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First Move with Julia Chatterley

Judge Temporarily Blocks Trump's Plan to Freeze Fed Aid; ICE Officials Arrested More Than 2,000 People; U.S. Tech Stocks Rally after DeekSeek Shocked Silicon Valley; N. Korean Soldiers Battlefield Tactics; XB-1 Prototype Breaks the Speed of Sound; Doctors Without Borders and Gaza's Humanitarian Crisis; Declining Compassion in U.S.; Violence Worsens in the DRC. Aired 6-7p ET

Aired January 28, 2025 - 18:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


[18:00:00]

JAKE TAPPER, CNN ANCHOR: -- sidelines as her team face South Carolina last night, just one week after Caldwell gave birth to a baby boy and she had

the flu.

After the game, South Carolina coach Dawn Staley said, quote, "Women have the strength of 10 men. No doubt about it."

The news continues on CNN with Boris Sanchez in for Wolf Blitzer, right next door in a place I like to call The Situation Room. I'll see you

tomorrow.

OMAR JIMENEZ, CNN ANCHOR: Welcome everyone. It is 7:00 a.m. in Beijing, 3:00 p.m. in Los Angeles, and 6:00 p.m. here in New York. I'm Omar Jimenez.

And wherever you are in the world, this is your "First Move."

All right. A warm welcome to "First Move." And here's today's need to know. A federal judge has temporarily blocked part of Donald Trump's plan to

freeze federal aid for thousands of programs. DeepSeek disruption, U.S. tech stocks rally after a Chinese A.I. startup shocked Silicon Valley. And

we speak to the founder of a non-profit currently trapped in his hotel by the fighting in the Democratic Republic of Congo. That conversation and

plenty more coming up.

But I want to start with a U.S. federal judge temporarily blocking part of the Trump administration plans to pause most federal grants and loans. This

of course comes after the White House Budget Office said the pause would include financial assistance for foreign aid, non-governmental

organizations, diversity and climate programs, potentially impacting trillions of dollars in government spending. And the move could cause major

consequences across the world.

In her first White House briefing, Press Secretary Karoline Leavitt discussed the issue.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KAROLINE LEAVITT, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: This is not a blanket pause on federal assistance and grant programs from the Trump administration.

Individual assistance, that includes, I'm not naming everything that's included, but just to give you a few examples, Social Security benefits,

Medicare benefits, food stamps, welfare benefits, assistance that is going directly to individuals will not be impacted by this pause.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

JIMENEZ: I want to bring in Seema Mehta, Los Angeles Times, a political reporter. As we just heard from the press secretary there, the White House

has stressed that assistance provided directly to individuals isn't affected, but I'm curious, what are you hearing in regards to this freeze?

Are you still seeing concern from people you may be speaking to on this front?

SEEMA MEHTA, POLITICAL REPORTER, LOS ANGELES TIMES: Absolutely. I mean, there is so much concern on the ground. Because, A, I mean, it's just --

it's such a huge order. I mean, potentially impacting trillions of dollars of funding. And for some of the programs, like, she mentioned -- you know,

Karoline Leavitt mentioned Medicare, but she didn't mention Medicaid, which is what so many Americans rely on for their health insurance, low-income

Americans. Things like Meals on Wheels, early education programs, you know, women, infant, children funding.

So, I think, I mean, yes, we are hearing so much concern. And, you know, especially with the Medicaid portals that went down in many states across

the nation, including California, you know, just so much uncertainty about, you know, what is being funded? What is not being funded? And these are

also -- I mean, some of these programs are for arguably some of the most vulnerable members of our society, whether it's low-income families, senior

citizens, low-income -- you know, children, you know, babies pregnant women, low-income pregnant women. So, there is -- yes, there is so much

concern across the nation right now.

JIMENEZ: And, you know, I guess at this point is, do we have a sense of why the budget office is ordering this freeze in the first place? I mean,

some parts of it, of course, were just temporarily blocked by a federal judge, but how did we get here?

MEHTA: I mean, I think, you know, President Trump is doing basically everything that he said that he planned to do when -- you know, when he was

campaigning for office. And I mean, his campaign or his -- I'm sorry, his White House is arguing that they are trying to root out, you know, funding

for woke programs, for, you know, DEI programs, et cetera.

But I think there is a lot of confusion among whether it's, you know, state governments or NGOs, non-profits, about, you know, what all is caught up in

this? What is the process to review this? You know, some of these programs get funding at the end -- at the very beginning of the month. Well, the

beginning of the month this year falls on Saturday, February 1st. And so, they don't know when their next check is coming in, yet they are still

trying to provide services. You know, for -- you know, for instance, you know, Medicaid in particular.

So, I think there's just so much confusion about, you know, what is the timeline for this? How is it going to be reviewed? I mean, obviously, this

is ending up -- it's already ended up in the courts. And even California's attorney general, Rob Bonta, was among several attorney generals across the

country who -- state attorney generals across the country who are suing over this.

So, this is clearly going to be litigated. But there is, I think, palpable fear among a number of groups that this is going to affect some of the most

vulnerable members of our society.

[18:05:00]

JIMENEZ: Obviously, this has an incredibly wide scope that we're continuing to keep an eye on here. Of course, you mentioned the point

Medicaid, not explicitly mentioned by the press secretary. Seema Mehta, thank you so much.

I want to expand this conversation now with Senior Legal Analyst Elie Honig, who's with us now. So, Elie, let's talk about this federal judge

temporarily blocking part of the Trump administration's plan to freeze all federal aid specifically for open awards already granted by the federal

government through at least 5:00 p.m. Monday.

I mean, what do you make of that ruling? Are you expecting to see more of legal pushback on some of what we've seen from the policy side and the

Trump administration?

ELIE HONIG, CNN SENIOR LEGAL ANALYST AND FORMER ASSISTANT U.S. ATTORNEY, SOUTHERN DISTRICT OF NEW YORK: So, it's not surprising at all, Omar, that

this federal judge has put a temporary hold on this program, because it is so sweeping, impacting trillions of dollars. And what the judge has said

for now is, let's not let this plan go into effect for a few days, so I, the judge, can at least receive some more detailed briefing on it from both

sides.

If I can project forward into the future for a bit, I think this is very likely to end up in the Courts of Appeals, and ultimately, the U.S. Supreme

Court, and I think it's very likely that Donald Trump's effort here to block federal funding will be struck down, will be found unconstitutional.

If you look at the United States Constitution, Article One, which creates Congress, the very first enumerated power it gives to Congress, the power

to tax and spend. And there have been Supreme Court rulings since then that have said, the president cannot unilaterally refuse to spend money that's

been allocated by Congress, except for in very narrow circumstances with some specific procedural requirements.

So, there is a very long, I think very high stakes legal battle ahead. But I believe this will come out with a ruling that what Trump's trying to do

here is unconstitutional.

JIMENEZ: And, you know, I guess at this point, you answer my next question was, is do you believe the White House even has the legal right to do so?

It sounds like you don't think so. That will likely be affirmed -- or that could be affirmed by the Supreme Court, as you just said.

But I guess overall, look, we've seen a lot of executive orders from Inauguration Day to now. And the thing with executive orders is, you know,

they don't become law right away there. They are often challenged in the courts. Do you anticipate a lot of the executive boards we've seen to this

point to be challenged in the courts? And are there any specific areas that come to mind as likely significant places of challenge?

HONIG: I think all of the substantive executive orders will be challenged in courts. I think essentially everything but renaming Denali back to Mount

McKinley will be challenged.

And the stakes here are enormous. I mean, several of these executive orders deal with immigration enforcement. I would look for them to be challenged.

Donald Trump tried to end the constitutional practice of birthright citizenship that says that any person who's born or naturalized in the

United States as a citizen, that one's already been challenged and it's already been put on, again, a temporary hold. There's already been a

challenge to the DOGE, the Department of Government Efficiency.

So, yes, I think the Trump administration fully expects that all of these will be litigated in the courts. But it seems quite clear that the Trump

administration has adopted a sort of act first and answer questions later type approach. I think their strategy here, legally and politically, is

let's just put out the full menu of everything we want to do. We'll fight it out in the courts, and if some of it is left standing, then that's

better than nothing. So, they've taken a very aggressive approach to this.

JIMENEZ: Testing and pushing, I think it is probably fair to say, at least on the legal front. Elie Honig, really appreciate you being here. Thanks

for the insight.

HONIG: Thanks, Omar.

JIMENEZ: All right. Meanwhile, U.S. federal workers who don't want to return to the office are expected to be offered buyouts, that is according

to a Trump administration official. Workers who opt to accept the buyout will need to resign by February 6th and would receive severance pay through

September 30th.

Now, another one of the Trump administration's top priorities has been efforts to crack down on illegal immigration. An officials say they've made

more than 2,000 arrests in the past two days in sweeps across the country. The raids continued Tuesday here in New York, where Homeland Security

Secretary Kristi Noem actually took part. Our Gloria Pazmino has the details.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

GLORIA PAZMINO, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Fear and uncertainty in New York City's immigrant community as federal law enforcement agencies

launch immigration enforcement operations expected to last several days.

SARAHI MARQUEZ, DACA RECIPIENT, RESTAURATEUR: I feel scared, I feel nervous, I feel anxious.

PAZMINO (voice-over): Sarahi Marquez, a DACA recipient, was brought to the United States by her parents when she was six years old. She has degrees in

psychology and biology and helps run the family restaurant here on Staten Island. For the past two weeks, workers have become increasingly panicked.

MARQUEZ: We work long days. We're just trying to make a better place and I wanted to speak out and not let fear intimidate me.

PAZMINO (voice-over): Since Trump signed his executive orders, Marquez has instructed her workers to memorize her phone number. Some are arranging

transportation to and from work to avoid walking on the street.

[18:10:00]

MARQUEZ: It feels like we're hunted down. And I say to myself what more can I do to prove myself?

TOM HOMAN, WHITE HOUSE BORDER CZAR: We're sending a message. It's not OK to be in this country illegally. It is not OK to enter this country

legally. It is a crime and there's going to be consequences.

PAZMINO (voice-over): More than 200 federal law enforcement officers fanned out across the city on Tuesday. Secretary of Homeland Security

Kristi Noem joined early morning enforcement operations.

Fear is also spreading across the city's migrant shelters. Parents declined to speak on camera, but some told us they've kept their children from

school in recent days. Out of fear, ICE could show up at school or that they will be picked up in any operations. Others told us they have no

choice.

Hennessy Romero (ph) says she takes her daughter to school so she can go to work. She feels some comfort thanks to her temporary protected status after

fleeing Venezuela. But she worries some bad apples will ruin the American dream of many. It's selfish, she says, of President Trump's directive.

We're here to work and provide for our families and the future of our children, she says.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

JIMENEZ: That was Gloria Pazmino reporting in New York. Meanwhile, U.S. tech stocks bounced back Tuesday after Monday's DeepSeek triggered sell-

off. The NASDAQ rallied 2 percent, gaining back a lot of what it lost in the previous session on fears that DeepSeek's lower cost business model

might give Beijing a leg up in the global A.I. race.

Let's take a look. A.I. chipmaker NVIDIA led the charge up more than 8.5 percent after its almost 17 percent loss on Monday. In Washington Tuesday,

White House Press Secretary Karoline Leavitt reiterated President Trump's warning that the deep seek breakthroughs in China are a wakeup call for

U.S. tech, and she said Trump administration policies will help ensure America's lead in A.I.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LEAVITT: The last administration sat on their hands and allowed China to rapidly develop this A.I. program. And so, President Trump believes in

restoring American A.I. dominance. And that's why he took very strong executive action this past week to sign executive orders to roll back some

of the onerous regulations on the A.I. industry.

And President Trump has also proudly appointed the first A.I. and crypto czar at this White House, David Sacks, whom I spoke with yesterday. Very

knowledgeable on this subject. And his team is here working every single day to ensure American A.I. dominance.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

JIMENEZ: And Leavitt also said the Trump administration is looking into the national security implications of the DeepSeek app. Ivan Watson has

more on DeepSeek and how it's rattled global investors.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

IVAN WATSON, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): celebration erupts across Chinese social media at the surprise success of

Chinese A.I. startup DeepSeek. The launch of DeepSeek's latest A.I. chatbot triggered a selloff in American tech stocks, while the app surged to the

top of the Apple App Store, beating out higher profile A.I. competitors like ChatGPT and Google Gemini.

DONALD TRUMP, U.S. PRESIDENT: The release of DeepSeek A.I. from a Chinese company should be a wake-up call for our industries that we need to be

laser focused on competing to win.

WATSON: I've just installed DeepSeek on my phone. I'm going to ask it a question. How much did it cost to develop DeepSeek? As an A.I. assistant, I

don't have access to internal company information. For more details about DeepSeek, please visit the official website.

WATSON (voice-over): The company claims it cost just $5.6 million to develop this model, a fraction of the investment spent by much bigger

American rivals. DeepSeek's founder is Liang Wenfeng, a 40-year-old CEO who emerged from relative obscurity last week when he was invited to address

the second most powerful man in the Chinese government.

Liang studied information and electronic engineering at China's prestigious Zhejiang University. He founded the hedge fund High-Flyer Quant in 2015

aimed at using mathematics and A.I. for quantitative investment.

Less than two years ago he launched the A.I. company DeepSeek, employing young homegrown talent. Liang described DeepSeek as an accidental disruptor

in this interview last week, adding, there's a gap of one or two years between Chinese A.I. and the United States, but the real gap is the

difference between originality and imitation. If this does not change, China will always be a follower.

[18:15:00]

ZACH KASS, FORMER HEAD OF GO-TO-MARKET, OPENAI: The success of open-source models, wherever they come from, in this case China, is great because it

actually means that better technology will be available to more people at less -- at lower costs.

WATSON (voice-over): But it's when you ask DeepSeek about China that you see glaring limitations.

WATSON: I'm asking DeepSeek, has Chinese leader Xi Jinping ever made a mistake? I am sorry. I cannot answer that question. I am an A.I. assistant

designed to provide helpful and harmless responses.

ISAAC STONE FISH, CEO, STRATEGY RISKS: DeepSeek as the leader in A.I. would be catastrophic, but it would also be incredibly dangerous for free

speech and free thought globally.

WATSON (voice-over): DeepSeek appears to have revolutionized the A.I. space race and opened many unanswered questions about the company and its

founder.

Ivan Watson, CNN, Hong Kong.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

JIMENEZ: Now, CNN has reached out to its founder, DeepSeek and High-Flyer Quant, for comment.

Now, CNN obtained a rare glimpse into the battlefield tactics of North Korean troops sent to fight alongside Russia in Ukraine. Kyiv Special

Forces say many North Korean soldiers choose suicide instead of surrender and remain loyal to their leader, Kim Jong Un, until the end.

Nick Paton Walsh has the story, which we must warn you contains graphic video throughout.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

NICK PATON WALSH, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): These are the first images on the ground of the capture of North Korean troops by

Ukraine. The soldier is injured, can hardly walk, but they spirit him away.

Russian shelling intensifies to prevent capture. A wild prize pulled through their wires here from brutal fighting in Russia's Kursk region

against a radicalized, near suicidal enemy, but one who'd never seen drones in war before. The special operations forces who fought them told us.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): They are all young, fresh and hardy. But they're only prepared for the realities of an Eighties war.

Despite all attempts to call them to surrender they continue to fight.

WALSH (voice-over): There's a unique challenge here. Ukraine wants to take captives, but the North Koreans seem to prefer to die. They shoot one here

in caution. In the distressing images that follow, they pull one injured Korean's leg, then realize he has a grenade he detonates under his chin.

His last words were to scream North Korean leader Kim Jong Un's name, South Korean officials say.

We meet the Ukrainians who show us the faked Russian military papers he was carrying, suggesting he was from Russia's Far East, and his military radio

codes. Another paper, handwritten pledges of brainwashed courage.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): The hammer of death to the unknown and the puppet trash is not far off. We wield the powerful force that makes

them tremble in fear. World, watch closely.

WALSH: These notes from a soldier killed really a snapshot of the mindset inside the Hermit Kingdom. Declarations of loyalty, even tactics on how to

fight Ukrainian drones, and also the suggestion that their presence here is about helping North Korea prepare for war. It's a remarkable insight, but

also a reminder of how this biggest land war in Europe since the 40s is becoming more global.

WALSH (voice-over): But also a glimpse of the fear they live under, how they inform on each other. Notes from an officer writing a critique of his

fellow soldiers.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): He engaged in a unimaginable disgraceful act by stealing supplies. (Another soldier) failed to uphold

the Supreme Commander's dignity and placed his personal interest above all.

WALSH (voice-over): Ukrainians film themselves taking DNA samples from the dead, which they say proved these were Korean. Ukraine says up to a third

of the 12,000 here are already dead or injured, and more are coming.

Amur (ph) shows us the newish AK-12 rifle and backpack Russia gave the North Koreans. They are overladen with ammo, he says, but sometimes nobody

armor or warm clothes and minimal water.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): We have seen cases when fighters from North Korea ran without body armor. They often don't wear helmets

which we find strange as well. They're very maneuverable, they run and move very quickly. They're hard to catch, especially with a drone.

[18:20:00]

WALSH (voice-over): This thermal drone video shows that speed of attack. Below are seven Ukrainians in a trench facing 130 North Koreans above, who

race at them and then try to flank them. Many died here, but they seem to be learning.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): They have a plan of what to do if they are attacked by a drone. It's one person who takes the hit. Two or

three people stand on the side and shoot directly. It is worth noting that they shoot quite well. This suggests that they were trained --

WALSH (voice-over): Ready to die, everybody checked for grenades. But not ready for this modern warfare. On a training mission, many won't survive,

for a future war not even glimpsed yet.

Nick Paton Walsh, CNN, Sumy, Ukraine.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

JIMENEZ: Thank you to Nick Paton Walsh for that reporting. Coming up, rebel fighters say they have captured one of the largest cities in the

Democratic Republic of Congo. We're going to hear from the founder of a non-profit who's been an eyewitness to the escalating violence. Stay with

us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MIKE BANNISTER, FORMER CHIEF CONCORDE PILOT: There we are. XB-1 is supersonic. Faster than the speed of sound. We've got confirmation from the

control room that she is supersonic. What a wonderful achievement.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

JIMENEZ: What a wonderful achievement. That's the voice of former Chief Concorde pilot Mike Bannister watching today's test flight of Boom

Aviation's XB-1 prototype as it broke the speed of sound. It's important because it's the first time any civil aircraft has gone supersonic over the

continental U.S. Boom hopes to launch a passenger plane that could reshape commercial aviation. And today's test pilot was Tristan Geppetto

Brandenburg. He told my colleague Jake Tapper what it was like.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRISTAN "GEPPETTO" BRANDENBURG, PILOTED BOOM SUPERSONIC FLIGHT: I think as a passenger on a supersonic airplane, unfortunately, it'll probably be a

little bit disappointing. There's really no -- unfortunately, you don't get to hear the sonic boom from the airplane. There's the only real indication

that you're going faster than the speed of sound is the Mach meter. And in this particular airplane, it flies pretty smooth, supersonic.

JAKE TAPPER, CNN ANCHOR: So, a trip from New York to London right now is about a seven-hour flight. With the new jet that you tested today,

theoretically, how long would it take to fly from New York to London?

[18:25:00]

BRANDENBURG: Our goal is to cut travel time in half. Unfortunately, right now, the current laws will prevent supersonic overflight over land. Our

first iteration of our airliners be over water only. But that seven-hour trip eventually when we -- as we continue to improve technology and as we

work with potentially get some laws changed to allow supersonic flight from New York to Los Angeles, we could cut that seven-hour flight down to

potentially down to three and a half hours.

TAPPER: When do you expect the commercial version of this carrier to become available for consumer use?

BRANDENBURG: That's a good question. We're -- as we finish up XB-1 and we shift our attention to overture, that's where the bulk of our attention is

going to go. Airplanes take some time to develop and we're going to develop a safe airplane. And so, that takes a little bit of time. We're hoping by

the end of the decade, but we'll see what we can do.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

JIMENEZ: Hey, I'll take that seven-hour flight going to three and a half hours, as long as it's safe, of course.

All right. Look, we got plenty of news to follow, including, coming up, thousands returning to their homes in northern Gaza, but there are still

questions about what they're actually coming home to. I'm going to speak to the head of Doctors Without Borders in the United States after the break.

Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

JIMENEZ: Welcome back to "First Move" with a look at more international headlines this hour. Google Maps will change the name of the Gulf of Mexico

to the Gulf of America for users in the United States. The move follows President Donald Trump's executive action last week to rename the Gulf in

order to quote, "honor American greatness." Google will also change the name of Denali to Mount McKinley, reversing the change made under the Obama

administration in 2015.

[18:30:00]

A plane operated by South Korea's Air Busan caught fire just before takeoff on Tuesday. The Airbus was headed for Hong Kong when a fire started in the

plane's tail. All 169 people were evacuated from the plane safely with just three minor injuries reported. But it, of course, follows a deadly plane

crash in South Korea last month, which killed all but two people on board.

German Chancellor Olaf Scholz slamming tech billionaire Elon Musk after he spoke virtually at an AfD rally in Germany. Musk telling the far-right

political rally that Germany should, quote, "move beyond Nazi guilt." Fred Pleitgen spoke with Chancellor Scholz. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

FREDERIK PLEITGEN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: He is openly advocating for the AfD. He has said that Germany needs to get over its

historic guilt for the Holocaust. And he's attacked you personally. Is that not direct meddling by the Trump administration in the political affairs of

Germany, in the German election? Are you going to raise this with Donald Trump?

OLAF SCHOLZ, GERMAN CHANCELLOR: I disagree completely with Elon Musk and what he's doing. What is new is that he is intervening in favor of right-

wing politicians all over Europe. And this is really disgusting, and I'm absolutely critical about what Elon Musk said about the history of Germany.

This is the week where we are remembering the freeing of the last people in the concentration camp of Auschwitz. And I'm absolutely clear, there is a

responsibility of Germany that will continue to be a responsibility. We are very happy about the United States that freed our country and helped us to

become a democracy again. And this is why I'm so angry about Elon Musk intervening for the far-right and Elon Musk also not acting adequate to

this killing of so many Jews and other people in Europe done by Germans in the past.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

JIMENEZ: I want to turn now to northern Gaza where Palestinians continue to return home. And it's really a bittersweet homecoming. Israeli

airstrikes have reduced much of the area to rubble. Officials say more than 300,000 people have now returned to the north as the ceasefire between

Israel and Hamas continues to hold.

Meanwhile, though, the office of Israel's prime minister says U.S. President Donald Trump has invited Benjamin Netanyahu to the White House.

The meetings are set to take place next week.

The war in Gaza has also been hard on medical and aid workers. My next guest leads the U.S. branch of Doctors Without Borders, also known as MSF.

Since the war began, nine of her colleagues have been killed. Despite this, the non-profit continues to treat injured Palestinians, conducting almost

10,000 surgeries. And of course, life doesn't stop during wartime. Childbirth, vaccinations, even water, MSF helps with those too.

So, joining me now is Avril Benoit, CEO of Doctors Without Borders USA. Thank you for being here. I really appreciate the time. I mean, look, as I

was just talking about tens of thousands, if not more, of displaced Palestinians began returning to Northern Gaza this week during what we have

seen to be a fragile ceasefire at times. But I don't have to tell you, the images of what they're returning to essentially a region reduced to rubble.

I mean, what have your doctors assess as the greatest need right now for their work when a lot of the infrastructure they likely need has been

destroyed?

AVRIL BENOIT, CEO, DOCTORS WITHOUT BORDERS USA: Well, it's not just the doctors assessing this, all the humanitarian organizations have seen people

return to rubble. Let's remember that we estimate 70 percent of all the buildings have been destroyed or severely injured or harmed rather. We also

have 90 percent of the population that's effectively without shelter, without their own homes. And so, they're living in tents and they're living

in schools.

And so, as they move toward their original neighborhoods, what they are finding in the rubble often are unexploded ordinances. And even one of our

colleagues saw a young child playing with something that could very well have led to death had it exploded. And so, there's going to be years and

years and years of cleaning up all this rubble to be able to build shelters again.

And what they're also finding, unfortunately, are remains of loved ones. There are an estimated 10,000 people who are lost, whose whereabouts are

unknown. And we assume that perhaps in this whole process of the ceasefire and people returning, they'll be able to locate them. We hope there's some

closure there.

But at the moment we're looking at a devastated healthcare system. 1,000 health workers have been killed, including, as you mentioned, our

colleagues, including the most recent one, who actually was killed by an Israeli airstrike in December. But we only learned about 10 days ago with

confirmation through various networks.

[18:35:00]

So, it's absolutely shattering and heartbreaking situation where the people need food, they need clean drinking water, they need shelter, they need

soap hygiene kits, everything that you can imagine just to continue surviving and hopefully rebuilding their lives if the ceasefire continues

like this.

JIMENEZ: And, you know, you mentioned years of work that is really needed here. I mean, we're just in phase one of what is supposed to be six weeks

of a ceasefire before potentially moving forward. What is the specific progress you're hoping to make during this ceasefire that you weren't able

to prior to this happening?

BENOIT: Well, there's a big push, of course, to bring in supplies. And as the trucks have been coming in laden with food, for example, we've seen

that the cost of food has really shot down. So, that already is a good start because people need everything, they need warm clothing, they need

tarpaulins. They need also items that were blocked as being dual use items perceived by the Israeli monitors, the authorities that were inspecting all

the trucks as perhaps being useful as war tools. These included many, many medical items.

So, we're hopeful that during this period of time, which we very much hope lasts, we have this opportunity to bring in as much as possible just to

allow the restarting of the health system that has been so damaged. And we're working in a couple of hospitals. We have some field hospitals. We

are working in numerous clinics and we're also envisioning setting up some clinics in those areas in the north of Gaza, where people are returning and

where there is effectively nothing for them as far as health care goes.

JIMENEZ: Yes. And before we go, I want to ask you about a separate but likely related topic, because Doctors Without Borders, you all put out a

statement today condemning the Trump administration's reinstatement of the Mexico City policy essentially bans U.S. government funding for foreign

non-profits that perform or promote abortions. How does this specifically impact the work that you do globally? And do you anticipate it being a

problem?

BENOIT: Yes. The loss of PEPFAR funding for organizations that are doing sexual reproductive health, which is vital for life, for life-saving of the

-- you know, reducing maternal mortality from unsafe abortions is something that is vital.

Now, we don't take U.S. government funding. We're entirely privately funded thanks to the generosity of a lot of people around the world, including

Americans, but to have other organizations lose this funding means a lot of women will die. There's also a loss of HR -- of HIV funding. We are very

concerned about the situation around the world with aid being stopped.

So, this is just -- it's just one of many, many instances where the halt to the flow of aid funding to other organizations is actually going to put a

huge burden on the people living in those areas in humanitarian crisis zones and low-income countries. And so, we're really concerned about that

and many other policies that have been announced or reversals of policies with the new administration, very much hoping that this can be corrected as

soon as possible.

JIMENEZ: Avril Benoit, thank you so much. CEO of Doctors Without Borders USA. Really appreciate you being here.

BENOIT: Thank you.

JIMENEZ: All right. Coming up after the break, worsening violence in the resource rich Democratic Republic of Congo as refugees flee for safety.

We're going to hear from one man who's been unable to escape. That's next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:40:00]

JIMENEZ: The Muhammad Ali Center warns that compassion in the United States is on the decline. That's according to his 2025 compassion report.

More than 60 percent of Americans feel less compassionate than they did four years ago.

Now, the center was founded by the late boxer and his wife, Lonnie, who is honoring his memory in a new audio series, "Ali and Me," debuted last week

on Audible. It features conversations with figures you might know, like Will Smith and Mike Tyson.

So, joining us now is Lonnie Ali. Thank you for being here. Really appreciate it. I want to start with the podcast because, look, I think

Muhammad Ali, fair to say one of the most well-known athletic figures globally of all time. What is it that you wanted people to learn or

understand through this work that people maybe haven't had the chance to learn over all these years?

LONNIE ALI, WIFE OF MUHAMMAD ALI AND CO-FOUNDER, MUHAMMAD ALI CENTER: Well, thank you, Omar, for having me on. The podcast was a passion project

for me and it started seven years ago shortly after Muhammad's passing because there was just a void, you know, him leaving, there was just a void

in having his voice in America at a time where we were experiencing divisiveness, toxic polarization, and I just wanted to continue his legacy

of inclusivity, of humanity, of compassion and kindness. And the best way to do that, I felt was through this podcast, and I was very happy to have a

very good friend of ours, John Ramsey, joined me as a host.

JIMENEZ: Yes. And you know, one of the things I think is really interesting is that I think if you just did a narrative telling of your

late husband's story, that would be enough to hook someone like me, but you tell it -- including guests whose lives were significantly impacted by your

late husband. Is there anything that surprised you in telling this story through that lens?

ALI: Yes. You know, it's interesting how many people Muhammad's legacy -- how Muhammad has impacted people over a diverse population and we have

athletes, you know, politicians activists, religious leaders, it's -- it was just amazing. And to hear them tell me how Muhammad's life and how he

lived his life impacted them and the way they live their life today was just amazing. I mean, the reach that this man had and continues to have is

exceptional.

JIMENEZ: Yes. And look, I mean, that goes without saying, it is interesting though, seeing that the wide range of people he influenced. I

also want to bring up, we were showing some of the numbers earlier, but you're also the lifetime director of the Muhammad Ali Center. And this

month you released what I think is a unique study on compassion in America driven by Muhammad's believing compassion is the strongest force we have,

which I don't think you could ever have too much compassion. But it also sounds like you didn't find there was enough of it in this study. What did

you find?

ALI: Well, what we found was that compassion has been on the decline for several years now. But what was important is that there have been over

4,000 -- well, a surge of 4,000 percent in people looking up compassion online, compassion related topics.

So, we know that compassion -- even though it's on the decline, it still exists. But we have to find that common ground to build that compassion

back up, build that compassion muscle. People are wanting that for a more healthy society.

[18:45:00]

We need that to bring people together. And it's something that is a vital part of Muhammad's legacy, compassion. He -- you know, something he

practiced every day.

JIMENEZ: And, you know, part of your answer when I asked why you wanted to do the audio series, and I think it ties into the compassion part is you

felt sort of this void and, you know, where his voice would have been in this moment. And I just want to ask you that. I mean, what do you think his

voice would have been in this moment that we're in right now?

ALI: You know, Omar, I don't think Muhammad would have done anything different than what he was doing before. Muhammad was able to connect to

people one on one before there was social media or anything of that nature. He was able to touch people directly, you know, one-on-one, meeting them in

person, and that's something we need to start doing as well.

You know, we live behind a screen. Muhammad didn't do that. He -- face-to- face. And we have to get back to that, of mixing with people, of talking to people face-to-face and finding out, you know, what their interests are,

them finding out more about us. That's the only way we're going to make that human connection. And that's what Muhammad was so good at.

JIMENEZ: Yes. Well, Lonnie, sad to be talking to you through a screen this time. Next time we'll make it happen in person. But really appreciate you

being here. Thank you. Thank you for taking the time.

ALI: Omar, if I may, I just want to say one thing.

JIMENEZ: Yes. Go for it.

ALI: IF your viewers would go to aliindex.org and look at the compassion index, the report, and sign the compassion pledge to practice that

compassion muscle every day, because that's the only way we're going to come together as a country and we start showing --

JIMENEZ: And you mentioned that huge spike of people who wanted to be more compassionate. So, clearly there are people out there. Lonnie, really

appreciate you being here.

ALI: Right. Thank you so much, Omar.

JIMENEZ: Of course. All right. Everyone, we'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

JIMENEZ: Welcome back, everyone. Violence is getting worse in the largest country in sub-Saharan Africa, roughly the size of Western Europe. The

Democratic Republic of Congo is the source of valuable minerals used in much of the world's technology. A group of rebels, which include the M23

militia, are advancing and claim to have seized the key city of Goma. Thousands of civilians are fleeing and -- Rwanda is accused of backing the

M23 rebels.

Meanwhile, far to the west, protesters in the capital, Kinshasa, attacked Western and African embassies, including those belonging to Rwanda and

France. Fires were also lit outside the American embassy. U.S. citizens are being advised to leave the city. CNN's Salma Abdelaziz has more.

[18:50:00]

SALMA ABDELAZIZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Heavy fighting was seen around Goma Airport just a couple of days after the M23 rebel group claimed that it had

full control of the city in the eastern part of the Democratic Republic of Congo.

Now, M23 has been advancing for weeks on Goma, and this lightning-fast offensive has forced hundreds of thousands of people to flee, at least a

dozen U.N. peacekeepers and foreign soldiers are dead. Hospitals are overwhelmed with the wounded, and now the tensions have spread to Kinshasa,

the capital where protesters were setting fires around western embassies, including the French embassy, the American embassy, the Belgian embassy,

angry at what they see as western intervention in African affairs.

Now, why is all of this happening? Well, it may have something to do with your cell phone. The M23 rebel group, this militia group, which is accused

of really terrible human rights violations, is backed by a neighboring country, Rwanda, that's according to the United Nations and other aides

groups, although Rwanda denies this.

And the accusation from those groups is that Rwanda and the M23 are after valuable minerals, precious minerals that are in the eastern part of the

DRC that are used to build our phones and to build our computers.

Now, there is one sign of hope, one sign of progress, Kenya says that it is bringing both Rwanda and officials from the DRC to a negotiating table to

try and find a diplomatic solution. Of course, the U.N. is appealing for calm.

Salma Abdelaziz, CNN London.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

JIMENEZ: Now, the U.N. humanitarian office is reporting many dead in the streets of Goma, the rape of civilians and looting. Among those killed was

a famed Congolese boxer, Belezi Bagunda, or Kibomango, killed this week, according to my next guest, who says Kibomango was acting as an unofficial

guide or protector to him while trying to help evacuate children to safety.

I want to bring in Matthew Leutwyler, the founder of We Are Limitless, a non-profit helping vulnerable children in Rwanda and the DRC. You've been

trapped in Goma, unable to leave because, of course, you fear for your safety.

Can you just tell me a little bit about why you were in the DRC, as I understand, to help rescue some of the children you were working with, but

what you encountered in that process?

MATTHEW LEUTWYLER, FOUNDER AND PRESIDENT, WE ARE LIMITLESS: Yes, we have a group of 40 kids that live in a home that we have about 20 minutes outside

of Goma, and it came under attack a couple of few days ago now. I'm losing track of time. And they had to flee. One of our older children is about 17

went back to get supplies that they left when they fled so hastily and was shot.

And when we heard about that, I was in Rwanda, I called, Kibo, Kibomango, and told him that I needed his help. He and I have been working together

for about five years on a documentary about his life and the women that he helps in his boxing club that he has, but he also helps me on the side with

the charity.

So, he met me at the border. We went across. Tried to move all the kids into a new house in Goma with him. And bring our other student, Musa (ph),

to Rwanda to get medical attention, but it just took longer than we all expected and we got stuck there. And so, he and I agreed to meet the next

morning and get Musa (ph). And so, we met. And then firefighters started and he told me to go back into my hotel and he would wait for me outside.

And, yes, he didn't make it. So, an hour later, I was -- somebody sent me a video of him dead. And so, we are mourning our friend while we're trying to

get out of here and get back to Rwanda. Things seem to have calmed down in the last seven or eight hours. So, I think we're going to be able to make a

move tomorrow, get back and get Musa (ph) the medical attention he needs.

JIMENEZ: And Musa (ph), of course, was the kid that was shot.

LEUTWYLER: Yes.

JIMENEZ: You know, you've tried to get out of the country a few times now, and our reporting is the M23 rebels are claiming to have taken over Goma,

despite Congolese officials having yet to confirm that. But have you seen any evidence of that takeover on the ground?

LEUTWYLER: Yes. I'm here in a hotel now.

JIMENEZ: Yes, yes. So, I guess that's my question. Have you seen -- what evidence have you seen of that takeover? Just give us a sense of what

you've been seeing.

LEUTWYLER: Yes. I mean, the firefight was pretty intense, on and off for the last couple of days. It was really bleak early this morning or maybe

yesterday. I can't remember now. But then about six, seven hours ago, things -- it looks like M23 really kind of took over and pushed out some of

the other factions as well as the DRC, you know, military.

[18:55:00]

Things are pretty calm now. We've heard that our students -- our children that are at this new house that we found in Goma are doing OK. They don't

have food and water, but they're safe. So, we'll hopefully get up in the morning. We have a little plan set. Hopefully, it sticks. And we'll go and

drop off food with them, grab Musa (ph) and get across the border. And --

JIMENEZ: Yes.

LEUTWYLER: And then, we've also got Kibomango's kids to take care of now. They are orphans now. So, I assume they will join our group and we'll do

what we can for them.

JIMENEZ: Yes. And I've got to go in literally 30 seconds here, but just to give just a word or two about who Kibomango was, how would you describe him

in a word or two?

LEUTWYLER: Protector until the end, you know. He always had my back, everyone's back, but he was very dedicated friend. And like I said, we've

been in some pretty hairy situations over the years and he's always stepped in front of me, you know what I mean? And then --

JIMENEZ: The protector, as you've described him so many times. Matthew Leutwyler, I'm sorry, I got to leave it there. The founder of We Are

Limitless.

LEUTWYLER: No worries.

JIMENEZ: Please stay safe. And I hope -- I mean, check in with me afterwards, but I hope your plan works out tomorrow.

LEUTWYLER: Yes, thank you so much.

JIMENEZ: Of course. All right. And that's it for the show, everyone. Thanks for joining us. I'll see you tomorrow.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[19:00:00]

END