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First of All with Victor Blackwell

Why Voters Of Color Were Ready For Racist Attacks On Harris; Amid Racist And Sexist Attacks, Women Work To Build Harris Coalition; "Uncommitted" Delegates Want Meeting With VP Harris; Uncommitted Voter: Fellow M.I. Delegate Told Me To "Shut Up"; Biden, Harris Call for Change After Sonya Massey's Killing; Deputy Charged In Sonya Massey Killing Had Troubling Employment & DUI History; G.A. Students In Limbo Over Fate Of AP African American History Course. Aired 8-9a ET

Aired July 27, 2024 - 08:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[08:00:00]

VICTOR BLACKWELL, CNN ANCHOR: Well, first of all, who is surprised? I'm really who is surprised by the way that some Republicans are attacking and attempting to other rides vice president Kamala Harris now that she's a black woman of South Asian descent, the presumptive Democratic nominee 101 days until Election Day, but not even seven days into this new matchup. The sexist and racist rhetoric around the Harris candidacy has begun. Some Republicans are calling this, let me see if you've heard this, the DEI candidate using diversity, equity and inclusion as a slur. And of course, they're suggesting that her primary qualifications are that she's a woman and a minority ignoring that she has been elected at the local, state and federal level.

And listen, there is Harris policy to scrutinize later this hour, we're going to do that we're going to focus on her policy towards Israel and the war in Gaza. But this DEI narrative is intended to suggest that she's just unqualified. Now have race and gender historically been relevant when choosing a running mate? Of course. Of course it has. Otherwise how would you explain the 47 white men who had the job before her?

Now the tone here is clear. Just because it was expected though that does not mean that we should not call it out and the people who use it to account. Former President Donald Trump mispronounces their name he calls a garbage, a bum. You've seen the clips, we don't need to play him again here.

This week, Republican vice presidential nominee J.D. Vance said that Harris has not shown enough gratitude. Vice President Harris talked about our love for the country. But Vance says yeah, but she's not grateful enough.

Despite the rapid coalescing of the Democratic Party behind Harris in the hundreds of millions of dollars raised in the day since there was this headline for The Washington Post this week. Harris's ascent feels some black women with jubilation and fear. And this from the New York Times, "In interviews around the country, black voters voiced enthusiasm for the reshaped campaign. They also worried about how a polarized country would see it." And this from this Associated Press who spoke with black women voters here in Atlanta, 23 year old Carrington Jackson put it this way. "She's at the intersection of sexism and racism. I think now that's going to be a whole other battle as well as competing against Donald Trump's supporters." And this 146 year old Mary Jameson, she puts it this way. "If a white woman can't win, how can a black woman wait?"

Harris, of course, is not the first to try. Shirley Chisholm ran for the Democratic nomination in 1972. She did not win it. But she shared this lesson about politics.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

SHIRLEY CHRISHOLM, FIRST BLACK WOMAN ELECTED TO CONGRESS; PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: How is breaking that tradition, that tradition in which only white males have only been the gentleman in this country that have guided the ship of space, so you don't expect people black white men or women to suddenly overcome a tradition that has been steeped ever since the inception of this republic? So I understand that I've broken the ice.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BLACKWELL: And Senator Harris adopted Chrisholm's campaign slogan for the people for her 2020 Run for the nomination.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

KAMALA HARRIS, VICE PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: She reminds me of a one of the many sayings my mother had which one of them is don't, don't you let anybody tell you who you are. You tell them who you are. That was Shirley Chisholm. Unbought, unbossed. And I stand as so many of us do on her shoulders. Because she understood that you just marched to that podium and you claim that podium is yours. And you don't ask anybody permission.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BLACKWELL: And now democratic organizers say that they are rising to the challenge. According to the campaign, there was a zoom call this week focusing on Latinas and brought in $90,000 in donations, Asian American Native Hawaiian and Pacific Islander women raised more than $100,000 on their call. Thursday night, there was the white women answer the call 2024 fundraising call. They say they raised more than $8 million for the Harris campaign. But all this was started on Sunday with a call led by black women. And the woman who led that call joins us. Jotaka Eaddy is the founder of Win With Black Women and full circle strategies. Also with Shannon Watts, who help organize the call featuring white women. She's the founder of Moms Demand Action.

Welcome to you both. And Jotaka, let me start with you. 44,000 women on that call, how do you keep up the momentum and how do you harness it for the next 100 days? JOTAKA EADDY, FOUNDER, #WINWITHBLACKWOMEN: Well, the momentum in this

country is very real because there is a collective excitement around vice president Kamala Harris and we are seeing being across this country and I think the way we keep up the momentum is that we keep just allowing and and encouraging people to organize, to organize wherever they are, to connect wherever they are, and to give the people that they are talking to the tools that they need to be able to educate themselves on the importance of this election, and most importantly, be able to cast their vote and understand that every last person in this country, we all have a role to play. And we should play that role and make sure that we are voting in November and telling everyone about the difference in the power of this election. And really the choice that we have.

[08:05:40]

BLACKWELL: Shannon, I want to play a portion of what you said on your call more than 160,000 people on the call featuring white women. Here's a part of what you said.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

SHANNON WATTS, HELPED ORGANIZE "WHITE WOMEN: ANSWERS THE CALL 2024": We are not starting a new organization. Tonight, we are activating the privilege platform and power of white women. We are acknowledging the role that we must play to help save our democracy. We are committing to take responsibility, and to take action to elect Kamala Harris. And then we take the next step, working within a larger coalition of women who have been doing this work incredibly effectively for decades.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BLACKWELL: That framework jumped out of -- actually my executive producer sent it to me in a text and the words jumped off my phone, activating your privilege for the Vice President's campaign. How do you do that? What that looks like practically?

WATTS: You know, white women have access to political and economic power that they unfortunately have too, rarely tapped into. Since the 1950s, the majority of white women have voted for the Republican presidential candidate and all but two elections. And so I wanted to take the baton from Jotake. She gave me her counsel incredibly wise, and she told me that the work that white women need to do is different. And so we came together on this call, which was less of a rally and more of a reckoning, to talk about the mistakes that we've made, the regrets that we have, and how we can do better going forward.

I woke up this morning to an email saying that we have now raised over $10 million. But this is just the start. We have a coalition call on Monday night with leaders like Jotaka, for women for Harris, and it is a call I would love for everyone to join Monday night, because the only way we win this election in 100 days is if we come together and stand shoulder to shoulder and get out there and get out the vote together. And that's exactly what we plan to do. BLACKWELL: Shannon, let me stay with you because there is, as you might appreciate some skepticism that when white women in November get to the intersection of race and gender, that as you suggested, the majority will choose their whiteness over their gender as they did the last two times that Donald Trump was on the ballot. Let's take a look at 2020 and 2016. In 2020 55% of white women voted for Trump, according to CNN exit polls 52% in 2016, when there was a white woman on the ballot for Democrats. Why should anyone expect that this year will be different that when you hit that intersection, white women will choose Kamala Harris over their whiteness, and focus on Donald Trump.

WATTS: Look, I don't want to be Pollyanna about this, that our track record is not great. I will say that white women are not a monolith. And we are divided among lines of religion and education and marital status. And when there's even just a small shift in our voting pattern, we can swing entire elections. And I am hopeful that when we hear these comments from the other side about cat ladies and women who don't have children and taking away women's access to abortion or even IVF that that will get some of the women the white women who are sitting on the fence off of the fence and get them on the right side of this issue.

My friend Brittany Packnett Cunningham always says, your whiteness will not save you from what the patriarchy has in store for you. I am hoping that we are further down along this path now having had Donald Trump as president and that white women see exactly what is in store for them.

BLACKWELL: Jotaka, what do you say? What's your answer to Mary Jameson, I read her quote from the AP here 46 year old in Atlanta. "If a white woman can't win, how can a black woman win?"

EADDY: I think that you know listening to Shannon and looking at the numbers, you know, black women. We have traditionally been as always said the backbone of the Democratic Party. Our voting black has always been silent, very solid at 90%, 91%. And then when we look up and we saw in the 2016 the devastating in November that devastating you know next morning and we saw how those votes we asked the question, how did so many women vote against their own self-interest?

[08:10:13]

And I believe that in this election, as Shannon said, there is a lot of reckoning. And there is a lot of reflection on what is really at stake. As we look at, you know, reproductive freedoms is on the ballot box. Voting Rights is on the ballot box, our freedom to learn is on the ballot box. And so much is at stake. And I believe in this election, women are understanding that, you know, the stark differences between a Donald Trump presidency and a Kamala Harris presidency is literally life or death for many. And it's my hope that white women and all women will understand that and will mobilize in ways that is very different than what we saw in previous elections, particularly of white women.

And I believe also we're going to see increased voter turnout and, you know, traditional leadership of black women, we're only going to see that rise. And I believe that we can win. I believe that we will win because we'll win with a great coalition. We're seeing the momentum really led by black women, but allies, even white men have a call on Monday night.

BLACKWELL: Yes, I saw that.

EADDY: The disability as a call coming up. Everybody is seeing themselves in this election. But most importantly, I think they're seeing their power. And they're also seeing that state and they're taking action and mobilizing. That's how we're going to win. That's how we get there.

BLACKWELL: Jotaka Eaddy, Shannon watts, thank you for the conversation and we'll be watching those calls. Now as the new coalition vice president Harris builds, where did those uncommitted voters stand and uncommitted Michigan delegate explains why he's not sold on Harris. But first a judge in Missouri ordered a man wrongfully convicted to be released. Why, after three decades in prison, as the state Supreme Court blocked him from going home. His attorney and wife who were moments away from seeing him freed this week are here next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[08:16:49]

BLACKWELL: In Missouri, a man is still in prison this weekend after a judge's order to release him because he's innocent. Christopher Dunn has spent 30 years in prison for murder he did not commit. So when the St. Louis Circuit Court overturned his conviction in order his immediate release his family was as they describe it over the moon.

On Wednesday, his wife was on her way to pick him up. But Missouri's Attorney General Andrew Bailey has been fighting to keep Dunn in prison and before he could be set free, Missouri Supreme Court blocked his release. And a statement to a CNN affiliate in St. Louis Bailey's office said, "Throughout the appeals process multiple courts have affirmed Christopher Dunn's murder conviction. We will always fight for the rule of law and to obtain justice for victims. Christopher's wife Kira is with us along with Tricia Rojo Bushnell. She's the director of the Midwest Innocence Project, which represents Dunn.

Welcome to you both. And Kira, let me start with you. I understand that you visited your husband twice yesterday. What is he saying and feeling?

KIRA DUNN, CHRISTOPHER DUNN'S WIFE: Well, Chris is a very strong and resilient person. We found over the years with these enormous ups and downs that if we take that right emotionally on that roller coaster, we won't survive it. Chris has already had three heart attacks since his hearing in 2018. So we've learned to live emotionally somewhere in the middle. And so even though this was a huge hit, and Chris was as low as I've ever seen him, he's stabilized here and we're just living in the moment, moment by moment, keeping our hope alive right now.

BLACKWELL: I just cannot imagine that. The judge here in St. Louis, the circuit court judge says that there's evidence of actual innocence here. And let me come to you Tricia, the boys who identified Christopher Dunn as the shooter recanted as adults. They say they lied. So based on that, how do you hear what the AG hear? Andrew Bailey says it multiple courts have affirmed his guilt?

TRICIA ROJO BUSHNELL, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR, MIDWEST INNOCENCE PROJECT: Well, I think what's notable is the over 3,500 individuals who have been exonerated since 1989, all of them would have had multiple courts, who affirmed their conviction before the new evidence was presented of their innocence. And what's notable about Chris's case here is actually two courts have now found that no reasonable juror would convict him both a Judge Hickel back in 2020. But in Missouri is the only state in the country that says innocence is not a claim to get out of prison unless you are sentenced to death. And Chris wasn't sentenced to death at that time. And the only reason his innocence was allowed to be heard this time was because a prosecutor brought that motion.

So this isn't a moment where Chris is just alleging something that hasn't been proven. It's been found by two courts, and by the very office that secured his conviction wrongfully over three decades ago.

BLACKWELL: Kira, take me to that moment where you are on your way to pick up your husband after decades in prison and you get the information that he's not coming home, at least then.

[08:20:11]

DUNN: Well, I was about five minutes from the prison when I received the call. And I had been just trying to keep it together and contain my joy and still keep my car straight on the road. And as soon as I got the call, I heard one of our media affiliates say, Kira, I thought I just knew what I was going to hear was not going to be good news. And they told me that amazingly, at the very last minute, when Chris was 50 feet from walking out, he had put on his suit, his civilian clothing that he had doubt painstakingly months before and I'd had sent to the prison. He'd had his blood tested. He'd been processed out in every way and was just finishing those final signatures. He disposed of all his property, he'd even thrown away his toothbrush because he figured he wouldn't need it anymore. And I was just know, I just went on autopilot and got to the prison and the people there, knew that I knew. And the mood was so somber. I just got out and slowly walked over and we just, the air was gone out of everything. We're in disbelief.

BLACKWELL: I can imagine the last 50 feet to freedom after a court ordering that there was actual innocence and he should go home. What's the next step here, Tricia? And when could he be coming home?

BUSHNELL: Yes. So the Missouri Supreme Court on Wednesday ordered briefing from all of the participants in the hearing. So we filed our brief Thursday, the prosecutor filed their brief yesterday, and the Attorney General's is due on Monday. So after Monday, the Missouri Supreme court could rule at any time. And the question is whether or not the attorney general has the right to appeal this kind of issue, because we don't believe the statute gives them any rights to appeal a prosecutor's motion.

So depending on what the Missouri Supreme Court says, you know, we hope that Chris will be coming home still and as early as early next week.

BLACKWELL: All right, Tricia Rojo Bushnell and Kira Dunn. Thank you both for spending some time sharing this story with me and we will, of course update everyone when Christopher Dunn after 30 years comes home.

Some Democrats voted uncommitted to protest the President's Gaza policy during the primaries. Now some of those voters are uncommitted delegates to the Democratic Convention. One of them says that he got a nasty reaction after bringing up Gaza on a state party call. He joins us next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[08:27:22] (BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

HARRIS: As I just told Prime Minister Netanyahu, it is time to get this deal done. So to everyone who has been calling for a ceasefire and to everyone who yearns for peace, I see you and I hear you.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BLACKWELL: Those were vice president Kamala Harris's first comments on Gaza as a presidential candidate after her meeting with Israel's Prime Minister. And some voters in Michigan are focusing very closely on those words. President Biden's handling of Gaza caused him support during the primary in February, more than 100,000 voters chose uncommitted instead of Biden. Well that gave the state to uncommitted delegates. Abbas Alawieh is one of them. He's also a leader of the National uncommitted movement. Abbas, thank you for being with me this morning. So let's start with the words. What we're hearing from the Vice President.

You were uncommitted on Biden. You're still not sold on Harris. But is there anything in the distinctions between what you're hearing that makes you any more or less willing to back the Vice President?

ABBAS ALAWEIH, UNCOMMITTED MICHIGAN DNC DELEGATE: Thank you so much for having me, Victor. I am very encouraged to hear that in the first time that the Vice President spoke about Gaza, she expressed a level of empathy that we quite frankly, haven't seen from President Biden, in the months and months since the mass killing campaign against Palestinians have started. But part of what I'm hearing here in Michigan is that we need those words to be paired with action. We can't hear our elected leaders say they want a ceasefire, and then continue the policy of sending bombs unconditionally to Netanyahu is murderous government. So what the base is saying right now is not another bomb the bases saying we want a ceasefire that includes the urgent demand of stamp funding the killing.

BLACKWELL: You're calling for a meeting with the Vice President, between the vice president or campaign and the uncommitted delegates. What do you want to say? What do you want to hear from her?

ALAWEIH: Yes. So, you know, during this period, an immense level of pain has been felt not just by Arab and Muslim and Palestinian Americans, but by antiwar voters. Voters of conscious all around our country, including over 730,000 nationally who voted uncommitted, who wants to see a policy change who don't agree with sending more and more weapons to Benjamin Netanyahu to kill children on mass.

And so we want to take that message that is central to our base. Our base is saying, Free Palestine and we want to be able to sit down with Vice President Harris to make that case have stopped sending bombs. We want to make sure that she hears us as we're saying that we don't want our movement, ignored or maligned or being called repugnant as this administration. Unfortunately, started off doing when the call for ceasefire started happening. And so we need her to engage substantively with our demand for an arms embargo so that we can come out of the Democratic National Convention, united as a party and ready to beat back against Trump's very destructive agenda.

BLACKWELL: I talked about before the commercial break that you got a pretty nasty reaction when you spoke up about this on the endorsement call, the state party in Michigan there, tell me about what happened.

ALAWIEH: Yes. So, I was on a call with fellow delegates, delegates to the DNC and there was a vote being called about whether or not to endorse Vice President Harris. Now, I take my responsibility as a delegate very seriously. I have a responsibility to the over 101,000 voters who voted uncommitted here in Michigan as a message to send -- as a message to change the Gaza policy. We haven't yet heard vice president Harris engaged seriously with the demands of our movement.

And we need to hear from her. We've requested a meeting and are hopeful that we'll be able to sit down with her. But in the interim, I was on that call, and just was sort of speaking up on behalf of those voters saying, hey, voters need to see a change in Gaza policy, and especially here in Michigan, it is a tough issue for a lot of us. And so, unfortunately, someone unmuted and said something to the effect of, shut up, a-hole.

And to be honest with you, Victor, it was deeply disrespectful and honestly painful. But I also recognize it as a symptom of a larger culture within our politics, and unfortunately, even within the Democratic Party of anti-Arab and anti-Palestinian racism and bigotry that, you know, has no problem trying to shut down or silence or malign people who are speaking up for Palestinian human rights. That general culture is not disconnected from the fact that our foreign policy is OK with funding the killing of Palestinians on mass, that policy needs to change and that culture needs to change. And I'm hoping Vice President Harris can help us change it.

BLACKWELL: Abbas Alawieh, a delegate there, uncommitted in Michigan, thank you so much for being with me.

ALAWIEH: Thank you so much, Victor. I appreciate it.

BLACKWELL: Vice President Harris spoke with a family of Sonya Massey in Friday. And as we learn new details about the Illinois sheriff's deputy that killed her, there are calls for more action on police reform and questions about why he had that job in the first place. I'll speak with the attorney general of Illinois about that next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[08:37:13]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SHADIA MASSEY, COUSIN OF SONYA MASSEY: Her daughter cannot sleep at night, John (ph). She's in one household, I'm in another household. For her to go to the bathroom, she has to be on FaceTime with me. For her to get a drink of water she has to call us before she get out of her bed. Now this is the hardest thing that we have ever been through as a Massey. It just breaks my heart that our family has to go through this.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLACKWELL: You know the more we learn about the killing of Sonya Massey, the more upsetting it gets. An autopsy report released Friday confirms that she'd died from a gunshot wound to the head. And now former deputy Sean Grayson has been charged with three counts of first degree murder for her death. And according to records we now know that in four years he worked for six law enforcement agencies. That's after being charged twice with DUI.

The Massey family wants his hiring by Sangamon County investigated. And both President Biden and Vice President Harris put out statements in response to the shooting that calling for police reform. Illinois's Attorney General led the last round of major policing reforms. And Kwame Raoul joins us now.

Mr. Attorney General, thank you for your time. Deputy Sean Grayson worked for six departments in four years, accused of inmate intimidation, pleaded guilty to two DUIs, discipline for failing to call off a high speed chase, discharged from the military for misconduct. Should he have been employed by the Sangamon County Sheriff's Office in the first place?

KWAME RAOUL, (D) ILLINOIS ATTRNEY GENERAL: Yes, well, there's question as to whether he should have been employed by the first police department that hired him based on things that transpired before he put on a badge, before he put on the uniform. If I were the decision maker, he probably would not have been employed. There was nothing that was an absolute disqualifier because for a lot of reasons here in Illinois, we make sure that we embrace second chances, we embrace the possibility that people may evolve over time, but certainly it doesn't appear by this gentleman's background that he should have been employed by the first police department.

One of the things that I should mention, and we have several 100 law enforcement agencies within the state and in the downstate reasons region of Illinois, it's not uncommon for there to be part time police officers filling up staffs of the various sheriff's offices or smaller police departments. And that seems to have been the case in Mr. Grayson's case that he had simultaneously he was working for multiple police departments.

[08:40:13]

BLACKWELL: And that's what he said in one of his letters is that he just wanted to move from part time to full time position and moving from one department to another. But when you read that list, should he be part time or full time? Masseys family wants an investigation? Let me ask you about legislative changes, because I mentioned that you led the last slate of sweeping policing reform change in Illinois in 2021 requiring employment of body cam. Grayson didn't do that.

Requirement to render aid, he didn't do that. Duty to intervene, there wasn't much time, but the other officer there did not do that if there was this excessive force. Is this a tragedy of individuals or is this cultural?

RAOUL: Well, let me say this, I actually led the last two police reforms. One of the things that I did when I was in the legislature some six years ago is make sure that our law required that if somebody was fired or -- for misconduct or was resigned while under investigation, that would need to be reported and held in a database. So it's such that they could not be employed. In this case, none of that occurred. That was some background, that's definitely questionable. But at some point, we have to trust some discretion to individual police departments.

With regards to him not deploying his body cam, that did not meet the law as we have put it in place. So, as you said, this is unfortunately, it's a horrific tragedy that should not have happened. This family should not be undergoing the trauma that they are going --

BLACKWELL: Yes.

RAOUL: -- undergoing. But it's not necessarily a failure of the law. One of the things that we also put in place in terms of the law is to make sure --

BLACKWELL: I hope -- let me -- attorney general, let me jump in here, if it's not a failure of the law, and I know no law stops every misdeed or misconduct. But then what do you tell this family? What do you tell the other families who might have to call on the Sangamon County Sheriff's Office and they've seen this body cam video? I mean, the law is your tool. What then do you do to protect the people in this county and across the state?

RAOUL: Absolutely. So, while there may not be a failure of the law, there may be -- there may be a failure of carrying out the law, carrying out policy. Right now, we're in a stage where there's been swift action by state police and investigating and swift action by the Sangamon County state's attorney in indicting the officer and arresting the officer. It usually doesn't happen that fast. So there's a criminal proceeding.

But also, we're engaged right now with a -- in a patterns and practice investigation of one police department in Joliet, Illinois. We're engaged right now in a consent decree implementation with the Chicago Police Department changing their policies. So there's always a possibility. I'm not saying that necessarily there's sufficient evidence to merit a patterns and practice investigation --

BLACKWELL: Yes.

RAOUL: -- it's pretty mature to say so. But that is a tool that we've been provided by the reforms --

BLACKWELL: All right.

RAOUL: -- that we put in place a couple of years ago.

BLACKWELL: Illinois Attorney General Kwame Raoul, thank you so much for being with me this morning.

There's been a fight in Georgia over an AP African American studies course that maybe you have not heard much about but you should. I want you to stay with me for this. The state now says that it will pay for the course but an advisor to the College Board says there's one, as he describes it, dark deceptive detail that treats this course different than the others. He's with us to explain ahead.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[08:48:48]

BLACKWELL: Georgia students who want to take an AP African American studies course have a tough decision. This week, just days before the start of the school year, Georgia Superintendent of Schools Richard Woods announced no state funding would be provided to cover the cost of the class. But then he appeared to reverse course after protests and questions from lawmakers. I say appeared because the state still will not pay for AP African American Studies. Instead it will fund the coursework under a different name, an existing state approved basic African American studies course.

With me now is Rashad Brown, an AP African American Studies teacher here in Atlanta. Let's start here by -- and it sounds like it's in the weeds and sometimes if people are trying to pull in okey-doke, that's exactly where they'll put it.

RASHAD BROWN, AP AFRICAN AMERICAN STUDIES CONSULTANT, COLLEGE BOARD: Right.

BLACKWELL: Right? Not in the headline, not in the bold statement. Why does it matter how this course is coded versus AP German History AP World History.

BROWN: OK, so the coding is very important because that is going to determine if the student's GPA receives a weighted increase in a weighted boosts. Also it determines how colleges are going to view the credit so they won't be able to really necessarily receive college credit for introductory course compared to an AP course. Furthermore, it also impacts teacher salaries, right, because teachers receive a bonus if they're teaching an AP class.

[08:50:10]

Also, it also affects FTE money because schools and districts are receive more funding for FTE, when courses have AP next to them. So what's the problem is you have funding for what you claim to be an AP course but it's titled an introductory course.

BLACKWELL: So just to be clear here that at school, a teacher can teach the entire curriculum, but because it's not coded as AP, it's a disincentive to take that course, because you don't get the credit.

BROWN: Correct.

BLACKWELL: The teacher doesn't get the money.

BROWN: Correct.

BLACKWELL: So, it would be more advantageous to teach or take AP Japanese History.

BROWN: Right.

BLACKWELL: AP World History.

BROWN: Or AP European History, which is coded properly. So, one thing that the spokesperson from the Board of Education said was that all courses are properly coded in the course framework, right? And so the issue is also it puts our students at a competitive disadvantage, right? Because when you're looking at the Hope Scholarship, you're competing, right? And so if you're taking a course that has similar rigor, but isn't delineated as such, well, you're pretty much wasting your time and you're not going to be as competitive for things like the Hope Scholarship where you're trying to receive that when you're looking at GPA.

BLACKWELL: Why? Why is this happening?

BROWN: Well, historically when we look at things, especially in the antebellum south, because it's not just here in Georgia, this is also happening in Arkansas, South Carolina, multiple states in the antebellum South Pass what are known as anti-literacy laws. And these anti-literacy laws made it an actual crime to teach newly freed slaves or Negros the ability to read or write. It was actually literally punishable under law, you can be fined, whipped, and imprisoned. And so, what we're seeing now is a reemergence of what we'd like to call modern day anti-literacy laws. And so, there were multiple calls from a large coalition of people in lawmakers and the NAACP and the ACLU to really urge the Georgia State Superintendent to reconsider his position before we reconsider it for him, because this is an elected position.

And he's supposed to serve in the best interest of all Georgians and all students. And if you can't do so, we need to find in the placement room immediately.

BLACKWELL: You taught the pilot course, you're part of the program.

BROWN: Yes, sir.

BLACKWELL: What do the students lose, those who because they want that way to GPA and choose something else if they don't take this course?

BROWN: Well, they just lose just the knowledge and just the ability to understand just the African diaspora and the impact that African Americans have had on not just this country, but the world at large. One thing we really want to make clear is that black history is American history. And this is not a class just for African American students, we have a multicultural coalition of students who really, really want to take this course, who really advocated for this course, and who really wants to stand up and make sure that their rights are protected and that the Georgia State Superintendent make sure that he hears their voice.

BLACKWELL: Rashad Brown, thank you.

BROWN: Thank you, sir.

BLACKWELL: All right. The Paris Olympics are now underway. Next, hear from the artists behind the unique inclusive posters for this year's games.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[08:57:39]

BLACKWELL: The Paris Olympic Games have begun. And something to look out for are its official posters. These are the work of artists Clotilde Jimenez. And I spoke with him about how he makes sure that all athletes are seen.

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CLOTILDE JIMENEZ, ARTIST: I'm Clotilde Jimenez. I'm an artist from Philadelphia and based in Mexico City and I work in primarily collage sculpture, ceramics, a plethora of different mediums throughout 2014, '15. That's when I started developing my collage practice. This is when I think a lot of these social movements were gaining traction around the country, Black Lives Matters, Me Too, all of these things. I mean, we've been talking about these things for a while in our communities but -- and again, you know, national traction.

Collage for me is -- it's a way of building upon layers. And I found myself as I was speaking about these things there was layers that I had to peel back from myself. And collage really helped me look at these different aspects of everything. You know, I was able to play with my own image, but also the images of other people and create a narrative that spoke two different things at the same time. And I was chosen to produce the Paris 2024 Olympic posters, synchronized swimming for the Olympics and then relay raced Paralympic relay race for the Paralympics.

When 1924, Paris hosted the Olympic Games, and I use that poster as kind of a starting point. And it was a very different poster. I wanted to kind of use that as a starting point and show what that might look like today in 2024 so that maybe in the next 100 years they can look back at my posters and kind of see who we were as people, what we stood for. I think that's kind of the job as an artist is to be kind of record keeper for the times that you live in.

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BLACKWELL: Now in Paris, Clotilde's work can be seen at the Marion Abraham gallery. His exhibition called the Long Run Wraps It's Run Today. For more in his work, checkout clotildejimenez.art.

And thank you for joining me today. Smerconish is up next.