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Police: SC Army Trainee Arrested After Hijacking Buss Full of Kids; Rep. Stefanik Supports 2020 Arizona Election Audit; Cheney: Ignoring Trump's Election Lies "Will do Profound Long-term Damage to our Party"; Cornell Student Launches "COVID Campus Coalition" to Combat Vaccine Misinformation on Social Media; Former Trump Aides Assist in 2022 Senate & Governor Campaigns. Aired 12-12:30p ET

Aired May 06, 2021 - 12:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[12:00:00]

KATE BOLDUAN, CNN HOST: John King will be picking up our coverage right now.

JOHN KING, CNN HOST: Well, everybody and welcome to Inside Politics. I'm John King in Washington. Thank you for sharing your day with us today. President Biden arrives in Louisiana next hour.

The setting today doubles as the message. The 75 year old bridge is 20 years past its expiration date. The president plans to set it up this contrast between real but rebuilding America and continuing to reward corporations by leaving the Trump tax cuts in place.

Today, some new economic numbers show the economy is gaining steam. Weekly new jobless claims came in under 500,000 for the first time since March 2020. That of course, this one the pandemic began.

Vaccine hesitancy remains a major hurdle. A new data show getting to hurt immunity will be a big slog here in the united states and a pair of drug company CEOs say staying protected could well make periodic COVID vaccine booster shots part of our new normal, more of the president's travels and those pandemic challenges ahead.

But we begin the hour with a moment of choosing for the Republican Party. Florida's ambitious Republican Governor found it OK today you see it right there to give Fox News exclusive rights to a bill signing exclusive access to state business. That is how Putin and - do business.

It is not how democracies are supposed to work. Here in Washington and in Wyoming the pressing GOP choice is between the truth or Trump between principle and power. Congresswoman Liz Cheney will soon lose her house leadership post the price for refusing to let the former president's election lies go unanswered.

In Washington, Cheney has few remaining allies even most Republicans who agree with her don't have the courage to publicly join her in defying the GOP's lying leader.

And back in her home state new CNN reporting today shows the impact of this fight a growing number of potential Cheney primary challenges, many of them eager to parrot Trump's lies about the election and also about the insurrection.

Let's begin there, with us to share their reporting and their insights CNN's Manu Raju and CNN's Nia-Malika Henderson. Manu, I want to start with you on Capitol Hill and I just want to show our viewers, the front page the lead page of the drudge report today, which focuses on this Washington drama about Liz Cheney knives out for Cheney. She is defiant.

The drudge report says there we go. We see it up on the screen. The votes are there. This is done. Many say it's about Liz Cheney. It's really about the direction of the Republican Party and the truth.

MANU RAJU, CNN CHIEF CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, no question about it. I mean, this is all about how best to position themselves to take back the house majority come 2022. And what Kevin McCarthy, the House Republican Leader has calculated is that he cannot afford to get crosswise with the former President Donald Trump.

That's a much different calculation than the Senate Republican Leader Mitch McConnell has made about taking back the U.S. Senate. McConnell wants nothing to do with Trump going forward and won't even under his name.

But McCarthy on the other hands has tracked down to Mar-a-Lago has continued to stay in contact with the former president has discussed with him Cheney's future and was going to elevate someone who is a close Trump ally. Elise Stefanik has the votes locked up.

She has been talking to members all across the conference; she made it very clear that she is on Trump's side over the last several years as a leader in fighting back against the first impeachment which has really got on Trump's radar here.

So things are moving pretty rapidly. But you know we should not understate how significant it is for a shake up like this to happen midterm and a leadership team.

This rarely happens in congress, particularly as someone of this magnitude but as Liz Cheney is. We have not seen a shake up from the House Republican conference really like this is 2015, when John Bainer abruptly resigned his speakership but that is what's going to happen here.

Liz Cheney is out because of her calling out Donald Trump and she's not going down quietly, expect more pushback on Donald Trump's claims in the days ahead, John.

KING: And so as you watch this play out, Elise Stefanik, as you noted, the Congresswoman from New York is - it's done that the books are cooked if you will, that fixes into make her the new number three.

So she's introducing herself to the country and to maybe some of the party, you don't know so what better way to do that you go on the podcast of Steve Bannon pardoned by the former president because of ethical and legal questions about his behavior and listen to Elise Stefanik if you had any doubts, she's with Trump.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. ELISE STEFANIK (R-NY): I fully support the audit in Arizona. We want transparency and answers for the American people. What are the Democrats so afraid of?

The American people deserve transparency and answers and we want to be able to fix and strengthen our election security and election integrity.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KING: Nia-Malika Henderson the votes were counted in Arizona.

NIA-MALIKA HENDERSON, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: Yes.

KING: There was an opportunity to do a recount the way the laws work. The Republican Party used to be the party of law and order. Now they've brought in a private company and they've taken public taxpayer ballots putting them - it's that's what's happening in Arizona, but at least defined access. It's great.

[12:05:00]

HENDERSON: That's right. You know, she says the American public wants answers. The American public has had answers. The Republican Party just doesn't like the answers that have been available. They don't like the sort of transparency either.

KING: And -

HENDERSON: Yes, yes. So that's what you see happening. Listen, if you're Kevin McCarthy, you see, Elise Stefanik, somebody who's a fellow traveler, obviously Trump sees the same thing. And Kevin McCarthy is looking at the reality. The party is Trump's party.

They did fairly well in 2020. They gained 11 seats in the house, they only need to I think flip five to win back the gavel to put Nancy Pelosi out of the speaker's office. So they are doubling down on Trump doubling down on Trumpism.

And Liz Cheney is not going quietly she had this Op-ed in the Washington Post, essentially saying that Donald Trump is a threat to democracy, that the party really has to decide where their future is in they have at least for now, does this matter in the long term, if you look at the sort of demographic shifts in the country and the ways in which particularly suburban voters are trending? Sure, but in the short term, it's probably a gamble that we're taking for Kevin McCarthy.

KING: Right. They believe Manu building the foundation of 2022 on Trump, but it's a house built on a foundation of lies, but they believe it gets them back into power. You're part of this reporting new CNN reporting of what's happening out in Liz Cheney state in Wyoming and the district. And it's fascinating and it just underlines and underscores what we're getting here. What the Republicans are going to get when they forced Liz Cheney out and I want to read a little bit from it here. Chuck Gray, a Wyoming Republican State Legislator absolutely believes that former President Donald Trump won the 2020 election.

He says that Wyoming representative Liz Cheney vote to impeach Trump for inciting the riot was unconscionable and disgusting and cannot stand for a month's long effort to push back against Trump big lie that he actually won the race.

Trump's - the Big Lie I'm sorry, "The Big Lie is what Liz Cheney is," Gray told CNN, "Liz Cheney is the liar." He says Liz Cheney is the liar. He says the media, not Donald Trump was responsible for the insurrection. That is fantasyland.

RAJU: Yes. And I asked him multiple times whether or not the Trump supporters had actually come into this building on January 6 that everybody saw with their own eyes that there's been ample video evidence that occurred.

And he said would not say whether or not in fact, Trump supporters were in this building and pivoted to what happened last summer Black Lives Matter criticize the media. And this all comes as both gray and the other Republicans in the race are vying for that Trump endorsement.

And what we've seen and not just in Wyoming but in other primaries across the country, is that the litmus test is about whether or not you endorse Donald Trump's conspiracies and lies about the 2020 election.

If you don't you end up on people like Liz Cheney, you can get targeted by the former president. If you do, potentially you could win his backing. And the way the Trump forces are going after Liz Cheney is that they are trying to unite behind one single candidate Trump is weighing in endorsement there are interviews of potential candidates, others are weighing whether they should get in.

And they are concerned that if there's multiple candidates essentially could fray the anti Cheney vote. So they look for an effort to try to clear the field find one specific candidate, but there's a real serious effort. Cheney's paying attention to it.

And the Trump team is as well as they believe Trump allies believe she's vulnerable if they find the right candidate.

KING: And they believe they want to make an example of her and that she's a high profile example, obviously the daughter of a former vice president and establish a Republican, if you will. Nia-Malika Henderson you mentioned the op-ed, I want to read some of it.

While embracing or ignoring Trump's statements might seem attractive to some for fundraising and political purposes.

That approach will do profound long term damage to our party and our country. We Republicans need to stand for genuinely conservative principles and steer away from the dangerous and anti democratic Trump cult of personality.

Everything she says in the op-ed is factual about the elections and all that. What's interesting to me is that politics in the end is about math. And there aren't many Republicans who are raising their hand saying I want to stand with Liz Cheney, put me on television.

I want to stand with Liz Cheney. There are some if you ask them a question, Senator Romney, Congressman Kinzinger, but there is not a flood of Republicans coming to her defense because they understand the math.

HENDERSON: They understand what is happening to her. She's being ousted from leadership. They also understand what happened to people like Jeff Flake and Bob Corker and Justin Amash; they didn't have a future in the party. They were essentially a run out.

This is Trump's party, you have to pay loyalty to him you have to spell his lies to be a member in good standing at this point.

KING: It is - that's the key point to be a member in good standing. You have to accept a lie. You don't join that club. To be a member in good standing you have to accept the lie. There it is, Nia-Malika Henderson, Manu Raju grateful for the reporting and insights.

Up next for us a college student fights COVID vaccine, misinformation and conspiracies in part by translating science on TikTok.

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[12:10:00]

KING: The overall COVID trend lines look better, but there are some warning signs. If you look at the vaccine rollout data and some of the polling about vaccine hesitancy let's walk through some important numbers.

Number one, the case timeline here you see the cases down 44,510 new infections yesterday you see across the top. The seven day average 46,000 plus new infections that is the lower since back in October so still stubbornly high, but down about seven, seven month low right now as you look at it that way.

The same thing here, this is never there's nothing good to say when you're looking at the deaths from COVID across the United States but the numbers now as low as they were back in July 2020. So progress if that's the right word still horrific.

We lost 776 Americans to COVID yesterday, but well down well down from the horrible highs of the winter there hospitalizations as well trending down. This is four straight days under 40,000 Americans in the hospital across the United States because of COVID.

So these numbers are getting better without a doubt, in part they're getting better because of this 32 percent of the American population is now fully vaccinated. 45 percent of the population has at least one dose among those 18 and over 41 percent fully vaccinated.

[12:15:00]

KING: And among those 65 and over 70 percent are fully vaccinated, especially here the progress among those who are most vulnerable. That is significant. The vaccine pace however, has slowed in recent days without a doubt. 2.1 million is the seven day average right now?

That's the lowest in two months. You see the peak in the Biden Administration. I got happy about this. But it is starting to trail off some of its access, but some of it is hesitancy people who don't want to get the vaccine that has changed over time.

This is from the Kaiser family foundation. Look, if you go back to January 31 percent had a wait and see attitude about the vaccine. Only 15 percent say that now 56 percent of Americans say I got it, I got my shot in the arm. But look at this steady line at 13 percent.

Definitely not 13 percent of Americans say definitely not add in the 15 percent who are still a little hesitant wait and see. That's the hesitancy issue there. Let's look at it more closely among those who say definitely not 20 percent of white evangelicals, 20 percent identify as Republicans 20 percent rural residents 12 percent in the age 18 to 29 group.

So let's talk about this hesitancy and how to deal with it with two very different people working in this fight. With us to share their expertise Dr. Scott Harris, he's the State Health Officer for the State of Alabama Department of Public Health. And Jordan Tralins is a Cornell University Sophomore and Founder of the COVID Campus Coalition. I want to start with you on campus there.

And I want to look at this number right here, 12 percent 18 to 29, not going to get a vaccine. So you have decided, Jordan to take this on you say this a lot of misinformation out there students seeing on social media seeing elsewhere, whether it's fertility, whether it's viral load lots of different things. So you are using TikTok. Take a look.

We like the mic drop. We like the mic drop a lot, so why, why did you decide this was so important? And do you have any feedback anecdotal or data wise, it tells you what you're doing is working.

JORDAN TRALINS, FOUNDER, COVID CAMPUS COALITION: Of course. So most people from my generation don't spend their free time sifting through scientific literature to formulate opinions about COVID vaccines and scientific matters in general, we really look at what's on our social media.

And that influences the way that we see the world. And I noticed early in the vaccine rollout, I wasn't seeing too much positive information or factual information about COVID vaccines on my social media pages.

And that's what inspired me to start at first on TikTok, and now on Instagram, the COVID campus coalition which has expanded to over 20 universities across the nation. KING: Amen for what you're doing. And Dr. Harris, come in at that

point, I want to just show the numbers the statistics in Alabama right now. If you look right now you're 32 percent of the population nationwide, fully vaccinated only 24 percent in your state of Alabama and you move bring it over here.

If you look at the counties here in Alabama, the darker the shading is the higher hesitancy in the counties. I know you have spoken about having doctors, people who have respect relationships in the community, recording videos or recording messages.

Maybe Jordan gave you some TikTok tips, if you will. It's a different generation maybe that you're trying to reach, but why do you think that that is the way to do it? She's getting with her members of her age group you want to get with people who say I respect I know dr. Harris, so I know the doctor from my community. Why is that so important?

DR. SCOTT HARRIS, STATE HEALTH OFFICER, AL DEPT. OF PUBLIC HEALTH: Yes, I think that hesitancy comes in a lot of different flavors. And so people depend on different sources of information. They depend on different trusted voices when they're making up their mind about what to do.

We know that in many parts of our state people have questions about what they hear from a government official or someone in the media. They are much more likely to trust someone that they have a personal relationship, particularly if that person is their own family physician or healthcare provider.

And so we've encouraged particularly primary care doctors, but all physicians in the state to personally reach out to people that they have a relationship with and tried to make the case for getting vaccinated.

KING: And Jordan, the public health professionals around the country who've been doing yeoman's work like dr. Harris for the last year plus, they understand that number one, they're doing great work. But number two; there are people out there who push back who question just about everything.

They hear from the scientists from the public health experts. I want to just scroll through we can show some of the Instagram scrolls. You have, you go you look at the CDC website. You look at the New England Journal of Medicine.

You look for places where you can find good info-graphics and then you put them in to your Instagram feed, a talk about the pushback. Where does it come from?

TRALINS: I definitely think the pushback just comes from a general lack of factual information and data and a lack of knowing where to turn for that information. So that's the whole notion surrounding our platform is we want factual information about COVID vaccines to be readily accessible to students.

[12:20:00]

TRALINS: Because I think that a lot of students and people in general, just don't fully know exactly where to look to find the statistics. It's not really being thrown directly in their face. And so we really want to have the facts presented in a clear manner that's eye catching and exciting for students and the general population to be able to easily interpret.

KING: And Dr. Harris help us like anything, as you have more experience doing something, you find out what works. And if something does work, you amp that up, if something doesn't work, you try something new in terms of getting convincing the skeptics, whether it's people who don't trust the science, whether people who are young, who think I'm invincible, it doesn't matter.

In your experience, what has worked and is there anything you thought would work that is simply proven? Nope, people aren't listening.

DR. HARRIS: You know, you - I guess we naively thought if we just roll the science out there and said, all scientists and medical professionals agree on this, then people would somehow just be convinced, but clearly, it's not that simple at all.

We certainly do see it as our role to make sure that we'll have the right information. We try to make it as, as much in layman terms as possible. We try to explain that we think we do have safe and effective vaccine products, that they're important to protect health, they're reporting to getting the economy open.

They're important to getting us back to normalcy. But at the same time, really what matters in our experience is that people need to have a very strong recommendation from someone that they trust, particularly someone they know personally that trust.

It seems like no matter how much information you give people that sometimes that's just not enough to overcome doubts unless someone that they really know well speaks up and encourage them to get vaccinated.

KING: That's one of the great things going through this for all the difficulties of the last year plus 14 months plus is to see you know, people trying to do whatever they can to help. Dr. Harris, Jordan Tralins, it's grateful for both of your time and insights today and grateful for what you're doing every day, much more importantly, helping us win the fight. Appreciate it to both of you.

When we come back, President Biden is headed to Louisiana to ask this question. What matters more to you repairing crumbling roads and bridges or protecting the Trump tax cuts?

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[12:25:00]

KING: New reporting today highlighting the web of Trump influence spreading in Republican campaigns across the country. And the big money being made by Trump world operatives at a time many Republican candidates are very eager to stay in the former president's good graces. CNN counts Kellyanne Conway, Tony Fabrizio, Corey Lewandowski, David Bossie, Bill Stepien, Tim Murtaugh among the former Trump aides doing work on 2022 races. And many of them are getting paid top dollar one Trump campaign aide boasted of making $20,000 in one month as a consultant on a Senate campaign.

CNN's Gabby Orr has been doing this fantastic reporting and joins me now. Gabby what else did you learn?

GABBY ORR, CNN REPORTER: Well, John, that $20,000 figure really shows that Republicans running in 2022 primaries but also in some gubernatorial races that will be happening this fall are willing to pay top dollar in order to get Trump advisors on their team and helping with their campaign.

We're seeing this take place and everywhere from Alaska and Nebraska to Ohio and Virginia where people like White House counselor Kellyanne Conway, former Trump Campaign Communications Director Tim Murtaugh and of course Dave Lewis, David Bossie and Corey Lewandowski have been brought on by candidates in order to guide them through their races.

A lot of these Trump advisers are telling candidates up front, we cannot guarantee a Trump endorsement, which, of course is kind of the gold standard to have as a Republican running in a primary these days.

But what they are saying is that they are still an asset to their campaign because of their understanding with the Republican base and their ability to drive turnout and help court grassroots supporters of these mega causes.

Still, there are some races were having a Trump advisor on your campaign and as a Republican candidate could be a liability. Places like Ohio or North Carolina, these traditional battleground states where statewide candidates will have to appeal beyond the mega base beyond just Republican voters. Having those Trump voices involved in their campaigns could potentially cause problems.

KING: Watches all this plays out to a fascinating early stage of the 2022 campaign. But that Trump and the Trump people coming up everywhere, Gabby Orr, grateful of the important reporting.

Up next for us more children now back in the classroom, but when you look deep into the numbers, there's a big racial divide.

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