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Trump Isolated After Charlottesville Response; Corker Say Trump Lacks Stability; Backlash Builds over Charlottesville Response; Talks Swirl of White House Departures. Aired 12-12:30p ET

Aired August 18, 2017 - 12:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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[12:00:24] JOHN KING, CNN HOST: Welcome to IINSIDE POLITICS. I'm John King. Thanks for sharing your day with us.

The two front terror investigation now underway in Spain. Five men in fake suicide belts shot dead in one incident. An urgent manhunt for the driver who mowed down dozens in the heart of Barcelona still underway.

Plus, new fault lines in a debate over confederate monuments and statues. The president says it's foolish to tear them down and his chief strategist brags Democrats will pay a price for erasing history.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MAYOR MIKE RAWLINGS (D), DALLAS: It's not just a question of statues. These have become totems for the alt-right, the white supremacists and now we've got it into a new conversation.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KING: That's stunning fallout from Charlottesville. Republican lawmakers question President Trump's moral compass and his basic grasp of the job. The backlash is only growing. Now, this stinging rebuke from Charlottesville victim Heather Heyer's mother, Susan Bro says she has not yet spoken to the president about her daughter and now she will not.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SUSAN BRO, MOTHER OF CHARLOTTESVILLE VICTIM HEATHER HEYER: As first I just missed his calls. The call -- the first call it looked like actually came during the funeral. I didn't even see that message. There were three more frantic messages from press secretaries throughout the day, and I didn't know why. That would have been on Wednesday.

And I was home recovering from the exhaustion of the funeral, so I hadn't really watched the news until last night. And -- I'm -- I'm not talking to the president now. I'm sorry.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What did you -- BRO: After what he said about my child and it's not that I saw somebody else's tweets about him. I saw an actual clip of him as a press conference equating the protestors, like Ms. Heyer, with the KKK and the white supremacists.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KING: With us to share their reporting and their insights, Julie Pace of "The Associated Press," Jonathan Martin of "The New York Times," Perry Bacon of FiveThirtyEight, and Karoun Demirjian of "The Washington Post."

A busy hour ahead. To Spain in a moment for the latest on the terror investigations. One American now confirmed to be among the 14 killed.

And President Trump headed to Camp David this hour. He's meeting with his national security team and trying to settle a fierce debate about U.Ss. troop levels in Afghanistan.

First, though, the mounting toll on the president because of his response to Charlottesville.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SUSAN BRO, MOTHER OF CHARLOTTESVILLE VICTIM HEATHER HEYER: You can't wash this one away by shaking my hand and saying I'm sorry.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Is there something, though, that you --

BRO: I'm not forgiving for that.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Is there something, though, that you would want to say to the president?

BRO: Think before you speak.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KING: Heather Heyer's mother there. Emotional comments from her.

Here, just a partial list to help take stock of this week's dramatic fallout.

Several White House policy councils disbanded after CEOs rushed to quit so their brand wouldn't be attached to the president's.

Several other major organizations, The American Cancer Society among them, announced they will no longer stage big events at the president's Mar-a-Lago resort.

2012 presidential nominee for the Republicans, Mitt Romney, today said this of the president. What he communicated caused racists to rejoice, minorities to weep and the vast heart of America to mourn.

Earlier in the week, Presidents George H.W. Bush and George W. Bush issued a rare joint statement, making clear in their view President Trump failed this test, American must always reject racial bigotry, anti-Semitism, and hatred in all forms.

The Republican Jewish Coalition rebuked the president, as did the only African-American Republican senator. Tim Scott of South Carolina says the president's angry Tuesday remarks about Charlottesville are, quote, indefensible, and that Mr. Trump's, quote, moral authority, is compromised.

And there's this from Senator Bob Corker of Tennessee, the Republican chairman of the Foreign Relations Committee.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. BOB CORKER (R), TENNESSEE: The president has not yet -- has not yet been able to demonstrate the stability, nor some of the competence that he needs to demonstrate in order to be successful. He also recently has not demonstrated that he understands the character of this nation.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KING: Again, that was just a partial list.

Where are we as we close this workweek? I mean you have, if you look, from Susan Bro, Heather Heyer's mother, you know, a private citizen now dealing with grief after this incident, to the Republican organizations, to the business groups running from the president. He ends the workweek at the pariah president, does he not?

JULIE PACE, ASSOCIATED PRESS: He does. He's increasingly isolated. He's increasingly isolated within his own party. The sentiments you heard from Senator Corker are sentiments that you have heard versions of from Republicans for quite some time. But to have a senior Republican senator who has tried to work with this White House -- and I think that's important to note, this is not a senator like a Jeff Flake or a Lindsey Graham, who has been pretty openly opposed to the president on numerous issues.

[12:05:23] Senator Corker was considered for vice president. He was considered for secretary of state. He has tried to work with the White House. For him to be coming out expressing that type of rhetoric publicly, I think is a turning point here in terms of the way Republicans are thinking about their relationship with the White House going forward.

KING: I think the same with Senator Scott. Again, Senator Corker, Senator Scott, not among those -- you're watching the president there on his way to Camp David. Just landing, I believe that's Hagerstown, Maryland.

Not among those who rushed to every fire. Not to criticize the senators who feel they need to be part of every story, but they don't. They're people who don't seek the limelight. In Senator Scott's case, I think he feels some -- a special need to do this, a, from South Carolina, b, he's the only African-American. But to say a president has lost his moral compass, does not have the moral authority to lead the country? I mean that's much bigger than just he blew Charlottesville.

PERRY BACON, FIVETHIRTYEIGHT: And I thought this week the -- the people in Washington criticizing him, we've heard some of that. We had new people doing it this week, I would say. An everyday citizen, whose daughter just died saying, I do not want to hear from the president, I do not want to talk to him, presidents --

KING: I will not talk to him, right.

BACON: I will not talk to him. Presidents of every party are -- usually coming -- moments like this are encouraged to go to the funeral, to speak to the family. And the fact that, you know, you have all these people who are regular citizens, you know, people who run businesses, people who run arts councils, people who do not want to be associated with the president, don't want to be near him, that's a profound thing. That's going to effect -- that changes the job in some ways. The president is usually the leader of everyone and he can't lead everyone if people don't want to be around him or be in the same room with him.

JONATHAN MARTIN, THE NEW YORK TIMES: I don't want to minimize the news this week, which by any measure is remarkable given the fact that you've got major institutions in American life. You know, whether it's the U.S. Senate or whether it's large American corporations who are basically condemning the sitting president. But to what end? To what end?

This has been a two-plus year story that all of us have lived and covered. When he announced his candidacy, I recall, in the aftermath, copies like Macy's, for example, pulled their Trump wear.

KING: Right.

MARTIN: There was a corporate backlash for a few days there that was front page news after he talked about Mexicans being rapists in his announcement speech. Well, guess what, John, he became the Republican nominee for the presidency and then became the president of the United States, after that happened. So to what end? What is going to happen? What is the action?

And that's what I think is the story now. These folks on The Hill, the congressional Republicans, are they now willing to do something besides one-off tweets and statements and comments and actually confront him in any real way?

KING: I think that's (INAUDIBLE) defining question about the political (INAUDIBLE). And that is my question is the sense that these -- he was a candidate -- before -- again, I'm not excusing things -- but he was a candidate before and he's the president now.

MARTIN: Right.

KING: And you had a national tragedy where people expected him to be all Americans' president. Not a Republican president. Not a Trump-base president. But all of America's president. And the fact that Susan Bro now says she won't even take his phone

call, that sort of puts up a road block to one of the ways he could try to put this behind him. Whether you agree or disagree with what he, you know, Tuesday, in that angry press conference in Trump Tower. If he could have arranged, you know, this weekend, next week, a phone call or a White House meeting with her at some point, that could have been a page turner.

MARTIN: Yes.

KING: Now it looks like that options gone.

KAROUN DEMIRJIAN, THE WASHINGTON POST: Right. And this is a measure of the adage, too little, too late. I mean perhaps if he had taken a different stance at the outset or even as, you know, late as Monday, this would have been a different story and she would have been more willing to pick up that phone, but now she's not.

And I think that that, in a way, you know, the point at which this becomes so personally an affront, what the president says becomes a personal affront, not just to Susan Bro, but also to members of Congress, can kind of go towards answering your question, which is that Trump has shown himself in the many different comments this week, and granted it was not the main event. The main event was Charlottesville. But anybody who criticized him in a forum that he didn't like, he went after directly.

KING: Right.

DEMIRJIAN: He went after McCain directly about his health care votes. He went after Flake directly. He went after Graham directly. At a certain point, this gets old. And, remember, we're coming into this event having just been through the health care debacle where Republicans started to show that they are not willing to go and track with the president on absolutely everything.

So this was a very bad thing to happen in a personal capacity on top of that political policy experience, that if he continues to hammer at people, individually, when they are saying, no, I have the moral high ground on this, you can't just pull them down into the mud with these tweets, they're going to stop potentially being willing to play ball with him on other things going down the line, especially if he's not (IINAUDIBLE).

KING: To that point, Rich Lowry writing in "The National Review," I want to say this, he -- you know, he says this. He is slip sliding towards a crisis of legitimacy. That is the significance of the discussion of his business councils. It's not unthinkable should this trajectory continue that a time could come which some Republican office holders refuse to visit the White House.

That's your question.

MARTIN: Yes.

KING: That's your question. Is this just a, this is how we have to react for a few days and then we hope this goes away and we stop asking? Or because this wasn't about politics, this was an American moment, and, yes, it's about race. Yes, it's about hate groups.

MARTIN: Yes.

[12:10:08] KING: But it's not a Washington story. It's an American story. And the president failed the test. Does that make it different?

MARTIN: I think it could. I think it depends upon what more he says here in the days to come. I think if he repeats what he said last week, or at the second press conference, I think it's going to make it very hard for folks on The Hill to keep working with him. If he kind of moves on, and we -- the press and the country collectively move ahead with whatever the next issue is, terrorism or what have you, then I think we probably, like everything else in the last two years, we just move on. So I think his conduct will drive lots of that.

But you said, failed the test. I am staggered that the president would not call the mayor of Charlottesville, would not come to the funeral, would not have anybody come to the funeral. I -- this is politics 101. This is leadership 101. And to not do that, and then to say what he said about those who are marching with Nazis and Klansmen in Charlottesville being fine people is -- it's extraordinary and it's just hard to comprehend.

KING: And so that's why you have these conversations.

It is stunning when you talk to leading senators, even some Trump cabinet members, people around the town. I've been in this town for 30 years. I've never heard anything like this.

MARTIN: Right. Yes.

KING: Where they talk about, well, if he doesn't want the job, he shouldn't have it.

MARTIN: Right.

KING: How could he not have sensed that he should have stepping up to this moment? You know, who are the -- where are the people around him to kick him and the make him step up to this moment?

The conversations are stunning about this. Look at these magazine covers. "The New Yorker," "Time," "The Economist." This is the president of the United States. A KKK hood as a bullhorn? A KKK hood as a sail? The salutes? I mean this is the national and international conversation about the president of the United States.

PACE: And it's -- it's upsetting. I mean I think that as Americans, you don't want to be having this kind of conversation about your president. No matter what party they are from. This is an uncomfortable conversation to have. I think inherently Americans want their presidents to succeed, even though politics is so much a part of that debate about the presidency. I think Americans generally want to respect and like their president. And they want to look to their president in these kinds of moments. I remember covering Obama after the horrible shooting in Charleston,

and talking to a lot of Republicans in South Carolina. And overwhelmingly Republicans in the state, and the appreciation they had for what Obama did in the aftermath was so profound.

KING: And the Republican governor, Nikki Haley, as well, at that moment, hailing that crisis as a governor of everybody, or a president of everybody.

What does it tell us -- and he's not the first, but this is earlier today -- the secretary of state, a Trump cabinet member, what does it tell us that members of the Trump cabinet, without being asked a question, feel they have to start an event by saying this?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REX TILLERSON, SECRETARY OF STATE: We all know hate is not an American value. We do not honor, nor do we promote or accept, hate speech in any form. And those who embrace it poison our public discourse and they damage the very country that they claim to love. So we condemn racism, bigotry in all its forms. Racism is evil, is antithetical to America's values.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KING: So what is behind this? That, you know, if you don't -- you know, if you don't like what the president said, let us say it? We need -- I feel I need to say it because I don't want to be tainted with the Trump brand? What is this?

BACON: That's what it is.

KING: That's what it is?

BACON: I know I think there's a lot of people who -- Ivanka, Mike Pence, all who won't criticize the president, all who want to go out of their way -- we're now at Friday. And I knew Rex Tillerson was opposed to racism probably last Friday, but I really -- you know, the fact that he's saying it today shows he does not -- you know, he wants to have everything for himself after this is over.

We've had Gary Cohn, you know, people close to him saying he's outraged. I think that what you're hearing is (INAUDIBLE).

I just want to say one thing about what Jonathan said, is the -- the idea that tax reform, for example, I assume the Republicans will vote with Trump on tax reform issues like that. I do think -- I know it's hard to look ahead, but March 2019, does John Kasich or Mitt Romney or somebody say, this (INAUDIBLE) the Republican Party and I need to go challenge this man immediately in the primary? I think the chances of that went up by a lot I would argue this week.

KING: That's an excellent point.

You've got something you want to say? DEMIRJIAN: I was just going to say there -- I mean as much as I agree that it is everybody kind of saving their own neck in saying these statements, it's also kind of a remarkable moment of, you know, they're not leaving the administration in protest. And so part of that is because, you know, it -- it takes a lot of guts to leave an administration when there's anything (INAUDBILE). Part of it is also, I mean, you're seeing kind of in these statements a little bit of a service element of this. This is not an easy position for these people to be in. They're trying to do a little bit, but it's maybe indifference to the fact that, you know, the country needs this and the president's not filling that void.

MARTIN: And largely responding to Gary Cohn rumors that he was going to leave.

KING: Right.

DEMIRJIAN: Yes.

MARTIN: Shows you that, you know, some of these folks, I think, would argue that they have to be there for the stability of the country.

DEMIRJIAN: Yes.

KING: Right. And we'll continue that very conversation when we come back.

A quick break.

When we come back, the Trump exhaustion is all across Washington. Guess what? It's even inside the Trump White House.

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[12:19:03] KING: Welcome back.

The president's under fire, not just from the business community, not just from fellow Republicans, not just from the mother of the Charlottesville victim. His own staff is said to be mad at the president. Members of the cabinet upset they were left standing there when the president launched into his remarks Tuesday at Trump Tower. His daughter is said to be disappointed in the president. His chief of staff described to me as full Irish after the president's Tuesday remarks.

Again, but -- but amid all this talk, will some of them go? "The Wall Street Journal" weighing in today urging them to stay. Quote, they have no illusions about Mr. Trump's character flaws, "The Journal" editorial board writes, or if they did, they don't any more. They are trying to serve their country, but that task gets harder with every reckless Trumpian flight from normal presidential behavior. Every person has to decide how long he or she can serve in good conscious, but we hope the best stay as long as they can for the good of the country.

A remarkable editorial in a normally Republican-leaning, Republican- favoring newspaper. Has some issues with the president, especially in recent weeks.

[12:20:03] But there is this conversation around town. You know, Ivanka was disappointed. Gary Cohn was furious. One of the Jewish members of the cabinet, Steve Mnuchin, being urged by his Yale classmates, get out.

It's remarkable the conversation around town. Let's not tip toe around it. A lot of Republicans telling their friends who work in the White House, get out before you can't shake the stench. I mean those are the conversations --

PACE: Absolutely.

KING: Those are the conversations that are going on. And when you talk to some of them, they say, you know, well, I get it, but I have to stay. Well, what's going to happen here?

PACE: Well, I think the other conversation that's happening from Republicans who are outside the White House is, there's no one on the bench who's ready to come in. And that is driving some of the discussion inside the White House, this realization. I mean they have tried to get a coms director three times without having much luck there. There is not a crop of --

KING: You're being kind at three. You're being very kind.

PACE: But there is -- there is not a crop of seasoned Republicans who are sitting there saying, I'm ready to step in if these people leave and try to give this a shot. So this is largely the staff that he is -- that he is going to be stuck with or he'll be stuck with empty offices if these people leave.

But there is this tension right now. I mean these Republicans know, if you stay, you cannot make that, you know, for good of country argument alone. You are going to be tainted by the things that are happening in this administration. So they -- this is a constant balance.

But no one I have talked to this week is running for the exit. Most people seem to be pretty committed to staying for the foreseeable future.

KING: Right. And at the beginning of the week one of the conversations was that Steve Bannon was on the outs. And now if you listen to the president this week, especially his talk about don't tear down the monuments. We'll get to more of that later in the program.

But if you listen to the president's response, lashing out at the alt- left in that Tuesday press conference, which is what caused a lot of the trouble, you would have to argue from a communications standpoint Steve Bannon is ascendant is the talk and it continues today that he is short for his job as chief strategist? Real or not?

DEMIRJIAN: Well, I mean, he -- these people are -- work closer to the White House than I am. But, in general, it's funny that, you know, clearly that the -- the aura's of Steve Bannon is so palpable in everything Trump's been saying in the last few days and then you have Steve Bannon talking to the American prospect and saying, oh, that's just all to make Democrats, you know, confused and distracted so he can do these, you know, economic -- aggressive economic moves with China and other places like that.

So Trump wouldn't actually, you know, endorse -- wouldn't firmly say Steve Bannon has my full support in that Tuesday press conference, which leaves the question open, the way he's done with many members of his administration. He likes to be the guy in charge who can make a decision at a moment's notice however he chooses to.

KING: And at that Tuesday press conference, I think we have the photos here. You mentioned Gary Cohn. The awkwardness, or the weirdness of a White House putting out a statement essentially saying, he's not leaving. That's strange. It tells you about -- you see right there, Steve Mnuchin, Gary Cohn, literally inches, a couple feet away from the president as he goes through this. And they were all said to be surprised by this. Although the president clearly planned it. He had his Saturday statement in his pocket. He pulled it out. He wanted to defend it.

But these remarks -- and, again, the president says this isn't fair. But the criticism has been that he essentially drew a moral equation between the counterdemonstrators there to protest the neo-Nazis, the white supremacists and the KKK, and those hate groups. And you've seen the Republican Jewish Coalition backlash (ph). Why -- if you're -- I guess my question is, if you're the leader and you decide you want to do this, that's the president's right. But why have your team standing there when you do it?

BACON: It was very striking to have them standing there. People like Elaine Chao was in the picture. I mean as (INAUDIBLE) I'm sure she didn't want to be in that spot right there.

I do want to say, I don't want to fully absolve the staff may -- may be outraged and want to say. At the same time, the cynical view of the maybe Gary Cohn wants to be Fed chair and that's why he's staying. Not, because he has some -- he's trying to, like, save the country.

MARTIN: (INAUDIBLE).

BACON: Like, I think we talk about General Mattis or the National Security (INAUDIBLE), I think there is some kind of patriotic impulse there.

On the domestic side, there's a lot of senior advisors who are very (ph) outraged. You know, Donald Trump clearly can speak and communicate on his own without asking for any advice. And so I think also, in terms of Bannon, it -- whether Bannon leaves or not, I think this week showed the sort of lead nationalist voice in the White House is Donald Trump, not Steve Bannon.

KING: It's the president. It's the president. But what does it say seven months in? You know, we had Reince Priebus leave. General Kelly come in. Apparently it's harder to get access to the president. There's more order and more routine normal structure in the White House. But the president is still the president. Your colleagues in "The New York Times" writing this on Wednesday.

Mr. Trump's venting on Tuesday came despite pleas from his staff, including his daughter Ivanka Trump and her husband Jared Kushner. Instead of taking their advice to stop talking about the protests, the president eagerly unburned himself with what he viewed as political correctness in favor of a take no prisoners attack on the alt-left.

That's to your point as well. The president is the president. Can we just stop any conversation that whether this person leaves or this person comes that this is going to change?

PACE: Yes. Yes, we can stop that conversation because it doesn't make a -- it doesn't make an impact.

And to your earlier question about, you know, why did the president have to have his advisers there? I don't even think he thought about it. He was very singularly focused in the aftermath of Charlottesville and the media criticism and the Republicans criticism of his initial statement. I don't want to psychoanalyze too much here, but I would doubt that he was really concerned about the impact on Gary Cohn or Steve Mnuchin or Elaine Chao standing up there with him.

[12:25:13] KING: We're laughing because this is not new and it's not a surprise, but it's leadership 101.

PACE: Yes.

DEMIRJIAN: Yes.

KING: Leadership 101. If you're going to take a risky stance, you don't drag people down with you, people who serve you loyally.

BACON: Who all looked surprised. If you watched their body language, it looked like they did not -- I don't know, maybe they shouldn't have been surprised. They know who they're working for. But they all looked surprised.

MARTIN: But Perry's right there, that this is a sort of fascinating mix of old-fashioned political ambition and the human ego combined with, you know, some sort of impulses towards serving the country and trying to frankly protect the country at a really uncertain time. And, you know, it's -- it's both of those things, I think. And some folks think there's more of one than the other, but it is a fascinating dynamic where I think a lot of people are appalled that their friends or former colleagues are in this capacity, yet there are others who say, look, I don't like it. I'm glad that they're there.

KING: Well, but that's the stunning part. Again, it becomes so common and casual, and we tend to just gloss over it, but people saying it's good to have those people around the president because we can't trust the president or the president's too erratic. That party is kind of stunning.

Everybody hold the thought. We'll continue the conversation. Up next, though, a shift, international news, big international news. The intense manhunt and growing investigation into those terror attacks in Spain.

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