already seen, for

instance, Europe has passed comprehensive legislation.

The UK is moving there. You know, Singapore is moving there, Hong Kong, basically the U.S. is falling behind. And I think Congress recognizes this.

We just saw, for instance, a draft bill come out last week from McHenry and Thompson that starts to clarify this role between the CFTC and the SEC.

So I think we'll get clarity one way or another. It's going to be the courts. It could be the Congress passing legislation or it could be, you

know, 2024 elections, something changes there that we finally get to that in the U.S.


CHATTERLEY: That was the CEO of crypto exchange, Coinbase Speaking to our Matt Egan. OK, coming up on "First Move", if I told you they produce around

half of the oxygen we breathe and remove a third of the carbon dioxide we create. Would you know what I'm talking about? I'm talking about the

world's oceans. We discuss next.



CHATTERLEY: Welcome back to "First Move", it's Thursday, eighth of June and that also means it's World Ocean Day. Now around the world our waters

provide home to most of the Earth's biodiversity, provide the main source of protein for more than a billion people and will provide employment to 40

million people in ocean based industries by 2030.

That's according to the United Nations. And yet they're also fragile. 90 percent of big fish populations are depleted, and half of our coral reefs

have been destroyed. We need to do more to protect them. So I sat down with the Wildlife Conservation Society's new President and CEO Monica Medina, on

the beach in New York's Coney Island earlier this week. And I asked her what World Ocean Day should mean to all of us.

MONICA MEDINA, CEO, WILDLIFE CONSERVATION SOCIETY: It's an important day for us to take stock of how we're doing and caring for this incredible

resource that we have. It's more than 70 percent of the planet, and we need to take care of it. People think it's so big, how could it fail. We can't

afford to lose our oceans.

They're a source of food for billions of people around the world. They're a source of commerce and businesses, jobs. And so we need our ocean now more

than ever before, and we have to conserve it.

CHATTERLEY: Do you know what blew me away with the statistics on this? It provides 50 percent of our oxygen; it takes away a third of the carbon

dioxide that humans create.

MEDINA: Huge carbon stinks.

CHATTERLEY: If you, yes, if you didn't know this before, you should know this. Because I think we talk about sustainability. We're talking more

thank goodness about biodiversity.


CHATTERLEY: We do not talk about our oceans enough. And you said to me ahead of this conversation they're vast, but they're fragile.

It's so important that we do better to protect them.

MEDINA: It's critical. Right now we're in this decisive decade for conservation. And we know if we don't act, we'll lose more coral reefs,

we've already lost half the coral reefs on the planet in the last 50 years. We know we need to conserve our ocean spaces, which is why we're working

hard here in New York to conserve an incredible place not far off the coast here called Hudson Canyon.

It's the end of the mouth of the Hudson River, all that water that comes out of the Hudson shoots out into the ocean and goes all the way to the

edge where the coastal area breaks off and goes into the deep sea right there. We want to conserve that space.

CHATTERLEY: Why isn't it protected now? I've been whale spotting or trying to -- because you protect them too. Why it is not protected now?

MEDINA: You know, we just don't think of the ocean as a place to put a park, but it's exactly where we need them. And in fact, there is a treaty

that is about to be voted on at the U.N. that would protect areas in the high seas that belong to no country which has never been done before. It's

so very important.

And the Hudson Canyon is a crucial part of the New York seascape. And you can log on to our website and sign a petition to help persuade the U.S.

government to protect this incredible place with deep water corals and whales and all kinds of species of fish. It's an amazing place, it's seven

Empire State Buildings deep. It's a real canine.

CHATTERLEY: Seven Empire State Buildings deep.

MEDINA: Huge and an important area for us to conserve right now, while we can.

CHATTERLEY: Talk about some of the other projects that you're doing because you do run the aquarium which we are here and then seeing today.


CHATTERLEY: But also some of the parks, the zoos as well. So it's not just about the water. But talk about some of the water projects that you have

going on in what, near 60 different countries all over the world.

MEDINA: We work in 60 countries all over the world, as you said nearly 60. And we are working hard to preserve coral reefs in many of those places to

work with fishing communities, with women who often are sort of the backbone of fishing communities where we know that there are illegal

fishers out there that are taking from coastal waters of poor countries.


So we're working on ending that, we have so many programs to help build up barriers along coastlines. You know, here in New York, one of the most

important ways that we can protect ourselves from storms is through replanting oyster reefs, which is a huge project working on that as well.

So our mission is to both protect out there in the wild, and to educate people here in New York City. And people who come from all over the world

to New York City to visit our aquarium here, because it's full of information about why there's such an important connection between what we

do on land, and what happens in the ocean plastic Pollution.

CHATTERLEY: Oh, my goodness, we just had the Head of the U.N. Executive Pro Environment Program.

MEDINA: Right, environment programming.

CHATTERLEY: Talking about this specifically. And she was saying to us that right now we're on track to reduce plastic pollution in the oceans by

around 8 percent by 2040.

MEDINA: 8 percent.

CHATTERLEY: Their mission is 10 times that. We as individuals can do more surely. I mean, clearly, there's vested interest in the plastic sector of

the world, there's going to be pressure the other way. We as individuals can do more too.

MEDINA: We absolutely can, there are 21,000 pieces of plastic in the ocean for every person on this planet. And that's 8 billion people. So it's

trillions of pieces of plastic in the ocean that means it's getting into our food chain. And that means it's in us.


MEDINA: Which is why this U.N. agreement is so important, but there are things people can do every day, they can buy those reusable water bottles

and bring those around. We know people need water, it's getting hotter, but you can carry around a reusable water bottle, or you can buy laundry

detergent in paper cartons as opposed to in plastic tubs.

We don't have to get rid of every modern convenience, we know plastic is sort of miraculous for the things that can do. But that's also makes it

hard for us to get rid of it in the environment. So if we think about using plastic for the things, we really need it and not for those single use

uses, things like plastic carry bags, and plastic water bottles. We can replace those will go a long way towards solving the plastic pollution


CHATTERLEY: I am sure our viewers will be able to hear the noise of the wind, it's so beautiful here.

MEDINA: It's a lovely day.

CHATTERLEY: Something that people need to think about when they start using the beaches, as we're seeing now is the summer months come as well. One of

the questions that I think was important to ask you is why is it hazy?

MEDINA: You know it's amazing, people think that the environment is a local issue. But it is a global issue. Right now there are massive fires

happening in Canada, seems like that's pretty far from us here in New York City. But the winds and the way that the currents, the air currents go,

we're getting an awful lot of the residual smoke from those fires.

And you can see it's made the sky here a little gray and cloudy. And in countries around the world where they don't have sufficient pollution

controls. This is what.

CHATTERLEY: This is air.

MEDINA: This is what it looks like. And we know, we know after COVID, when we all stopped driving how much cleaner the air looked and felt to us. And

we can see the difference on a day like today.

CHATTERLEY: The importance to me at this moment too is that we're one world, we're all connected in the impact that we have in one country. A

filter around the world is an argument for us all to work together on this.

MEDINA: The Ocean is the thing that connects everyone on the planet. There's not many oceans, there's really only one ocean, that's what

scientists would tell you and it connects everyone on the planet.

CHATTERLEY: Yes, final message about the importance of World Oceans Day. Not just a one day a year, but also every day and also to educate our

young. I looked and saw that you had some -- cancel, though. I don't think I quite make the age, age range. But we have to teach our young about

importance of the oceans too.

MEDINA: We do and you know, I think people love the ocean. So it's not hard to motivate them. We just need to help them know how. And to appreciate

that if we don't take care of it, we won't have that oxygen to breathe, we won't have fish to eat; we won't have beautiful clean beaches to swim in.

And it is easy to do things yourself but we also need to remind our governments to take action. That's why that U.N. agreement on high seas

areas is so important. That's why that you an agreement on plastics is so important. And why working together I think we can solve these problems. We

just have to put our minds to it.

CHATTERLEY: Final quick pitch, money, this takes money and this takes resources. What can people do to help you specifically?

MEDINA: If you want to help us out, just go to and check out all the work that we do and if you have $1 to spare or 10 or 20, please drop us

a donation. We will make good use of it.

CHATTERLEY: Thank you.

MEDINA: Thank you very much.


CHATTERLEY: We'll visit the aquarium because it was a great day out, I loved it. OK, just ahead here on "First Move" south Florida football fans

are in for a treat. A superstar Lionel Messi announces his next news, more on that next.


CHATTERLEY: Welcome back to "First Move". And some Miami magic yes, there are some excited football fans in Florida today with news that Lionel Messi

is coming to town. The Argentinian superstar considered by many to be the best player in the history of the game.

Is that designed for David Beckham's club into Miami? World Sports, Patrick Snell joins us now to discuss. Patrick, welcome to the show. It's --

moment, the three M's, he didn't take the money by going to Saudi; he didn't go for the memories with Barcelona. He chose Miami. Why?

PATRICK SNELL, CNN WORLD SPORT: Miami. Nice. I tell you what, Julia, this is an incredible story. I don't think too many saw this one coming. You

know, my mind has been reflecting on the great Pele when he came to America in the 1970s and played for the New York Cosmos. David Beckham himself in

2007 is going to the LA Galaxy as well.

This is perfect timing as well, massive feel good factor now over here in the United States. The Men's World Cup is going to be here in 2026, along

with Canada and Mexico as well and then how about this? When the news was announced Julia into Miami's Instagram account going from 1 million

followers to 5 million followers in the space of 24 hours alone, I think that tells its own story.

You know, he wasn't meant to be doing this supposedly. Those in the know were indicating he was off to maybe back to Barcelona where he had all that

success earlier in his career, or maybe after Saudi Arabia to join Cristiano Ronaldo in the Saudi Pro League. It did not happen.

And now Major League Soccer has one massive coup on its hands. This is just massive news. Let's retrace our steps and hear how Messi himself broke the

news to Spanish media on Wednesday. Watch and listen.


LIONEL MESSI, 2022 WORLD CUP WINNER: I made the decision that I am going to Miami. I still haven't closed it 100 percent. I'm missing some things. But

we decided to continue my journey there.


SNELL: This is a man, this is an icon Julia who rarely, rarely speaks in public, I'm telling you. So when he does, we're hanging on his every word,

just quickly to reset for our viewers what he's achieved in the game because it is very, very substantial. He still by the way on the contract

just officially at least to Paris Saint-Germain, this is not yet.

This is not yet a done deal to enter Miami I will say career defining moment for him late last year when he wins the World Cup for the first time

and a storied career Julia, as I mentioned earlier with Barcelona.


34 trophies in total during his time there, seven Ballon d'Ors during a magnificent carrier and of course it still continues and of course for

champions leagues as well, what a story? We're having this conversation today.

CHATTERLEY: He's got nothing left to prove. I mean, he could go away he likes, but it's very exciting, I can say living on this side of the world.

I'm very excited. But I have to say, Patrick, I do love your voice. I mean, I love listening to you anchoring. But even if it weren't that exciting,

just listening to you talk about it gets me really excited.

SNELL: I'm very blessed. Thank you so much.

CHATTERLEY: Fingers crossed, this works because I'm very happy for Floridians at this moment.

SNELL: Welcome, thank you so much.

CHATTERLEY: Great to chat with you. Thank you, Patrick Snell there. OK, that's it for the show. We're all excited now. If you missed any of our

interviews today, there'll be on my Twitter and Instagram pages as always, you can search for @jchatterleycnn. In the meantime, "Connect the World" is

up next. And I'll see you tomorrow.