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Glenn Beck

California Congressman Weighs in on Imprisoned Border Guards; More Border Crossing Related Deaths This Year; Analyst Finds Progress in Iraq; Woman Sues Over Porn DVD Cover

Aired August 01, 2007 - 19:00   ET


GLENN BECK, HOST: Coming up, a special edition of the program. Tonight from our nation`s capitol, where I had the chance this afternoon to sit face to face in the Oval Office with our commander in chief.
Hello, America, and greetings from Washington, D.C. I am here today because I was invited last Friday to personally meet with President Bush for an off-the-record and, honestly, quite shockingly frank discussion inside of the Oval Office.

Today I met with the George Bush I haven`t seen in a long time, not since I saw him leading the nation from that step of that fire truck right after 9/11.

The president and I talked about a number of things. Mostly it was the war in Iraq, Islamic radicals, and the possible threat of Iran. I`ll have details on some of that a little later in the show.

But first, I also had the chance to briefly discuss with the president the wrongly imprisoned border agents Ramos and Compean. He didn`t necessarily avoid the issue, but something tells me my views on the matter really -- you know, doesn`t make him want to invite me to spend the night in the Lincoln Bedroom.

I guess that`s understandable, considering that I am thrilled that the House Republicans and Democrats slammed U.S. attorney Johnny Sutton yesterday. They are furious at this guy for not appearing at a House subcommittee hearing into his prosecution of two loyal Americans trying to keep us safe from drug smugglers.

So America, here`s the point tonight. The truth is non-partisan. Both parties now smell a rat in this case, and the traps are starting to snap. And here`s how I got there.

U.S. attorney Johnny Sutton`s failure to appear at yesterday`s congressional hearing only made House members angry, and then they called for more hearings. Nice work, Sutton. Yes, seems like your strategy for dealing with Congress is as brilliant as your legal judgment in this case.

Those running the hearing couldn`t help but wonder why Johnny Sutton could appear all over the radio and television shows. He`s been on my show twice. But no, he can`t make time to show up and testify in front of Congress? Congressman Dana Rohrabacher suggested this explanation.


REP. DANA ROHRABACHER (R), CALIFORNIA: Of course, here, he would be held liable for perjury or lying to Congress if he were intentionally to distort the truth. That`s not the situation when he`s talking to the media.

There have been so many questionable statements and bad decisions that this case stinks to high heaven.


BECK: Uh-oh. I don`t think Sutton`s getting a Christmas card.

Tonight, here`s what you need to know. Prosecuting Ramos and Compean was wrong, but persecuting Johnny Sutton for doing it isn`t. Finally, some of the right people are asking the right questions, and Johnny Sutton, or whoever he`s taking orders from, has decided he should pull a no-show.

But you know what? It`s no longer going to fly, because there are good people on both sides of the aisle and more that are starting to gather, who will not stop until this wrong is made right.

And President Bush assured me today in so many words that this investigation is ongoing. I just don`t know if we`re on the same side on this one.

I hope you`re worried, Johnny Sutton, because it is ongoing, and there are a few supermen left in Washington who want to make sure that truth and justice are still the American way.

Congressman Dana Rohrabacher, he is a Republican from California.

Congressman, why do you think Sutton didn`t show up?

ROHRABACHER: Well, first and foremost, Mr. Sutton wants to limit the amount of time that he has spent under oath describing what went on in this case. As I mentioned, when he`s on your show, he can say anything.

And what they told the jury, now we know, was an inaccurate portrayal of the drug dealer. They portrayed him as some innocent victim who was a one-timer trying to raise money for his sick mother`s medicine, for Pete`s sakes.


ROHRABACHER: So he lied to the jury. And then he covered up that fact by keeping information from the jury about -- which would create the correct version, which is the guy was a drug smuggler.

And of course, now he wants to stonewall Congress so he won`t have to go on the record.

BECK: OK, I just want to be very clear. If you`re a new listener or a new viewer of the program, I`m against Johnny Sutton in this. I think he`s wrong.

But let me give him a fair shake and ask you this question. Was this kind of a, hey, would you stop by Congress, and why don`t you, when you`re in town, come by and testify? Or are you -- is -- how odd is it for someone to be asked to testify, as you have asked him, and then them not to show up?

ROHRABACHER: Well, let me just say that it is unfortunate that this type of stonewalling and contempt of Congress seems to be the rule of the day under this administration.

And I am a Republican. I voted for George Bush both times. I`ve been here 20 years, however, and this is the worst administration in dealing cooperatively with Congress.

We, for example, have been trying to investigate this whole issue. We asked to see the passes. These are official federal documents that were issued to the drug dealer that gave him free transit across our borders.

The U.S. attorney`s office, Mr. Sutton, and the -- and the Department of Homeland Security told us, no, you can`t see those documents unless you get a privacy waiver signed by the drug dealer. Now, does that sound like cooperation to you?

BECK: OK, you know what I`m finding heartening is there are a lot of people in Washington on both sides of the aisle. We have a Democrat now who was a former prosecutor from Massachusetts...

ROHRABACHER: That`s right.

BECK: ... who said this is not right. Are you starting to feel the storm clouds gather around the Sutton team and homeland security on this?

ROHRABACHER: Oh, I just -- the tide has turned. We were fighting an uphill battle, and now the Democrats have begin to realize, this isn`t just an illegal immigration issue, which they have some questions about. This is an issue about justice, and it`s also an issue as to whether this administration will cooperate and treat the Congress with respect.

And in both cases, we have an injustice, and now we have the Congress being treated by -- with contempt by the administration.

BECK: Congressman, I have to tell you, what you`re looking into now is the connection between our security and our prosecutors and Mexico. And what is the connection between these two countries?

I have to tell you, I was with -- I was with some people today not connected with the White House that were telling me, "Glenn, there is no connection, there is no connection whatsoever. This is just -- these were just bad guys, and you know, basically, don`t look into the connection between Mexico and the United States."

Give me a compelling -- all I have is my gut. Tell me a reason why you believe this is really -- there is a connection.

ROHRABACHER: Well, first of all, there`s a pattern here with Johnny Sutton himself, but there are about six cases here where we`ve had law enforcement officers prosecuted for stopping drug dealers or human traffickers at the border and where there`s some altercation took place. Now, this is, as I say, it`s a pattern.

Now, why is this happening? It`s happening because there`s been some kind of deal made between this administration and Mexico that we don`t know, and the Border Patrol agents are caught right in the middle.

BECK: Congressman, keep your teeth in this one.


If I had a buck for everybody with a badge that has said to me recently, "You keep on this story about those border agents," I`d be a wealthy man.

I want to remind you once more about the men I consider to be the nation`s first political prisoners, former U.S. border agents Compean, Ramos and Gilmer Hernandez. They`re all serving long sentences in federal prison for the crime of what I believe is just doing their jobs.

It is time these men truly get the justice they deserve. It`s time for them to be released.

Now, if you think that illegal aliens are dying to get into this country, you are absolutely right. There was a story in "USA Today" I saw on the train coming down to Washington today, a huge increase in the number of illegals who are -- who have died while trying to cross the border. It suggests that the flow of immigrants from Mexico is bigger than ever, at least in these routes.

Last weekend, five bodies were found near a remote crossing in Tucson, Arizona, bringing the border deaths to 125 this year. That`s a 22 percent increase over the number found dead by this time last year.

Bill Welsh is the reporter for "USA Today".

Great story, Bill. What -- what is the conclusion that you`re drawing here? Why are there more deaths? Is it because we`re getting tougher, more people coming in, or what does it mean to you?

BILL WELSH, "USA TODAY": Well, I mean, that`s the real question here. There have been a lot of claims that the number of migrants attempting to cross the border is down.

The Border Patrol points to decreased number of arrests as evidence that fewer people are coming in, but the people who watch the borders say they don`t think that`s necessarily the case.

Nobody knows for sure how many people are coming in, but this increased activity, increased vigilance along the border by the Border Patrol and others is having an effect. And what it`s done, at a minimum, is drive people who are determined to cross the border into more and more remote areas, more dangerous crossings, and more of them are dying out there in that brutal Sonoran Desert.

BECK: What -- what is the sense from the border agents that you have received? What`s their morale, or how -- how are they feeling? Did you get any sense at all?

WELSH: Well, I mean, that`s difficult to say. It`s -- everyone you talk to has a little bit different experience. But I think the overwhelming feeling of people that I have talked to along the border who are agents is that they just are out there, they just have to keep doing their job. The flow is relentless.

And for all the talk in Washington or elsewhere around the country, people still keep coming across the border, and their job is to stop them and send them back.

BECK: God bless these guys.

WELSH: And many times they see the same people, as you know, coming across.

BECK: Yes. There is a group called Humane Borders. And these are the people putting up, you know, water stations and everything else. And I understand, I mean, nobody wants people to die out in the middle of the desert, but it`s a horrible thing.

But you know, I think we should have -- I think we should have border guards there at the water stations. Is there -- is there -- are our border guards or immigration services, are they watching these humane stations or not?

WELSH: Well, you know, Glenn, that`s a really good question. It`s one I was curious about, too. And the answer that I get from the people who put this water out is that, yes, the Border Patrol knows where those locations are, but they think that there are too many of them for the Border Patrol to spend their time constantly watching those -- each of those stations. If they did, it would give more opportunity for people to go elsewhere.

Another factor is, these people that come in typically are being led by coyotes. And a coyote goes to the water station and perhaps gets some, brings it back.

BECK: OK, all right. William, thank you very much.

Coming up, more on the conversation that I had today in the Oval Office with President Bush and some good news out of Iraq. Our troops are on the ground, and they say the surge is actually working, and morale is on the rise. You`ll never guess where I read this: the "New York Times"?

Also, Fred Thompson, the most popular man not running for president. Well, at least not officially yet. We`ll take a closer look at where he stands on the issues that matter to you. Don`t miss tonight`s "Real Story".

Plus, he`s a man of a thousand voices and the star of the box office hit, "The Simpsons". Harry Shearer stops by to discuss one of the summer`s biggest movies and his new CD. Stick around.


BECK: Coming up, Fred Thompson sits on top of most of the polls for president, and he hasn`t even announced he`s running yet. Is this a winning strategy, or is he missing a golden opportunity?

But first, earlier today I had the opportunity to sit down in the Oval Office with the president of the United States for an honest, frank, off- the-record conversation about the war in Iraq and other things.

The meeting happened just a few hours ago, so I`m still trying to digest everything and obviously remember everything. I really couldn`t even take a pencil or a piece of paper into the meeting.

Tomorrow on the radio program I hope to be able to tell you exactly what it is like to be an average schmo that grew up in his dad`s bakery sitting eye to eye with a guy who you`ve both strongly supported and strongly challenged, and he`s the leader of the free world. It was a little strange. I hope you can join me on the radio tomorrow.

But tonight, I want to give you some of my initial reactions. Although I agreed to not quote him directly, I can tell you this: President Bush is a man who personally feels the pain of every lost soldier. Join me tomorrow. Let me tell you the whole story on this.

He feels the pain of every wounded hero, every lonely, grieving parent this war has caused. He is a man who understands the heavy cost that we are paying.

But who believes with every ounce of his being that we are in the fight for our very survival, a fight that`s importance can only be judged fairly decades from now, and I believe a fight he is willing to be judged harshly for until that time comes, even if he`s long dead.

I can also tell you that he`s -- frustrated is not exactly the right word -- frustrated -- hopeful, yet frustrated. He`s frustrated that so many people are so myopic that they have lost sight of the forest through the trees. He`s frustrated that so many powerful forces, forces that understand what is truly at stake and who our enemies really are, have lined up against the war on terror because it`s politically expedient.

But above all, I can tell you that the president has incredible passion and resolve. I have not seen this George W. Bush since he had a fire truck behind him and a bull horn in his hand. He was so clear-minded; he was focused. This is not the guy you see on television.

Wolf Blitzer and I were talking about it before I went on the air. He said he has the same experience with him. He is so focused and confident. He`s confident that the military he loves so much, the soldiers that he thinks of as his own family -- I`m not kidding you -- will not only win the hearts and minds of the Iraqi people, but also the American ones, as well.

Now, a name that did come up with the president today in our meeting is the name Michael O`Hanlon. He is the senior fellow at the Brookings Institution. He joins me now.

Michael, I`ve got to tell you, I would imagine -- I don`t know this for sure -- but I would imagine your name or Ken Pollack`s name doesn`t come up in pleasant terms at the White House very often.

I think the article they read that you two wrote in the "New York Times", of all places, I believe the president slept with that night. I couldn`t believe it. You are two very outspoken critics of the president and this war, but you say something is happening in Baghdad. Tell me about it.

MICHAEL O`HANLON, BROOKINGS INSTITUTION: Well, nice to be with you and have the opportunity to talk about this.

You know, we don`t paint a rosy picture, but we do say there is momentum on the battlefield. That is the key point to drive home. There is a sense among our troops and among Iraqi forces working with them that they`re in a real partnership and they`re making progress, especially against certain kinds of extremist groups, al Qaeda in Iraq, other Salafist groups, certain Shia militias. The challenge is still great, as you well know.

BECK: Sure.

O`HANLON: The civil strife has not really been resolved, it`s simply been suppressed by our stronger presence, by a lot of concrete barriers, a lot of checkpoints.

Until the Iraqi politicians start making reconciliation across sectarian lines, there is not going to be real deep progress on that issue. But in terms of short-term battlefield trends and progress against some of these more extremist groups, it is definitely happening. It is more striking than I expected.

BECK: Michael, I have to tell you, first of all, I have to thank you. I know that, you know, you generally drift the liberal sort of way, write for op-ed pieces for the "New York Times", for the love of Pete, and I go the other direction.

But I so respect you two for not having a political agenda, just telling it the way it is, and your only agenda is the truth. And it was really refreshing, and I so appreciate it.

Petraeus -- they really feel that they have a -- and quite possibly for the first time -- a commander that they are -- that really gets it. Did you get that sense? The troops.

O`HANLON: Yes, not only has Petraeus got it, but he`s actually gotten them to get it. In other words, I think the Bush administration, frankly, even though they now are finally on friendlier terms with me this week, I still want to say something somewhat critical...

BECK: Sure.

O`HANLON: ... which is that they -- they did not do a good job in the early part of this war, which is why I was a critic. They -- especially Mr. Rumsfeld but also Mr. Cheney and some others thought that the opposition would be minimal, that once we overthrew Saddam, that the need for a strong U.S. presence and the major plan for restoring stability would not that be important. They got that wrong.

And -- and frankly, some of the generals who were involved in that period of time -- and I will mention General Franks as one of the people -- were willing to go along with this, even if their own military background probably should have told them that it was a mistake.

Of course, General Shinseki tried to oppose this, and he was overruled.

I think that what you`re seeing now is that Petraeus and others who think like him have convinced the administration the only hope here is to actually go with a much stronger force and try to give security to the Iraqi population.

That`s the key in any kind of a counterinsurgency. You think about going on the offense second. You think about providing security for the population first. And Petraeus does that, and he`s convinced this president to support him in the effort.

BECK: Yes, I will tell you, Michael, that I agree with you: tough times are ahead, and this isn`t a rosy picture. But it is some good news, and it`s nice once in a while to hear it.

Thanks, Michael.

O`HANLON: Thank you.

BECK: Coming up, imagine finding yourself, your own self-portrait, on the cover of a porn DVD, and you`re not a porn star. Well, I`ve got one woman`s nightmare story and, even more shocking, the response she got from the pornographer when she complained.

By the way, her picture was when she was 14. Stick around; it`s next.


BECK: Oh, as you know, many young women dream of having their picture appear on the cover of a DVD. No, not so much, especially, they especially don`t have that dream if they`re 14 years old and the DVD is a piece of low-grade porn titled "Body Magic". That dream is a nightmare.

And that is exactly what happened to Laura Jane Cotton when someone stole her self-portrait from a web site and plastered it all over the packaging of an adult movie. She`s suing the movie`s distributors. By the way, that picture was taken when she was 14 years old. broke the story. Joined now by William Bastone. He`s the editor of the site.

Bill, how did they get the picture when she was 14?

WILLIAM BASTONE, EDITOR, THESMOKINGGUN.COM: Well, she actually has a web site. She`s now 18 years old. She`s in college in England, and she has a web site upon which she has a lot of her art photographs, one of which is this self-portrait she took when she was 14 years of age.

And apparently, when they were putting together the packaging art for this film "Body Magic", the reissue of this film, "Body Magic", they just went onto her site and took the image and plastered it on the DVD box, as well as the actual DVD itself. It`s silk-screened on there, as well.

BECK: OK. Now, we have a couple of -- we have a couple of responses when she wrote and said, "Hey, you know, please take my picture off the cover." These are the two letters that she has received back from the company.

"Not only will you not be compenstated (sic)" -- their spelling -- "for your photo, but we have turned this problem over to our attorney. It seems the company my graphic company got the photo from on the Internet is a public domain operation. You knew this when you originally sent us your scheming letter. Nice try, toots. We`re still trying to remove you from the art, not because of your claim, but let`s face it, your picture means very little to the film."

Well, I would hope so, she`s 14 years old.

And then the other one was -- "I`m sure by the end of the month, your face will be history. We`ve stopped selling the DVD until the cover is replaced. We have further checked out your name, and it`s not like a house whole (sic) name. Actually, removing your image will help us improve the sell (sic) of the DVD. So far it bombed."

They actually haven`t taken her picture off the DVD, right?

BASTONE: No. While they changed the box that the DVD came in, if you were to order it, as her lawyer has, within the last couple of weeks, he`s received the DVD, and while the box has a new -- has a new photograph on it, when he took the DVD itself out, her image is still silk-screened on the actual DVD.

BECK: Well, I mean, this is weird, because you would think that you would -- you`d be able to trust the people who made "Sensual Encounters of Every Kind", and "The Rhinestone Cowgirl", which is like "Rhinestone Cowboy" except with a girl, and she has a lot of sex.

BASTONE: Right. Well, if you can`t trust your local pornographer, really, Glenn, who can you trust?

BECK: Yes, I understand. Isn`t there some kind of law about putting 14-year-old pictures -- you know, a picture of a 14-year-old on the cover of a porn?

BASTONE: Well, I mean, I think that the image itself is very demur. It`s not a lewd image, so I don`t think they would have a problem on that. I mean, the question is -- is, obviously, they`re violating her copyright.

And her contention is that if people see this, they`re going to think that she`s starring in the movie, and it casts her in a pretty -- pretty poor light for someone who`s trying to be a legitimate art photographer.

BECK: Yes, all right. William, thanks a lot.

Up next, the "Real Story" on Fred Thompson`s undeclared run for e White House. Back in a second.


BECK: Coming up, the "Real Story" on Fred Thompson and Harry Shearer. This is the guy who`s behind the voice of Mr. Burns, Smithers, Ned Flanders, and a lot of other "Simpsons" characters that you know and love.

But first, it`s time for "Story Count," four stories, 90 seconds. Buckle up, here we go.

Story one: Some time in the next 24 hours, a submarine is going to drop a metal canister containing a Russian flag onto the sea bed at the North Pole. Does that mean they own it? Well, yes, sure, it does, and we own the moon, too. The Russians actually think they do, but the U.S., and Canada, and Denmark all respectfully disagree. Who cares? I mean, it`s the North Pole, Santa and the elves, right? Wrong.

Story two: There may be over $1 trillion worth of oil and gas buried in that sea bed, which would come in pretty handy, considering that we`re about to run out of it. Oil prices hit another record yesterday, topping out at over $78 a barrel. Some experts think that it could be at least $90 a barrel this fall. Of course, those prices assume that Al Qaeda doesn`t continue their summer vacation. What if they don`t?

Well, that brings us to story three and Barack Obama. After being routinely criticized by Hillary Clinton for his lack of foreign policy backbone, Obama played the role of hawk today.


SEN. BARACK OBAMA (D), ILLINOIS: If we have actionable intelligence about high-valued terrorist targets and President Musharraf will not act, we will.


BECK: Yes, OK, so Barack says he`s tough on Al Qaeda, but what do you do about the bigger threat we all face, baby formula? Story four: New York City health officials announced today they want to triple the number of moms who breast feed their babies. That means no more city information about formula, and no more freebies when you leave the hospital. That also means that Mayor Bloomberg now has banned smoking, banned trans-fats, and banned baby formula. I know he keeps changing political parties, but perhaps he should check out the Communist -- I mean, Progressive Party.

OK, switching gears. Now to the "Real Story." Fred Thompson has received a ton of interest ever since rumors started that he was going to run and enter the GOP race, but what does anybody really know about this guy? Tonight, we begin a two-part series: The "Real Story" on Fred Thompson.


BECK (voice-over): Fred Thompson has a lot of fans. In the most recent "USA Today"-Gallup polls, he`s ranked number two among Republican candidates. Giuliani placed first. The thing is, the guy hasn`t even officially announced his candidacy.

FMR. SEN. FRED THOMPSON (R), TENNESSEE: I don`t have any big announcements to make here tonight.

BECK: But he definitely isn`t leaving anything to doubt.

THOMPSON: I`ll just say this, I plan on seeing a whole lot more of you, how about that?

BECK: So who is Fred Thompson? Where does he stand? Everybody says he`s the next Ronald Reagan, but is he?

MIKE ALLEN, POLITICO.COM: As one person said to me, when he was in the Senate, no one called him Ronald Reagan. Now, of course, that`s exactly how he`s being portrayed. And so he is determined to come out with a lot to say, things that connect with the American people, a determination to take on big issues.

BECK: Issues like homeland security and terrorism. As far as the war in Iraq, he stands by President Bush`s decision to duke it out as long as we have to.

THOMPSON: This is going to be not a war of bombs; this is going to be a war of will, a war of will that we have to win.

BECK: But when it comes to immigration, he thinks we need to secure our borders, but he didn`t buy in to President Bush`s plan.

THOMPSON: The bottom line is what`s best for the strength and the long-term endurance of this country. And this immigration bill is not it.

ALLEN: And the challenge for Senator Thompson is to be a Bush ally without being seen as Bush. So he`s going to say that he supported the president on most things that are near and dear to the heart of conservatives, but he`s going to make it clear that he understands that the country is ready for a different direction.

BECK: Most speeches, he talks about his deep, personal belief in federalism.

THOMPSON: The rule of law. Market economies. The rights of private property. Free and fair trade.

BECK: But his ideals about federalism have made his stance on abortion a little confusing to some.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Fred Thompson is not pro-life.

BECK: Thompson says he`s pro-life, but in this 1994 debate we found on YouTube, listen to how Thompson replies to a question about whether or not the government should make laws banning abortion.

THOMPSON: I do not believe that the federal government ought to be involved in that process.

BECK: The other controversy came after his term as senator.

ALLEN: While Senator Thompson was out of office, he made a fair amount of money over several years as a lobbyist. Now people are going to start to go through those client lists and try to figure out, like what exactly he did, what issues were involved, and how that image as a lobbyist might detract from the image of Senator Thompson as a regular guy.

BECK: And regular guy is the exact image he`s trying to portray. Many pundits say it`s his biggest strength as a candidate.

ANNOUNCER: ... the bold change Washington needs.

BECK: Even back in 1994 as he was running for the Senate, he donned that plaid shirt and stood next to a red pickup.

THOMPSON: We need somebody on the inside of that place fighting for us.

BECK: Back then and today, Fred Thompson wants America to believe he`s not a Washington insider. I, for one, hope he`s not, but whether or not he is remains to be seen.


BECK: Joining me now is Republican strategist Amy Holmes and Dave Glover, a radio talk show host in St. Louis, KFDK. By the way, David, congratulations on your number-one rating yet again in St. Louis.

DAVE GLOVER, RADIO HOST: Thank you, buddy.

BECK: Let me start with you, Dave, actually. When you think of Fred Thompson, do you think, "Good god, announce already"?

GLOVER: I do. It`s just about time. I think that he has stretched out the drama about as long as he can. Now it`s beginning to become annoying to a lot of people. But we`re going to forget that six months from now. But Labor Day, give or take a week or so.

BECK: Yes. Amy, I actually think that this is working to his detriment, because I don`t know if he -- and you probably do -- I don`t know if he said he was going to announce around July 4th or if that was just a rumor, but it almost seems like now there`s this impression that, "Well, there must be something wrong, what`s going on?"

AMY HOLMES, REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST: Well, that July 4th number was a rumor that got wide circulation, so there was a lot of expectation that you`d hear from him from them. But, you know, I don`t think this is hurting him at all. Look, this is Washington, August, the dog days of the summer. Families are on vacation. They`re at the beach. They`re camping. They`re not paying attention to whether or not Fred Thompson is going to be announcing for president. If anything, they`re probably watching him in "Law & Order" reruns.

So I think when he gets back, September, back to school, big announcement, then he can get all the hoopla, all the positive press. To do it right now would just be putting it in an media black hole, and it doesn`t really make sense.

BECK: Dave, Amy brings up a good point that, you know, now people are not watching TV, they`re not thinking about the news. What are real people doing? Do you think anybody really is paying attention to this political cycle now?

GLOVER: No, no. And that`s why I ultimately think that Fred Thompson very well may be our next president, because I think he appeals to those very people, the people who read "People" magazine as opposed to "The Economist" and who are watching "Age of Love" instead of "Frontline." I think he appeals to middle America.

HOLMES: Oh, come on now. I think that`s a bit of an elitist statement. We also know that Fred Thompson appeals to conservatives, he appeals to the base, and that`s why his numbers are so high.

GLOVER: Those aren`t the people who elect the president, though, with all due respect.

HOLMES: Well, they`re certainly the people who elect the Republican nominee right now.

GLOVER: That`s going to be a much bigger challenge for him. If he can get the nomination, I think he`ll do very well in the general election.

BECK: Wait, wait, hang on just a second, Dave. Who do you think is going to get the nomination? I mean, you have Rudy Giuliani, who, I`ve got to tell you, I think the next president should be, and would be for conservatives, the guy that will come out and say, "You know what I`m going to do? I`m going to try a new strategy over in Iraq. I`m going to try something we haven`t done yet and that`s kick their ass!" I think that`s what America`s looking for.

GLOVER: And I think that`s who Fred Thompson is. I think that`s what he`s going to say. I think, though, at this point, even though Giuliani`s running ahead in the polls, and if you look at the ones that matter, where the primaries are going to be, that Romney looks about as good as anybody.

BECK: Amy, too early to tell who you think is going to come out on top in the Republican nomination?

HOLMES: Oh, far too early. I mean, we saw a poll that said that none of the above was polling better than the frontrunners.

BECK: What`s your gut tell you, though? For instance, Fred Thompson, can he stand the scrutiny -- you know, Rudy Giuliani, I like him on some things, I hate him on other things, but the one thing that really spooks me is: That guy has more skeletons in the closet than most serial killers. I mean, there are just skeletons...

HOLMES: Oh, my goodness!

BECK: No, there are. There are skeletons all over.

HOLMES: Well, we elected Bill Clinton. We elected Bill Clinton, and he had a lot of female skeletons in his closet.

BECK: Right.

HOLMES: With the Republican nominee, Glenn, in all honesty, I don`t have a gut feeling on this one. I like Giuliani, but as we know he has problems with being pro-choice and pro-gay rights. He`s running ahead so far among Republican voters, but that`s before Fred Thompson has joined the race.

And you have to remember, Fred Thompson, he has been in this game a long, long time. He was Howard Baker`s right-hand man during the Watergate hearings. He is no stranger to the ups and downs of politics. I mean, even being an actor, let`s face it, it`s giving him skills to be able to stand on the national stage and be able to withstand a roller coaster career, so...

BECK: Amy, I will tell you this. And, Dave, I want you to chime in on this, because I saw this as a good thing, actually, and I think you`ll probably relate. I had somebody who`s high-placed here in Washington, who I won`t rat out on this, who said Fred Thompson, God bless him, I love him, but lazy. He said he was just known in the Senate as being one lazy guy. Dave, in a way, I saw that as an advantage. Wait a minute, a politician -- more politicians won`t get things done?


HOLMES: Good conservatives might actually applaud that.

GLOVER: Yes, he`s going to need to surround himself with some good people. It sounds like his wife`s not lazy, so that`s a plus. But I still say that, once he gets in this thing, he is the only one of him in the race. The rest are very Type A, to the point of being shrill, and I think he`s really going to stand out. And all these Republicans who are talking about none of the above, wait until someone, Fred Thompson or one of the others, is running against Clinton or Obama. They`re going to turn out in droves in `08.

BECK: OK, Amy, David, thank you so much. That`s "The Real Story" tonight.

Coming up, "The Simpsons," one of the biggest movies of the summer, I`ll talk to one of the biggest stars. I`m not interviewing a cartoon, although that would be kind of cool. We`ll sit down with Harry Shearer. Don`t miss it, next.


MARGE SIMPSON, "THE SIMPSONS": We need diapers. No, we don`t, no. Ladies razor blades.


M. SIMPSON: No, no, we don`t. I forgot, we`re European.




BECK: What is the number-one reason people buy a Prius? What`s going to get you into this ugly car? The trees, I just love the trees so much. No. The number-one answer, "It says something about me." Well, how fabulous. It says something about you. To me, it says that you`re a blind moron. It says something about me, number one. I like its unique design qualities. Number three, it will save me money. And, number four, I care about the trees.

So in other words, the average person buying a Prius doesn`t really care about the trees. I mean, they care a little bit. Well, I`ve got news for you: I care a little bit.


BECK: Unbelievable what narcissists we have become. Now, if I could only get one -- if I could make this about me and I could only get one guest that`s a bass-playing comedic actor who has his own radio show, also does funny voices for an award-winning animated series, it would have to be Harry Shearer. And what a coincidence, here he is.

How are you, sir?

HARRY SHEARER, ACTOR: You`re looking good, Glenn.

BECK: Now, see, let`s make it about me.

SHEARER: Let`s make it about you.

BECK: Last time you were here, you had "For Your Consideration" out. Hadn`t seen it yet, saw it, tragically sad.

SHEARER: Oh, yes.

BECK: My gosh, I didn`t expect that at all.

SHEARER: Yes, I said, as we were making it, this is going to be the saddest of this bunch of movies.

BECK: Oh, my gosh. And you know what? It showed the actors. You know, I`m a Christopher Guest fan, and that whole ensemble, it really showed everyone`s talent because it was not just funny and dry. It was tragically sad.

SHEARER: When Catherine O`Hara gets drunk the morning that she doesn`t win -- not to give anything away -- and comes out to take out the trash from the night before, and she gets ambushed by Fred Willard as an "ET" reporter, it`s just -- you think, I think the audience has to feel, "Thank god I`m not in show business."

BECK: OK, we have so much to talk to and such little time. "Simpsons," saw it this weekend, funny.

SHEARER: Thank you. Number one, baby, number one!

BECK: Yes, were you up at night worried about that? Was anybody?

SHEARER: I was up in the daytime worrying about it.

BECK: Were you?

SHEARER: Yes. Nights were good.

BECK: Yes, I bet you have very little sleep, all of you guys.

SHEARER: Yes. Well, I`ve had very little sleep recently because it went straight from Live Earth, Spinal Tap at Live Earth.

BECK: I didn`t know you did that.

SHEARER: Oh, yes.

BECK: Was it here in New Jersey?

SHEARER: No, London, at Wembley Stadium.

BECK: OK, because, you know, I was called a fascist corporate toadie by RFK here in New York.

SHEARER: Really? Well, nobody talked about you in London.

BECK: Good, thank you, thank you.


BECK: Did you take a big jet over there?

SHEARER: Yes, big, expensive jet, yes.

BECK: Good, good.

SHEARER: But we walked back, so...

BECK: Good. So you did that, you have "The Simpsons," you just started a Web site.

SHEARER: I`m part of a Web site that just started up called, which is a place where creative people are told, "Hey, nobody`s around to tell you what you can or cannot do. Here`s the money. Go do it. We`ll put it up on the Internet."

BECK: And I`ve got to tell you, this is the kind of stuff that`s the future. I was just in Detroit, and I was talking to a radio guy who said they`re trying to now legislate that if you`re an independent record person that you should have a right to have your music exposed on radio. And I thought, "That`s such a lack of understanding of how radio works anymore. It`s so tested." I mean, ring tones are tested to see if that song should be played. The Internet, finding people who are just, you know, expressing themselves creatively, the real future is to find them on the Internet.

SHEARER: Yes, it is, because the idea for this site is, it`s not repurposed network programming. It`s not cats in the bathtub, you know, amateur videos.


SHEARER: It`s professionals, people who have careers, but who are lured by the promise of no network suits, nobody saying, "Here are the rules," free to sort of create for the audience, and get feedback from the audience.

BECK: How do you make money on this?

SHEARER: Advertising.

BECK: Oh, that`s fabulous.


BECK: And you have a lot of stuff of yours up there?

SHEARER: Yes, I`m sort of the lead guy. I have a piece that started this week. The premise is Dick Cheney, not free with his emotions a lot in public...


SHEARER: ... has a little secure, disclosed nightclub where he comes down and sings with a jazz trio to vent his feelings.

BECK: Oh, that`s fabulous.

SHEARER: And it`s a little jazzy ballad about how...

BECK: Dick Cheney singing...

SHEARER: Dick Cheney singing with a jazz trio about how glad he is that Scooter didn`t do jail time.

BECK: That`s good.

SHEARER: "No Cooler for the Scooter." And he actually gets up and lies on the piano at one point, Baker Boy style (ph). You`ve never seen that before.

BECK: No, I haven`t. Is he wearing anything low-cut and lacy? No, nothing at all?

SHEARER: No, nothing Hillary-style, no cleavage.

BECK: And you have a new album out or a new CD.

SHEARER: What the hell is this? Where did that come from?

BECK: This wasn`t planned at all. That wasn`t on the list. It was number five question.

SHEARER: This is so live.

BECK: It`s crazy. Anything can happen.

SHEARER: Yes, it`s my CD, first musical CD I`ve done called "Songs Pointed and Pointless." Some of them are satirical. Some of them are just goofy.

BECK: Can we play -- do we have a little clip? Do we have time to play a clip of one? I know this television, we usually do this on radio. Except you have to look at us two dopes...

SHEARER: I didn`t hear that.

BECK: It was fabulous.

SHEARER: That was George W. Bush singing "Addicted to Oil," the premise being, you know, people are tuning out his speeches. Maybe he needs to start singing them.

BECK: May I ask you?


BECK: Because I was against Scooter Libby, and I want to get us off of oil, but I can`t take messages anymore. If you`re somebody who also happens to not like, you know, live in Hollywood, can you listen to this CD without your head exploding?

SHEARER: Yes. A friend of mine said to me today, "My dad and mom are real like conservative Republicans, and they saw the Dick Cheney video, and they said they really laughed at it and liked it.

BECK: Good, good.

SHEARER: So I`m not campaigning.

BECK: You are truly one of the funniest people or one of the most talented people in Hollywood.

SHEARER: Well, thank you. Thank you.

BECK: Just love your work.

SHEARER: And you`re looking great.

BECK: No, seriously, tell me some more.

SHEARER: OK, the tie...

BECK: We`ll be back in just a minute.

SHEARER: That is a tie, isn`t it?

BECK: No, this is actually just some of my chin that has been pulled out and knotted and then we paint it.

SHEARER: That`s a lovely tie.

BECK: Yes, thank you.


BECK: Sheryl Crow made headlines a few months ago by suggesting we could help prevent global warming by using just a single sheet of toilet paper. Thankfully, as I reported, and not a lot of people did, she was joking. But now a remarkable new invention is about to hit the market and promises to help save this planet, five sheets at a time.

Joining me now is the director of North American washroom business, Kimberly-Clark, Richard Thorne.

Hello, Richard, how are you?

RICHARD THORNE, KIMBERLY-CLARK: Good evening, Glenn, I`m very well, thank you.

BECK: Good. Now, this is kind of like the iPod thing. You know, when you`re the only people that had an iPod, I`m the first guy to have this, right?

THORNE: Absolutely right. We think this is a great, cool, new invention that`s going to really help health and hygiene everywhere in the public stalls out there.

BECK: And what exactly is it?

THORNE: It`s an electronic jumbo roll toilet tissue from Kimberly- Clark. It dispenses our Scott bathroom tissue in, as you pointed out before, 20 inches at a time, in pre-measured sheets.

BECK: Watch this. Watch this, America. You just put your hand down here, and it`s just that easy. Hang on, you just -- there it is. There it is. Five sheets of -- now, this is going to make a difference right here.

THORNE: This is going to make a big difference right there.

BECK: This wouldn`t make a difference for my 2-year-old son. I would be wiping his pooty with five sheets. I mean, how did you come up with it should dispense five sheets?

THORNE: Well, we came up with it. We do a huge amount of research. Toilet tissue is our business. We`ve been in it for over 100 years now.

BECK: I haven`t heard that phrase from very many people, but, OK, so, quickly, we`ve only got a minute, how did you come up with the five sheets?

THORNE: We came up with -- a huge amount of research, both internally at Kimberly-Clark, but also we have smart dispensers which measure the amount of toilet tissue people take and use when they use the product in use. And basically...

BECK: So this is an average. So some people use less than five sheets?

THORNE: Some people use less; some people use more. So the dispenser has got three settings on it, a short one for 16 inches, a medium one for 20, and a long one for 24, but you can go back to it as many times as you want.

BECK: There you go.

THORNE: It isn`t only 20 sheets and then you have to put a dime in to get some more tissue. You can go back many, many times.

BECK: OK, OK. Well, you know what, I have to tell you, I do love your products, you know, and the roll of toilet paper, but if people are using less than five sheets, I`m never shaking anyone`s hand ever again.

THORNE: Absolutely right.

BECK: Richard, thank you very much.

THORNE: Thanks very much, Glenn.

BECK: Bye-bye.

THORNE: Bye-bye.

BECK: And it`s all mine. Don`t forget, if you want to know what`s on tomorrow`s show or if you`d like a little more in-depth commentary on toilet paper, hey, you sign up for my free daily e-mail newsletter at From New York, good night, America.