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First of All with Victor Blackwell

Many Black Women Voters Left Frustrated After Harris' Loss; Why Man Black Women Are Feeling Frustrated; Harris' Defeat Raises Questions About Future Of DEM Coalition. Black People Across U.S. Receive Racist Text Messages After Trump's Win; FBI Investigates Death Of Black Man Found Hanging In Alabama; A California Ballot Measure To Ban Forced Prison Labor Is Failing; 2 Canton Officers Pleaded Not Guilty In Frank Tyson Case. Aired 8-9a ET

Aired November 09, 2024 - 08:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[08:00:00]

VICTOR BLACKWELL, CNN ANCHOR: They are frustrated. We're going to have a conversation about why and what comes next. And there also may be no surprise that the president says that his promise of mass deportations in the campaign is his number one presidential priority. The president also won Latino voters with a message on immigration and the economy. Someone who told me this was going to happen months ago is back with me.

And later, children, college students, black people across two dozen states say they're getting these racist text messages that reference slavery and picking cotton. We're going to get some historical context from Michael Eric Dyson. So stay with us. Packed show. Let's start it right now.

Well, first of all, this morning, I want to start with a little story, personal story. If you've never been to Atlanta Airport, there's a rotating art exhibition. Just as you're leaving Terminal T, you're headed out to baggage claim, going to your car. There are glass cases on either side and they're usually filled with works by local artists. And I love those shows.

So usually I stop to check out the new pieces. But there was one particular day, 2016, it was March 15th. One portrait stopped me. And this is it. The name of it is Grandma's Glory. It's by Atlanta artist David Roby. An elderly black woman, bare feet, hair braided in a simple wooden chair wrapped in the American flag.

I was awestruck. I couldn't move. I know I was in the way. And people were rushing by. I just could not take my eyes off of this. It's a stunning image, but also because we don't see black women like this featured in patriotic works. Right. Black women in Americana.

I later learned that it was inspired by photographs of Ms. Milvertha Hendricks as she was wrapped in an American flag blanket after Hurricane Katrina. She was waiting to be evacuated in New Orleans. But there's an important difference between the photo and the painting. If you look closely at the woman in this painting, she's not just wrapped in the flag. Look at her hands, needle, and thread.

I sat with this image this week again, awestruck, but for a different reason. 91 percent of black women, according to CNN exit polls, voted for Vice President Kamala Harris to become the first black woman president of the United States. And black women were 7 percent of the electorate. No other demographic across race or gender, age, income, education, married, rural, suburban. Nobody supported either candidate so abundantly.

Now, black women have long been the backbone of the Democratic Party, but it warrants repeating, 91 percent. And less important than who they voted for is what they say they were voting for. Because you know what the most important issue for Harris voters was, according to CNN exit polls? It was not foreign policy. It wasn't the economy. It wasn't immigration. It wasn't abortion rights. It was American democracy. Think of it.

This is a country that has never elected a black woman governor. Of the more than 11,500 members of Congress in the history of America, 60 have been black women. That's about one-half of 1 percent. And next session, two black women will serve in the Senate together for the first time ever. Angela Alsobrooks of Maryland, Elisa Bunt Rochester of Delaware.

And still, so many black women voted to protect the democracy of a country. Let's make it plain here that for centuries denied their grandmothers and their great-grandmothers full participation in it. So, yes, I sat with this painting this week. Grandma's glory now hangs in my home.

And as I've listened to the black women who voted for Vice President Harris and who say they voted for democracy and are frustrated and hurt, I understand it a little bit more. Black women, needle and thread, mending the flag.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We did our job. So we really, really have to stop going above and beyond for these other women that are just going to disappoint us.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I'm tired of coming to other people's defense and protesting for other people and standing up for other people and giving a helping hand to other people. And then when it comes time where I need that helping hand, you don't stretch your hand far enough out for me.

[08:05:04]

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Black folks, black women especially, your job is to rest, kick up your feet, take off the cape. We showed up, we showed out. We spoke up. We did what were supposed to do. It is now time to rest. And I don't mean rest like be apathetic, because that's not what we need. Some of us do need to organize. But I want you to organize for your community, not to save the country. We're done with that now.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BLACKWELL: All right. Let's have a conversation. Holly Holiday is a lead organizer with the group Win With Black Women and president of Sisters Lead, Sisters Vote. And Liz Minnella is a co-organizer of White Women Answer the Call. Welcome to you both.

Holly, I'm going to start with you because there are a lot of black women who are ready to just check out of the coalition. And I'm sure you've seen it. They say, don't call us again because we have shown up for you over and over. And when we needed you were not there. So what do you say to those black women this morning who share that sentiment?

HOLLY HOLIDAY, LEAD ORGANIZER, #WINWITHBLACKWOMEN: Yes, I say I appreciate it. I appreciate them. I appreciate their work. And the reality is we are proud of this race. We're disappointed in the outcome. But let's be really clear. We showed up for ourselves. We showed up for the reason that democracy is important is because we recognize that democracy is a system where black people have opportunity and access. So we care about democracy because we care about our families.

And I'd also like to say, and I appreciate you bringing up some of them, we won some stuff in 2024, and we won some stuff because we showed up. Yes, you talked about the senators. But let me add a little bit more context to the Congress.

I don't know if people recognize every single black woman incumbent in the Congress was reelected, even in some red states like Amelia Sykes in Ohio and Summer Lee in Pennsylvania. We also elected a new crop of black women prosecutors where black women represent less than 1 percent of all prosecutors, including reelecting Fani Willis, who Trump came after with both barrels and Monique Worrell in Florida, who DeSantis literally ousted from her job.

So I say to black women, yes, be disappointed. I understand, especially when you're focused on the top of the ticket. But think about what is happening in your own communities that you're making a difference in because we are seeing lots of wins there.

BLACKWELL: Liz, I want to play a portion of a conversation that I had the weekend after the big Zoom calls. Black women had a big call for Kamala Harris. White women had a big call for Kamala Harris. I understand you were part of that. Shannon Watts was on the show. And here's a part of our exchange.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

SHANNON WATTS, CO-ORGANIZER, "WHITE WOMEN: ANSWER THE CALL 2024": And I am hopeful that when we hear these comments from the other side about cat ladies and women who don't have children and taking away women's access to abortion or even IVF, that will get some of the women, the white women who are sitting on the fence, off of the fence and get them on the right side of this issue. My friend Brittany Pack, Nick Cunningham always says your whiteness will not save you from what the patriarchy has in store for you. I am hoping that we are further down along this path now, having had Donald Trump as president, and that white women see exactly what is in store.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BLACKWELL: For them post post-election now and exit polls not remarkably different than they were in 2016 and 2020. And we should always understand that white women are no more monolith than black women are monolith. But what's your assessment of what we're learning about these numbers and how white women voted this cycle?

LIZ MINNELLA, CO-ORGANIZER, "WHITE WOMEN: ANSWER THE CALL 2024": So I think it's safe to say we're deeply disappointed in the way that white women voted. I traveled from my hometown to D.C. on Election Day and my friend who traveled with me all through the airport wore a T-shirt that said vote like a black woman. And we decidedly did not. We know from exit polling that about 45 percent of white women voted for Harris, which is arguably worse than it was in 2020. I think it's also interesting to drill down into that statistic and look at the fact that 60 percent of college-educated white women voted for Harris and contrast that with the 65 percent of non-college-educated white women who voted for Trump. So I think that points to the fact that we have a messaging problem. We lost an online messaging war to reach non- college-educated white women.

Ballot initiatives based on Democratic principles like raising the minimum wage and abortion access and paid sick leave won in states where the Democratic candidate lost. So that tells me we don't have a policy problem. We have a communication problem. We have issues reaching these non-college-educated white women and giving them a persuading message that makes them vote in their own self-interest.

[08:10:09]

BLACKWELL: Holly, three quarters between 75 percent and 8 percent of black men supported Vice President Harris, but about 21 percent of black men supported Donald Trump. And so in the next cycle both parties will have to court black men, will have to address policies to them to try to build those numbers. I wonder if the near monolithic numbers for black women serves as a disincentive for the parties to court black women.

HOLIDAY: Well, I certainly hope that is not the case because I think that they you will find, as I mentioned, when you look across what's happening in states and we'll have an opportunity to see this next year when we look at states like New Jersey and Virginia, particularly Virginia, as they elect the governor, that they've been able to elect a lot of Democrats because black women are showing up. And if they want to make sure that black men continue and increase showing up, I suggest that black women are going to be part of that formula. I'm not quite sure how they're doing their analysis on how you do outreach to people, but it actually requires you to have some type of relationship with them. And creating wedges and disenfranchising or seeking to disenfranchise black women from black men is literally like breaking up our own family. And if they think that's a winning strategy, I suggest they rethink that one.

BLACKWELL: Liz, last question to you here. Did the Democrats over-rely on the reproductive rights argument to try to build their support among white women?

MINNELLA: I think so. When we look at the conversations that were had online, a lot of the white women that voted for Trump were talking about saving their daughters by voting for a candidate that was going to protect them in locker rooms and on their sports teams from trans people. And this messaging hit very hard online.

We had no infrastructure to combat it. We thought that this was a winning message and that we could disseminate that message through our traditional campaign structure. We needed to be online, we needed to be seeing this misinformation, this firehose of misinformation that was being presented to people and they felt that they were voting in the interest of women and their daughters by protecting them from red dye 40 in Doritos and trans athletes. And it's really terrifying that we just -- we were not having the same conversation that were.

We were playing checkers, they were playing chess. We need to develop an online infrastructure with paid influencers who can message to people on the things that resonate with them and can turn their fears into action at the voting booth. The right has done an incredible job of that. They've been investing in that infrastructure for a decade. And we need to stop looking at our playbook and trying to improve upon it and start looking at their playbook.

BLACKWELL: Liz Minnella, Holly Holiday, I thank you both for the conversation.

HOLIDAY: Thanks.

BLACKWELL: You probably know by now that Donald Trump made some major gains with Latinos, especially Latino men. My next guest says that's because of immigration and the economy. And he told me this would happen months ago. The economy.

So what does he make of the president-elect saying there's no price tag for his mass deportation plan? Plus, kids and college students across two dozen states receiving racist text messages. The messages say they've been selected to pick cotton and executive slaves are coming to pick them up.

Michael Eric Dyson is ahead on the climate. And to add some crucial context.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[08:18:47]

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT-ELECT OF THE USA: On day one, I will launch the largest deportation program in American history to get the criminals out.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BLACKWELL: The president-elect says that campaign promise is a presidential priority and it's not limited to just the criminals. He says that all undocumented migrants in this or immigrants in this country have to be deported. Now, when he was asked this week how much it would cost, the president-elect said there is no price tag. There is a cost, though.

According to ICE, back in 2016, the average cost of apprehending, detaining, processing, and removing one undocumented immigrant from the United States is $10,900. Pew Research says 5 percent of the U.S. Workforce is undocumented. That's 8.3 million people. And the Institute on Taxation and Economic Policy says undocumented migrants pay $96.7 billion in taxes annually. All notable when you consider the economy, is a major reason why many voters back Trump over Harris and noteworthy numbers of those Latinos who voted.

The numbers of Latinos who voted, particularly men, in historic numbers when compared to support for Biden in 2020. So let's talk about all this with Daniel Garza. He's the president of the Libre Initiative, conservative Hispanic group, working on policy issues including the economy and immigration. And you said months ago this was going to happen.

[08:20:14]

Daniel, welcome back. Let me start here because the Democrats haven't decided their path forward. If it was the message or the policy that did not resonate from your perspective, and I know you're in no business of giving Democrats advice, but which was it? Was it primarily the messaging or the policy?

DANIEL GARZA, PRESIDENT, THE LIBRE INITIATIVE: Victor, Look, I strongly feel that the working class Latinos, 85 percent of Latinos are working class. I think they felt ignored. Their pain was ignored. The rising cost and the inability of wages to keep up with the rising costs really hurt a lot of working-class Latinos who were already making it from paycheck to barely making it from paycheck to paycheck. So now there's this expectation that this new leadership will return us to a pro-growth, pro-trade, pro-energy approach so that more and more Americans can improve their economic well-being. And I think it is, you know, hopefully it's an agenda that seeks to increase productivity and wage growth. That's what we're looking at. And weren't getting that narrative from Harris.

BLACKWELL: Daniel, when you say there's an expectation, I went back and I just wanted to refresh myself on some of the statistical and the anecdotal assessments of the Trump administration among Latinos. These numbers all come from Pew 2018. Only 22 percent of Latinos approved of Trump's job as president, 67 percent that his policies were harmful to them. 2020, only 18 percent of Latinos rated economic conditions as excellent or good. What is this economic nostalgia that we see from a lot of Latinos, this expectation of returning to a better time when at the time so many said it wasn't working for him?

GARZA: Imagine how it was compared to the Biden years then if that is true. Look, I think they just sometimes it's about the way they feel. And they felt that they were better off under Trump pre-COVID that unemployment was down, that wage growth was up, that home ownership was up, that labor participation was up, that energy production was up, that there were less taxes, tax cuts, there was more money in their pocket, there were regulatory cuts. The entrepreneurship was being unleashed. More Latinos were entering the workforce as entrepreneurs and starting their own businesses.

They removed unneeded certification. They cut government jobs and spending to a certain extent. So all this really helped them to flourish better. But under this administration, public Spending went way up, prices went way up, and people just felt a loss of control of their finances, and they were taking on water. And this sense of, you know, sinking along with everybody else. That conversation spread across the country in the Latino community.

BLACKWELL: Let me ask you about this plan for mass deportation. I want to read you a section of a letter from September 2016, an open letter. "We, the undersigned, reject any proposal that suggests the following. An end to the longstanding practice of birthright citizenship in the United States and the mass deportation of immigrants and U.S. Citizens, particularly those who have obeyed laws and contributed to society since arriving in the country."

You recognize that letter because you wrote it. And so what has changed?

GARZA: Nothing. Birthright citizenship will not end under Donald Trump. And if he tries to end it, we will oppose it, we will resist it. That is something that is a birthright to all Americans.

BLACKWELL: And he says he will try to. He will try to end it.

GARZA: Sure. But you need to be ratified by what, 65 percent of the states legislatures, by a supermajority in the Senate and the House. It's just not going to happen.

BLACKWELL: What about deportation?

GARZA: Look, there's some confusion about what mass deportation means. Is it targeted in focus Deportations? Folks already on the deportation list. Apparently there's 1.3 million folks on that list who failed to show up for court or were ordered by the judges to be deported and have not been deported.

BLACKWELL: But he doesn't appear to be confused about deportation. He says all estimated 11 million have to go.

GARZA: Yes, it's not viable to begin with, but if you are talking about random folks who will be pulled out of their homes or their jobs, folks who are here working to strengthen America and improve their lot in life, there's going to be some resistance to that across the board. There's no question about it.

Look, I think everybody agrees that we need to get rid of the folks that come to exploit and come do harm to Americans. That should be the priority. And you will be joined by all Americans in that effort, that's for sure. There's no question, though, that Congress is on the clock here. There is an urgency for reform, to expand legalization tracks, get folks to help strengthen America. Those who want to contribute are welcome. Those who come to do harm are going to be tossed back.

[08:25:13]

BLACKWELL: Daniel Garza of the Libre Initiative, good to have you on again. Thanks so much.

GARZA: What a pleasure, Victor.

BLACKWELL: All right, this is alarming. Black people in two dozen states now say they've received racist text messages. The messages claim that slave catchers will round them up to pick cotton.

Author Michael Eric Dyson is here to react and talk about the anxiety a lot of people are feeling. And then we'll broaden the conversation out to post-election.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BLACKWELL: There is this bizarre and really scary situation playing out in about two dozen states right now. Black people receiving text messages from a number they don't recognize that tells them that they've been selected to pick cotton and that an executive slave or a slave catcher will pick them up. There's even a plantation assignment.

And the texts are personalized with the recipients' names. And the FCC and the attorneys general of several states are trying to figure out where these messages are coming from and why. And to make matters worse, these are going to college students and to children.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I was scared.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What were you scared of?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That I was going to get picked up out of school and have to get cotton picking. Pick cotton and slavery.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: After I got that text message, that message, it had me thinking. It's had me thinking, like, why would they send it to me?

TALAYA JONES, RECEIVED RACIST MASS TEXT MESSAGE: I immediately sent it to my mom and my sister in our group chat and were all just like, what is going on in the world? There's no way that it's 2024 and things like this are happening again. And it's just insane. Like the level of disrespect that people have for other humans.

And it just really shows, like, we thought we came far from where were hundreds of years ago, but honestly, we have not at all, clearly.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLACKWELL: Michael Eric Dyson is with us. He's an author and distinguished professor at Vanderbilt. His latest book is "Represent: The Unfinished Fight for the Vote." Michael, good morning to you. Thanks for being with me. What's your interpretation? We hear this young woman say it's unbelievable in 2024 that this would happen. Your assessment of why this is coming out now, post-election.

MICHAEL ERIC DYSON, AUTHOR, "REPRESENT: THE UNFINISHED FIGHT FOR THE VOTE": Well, thanks for having me, brother Victor. Well, the unleashing of the torrents of hatred, the passions of bigotry under Donald Trump. I mean, we hate to be reductive, but the truth is Donald Trump authorizes the formidable expression of hatred and the passions of bigotry that concentrate what many white supremacists and others have thought for so long.

Now they can come out of the closet, they can come out of their hoods, they can relieve their sheets, and they can say these kinds of things out in public and in open. Calling Letitia James a fat woman, denigrating the identity of many black people and these anonymous texts sent to black people to remind them that they are to be corralled and corrupted by a system that refuses to acknowledge their humanity.

So no surprise that with Donald Trump's second presidency comes the reissue of certain forms of hatred and bigotry.

BLACKWELL: And I want to be clear is that the Trump team, the transition says that they have nothing to do with these text messages. There is no evidence that they are involved in these text messages. But I hear your point on climate. Let me ask you about the result. Go ahead.

DYSON: Right. I'm not saying they're directly responsible as if in their hands are on it. But the suggestion that Donald Trump has nothing to do with this in terms of the hatred that has been marshaled under his rubric is something altogether different. And their hands are not clean.

BLACKWELL: President-elect Trump performed better among black male voters than any Republican has in almost half a century. And so, when we consider some of the things he has said, history with the exonerated five, housing lawsuits from the federal government, how do you reconcile that performance and what so many have learned about the next president?

DYSON: Well, Gore Vidal said we live in the United States of amnesia. And in this instance, this is a black variety of amnesia, Afro amnesia. These are people who either are not old enough to understand the historic trajectory of Mr. Trump's bigotry, or those who are here denying the legitimacy of the claim that this is a man who has done horrible things in the name of preserving and protecting a kind of whiteness that is destructive not only to the broader American society, but to black people in general.

And for those who claim, oh, it was about his swag, misunderstand the nature of a kind of charismatic identity. And those who claim that Donald Trump gave them checks missed the malignant narcissism that motivated him to put his name on relief checks that Congress validated that he refused to support in its initial stage. So, this is a jumble of misinformation and amnesia coming together in

part to promote the black support of a man who is manifestly against the interests of African Americans.

BLACKWELL: Michael. And this is probably the conversation that Democrats are having trying to do their post mortem.

[08:35:03]

This is the conversation that Democrats, you others have had leading up to the election. And it didn't work. And so is the best approach or the effective approach to the black men who you're discussing this. Right. They bought an economic message, many of them.

DYSON: Well, I mean, again, an economic message while the great recovery from the pandemic was continued under President Biden while the attempt to, yes, inflation rose, but wages rose and the possibility of black people getting employed rose, black unemployment decline to a certain degree. So I'm not going to reduce the complexity and nuance of a discussion about race to one election.

Yes, maybe we perhaps didn't get the message across effectively in this particular instance, but it doesn't mean the message was wrong. It means we have to rejigger what we do in order to make that message more clear.

BLACKWELL: All right, Michael Eric Dyson, always good to have you. Part of the conversation. Thank you.

DYSON: Thank you, sir.

BLACKWELL: So this next headline is chilling and I want to make sure it's not missed. In all the election news, the FBI is stepping in to help in the investigation of a black man found hanging in an abandoned house. His widow refuses to believe the police explanation that his death was suicide. She's here with us next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[08:41:13]

BLACKWELL: The FBI is investigating the death of a black man in Alabama. He was found hanging in an abandoned house. Sheriff's deputies found Dennoriss Richardson in September in an abandoned house miles from his home. Now, his death was ruled out suicide, but his wife believes his death may be related to a lawsuit filed against local police.

In a statement, the Colbert County sheriff confirmed he asked the FBI to step in, saying that his department had exhausted all its resources. And he added that we feel confident in what our findings were, but we feel like by doing this we can give the family more peace of mind.

Joining me now are Dennoriss's widow Leigh Richardson and their family attorney, Roderick Van Daniel. Welcome to you both. Lee, let me start with you.

You don't believe that your husband died by suicide. Tell me more about why you don't think that is the case.

LEIGH RICHARDSON, WIDOW OF DENNORISS RICHARDSON: Well, first of all, just in our faith, in our Christian faith, we have always taught our children, you know, that we considered suicide a ticket to hell. And just knowing him in his heart and his love for his children, he took being a father, a role model very seriously. He was not only a good father, but he was also a mentor in the community. And he had many nieces and nephews that looked up to him.

BLACKWELL: Did he have any connection to this house?

RICHARDSON: No, not at all.

BLACKWELL: Was there any note or anything left?

RICHARDSON: No, not at all.

BLACKWELL: No.

RICHARDSON: Nothing. And that's the thing. He didn't even tell my children, you know, bye. Or anything that a loving father of his caliber would have done.

BLACKWELL: And you believe -- and you don't have to say any names because I don't want to get you into any legal trouble. But do you believe that you know who's involved even if you don't say the name? Do you know, you think you know?

RICHARDSON: I'm very suspicious of the circumstances that were happening in his life prior to his death. Yes.

BLACKWELL: Roderick, let me come to you because you represent five black and Latino men in federal lawsuits against the Sheffield Police Department there. Richardson was one. Talk about the claim in his case that you think is related potentially to this.

RODERICK VAN DANIEL, CIVIL RIGHTS ATTORNEY: I don't want to go too deep into it because we also still have a pending for litigation right now. But if are we just trying to fight for justice for him and the community there and what happened to him is just a bad thing for the whole black community and for the whole community as a whole for the city of Sheffield, a person being choked for hitting the neck for we don't need no citizens nowhere in the state of Alabama or the whole entire United States of America being in restraint chairs over three the four hours, then saying that you can't get no help from no one threatening their lives, being maced in jail cells. We don't need that nowhere in the United States of America.

Also, we don't need the officers going into jail cells and beating up the citizens and then filing charges on them for assault.

BLACKWELL: Are those things that you're alleging to happen in this police department? DANIEL: The city of Sheffield Police Department are harassing the

citizens there.

BLACKWELL: Leigh, let me ask you. We read the statement from the Culver County Sheriff's Office, and he says they believe that he died by suicide. They've done all they can. What's your degree of confidence in their investigation?

[08:45:00]

RICHARDSON: I don't see an investigation. The things that I was shown were, you know, just very minimal. I don't know how all resources were exhausted when I have no evidence that makes me believe anything other than what I'm saying.

BLACKWELL: And do you then have greater confidence that you'll get clarity now that the FBI is involved?

RICHARDSON: I do have hopes that the FBI and the Justice Department will look into all of the details and also not only for Dennoriss. This is a huge issue in our community. I've had several people reach out since Dennoriss death. And these are white, black, Latinos. There are several other instances where misconduct and excessive force has been brought into play.

BLACKWELL: All right, Leigh, Roderick, thank you both for being with me. We will, of course, follow this case and this story.

We, of course, reached out to the Sheffield Police Department. They've not responded to requests for comment on the lawsuit.

It's almost strange when you say it out loud, but in progressive California, a ballot proposal to end a so called slavery loophole failed this week. Now, to be clear, slavery is illegal in California. But Proposition 6 would have closed a provision in the California constitution that allows jails and prisons to force prison inmates to work.

Meanwhile, a tough on crime measure, Proposition 36, passed overwhelmingly. And last week I spoke with Samuel Brown, a former California inmate who helped write Prop 6. He said the failure of Prop 6 and the passage of Prop 36 feeds a system that harms communities of color.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SAM BROWN, ORIGINAL AUTHOR OF CALIFORNIA'S PROP 6: The tough on crime legislation is oftentimes historically supported by large organizations and corporations that benefit from prison labor. What Prop 6 does, Prop 6 undermines that and takes away the benefit and incentives for them to invest in tough on crime legislation that destroys communities of color. And so many people are being, you know, fooled to think that they're focused on public safety.

(END VIDEO CLIP) BLACKWELL: Prop 36 makes shoplifting a felony for repeat offenders and increases penalties on some drug offenses. We've also been tracking this story. Two Ohio police officers charged in the death of a man who died in their custody earlier this year have now entered not guilty pleas in the case. That's according to CNN affiliate WOIO.

And we first shared Frank Tyson's story in May. He died in April after he crashed his vehicle and ran from police. Now, that's when officers wrestled him to the ground. One of them placed a knee on his neck or near his neck. In the video, Tyson can be heard telling them, I can't breathe five times in a minute. And after he stopped speaking, the officers realized he was unresponsive. I spoke with Tyson's fiancee back in May. And she responded to the video.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SIBRENA JONES, FRANK TYSON'S FIANCEE: I was hurt, devastated, angry, mad. I couldn't believe what I was seeing. It was wrong. Man, I can't get that video out of my mind. I wanted to see those police officers in jail, not only because I don't want them to have another job. I want them to be taken away from their families, just like they took Frank away. I know they won't be dead, but just would have to be done.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLACKWELL: The coroner listed Tyson's death as a homicide, and the two officers are now charged with reckless homicide as a felony, punishable by up to 36 months in prison. We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[08:53:25]

BLACKWELL: Art is life now. And I'd like to end this hour really where we began, artist David Roby and his painting Grandma's Glory.

(BEGIN VIDEO CIP)

DAVID ROBY, VISUAL ARTIST: I'm David Roby. I live in Atlanta and I'm a visual artist. One day I was thumbing through a magazine and I came across a black and white photo of an elderly black lady who was one of the Hurricane Katrina survivors. The caption read Left Behind. It inspired me to try and project the sadness that she must have felt and the uncertainty that she must have surely felt being left behind.

And the flag was a blanket and a security and she was taking pride in stitching it. That's not in the photo. You know, matter of fact, I didn't see her hands. There was a message that, you know, the plight of black people in this country and in spite of it, she just took upon herself to repair that flag. That was her comfort.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLACKWELL: David says he's painted many works, but Grandma's Glory is his favorite. It's my favorite, too. Grammy nominations are out. And if you know me and you've watched this

show, you know I am a member of the Beehive. And congratulations to Beyonce, 11 nominations.

[08:55:00]

She's now the most nominated artist ever. Album of the Year, Record of the Year, Song of the Year, Best Pop Solo Performance for Bodyguard. The first two were for Texas Hold 'Em do our group for that song with Post Malone, Levi's Jeans Best Country Album, Best Country Solo Performance for Sixteen Carriages. This is a fantastic album. I know it slipped on the charts but it is still quality and an example of her stretching herself.

If you see something or someone I should see, tell me. I'm Victor Blackwell on socials, Instagram and X. Also, if you missed a conversation or a story or if you'd like to hear it again, check out CNN.com/Victor-Blackwell-First-of-All, hyphen between each word. You can watch at any time and listen to our show's podcast wherever you get your podcast.

Thank you so much for joining me today. I'll see you back here Saturday at 8:00 a.m. Eastern. Mr. Smerconish is next.

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