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Inside Politics

Kerry Wins Michigan, Wisconsin Caucuses; Bush Interviewed on Sunday Talk Shows

Aired February 08, 2004 - 10:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


ANNOUNCER: Live from Washington, this is INSIDE POLITICS SUNDAY.
JEANNE MESERVE, HOST: Hi. I'm Jeanne Meserve in Washington.

Politics doesn't take weekends off. And neither do we. Welcome to this edition of INSIDE POLITICS SUNDAY.

A busy month for the Democratic presidential candidates. After three contests this weekend there's still more to go. And President Bush conducted his first Sunday interview today. We'll get to that shortly.

But we begin with caucus results in two states, Michigan and Washington. With 100 percent of the votes counted in Michigan, it's another big win for John Kerry. He finished well ahead of his rivals with 52 percent of the votes. Howard Dean placed second with 17 percent, then John Edwards with 13 percent.

In Washington State, another Kerry triumph with 99 percent of the votes tallied there. The senator from Massachusetts is on top with 48 percent. Dean, second, with 30 percent. And Dennis Kucinich third, with 8 percent.

And here is how the delegate count stands. Kerry leads the pack with 412 delegates. Dean has 174. And Edwards is third with 116. It takes 2,161 delegates to win the nomination in Boston.

While celebrating second place finishes in both of yesterday's caucuses, Dean is coping with another setback. A major union, the American Federation of State, County and Municipal Employees has withdrawn its endorsement of the former Vermont governor. And at this hour, a key endorsement for John Kerry. He's expected to garner the support of Virginia governor, Mark Warner. Live coverage of that endorsement when it comes.

On today's election call calendar, the main caucuses. Voters down East are gathering in libraries and schools and fire and other places all across the state. They'll vote from 1:00 to 8:00 Eastern Time. Twenty-four delegate are at stake in the Pine Tree State. The first results are expected around 3:00 p.m. Eastern, and the final tally about six hours later. From 12,000 to 15,000 voters are expected to show up.

And now to Kerry's big night. He has little time to celebrate his victories in Michigan and Washington, as the election calendar keeps marching on. The latest from CNN's Kelly Wallace in Richmond, Virginia.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

KELLY WALLACE, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): With two more victories under his belt, a beaming John Kerry moves another step closer to the Democratic nomination.

SEN. JOHN KERRY (D-MA), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: And that is the same message that I am carrying to Virginia and to Tennessee and to the rest of this country. And that message is, George Bush's days are numbered. And change is on the way.

(APPLAUSE)

WALLACE: In his speech Saturday night to Virginia Democrats, Kerry sharpened his attacks on the Bush White House calling it, "extreme." The senator and his advisers admit they are trying to send this message: if President Bush and his top political aides try to paint Kerry as a Massachusetts liberal he will hit back hard.

KERRY: I have news this time for George Bush and Karl Rove and Ed Gillespie and the rest of their friends. I am not going to back down. I am one Democrat who knows how to fight back, and I have only just begun to fight.

WALLACE: The victories on top of an expected endorsement Sunday from Virginia's popular governor give the front-runner even more momentum going into Tuesday's contest in Virginia and Tennessee. While Kerry currently leads the polls in both states, North Carolina Senator John Edwards and retired General Wesley Clark of Arkansas are fighting hard to stop his stride. Clark tries to distinguish himself from Kerry's record of 20 years in Washington.

WESLEY CLARK (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I'm not a Washington insider. I'm a Washington outsider. While others have been talking and debating, I have been deciding and doing.

WALLACE: Edwards says he is a Democrat who will campaign and win in the South. A thinly veiled reference to Kerry's comments in New Hampshire that it is a mistake for Democrats to focus on the South.

SEN. JOHN EDWARDS (D-NC), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: They are tired of republicans taking the South for granted. They are tired of Democrats ignoring the South.

WALLACE: If Kerry wins Tuesday, he will not only prove he can win in the South, he could force either Edwards or Clark out of the race.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

WALLACE: And more good news for John Kerry. Tennessee -- one of Tennessee's largest newspapers is endorsing John Kerry over southerners John Edwards and Wesley Clark. For the past hour, John Kerry and Virginia governor, Mark Warner, have been inside the governor's mansion behind me watching President Bush on "Meet the Press." We are told the two men are expected to come out before cameras and reporters within the hour. And that is when Warner will publicly endorse John Kerry for president -- Jeanne.

MESERVE: Kelly, of course Kerry was talking about the president last night. He called him extreme. He called him out of the mainstream. What does that represent in terms of the Kerry campaign?

WALLACE: Well, there is a strategy here, Jeanne. They wanted to get the message to Republicans, but also to the Democratic Party faithful that they are going to fight back and fight back hard. If the Republicans try to attack John Kerry, and if they go after John Kerry, just as Republicans went after Michael Dukakis back in 1988, the Kerry campaign believes mistakes were made back in 1988, that the campaign did not fight back hard enough. So that's part of the strategy here.

Also, they know President Bush was going out for one hour early this morning. They wanted to get their story out as well -- Jeanne.

MESERVE: Kelly Wallace in Richmond, Virginia, thanks so much.

John Edwards is focusing on two key southern states this week and Wisconsin February 17, as he tries to stop the Kerry juggernaut.

Here's Phil Hirschhorn.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

PHIL HIRSCHHORN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Still battling for the Democratic nomination, John Edwards made his first trip of the year to Wisconsin, and made it clear he sees his opponent as George Bush.

EDWARDS: This president is at war with working people every single day, making their lives harder, making it more and more difficult every day for working people to have a voice, for working people to be able to organize.

HIRSCHHORN: The North Carolina Senator telling an audience packed with textile workers endorsing him that being a son of a mill worker makes him more sympathetic to their concerns.

EDWARDS: We are going to ban the hiring of permanent replacement for strikers and make it the law of the land.

HIRSCHHORN: Polls show Edwards battling Wesley Clark and Howard Dean for second place in the Wisconsin primary, but one out of five voters there say they're undecided.

EDWARDS: I think Wisconsin is still wide open.

HIRSCHHORN: So is the race, at least for second place, between Edwards and Clark in Virginia and Tennessee, which hold primaries Tuesday. Frontrunner John Kerry is ahead in both states. Edwards says a top two finish is all right with him and his campaign will go forward even without a win Tuesday. EDWARDS: I think that Tennessee and Virginia and Wisconsin are part of an ongoing process. I have always viewed this as a long-term race to the nomination. We have -- luckily for us, we have the money and resources to maintain a long-term effort for this nomination.

HIRSCHHORN: Edwards says the primary process now is about narrowing the presidential field to two Democrats. He believes he will be one of them.

Phil Hirschhorn, CNN, Richmond, Virginia.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

MESERVE: As we reported, Howard Dean's embattled campaign has suffered another blow. The American Federation of State, County and Municipal Employees has withdrawn its endorsement of him. But even as he copes with that setback, Dean is pushing ahead with a bid for a comeback. His target, Wisconsin.

CNN's Joe Johns reports.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JOE JOHNS, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Howard Dean came back to Vermont this weekend to see his son play hockey. But his main focus on the campaign trail now is the February 17 primary in Wisconsin, which a campaign e-mail said Dean must win or he could be out of the race. The e-mail asked for $700,000 for advertising, but Dean said it brought in much more.

HOWARD DEAN (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: And we are going to do everything we can to win Wisconsin.

JOHNS: The hope is that Wisconsin, with its history of progressive politics, can somehow jump-start this bid for the White House. But a handful of hastily arranged events there did little to lift the gloom of a campaign that so far has failed to win a single binding primary. The make-or-break appeal also added more uncertainty about Dean's future as a candidate. He took questions first on a radio show Friday, then Saturday on network TV, on whether he'd run for vice president on a ticket with John Kerry, for example.

DEAN: If John Kerry's the nominee I'm going to support him. Second of all, if John Kerry were the nominee, I would advise him not to pick me, because you don't need two people from New England on the ticket. I will do whatever I can, however, to help beat George Bush.

JOHNS: Another sign of trouble was Dean's decision to dial back his efforts in other states in order to camp out in Wisconsin.

DEAN: Our decision to fight here and to win here was made because we believe people are voting for Senator Kerry without knowing anything about him. This is going to be a fully contested, fully thought out primary, the first one since Iowa and New Hampshire.

JOHNS: Dean takes a quick trip to Maine on Sunday and then returns to Wisconsin to wage that do-or-die fight to try to win the primary.

Joe Johns, CNN, Burlington, Vermont.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

MESERVE: The battle for the South: who is leading in the race below the Mason-Dixon Line? We'll speak to campaign advisers for Kerry, Edwards and Clark next.

And later, if it's Sunday, it's meet the president. A rare interview with the commander in chief. We'll have details.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MESERVE: This Tuesday's southern primary shape up as critical elections for the men chasing John Kerry. Tennessee and Virginia are voting. And while Kerry is in the lead in both states, the race for number two is very close.

In Virginia, the American Research Group's poll shows Kerry in front with 35 percent. John Edwards at 22 percent. And Wesley Clark is third. The margin of error in that poll, plus or minus four points. In Tennessee, the same group shows Kerry with 32 percent, followed again by Edwards and Clark.

Now we talk to three insiders from those campaigns. In Chicago, David Axelrod. He's a media adviser to John Edwards. Mo Elleithee in Richmond, Virginia. He's a Virginia communications director for Wes Clark. And in Washington, Tad Devine, a senior adviser to Kerry.

Thank you all for coming in.

David Axelrod, let me start with you. Looking at yesterday's results, big wins for John Kerry in two states. Is it time to say it's all over? Isn't it an obvious conclusion at this point?

DAVID AXELROD, MEDIA ADVISER, EDWARDS CAMPAIGN: I think far from that, Jeanne. Well, first of all, let me congratulate Tad and Senator Kerry on a good day yesterday. They deserve congratulations for that.

As you know, we didn't contest those races. We were concentrating on Tuesday's contests in Tennessee and Virginia. As Senator Edwards said earlier on your show, we view this as a marathon, not a sprint.

You know, even after the Wisconsin primary, three quarters of the delegates will not have been selected. And I don't think the American people or the Democratic Party want to bring the curtain down on this race. Our goal is to get this down to a two-person race. We believe we are there effectively. We will be there, in fact, after the Wisconsin primary, and we look forward to that contest.

MESERVE: Mo Elleithee, let me ask you about this. Look, you've got this Kerry momentum going. We've got these polls that we just talked about, from Tennessee and Virginia, showing Kerry out in front. How do you stop him? MO ELLEITHEE, CLARK CAMPAIGN SPOKESMAN: Well, by simply taking our message directly to the voters here in Virginia and Tennessee and beyond. People in the South are just now starting to pay attention to this campaign. They are starting to focus on what is going on. And we've been campaigning hard across Tennessee and Virginia. We are getting tremendous response from the voters here. Because they see in Wes Clark someone who shares their values, someone who shares their background and someone who has got the leadership abilities that they are looking for. When you put these three candidates side by side, more and more people are moving to Wes Clark because they see he's the total package.

MESERVE: Tad Devine, in his speech last night, we saw Senator Kerry call out and call the president extreme, out of the mainstream. He wasn't talking about his Democratic rivals, he was talking about the president. Is this an indication that he has already decided he doesn't have to worry about the other guys in the Democratic pack?

TAD DEVINE, SENIOR ADVISER, KERRY CAMPAIGN: No, he's going to continue to do what he's been doing, which is campaign in every state. I think that's a big difference between the Democrats in this race and John Kerry right now. Iowa and New Hampshire were stand-alone events. We understood the premium there was to win a state. Now it's a different process. You have to campaign everywhere and try to win delegates everywhere. So he's going to keep focused on winning, running everywhere and winning everywhere.

MESERVE: David Axelrod, what about that? Is it a national campaign, if you look at a couple of primaries and say I'm not going to compete there?

AXELROD: Well, I think the nature of this -- the way this process is stacked up, you really have to apportion your resources and time strategically. John Kerry didn't spend a lot of dough in Michigan yesterday, because he didn't have to. He spent time elsewhere. We all make decisions like that because that -- there are too many -- simple too many primaries to cover them all, coming up as quickly as they are.

But the reality is, as I said, three-quarters of the delegates will still be available after February 17. And of course, March 2, so-called soup Tuesday is a bonanza of delegates.

So there's still a great opportunity for our campaign to win the nomination. That's why we're going to continue in this race. We think the Democratic Party deserves the best candidate, and we ought to have that contest and find out who the best candidate is.

MESERVE: Both Clark and Edwards have put a lot of emphasis on Virginia and Tennessee, the two primaries that are coming up. Mr. Elleithee, let me ask you, if your candidate doesn't win in either of those states, is it over?

ELLEITHEE: Well, we're going to do well here in Virginia and we're going to do well in Tennessee.

MESERVE: Is a number two slot good enough?

ELLEITHEE: I think we're going to finish as well as we can. We see a lot of momentum on the ground in both states. We're playing hard, we're playing to win in both states, and we fully expect to move forward, to compete in Wisconsin and beyond.

We are running a national campaign. And again, I think Wes Clark's message is resonating all over the country. And that's really going to springboard from here in Virginia and Tennessee.

MESERVE: You know, Mo, another question for you. Yesterday, we saw General Clark come out and attack John Edwards and his support of veterans, or lack of support of veterans as he put it. When you have the two people, Clark and Edwards, going after one another, does that all work to John Kerry's advantage?

ELLEITHEE: Well, I think elections are about choices. And we have got three candidates, really, here in this race, and all of them are good men, all of them would be better choices than George Bush, but there are differences between them, and it's important to point out those differences. Wes Clark has been -- Wes Clark has been in public service for 34 years. He is a veteran. There are some differences with the way John Edwards voted when it comes to veteran issues, and those are the kinds of things that should come up in a campaign.

MESERVE: You wanted quickly to respond there, David? I want to get to Tad here, but...

AXELROD: Yes, I just want to say, we are not going after Wes Clark. One of the hallmarks of the Edwards campaign, one of the deeply held beliefs is that we ought not to be ripping each other up as Democrats. That we want -- that Democrats want a candidate who will defeat George Bush and lift this country up. And that's what our campaign is about. Everybody has to make their own choices. The Clark campaign made theirs, we are going to make ours.

MESERVE: Want to ask you, Tad, about this AFSCME move yesterday to withdraw its endorsement of Howard Dean. AFSCME didn't appear to do a great deal for him, even with their support he didn't get a win. How significant is this development?

DEVINE: Well, I think it's important. They are a very, very important union. Their leadership is amongst the most important leadership in organized labor. So I think whenever that happens to a campaign, that's got to be a big setback.

MESERVE: Are you going to get them? Are you going to get the Gephardt labor supporters?

DEVINE: I don't know. It seems that some of these organizations are coming with Senator Kerry. I think they're impressed, not just by the fact that he's winning, but what he's talking about. He's talking about jobs, he's talking about health care. He's talking about a stronger America. He's talking about the environment. So I think if he keeps talking about these issues, I think we will win more and more support.

MESERVE: OK, Ted Devine, David Axelrod and Mo Elleithee, thank you all for joining us.

DEVINE: Thank you.

AXELROD: Thank you.

MESERVE: And straight ahead, the first ever Sunday interview with President Bush, and Senator John Kerry shared this preview with reporters.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KERRY: They are going to say that he looked smart, he looked presidential, knew what he -- knew -- knew his -- he knew his foreign policy and domestic policy. Of course we're talking about Tim Russert.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MESERVE: CNN White House correspondent Dana Bash has the real story when we return.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MESERVE: If you had any doubts that the presidential campaign is in full swing, you can now set those aside. President Bush is talking on NBC's "Meet the Press" this morning. In fact, it's his first ever Sunday talk show appearance since becoming president. CNN's Dana Bash is at the White House with all the details -- Dana.

DANA BASH, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Hi, Jeanne. And you know, of course, weapons of mass destruction, not finding them in Iraq has become a huge issue out on the campaign trail. And what we saw from the president during the one-hour interview on NBC this morning was the change, if you will, in the way the White House is handling that issue politically.

You saw, of course, the president on Friday say that there is going to be this new seven-member commission to look into pre-war intelligence. Today when the president was asked about weapons of mass destruction not being found, he just came out and said, correct, acknowledging that, which is something we certainly hadn't seen from the White House in the weeks and months before.

But he also suggested that what he used in terms of the intelligence that he used on Iraq was basically the best that he had, and that he did acknowledge that he was surprised that the weapons were not found.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: First of all, I expected to find the weapons. Sitting behind this desk, making a very difficult decision of war and peace, and I based my decision on the best intelligence possible. Intelligence that had been gathered over the years. Intelligence that not only our analysts thought was valid, but analysts from other countries thought was valid.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BASH: And Jeanne, we heard what is becoming an evolving change, if you will, in the rationale for war. The president saying now that he believes Saddam Hussein at least had the capacity to make weapons of mass destruction based on what David Kay, the former weapons inspector, is saying, that's quite different, of course, than what we heard before the war, essentially making it clear that perhaps it was a more dire threat from what was coming from Iraq.

But he used the word war, Jeanne, 26 times in the beginning of that interview. Clearly what the White House is trying to do politically here is to have the president out there saying, look, I was sitting in the Oval Office, I have sort of the weight of the world on my shoulders, if you will, and it's my responsibility to protect the American people, and I did what I thought was right. That's something we're going to hear a lot more from the president in the weeks and months to come.

MESERVE: Dana, Democrats, notably Terry McAuliffe, have said, alleged in recent days that the president was AWOL during his service in the National Guard. What did the president have to say about that today?

BASH: Well, Jeanne, it was the first time we've heard the president respond to that, at least in this election cycle. And the allegation is that there was a period within the year of 1972 that essentially that perhaps the president didn't show up for service, while he was in Alabama.

What the president said is that this has come up in every election he has run in since he was running for governor in 1994, he said it is basically false. That he did complete his service. And he also said that anybody that wants to look at those records to prove it certainly can, but he did acknowledge that there has been trouble finding some of those records. But he said to anybody who alleges that he didn't complete his duty, this is what his answer was.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BUSH: They are just wrong. There may need be no evidence, but I did report. Otherwise I wouldn't have been honorably discharged. In other words, you don't just say I did something without there being verification. Military doesn't work that way. I got an honorable discharge, and I did show up in Alabama.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BASH: And the president did say that he left early. He left the service early in order to go to Harvard Business School, but that that was allowed. And he did say what we heard from aides over the past couple of days, which is that he -- he cautioned or he said that the Democrats should be cautious in making any kind of connection between National Guard service and perhaps leaving the country to go to Canada, something that John Kerry suggested last week. He said he should be very careful about that, because there are lots of people in the National Guard who are serving this country at this time -- Jeanne.

MESERVE: The president was also asked about some comments John Kerry has made, the quote is, "all of a sudden he's the Marlboro man. I know this guy. He was two years behind me at Yale. I knew him, and he's still the same guy." What did the president have to say about that?

BASH: Well, it's interesting. He said he didn't know John Kerry at Yale. He even joked about the fact that he couldn't discuss whether or not they were -- they had some of the same secrets from the Skull and Bones secret fraternity that they were in at Yale. But he was very reluctant, Jeanne, even to go there, if you will, on John Kerry, saying that he's not the Democratic nominee yet. He would simply say that all of the allegations we are hearing from the campaign trail about the president, that he is not sort of ready for prime-time, if you will, it's the same thing, he said if you close your eyes, it's the same thing you heard in 2000.

But one thing he did say, as you can imagine, when he was asked whether or not he will even entertain the idea of losing, he said he wouldn't, he said he's not going to lose and he's prepared to have a very strong campaign in this coming year, as you can imagine, Jeanne.

MESERVE: Great, Dana Bash at the White House, thanks so much.

And right now, outside the state house in Richmond, Virginia, governor -- the governor of Virginia, John Warner, is talking -- excuse me, Mark Warner, is giving his endorsement to John Kerry. We'll be going to that in just a moment when we come back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MESERVE: Virginia's primary just 48 hours away, and today the governor, Mark Warner, has come out and thrown his support to John Kerry. John Kerry speaking outside the state house in Richmond right now. Let's listen in.

(JOINED IN PROGRESS)

KERRY: ...what the president and his administration told the American people throughout 2002. Back then, President Bush repeatedly told the American people that Saddam Hussein -- quote -- "has got chemical weapons."

They told us they could deploy those weapons within 45 minutes to do injury to our troops. They told us they had aerial vehicles and the capacity to be able to deliver those weapons through the air. And it was on that basis that he sent Americans, sons and daughters, off to war.

Now the president is giving us a new reason for sending people to war. And the problem is not just that he is changing his story now, it is that -- it appears that he was telling the American people stories in 2002. He told America that Iraq had chemical weapons two months after his own defense intelligence agency told him there was -- quote -- "no reliable information on whether Iraq is producing and stockpiling chemical weapons."

I once again call on the president to have a legitimate and immediate investigation into the extraordinary failure of intelligence or to help explain to the American people whether there was politics involved in the development of that intelligence. I respect the fact that the president has asked for a commission that will look at all of the intelligence agencies.

But that's not what America has asked for. What Americans asked for and what we need is an explanation of what happened to our intelligence with respect to this war. There aren't that many people to talk to, there's not that long a trail to trace, and it ought to be able to be done in a matter of months and it needs to be done in order to provide America with a clear understanding of what our intelligence status is and of how we went to war.

MESERVE: John Kerry speaking in Richmond, Virginia. President Bush, of course, speaking this morning on "Meet the Press," hoping to put the issue of weapons of mass destruction to rest. John Kerry clearly hoping he hasn't and bringing that up once again.

Once again, Kerry endorsed this morning by Virginia's governor, Mark Warner, with the Virginia primary just 48 hours away.

And the Democratic leader of the pack, John Kerry is used to criticism from his fellow candidates. But now the Republicans believe they've found his Achilles heel.

CNN's senior political analyst, Bill Schneider, has the story behind the story.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

WILLIAM SCHNEIDER, CNN SR. POLITICAL ANALYST (voice-over): John Kerry is, by just about any definition, that most exotic of political creatures, a Massachusetts liberal -- which means, Republican operatives believe, easy prey.

ED GILLESPIE, RNC CHAIRMAN: Americans for Democratic Action, the premier liberal rating organization, has given John Kerry a lifetime rating of 93 percent. Ted Kennedy has a lifetime rating of 88 percent, five points less. Who would have guessed it? Ted Kennedy is the conservative senator from Massachusetts.

SCHNEIDER: If Kerry is the Democratic nominee, Republicans expect to turn him into another Michael Dukakis, a criminal-coddling, ACLU-loving, furlough-granting, death penalty-opposing, tax-raising, pledge of allegiance-objecting, politically correct liberal elitist. Kerry speaks French for goodness sake and he was once Dukakis' lieutenant governor.

But Kerry is also a decorated war hero and a former prosecutor. And something else. He is not a wimp.

KERRY: And if George Bush wants to make national security the centerpiece of this campaign, we have three words for him that we know he understands -- bring it on.

SCHNEIDER: Dukakis got the wimp image in 1988 because he let the elder George Bush, who was supposed to be the wimpy candidate, beat him up. Kerry is not about to make that mistake.

DAVID GERGEN, U.S. NEWS & WORLD REPORT: This is not a Michael Dukakis. He is going to put up a fight.

SCHNEIDER: You bet he will.

KERRY: If they want to choose some kind of web -- you know, wedge sort of issue and distort my position, I will fight back very clearly.

SCHNEIDER: Kerry would certainly look a lot better in a tank than Dukakis did -- maybe even better than George W. Bush did on an aircraft carrier.

KERRY: Some of us know something about aircraft carriers for real.

SCHNEIDER: One other difference from 1988 -- this George Bush is the incumbent president, defending an uncertain economy and a controversial record. The 2004 election will be a referendum on him, not on his Democratic opponent.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SCHNEIDER: Republicans believe they know how to run against the Massachusetts Democrat. But Democrats have some experience electing a Massachusetts senator who is wealthy, well-bred and a war hero -- one who happened to have the same initials John Forbes Kerry -- Jeanne.

MESERVE: Front page of every paper this week -- gay marriage, Massachusetts -- how does this impact Kerry, if at all?

SCHNEIDER: Yes. Well, Kerry has said he disagrees with the Massachusetts supreme judicial court decision. However, back in 1996, he voted against the Defensive of Marriage Act, which would -- which put the federal government on record as opposing gay marriages and was signed into law by Bill Clinton. So he has a difficult time with that issue.

But so does George W. Bush. George W. Bush has very carefully avoided backing a constitutional amendment. Why? Because our polling, just released, shows today 62 percent of Americans oppose recognition of gay marriages as legal. On the other hand, when asked, Would you support a constitutional amendment to ban gay marriages, it's an even split. It's a dangerous issue for both sides.

MESERVE: Bill Schneider, thanks a lot for the insight.

SCHNEIDER: OK.

MESERVE: And now for our Sunday edition of "Campaign News Daily."

Democrats in Tennessee throw a primary party for presidential candidates. The guest lists includes former Vice President Al Gore, Tennessee Governor Phil Bredesen and other prominent Democrats. Wesley Clark and John Edwards also RSVP'ed.

The Clark campaign races against the clock in a push to catch up. The former general will visit six cities in a 12-hour period. Among the stops, the D-Day memorial at Bedford, Virginia; church services in Memphis, Tennessee, campaign stops near Racine, Wisconsin.

Howard Dean concentrates on Wisconsin. The former Vermont governor is spending a little time in Maine today, and appears on two TV talk shows, including CNN, before moving on. Dean is forgoing a major effort in Virginia and Tennessee.

MESERVE: Coming up, brewing up a Sunday dose of "The Morning Grind, looking ahead to Wisconsin.

And later, Jon Stewart, Jay Leno and David Letterman cash in on the candidates.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DAVID LETTERMAN, CBS "THE LATE SHOW" HOST: Howard Dean was at a fish market in Seattle catching fish. And -- and he did so well that next week he starts full time. That's what he'll be doing.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MESERVE: Welcome back. And here with our Sunday cup of "The Morning Grind," CNN political editor, John Mercurio.

John, thanks a lot for coming in.

JOHN MERCURIO, CNN POLITICAL EDITOR: Thank you.

MESERVE: Busy weekend where labor is concerned. You can AFCSME saying, Oh, Howard Dean no more. You had Gephardt, who's had union support, moving his support to Kerry.

Where do the unions go?

MERCURIO: I think it's sort of an open question at this point, what sort or support or what sort of effect is they have. But the Alliance for Economic Justice, which is a -- or, a group of 18 unions that had backed Dick Gephardt are going to be getting behind John Kerry, sources are telling me. They have polled -- they have polling that's out right now. They're trying to determine where their representative sit. But on Wednesday, they're going to be meeting for a conference call -- the general presidents are -- and they'll be getting behind John Kerry, probably sometime later this week.

MESERVE: Maine, caucusing today. No polling up there. Any clue what we should expect?

MERCURIO: Twenty-four delegates at stake. I talked to the state party chairwoman yesterday. She told me that John Kerry and Howard Dean both have probably the strongest organizations, but she and a lot of others Democrats that I've talked to said not to count out Dennis Kucinich -- not necessarily a winner, but probably a strong third place.

You got to remember that Maine, as Jeanne knows pretty well, is a state with a strong Green Party -- how Ralph Nader got 6 percent up there. The gubernatorial candidate from the Green Party got 9 percent last year. And Kucinich has been making a big draw towards the Green Party, urging them to switch to the Democrats to vote -- to vote for him.

If he pulls it out, it actually could be an interesting show for him, a strong play in that state.

MESERVE: Everybody is looking at Wisconsin, already looking at there, because Dean has said do or die.

MERCURIO: Right.

MESERVE: Is he going to be able to do it?

MERCURIO: Yes, it's his last stand and if the polling that we have today proves to be omniscient or prescient, or whatever the word is...

MESERVE: Accurate?

MERCURIO: ...then -- accurate -- then -- then it would be his -- it would be a fall. John Kerry right now has 41 percent; Wes Clark in second place with 15; John Edwards in third place with 10 percent. Obviously, Dean at 9 percent. If he were to make a comeback and win in Wisconsin, we would have a whole new comeback story, I think, and....

MESERVE: Given the numbers there, why did he pick Wisconsin as a place to make the stand?

MERCURIO: I think he saw Wisconsin as a state with a lot of progressives, much like Washington state yesterday -- his showing yesterday in Washington, his second place in Washington must not have been very encouraging for how he's going to do in Wisconsin.

MESERVE: OK. John Mercurio, thanks a lot for coming in. And for the best daily briefing on politics, brew up "The Morning Grind" on your computer. Log on to cnn.com/grind for the latest political news.

And just ahead, a presidential grilling. George Bush sits down for his first Sunday interview. Donna Brazile and Jonah Goldberg debate his performance and talk about the Democrats when we come back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MESERVE: There may be many more surprises ahead in campaign 2004. Some may emerge from the Democrats on the way to the nomination, others from President Bush's campaign.

Taking stock now, Donna Brazile, Democratic strategist. And Jonah Goldberg, editor of National Review Online.

Thanks a lot both for coming in.

Donna, I'll give you your chance first. The president this morning on "Meet the Press," trying to put these issues about weapons of mass destruction in Iraq to rest. Did he do it?

DONNA BRAZILE, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: No, I don't think so.

I think the president today began to explain his decision making and his -- perhaps his timeline of how he got to the point were he rushed the country to war. I think this opens up a lot of -- more questions that the president needs to understand, the Democrats, well as the media, will raise about his decision to bring the country into war with faulty intelligence.

The other fact is, is that he has delayed the report now until next -- next May. That's too long. We should have an annual report before September 11 to understand what happened with -- again, another intelligence failure.

MESERVE: Jonah, I have to give you your chance to fire back here.

JONAH GOLDBERG, NATIONAL REVIEW ONLINE: I think what we've seen in the last couple of weeks with David Kay, with George Tenet's speech, and now with President Bush this morning, is that the sort of standard Democratic line that we have seen, primarily from people like Ted Kennedy, that this was all a lie, that the data was cooked, they cooked the books, they hyped it all -- I think that is starting to melt the way, and the issue is going to be did George Bush make the right decision given the information he had at the time?

Now, obviously I don't think the White House wants to have this debate at all. But I don't think that's necessarily a losing debate, either. If John Kerry wants to take the other side and say that he would he rather have trusted Saddam Hussein, given the information that they had, I think Kerry loses that argument. And it's a good argument for the Republicans. BRAZILE: Well, Colin Powell, before he was reprimanded or told to recant his story, said had he known what he knows today, he would not have supported the decision to go to war. So I think this is a legitimate area of concern on behalf of the entire American people, and this -- gain, this is about the president, the intelligence, the intelligence that was shared. Did they cook the books? And if so, why.

MESERVE: Is this an issue that sustains steam for the Democrats from now until November?

BRAZILE: Well, national security will be a major issue in this presidential election, and I think in the context of keeping America safe and secure, I think Democrats can raise now some fresh new issues around this whole intelligence blunder.

Look, this is not just the rush to war in Iraq. It's also our response to September 11. We mowed down all of our allies in rushing to this war, and I think the Democrats should raise this issue in the presidential -- context of the presidential campaign.

MESERVE: Why did the president do this -- sit down for an hour with Tim Russert? Does it show just how worried his camp is?

GOLDBERG: I think so. I mean, I think a lot of the playbook that the White House has had from expecting Howard Dean to have it to expecting a long primary fight -- a lot of these things haven't happened. The public debate has been such that I think the White House felt it had to get out in front of this.

And again, I would just simply say to Donna that there's a difference between of acquisition of cooking the boxes, or, as Ted Kennedy says, "a lie hatched in Texas," and saying that the intelligence turned out to be wrong. It seems to me now that the debate is changing -- that people actually do see the distinction between those two, and I think it helps George Bush quite a bit if we can get past this whole cooking the books thing and say that George Bush simply made the best decision possible given the information. And I think that's a good debate.

MESERVE: Two primaries yesterday, big wins for John Kerry.

BRAZILE: Well, look....

MESERVE: Is he it?

BRAZILE: He's running a national campaign. His campaign is very disciplined, very organized. He's now refueling his campaign. He has a lot of money, a lot of momentum. I think he'll win the Maine caucuses today. I believe he'll win Tennessee and Virginia next week. On to D.C. and Nevada.

John Kerry will accumulate enough delegates going into the crucial Super Tuesday primary to clench the nomination.

GOLDBERG: Yes, I mean, I think -- look, it's very hard to see how Kerry doesn't get it. I think --what do they say? -- the smell of almonds is the smell of a wound going bad. Well, for presidential campaigns -- when Howard Dean does something like actually talk about whether or not he would take the vice presidential slot, it is the stink of death coming off of that campaign. He's got one shot in Wisconsin to just get back in the news -- not necessarily to win anything -- and I don't think he's going do that either. So I think it's over.

MESERVE: A new CNN-TIME poll matching up Kerry and Bush. And essentially, it's a dead heat here. Those numbers are going to change.

BRAZILE: Very competitive election. We all know that. The country is equally divided between the two major political parties. This will be a very difficult race regardless of who the nominee is on the Democratic side.

GOLDBERG: Yes, I think that's right. If you look at the actual electoral map, it's very hard not to come up with some sort of 267 to 271 kind of scenario with the electoral map.

BRAZILE: Not again. Not again.

MESERVE: Who is the vice president, presuming Kerry is the nominee? Is the Democratic vice presidential pick going to have any big impact?

BRAZILE: He has a long bench to look at. You have Bill Richardson, Janet Napolitano, Dick Gephardt, John Edwards, Wesley Clark -- I mean, I can go on and on and on.

MESERVE: And who's your favorite on that list?

BRAZILE: Well, I have a favorite, but I'm going to hold it to myself this time.

GOLDBERG: I mean, technically (ph) my favorite would be someone like Howard Dean and just watch them go down like the Titanic.

But ....

MESERVE: Not to be partisan (UNINTELLIGIBLE)

GOLDBERG: I do think what's interesting is that polling shows that Edwards can't even bring North Carolina for a Kerry ticket, but Bayh -- Even Bayh, Senator Evan Bayh, could probably bring Indiana, which would be big news, but feminists don't like his record on abortion. So that may not happen.

BRAZILE: Well, then, I should add Bob Graham, because we'll maybe finally get Florida this time, you know?

MESERVE: OK. Donna and Jonah, thank you both for coming in.

GOLDBERG: Thank you.

MESERVE: And coming up, it's "Must-See IP" -- great late-night laughs from the campaign trail.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LETTERMAN: Here we go. Top ten things never before said by a presidential candidate.

No. 10...

EDWARDS: Vote for me or I'll slash your tires.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MESERVE: A sense of humor is a key requirement for candidates on the long and arduous campaign trail, and some late-night comics make sure the Democrats don't take themselves too seriously.

Here's this week's sampling.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

LETTERMAN: Top 10 things never before said by a presidential candidate. No. 10...

EDWARDS: Vote for me or I'll slash your tires.

JAY LENO, HOST, NBC "THE TONIGHT SHOW": Do you know that name of Kerry's bus? His campaign bus? "The Real Deal Express." That's the name of his campaign bus.

Do you know the name of Dennis Kucinich's campaign bus? Greyhound.

EDWARDS: Forget universal health care, I'm buying every American an X-Box.

LETTERMAN: Wow. Not a bad...

JON STEWART, HOST, "THE DAILY SHOW": In South Carolina, Senator John Edwards won handily, fulfilling his promise to win every state he was born in.

LETTERMAN: No. 6...

EDWARDS: If your last name begins with M through Z, sorry, your taxes are doubling.

LETTERMAN: Howard Dean was at a fish market in Seattle catching fish. And -- and he did so well that next week he starts full time. That's what he will be doing.

EDWARDS: Lady, that is one ugly baby.

CLARK: Oklahoma is OK by me!

STEWART: Ah. Ah. Ah. Ah. I get it.

LETTERMAN: And the No. 1 thing never before said by a presidential candidate...

EDWARDS: Read my lips, no new wardrobe malfunctions.

LETTERMAN: There you go.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

MESERVE: And that's INSIDE POLITICS Sunday for this weekend.

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on Sunday Talk Shows>


Aired February 8, 2004 - 10:00   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
ANNOUNCER: Live from Washington, this is INSIDE POLITICS SUNDAY.
JEANNE MESERVE, HOST: Hi. I'm Jeanne Meserve in Washington.

Politics doesn't take weekends off. And neither do we. Welcome to this edition of INSIDE POLITICS SUNDAY.

A busy month for the Democratic presidential candidates. After three contests this weekend there's still more to go. And President Bush conducted his first Sunday interview today. We'll get to that shortly.

But we begin with caucus results in two states, Michigan and Washington. With 100 percent of the votes counted in Michigan, it's another big win for John Kerry. He finished well ahead of his rivals with 52 percent of the votes. Howard Dean placed second with 17 percent, then John Edwards with 13 percent.

In Washington State, another Kerry triumph with 99 percent of the votes tallied there. The senator from Massachusetts is on top with 48 percent. Dean, second, with 30 percent. And Dennis Kucinich third, with 8 percent.

And here is how the delegate count stands. Kerry leads the pack with 412 delegates. Dean has 174. And Edwards is third with 116. It takes 2,161 delegates to win the nomination in Boston.

While celebrating second place finishes in both of yesterday's caucuses, Dean is coping with another setback. A major union, the American Federation of State, County and Municipal Employees has withdrawn its endorsement of the former Vermont governor. And at this hour, a key endorsement for John Kerry. He's expected to garner the support of Virginia governor, Mark Warner. Live coverage of that endorsement when it comes.

On today's election call calendar, the main caucuses. Voters down East are gathering in libraries and schools and fire and other places all across the state. They'll vote from 1:00 to 8:00 Eastern Time. Twenty-four delegate are at stake in the Pine Tree State. The first results are expected around 3:00 p.m. Eastern, and the final tally about six hours later. From 12,000 to 15,000 voters are expected to show up.

And now to Kerry's big night. He has little time to celebrate his victories in Michigan and Washington, as the election calendar keeps marching on. The latest from CNN's Kelly Wallace in Richmond, Virginia.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

KELLY WALLACE, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): With two more victories under his belt, a beaming John Kerry moves another step closer to the Democratic nomination.

SEN. JOHN KERRY (D-MA), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: And that is the same message that I am carrying to Virginia and to Tennessee and to the rest of this country. And that message is, George Bush's days are numbered. And change is on the way.

(APPLAUSE)

WALLACE: In his speech Saturday night to Virginia Democrats, Kerry sharpened his attacks on the Bush White House calling it, "extreme." The senator and his advisers admit they are trying to send this message: if President Bush and his top political aides try to paint Kerry as a Massachusetts liberal he will hit back hard.

KERRY: I have news this time for George Bush and Karl Rove and Ed Gillespie and the rest of their friends. I am not going to back down. I am one Democrat who knows how to fight back, and I have only just begun to fight.

WALLACE: The victories on top of an expected endorsement Sunday from Virginia's popular governor give the front-runner even more momentum going into Tuesday's contest in Virginia and Tennessee. While Kerry currently leads the polls in both states, North Carolina Senator John Edwards and retired General Wesley Clark of Arkansas are fighting hard to stop his stride. Clark tries to distinguish himself from Kerry's record of 20 years in Washington.

WESLEY CLARK (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I'm not a Washington insider. I'm a Washington outsider. While others have been talking and debating, I have been deciding and doing.

WALLACE: Edwards says he is a Democrat who will campaign and win in the South. A thinly veiled reference to Kerry's comments in New Hampshire that it is a mistake for Democrats to focus on the South.

SEN. JOHN EDWARDS (D-NC), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: They are tired of republicans taking the South for granted. They are tired of Democrats ignoring the South.

WALLACE: If Kerry wins Tuesday, he will not only prove he can win in the South, he could force either Edwards or Clark out of the race.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

WALLACE: And more good news for John Kerry. Tennessee -- one of Tennessee's largest newspapers is endorsing John Kerry over southerners John Edwards and Wesley Clark. For the past hour, John Kerry and Virginia governor, Mark Warner, have been inside the governor's mansion behind me watching President Bush on "Meet the Press." We are told the two men are expected to come out before cameras and reporters within the hour. And that is when Warner will publicly endorse John Kerry for president -- Jeanne.

MESERVE: Kelly, of course Kerry was talking about the president last night. He called him extreme. He called him out of the mainstream. What does that represent in terms of the Kerry campaign?

WALLACE: Well, there is a strategy here, Jeanne. They wanted to get the message to Republicans, but also to the Democratic Party faithful that they are going to fight back and fight back hard. If the Republicans try to attack John Kerry, and if they go after John Kerry, just as Republicans went after Michael Dukakis back in 1988, the Kerry campaign believes mistakes were made back in 1988, that the campaign did not fight back hard enough. So that's part of the strategy here.

Also, they know President Bush was going out for one hour early this morning. They wanted to get their story out as well -- Jeanne.

MESERVE: Kelly Wallace in Richmond, Virginia, thanks so much.

John Edwards is focusing on two key southern states this week and Wisconsin February 17, as he tries to stop the Kerry juggernaut.

Here's Phil Hirschhorn.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

PHIL HIRSCHHORN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Still battling for the Democratic nomination, John Edwards made his first trip of the year to Wisconsin, and made it clear he sees his opponent as George Bush.

EDWARDS: This president is at war with working people every single day, making their lives harder, making it more and more difficult every day for working people to have a voice, for working people to be able to organize.

HIRSCHHORN: The North Carolina Senator telling an audience packed with textile workers endorsing him that being a son of a mill worker makes him more sympathetic to their concerns.

EDWARDS: We are going to ban the hiring of permanent replacement for strikers and make it the law of the land.

HIRSCHHORN: Polls show Edwards battling Wesley Clark and Howard Dean for second place in the Wisconsin primary, but one out of five voters there say they're undecided.

EDWARDS: I think Wisconsin is still wide open.

HIRSCHHORN: So is the race, at least for second place, between Edwards and Clark in Virginia and Tennessee, which hold primaries Tuesday. Frontrunner John Kerry is ahead in both states. Edwards says a top two finish is all right with him and his campaign will go forward even without a win Tuesday. EDWARDS: I think that Tennessee and Virginia and Wisconsin are part of an ongoing process. I have always viewed this as a long-term race to the nomination. We have -- luckily for us, we have the money and resources to maintain a long-term effort for this nomination.

HIRSCHHORN: Edwards says the primary process now is about narrowing the presidential field to two Democrats. He believes he will be one of them.

Phil Hirschhorn, CNN, Richmond, Virginia.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

MESERVE: As we reported, Howard Dean's embattled campaign has suffered another blow. The American Federation of State, County and Municipal Employees has withdrawn its endorsement of him. But even as he copes with that setback, Dean is pushing ahead with a bid for a comeback. His target, Wisconsin.

CNN's Joe Johns reports.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JOE JOHNS, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Howard Dean came back to Vermont this weekend to see his son play hockey. But his main focus on the campaign trail now is the February 17 primary in Wisconsin, which a campaign e-mail said Dean must win or he could be out of the race. The e-mail asked for $700,000 for advertising, but Dean said it brought in much more.

HOWARD DEAN (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: And we are going to do everything we can to win Wisconsin.

JOHNS: The hope is that Wisconsin, with its history of progressive politics, can somehow jump-start this bid for the White House. But a handful of hastily arranged events there did little to lift the gloom of a campaign that so far has failed to win a single binding primary. The make-or-break appeal also added more uncertainty about Dean's future as a candidate. He took questions first on a radio show Friday, then Saturday on network TV, on whether he'd run for vice president on a ticket with John Kerry, for example.

DEAN: If John Kerry's the nominee I'm going to support him. Second of all, if John Kerry were the nominee, I would advise him not to pick me, because you don't need two people from New England on the ticket. I will do whatever I can, however, to help beat George Bush.

JOHNS: Another sign of trouble was Dean's decision to dial back his efforts in other states in order to camp out in Wisconsin.

DEAN: Our decision to fight here and to win here was made because we believe people are voting for Senator Kerry without knowing anything about him. This is going to be a fully contested, fully thought out primary, the first one since Iowa and New Hampshire.

JOHNS: Dean takes a quick trip to Maine on Sunday and then returns to Wisconsin to wage that do-or-die fight to try to win the primary.

Joe Johns, CNN, Burlington, Vermont.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

MESERVE: The battle for the South: who is leading in the race below the Mason-Dixon Line? We'll speak to campaign advisers for Kerry, Edwards and Clark next.

And later, if it's Sunday, it's meet the president. A rare interview with the commander in chief. We'll have details.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MESERVE: This Tuesday's southern primary shape up as critical elections for the men chasing John Kerry. Tennessee and Virginia are voting. And while Kerry is in the lead in both states, the race for number two is very close.

In Virginia, the American Research Group's poll shows Kerry in front with 35 percent. John Edwards at 22 percent. And Wesley Clark is third. The margin of error in that poll, plus or minus four points. In Tennessee, the same group shows Kerry with 32 percent, followed again by Edwards and Clark.

Now we talk to three insiders from those campaigns. In Chicago, David Axelrod. He's a media adviser to John Edwards. Mo Elleithee in Richmond, Virginia. He's a Virginia communications director for Wes Clark. And in Washington, Tad Devine, a senior adviser to Kerry.

Thank you all for coming in.

David Axelrod, let me start with you. Looking at yesterday's results, big wins for John Kerry in two states. Is it time to say it's all over? Isn't it an obvious conclusion at this point?

DAVID AXELROD, MEDIA ADVISER, EDWARDS CAMPAIGN: I think far from that, Jeanne. Well, first of all, let me congratulate Tad and Senator Kerry on a good day yesterday. They deserve congratulations for that.

As you know, we didn't contest those races. We were concentrating on Tuesday's contests in Tennessee and Virginia. As Senator Edwards said earlier on your show, we view this as a marathon, not a sprint.

You know, even after the Wisconsin primary, three quarters of the delegates will not have been selected. And I don't think the American people or the Democratic Party want to bring the curtain down on this race. Our goal is to get this down to a two-person race. We believe we are there effectively. We will be there, in fact, after the Wisconsin primary, and we look forward to that contest.

MESERVE: Mo Elleithee, let me ask you about this. Look, you've got this Kerry momentum going. We've got these polls that we just talked about, from Tennessee and Virginia, showing Kerry out in front. How do you stop him? MO ELLEITHEE, CLARK CAMPAIGN SPOKESMAN: Well, by simply taking our message directly to the voters here in Virginia and Tennessee and beyond. People in the South are just now starting to pay attention to this campaign. They are starting to focus on what is going on. And we've been campaigning hard across Tennessee and Virginia. We are getting tremendous response from the voters here. Because they see in Wes Clark someone who shares their values, someone who shares their background and someone who has got the leadership abilities that they are looking for. When you put these three candidates side by side, more and more people are moving to Wes Clark because they see he's the total package.

MESERVE: Tad Devine, in his speech last night, we saw Senator Kerry call out and call the president extreme, out of the mainstream. He wasn't talking about his Democratic rivals, he was talking about the president. Is this an indication that he has already decided he doesn't have to worry about the other guys in the Democratic pack?

TAD DEVINE, SENIOR ADVISER, KERRY CAMPAIGN: No, he's going to continue to do what he's been doing, which is campaign in every state. I think that's a big difference between the Democrats in this race and John Kerry right now. Iowa and New Hampshire were stand-alone events. We understood the premium there was to win a state. Now it's a different process. You have to campaign everywhere and try to win delegates everywhere. So he's going to keep focused on winning, running everywhere and winning everywhere.

MESERVE: David Axelrod, what about that? Is it a national campaign, if you look at a couple of primaries and say I'm not going to compete there?

AXELROD: Well, I think the nature of this -- the way this process is stacked up, you really have to apportion your resources and time strategically. John Kerry didn't spend a lot of dough in Michigan yesterday, because he didn't have to. He spent time elsewhere. We all make decisions like that because that -- there are too many -- simple too many primaries to cover them all, coming up as quickly as they are.

But the reality is, as I said, three-quarters of the delegates will still be available after February 17. And of course, March 2, so-called soup Tuesday is a bonanza of delegates.

So there's still a great opportunity for our campaign to win the nomination. That's why we're going to continue in this race. We think the Democratic Party deserves the best candidate, and we ought to have that contest and find out who the best candidate is.

MESERVE: Both Clark and Edwards have put a lot of emphasis on Virginia and Tennessee, the two primaries that are coming up. Mr. Elleithee, let me ask you, if your candidate doesn't win in either of those states, is it over?

ELLEITHEE: Well, we're going to do well here in Virginia and we're going to do well in Tennessee.

MESERVE: Is a number two slot good enough?

ELLEITHEE: I think we're going to finish as well as we can. We see a lot of momentum on the ground in both states. We're playing hard, we're playing to win in both states, and we fully expect to move forward, to compete in Wisconsin and beyond.

We are running a national campaign. And again, I think Wes Clark's message is resonating all over the country. And that's really going to springboard from here in Virginia and Tennessee.

MESERVE: You know, Mo, another question for you. Yesterday, we saw General Clark come out and attack John Edwards and his support of veterans, or lack of support of veterans as he put it. When you have the two people, Clark and Edwards, going after one another, does that all work to John Kerry's advantage?

ELLEITHEE: Well, I think elections are about choices. And we have got three candidates, really, here in this race, and all of them are good men, all of them would be better choices than George Bush, but there are differences between them, and it's important to point out those differences. Wes Clark has been -- Wes Clark has been in public service for 34 years. He is a veteran. There are some differences with the way John Edwards voted when it comes to veteran issues, and those are the kinds of things that should come up in a campaign.

MESERVE: You wanted quickly to respond there, David? I want to get to Tad here, but...

AXELROD: Yes, I just want to say, we are not going after Wes Clark. One of the hallmarks of the Edwards campaign, one of the deeply held beliefs is that we ought not to be ripping each other up as Democrats. That we want -- that Democrats want a candidate who will defeat George Bush and lift this country up. And that's what our campaign is about. Everybody has to make their own choices. The Clark campaign made theirs, we are going to make ours.

MESERVE: Want to ask you, Tad, about this AFSCME move yesterday to withdraw its endorsement of Howard Dean. AFSCME didn't appear to do a great deal for him, even with their support he didn't get a win. How significant is this development?

DEVINE: Well, I think it's important. They are a very, very important union. Their leadership is amongst the most important leadership in organized labor. So I think whenever that happens to a campaign, that's got to be a big setback.

MESERVE: Are you going to get them? Are you going to get the Gephardt labor supporters?

DEVINE: I don't know. It seems that some of these organizations are coming with Senator Kerry. I think they're impressed, not just by the fact that he's winning, but what he's talking about. He's talking about jobs, he's talking about health care. He's talking about a stronger America. He's talking about the environment. So I think if he keeps talking about these issues, I think we will win more and more support.

MESERVE: OK, Ted Devine, David Axelrod and Mo Elleithee, thank you all for joining us.

DEVINE: Thank you.

AXELROD: Thank you.

MESERVE: And straight ahead, the first ever Sunday interview with President Bush, and Senator John Kerry shared this preview with reporters.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KERRY: They are going to say that he looked smart, he looked presidential, knew what he -- knew -- knew his -- he knew his foreign policy and domestic policy. Of course we're talking about Tim Russert.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MESERVE: CNN White House correspondent Dana Bash has the real story when we return.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MESERVE: If you had any doubts that the presidential campaign is in full swing, you can now set those aside. President Bush is talking on NBC's "Meet the Press" this morning. In fact, it's his first ever Sunday talk show appearance since becoming president. CNN's Dana Bash is at the White House with all the details -- Dana.

DANA BASH, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Hi, Jeanne. And you know, of course, weapons of mass destruction, not finding them in Iraq has become a huge issue out on the campaign trail. And what we saw from the president during the one-hour interview on NBC this morning was the change, if you will, in the way the White House is handling that issue politically.

You saw, of course, the president on Friday say that there is going to be this new seven-member commission to look into pre-war intelligence. Today when the president was asked about weapons of mass destruction not being found, he just came out and said, correct, acknowledging that, which is something we certainly hadn't seen from the White House in the weeks and months before.

But he also suggested that what he used in terms of the intelligence that he used on Iraq was basically the best that he had, and that he did acknowledge that he was surprised that the weapons were not found.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: First of all, I expected to find the weapons. Sitting behind this desk, making a very difficult decision of war and peace, and I based my decision on the best intelligence possible. Intelligence that had been gathered over the years. Intelligence that not only our analysts thought was valid, but analysts from other countries thought was valid.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BASH: And Jeanne, we heard what is becoming an evolving change, if you will, in the rationale for war. The president saying now that he believes Saddam Hussein at least had the capacity to make weapons of mass destruction based on what David Kay, the former weapons inspector, is saying, that's quite different, of course, than what we heard before the war, essentially making it clear that perhaps it was a more dire threat from what was coming from Iraq.

But he used the word war, Jeanne, 26 times in the beginning of that interview. Clearly what the White House is trying to do politically here is to have the president out there saying, look, I was sitting in the Oval Office, I have sort of the weight of the world on my shoulders, if you will, and it's my responsibility to protect the American people, and I did what I thought was right. That's something we're going to hear a lot more from the president in the weeks and months to come.

MESERVE: Dana, Democrats, notably Terry McAuliffe, have said, alleged in recent days that the president was AWOL during his service in the National Guard. What did the president have to say about that today?

BASH: Well, Jeanne, it was the first time we've heard the president respond to that, at least in this election cycle. And the allegation is that there was a period within the year of 1972 that essentially that perhaps the president didn't show up for service, while he was in Alabama.

What the president said is that this has come up in every election he has run in since he was running for governor in 1994, he said it is basically false. That he did complete his service. And he also said that anybody that wants to look at those records to prove it certainly can, but he did acknowledge that there has been trouble finding some of those records. But he said to anybody who alleges that he didn't complete his duty, this is what his answer was.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BUSH: They are just wrong. There may need be no evidence, but I did report. Otherwise I wouldn't have been honorably discharged. In other words, you don't just say I did something without there being verification. Military doesn't work that way. I got an honorable discharge, and I did show up in Alabama.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BASH: And the president did say that he left early. He left the service early in order to go to Harvard Business School, but that that was allowed. And he did say what we heard from aides over the past couple of days, which is that he -- he cautioned or he said that the Democrats should be cautious in making any kind of connection between National Guard service and perhaps leaving the country to go to Canada, something that John Kerry suggested last week. He said he should be very careful about that, because there are lots of people in the National Guard who are serving this country at this time -- Jeanne.

MESERVE: The president was also asked about some comments John Kerry has made, the quote is, "all of a sudden he's the Marlboro man. I know this guy. He was two years behind me at Yale. I knew him, and he's still the same guy." What did the president have to say about that?

BASH: Well, it's interesting. He said he didn't know John Kerry at Yale. He even joked about the fact that he couldn't discuss whether or not they were -- they had some of the same secrets from the Skull and Bones secret fraternity that they were in at Yale. But he was very reluctant, Jeanne, even to go there, if you will, on John Kerry, saying that he's not the Democratic nominee yet. He would simply say that all of the allegations we are hearing from the campaign trail about the president, that he is not sort of ready for prime-time, if you will, it's the same thing, he said if you close your eyes, it's the same thing you heard in 2000.

But one thing he did say, as you can imagine, when he was asked whether or not he will even entertain the idea of losing, he said he wouldn't, he said he's not going to lose and he's prepared to have a very strong campaign in this coming year, as you can imagine, Jeanne.

MESERVE: Great, Dana Bash at the White House, thanks so much.

And right now, outside the state house in Richmond, Virginia, governor -- the governor of Virginia, John Warner, is talking -- excuse me, Mark Warner, is giving his endorsement to John Kerry. We'll be going to that in just a moment when we come back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MESERVE: Virginia's primary just 48 hours away, and today the governor, Mark Warner, has come out and thrown his support to John Kerry. John Kerry speaking outside the state house in Richmond right now. Let's listen in.

(JOINED IN PROGRESS)

KERRY: ...what the president and his administration told the American people throughout 2002. Back then, President Bush repeatedly told the American people that Saddam Hussein -- quote -- "has got chemical weapons."

They told us they could deploy those weapons within 45 minutes to do injury to our troops. They told us they had aerial vehicles and the capacity to be able to deliver those weapons through the air. And it was on that basis that he sent Americans, sons and daughters, off to war.

Now the president is giving us a new reason for sending people to war. And the problem is not just that he is changing his story now, it is that -- it appears that he was telling the American people stories in 2002. He told America that Iraq had chemical weapons two months after his own defense intelligence agency told him there was -- quote -- "no reliable information on whether Iraq is producing and stockpiling chemical weapons."

I once again call on the president to have a legitimate and immediate investigation into the extraordinary failure of intelligence or to help explain to the American people whether there was politics involved in the development of that intelligence. I respect the fact that the president has asked for a commission that will look at all of the intelligence agencies.

But that's not what America has asked for. What Americans asked for and what we need is an explanation of what happened to our intelligence with respect to this war. There aren't that many people to talk to, there's not that long a trail to trace, and it ought to be able to be done in a matter of months and it needs to be done in order to provide America with a clear understanding of what our intelligence status is and of how we went to war.

MESERVE: John Kerry speaking in Richmond, Virginia. President Bush, of course, speaking this morning on "Meet the Press," hoping to put the issue of weapons of mass destruction to rest. John Kerry clearly hoping he hasn't and bringing that up once again.

Once again, Kerry endorsed this morning by Virginia's governor, Mark Warner, with the Virginia primary just 48 hours away.

And the Democratic leader of the pack, John Kerry is used to criticism from his fellow candidates. But now the Republicans believe they've found his Achilles heel.

CNN's senior political analyst, Bill Schneider, has the story behind the story.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

WILLIAM SCHNEIDER, CNN SR. POLITICAL ANALYST (voice-over): John Kerry is, by just about any definition, that most exotic of political creatures, a Massachusetts liberal -- which means, Republican operatives believe, easy prey.

ED GILLESPIE, RNC CHAIRMAN: Americans for Democratic Action, the premier liberal rating organization, has given John Kerry a lifetime rating of 93 percent. Ted Kennedy has a lifetime rating of 88 percent, five points less. Who would have guessed it? Ted Kennedy is the conservative senator from Massachusetts.

SCHNEIDER: If Kerry is the Democratic nominee, Republicans expect to turn him into another Michael Dukakis, a criminal-coddling, ACLU-loving, furlough-granting, death penalty-opposing, tax-raising, pledge of allegiance-objecting, politically correct liberal elitist. Kerry speaks French for goodness sake and he was once Dukakis' lieutenant governor.

But Kerry is also a decorated war hero and a former prosecutor. And something else. He is not a wimp.

KERRY: And if George Bush wants to make national security the centerpiece of this campaign, we have three words for him that we know he understands -- bring it on.

SCHNEIDER: Dukakis got the wimp image in 1988 because he let the elder George Bush, who was supposed to be the wimpy candidate, beat him up. Kerry is not about to make that mistake.

DAVID GERGEN, U.S. NEWS & WORLD REPORT: This is not a Michael Dukakis. He is going to put up a fight.

SCHNEIDER: You bet he will.

KERRY: If they want to choose some kind of web -- you know, wedge sort of issue and distort my position, I will fight back very clearly.

SCHNEIDER: Kerry would certainly look a lot better in a tank than Dukakis did -- maybe even better than George W. Bush did on an aircraft carrier.

KERRY: Some of us know something about aircraft carriers for real.

SCHNEIDER: One other difference from 1988 -- this George Bush is the incumbent president, defending an uncertain economy and a controversial record. The 2004 election will be a referendum on him, not on his Democratic opponent.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SCHNEIDER: Republicans believe they know how to run against the Massachusetts Democrat. But Democrats have some experience electing a Massachusetts senator who is wealthy, well-bred and a war hero -- one who happened to have the same initials John Forbes Kerry -- Jeanne.

MESERVE: Front page of every paper this week -- gay marriage, Massachusetts -- how does this impact Kerry, if at all?

SCHNEIDER: Yes. Well, Kerry has said he disagrees with the Massachusetts supreme judicial court decision. However, back in 1996, he voted against the Defensive of Marriage Act, which would -- which put the federal government on record as opposing gay marriages and was signed into law by Bill Clinton. So he has a difficult time with that issue.

But so does George W. Bush. George W. Bush has very carefully avoided backing a constitutional amendment. Why? Because our polling, just released, shows today 62 percent of Americans oppose recognition of gay marriages as legal. On the other hand, when asked, Would you support a constitutional amendment to ban gay marriages, it's an even split. It's a dangerous issue for both sides.

MESERVE: Bill Schneider, thanks a lot for the insight.

SCHNEIDER: OK.

MESERVE: And now for our Sunday edition of "Campaign News Daily."

Democrats in Tennessee throw a primary party for presidential candidates. The guest lists includes former Vice President Al Gore, Tennessee Governor Phil Bredesen and other prominent Democrats. Wesley Clark and John Edwards also RSVP'ed.

The Clark campaign races against the clock in a push to catch up. The former general will visit six cities in a 12-hour period. Among the stops, the D-Day memorial at Bedford, Virginia; church services in Memphis, Tennessee, campaign stops near Racine, Wisconsin.

Howard Dean concentrates on Wisconsin. The former Vermont governor is spending a little time in Maine today, and appears on two TV talk shows, including CNN, before moving on. Dean is forgoing a major effort in Virginia and Tennessee.

MESERVE: Coming up, brewing up a Sunday dose of "The Morning Grind, looking ahead to Wisconsin.

And later, Jon Stewart, Jay Leno and David Letterman cash in on the candidates.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DAVID LETTERMAN, CBS "THE LATE SHOW" HOST: Howard Dean was at a fish market in Seattle catching fish. And -- and he did so well that next week he starts full time. That's what he'll be doing.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MESERVE: Welcome back. And here with our Sunday cup of "The Morning Grind," CNN political editor, John Mercurio.

John, thanks a lot for coming in.

JOHN MERCURIO, CNN POLITICAL EDITOR: Thank you.

MESERVE: Busy weekend where labor is concerned. You can AFCSME saying, Oh, Howard Dean no more. You had Gephardt, who's had union support, moving his support to Kerry.

Where do the unions go?

MERCURIO: I think it's sort of an open question at this point, what sort or support or what sort of effect is they have. But the Alliance for Economic Justice, which is a -- or, a group of 18 unions that had backed Dick Gephardt are going to be getting behind John Kerry, sources are telling me. They have polled -- they have polling that's out right now. They're trying to determine where their representative sit. But on Wednesday, they're going to be meeting for a conference call -- the general presidents are -- and they'll be getting behind John Kerry, probably sometime later this week.

MESERVE: Maine, caucusing today. No polling up there. Any clue what we should expect?

MERCURIO: Twenty-four delegates at stake. I talked to the state party chairwoman yesterday. She told me that John Kerry and Howard Dean both have probably the strongest organizations, but she and a lot of others Democrats that I've talked to said not to count out Dennis Kucinich -- not necessarily a winner, but probably a strong third place.

You got to remember that Maine, as Jeanne knows pretty well, is a state with a strong Green Party -- how Ralph Nader got 6 percent up there. The gubernatorial candidate from the Green Party got 9 percent last year. And Kucinich has been making a big draw towards the Green Party, urging them to switch to the Democrats to vote -- to vote for him.

If he pulls it out, it actually could be an interesting show for him, a strong play in that state.

MESERVE: Everybody is looking at Wisconsin, already looking at there, because Dean has said do or die.

MERCURIO: Right.

MESERVE: Is he going to be able to do it?

MERCURIO: Yes, it's his last stand and if the polling that we have today proves to be omniscient or prescient, or whatever the word is...

MESERVE: Accurate?

MERCURIO: ...then -- accurate -- then -- then it would be his -- it would be a fall. John Kerry right now has 41 percent; Wes Clark in second place with 15; John Edwards in third place with 10 percent. Obviously, Dean at 9 percent. If he were to make a comeback and win in Wisconsin, we would have a whole new comeback story, I think, and....

MESERVE: Given the numbers there, why did he pick Wisconsin as a place to make the stand?

MERCURIO: I think he saw Wisconsin as a state with a lot of progressives, much like Washington state yesterday -- his showing yesterday in Washington, his second place in Washington must not have been very encouraging for how he's going to do in Wisconsin.

MESERVE: OK. John Mercurio, thanks a lot for coming in. And for the best daily briefing on politics, brew up "The Morning Grind" on your computer. Log on to cnn.com/grind for the latest political news.

And just ahead, a presidential grilling. George Bush sits down for his first Sunday interview. Donna Brazile and Jonah Goldberg debate his performance and talk about the Democrats when we come back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MESERVE: There may be many more surprises ahead in campaign 2004. Some may emerge from the Democrats on the way to the nomination, others from President Bush's campaign.

Taking stock now, Donna Brazile, Democratic strategist. And Jonah Goldberg, editor of National Review Online.

Thanks a lot both for coming in.

Donna, I'll give you your chance first. The president this morning on "Meet the Press," trying to put these issues about weapons of mass destruction in Iraq to rest. Did he do it?

DONNA BRAZILE, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: No, I don't think so.

I think the president today began to explain his decision making and his -- perhaps his timeline of how he got to the point were he rushed the country to war. I think this opens up a lot of -- more questions that the president needs to understand, the Democrats, well as the media, will raise about his decision to bring the country into war with faulty intelligence.

The other fact is, is that he has delayed the report now until next -- next May. That's too long. We should have an annual report before September 11 to understand what happened with -- again, another intelligence failure.

MESERVE: Jonah, I have to give you your chance to fire back here.

JONAH GOLDBERG, NATIONAL REVIEW ONLINE: I think what we've seen in the last couple of weeks with David Kay, with George Tenet's speech, and now with President Bush this morning, is that the sort of standard Democratic line that we have seen, primarily from people like Ted Kennedy, that this was all a lie, that the data was cooked, they cooked the books, they hyped it all -- I think that is starting to melt the way, and the issue is going to be did George Bush make the right decision given the information he had at the time?

Now, obviously I don't think the White House wants to have this debate at all. But I don't think that's necessarily a losing debate, either. If John Kerry wants to take the other side and say that he would he rather have trusted Saddam Hussein, given the information that they had, I think Kerry loses that argument. And it's a good argument for the Republicans. BRAZILE: Well, Colin Powell, before he was reprimanded or told to recant his story, said had he known what he knows today, he would not have supported the decision to go to war. So I think this is a legitimate area of concern on behalf of the entire American people, and this -- gain, this is about the president, the intelligence, the intelligence that was shared. Did they cook the books? And if so, why.

MESERVE: Is this an issue that sustains steam for the Democrats from now until November?

BRAZILE: Well, national security will be a major issue in this presidential election, and I think in the context of keeping America safe and secure, I think Democrats can raise now some fresh new issues around this whole intelligence blunder.

Look, this is not just the rush to war in Iraq. It's also our response to September 11. We mowed down all of our allies in rushing to this war, and I think the Democrats should raise this issue in the presidential -- context of the presidential campaign.

MESERVE: Why did the president do this -- sit down for an hour with Tim Russert? Does it show just how worried his camp is?

GOLDBERG: I think so. I mean, I think a lot of the playbook that the White House has had from expecting Howard Dean to have it to expecting a long primary fight -- a lot of these things haven't happened. The public debate has been such that I think the White House felt it had to get out in front of this.

And again, I would just simply say to Donna that there's a difference between of acquisition of cooking the boxes, or, as Ted Kennedy says, "a lie hatched in Texas," and saying that the intelligence turned out to be wrong. It seems to me now that the debate is changing -- that people actually do see the distinction between those two, and I think it helps George Bush quite a bit if we can get past this whole cooking the books thing and say that George Bush simply made the best decision possible given the information. And I think that's a good debate.

MESERVE: Two primaries yesterday, big wins for John Kerry.

BRAZILE: Well, look....

MESERVE: Is he it?

BRAZILE: He's running a national campaign. His campaign is very disciplined, very organized. He's now refueling his campaign. He has a lot of money, a lot of momentum. I think he'll win the Maine caucuses today. I believe he'll win Tennessee and Virginia next week. On to D.C. and Nevada.

John Kerry will accumulate enough delegates going into the crucial Super Tuesday primary to clench the nomination.

GOLDBERG: Yes, I mean, I think -- look, it's very hard to see how Kerry doesn't get it. I think --what do they say? -- the smell of almonds is the smell of a wound going bad. Well, for presidential campaigns -- when Howard Dean does something like actually talk about whether or not he would take the vice presidential slot, it is the stink of death coming off of that campaign. He's got one shot in Wisconsin to just get back in the news -- not necessarily to win anything -- and I don't think he's going do that either. So I think it's over.

MESERVE: A new CNN-TIME poll matching up Kerry and Bush. And essentially, it's a dead heat here. Those numbers are going to change.

BRAZILE: Very competitive election. We all know that. The country is equally divided between the two major political parties. This will be a very difficult race regardless of who the nominee is on the Democratic side.

GOLDBERG: Yes, I think that's right. If you look at the actual electoral map, it's very hard not to come up with some sort of 267 to 271 kind of scenario with the electoral map.

BRAZILE: Not again. Not again.

MESERVE: Who is the vice president, presuming Kerry is the nominee? Is the Democratic vice presidential pick going to have any big impact?

BRAZILE: He has a long bench to look at. You have Bill Richardson, Janet Napolitano, Dick Gephardt, John Edwards, Wesley Clark -- I mean, I can go on and on and on.

MESERVE: And who's your favorite on that list?

BRAZILE: Well, I have a favorite, but I'm going to hold it to myself this time.

GOLDBERG: I mean, technically (ph) my favorite would be someone like Howard Dean and just watch them go down like the Titanic.

But ....

MESERVE: Not to be partisan (UNINTELLIGIBLE)

GOLDBERG: I do think what's interesting is that polling shows that Edwards can't even bring North Carolina for a Kerry ticket, but Bayh -- Even Bayh, Senator Evan Bayh, could probably bring Indiana, which would be big news, but feminists don't like his record on abortion. So that may not happen.

BRAZILE: Well, then, I should add Bob Graham, because we'll maybe finally get Florida this time, you know?

MESERVE: OK. Donna and Jonah, thank you both for coming in.

GOLDBERG: Thank you.

MESERVE: And coming up, it's "Must-See IP" -- great late-night laughs from the campaign trail.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LETTERMAN: Here we go. Top ten things never before said by a presidential candidate.

No. 10...

EDWARDS: Vote for me or I'll slash your tires.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MESERVE: A sense of humor is a key requirement for candidates on the long and arduous campaign trail, and some late-night comics make sure the Democrats don't take themselves too seriously.

Here's this week's sampling.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

LETTERMAN: Top 10 things never before said by a presidential candidate. No. 10...

EDWARDS: Vote for me or I'll slash your tires.

JAY LENO, HOST, NBC "THE TONIGHT SHOW": Do you know that name of Kerry's bus? His campaign bus? "The Real Deal Express." That's the name of his campaign bus.

Do you know the name of Dennis Kucinich's campaign bus? Greyhound.

EDWARDS: Forget universal health care, I'm buying every American an X-Box.

LETTERMAN: Wow. Not a bad...

JON STEWART, HOST, "THE DAILY SHOW": In South Carolina, Senator John Edwards won handily, fulfilling his promise to win every state he was born in.

LETTERMAN: No. 6...

EDWARDS: If your last name begins with M through Z, sorry, your taxes are doubling.

LETTERMAN: Howard Dean was at a fish market in Seattle catching fish. And -- and he did so well that next week he starts full time. That's what he will be doing.

EDWARDS: Lady, that is one ugly baby.

CLARK: Oklahoma is OK by me!

STEWART: Ah. Ah. Ah. Ah. I get it.

LETTERMAN: And the No. 1 thing never before said by a presidential candidate...

EDWARDS: Read my lips, no new wardrobe malfunctions.

LETTERMAN: There you go.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

MESERVE: And that's INSIDE POLITICS Sunday for this weekend.

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