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First Move with Julia Chatterley
Wildfires Tear Through Los Angeles; Trump Mulls Declaring Emergency to Impose Tariffs; "Delta Concierge" A.I. Launched; Delta CEO on 100 Years of Service; Countries Push Back on Trump's Foreign Policy Threats; L.A. Firefighters Overwhelmed; Coursera Sees Boom in Demand for A.I. Courses. Aired 6-7p ET
Aired January 08, 2025 - 18:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[18:00:00]
JAKE TAPPER, CNN ANCHOR: You can follow me on Facebook, Instagram, Threads, X, on the TikTok, @jaketapper. You can follow the show on X, @The
LeadCNN. If you ever miss an episode of the lead, you can listen to the show whence you get your podcasts. The news continues on CNN with Wolf
Blitzer in The Situation.
JULIA CHATTERLEY, CNN ANCHOR, FIRST MOVE: It's 7:00 a.m. in Shanghai, 3:00 p.m. in Los Angeles, and 6:00 p.m. here in New York. I'm Julia Chatterley.
And wherever you are in the world, this is your "First Move."
And a warm welcome to "First Move," as always. And here's today's need to know. Firefighting. Four devastating wildfires burning in Los Angeles with
no end in sight. Economic emergency. Donald Trump considering a declaration that would give him wide powers to impose swift tariffs. A.I. assignment.
I'll speak to the CEO of online learning giant Coursera on the surging demand for courses tied to artificial intelligence.
And --
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ED BASTIAN, CEO, DELTA AIR LINES: The demand has never been stronger. The product has never done greater. Our customer satisfaction rates have never
been higher.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CHATTERLEY: -- Delta's CEO tells me what's next for the airline as it celebrates a century in service. That conversation and plenty more coming
up.
But first, massive fires tearing through Los Angeles, forcing thousands of people to flee their homes. The popular tourist area of Santa Monica has
just posted an evacuation order now for the northern part of the city. At least two people have died. All four blazes at zero percent containment.
Leaving first responders focused on saving lives.
President Joe Biden visited the area later, signing off on a major disaster declaration for California. The fires have been fueled by an intense
windstorm torching thousands of acres in just 24 hours. Nick Watt has more.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I just have one bag to pick. It's fine, mom. Just get out of the house.
NICK WATT, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Just look at that view out her window, and this.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, let's get out of here. We tried. We tried, bro.
WATT (voice-over): More than 50,000 people have been ordered or advised to evacuate from the Palisades Fire alone.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That makes the difference between living and not.
WATT (voice-over): Flames hopped major roads, including the fabled Pacific Coast Highway.
CHIEF KRISTIN M. CROWLEY, LOS ANGELES CITY FIRE DEPARTMENT: We are absolutely not out of danger yet. With the strong winds that continue to
push through the city and the county today.
WATT (voice-over): Those strong Santa Ana winds were forecast, we knew something was coming, just not this. Officials say they prepped for maybe
one or two fires.
CHIEF ANTHONY MARRONE, LOS ANGELES COUNTY FIRE DEPARTMENT: There are not enough firefighters in L.A. County to address four separate fires of this
magnitude.
WATT (voice-over): Four major fires are now burning in L.A. County, the most heavily populated county in the entire country.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I'm acting home, and I'm really very upset inside.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This year we knew with zero rain that one big windstorm and we were toast. It seems like a lot of the homes here they're burning
because of embers that have landed in bushes and are lighting.
WATT (voice-over): Wind gusts in SoCal hit 100 miles per hour, driving flames through bone dry brush and homes. Utter devastation in the desirable
neighborhood of Pacific Palisades. This is Palisades village the now barely recognizable sushi downtown. We were here last night as those winds were
picking up.
In the early hours, the fire hydrants here ran dry.
JANISSE QUINONES, CEO, LOS ANGELES DEPARTMENT OF WATER AND POWER: We were not able to fill the cans fast enough. So, the consumption of water was
faster than we can provide water.
WATT (voice-over): The Palisades Fire already among the 20 worst in California's recorded history, and 15 of those have hit in just the past
decade. As our climate changes and our planet warms.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is a tragic time in our history here in Los Angeles, but a time where we're really tested and see who we really are.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
CHATTERLEY: And just breaking in the last few moments, the Los Angeles County Sheriff Robert Luna has told CNN affiliate KABC that five people are
dead as a result of the Eaton Fire. So, five people losing their lives as a result of the Eaton Fire.
Now, Julia Vargas Jones joins us from Altadena in California. Julia, good to have us with us. We can see the scenes of devastation behind you. Just
describe what you're seeing and the battle that the firefighters there are facing.
JULIA VARGAS JONES: Yes, Julia. Listen, this is one of the main drag. Sol, behind me, this is the scene we've seen all over. This is one of the main
drags. This is Lake Avenue in Altadena. Just up this street, that is -- that's the mountains that you might be able to see past this wall of smoke.
That's where the fire has been coming from.
[18:05:00]
I just spoke to a resident of three blocks up this way who just went to see if his home was still there. He told me, absolutely it is not. It's just
been completely destroyed by this fire.
The winds are just starting to pick up again. I felt it just before we got on this live shot. We got a little gust coming from this one structure.
Across the street, this used to be a church right here. The cars that you're seeing crossing up and down, these are people trying to check on
their homes, trying to get out to get their pets.
We saw for the first time a helicopter dumped a little bit of water in one of the structures over here. This is where we came from. We just did a big
sweep around these four or five blocks, trying to see the extent of the damage. And, Julia, it is apocalyptic. That is the right word to use here.
It doesn't look real. It doesn't look like this is the City of Altadena anymore. There's so much the extent of the damage is so wide. It's nothing
like I've ever seen before. And these firefighters have been working so hard. 750 firefighters working shifts of 36, 48 hours, dealing with issues
like lack of water. Some of the residents here telling me that there isn't any water for them to actually try and help.
We've noticed also, and I spoke to neighbors using buckets, using garden hoses, trying to get the fire to stop. So, it doesn't advance deeper into
their neighborhoods. People are desperate and they're pleading with authorities to try and get attention to their homes. But it's difficult and
firefighters have difficult choices to make.
We saw firefighters leave this active fire that I'm standing in front of to go to something that probably must have been much more urgent. A fleet of
engines going up the street. We can only imagine what kind of flames are over there, Julia. But the winds picking back up with the containment
definitely nowhere close to what it should be or what it needs to be for this to be stopped. It is very concerning and I cannot imagine the level of
panic that people who live in this area are feeling right now.
You know, we've seen this resignation almost from some of the residents. So, people just think, well, I don't know what to do there. They're numb to
just see your entire home go up in flames. It's just been -- it's been difficult to watch. And to see people come together, it's also -- to help
their neighbors, to help people in their community, even when they themselves have lost everything. It's quite touching, Julia. But the scale
of this, I can't stress this enough, it is devastating.
CHATTERLEY: Yes, difficult to watch. Also, difficult to breathe. I mean, we can see that the smoke in the air around you in particular, Julia. And
as you say, it's sort of an overwhelming task for the firefighters because they have to, as they've been saying, prioritize life and they can't
prioritize buildings at this stage and provide the level of water to try and put some of those flames out, which is devastating.
What the weather forecast and the meteorologists are saying to us is that the wind has dropped. Have you felt that as you've been reporting over the
course of the day? Because that's sort of one hope that that will at least in some way contain the spread, the ongoing spread of this. Have you felt
the wind speed drop?
JONES: Yes, we did. Absolutely. Throughout the mid-morning, we had a kind of a lull of wind. I'm just going to -- I'm going to step over here. I'm
sorry. I'm just feeling a little bit of heat on my back here. I just want to step away to be safe here, Julia.
Look, it has been -- there's been a lull, and right before we came on with you, I just felt a gust of wind pick back up. So, I mean, I think I'm not
sure. I'm not sure what the next few hours hold for us, but we're hoping that -- here it is again, we feel the wind coming back.
But at least now we can see there's some helicopters up in the air. And so, that means that the winds are not too bad. That means that we can, at this
point in time, compliment what's happening on the ground in terms of battling these flames with some aerial work, which is huge. That makes a
big, big difference, Julia, in how much area they can cover at once. So, that does and should give hope to some of the families here.
CHATTERLEY: Yes, an important sign there, certainly, if they can get up in the air with visibility and with the wind speed dropping as well. Julia,
thank you so much for joining us. You stay safe, please, there. Julia Vargas Jones there in L.A. for us.
All right. President-Elect Donald Trump heading back to the White House less than two weeks from now. Speculation about what he'll do about tariffs
in his first days in office has reached a fever pitch.
[18:10:00]
CNN has learned that Trump and his team are now considering declaring a national economic emergency that would allow them to quickly impose
universal tariffs and oversee imports. The Trump transition team has not yet responded to CNN's request for comment, but one source says, quote,
"nothing is off the table." Kayla Tausche has more.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
KAYLA TAUSCHE, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: President-Electe Donald Trump and his team of advisers are currently searching for a legal
avenue to enact the wide-ranging tariffs that he has proposed on the campaign trail, building on a tariff program that he put in place in his
first term, but now trying to take it a step further.
Sources familiar with the matter tell me that the president-elect and his advisers are exploring using the International Economic Emergency Powers
Act, known as IEPA. The president, under this plan, would potentially declare a national economic emergency, therefore setting the stage for
legal justification to advance those broad and wide-ranging tariffs against both allies and adversaries.
Now, under this law, known as IEPA, a president is allowed to regulate imports during a time of national emergency. It's unclear what basis
President-Elect Trump would use to declare this emergency if he ends up choosing this path, given that job growth and economic growth are certainly
doing well and have been for years.
President-Elect Trump himself at a press conference even said that on January 20th, when he takes office, the economy will be in great shape. But
it does provide him very large and wide-ranging legal remit to go forward with these tariffs, which he's proposed as 10 percent on imports from any
country around the world and up to 60 percent tariffs on anything coming in from China.
Now, certainly Trump's team are also exploring other legal avenues to pursue these tariffs, but they advise that some of those avenues would be
lengthy, protracted, and be met with opposition. They would require an investigation and very strict national security grounds to actually move
forward with some of these tariffs. Using IEPA, they know, would potentially be a way to get around that.
Now, all of this comes as no decision has been made on which specific avenue to proceed with, but Trump's team is trying to figure out how to put
pen to paper on his campaign pledges and try to make a splash as soon as he takes office.
Kayla Tausche, CNN, The White House.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
CHATTERLEY: Our thanks to Kayla there. Now, it's not just the threat of tariffs that has America's allies and training partners on edge, President-
Elect Trump, wide-ranging foreign policy threats that he amplified in his press conference Tuesday are creating fresh concerns over just how
expansionist his foreign policy might be. Nations in Trump's apparent sights expressed further resistance on Wednesday, as Nic Robertson reports.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
NIC ROBERTSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL DIPLOMATIC EDITOR (voice-over): It's the image amplifying President-Elect Donald Trump's latest international
threat. His son, Donald Jr., landing in Greenland for a private visit.
DONALD TRUMP JR., DONALD TRUMP'S SON: Just really excited to be here.
ROBERTSON (voice-over): As his father refused to rule out taking the autonomous Danish territory by force.
DONALD TRUMP, U.S. PRESIDENT-ELECT: We need them for economic security.
AAJA CHEMNITZ, MEMBER OF DANISH PARLIAMENTARY/GREENLAND RESIDENT: Greenland is not for sale. Greenland will never be for sale.
ROBERTSON (voice-over): Danish politicians in particular outraged by what many see as a Trump stunt.
CHEMNITZ: The majority in Greenland, they find it quite scary, actually, and quite uncomfortable.
ROBERTSON (voice-over): The world's largest island, home to little more than 56,000 people, with huge strategic and mineral value, is trying to
carve out its own place in the world and it's not for sale according to its government. But some of its politicians do see a compromise.
KUNO FENCKER, MEMBER OF GREENLAND PARLIAMENT: We are working on creating a sovereign country, which is Greenland. If Trump is talking about a real
estate agreement, the U.S. is renting a big area of land in North Greenland and it should be just very normal to pay for that.
ROBERTSON (voice-over): Across the world in Panama, where Trump also warns force is an option to take back control of the globally vital Panama Canal,
there is no negotiation to be had.
JAVIER MARTINEZ-ACHA, FOREIGN MINISTER OF PANAMA (through translator): Our canal's sovereignty is not negotiable, and is part of our history of
struggle, and an irreversible conquest.
ROBERTSON (voice-over): Canada, too, in Trump's crosshairs for annexation.
TRUMP: They should be a state.
ROBERTSON (voice-over): So, much rhetoric, the German chancellor appears to compare Trump with Russian President Vladimir Putin.
OLAF SCHOLZ, GERMAN CHANCELLOR (through translator): The principle of inviolability of borders applies to every country, regardless of whether it
is to the east or west of us. Every country must adhere to that.
[18:15:00]
ROBERTSON (voice-over): Unlike his first term, where world leaders dismiss Trump's often bombastic rhetoric as just that, this time they seem to be
preparing for more push and heavy persuasion from the incoming commander in chief.
METTE FREDERIKSEN, PRIME MINISTER OF DENMARK (through translator): There are a lot of words being spoken right now. We need to stay calm and stick
to our principles.
ROBERTSON (voice-over): Denmark's newly revamped royal coat of arms, a calibrated hint of that calm. The polar bear representing Greenland just
got bigger.
Nic Robertson, CNN, London.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
CHATTERLEY: OK. Straight ahead for us, A.I. in the sky. Delta Airlines rolling out a digital concierge service for passengers powered by
artificial intelligence. We'll hear the details from the carrier's CEO.
And A.I. gaining altitude in the classroom too. Online learning firm Coursera says students are signing up every 10 seconds. Find out how A.I.
Essentials can help you amplify your credentials. That's coming up.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
CHATTERLEY: Welcome back to "First Move" on a wobbly Wednesday for U.S. stocks. In today's Money Move, the Dow and the S&P posting modest gains.
Tech a little softer as U.S. investors dial back hopes for additional Fed rate cuts.
Just released, Federal Reserve Minutes showing Central Bank officials laser focused on how President-Elect Trump's economic policies might reignite
inflation. Nearly all Fed members saying inflation risks are on the rise. It seems the move to cut rates in December might have been a closer call
than we thought. The next meeting bears watching.
In Asia, stocks finishing Wednesday's session mostly lower. China seeing its currency fall to a 16-month low against the dollar -- U.S. dollar, due
in part to Trump tariff fears. Beijing also boosting subsidies for consumers in hopes that they'll spend more and jump start growth.
Now, shares of Delta Airlines are off to a flying start this year with some big updates to mark the company's centennial. The Delta Concierge is a new
A.I.-powered assistant on its app that aims to elevate the travel experience. Delta also announcing free YouTube access on its flights for
SkyMiles members.
I spoke about these initiatives earlier today with Delta CEO Ed Bastian, who also delivered a keynote speech at CES in Las Vegas. Listen in.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ED BASTIAN, CEO, DELTA AIR LINES: Well, thank you, Julia. It's great to be with you. Happy New Year to you as well. We're turning a hundred -- we
turned a hundred years old this year and what a great way to kick off our hundredth year -- second hundredth year, our centennial at the sphere last
night in Vegas at the CES show.
[18:20:00]
Extraordinary interest in Delta in the next century of flight. First U.S. airline to turn 100. So, we had a lot to talk about, and certainly,
technology is going to be a big enabler of our future.
CHATTERLEY: Yes, and with age comes wisdom, certainly as far as technology is concerned. Talk to me about how you're going to be using A.I. to enhance
the customer experience, and I know you're sort of ready to go this year. So, it's happy birthday and let's get on with it. How is A.I. going to
improve the customer experience?
BASTIAN: Well, we talked about A.I. in a number of different settings, whether it's enhancing the operational performance of the airline. We
already are the world's most reliable airline, but there's certainly things we can continue to learn through technology to get better, more predictive
and more -- make the consumer experience that much more easier.
But when you really think about A.I., one of the greatest opportunities we have is what we announced last night with a product called Delta Concierge,
which is an A.I. -- gen A.I. enabled basically assistant, a personal assistant that you can use over the Fly Delta app that knows you, knows
your preferences, knows your opportunities, can serve up to you as much as you need, whether you want to change a flight, whether you want to change a
seat, whether you want to check on a different price, whether you want to bring your family. What do you want to do when you get to your destination?
CHATTERLEY: I know you've also made changes to in-flight entertainment as well, which is sort of an A.I. upgrade but also a partnership with YouTube.
Talk to me about what that's going to mean for someone who's getting on one of the Delta flights. How is that going to upgrade the experience?
BASTIAN: Well, two years ago when I was here at CES, we announced the launch of free fast Wi-Fi for all. As long as you're a member of our
SkyMiles program, which is easy to access, there's no cost to join. And now, we're ubiquitous. It's throughout the U.S., it's through many of our
international destinations. We'll be completed through this year on a global scale.
And what that's enabled us to do is to bring new offerings, new product on board the plane from an entertainment angle. We currently have great
companies like Paramount Plus, T-Mobile here in the States, Amex, Walmart Plus where customers have a lot of opportunities to either shop or to be
entertained. But the greatest entertainment venue there is right now in terms of TV and broadcast and original content, including creative content
is YouTube.
And we announced an exclusive long-term arrangement with YouTube, where they're going to be bringing their content providers, their creators onto
our screens, and customers can either watch that on their handheld devices, they'll be able to watch it in our seatback screens. We have 165,000
seatback screens flying a day.
CHATTERLEY: And I love the idea as well of being able to tap into the content that I have on my own phone as well, potentially and sort of
casting to some of the screens. Now, I will say, I took a flight from Doha to New York recently. It was with Catereres (ph). And I took one flight
going there, which had no Wi-Fi due to various issues. And then I took a flight back, which had Starlink.
And I know they're boosting the accessibility of Starlink. I know United, also a competitor, is accelerating their adoption of Starlink. Talk to me
about what you're thinking as far as this is concerned. Because for me as a customer, this was a gamechanger from start to finish.
BASTIAN: Yes. Well, we're familiar with Starlink. We have worked with SpaceX for some time. In the original design of it several years ago, we
were ready to go, they weren't quite ready for us. And so, we have another satellite provider. There could be opportunities in the future to enhance
it. But right now, our product is excellent on board.
We're a leader in the space. First in the sky with free fast Wi-Fi for all. We've got a lot of people announcing it. Not a lot of people actually up
and running. So, all those announcements you're seeing, be careful. But we're actually system wide with it this year. And we'll have opportunities.
Now, if there's better satellite providers, that's great, but we already have the equipment and the technology and the capabilities on board our
planes today, and our customers are enjoying it. You know, historically, less than 5 percent of a cabin took Wi-Fi when it was a pay model. Today
that we democratized it, made it free for all, we have 40 percent of our customers using it today on board and on some of our international
journeys, that number is higher, as high as 75 or 80 percent.
So, we understand the space well and if we can get better satellite coverage, believe me, we'll be well over it.
CHATTERLEY: Yes, the unsaid message there was, Julia, get on the Delta Flight and see what you think before you talk about the competitors.
[18:25:00]
The challenge with greater digitization and connectivity, obviously, is it makes you more vulnerable to basic errors, to cyber risks. And obviously,
we saw that last year with the Microsoft CrowdStrike debacle and obviously, it caused flight problems for you and it caused financial issues for both
you and your customers. And I know you're challenging that with litigation. I guess my question is, how do you accelerate in one sense that mitigate
the risks of the other?
BASTIAN: Well, that event was a control breakdown within the CrowdStrike operating process. They did not have the controls to catch a mistake that
they made, which perpetrated a bug not just through Delta, by the way, as you know, through thousands and thousands of other companies around the
world.
We've gone through and made certain that there's no technology provider that has the access that CrowdStrike had directly to our kernel, which is
our core operating system. So, we're clean from that type of instance.
But you're right, cyber security, all forms of protection around the important digital assets that we've created is vital. It's one of the
reasons we've moved our technology stack to the cloud world with AWS. We've done that over the last several years, and they're doing a great job
helping us, not just with flexibility and efficiency and delivering great computing power, but also it's much more resilient as well.
CHATTERLEY: You've also very quickly expressed great optimism about the incoming U.S. administration. You suggested, and I'll use your word, that
there was overreach by the prior administration. Can you be specific on what you're optimistic about in terms of perhaps pulling back on that reach
and where you get regulatory clarity from the next administration or where you're hopeful of it?
BASTIAN: Well, the word I think -- I did use the word overreach, but the word that also comes to mind is balance. We understand the importance of
smart and strategic regulatory authority from the Department of Transportation, and we respect that, and we endorse that.
We also know that the industry itself needs to have an advocate, and it can't be one sided. And I think that's what we saw. It was very one sided
under the current administration. And we hope in the next administration that will be a more balanced approach, understanding the importance to
provide opportunities for the industry to continue to grow and succeed just like our consumers do.
CHATTERLEY: On that note, Ed, happy birthday once again. Message to customers and potential customers as you hit 100 years old?
BASTIAN: Our next century of flight is looking incredibly exciting and promising. Where we're going to focus ourselves for the next century is on
international. We think about the first century of flight, it was very much about connecting regions and continents. The next century is going to be
very much connecting the world.
Only one in five people in the world have even been on an airplane. Just think about that statistic. And when you think about the remote area of the
world, whether it's in the South Pacific, whether it's in Africa, South America, so many other places where air travel could eventually make a huge
difference in terms of growth and economic development and opportunity.
CHATTERLEY: Yes.
BASTIAN: Yes.
CHATTERLEY: Good luck with that, sir. Fantastic. Happy birthday and great to chat to you. And Happy New Year.
BASTIAN: Thank you, Julia.
CHATTERLEY: Always a pleasure, sir.
BASTIAN: Happy New Year to you.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
CHATTERLEY: Ed Bastian, the Delta CEO there. All right. Coming up for us, Los Angeles fire crews were ready to handle one or two major wildfires, but
never this many all at the same time. Coming up, we'll be speaking to a scientist whose long said policies to protect homes in this region are
woefully lacking. A must change now. Find out how, next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
CHATTERLEY: Welcome back to "First Move." And we continue with our coverage of the wildfires in Los Angeles, where the county sheriff says at
least five people are now dead due to the flames. Residents in affected areas are trying to save their homes, while others are forced to leave with
simply what they can carry.
One of the fires has already destroyed at least a thousand structures, making it the most destructive in L.A. County's history. Fire officials
meanwhile have to use bulldozers to clear cars abandoned after their drivers had to flee on foot.
Chad Hanson is a wildfire scientist and author of "Smokescreen: Debunking Wildfire Myths to Save our Forests and our Climate." And he joins us now
from California. Chad, good to have you with us. I'm sorry about under these circumstances.
Can you just put what we're seeing in perspective? Because I think we do in some respects grow used to scenes of devastation when it's wildfires, but
these aren't forest fires, these are deep within communities.
CHAD HANSON, WILDFIRE SCIENTIST AND FIRE ECOLOGIST, JOHN MUIR PROJECT AND AUTHOR, "SMOKESCREEN": That's right. You know, not only are they not
forest fires, but these are fires that are mostly in grasslands or chaparral areas, you know, shrub habitats. Oak woodlands, these are not
forest fires.
And there -- fires that are being driven by weather and climate factors, these are climate and weather driven events. We have a hurricane force
winds. You know, you can't fight or stop fires like this. And they're driving the fires right to these communities. And the problem is, is that
our current forest policies, our current wildland fire policies are focused on forests and removing trees from forest, thinking that's going to stop
fire somehow. In reality, it actually doesn't do that at all. But also, it ignores the fact that most communities that are vulnerable to wildland
fires are nowhere near a forest. And really, this is a community safety issue, and it has to be addressed at the community itself. And there are
proven ways to do that.
CHATTERLEY: And this is a critical question, I think, is even voices that I've heard speaking in Congress today. Again, they're talking about
forestry and forestation, and what you're saying is, and I will reiterate that point that, there are no forests near this. This is happening
shrubbery. There needs to be better plans in place to protect homes that don't involve that.
So, Chad, to that point, what approach should be used and where should resources be focused?
HANSON: Yes. You know, and that's the key question. So, there are four things that need to be done to shift our federal wildland fire policy to
actually protect communities. Number one, we need to focus on home hardening, and that's basically making the homes themselves more fireproof,
more fire resistant, simple things like fire resistant roofing, but also even simpler things like, wire mesh that is a fine scale, like one-16th or
one-eighth inch mesh on exterior events like attic spaces.
[18:35:00]
And what that does is it'll prevent the embers from being blown into the attic by the winds. A lot of homes burn in that way. And, you know, a
couple hundred dollars can honestly stop a lot of homes from burning. So, people need the help. They need the information because a lot of people
don't know this. But that's the first one.
The second one is defensible space pruning. And that's basically removing dry grasses for the most part and lower limbs within 100 feet of homes or
less, that's a key factor. And evacuation planning and assistance. A lot of communities need the help for effective evacuation planning and plans.
And the last one is just redirecting our resources. You know, right now we're subsidizing logging in back country public forests to the tune of
billions of dollars a year, and we have policymakers telling the public that that's going to somehow stop a wildland fire from reaching a town, but
it's not doing that. The fires are often spreading faster through these logged areas.
But more importantly, they -- most of the communities that are at risk, like these communities in Los Angeles are not in the forest, they're in low
elevation areas and foothills and valleys where it's mostly grass and shrub habitat. So, yes, we kind of just need to, you know, do 180-degree reversal
from our past policies.
And this is no moment for political opportunism. This is a moment to come together and put community safety first.
CHATTERLEY: I mean, what's frightening about this, Chad, is that what you're saying is that there needs to be a sort of 180 policy shift. But
actually, some of the policies that are in place are actually exacerbating the problem.
I saw Senator Tim Sheehy, Republican of Montana, talking about this on Capitol Hill today, and he said that we're not set up at the state or the
federal level to deal with this. To your point -- and he suggested, by the way, there was bipartisan support for change. Do you believe that Congress
is on board with this? Because you also mentioned sort of a shift from the logging industry required here. There's clearly incentives to focus on
certain things and not others.
Is Congress ready for the shift in policy that you're talking about? Because clearly, the public needs to be aware of simple steps that can be
made to protect their homes better.
HANSON: Yes. Well, there is some positive movement, I will say, and this is a good sign. There is some bipartisan support for putting some focus on
protecting communities, through home hardening defensible space, pruning, evacuation, planning, and assistance. Those three things. That's key.
The problem is, is that the bipartisan leaders of this policy shift are not shifting the funding away from the place where it's mostly going right now,
in terms of wildland policy -- wildland fire policy, and that's into subsidies for back country logging, which is not doing anything to help.
It's actually making climate change worse. And oftentimes it's associated with faster spreading fires toward towns in these mountain communities that
actually are in the forest, which again, most of the at-risk communities are not in force. And so, it's really just, you know, a misplaced
anachronistic policy that needs to change.
CHATTERLEY: Yes, and lobbying power to a certain degree, breaking, or requiring some breakage as well. Chad, to your point, very quickly, because
I have about sort of 20 or 30 seconds. What proportion, and if you don't know, I understand, of the homes that we're looking at now that are being
destroyed have home hardening measures in place?
HANSON: Great question. Very few. You know, where -- again, most people don't realize that home hardening is something that will save their home
and defensible space pruning. They haven't been told. They haven't gotten the message or they do know, but they can't afford it and they need help.
And so, most of these communities are not being protected in the way they could be.
Where we have seen communities that have done the home hardening and the defensible space, the vast majority of homes survived fires.
CHATTERLEY: OK. Chad, we're going to continue this conversation when there's less of an emergency situation going because we need to talk about
this again and raise awareness. Great to have you on, sir. Thank you so much. Chad Hanson there.
HANSON: Thank you.
CHATTERLEY: All right. For more on what residents can expect in the coming hours, we're now joined by Chad Myers. Chad, I'm sure you were listening to
that conversation as well. It's sort of fascinating, isn't it? Tell us what's coming. And I believe there is some good news on wind speeds, which
you were talking to us about being so dangerous yesterday.
CHAD MYERS, CNN METEOROLOGIST: 100 percent. The wind speeds are going to come down by half overnight tonight from where they were. One thing,
though, that people don't realize, and I didn't even know this until 30 years ago, in the old days when people actually had curtains and not
blinds, if you closed your curtains and the fires were outside your home, the heat from the fire itself could penetrate right through the glass, get
to the flash point of the curtain, which was typically polyester or something, and actually burn the house from the inside out, even though the
fire not actually never got inside the house itself. How about that?
CHATTERLEY: Wow.
[18:40:00]
MYERS: So, now they say spread the curtains apart or pull them down altogether, because at least they won't get -- if the fire is here, window
here, curtain here, at least you have a little bit of a buffer.
So, here's how it happened last night. 95 percent of the world when the sun sets, the winds die off. That doesn't happen in Southern California, not
with this setup. This high pressure here in the desert starts to get cold at night, completely clear skies. That air wants to sink, exact opposite of
a hot air balloon going up when the cold air gets colder, it goes down and then the desert exhales. And it exhaled right through the mountains, right
through the canyons and into the fire, and blowing those embers at nearly 80 miles per hour in those fire zones.
Now, we're not going to get 80 and we're not going to get 10, we're going to be somewhere between 20 and 40 miles per hour. A hundred miles per hour
is 160 kilometers per hour. And that's just -- you can't even think about what that wind might be. That's a hurricane, but no wind -- no rain,
rather, because we would love to see the rain.
This hasn't had a drop of rain since March. Really? OK. Maybe a couple drops in May, but the last time it had one inch of rain was March 30th and
it has been dry ever since. Everything that grew last year is now dry and is now burning. So, winds are coming down into the 20s in the 30s. Still
the red flag warning, which means please be careful out there.
But by tomorrow, we could begin to see some winds pick up south of here. Could you imagine all the firefighters that are from down here did mutual
aid came up here and now all of a sudden, there were fires back down there? That's certainly what we don't need, but it's a possibility on Friday
morning when the winds pick up in San Diego.
To the east of San Diego, now the forecast and the computer models are saying possibly 80 miles per hour, 135 kilometers per hour. And no sparks
right now. And a wind is fine as long as there's no sparks. Julia.
CHATTERLEY: Yes, we'll continue to watch it, Chad. And I'm still digesting your curtains story. News you can use. Always great to have you on. Thank
you. Chad Myers there.
All right. Coming up on "First Move," Interest in A.I. education is surging. The CEO of online learning platform Coursera telling us which
classes are trending and why.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
CHATTERLEY: Welcome back to "First Move." It's probably no surprise that given how endlessly we talk about A.I., as more cash is invested in A.I.
development and as tech stocks, of course, tied to A.I. keep rising, more and more people want to get educated on what A.I. is and what it can do.
[18:45:00]
Coursera, one of the world's largest online learning platforms, says someone enrolled in an A.I. course every 10 seconds last year. And the most
popular course on the platform in 2024 was A.I. Essentials taught by Google. It comes at a time when around 40 percent of companies say they
plan to reduce their workforce by 2030 due to A.I. This, according to the World Economic Forum.
Now, joining us is the CEO of Coursera, Jeff Maggioncalda. Jeff, always a pleasure to have you on the show, sir. Happy New Year.
JEFF MAGGIONCALDA, CEO, COURSERA: Happy New Year, Julia.
CHATTERLEY: That is an extraordinary level of demand. What are the most popular courses and who's signing up for them?
MAGGIONCALDA: Yes, we're definitely seeing huge global demand for generative A.I. We could talk about which countries and which demographics.
But the big courses that are -- the top five courses that are generative A.I. courses are, as you mentioned, Google A.I. Essentials. That's good
sort of for the average person trying to learn the basics of this.
The second most popular is generative A.I. for executives and business leaders from IBM. So, this is like trying to figure out what to do with
your business. The third is introduction to generative A.I. for software developers. So, this technology is changing the way that software engineers
write code. Four is productivity from Microsoft 365 Copilot. And then five, which is one of my favorites is Accelerate You're learning with ChatGPT.
Learning how to use generative A.I. to learn more efficiently.
CHATTERLEY: It's brilliant. So, it's in all areas and all angles. And you mentioned something that does interest me, which nations. Who's the most
aggressive about understanding all of these things, whether it's business executives or just individuals?
MAGGIONCALDA: The number one country taking generally courses on Coursera is India. Number two is the U.S. But more than half of the people taking
generally courses on Coursera are actually in emerging markets like Pakistan, Brazil, Mexico, India, other countries who are seeing this -- you
know, the people around the world are seeing this as an opportunity to develop very high demand skills that could be very useful for getting
hired.
CHATTERLEY: That's fascinating, isn't it? I guess on India, we do have to do a population adjustment relative to the United States and other nations.
But the EM point is vital. Do these courses lead to jobs in certain cases, Jeff? Because I think this is an important one. And I can see some of the
biggest names are working with you. As you've said, NVIDIA, Google, Microsoft. Are they helping people understand that they also perhaps
training their employees of the future?
MAGGIONCALDA: Yes, I think it's both of those things. If you look at that World Economic Forum report that you just mentioned, when they look at the
top growing jobs, it's big data specialists, FinTech engineers. Number three is A.I. and machine learning specialists.
So, clearly people are learning these skills because as builders, they want to use the technology. We're also seeing though, to your point around
companies, people who don't learn these skills are going to fall behind other people that do.
So, we see in the in that same World Economic Forum Report, 80 percent of businesses plan to reskill their employees to teach them generative A.I.
because they're expecting a lot of productivity gains from this technology.
CHATTERLEY: Yes, the question is what else I guess? Because if you're looking at this and to the point that we were making with that World
Economic Forum survey, if people are reducing their workforce, what and how do you upskill beyond just understanding A.I. and having sort of the
digital know how? Are you seeing some surge in other courses as people look to perhaps diversify their skills? Because I think that's one of the things
that the questions that I'm always asking myself is, where else do you go?
MAGGIONCALDA: Yes. Well, there's -- a lot of where you go is being human. So, you know, one of the things that's happening because of general A.I.,
well, the world's changing very quickly and businesses are struggling to adapt. So, many of these skills that are not technical being learned on
Coursera are skills associated with adapting to change.
So, yes, general A.I. is a very top skill, but there's stakeholder communications, there's human resources, technology. Number four skill in
the -- in businesses is assertiveness. So, learning how to communicate, adapt to change, work in teams, negotiate, visualize presentations, a lot
of what this is about is adapting to change.
CHATTERLEY: Yes. I mean, seriously, I'm ready for that, Jeff, because I'm definitely expecting to be replaced by A.I. in like the next three or so
years, three to five. I've definitely got the human thing down. What do these courses cost, Jeff, for people that perhaps are looking to diversify
to understand? What's the average cost of one of these courses and how long do they last?
MAGGIONCALDA: Yes, they last as long as you want to take. They're always available. We have about 10,000 courses now. They cost about $49 a month.
It's a different pricing in different countries. So, lower pricing in certain parts of the world.
[18:50:00]
But what we've been able to do with generative A.I. is to translate more than 5,000 courses into more than 24 different languages. So, one of the
wonderful things about A.I. is the accessibility of this education and these skills is now global because of language translation, which we can
now do at scale.
CHATTERLEY: Yes, it's fantastic. And I think it's also as companies are looking to show return on their A.I. investments, being able to skill your
employees like this and have that sort of directly tied to it is important too. Jeff, we've always got more to talk to you about, but I've run out of
time. So, we'll reconvene, my friend. Great to have you on, sir. Thank you. The CEO of Coursera.
MAGGIONCALDA: Thanks for having me.
CHATTERLEY: Happy New Year again. Now, if you've missed any of our interviews today, they'll be on my X and Instagram pages. You can search
for @JChatterleyCNN.
Coming up, more on the devastating fires in Los Angeles. At least 1,000 homes and other structures have been destroyed, and the four fires are
still raging. We'll bring you the latest after this.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
CHATTERLEY: Welcome back to "First Move." And we return to our coverage of the devastating fires in Los Angeles County. At least five people have died
and several more have been injured as the region battles four major blazes.
Winds, as we were discussing earlier on the show, have subsided somewhat compared to earlier in the day, which should, to some degree, contain the
ongoing spread. However, they do remain strong, blowing embers and setting areas alight.
Now, in the meantime, President Joe Biden has approved a major disaster declaration for California. As you can see, he was there in Santa Monica
earlier, meeting with members of the emergency services. He's granted the state more federal resources as a result to help with the containment and
the recovery mission that will take place after these fires end burning.
Now, our Anderson Cooper is in Altadena, California by the Eaton Fire and he explained what it's like to be on the scene.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ANDERSON COOPER, CNN ANCHOR: The wind is just taking these embers from the tree. They're all over the block and they are moving to other houses. And
you see new fires being created from these embers.
This house is gone. I mean, just look, all these houses are gone here. This fire -- there's a fire crew here. I was talking to the captain earlier.
They ran out of water here on this street about 30 minutes ago. They went - - they hooked up the hydrants. They turned them on, the water ran out. So, now, they're just moving on to another area.
What they did when they don't have water is they try to create defensive perimeters around houses that they think they can save. And those houses
are houses that don't have a lot of bushes, hedges, plantings in front of them or around them, or if it does, they try to rip -- they spent they've
spent like the last hour just trying to clear debris from houses to try to maybe save it.
[18:55:00]
But it's a matter of luck or misfortune. Where are these embers land? Where are these flames -- the flames hop.
This area over here, I want to show you. I mean, this house is completely gone. We've watched this entire house burned down. The house next door. The
car that you see over here, we watched that. The flames jumped from the house onto the car. There was a small explosion as the gas canister blew.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
CHATTERLEY: As Anderson was describing there, residents in some of these affected areas still trying to save their homes, while others have been
forced to leave with simply what they can carry.
One of the fires has already destroyed at least a thousand structures, and that makes it the most destructive in L.A. County's history. Fire
officials, meanwhile, having to use a bulldozer, as you can see here, to clear cars abandoned after their drivers had to flee on foot. We will
continue to be across this developing story over the coming hours. You can stay with CNN.
In the meantime, that just about wraps up the show. Thank you for joining us, and I'll see you tomorrow.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[19:00:00]
END
