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Inside Politics

Aretha Franklin Dead at 76; Remembering Aretha Franklin; John Lewis Remembers Aretha Franklin; Don Lemon Remembers Aretha Franklin; Dionne Warwick Remembers Aretha Franklin; Interview With Rep. John Lewis. Aired 12-12:30p ET

Aired August 16, 2018 - 12:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[12:00:12] ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

JOHN KING, CNN ANCHOR: We have breaking news this hour. Sad, breaking news.

The queen of soul, Aretha Franklin, has died after a battle with pancreatic cancer. She was 76 years old. Franklin passing at home in hospice care surrounded by family and friends.

Franklin was and remains undoubtedly one of the most influential and important voices in global music history. Her career spanning more than half a century. She churned out dozens of iconic hits over those decades, "Respect," "Think," "Freeway of Love," just to name a few.

And she was the first woman admitted to the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame. She performed for popes, presidents, and royalty, a veritable queen herself. But she says she wanted any talk of her legacy to begin with this, her efforts to be a mother and a wonderful mother at that. A personal favorite here, Franklin's cameo on "Blues Brothers" almost two decades ago.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ARETHA FRANKLIN, MUSICIAN (singing): Freedom, freedom, freedom, freedom, freedom, freedom, freedom, freedom, freedom, freedom.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KING: Tributes are flowing in from around the globe from presidents, from prime ministers, from every day Americans, from the entertainment industry as well.

President Trump, just moments ago, paying tribute at a cabinet meeting. We may get tape of those remarks in just a few moments.

So let's get straight now to CNN's Ryan Young. He is in Detroit, outside the church where the gift and the grace of Aretha Franklin blossomed.

Ryan.

RYAN YOUNG, CNN CORRESPONDENT: John, absolutely. People in this city want to make sure people understand how much they love Aretha Franklin. People have been driving by, playing her music. They've been honking their horns. But so many people here have personal stories about Aretha Franklin and what she meant to them.

But I want to talk to the man who leads the church where so much of her history is tied to, Reverend Robert Smith.

Today is a day that obviously stands out. You know about the pain she was sort of suffering for some -- quite some time. But what can you tell people of the world about Aretha Franklin?

REV. ROBERT SMITH JR., NEW BETHEL BAPTIST CHURCH: That she loved God. And she loved her church. And she loved her daddy. She kept her daddy's name alive by having an annual revival and gospel singing night, three nights every year. In the month of August. It would be going on right now, next week, if it went out as planned for every year. She'd feed all the people in the community until they can't eat no more. And we all sing and shout half the night.

YOUNG: Give me something personal that will attached you to her. I mean I know the music was great. I keep hearing from people that she never changed. She was normal. Give me something that touched you in your time with her.

SMITH: Well, I knew her through pictures for a long time because I lived in a little town called Pensacola, Florida. It's not a little town now. It was about 12,000 people when I was there though. And Ted White Sr. lived a street over from me. My parents ran a grocery store and I would take his groceries home and I would see all of these pictures of this famous woman, Aretha Franklin.

And here I am today. She's made my name a household word. I've traveled much of the globe because of her. I will in her debt all of my life, but I'm certainly thankful that she got her heavenly reward.

YOUNG: What was that voice like when you were in the room and the fact that you see so many people in Detroit touched by her love for the city as well?

SMITH: Well, her voice was like none other. Governor Jim Blanchard called it a natural resource of Detroit. And it's what Detroit was exporting that was always good, the voice of Aretha Franklin.

YOUNG: My very last question is, how will you guys move forward now in terms of trying to remember Aretha Franklin?

SMITH: Well, we're waiting on the family, whatever the family tells us, that's what we're going to do. And I do hope that they understand that I'm just here to serve them. My personal wish is for a mural (ph) of Aretha and her father on the back of the church as a permanent marker for this place being the place where the great voice of C.R. Franklin and Aretha Franklin was heard.

YOUNG: OK, thank you so much, reverend. I really appreciate you.

Look, you talk often and we give people these monikers, the king of pop or whatever. But there's only one queen of soul. And you can feel the love for her within this city. I went to a barbershop yesterday and everyone in there had somewhat of a personal story about their connection with Aretha Franklin.

And something that I want to point out here is, a lot of people loved her for the idea that she never left this city. She didn't give up on this city. And now you see the city coming back, and they feel like Aretha's love for it was part of that reason that so many people felt the need to come back to this city.

So, John, and you listen to the music, it puts a smile on your face, and know that she spanned six decades and to touch as many people as she did, feeding so many people in this city over and over again. A lot of people said she could have left, but she stayed.

John.

[12:05:03] KING: Ryan Young, grateful for that great reporting.

It's a sad day but also a celebration. Please extend our thanks and our gratitude for Reverend Smith for taking time on this difficult day.

Joining me now on the phone with their insights on this remarkable woman, her remarkable career in music and her contributions, CNN's Van Jones and CNN contributor Nischelle Turner.

Nischelle, let me start with you first as we celebrate Aretha Franklin the entertainer. Put her into context. She is the queens, ahead of the pack and by herself and alone.

NISCHELLE TURNER, CNN CONTRIBUTOR (via telephone): Absolutely. And putting her into context is hard to do, John, because she set the standard in so many way for so many artists of today. We've seen so many of them pay tribute to her and talk about how she changed the face of music.

Paul McCartney said it this morning, that she inspired their generation, inspired them and the Beatles. And so when you think about that, and think about how she put soul music into the mainstream in a lot of ways, she really did inspire a generation of music.

And she was effortlessly fusing her gospel sound into soul music and making it -- and making it mainstream. So it's hard to put her into context because when you heard her voice and the things that she could do -- I remember 1998, I think it was Pavarotti, I think, became sick and couldn't perform at the Grammys, and Aretha Franklin stepped in, on a moment's notice, and shamed (ph) this opera just effortlessly. She brought people to their feet. She brought tears to their eyes. And that just showed her range and showed everything that she could do.

I mean, you know, it is a sad day, but I heard you say it's a celebration. And, actually, I am on the set of "Murphy Brown" for "Entertainment Tonight" here in New York today. And if you remember that show, you remember how much Aretha Franklin's music meant to Murphy Brown when she gave birth to her son on that iconic episode. The first thing she did was sing "Natural Woman" to him.

And I just talked to Candace Bergen about Aretha and her legacy and she told a great story about sitting at the piano and singing "Natural Woman" on the set of "Murphy Brown" with Aretha and how much it meant to her and how much she will remember that and with her was a moment in history for her. So just those little things that have happened along the way of her six decade career, what shaped her to be the queen of soul.

KING: A remarkable moment. And what makes it so stunning is it's just one of dozens and dozens and dozens.

Van Jones, I want to bring you in, but I'm going to make you wait one second. I'm going to make it worth your while, though. Aretha Franklin at the House of Blues in 2008 singing her signature "Respect."

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ARETHA FRANKLIN, MUSICIAN (singing): What you want, baby I got it. What you need, you know I've got it. All I'm asking, is for a little respect.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KING: So, Van, you're watching Aretha Franklin here singing "Respect." But if we rewind the clock to when she first started singing that song, maybe many Americans, maybe younger Americans don't remember it as such or realize it as such, it's a civil rights ballot.

VAN JONES, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR (via telephone): Absolutely. You know, it's a -- it's a sad day. But, you know, she is somebody whose -- her voice, her artistry would stand by itself, speak for itself. But she -- she comes out of tradition. Her father, C.L. Franklin, was already an icon, a civil rights giant. And she grew up in that church singing, you know, gospel music in that church, but under the direction and tutelage of a father that she never stopped talking about and Detroit has never stopped talking about, C.L. Franklin.

And then that song, you know, became an anthem both for women and for African-Americans. It was the only real song that bridged those two movements in real time instantly in 1967. And she was honored by everybody. I mean, you know, George Bush -- George W. Bush gave her the Medal of Freedom. Barack Obama had her sing at his inauguration. I mean she's just a universal icon.

But she was always a friend of poor folks and people who were seeking justice. When Angela Davis, probably the most controversial woman of her moment, was arrested, ultimately cleared, Aretha Franklin said, I will bail her out and was willing to put up a quarter million dollars to bail her out. People were shocked by that. But she said, listen, she's a friend of black women, she's a black leader, and that became a part of the legacy as well. KING: Van and Nischelle, Van just mentioned George W. Bush. And I --

we have some sound from George W. Bush. This is the impact she had. One of the things, when you cover politics, you're around a lot of celebrities, you're around a lot of politicians, is watching the face of the president of the United States, for example, whether it's George W. Bush or Barack Obama, we have it both, when you understand when they understand they are in a special place because they're around famous people all the time, they're around celebrities all the time, they're themselves the president of the United States, and they get chills being around Aretha Franklin.

[12:10:15] Listen here to George W. Bush.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GEORGE W. BUSH, FORMER U.S. PRESIDENT: One record executive put it this way, Aretha is still the best singer in the world bar none. She finds meanings in lyrics that the composers didn't even know they had. She chills you, heats you, effects your soul. It's exhilarating.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KING: She chills you, heats you, effects your soul. It's exhilarating, Nischelle.

TURNER: Yes. Yes. Absolutely. I got chills just listening to that.

JONES: I only got a chance to meet her one time. I was in Nashville, Tennessee. I was just a young guy. I was walking through a hotel lobby and she was sitting there. Her staff was trying to figure out where she was supposed to be next.

And I just went over to say hello to her. And she treated me like I was the most important person in the world. She was tired. I was nobody. She was the queen. She was regal. But she asked me, where are you from? Where's your mother from? Where's your father from? You look like a good, you know, young man. Keep your studies. Stay in your -- stay in your books.

I mean she just had that regal quality where you walked away feeling like you were the important one, even though she was a global superstar. And she -- and I can tell you there are thousands and thousands of people who can tell you similar stories. She was the queen, but she was the people's queen.

TURNER: Well, I have one. I mean, you know, out of the blue, about three years ago, I got an e-mail from Aretha. Just out of the blue. And it was just her saying that she watched me on television and she was -- oh, I'm sorry, I'm getting a little choked up. She was proud of me. That meant the world to me, as you can imagine.

And so I started e-mailing her back. And we struck up, you know, a relationship over e-mails. She would invite me to her birthday parties and talk about how much fun they were and just check in every now and then. And she would tell me about other women that she was very supportive of and that she -- that she loved. And it -- it was just very special because here she was, an icon, a legend, the queen of soul, taking time to tell a young reporter in this business how special she was, that she mattered. That meant the world to me, and I'll never forget it.

KING: Well, in many ways, that's as great, if not a greater legacy than the music itself, just being such a mentor and a supporter of others.

TURNER: Absolutely.

KING: As she said, she wants to be remembered most of all as a wonderful mother. And we will do that as we continue our coverage.

Nischelle and Van, thanks so much for your insights there.

Next for us here, her legacy, undeniable, but the queen herself, as I just noted, wanted to be remembered, listen here, for more than her music.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What would you want people to remember about Aretha and her voice?

ARETHA FRANKLIN, MUSICIAN: That not only was I a wonderful artist, but I am a wonderful woman and a wonderful mother. That's what I'd like for you -- and a friend -- to remember about me.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[12:17:20] (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ARETHA FRANKLIN, MUSICIAN (singing): Darling, believe me there is no one -- no body but you. Please, baby, love me too. Will you do that? Answer my prayer.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KING: Our breaking news this hour, Aretha Franklin, the queen of soul, has passed on at the age of 76. As we celebrate her life and legacy, tributes flowing in from around the world.

This statement released just moments ago from the former president of the United States, Barack Obama. Among the things Michelle and Barack Obama say in this statement, she helped us feel more connected to each other, more hopeful, more human, and sometimes she helped us just forget about everything else and dance.

Amen to those words from the former president.

And let's bring in a civil rights icon, the Congressman John Lewis. He joins me on the phone right now.

And, congressman, I want to read a bit of your statement too because it -- I found it so poignant. You talk about times when you were jailed for your nonviolent protests during the movement. When we would be released from jail after a nonviolent protest, we might go to a late-night club and let the music of Aretha Franklin fill our hearts. She was like a muse whose songs whispered the strength to continue on.

Sir, I appreciate your time today. Just your thoughts and reflections on the remarkable life of Aretha Franklin.

REP. JOHN LEWIS (D), GEORGIA: Well, we have -- thank you, John.

We have lost one of the great spirits of our time. Aretha inspired all of us with her unbelievable capacity and ability to make us smile, for us to dance, to be happy. She was just a wonderful, beautiful soul.

I met her on several occasions. And she was always up and always asking about people. About a year and a half ago, I saw her in Washington at the Portrait Gallery and she went asking about all of the people in the movement that she knew, about some of the young people.

One moment I will never forget in August 1967, she was performing at a convention for Dr. King. She was singing and she got happy and she kept singing. And Dr. King asked someone to go over and tell Aretha, we've got to close it out, it's getting late. But she was feeling so good about being there to perform for Dr. King and the movement. That was the last performance that Dr. King witnessed of hers.

[12:20:04] KING: I watched an interview this morning right after this news broke and she was minimizing her role as a civil rights leader, as a civil rights pioneer, saying, oh, she might have been at the marches, but she was in the back, that she didn't think of herself as such an influence. I'm assuming you would dispute that.

LEWIS: I would dispute that because she did so much. She would help gather people together, to raise money. I think she was deeply motivated and inspired, not just by her own music, but also by the teaching and the preaching of her father.

KING: And there are different ways to make your point. You were on the front lines, sir. You were jailed. You were bloodied. You were beaten. How important is it as you're trying to make your case, largely to white America to listen, when you do have this remarkable entertainer who suddenly becomes more mainstream. What contribution does that make to the cause?

LEWIS: Well, Aretha and so many other entertainers, they were black, they were white, they were Hispanic, but they all came together to make it real, to make it plain. And Dr. King used to say from time to time when people would be singing or preaching, make it plain, make it real. And that's what these musicians and entertainers had the ability to do.

I was in New York, oh, about two or three years ago and she saw me and she said, come to my birthday party. Come to my birthday party. And after the concert, she invited me to come to a birthday party. And it was really in the lobby of a hotel in downtown Manhattan. KING: It is a very long list, a tribute to her long legacy and long

career, but if Congressman John Lewis, civil rights hero, had to pick an Aretha Franklin song to listen to, to reflect on this day, what would it be?

LEWIS: Oh, "Respect." "Respect."

KING: Amen for that.

Congressman John Lewis, appreciate your time on this day and your insights on the impact of this remarkable woman, Aretha Franklin.

Congressman, again, thank you so much. Appreciate it.

I want to bring in CNN's Don Lemon, who also knew Aretha Franklin personally.

Don, let me just start, I heard you earlier, but I just want, now that you're with a camera here and you can look our viewers in the eye, to just share your thoughts on this day.

DON LEMON, CNN ANCHOR, "CNN TONIGHT": Well, it's obviously a sad day. I've been heartened by all the tributes and all the people who are saying, you know, really kind things about Aretha, as they should. She is an icon. She's a legend. And to hear someone like John Lewis speak about her really warms your heart.

You know, I got to spend some time with her, not a lot of time, like many of her friends that she's known for decades. I've known her for the past five, maybe five -- seven -- five to seven years. And we just developed this friendship where we would contact each other, often through texts, and every once in a while I would get a random phone call from her. And then, you know, we would do lunch or I'd go to her party or see her here in the city.

The last time I saw her was in 2017, in the late spring, early summer when she was here for the release party for Clive Davis. And she performed. And she looked amazing. And I can only imagine then -- she didn't tell us then, but what she was dealing with, because then after that she no longer, you know, did concerts.

I -- I'm just -- I'm heartbroken. But I'm heartened that her legacy will live on. The music will play on. And as we've been listening, John, to so many hits. And, you know, John, I've been -- I've been speaking to a lot of folks who -- who knew her. And one of them is also iconic legend is Dionne Warwick. And I think Dionne is on with us now.

Ms. Warwick, ae you there?

DIONNE WARWICK, MUSICIAN (via telephone): Yes, I am.

LEMON: How are you doing today?

WARWICK: I'm trying to pull this together. You know, we've lost an iconic not only voice but person. I've known Re (ph) since she was 15. We were both teenagers when we first met. And it's sad.

But, you know, her father, being a minister, and my grandfather also was a minister, and my grandfather told me many years ago -- and I'm sure Aretha's father must have said something of this nature -- that God put us all here for a purpose. And, you know, once we've fulfilled that purpose, his reward is to call us home. And I -- all I can say is that he's built the major part of that choir up there in heaven.

[12:25:06] LEMON: So tell us about -- you know, you guys came along at the same time. I've seen some of the images of you and Stevie Wonder, Hayley Jackson (ph), all of you in the same room. What was it like? Because you had to come up through the ranks then. It wasn't just like someone pulled you off of "Star Search." You had to -- you had to earn it. And both of you certainly did that.

WARWICK: Oh, absolutely. You know, I remember when Aretha first joined Columbia Records. And they had her recording something that was so completely out of what we now know as Aretha Franklin's sound. And -- but I thought she was doing a great job at it, as a matter of fact. You know, Re (ph) has -- and has always had the ability to just adjust to whatever the situation happened to have been, especially musically. She is iconic in every single field of music. And my special memory of her will always be a gospel feel.

LEMON: You know, she's been called -- you know Aretha, she's been called a diva and, you know, she would let you know how she felt. What do you say to that?

WARWICK: I think that's what made her Aretha, you know? I also had (INAUDIBLE) same way. You know, I don't think that it would be fair to people not to be who you are one way with them Monday and then the next time they saw you you're another way. You know, she had that, what you see is what you get attitude. And that's what Aretha was all about.

I know -- I know, you know, everybody heard about whatever it was that Aretha supposedly and I was going through at one time, which I felt was, well, you know, Aretha's being Aretha. So I just shined (ph) that on and didn't dignify it because I'm sure that she would never have dignified it. So that has passed. And no ill thoughts or memories about that for me.

LEMON: Yes. Well, I'm glad that you guys -- listen, with friends and loved ones, you have ups and downs. You have agreements and you have disagreements. But I'll just give you -- just give you, for me, she meant so much to my family and to my mother and to people of your generation. And then you guys passed so much on to us.

Talk to us about the legacy she will and people like her leaves behind for us, especially the civil rights movement until now. What should we know? What can we learn from her?

WARWICK: Well, I think, first of all, there was only one Aretha. And there will only be one Aretha. There will never be another one. She had something that God gave only to her. She -- you know, I knew her very, very well. And with the fact that my

(INAUDIBLE) sweet inspirations traveled the road with her, doing background work and opening her shows, I got to know her even better. So, you know, she was -- she's basically considered part of our family.

LEMON: Yes.

WARWICK: You know, it was -- it was that closeness that we all had together. So I think her legacy will be her music, of course --

LEMON: Yes.

WARWICK: But her -- but her consistency of being available to do what she had to do, when she had to do it, why, and for whom.

LEMON: Yes.

WARWICK: And she will be missed. God knows she'll be missed, that's for sure.

LEMON: Absolutely.

WARWICK: And, you know, I'll miss her singing a song that became a favorite of mine when I first met her, when she was on the road with her father, singing before he preached. And that song will always live with me regarding who and what Aretha is. A song called "Never Grow Old."

LEMON: No, "Never Grow Old," yes.

WARWICK: Yes. Uh-huh. That was my song with regard to when I remember -- when I think of Aretha, I think of "Never Grow Old."

LEMON: Yes. Well --

WARWICK: And (INAUDIBLE) -- she did many of my recordings (INAUDIBLE).

LEMON: She did. She -- "Say a Little Prayer." Right, you guys recorded the same songs.

Well, Ms. Warwick, I know that you have to -- you're off to Brazil. So I will let you go.

WARWICK: Yes, I'm closing this last suitcase now.

LEMON: Well, thank you. Well, you -- listen, you handle your business, and we thank you for calling in to pay tribute to your friend and legend Aretha Franklin. And from another legend Dionne Warwick.

Thank you, Ms. Warwick.

WARWICK: Absolutely. And my sincere condolences to the family. Absolutely.

[12:30:00] LEMON: Thank you. Absolutely. WARWICK: Take care.

LEMON: John King, you -- you heard Dionne Warwick in "Say a Little Prayer," originally recorded by Dionne Warwick and then Aretha Franklin did it was well and she - you know, you heard Dionne say that they recorded