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Super Tuesday: McCain Leading GOP; Clinton & Obama Dead Heat on Dem Side
Aired February 05, 2008 - 00:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
GLENN BECK, HOST: Well, hello, America. It is midnight on the East Coast. Super Tuesday or "Mediocre Wednesday" as I would like to call it. It has been quite a night. The big story is there is no big story, yet.
We are going to go behind some of the numbers here with former Gore adviser and Democratic strategist Peter friend -- Peter Fenn.
PETER FENN, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: I am a friend.
BECK: You are a friend. You are a friend.
BECK: And also we are here with CNN political contributor Amy Holmes.
Let`s talk a little bit about -- we are going to Erica here and get some of the numbers in California. They are still crunching it, it is very close at this point, although it looks like McCain is starting to pull away in California.
But there are some interesting things that I found in the California numbers. For instance, if you thought that the economy was bad, you went with McCain. If you thought the economy was good, you went for Romney. How does that make sense?
AMY HOLMES, CNN POLITICAL CONTRIBUTOR: That is so peculiar. And we saw it, I believe it was in Florida, if you thought the economy was the most important, that you went with McCain.
I tried to chalk this up to that those voters sort trust McCain, you know, Grumpy Gramps is going to take care of things for them.
BECK: Grumpy Gramps.
HOLMES: And that, you know, Mitt Romney did talk a lot about optimism and the American economy as doing well. So maybe he reached out to those voters. But it is a weird, weird, peculiar finding.
FENN: And I think the last week, the Romney campaign made a mistake. I mean, I think they should have gone in, he is Mr. Fix-it. He is the guy who knew the most about business and the -- he came into Utah, took care of those Olympics and took this company and made it work.
And he can be great guy in California. And -- but no, they were going to do, I`m Mr. Conservative, Mr. Conservative.
BECK: Let me.
FENN: And I didn`t think that worked.
BECK: Yes. Let me go to -- let me go to Erica Hill now in Atlanta who can give us all the details in California.
What is happening out in California?
ERICA HILL, CNN HEADLINE NEWS ANCHOR: Well, before we get to California, Glenn, I do want to give you sort of an overview, because I know you said the big story of this hour is there is no big story.
I have got to tell you, though, I have a little bit different take on it. The big story is Super Tuesday may not be deciding the race -- or, rather, the nominees. And that is a big change from what we have seen in year`s past.
So look at this, here is your map right now for where we stand for the Democratic contenders. As we know, really just between Clinton and Obama at this point. So you can see the states that each one has taken. I believe we have the map for the Republicans as well.
Still waiting on California, a key state there for both the Democrats and the Republicans. And then you look at the Republican states here, Mike Huckabee really doing much better than a lot of people thought.
In fact, earlier tonight, he came out and said, you know, someone said this week it is a two-man race, well, maybe it is, because earlier in the night it really seemed that Huckabee and McCain were going to be the frontrunners tonight.
But we are seeing Romney pull up a little bit more as we head in and get -- and learn a little bit more about what is happening out West. So getting to California now, one thing really interesting here is how it breaks down by race.
So you can see here, pretty much -- well, not quite evenly split, but only a 6 percent difference when it comes to the white votes for Obama, among Democratic voters. You look at African-American voters, also not a huge surprise here, but those are pretty big numbers, 81 percent going for Obama.
Here is what is key, Latino voters overwhelmingly are choosing Senator Clinton over Senator Obama, two-thirds of California`s Latino voters. Remember, they are almost a third of the state population.
Asian voters, Clinton also scoring very high with them. I`m stopping, go ahead.
BECK: All right. I want to ask you, what do you have on the GOP on the Hispanic vote?
HILL: Let me call it up for you. I think we can bring it up. But I`m going to call it up on my computer for you as well, if I can. I`m trying to get out of this screen actually because I was trying to get that for you earlier.
Give me a second, let me get it for you and I will bring it back to you, how about that?
BECK: OK. Yes, go ahead, Amy.
HOLMES: Yes, I was just going to say, can I address the question of race? I think sometimes it`s oversimplified. The real problem that Hillary has and nobody talks about it, she has a man problem, and I don`t mean her husband. She does very poorly among white males. This has been the case throughout this campaign.
And in California, she bombed. Obama got 60 percent of the white male vote where she only got 33 percent. And that is in her own party. I think Democrats should be really worried about Hillary being their nominee going into the general election when white males in her own party don`t like her.
FENN: Look, look, look, you say, don`t like her. I think you have to look at that question, which is, would you support -- whether it is Obama or Clinton? And what we have found in all of these primaries is that it is a tough choice for people. They went with Obama or they went with Clinton.
But it wasn`t that they said, no, no, no, I`m not going to go for Clinton.
HOLMES: Oh, Peter, Peter, white males in Iowa went for Obama.
FENN: No, no, no, I think -- no, no, no, but I`m talking about -- in a general election, Amy, I`m saying, look, that these people said, I`m voting for Obama and there is no way I`m going to touch Hillary Clinton in the general election against a Republican. That is fine.
But that`s not what you are seeing in these situations. And that isn`t racial either. You are seeing them amongst blacks supporting Clinton in the general election as well as whites. So I agree with you that there is a gender gap here in terms of the primary, but not in the general election.
HOLMES: Well, yes, and then the media doesn`t talk about it because nobody goes around saying, I get white men to vote for me. It`s usually sort of like more noble to get black men, black women, Hispanics.
BECK: I`ll take white men.
BECK: I mean, I`ll take -- if I`m running, I`ll take anybody, I don`t care what color you are, what gender you are. You know, the thing, though, is, is Clinton is just unlikable. She is just unlikable.
FENN: You guys keep saying that. And I`ll you.
BECK: She is. Peter, Peter, let`s be honest. And I know this comes from a guy -- and I have a lot of respect for you, but from a guy who hung out with Al Gore, so I mean, I have got to take it with a grain of salt.
FENN: He wasn`t my best friend. I wasn`t his best friend.
BECK: I know, but really, do you -- be an average person. You don`t want to hang out -- with Bill, you can.
HOLMES: Be a white male, they don`t like her.
BECK: Bill you can hang out with -- OK, let me.
FENN: I will make one fundamental point, and that is that if you are running for president of the United States and you are not likable and you don`t have a three dimensional personality, if you are an automaton, you are not going to make it. Now in New Hampshire you saw.
BECK: She is.
FENN: No, I don`t think that`s true. Well, and you -- we are just sitting here in the city of New York and the state of New York where she went up to Buffalo, where she went around the state.
HOLMES: She was running against Rick Lazio.
FENN: . where she campaigned -- well, listen, Rick Lazio is very close. He scared out Giuliani -- out of the race. My point being.
BECK: I mean, for the love of Pete, they put the emotion chip in, she cries.
BECK: Let me go to Michael Reagan here. Michael, are you there?
MICHAEL REAGAN, RADIO TALK SHOW HOST: Yes. Who did the midgets vote for in California? I want to know.
BECK: Is this the most amazing night that you have ever seen? When I said earlier the big story is there is no big story, there is no clear cut anything. I mean, we are looking at mishmash, divided up by region for the Republicans. We are looking at a close race, just -- I mean, when was it, Michael, we were -- a week ago, two weeks ago we were talking about a brokered convention for the Republicans, we may be looking at a brokered convention for the Democrats.
REAGAN: Yes. I mean, the big story is really going to be California. California hasn`t been counted yet. You have 2 million absentee voters that got, you know, put in today into the hopper. It could be a day or two before we find out about California.
Both sides, Democrats and Republicans, are waiting for California because they can sit there and say, I won California. Mitt Romney wins it, he keeps on going forward. Mitt Romney loses it, Mitt Romney is going to be asked by Huckabee why don`t you get out of the race so that in fact I can do battle with John McCain.
Mitt Romney needs California more than anybody else in this race. Obama can live another day without it. But he can live longer with it. Hillary wins it, she helps put herself into the driver`s seat for November.
BECK: Explain, Michael, being a guy from California, how you can say the economy is bad, and that`s why I`m going with McCain, as opposed to the economy is good, and that`s why I`m going with Mitt Romney. Mitt Romney is the -- if you will, Lee Iacocca that can come in and has turned companies around, he is a businessman, et cetera, et cetera, that is his strong point.
REAGAN: You are right. But Peter was right. He came out here and sold himself, I`m the conservative in the race, vote for me. He didn`t sell himself on, you know, here I am as a businessman saving the Olympics, and here is what I did for Massachusetts, whatever. I am the conservative, in fact, in the race.
I think that ultimately did hurt him in the state of California. We`ll find out later on, the next day or two if, in fact, he was able to pull it out or not. But again, ran on the wrong issue there. He should have run on the fact that he could fix the economy. He is the guy who fixed the Olympics, not the guy who is the most conservative in the race.
HOLMES: Can I ask a question, Michael, but wouldn`t saying, I`m the conservative mean that you are good on the economy, that you can fix the economy, why would these things be in conflict?
REAGAN: But you have everybody out there saying they are a conservative.
BECK: No, no, no. No, Michael, they don`t say they are the conservative. If one more person says they`re Ronald Reagan, blood is going to shoot out of my eyes. I can`t take it anymore.
REAGAN: I will tell you, I thought my dad was on the ballot. Listen, I`m going to state that we have Indians getting on television saying, please vote for us to give $9 billion of our profits to the state. And you sit there saying, wait a minute, why would you give up $9 billion of profit? And you find out because they are going to make $160 billion off the new slot machines that Governor Schwarzenegger just gave them.
I mean, I live in a weird state.
BECK: All right. We are going to come back in just a second. We are going to find out right from the horse`s mouth what happened with Romney, what are their plans? We are going to talk to the Romney camp when we come back.
BECK: Welcome back to a special live edition of the GLENN BECK program. Kevin Madden is the press secretary for the Romney campaign, and he is with us now.
Kevin, I`ve just got to show you something here, my friend. This is my binge cake. I was bingeing earlier, because Romney is my guy and I couldn`t yell at the TV when the returns were coming, so I had to binge on chocolate cake.
Now it seems that you are having some good news coming out of the West. What is the strategy to be able to pull this thing out of the fire now?
KEVIN MADDEN, MITT ROMNEY PRESS SECRETARY: Well, you are right, it is going to be a long night. We are going to watch a lot of these returns come in from these western states. We have got good news out of places like Montana and North Dakota.
And we will have to wait and see how some of these results turn out in California and Colorado. But, you know, our message has been that Governor Romney is the best conservative to bring together those economic conservatives, social conservatives and national security conservatives that are going to help us bring together that vital Reagan coalition that is going to help us win in November.
So it`s going to be a long night. We`ll be waiting for these returns to come in.
BECK: We were just talking about this a second ago. I said this to Governor Romney when he was on my radio program a week ago. He is Lee Iacocca. I remember being 10 years old and thinking, if this guy can turn Chrysler around, why can`t we get somebody to turn America around that is from the business sector.
That is who Romney is. Why did he go into California with a different message than that? Let me turn the economy around.
MADDEN: I think you are right. And I think that the most compelling message that Governor Romney is that he is somebody who is Mr. Fix-it. Everywhere he has gone, if you look at his resume of accomplishment, whether it was when he was a businessman for 25 years, building successful companies, whether he was -- when he was taking over the -- you know, malfunctioning Olympics and delivering success there, and as well as when he became governor of Massachusetts, pulling the state economy out of a ditch and creating jobs.
The essence of Mitt Romney is that he is the turnaround specialist, that he can do for the American economy what he did for the Olympics and for Massachusetts. And I think as we progress through this calendar of primary contests, Glenn, you are going to see a lot more of that.
And I think that, you know, a lot of people looked at the beginning of this campaign as February 6th as an endgame in this nomination when in fact we are right smack dab in the middle of a contest here.
And as we move through these next dates on the calendar. And we can continue to engage Republican primary voters all across the country. That is going to be the Mitt Romney you`re going to hear from.
BECK: Good. Thanks, Kevin. Now let`s go back to Erica, who is going to give some more information on California from the update desk. Hello, Erica.
HILL: Yes, absolutely. I do want to get you quickly the information you asked for earlier in terms of Latino voters in California, how they`re leaning on the Republican side. Keep in mind here, they are 13 percent of California Republicans, are Latino. Thirty-three percent of them going for McCain, 25 percent for Romney, 23 percent for Huckabee. So that`s your breakdown there.
I want to get you now to two big states we`ve been following, California I`ll get to.
BECK: Hold on, hold on.
HILL: Yes, yes, yes.
BECK: Wait, wait, I`m sorry.
BECK: Let me -- let me address that. Can you give me that number again? I`m sorry, it`s.
HILL: Which number do you need?
BECK: . midnight here on the East and I`ve been doing radio since 9:00 this morning. Give me the numbers on the Latino breakdown again.
HILL: In California, what I have, 13 percent of registered Republicans there are Latino. Of those Latino voters on the Republican side, 33 percent going for John McCain.
HILL: Twenty-five percent for Romney, 23 percent for Huckabee.
BECK: Got it. OK.
HILL: So that is what you have been asking for earlier.
BECK: Got it. OK. All right.
HILL: OK. Good. So I want to get you to Missouri now, because this is a huge contest. We`ve been talking about this since we went on the air, 7:00, Glenn. And this is something that is still not decided. Check this out, 98 percent reporting, and it is really still a race between McCain and Huckabee, 1 percent separates these two.
And keep in mind, Missouri, this is a winner-take-all state. So McCain or Huckabee, either one could win by a few hundred votes, they are getting all 58 delegates. So that`s why at 98 percent, still can`t call it. It`s still that close.
BECK: And do we have -- Conway (ph), do we have Mike Huckabee on this half hour?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Still working on it. Hoping for the next half hour, Glenn.
BECK: Oh, next half hour, OK.
You know, going into this, this was a two-man race, it is not a two- man race, it`s a three-man race. And it`s a regional race. You`ve got the -- you`ve got McCain kind of doing well everywhere. But you have Huckabee doing well in the South and Romney doing well in the West. What are you going to do to unite all of this?
HOLMES: Well, and what you`re seeing is that John McCain, while he may be ahead in those states, he is still getting a third of the voters, you know, 33 percent, 37 percent. He is not getting anywhere near what you would -- could call a consensus vote.
And in the Missouri -- in Missouri, this is interesting, in the exit polling, for people who decided today, they were evenly split between McCain and Romney. And what that tells me is there is such deep, you know, unease, that that was not an easy vote to cast. They didn`t know who they were going to vote for walking into the polling booth.
FENN: The other thing you have got is you obviously have a lot of latent strength for Huckabee that people didn`t predict in these states. You know, they said, OK, fine, Arkansas, OK, fine. You know, the Deep South where he is known and popular and where you have the evangelical vote.
But this is quite unusual to get a three-way race going in Missouri, it really is. And there may be a bit here too of the pox on both your houses with McCain and Romney in the back and forth. So it is possible that Huckabee benefited from some of that negativity that has been going on this last (INAUDIBLE).
BECK: I think there are three kinds of -- I think there are three kinds of conservatives. There is the conservative -- there is the Northeast conservative, you know, and the -- kind of the conservative that is strong on war. Then you have got the let-me-get-you-baptized conservative. And then you`ve got the western conservative, like -- that really Ronald Reagan was.
And that is a little bit of everything, but mainly, let me clear the land myself. Get out of my way and let me do it myself. Get government out of the way. And you have got those three candidates separately.
HOLMES: And we were talking earlier that Republicans, what they are really looking for is a country club Republican who can go and shoot off guns and go hunting and then go to a Baptist, you know, barbecue.
HOLMES: And George Bush was that guy, we don`t have him this time around.
FENN: Right. And it is interesting, if you look at Romney`s strength, it has been in those western states. You know, it is kind of funny (INAUDIBLE), you know, I have to say, for sort of a Ken doll-looking guy, slick easterner type doing very well in Montana and Colorado and.
BECK: Why is -- let`s go to Michael Reagan, why is he doing well in the West?
REAGAN: Yes, well, he may be doing well in the West. He has got that great look, and it gives, again, what you have been selling, the fact that he has been able to go out there and fix things.
But he can`t afford to sit there and lose Missouri and lose California. He can`t come out of Super Tuesday being behind Huckabee in delegate count. I mean, that is almost a death knell for Mitt Romney if he comes out behind Huckabee in all of this.
And again, you have got all of these different Republicans running. Everybody is saying they are conservative. Everybody is taking a different position, if you will. There are two kinds of Republicans, let me tell you that, Glenn.
There is the Reagan Republican and the Rockefeller Republican. And right now, the bottom line is the Rockefeller Republicans are leading the pack and the Reagan Republicans are sitting there waiting for their leader to emerge from it all.
And it may take another four years to find him.
BECK: All right. We`ll be back in just a minute.
BECK: Welcome back, America. It is after midnight in the East. Every day I talk to millions of Americans and they are never shy about their opinions. So while I`m here on television, my radio producer, Stu (ph), is behind the mike, keeping tabs on the GLENN BECK insiders, a group of people that gather every day on the Internet.
What are people saying tonight, Stu?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well, Glenn, they are wondering if you are OK. They.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You are starting to look like it`s sleepy time. Are you going to take a nap?
BECK: It is sleepy time. You know, I just got off -- I just got off bed rest from -- my doctor told me to take like five days off for bed rest. So it`s a little -- you know, it`s not the day to really come right back into work.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No, well, maybe, you know, the 20-hour-day wasn`t the best idea. Maybe also the six pounds of chocolate cake, creating a sugar rush, creating a sugar crash, also not the best.
BECK: Have you come up with any -- have you come up.
FENN: Does it work for you?
BECK: Have you come up with any solutions on how Romney can win?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes. And the clear one really right off the bat is if California secedes from the union. If that occurs.
BECK: That is good.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: . he is doing very, very well.
BECK: I might be willing to allow that one to happen.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, I thought you might.
BECK: I mean, I love California -- parts of it. Other parts, I don`t understand how you live there.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes.
BECK: How do you do it? How do you live -- San Francisco is one of the greatest cities in America, it really is, and there is people there. I don`t understand it.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I know. We haven`t dealt -- we didn`t go too deep into that.
BECK: All right.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: But, I mean, you know, I think what you said is true, like it`s amazing that every single -- I don`t know why we talk about this stuff in advance, because honestly, does it ever come out the way that we say?
BECK: No. This whole thing has been upside down. In fact, we thought it was going to go -- there was a possibility it was 9 points ahead for Romney today. We are ready to call California. Let`s go to Erica.
Go ahead, Erica.
HILL: Yes, that`s right. CNN is now projecting that Senator Hillary Clinton and Senator John McCain will take the state of California for their respective parties. So you look at Hillary Clinton there. A total of more than 440 delegates up for grabs in California. Again, CNN now projecting Hillary Clinton will take California.
And on the Republican side, CNN projecting that we will be able to call that state for John McCain. And we also just called John McCain -- CNN also predicting John McCain in Missouri. This is one we just talked about just a couple of minutes ago.
But that`s huge there, because remember, there was 1 percent difference between McCain and Huckabee with 98 percent reporting in Missouri, which is a winner-takes-all state, 58 delegates at stake. So that is a huge win for John McCain.
It will be interesting to see what the number of votes -- just how many votes actually separate McCain and Huckabee in Missouri with 100 percent reporting.
BECK: OK. Guys, let`s just.
FENN: Game over. Game over for the Republicans, no question. I don`t think -- you know, I mean, Mike Huckabee ain`t going to make a late surge here. And I think Romney is toast. So I don`t see it happening.
And on the Democrats, they are going to fight another day, another week, another month, and you guys are going to love it.
HOLMES: Get out your popcorn.
BECK: Do you remember, Amy, we were just talking that it was going to be the other way around.
HOLMES: Yes, totally.
BECK: The brokered convention for the Republicans. This is the most ridiculous -- no, I mean, for us -- for doing television, we had no idea what we were talking about.
HOLMES: Every political professional was wrong, OK?
BECK: Yes. OK. Got to take a break. Back with more insanity coming up.
BECK: Well, here we are, live Super Tuesday, the latest results and returns now from election update desk with Erica Hill.
Erica, we go back to California. There are some interesting things coming out, most important issue, immigration, 53 percent for Romney. Economy, 46 percent for McCain, only 33 percent for Romney.
HILL: Yes. The economy was a really interesting one. You brought it up at the beginning of the show. It was one that we noticed here too. People who tend to think the economy is in good shape go for Romney. They don`t think the economy is doing well, they go for McCain.
And a lot of people said, well, why wouldn`t you go for the business guy if you had a problem with the economy? But that`s the way it`s playing out. Of course, the -- really now the story though coming out of California is the fact that CNN is projecting a winner on both sides in this state.
And on the Democratic side, projecting Hillary Clinton, really making a strong showing.
BECK: That is not a flattering picture. That is not a flattering.
FENN: Nor is that.
BECK: Nor is that. I mean, these are the two people that were running. How did this -- America, how did it happen! How did we.
HILL: So it`s the actual results that you have a problem with? I thought you had a problem with the actual photo that we were using. But it`s the results, Glenn.
BECK: No, I knew. No, I have a problem with the photos that we`re doing. I can`t believe I live in a country where we say we want change, and we`re deciding now between a woman who lived in the White House, moved eight blocks down to the Capitol, now is going to move back to the White House, there is big change, or the guy who has been working at the Capitol is going to move to the White House. That is not change.
We don`t even need a moving truck.
HILL: But those are the people who are (INAUDIBLE).
BECK: You get some people, just say, hey, can you move my desk into the other room? For the love of Pete how did this happen to us?
HILL: OK. But keep in mind, Glenn, this isn`t over yet, because yes, California is an incredibly important state for both sides of the aisle. But let`s take a look at the delegate count now, because remember, it all comes down to the delegates.
And when we take a look at the Republican side, McCain doing well, but he is not there yet. You need almost 1,200 votes to win that nomination. He has got 475. Definitely on his way, but he doesn`t own it.
BECK: OK. Tell me about the conservative vote in California.
HILL: Conservative vote in California, really interesting the way this plays out, because, as you can see here, a number of -- almost, not quite the majority, but most of the conservatives there going for Romney with 46 percent, which is interesting because there has been so much talk about McCain and whether or not he can really bring the conservatives out, whether conservatives will vote for him, which makes me wonder, and I would think you and your panel could bat this around, how McCain is going to do?
Is he still going to continue to have a problem with conservatives as the rest of this plays out?
BECK: Is Michael Reagan still with us?
REAGAN: Yes, I`ve been here. I`m here.
REAGAN: Glenn, I`m here.
REAGAN: I will tell you one thing, if there is 13 percent Hispanics in California, there is 12 percent conservative.
BECK: How do you -- how do you survive as McCain without any conservatives rallying around you? How do you do it?
REAGAN: Conservatives have always -- for whatever reason is, conservatives have always needed a leader. Right now conservatives don`t have a leader. And so we are all over the map. We are every place, as you see, 46 percent went for Romney, 30 percent went for McCain. We are looking for a leader.
And so I don`t know why it is. Liberals don`t see -- liberals need ideology, that is their leader. But conservatives need someone they can put their faith behind. And they haven`t found that person.
BECK: No, you know what? Michael, I have to tell you. I was just -- I just spoke to the Young Republicans out in Idaho over this weekend. And they -- and you know, they said, Glenn, what do we do? You know, we can get involved in so many things, what would be the best thing to do?
And I`m not a Republican. I`m an independent. And I said, first of all, stop caring about the stupid elephant, care about values. Figure out what you really, truly believe in. And when you have those -- that set of values, you`ll be led to what your -- you should be engaged in.
REAGAN: You`re right, Glenn. You`re right.
BECK: Right now -- right now, the Republicans are just doing things without the core values that is leading them to those things.
REAGAN: And they`re looking for the leader that has those core values that they in fact can get behind. Barry Goldwater, then Ronald Reagan, Newt Gingrich then led the party. Newt Gingrich went away, and so did the leadership for that side of the party.
So they are floundering out there looking for that person to take them forward into the future. And that person has not been raised up at this point. And something else, too, you know something, nobody has been building the Republican Party from the ground up.
Hillary Clinton has been building the Democrat Party from the ground up. And so therefore she gets what she gets. But nobody in the Republican Party has been building from the ground up for a long period of time. They have been kingmakers instead of building the party from the bottom.
BECK: But see, this is my problem with you -- this is my problem with you, Michael, is, look, you know I love you and I respect you.
REAGAN: Oh, I know, yes.
BECK: . but -- no, no, no, but you were on the program -- you were on the program just last week. John McCain is the kind of guy that will tear it down from the top all the way down to the ground.
REAGAN: But I agree with you. I have an article out, Glenn, that says John McCain thinks of conservatives like he thinks of the Viet Cong. We`re the Viet Cong of this generation.
BECK: Right. But you.
REAGAN: I think the man is an angry, angry man.
BECK: . just said to me -- you just said to me last week that, you know, as soon as he becomes the candidate, you`ll back him. He`ll tear it down.
FENN: But let me ask you.
REAGAN: I said, I said, I said, what would Ronald Reagan do? That seems to be the question. Ronald Reagan would in fact support the nominee of the party. Let`s go back to `76. Nancy Reagan hated Betty Ford. Ronald Reagan didn`t like the Ford family much at all. But Ronald Reagan, in a tough campaign, where Nelson Rockefeller ripped the phone out of the floor of the convention in Kansas City, threw it halfway across the room.
You talk about dirty campaigns? We were in a dirty campaign, but at the end of it, Ronald Reagan supported the nominee of his party. Gerald Ford lost not because of Ronald Reagan. Gerald Ford lost because we had a bad candidate. But he supported the party nominee. Maybe that`s what we need to do now. And meanwhile, raise up the next leader in this party.
FENN: Yes. But don`t you guys think that really what has been going on here in the last eight years is that you had an administration that has cut corners. The Karl Rovian approach here has been to take those values and throw them out the...
BECK: Throw them out the window.
FENN: Other than two Supreme Court appointments.
BECK: Amy and I were talking earlier today. And, Amy, I am so glad to hear you say this. In 2004, everybody said, oh, the Republicans lost because of the war. And I was on the air saying, bullcrap, it`s not the war. They`ve sold out every value, especially when it comes to economics.
HOLMES: In 2006, Republicans lost because of spend, spend, spend. And you know, frankly, George Bush let it happen. And you know, some people even speculate that it was to, you know, buy off Republicans because of the Iraq War, that he needed their support, so here`s a Benny for you. Here`s the "bridge to nowhere."
FENN: So now the question is, is this -- McCain, is this the third term of a George Bush presidency?
BECK: Yes. Yes, it is.
HOLMES: I wouldn`t go that far. I think what has been really unusual, really extraordinary..
BECK: Where is he different?
HOLMES: Oh my.
BECK: Where is he different?
BECK: I can`t believe it. I`m with a guy who hangs out with Al Gore.
HOLMES: Well, we do -- we do know.
REAGAN: Glenn, Glenn, Glenn, if I could get into this.
BECK: Hang on.
HOLMES: I would say we do know that McCain supported the surge before George Bush did. That he opposed George Bush`s own secretary of defense. George Bush came around after the 2006.
FENN: But not on economics. On economics.
HOLMES: . election. And he opposed George Bush`s tax cuts when George Bush proposed them. So they are very different people. And that`s part of the problem right now.
BECK: That is not a good thing. Michael.
REAGAN: But, Glenn.
REAGAN: Glenn, I will tell you one thing. I mean, I talk about coalescing behind McCain and what have you. But the problem is with you or Rush or Ann or any one of these people is the fact that, you know, I think you all -- many of you are going to sit there and stay home.
The one thing about the Democrats is, if you vote for Hillary, you`ll accept Obama. If you vote for Obama, you`ll accept Hillary. They`re fighting a campaign but everybody on the Democratic side seems to like them.
On the Republican side, you like your candidate and you hate the other guy. And that is how they`ve been running the campaign. That`s why you see Huckabee where he is? Because he stayed away from that part of the fray.
HOLMES: I`m not so sure about that.
REAGAN: . and in fact that says a lot.
HOLMES: I`m not so sure about -- Obama`s supporters would hate Hillary. You talk to them, they are -- that is part of the reason why there is.
BECK: You think there is no love lost between Hillary and Obama, you`re out of your mind. And you know what.
HOLMES: Oh, no. The snub seen around the world.
REAGAN: Oh, no, no, but that vote, the Democrats will vote for her, Democrats will vote for her.
BECK: You know what.
FENN: Michael is right.
BECK: . Michael, I have lent my power and my voice to George W. Bush and the Republican Party long enough, I`m done. I want them to stand for what they say they stand for. I`m tired of being betrayed. You know what, you.
REAGAN: But that`s why you`re an independent.
BECK: That`s exactly right. That`s exactly right. And you know what, I think more people should be independent. I think you should divorce yourself from the Democrats and the Republicans, because they`re the same thing. They`re leading us to the same exact -- same place, except one is taking us on a plane and the other one is taking us on a steam train. We`ll be back in minute.
BECK: Well, we just talked to Governor Romney`s people. And they are continuing -- I don`t know how they are going to, you know, pick it up and win. I don`t know what the strategy is to beat John McCain at this point. Now we go to GOP presidential candidate Mike Huckabee, who is also staying in the race. He was told that it was a two-person race.
It is obviously a three-person race, you did well, Governor.
MIKE HUCKABEE (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Well, thank you, Glenn. We had a good night tonight. And where won was significant because we won where a person has to win in order to be president. If Republicans can`t carry states like Tennessee, Arkansas, West Virginia, those swing states, Alabama and Georgia, they`re not going to get elected.
And that`s what we had to show tonight, was that when it comes time to (INAUDIBLE), these are states you have to be able to win.
BECK: So where do you go from here? How do you put a win together to beat John McCain?
HUCKABEE: Well, until he gets 1,191 delegates, he`s not the nominee. He`s certainly the frontrunner, we acknowledge that. But there are a lot of states. And one of the things that will have to happen, people will need to decide who is in the best position to take this race, not just against John McCain, but against Hillary or Obama.
Nobody has ever run against the Clinton machine but me, and I`ve done it four times and won. So I understand something, if that`s (INAUDIBLE). And even with Obama, I think, you know, frankly I have got to capacity to take votes in normal Democrat places.
I got 48 percent of the African-American vote in my state. I`ve gotten the support union members and people that normally don`t Republican. But they vote convictions, they are Second Amendment supporters, they are pro-life, they believe in traditional marriage.
And so a lot of those folks are willing to support me, even if they are typical or traditional Republicans.
BECK: Governor, a couple of things. You say that McCain is obviously the frontrunner. I think those were your exact words. Yet while you were campaigning, you didn`t go after McCain, you went after Romney, why?
HUCKABEE: Well, because Romney had drawn first blood on me. You know, Romney went relentlessly and ruthlessly against me in Iowa, ran hundreds of thousands of dollars of attack ads, mostly misrepresenting my record as a governor, did the same thing to McCain in New Hampshire. And.
BECK: So are you saying that it was a blood.
HUCKABEE: . you know, that`s what it was about.
BECK: It was revenge? It wasn`t -- I mean, again, the frontrunner was McCain. You took more votes -- everybody has been saying that you were taking votes away from Romney. You ended up taking more votes away, it looks at this point, from McCain. Were you just -- this was a blood sport for you?
HUCKABEE: Well, you know, when people said I took from (INAUDIBLE), I believe this, people voted for me because they wanted me to be president. They voted for Mitt Romney because they wanted him to be president, or they voted for John McCain because they wanted him to be president.
And this idea that one of us has sort of an obligation to step aside, you know, there is a lot of people who have made incredible sacrifices for me to be in this race. I don`t have a lot of donors who can write $2,000 checks and not miss it.
Most of my donors are $20 and $30 and sometimes $5 donors. And it really does have an impact on them. You know, our mikehuckabee.com Web site has just been lit up like a Christmas tree, even over these last few days.
And if you can read some of the stories that people write in, you realize that they are not voting to just to say, I would like to see a Republican president, they are very committed, very loyal, very dedicated. And so I feel like I`ve got an obligation to them.
This isn`t about just the Republican Party, it`s about our country. And, you know, the Republican Party is of less consequence to me than America and making sure that we have a president that believes that we`ve got to protect human life, that we`ve got to stand for traditional marriage, that we have to keep taxes.
And of course, as you know, Glenn, I`m a big proponent of the fair tax, which I think would do more to revitalize the American economy and to keep jobs than anything.
BECK: I have to tell you, I`m surprised that the fair tax doesn`t play better than it does. I mean, I think it`s one of the best -- is the best tax idea that is out there.
HOLMES: Governor Huckabee, this is Amy Holmes asking you a question. Now you said that you won in states that Republicans need to win, and you know what, John McCain didn`t. So what would you say is his greatest vulnerability? What was it that you were able to trump?
HUCKABEE: You mean in terms of why we won those states?
HOLMES: Yes. What did John McCain not bring to the table that you did?
HUCKABEE: Well, there are still questions as to his position on immigration, embryonic stem cell research on humans, lack of support for the human life amendment. You know, there are a lot of people that really believe, as I do, that those are very, very important issues.
Now I don`t think that makes John McCain a liberal. I think when people call him a liberal, that`s really stretching it. I mean, compared to Barack Obama, he is no liberal. Compared to Hillary, he is no liberal. Maybe compared to me, he is not even liberal, he has just got some very different views and maybe they are not as conservative as mine.
But I think that is what we are trying to do, is to say, let`s not (INAUDIBLE) the party, let`s not create this fratricide. That doesn`t help us. What we do need to do is recognize at the end of the day, one of us is going to be the nominee, and we need to be able to join on that stage in Minneapolis-St. Paul, say to the nation, we have fought our -- through our primaries, we`ve had our differences, and now it`s time to unite and bring this country the kind of leadership that it can be proud of.
FENN: Governor, this is Peter Fenn. I just want to ask you one quick question, and that is, how do you think you are going to change your message as you go now to campaign against John McCain in the upcoming primaries?
HUCKABEE: Probably won`t change it a great deal, because I think people are gravitating to me not because they see something where I`m against John McCain. What they see is that I am a strong, clear, definite voice when it comes to issues that matter to them, whether it is the fair tax, whether it is the sanctity of life, the Second Amendment.
And I`m the one candidate who, on those issues and several, I think, have not only a resounding clarity in what I say, but an even more resounding clarity in a record that backs it up...
FENN: But do you compete.
HUCKABEE: . human life and a marriage amendment in my state, things that really people can look to and say, OK, he has not just talked about it, he has actually done it.
FENN: But do you think the economic issue is likely to be the most important issue now? Is that going to be the defining issue between the two of you?
HUCKABEE: I think it very well may be. And on that issue, I think I`ve got certainly the capacity to win that, because I have been governor for 10 1/2 years, that means you are responsible to help create the environment in which jobs come or jobs go.
I have steered the canoe through low water and high water, when we were in good times and bad. Led us from a $200 million deficit to a surplus of $850 million, and balanced the budget every year. That`s what you want a president to do. I`ve actually done it.
So on the very first day I sit in that office, I understand what it takes.
HUCKABEE: . to be able to bring that kind of economy back to this country.
BECK: Governor, good night for you. Thank you very much for joining us. Let`s go -- and now back to Atlanta with Erica Hill and find out what else is happening.
What is the latest, are you still on California or you have.
HILL: No. You know what I want to do is actually give you more of an entire picture of the country, because so many states are taking a part in Super Tuesday today. So let`s start off on the Republican side.
Here`s the map looking the Republican wins. As you can see, Senator McCain really running away with a lot of the delegates in this case. Want to break that out a little bit further for you.
I think we have the numbers for the actual -- the allocation, if you will, for the delegates. So you look at it where it stands right now. That is where we are. If you look quickly at the Democratic map, you are going to see that the number of delegates there seems really low, especially because California has 441 at stake.
They haven`t been doled out yet. We can call the state but not yet the delegates.
BECK: One last check here, live tonight, Erica Hill at the election update desk -- Erica.
HILL: OK. Glenn, so we are going to give you one last overview of how things have played out on this Super Tuesday. And we take a look first at the Republican map. You`re going to notice, it is color-coded here. So the red states, those are states that were being called for John McCain.
So you see, he kind of cuts this swathe across the country, doing well on both the West Coast and the East Coast. You see the southern states there, sort of that pinkish color? Those went to Huckabee. And then the ones that are left, more burgundy and maroon, if you will, those are all going to Romney. So that`s how it played out on the Republican side.
Want to give you a look at the Democratic side. You can see too the light blue is Senator Clinton. Those two yellow states haven`t been called yet. Obama is the darker blue. Clinton really doing well on the edges of the country as well, while Obama did really well in the Plains and in the Midwest.
Now what is interesting, though, is that we are far from done. As you just talked about with Governor Huckabee, and as we are seeing clearly from this Democratic map, that almost makes it look neck and neck when you look at the delegates, even though they haven`t all been parsed out yet, but there is another day coming up.
Next Tuesday, I don`t know if you`re busy, Glenn, Maryland and Virginia, though, having a contest or two, and maybe you would like to talk about them.
BECK: I`m sleeping.
HILL: You sure?
BECK: I`m sleeping.
HILL: Well, why don`t you check your calendar for this date, March 4th.
BECK: This one is big, yes.
HILL: Terrific Tuesday, as my producer John (ph) calls it. I call it a pretty good Tuesday. But these are really big contests: Ohio and Texas. And those are going to be key.
BECK: Are those winner-take-all?
HILL: I have to -- hold one second, and I`ll tell you.
BECK: Now wait a minute, they`ve got that big, huge CNN book around here someplace.
HILL: I do, I have it, you want to see it? Look, here it is.
BECK: Yes, do you know?
HILL: I`m going to look it up.
BECK: Peter, Amy?
HOLMES: I haven`t the faintest.
FENN: Obviously now with the Democrats, it`s 441 delegates for the Democrats, I know, in those March 4th states, which is really a huge number of delegates.
BECK: He`s bluffing, he has no idea.
FENN: Bluffing, me bluffing?
FENN: I don`t pay attention to Republicans.
BECK: Let me.
HOLMES: We use a magic 8-ball, yes.
BECK: All right. Let me go here. You know, if you go into Barack Obama, Barack Obama seems like the exciting candidate. He seems like the JFK of this generation. However, the economy is the big issue right now. And when you talk about the economy, it is easy for somebody to say, well, we give everybody health care and we`re going to cut everybody checks and everything else.
But if something happens overseas, if the surge doesn`t work all of a sudden, something happens, that guy is over, he`s a vapor, because nobody - - he is completely untested.
FENN: On foreign and defense policy, there is no question, I think, that Hillary would trump him in the campaign going forward, and would be a stronger candidate in the fall. I also think though, Glenn, that this is - - you know, this is kind of about the two Cs really.
I mean, change is awfully important, but competence. And I use that a little differently than experience. I think competence is a different word. And you know, I think he has shown himself to be quite competent as a campaigner, to be honest with you. I mean, he`s not doing bad.
BECK: But there`s.
FENN: But you know, this president has given competence a bad name, in my view.
BECK: There is another C, crabbiness.
BECK: I think John McCain is quite.
FENN: Going back to may be (ph) again.
BECK: No, he is quite possibly the crabbiest guy ever.
HOLMES: He certainly has that reputation. He yells at his colleagues. He screams profanities.
BECK: Holy cow.
HOLMES: You say the way that he was grimacing at Romney in that debate. But the good news.
BECK: All right.
HOLMES: The good news, Glenn, when I look at this, is the Republican contest is still about substance, Democrats is all about style.
BECK: All right.
BECK: America, good night! And good luck, oh.
HOLMES: May the Force be with you.
BECK: May the Force be with you, yes.