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Glenn Beck
American al Qaeda Member Releases Another Video; Is Wiretapping Bill a Protection or an Invasion of Privacy?; Self-Proclaimed Pedophile Slapped with Restraining Order; Aviation Expert Weighs in on Travel Delays
Aired August 06, 2007 - 19:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JOE PAGLIARULO, HOST (voice-over): Tonight, yet another al Qaeda video release. This time with an American in front of the camera. Could these newest terrorist threats be for real?
Plus, the latest on self-proclaimed pedophile Jack McClellan. A shocking restraining order bars him from getting near every child in California. How the surprising ruling could have historic implications.
And where in the world is Lindsay Lohan? Reports say she`s just checked into a swank five-star rehab resort. Could the third time in rehab be the charm?
All this and more, tonight.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
PAGLIARULO: Hello, America. I`m Joe Pagliarulo, Joe Pags, filling in for Glenn Beck. Tonight, a message from al Qaeda, a message from al Qaeda.
A new video from the terror organization released yesterday warns that U.S. embassies around the world are targets for terrorist attacks. The man behind the tape, Adam Gadahn, a California-raised American who turned to radical Islam in the 1990s. Now he`s known as Azzam al-Amriki. He`s an al Qaeda member. Wanted by the FBI for treason.
In the video, Azzam the American, as they call him, refers to American embassies as, quote, "spy dens", saying these, quote, "spy dens and military control centers" -- that`s what they are -- "from which you plotted your aggression against Afghanistan and Iraq shall continue to be legitimate targets for brave Muslims unless you heed our demands," he says. "Stop the crusade and leave the Muslims alone."
Well, this is not the first threat of its kind. Just two months ago, al-Amriki issued a different video demanding George Bush withdraw all of his troops from Muslim land or face attacks worse than 9/11.
Some experts claim these messages are nothing new and pose no imminent threat. It`s just more of the same al Qaeda chatter. But at what point does chatter become action?
Michael Scheuer is the former head of our CIA`s Osama bin Laden unit.
Mike, is there something to be concerned about here? Let me tell you something. Every time I see a video like this from little Adam Gadahn from California, I feel like laughing, because it seems to me that this is a show of their impotence. If we could do something, we would. We wouldn`t be sitting in a camera. Am I off base on this?
MICHAEL SCHEUER, FORMER CIA AGENT: I think you may be a little bit. One of the problems for Americans is we assume that if we haven`t been attacked when we expect it, that they can`t attack us. And for those -- I think that`s wrong.
And for those who kind of ridicule Gadahn, you have to keep in mind that he is the only one who speaks on the topics that Osama bin Laden and al Qaeda and Zawahiri speak on. He`s in a very privileged position here. And I think it`s a kind of a mistake to think that he`s not a serious player when he warns us.
PAGLIARULO: No, I think he`s a serious player, Michael. I don`t want you to get me wrong. He`s a very serious player, but he`s a serious player because he knows the lingo. He knows to talk to Americans. They actually believe, through his words, that they then can get to us and our consciousness, right?
SCHEUER: Well, that`s certainly part of it. But it`s already directed toward the Muslim world. The prophet Mohammed said before that you attack anyone you had to -- you had to warn them repeatedly. And Azzam plays the role of not only warning us to fulfill that requirement, but warning us in our own language.
This message and others are designed as much for the Muslim world, to convince them that al Qaeda has gone the extra mile to warn us, as it is for the Americans.
PAGLIARULO: Is this a service of their lunacy, Michael? The fact that they -- that they keep on saying that we did something first, we`re on a crusade, we`re in Muslim land? I mean, did we forget 9/11? Did we forget about the Cole? Did we forget about Kenya? Did we forget about the bombing in Bali? Why is it that they`re pretending as though we started this?
SCHEUER: Well, that`s -- that`s kind of the initiative of all people, I think, to say the other folks started it.
But I think what`s important is what they`re saying. They`re not saying anything about our culture, the way we work, our freedoms, women in the workplace. What they`re saying is that your support for Israel, your support for the Arab tyrannies, your presence in Iraq, that`s what`s driving this war.
And whether you agree with that or not, I think Gadahn speaks very clearly about what their motivation is and how, at the same time, all American politicians have lied to Americans about what the motivation of the enemy is.
PAGLIARULO: And I understand that. But at the same time he purports that -- you just said it yourself -- that he`s speaking for Osama bin Laden, Ayman al-Zawahiri. And if he, in fact, is, bin Laden said it was because of construction contracts with his dad, because we were on consecrated land in Saudi Arabia.
SCHEUER: Yes.
PAGLIARULO: Because of our support for Israel, because of our help of the Mujahideen and then we forgot about the Mujahideen. What exactly is it? Can you, as the expert -- I`m just a dumb radio guy -- can you as the expert pinpoint to me and to those watching what exactly it is that they want? Because I`m hearing mixed messages from this new guy now.
SCHEUER: Well, I don`t know if it`s a mixed message so much, sir. I think they`ve been very consistent over time. They want us off of the Arab Peninsula. They want out of other Muslim countries.
PAGLIARULO: Not going to happen. Not going to happen. Go ahead.
SCHEUER: And they want the end of support for Israel.
PAGLIARULO: Not going to happen. Right. Go ahead.
So the endgame is what, a world war in their mind? The endgame for me is, hey, let`s all have freedom and democracy and liberty, and we`re all going to be happy eventually. They (ph) have to understand that our way of life is OK, too.
SCHEUER: Unfortunately, we will lose. Their -- their definition of victory is not what ours is. They`re not trying to impose some other kind of form of government. What they`re trying to do is to bleed us to bankruptcy. And over time that`s what will happen.
Indeed, even today, from working in the government, after Azzam appeared yesterday, you can bet that there are Americans spending millions of taxpayer dollars today to beef up security at embassies around the world.
PAGLIARULO: So you think that was just sort of an end run around to get us to spend more money, take it away from maybe the fight in Afghanistan and Iraq and use those resources elsewhere?
SCHEUER: I think that`s part of it, certainly. You know, like most things, most things are designed to do more than one thing at a time. And that speech was clearly designed to do that, sir.
PAGLIARULO: All right. Mike, listen, we appreciate your knowledge. I don`t know that we agree on everything, but it sounds like you`re smarter than I am, so I won`t push it.
SCHEUER: Not the case at all, sir.
PAGLIARULO: All right. Thanks a lot for that.
The same day al Qaeda released its most recent threat video, President Bush signed a new and controversial eavesdropping law that he says will help combat terrorists like this dork from California. Not Mike, the Adam Gadahn guy.
It gives the U.S. government expanded authority to eavesdrop on Americans` international phone calls and e-mail messages without a warrant. So will this law actually help us combat terrorists like Azzam, or is it just a total invasion of privacy?
Joining me now to hash it all out, Clark Kent Ervin, director of the Homeland Security Department of the Aspen Institute.
Clark, it`s got to be a nice institute, if it`s got Aspen in front of it. Come on.
CLARK KENT ERVIN, DIRECTOR, HOMELAND SECURITY DEPARTMENT, ASPEN INSTITUTE: It is indeed. Absolutely.
PAGLIARULO: You`re living the high life there.
ERVIN: That`s right.
PAGLIARULO: OK. So we see this guy, Azzam the American, Adam Gadahn, whatever he wants to call himself. We hear about terror plots that were planned between -- on international phone calls from America to overseas.
I`ve got to ask you something. And again, very simplistic thinking here on my part, and I apologize if I`m way out of my league here. When I make an international phone call, what wires am I using?
ERVIN: Well, you`re using American wires.
PAGLIARULO: OK.
ERVIN: And they travel internationally. So, you know, you can make the argument that it`s both domestic and international.
PAGLIARULO: So I mean -- so it`s wireless -- is it not inherently wireless when I go international? There is not a wire from here to London, is there? Maybe I missed it.
ERVIN: No, there`s no physical wire. No, absolutely not.
PAGLIARULO: So if we`re talking wiretapping, actually, if the government were smart, they probably could get around this whole "I need a court order and I need a wire -- and the FISA court and all this garbage," because there really isn`t a wire involved, right?
ERVIN: Well, I think that`s right. But you know, the larger issue here, though, is it possible to reconcile security and liberty? And I think the answer is yes.
Certainly, I`m very sympathetic to what the administration is trying to do.
PAGLIARULO: Right.
ERVIN: If there is a communication, a telephone call or an e-mail exchange between a foreigner abroad who may -- or is a terrorist and somebody in the United States, I want to listen to that call. I want to read that e-mail message.
The question is whether that should be done with a warrant so that there`s independent judicial review. And I think there should be. I frankly don`t trust the government. I think that`s what checks and balances are all about.
PAGLIARULO: And I`m not here to say we should trust the government. I don`t want people listening to my phone calls either.
But at the same time, if you suspect that Joe Pags is talking to somebody overseas about al Qaeda operations in America or beyond, what do you do? You go to the court, you wake up the judge, you see if you can get a court order tomorrow, you wait two weeks and then you miss the ball. What exactly did the president signed that changes that if he did?
ERVIN: What the president has signed is now only on the word of the attorney general and the director of national intelligence, if they say the person abroad is a terrorist or may be a terrorist, that`s sufficient for this communication to be eavesdropped upon.
PAGLIARULO: OK.
ERVIN: What I`m saying is that there should be independent judicial review. You know, under the FISA procedures, the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act, independent judges, even three days after, they have up - - the government has up to three days under that old procedure to get the courts to sign off on this. And maybe three days is not -- is not quick enough.
PAGLIARULO: Right.
ERVIN: Or not enough time rather.
PAGLIARULO: Sure.
ERVIN: Maybe it should be longer. But the point is, you know, I think there should be independent review here.
PAGLIARULO: Well, I agree with you there, but when it comes to the FISA court and the fact that Jimmy Carter put it into play, didn`t he have an executive order that said, you know what? If the president of the United States wants and those who work directly for him want to bypass this, they can. I thought there was an executive order that said the attorney general, the president, they didn`t have to follow this rule as closely as everybody else.
ERVIN: Well, there`s an executive order that the president signed for a while that did bypass the FISA procedures, and that`s what the law has now changed. Now the law permits no court review. The attorney general alone and the director of national intelligence can authorize this.
You know, I would like to be able to trust our government, but I think the experience shows that we can`t. That`s the whole genius of America, checks and balances.
PAGLIARULO: Right. But I want to interject this, because checks and balances after the fact, that doesn`t make me feel good. Isn`t this just a feel-good measure? I can go and I can invade your privacy, check your wire. I can check your line, can see your conversation, your e-mail, whatever.
And I don`t know, a week later I`ll check with a judge to make sure he was OK with what I already did last week. And it`s just making us feel good after the fact. If in fact, you don`t trust our government, you should be patently against this, right?
ERVIN: Well, no, there`s really no perfect solution, Joe. I mean, that`s the problem. We have to balance these things.
There are times when there is an emergency and the government does have to engage in this wiretapping, they do have to listen into the call and they do have to read the e-mail and they don`t have the time to go to a judge.
All I`m saying is that there should be a procedure to permit a judge as quickly as possible to review it. And if a judge subsequently reviews it three days later, seven days later, a month later or so and finds that there was no basis for finding that the other person was a terrorist, then that information should be thrown out. That`s really the best we can do to reconcile security and liberty.
PAGLIARULO: It`s the best we can do, but I don`t know that it reconciles -- reconciles it all. Either it`s an invasion of privacy or it`s not. Either we have security or we don`t. But Clark, you made it much clearer to my simple brain. Thank you very much.
ERVIN: Thank you, Joe.
PAGLIARULO: Coming up right here, California gets something right. A Los Angeles court has slapped a retraining order on self-proclaimed pedophile Jack McClellan. I`ll talk to the man who served this scumbag.
Then GOP presidential candidate Mitt Romney, from his YouTube off the record remarks to his fiery anti-Obama rhetoric during yesterday`s debate, why he`s shaping up to be the candidate to beat.
And all is not going so well for poor Lindsay Lohan. Rumors that she`s fled to rehab, that she`s holed up at her mom`s house, that she`s anywhere besides in front of the camera. But could dropping out save her career?
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PAGLIARULO: Coming up, Mitt Romney is on a roll. His off the record remarks about his faith and his pro-life stance are taking YouTube by storm, and he`s escalating his Obama bashing. And well, he sure is handsome. You see that hair? This guy really -- I don`t know how he did. Does all that add up to winning the GOP or not? I`ll find out, coming up.
But first, a self-described pedophile is no longer allowed near kids in California, thanks to a temporary restraining order.
Jack McClellan was served with the appropriate legal documents as he was boarding a plane to Chicago, where unfortunately, he can still get as close to kids as he wants.
McClellan had been posting pictures of children in public places on the Internet, pictures he had taken. He`s admitted to staking out little girls, or L.G.`s as he calls them, in parks, libraries and fast food restaurants. The restraining order is a legal landmark, because even though McClellan calls himself a pedophile, there`s no evidence that he ever molested any kids.
Pam Bondi is a Florida state prosecutor. Anthony Zinnanti is the attorney who served McClellan with the order.
Anthony, how did this piece of -- I mean, this guy, McClellan, respond when you hit him with the piece of paper?
ANTHONY ZINNANTI, ATTORNEY: He was very smug and came out of the plane, and he -- actually, he didn`t come out of the plane right away at first, because he saw the two uniforms with us. So he figured, this is finally catching up with him.
Well, he ducked out, he ruffled through the papers, and he goes, "Oh, this must have to do with the injunction." He was real smug. And then he turned around and disappeared back into the plane.
PAGLIARULO: Yes, but is it catching up to him? I saw this guy on network news and all over the place lately. He`s getting so much fame out of this. I`m starting to think he`s only doing it to get the attention of people so that we`ll stare at him like he wants to stare at the little girls.
ZINNANTI: You know, this guy is a narcissist.
PAGLIARULO: Right.
ZINNANTI: He`s a narcissist and he`s a liar. And the noose is tightening. The noose is tightening.
PAGLIARULO: Sure.
ZINNANTI: There`s new information with respect to a witness that came forth yesterday, and there may be some trouble for Mr. McClellan.
PAGLIARULO: Hey, Pam, I want to bring you in here. Here`s my question. I`m not a lawyer, don`t play one on television. I`m not the smartest guy going. You`ve already deduced that.
PAM BONDI, ATTORNEY: You`re close.
PAGLIARULO: The bottom line for me, though, isn`t this guy, hasn`t he already committed a crime? And here`s what I mean. Isn`t he aiding and abetting -- if he puts up a web site that says, "Here`s the bank. The vault combination is this. Here`s what`s going on at that location. Go there and all the money is yours." Even if he doesn`t go rob the bank himself, didn`t he just aid and abet?
BONDI: Well, Glenn (sic), that`s a good analogy.
However, they would have to rob the bank for that to happen. So they would have to have a complete -- a completed crime in order for him to be guilty.
So hopefully, it won`t get to that. Hopefully, no child will be molested as a result of his sick, sick web site. And we won`t get that far.
The problem with our laws haven`t really caught up with technology.
PAGLIARULO: Sure. Well, that`s true, and we`ll get into that in a second.
I mean, the bottom line is this thing is going to be thrown out. This court order doesn`t mean anything. It`s not as good as the piece of paper it`s written on. He hasn`t done anything. You can`t say you`ve got to stay 30 feet away from people that you haven`t done anything to. I mean, this thing`s going to be thrown out.
What is the next step, if not -- if you can`t prove that he`s aiding and abetting. If I walk -- let me ask you this. And Anthony, maybe you can help me out with this. If I walk into a police station and said, "Hi, I just killed four people," would you do something with me or say, "I don`t have any proof of that. Why don`t you leave?"
This guy says he`s a pedophile, which to me the definition is he has attacked children, he`s gone after children. I would want him interrogated until he fesses up to what he`s done.
ZINNANTI: No, the -- the fact of the matter is if you walked into a police station and said, "I just killed four people," that`s an admission that can be used against you.
PAGLIARULO: He`s admitting that he`s a pedophile. Is that not a legal charge, being a pedophile, in a certain degree?
ZINNANTI: No, no, no. Having an orientation does not mean that you`re a criminal.
However, this court order, it`s not going to be thrown out. This court order is based upon a lot more than his orientation as a pedophile. This guy has blogged about smuggling drugs on an international flight, and more disturbingly, he blogged about contemplating luring a child into his car and...
PAGLIARULO: Yes, but you can`t -- hold on, Anthony. And Pam, I`ll bring you in here as a prosecutor. Can you prosecute a case where I said I contemplated something?
BONDI: No.
PAGLIARULO: Of course not.
BONDI: No, no, no, Joe. And I mean, you`re making great points. But the problem is you`d have to complete the crime in order for him to be guilty of an accessory or aiding and abetting. And we all hope we`re not going to get to that point.
PAGLIARULO: How about conspiracy to commit? I mean, if I give you the blueprint and show you how to get in there and do what you have to do - - and by the way, we`re calling this an orientation, really?
BONDI: Well, you know, they have -- it`s sick, totally sick what he`s doing. And I think the lawmakers in California are already working on changing the laws.
You know, when you make these laws, you never -- would you ever in your wildest dreams think that there would be some sick person out there doing this?
PAGLIARULO: No.
BONDI: So our laws are constantly changing to keep up with pedophiles, with voyeurs...
PAGLIARULO: Right.
BONDI: ... with all these criminals in our society, Joe. So hopefully the laws will catch up, and hopefully there`s some great activists like these two great lawyers in California who have gone after this guy.
PAGLIARULO: Hey, Anthony, was there a certain amount of satisfaction handing this guy that court order? Or did you know that it was something that might not stick? Actually, you said that it will stick.
ZINNANTI: No, this is -- we have a very strong case against this guy.
This is a civil harassment order. This isn`t a criminal action. So there`s a lot of information that`s sort of in the void right now. I wish I had time to talk about it. If you want to talk about it, great.
But there was a tremendous satisfaction in finding him, because he evaded him once, and we trapped him in the airplane. I mean, we got through airport security and got down the jetway, and he was trapped. So yes.
PAGLIARULO: Well, I`ve got to tell you this, Anthony, and this is nothing against you. I hope that this doesn`t succeed. Because as Pam was saying, we need to catch up with technology. We need to get a bad guy like this that might be scoping out my three daughters that are sitting around at home or going to a park or playing on a playground.
And this thing is not strong enough. It`s a civil action because the neighborhood didn`t want him near that area. And the judge said, "Hey, let`s make it all of California." Thirty feet, it`s never going to stick. This guy has every right to go anywhere he wants in America, whether we like it or not.
Either we stick him with something that shows that he`s a pedophile or he walks.
I`ll give you guys the last word. Pam.
BONDI: Well, we all hope it sticks, because at least it`s something. It`s something out there.
They`re working on changing the laws. And Joe, what you`re doing by putting this guy`s face all over television is you`re warning parents. And parents need to keep their children away from this man.
PAGLIARULO: OK.
BONDI: Anybody who watches the show, this is a sick, sick person.
PAGLIARULO: All right. Anthony, I gave you some time earlier.
Pam, thank you very much.
BONDI: Thank you.
ZINNANTI: Thank you.
PAGLIARULO: A very interesting case we`re going to keep our eyes on.
Coming up, in case you needed information that two-hour flight delays, cancellations and lost baggage all equal travel headaches of epic proportion, now there`s a report to back all that up. Fantastic.
And Barack Obama, isn`t he that candidate that wanted to personally hold hands and sing "Kumbaya" with every global enemy of the United States? So why the heck is he now saying that military action in Pakistan isn`t such a bad idea? I`ll find out.
Back in a bit.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PAGLIARULO: Planning a relaxing vacation this summer? Well, here`s a tip if you want to maintain your sanity: avoid the airport.
The Air Travel Consumer Report was released today and guess what? Flying officially sucks. The report whose latest data is from June of this year says nearly one third of all commercial flights are delayed. You can blame it on weather, security, customer service or overbooked flights. It all means just one thing, though: skies are not all that friendly anymore.
Terry Trippler is an aviation expert.
And Terry, just like that study we got out of the University of Texas at Austin last week that said hey, there were 237 reasons why we like to have sex, did we have to have a survey that told us that airline travel sucks today?
TERRY TRIPPLER, AVIATION EXPERT: Yes, I don`t think we did, Joe.
You know, it is going in the wrong direction. I think we -- anybody would agree not -- June was not good. I don`t think July is going to be much better. We`ve got some serious problems out there. Got to take care of them.
PAGLIARULO: Is there any recourse, though, for the regular traveler who wants to get there from here? You`re not going to want to drive 24 hours, if you can do it in three or four hours in the air. They`ve got us where they want us, don`t they?
TRIPPLER: Well, you`ve really got to kind of have -- work around the system and manage the system as best you can. If you haven`t booked your ticket already, I`ve got to recommend you`ve got to allow an extra day. Particularly if you have to be to work Monday, you better to plan to come home on Saturday, because you never know.
You know, it wasn`t a year or two ago that hearing somebody missing a flight and staying overnight was something. Now we have a situation where these high road factors, people have their flight cancelled or they miss it, two to three days they`re stuck. It`s inexcusable.
PAGLIARULO: It is inexcusable. But what`s the recourse? Again, I mean, my mother-in-law, my wife`s aunt, my nephew, they all flew in the other day. They were a day late. And there was not one apology from the airline. They said, "We`re putting you up in a hotel. We`re going to give you some food." And you have nothing to say about it.
Isn`t there some recourse? Can`t I then say, "Well, wait a second, put me on another flight to the same place from a different airline. I have some rights here." What about that?
TRIPPLER: Well, you can definitely ask the airline to do that. It depends upon the reason for the delay or the cancellation or whatever. If it`s the airline`s fault, if it`s mechanical, the vast majority of airlines are required to put you on another one of their flights or another flight of another airline.
If it`s weather, if it`s shortage of labor, then it`s a different situation. It`s up to the airline to do whatever they want. They will, as a customer service, do whatever they can for you, but boy, I`ll tell you, it`s tough when all the other flights are filled.
That`s the problem that we have this year. Compounding it are load factors 90 to 100 percent.
PAGLIARULO: Right.
TRIPPLER: The flights are full.
PAGLIARULO: Yes, but I`ve got to tell you this. When it comes to things that are weather related, I get it. I mean, that`s not the airline`s fault. That`s clearly George W. Bush`s fault.
But when it comes to actually having a shortage of labor, how is that not the airline`s fault? Who is making the schedule, me?
TRIPPLER: You know, you`re absolutely right. So when an airline claims a shortage of labor is not their fault, but unfortunately, Joe, that`s how they write the contract of carriage. It`s called a force majeure event, just like weather, and they say shortage of labor, a labor strike, weather, we`re not responsible.
That`s wrong, but that`s the way it is right now. So what you`ve got to do is you`ve got to work around it as best you can. Try to -- try to avoid a hub if you can. It would really help. I know that`s very difficult, but if at all possible, avoid a hub.
Also, book early in the day. If you haven`t booked yet, go early in the day. If you can`t, go a day early and do be aware the vast majority of airlines offer a stand-by option.
PAGLIARULO: I`m out of time. I need like a one or two-word answer. Sorry, Terry. Just about out of time. What`s the best airline right now for me to call if I want to go there? Anywhere?
TRIPPLER: Continental.
PAGLIARULO: Continental, all right. Terry, thank you very much. Appreciate it. Great information. The knowledge is wonderful.
Remember, there`s only like a year and three months left until election day. I can`t believe it`s almost upon us. All the political news that`s fit to tell when we come back in just a bit.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PAGLIARULO: Welcome back. I`m Joe Pagliarulo, Joe Pags, in for Glenn Back. Coming up, Lindsay Lohan. I know you`re having withdrawal because you haven`t heard about her in the past five minutes, and I`m about to take care of that for you. An update on this train wreck that is La Lohan in just a bit.
But first, with Congress on their summer break, cranking up the A.C., chowing down on fried dough, no doubt, the last thing you`d expect to trump the insane shenanigans of the aforementioned Lohan is our politicians. But this weekend, our 2008 presidential candidates delivered up a smorgasbord of smackdowns and blunders that, if not quite the high drama of a celebrity DUI, certainly entertains.
Let me start with yesterday`s GOP debate hosted by ABC`s "This Week with George Stephanopoulos," which saw the candidates avoiding attacks on one another, choosing instead to focus on their Democratic rivals. Here`s one from Rudy Giuliani.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
RUDY GIULIANI, FORMER MAYOR OF NEW YORK CITY: I looked at the three leading Democratic candidates. They haven`t held an executive office in their lives. They haven`t run a city, a state, a business. I think maybe they`ve run a club somewhere.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PAGLIARULO: You`ve never held an executive office, always a crowd- pleaser. Then there was Barack Obama who just a week ago wanted to sit down and drink tea and sing "Kumbaya," as we mentioned earlier, with our enemies. He had this to say Saturday when talking about Al Qaeda in Pakistan.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. BARACK OBAMA (D), ILLINOIS: There are terrorists holed up in those mountains who murdered 3,000 Americans. If we have actionable intelligence about high-value terrorist targets and President Musharraf will not act, we will.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PAGLIARULO: OK, so I sense a little confusion there between friends and enemies. And lest we let a little political inconsistency disappear without comment, Republican candidates ganged up on Obama during yesterday`s debate, with Mitt Romney delivering the best zinger.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MITT ROMNEY (R), FORMER GOVERNOR OF MASSACHUSETTS: In one week, he went from saying he`s going to sit down, you know, with tea with our allies, but then he`s going to bomb our allies. I mean, he`s gone from Jane Fonda to Dr. Strangelove in one week.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PAGLIARULO: Get that guy a comedy show. Come on, Mitt. Mitt Romney wraps up our political round-up clearly on his game this weekend, or so I thought until I saw this on YouTube, a little off-mic debate with a conservative radio host. It got just a little heated when Romney`s faith and his stance on abortion were called into question.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ROMNEY: I`m not distancing myself from my faith. I`m proud of my faith. And I accept every -- there`s nothing I distance myself from
Are you`re thinking I`m disagreeing with you?
JAN MICKELSON, RADIO TALK SHOW HOST: No, I don`t know.
ROMNEY: Are you disagreeing with me? Let me once again say I understand my faith better than you do.
MICKELSON: Right.
ROMNEY: You don`t believe that, do you?
MICKELSON: I`m not sure.
(CROSSTALK)
ROMNEY: This is all frivolous.
(CROSSTALK)
ROMNEY: I`m running for president.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PAGLIARULO: He`s right in the guy`s face. Don`t mess with Mitt, just saying. Here to help me parse the good punch from the bad joke and to find out if anyone is actually paying any attention to any of it, Republican strategist Cheri Jacobus and Democratic strategist Jamal Simmons.
Hello, welcome. Great to see you both.
JAMAL SIMMONS, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: Thank you for having me.
CHERI JACOBUS, GOP STRATEGIST: Thanks. Good to be here.
PAGLIARULO: Great to see you both. OK, so watching this thing yesterday with Mitt Romney, and everybody talks about how rehearsed and how ready to go he is, he`s got all these answers that aren`t off-the-cuff at all, I thought he was going to punch that radio guy. Cheri, what do you think?
JACOBUS: You know, I think he showed some real emotion, genuine emotion, and I think he was probably right to do it. He`s being questioned so much about his religion in ways that other candidates aren`t, so showing some true emotion and spontaneity was not necessarily a bad thing. And I think it was something that showed integrity, and he`s probably been waiting to do it for quite some time, is my guess.
PAGLIARULO: Well, this thing is certainly working to his advantage. What`s not working to the advantage of Barack Obama -- and, Jamal, I`m going to pull you in here -- OK, he said that he wants to sit down unconditionally with Iran, with North Korea, with Venezuela, with Cuba, but then he wants to go in and potentially bomb Pakistan. He said so. And then, like a couple of days later, he said, "But I would never, ever use nukes ever, ever." What is this guy, a peace advocate, a warmonger, a peace advocate? He`s kind of confused, no?
SIMMONS: Well, Joe, you`re certainly wrapping up a whole bunch of different things in that question. I mean, first of all, Mitt Romney can`t be this prickly-pear that`s upset every time someone asks him a question about his religion. I mean, they attacked Barack Obama`s faith, whether or not he was a Christian, all sorts of things. Hillary Clinton has been getting attacked for years.
So, you know, running for president ain`t bean bags. You`ve got to be ready to get in the game and get roughed up a little bit. As far as Barack Obama goes, I think where he`s going is actually where the American people are, which is we don`t want to just have this sort of arrogant American attitude where we stride around the world, do what we want to do, and never ask anybody any questions. Sitting down and talking to people who oppose us isn`t such a bad thing. Ronald Reagan did it. Why can`t the president of the United States...
(CROSSTALK)
PAGLIARULO: Hold on, Jamal, because that all sounds well and good -- and, by the way, Mitt Romney being prickly just because somebody happened to ask him about his religion, it`s been happening for almost a year now.
(CROSSTALK)
PAGLIARULO: I`m not necessarily going to be voting for Mitt Romney. I don`t like any of them yet. We`ll find out at the end of the day what we`re all going to do. When it comes to Barack Obama, though, this guy -- he`s claiming to be the new Ronald Reagan. You`re right. He said that at the last debate for the Democrats, and he forgot to mention the fact that Ronald Reagan said, "Hey, Gorbachev, how are you? I`d like to be friend with you. By the way, our nukes are pointed at your butt. And if you don`t do what we want you to do, we`ll show you what America`s all about!" Barack Obama is confused right now, because, you`re right, he`s trying to play nicey-nice for everybody and every side in America. And I`m sorry, I`m confused, and I tend to watch these kind of things.
SIMMONS: But then how do you attack him, because he wants -- he thinks we have a conventional army that`s well enough to go into the mountains of Pakistan and actually go get Osama bin Laden, which George Bush and the Republicans haven`t mentioned Osama bin Laden in five years. He said, "Dead or alive." Osama bin Laden is still loose, and Obama is going to go get him.
PAGLIARULO: OK, Obama -- I just want to make sure I understand. Cheri, I`m going to go to you next. I just want to make sure I understand you right, Jamal. We`re going and get Osama bin Laden, and Obama is going to do it while he`s having tea with Chavez and Fidel Castro. You know it doesn`t make any sense.
Cheri, on your side of the aisle, when you hear Obama do this kind of thing, isn`t it just the guy -- you know, he`s going with what the American people want or is he confused?
JACOBUS: No, I think what he`s doing is showing some naitivity (sic). And for a while, I think that`s been the fear of a lot of Democrats who sort of wanted to support him, because he has this sort of rock star persona and there`s many attractive things about him as a candidate, but he`s not quite ready for the job.
PAGLIARULO: I love watching him as a candidate. I`m with you.
JACOBUS: And this is what it boils down to. We`re talking about somebody who`s going to be commander-in-chief, the leader of the free world, and Barack Obama has finally -- you know, he`s been unmasked. He`s been able to avoid some of these gaffes, but it was bound to happen as we get closer and closer to choosing our next commander-in-chief. He`s not ready. He`s naive. He doesn`t understand foreign policy. Might be a nice guy, but that type of naitivity (sic), quite frankly, is very, very dangerous.
SIMMONS: Well, this is just...
PAGLIARULO: Go ahead, Jamal.
SIMMONS: This is more of the sort of elite Washington insider, more of the same group of people who think that everything is going well in the world, the United States doesn`t have any problems. If we`re going to fix what is going wrong right now with the United States foreign policy, it means we`re going to have to do some things differently. And maybe it means we have to pull some plays from out of the books from times past when they actually worked.
PAGLIARULO: Yes, but I don`t know any playbooks, Jamal, when we sat down with our enemies and then we bombed our friends. But we can talk about that later. I don`t mean to focus on Mitt Romney and Barack Obama, but I have to because they did the best, I feel, in the last debates and over the past couple of weeks.
Mitt Romney, Jamal, appears to be going after Obama. Why would he do that? If I were Mitt Romney, I might my focus my attention on the frontrunner, Hillary Clinton.
SIMMONS: Well, maybe they think Obama has more of a threat. I mean, Mitt Romney is sort of the more likely change agent on the Republican side. You know, he`s not from Washington. He hasn`t worked in Washington. Barack Obama just got to Washington. So if people are looking for a change agent, they may be looking at one of those two candidates. So he may feel some threat from Barack Obama.
PAGLIARULO: I just want to make sure I heard what you just said. So you`re going to vote for Mitt Romney?
SIMMONS: Not on your life.
PAGLIARULO: Isn`t that what you said?
SIMMONS: Not on your life.
(CROSSTALK)
PAGLIARULO: Any idea why these two are going at each other exclusively and why they`re leaving everybody else out?
JACOBUS: You know what? We`re really over-thinking it. It`s not that complicated. The fact of the matter is, this is a very important issue, this type of foreign policy. Barack Obama brought it to the forefront, and Mitt Romney is taking this opportunity to get his -- to show his leadership abilities and to talk about this and to show the weaknesses in the Democratic Party. So he`s doing a smart thing.
I don`t think he`s doing it necessarily because he wants to take on Barack Obama just for the sake of taking on Barack Obama. But this is an issue that we have to be talking about. It`s about time we talked about this, rather than the religion and if people think that a distant relative of Mitt Romney`s might have had more than one spouse...
(CROSSTALK)
JACOBUS: I think that this is a good way to start defining this race with the issues that are really very, very important.
PAGLIARULO: Jamal, go ahead.
SIMMONS: This is a key point, because for the Republicans, they have to define this race about the Democrats because they don`t have anything to run on. They`ve got big deficits...
PAGLIARULO: Oh, that sounds just like a 2006...
SIMMONS: Hey, hey, you know, the 2006 race worked out pretty well for us.
PAGLIARULO: You guys only won because they attacked -- you know, they said what was wrong with what was going on. There was never a plan put forth, and you know that. Nothing has gotten done in this Congress so far.
SIMMONS: ... six for `06, all those plans, minimum wage, universal health care...
(CROSSTALK)
PAGLIARULO: Are you making minimum wage? I`m not. I mean, come on. Who does that affect?
JACOBUS: Congress has a low approval rating for a reason.
(CROSSTALK)
SIMMONS: Who does it affect? It affects millions of Americans.
PAGLIARULO: It affects people who don`t want to move up the food chain and get a better job! You know what? If I had 10 more minutes, we`d have a lot of fun, you two.
Cheri, Jamal, thank you so much for the knowledge. Appreciate you coming by.
Coming up, that Lindsey Lohan update I was promising you, I hope you`re as excited as I am.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(NEWSBREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GLENN BECK, HOST: What is the number-one reason people buy a Prius? What`s going to get you into this ugly car? The trees. I just love the trees so much. No. The number-one answer? It says something about me. Well, how fabulous. It says something about you. To me it says that you`re a blind moron.
It says something about me, number one. I like its unique design qualities. Number three, it will save me money. And number four, I care about the trees. So in other words, the average person buying a Prius doesn`t really care about the trees. I mean, they care a little bit. Well, I got news for you: I care a little bit.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PAGLIARULO: So Lindsay Lohan is in the news again, but not for something she`s done. She`s actually making news because no one knows where she is. There are unconfirmed reports that she`s checked into rehab in Utah. If you`re keeping score at home, that would be Lohan`s third trip so far this year. But hey, it`s only August.
Reportedly, she`s at Utah`s Cirque Lodge, which has been described as a private substance abuse retreat with stunning views of the Sundance ski resort, which is kind of ironic, because with the way her career has now tanked, this may be the closest she gets to Sundance for some time.
Her latest film, "I Know Who Killed My Career" -- oops, sorry, "I Know Who Killed Me," is a bona fide bomb. In its second week of release, it`s already dropped 67 percent, falling to number 15, and now Hollywood insiders are calling her "uninsurable," which usually doesn`t bode well for one`s career. Is it curtains for Lohan?
Well, joining me now are Kim Serafin, senior editor of "InTouch," and Julia Allison, editor-at-large for "Star" magazine.
Thank you so much, ladies, for joining me. Oh, where is she, first of all? Anybody know where he is?
KIM SERAFIN, "INTOUCH WEEKLY": The reports are saying she is at Cirque Lodge in Utah. And that`s where it looks like she`s going to do her third stint in rehab.
PAGLIARULO: OK, and, Julia, is she at Cirque or is she at home with mom on Long Island?
JULIA ALLISON, "STAR" MAGAZINE: No, our sources are telling us that she went into rehab as early as last Friday, and she`ll be there for at least 30 days, if not longer. And in addition to that, you know, she did her first stint at Wonderland, her second at Promises. "Star" reported, when she was at promises, that she smuggled in all sorts of contraband, including whippets. She text messaged during rehab sessions. She didn`t take it seriously. But Cirque is a serious rehab facility. Mary Kate Olsen went there. She hasn`t had a relapse since she left. And we do think that Lindsay will have to take it seriously to come around.
PAGLIARULO: Well, Julia, it`s got to be serious, because the name is Cirque. Doesn`t that mean in circus in French, Cirque du Soleil? Isn`t that the French word for circus? I mean, come on.
ALLISON: These rehab places, they name -- they have the weirdest names, I agree with you. You know, Wonderland, Promises, you know? Who knows why they name them the way they do.
PAGLIARULO: But I`ve got to ask you this. Hey, Kim, I`ve got to ask you. Is she going to take this one seriously? She didn`t take the last one seriously. Julia said whippets, which his -- I just find this out. You suck on the Ready Whip stuff? I don`t even know what that is. And she`s text messaging during -- she`s doing this to save her career, right? She`s not trying to save her life.
SERAFIN: You know, I think at this point she does need to really focus on her health right now, and her career, obviously, is an issue. But I think that her health needs to be first and foremost. I think that the series of events that happened in the past couple of weeks maybe will make her take this much more seriously.
Wonderland was the rehab center up in Laurel Canyon, and she was seen out at the gym and shopping, and Promises is right in Malibu. And even though that is a serious rehab center, she was sort of out and about, and she took some time off. And, you know, this one is away from L.A., so I think that is going to be a very good situation for her to kind of get away from it all.
And it`s interesting, because even in this "Elle" magazine interview that is coming out on the stands next week, she said something about Wonderland, like she went in because she needed to get a break and needed to get away from it all and was growing up. She doesn`t say, "I went in because I had an alcohol problem, or I went in because I had a drug problem." So I think that hopefully will be her first step...
(CROSSTALK)
PAGLIARULO: And we`re seeing some of those pictures from that "Elle" magazine interview, which, by the way, during the "Elle" magazine interview, didn`t she say something about she would never drive drunk (INAUDIBLE) wasted and driving, that people were after her, and that`s what they want to see, her trip and fall, but she`s never going to do it, she`ll never drive drunk. And what was it, like four days later, she crashed the Mercedes into a tree?
ALLISON: Famous last words. And, you know, as a celebrity, you never want to say something like, "I`ve never done this," like Paris Hilton did with Larry King. "I`ve never done drugs." It just makes it too easy to shoot you down. But Lindsay, the series of bad decisions that she`s made over the past couple of -- especially couple of months, but even the last couple of years are really astounding. It`s almost like she`s pouring lighter fluid all over herself and setting herself on fire, you know?
(CROSSTALK)
PAGLIARULO: It`s absolutely true.
ALLISON: The one thing that people do agree on, even as you said before, that a lot of people, studio bosses, producers, are saying now she`s uninsurable right now, the thing is people do agree that she`s a great actress. And that`s the one thing that people continue to agree on. So if she can pull herself together, Hollywood always loves a comeback, Hollywood always loves to pump people up, bring them down, and then bring them back up.
(CROSSTALK)
PAGLIARULO: Hold on a second, because, you know, a great actress in what sense? I mean, she did "Herbie." Hey, look at that Herbie. Look at that love bug. I mean, what else did she do? I mean, I can`t...
(CROSSTALK)
SERAFIN: ... were actually bona fide hits, so...
ALLISON: Of all her movies, of all her movies, she`s only had three hits. She`s had "Herbie," she`s had "Just My Luck," she`s had "Prairie Home Companion," she`s had "Bobby," and then, of course, "I Know Who Killed Me." I have to say, even Jennifer Aniston couldn`t survive a string of flops like this. It`s incredible that anyone is even interested in sending her scripts anymore.
PAGLIARULO: Absolutely. Hey, Kim, I`ve got to ask you this real quick. Lindsey Lohan`s father, she`s going to solve the whole problem. He`s now going to go ahead and minister to poor drug addicts. He`s going to become a drug abuse counselor. That`s a good move, for a former prisoner, right?
SERAFIN: Well, you know, I have no idea about his life. You know, hopefully she`ll pull herself together. Hopefully her family will rally around her. You know, even the producer that sent out that scathing note about that movie, "Georgia Rules"...
(CROSSTALK)
PAGLIARULO: Hey, there`s daddy right now in handcuffs. That`s nice. Here`s some video of daddy right now being taken away. Julia, is he going to be a drug counselor, is that the deal?
ALLISON: Yes, that`s what we`re hearing.
PAGLIARULO: Come on.
ALLISON: He wants to do substance abuse counseling. And I know when I was doing interviews last week at CNN and at FOX News, he was there every single place I went. He was there. And I thought, "Get off the TV and go fix your daughter`s life."
PAGLIARULO: Exactly right. Julia, Kim, thank you so much. We`ve got to move on. Thanks a lot. We`ll be back right after this.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PAGLIARULO: Tonight, there`s a very good chance baseball history will be made, as Barry Bonds attempts to break the Major League record for career home runs. After tying Hank Aaron`s record of 755 home runs on Saturday, Bonds took yesterday off and now returns home to San Francisco where he`ll try to break the record in front of what will undoubtedly be a much friendlier home crowd. Still, he`ll be doing this under an enormous cloud of suspicion regarding possible steroid use.
Joining me now to talk about this is "San Francisco Chronicle" reporter Lance Williams, who is the co-author of the book "Game of Shadows."
Lance, we appreciate your time today.
LANCE WILLIAMS, AUTHOR, "GAME OF SHADOWS": It`s my pleasure.
PAGLIARULO: Hey, Lance, Barry Bonds is a jerk, right?
WILLIAMS: Yes, I suppose so.
PAGLIARULO: And I ask that for a simple reason. In 1998, I couldn`t get away from my computer watching the Gamecast on ESPN or watching Mark McGwire or Sammy Sosa every time they got up. You know, subsequently we find out Mark McGwire, at least, probably full of steroids. He didn`t admit, but he cried in front of Congress. He admitted to androstenedione. But that rejuvenated the game of baseball. That brought people back to baseball.
Like it or not, Barry Bonds is nowhere near the figure that Mark McGwire and Sammy Sosa were in 1998. Barry Bonds has had a history, before he bulked up and got a head the size of a tire on a car, this guy has always been a jerk to you guys in the media. Does that play at all into how you feel about what`s happening right now?
WILLIAMS: No. You know, I never had to interact with Barry as an athlete before I took on the project of "Game of Shadows," so I don`t have that kind of past history. I know he`s a difficult person. But I think his press coverage has been surprisingly positive, given the provocations that I`m aware of that he makes. He doesn`t make it easy for the press, and a lot of what`s being written even now is really upbeat.
PAGLIARULO: OK, so and watching Barry Bonds hit 755, there`s one thing you and I can agree on: 755 pitches coming at this man during his career went over the fence. That`s undeniable. For the vast majority of that career, although it was shunned on and looked down upon, nobody was testing for steroids in baseball. There was no, you know, hard and fast rule against steroids in baseball. If he can melt down a door and inject it into his big toe to make him hit more home runs, that was perfectly legal. Why are we going after him now?
WILLIAMS: Well, it was illegal to use those drugs since the `80s. It was a crime. Perhaps baseball didn`t have a particular rule against it, but it wasn`t legal conduct. We`re going after him now because he`s breaking the biggest record perhaps in all sports, because the feds are investigating him for perjury when he says he didn`t take steroids, because his trainer is sitting in prison rather than speaking about him.
PAGLIARULO: Hey, Lance, we appreciate your time. We`ll talk again. Thank you.
Hey listen, from New York, we`ve got to get out of here with Joe Pags, have a good night.
END
