Return to Transcripts main page

Inside Politics

Biden Year Two Challenges: Ukraine, Inflation, Coronavirus; Biden Met With National Security Team Saturday To Discuss Russia; Biden Pushes Back On Progressives: I'm Not Bernie Sanders; Jan. 6 Committee Gets Access To 700 Pages Of Trump White House Docs; Senator Sinema Censured By Arizona Democratic Party. Aired 8-9a ET

Aired January 23, 2022 - 08:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[08:00:32]

(MUSIC)

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ABBY PHILLIP, CNN HOST (voice-over): Biden's reset. Inside the White House's plan to win back Americans sick of COVID chaos and rising prices.

JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I know there is a lot of frustration. We have faced some of the biggest challenges that we've ever faced in this country. But we're getting through it.

PHILLIP: Plus, Trump White House documents about January 6 are released to Congress. How much jeopardy is the ex-president in?

GEORGE CONWAY, ATTORNEY: Trump used to talk about how he could shoot someone on Fifth Avenue and basically, he was trying to shoot the constitution here.

PHILLIP: And delicate diplomacy. Can the West convince Putin not to invade Ukraine?

BIDEN: Let there be no doubt if Putin makes this choice, Russia will pay a heavy praise.

PHILLIP: INSIDE POLITICS, the biggest stories sourced by the best reporters, now.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

PHILLIP: Welcome to INSIDE POLITICS SUNDAY. I'm Abby Phillip.

President Biden begins his second year in office facing challenges everywhere he looks. A war is brewing in Eastern Europe, rising inflation is taking bite out of your paychecks and though there are signs that omicron may be peaking, the COVID death toll is back above 2,000 Americans a day for the first time since last summer.

"Time Magazine" framed it this way, storm clouds in the Oval Office with the president beset by crisis. At his news conference last week, Biden insisted we are in a far

better place than a year ago but he also acknowledged the frustration and anger that so many Americans are feeling.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BIDEN: You have to look at things we used to look at on balance. What is the trajectory of the country? Is it moving in the right direction now? I don't know how we can say it's not. I understand the overwhelming frustration, fear and concern with regard to inflation and COVID. I get it.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PHILLIP: Yet, the report card from voters isn't kind. Just 28 percent of Americans and fewer than half of Democrats think Biden should run for reelection.

The Biden White House is now trying to push a scaled down version of its legislative agenda in the hopes of putting some more wins on the board before the midterm elections.

Joining me now with their reporting and their insights, Asma Khalid of NPR, "Politico's" Rachael Bade, Astead Herndon of "The New York Times", and CNN's Jeff Zeleny.

So, Jeff, a lot of Democrats and many voters perhaps think that Biden actually does need a reset. But what are you hearing about what he thinks?

JEFF ZELENY, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: Well, Abby, Biden isn't as frustrated with his presidency as many Democrats and many admirers are, quite frankly. And that is one of the things that concerned so many of his supporters if they're on Capitol or governors out in the country or others. They wonder if he realizes how, you know, off the country is.

He said there is no doubt the country is moving in the right direction. That's not what Americans are feeling necessarily. The wrong track number, some two thirds of Americans simply believe the country is on the wrong track. That is worrisome.

And I was talking to one longtime admirer of the president, who wants him to succeed and he said he's really surprised by one thing. For a president who's so emphatic. We've seen President Biden so many ways show that empathy that his news conference on Wednesday, he was talking more about his accomplishments than feeling the concerns of average Americans. So, that is one of his challenges going forward, trying to feel those concerns and show that he is adapting them, not just simply trying to pushing through his own legislative program.

PHILLIP: Yeah. And to your point, Jeff, there is a lot of disappointment it seems in the polling. And when you look where he is in this NBC News poll and all these different groups, independents, Black voters, young voters, Latino voters, down by double digits.

When he says, I understand your pain, I think what your sources are saying is that he needs to say that more often.

But the White House seems to think to your point, Jeff, that Biden isn't getting enough credit for what he's done and to be fair, he did a lot in that first --

ZELENY: Sure.

PHILLIP: -- six months in office, the first year infrastructure COVID relief. But here is what voters have to say in the "New York Times" focus group that was very revealing. These are voters who voted for Obama, voted for Trump. Some of them said they would consider voting for Biden again but they are overwhelmingly despondent. Listen.

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

JANET, 66 YEARS OLD: I have seen the country, lots of ups and downs.

[08:05:04]

And I feel this is the lowest point in our -- in my lifetime.

ALICE, 60 YEARS OLD: You're not even safe to walk around and go to the train station because somebody might throw you off the train.

DON, 36 YEARS OLD: I actually was on the end of defunding the police at one point. But here recently, crime has skyrocketed.

NICK, 43 YEARS OLD: I've had COVID multiple times and I'm concerned with that. But inflation is hitting us every day in our pockets and everything that we do.

JULES, 42 YEARS OLD: I don't care about COVID anymore. I want my kids to have a regular life.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

PHILLIP: So that's a lot, Astead. But what is a potential opportunity for the White House to start to address at least some of those problems, whether it's COVID or crime or whatever it is, inflation that is on American's minds?

ASTEAD HERNDON, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: Yeah, it's a daunting task. I think that focus group makes it clear and that tracks what we see in the polling. It's not just a singular problem for this White House right now, it is problems across the board, across many different voting groups. I think that speaks to a kind of larger issue, yes. The White House was delivering some political wins in the first six months on COVID relief and infrastructure. But this was -- this was a campaign that raised the bar for what they were going to deliver.

Remember, by the general election, Joe Biden was telling the country not only would he not be Donald Trump, not only would he do to the virus, but it would solve the social inequities that the virus exposed. That this could be -- that this would be a presidency that looked at the kind of larger social ecosystem. And frankly, because of legislative kind of processing questions, they haven't come around to that.

And so, I think you have a country that feels a mismatch between promise and delivering on a lot of different fronts. The issue for the White House now is an election year and as we all know, in Washington, that usually means not a lot is going to get done from this point to the midterm election.

PHILLIP: So many big promises made in the campaign and a president who has much more experience than most.

Rachael, I mean, one of the things that stood out to you as from the press conference is the way that President Biden seemed to say, you know what, I don't want to be president senator anymore. I want to be just the president.

What do you think that means on Capitol Hill?

RACHAEL BADE, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: The comment was pretty revealing because Biden, you know, running for election to become president toted his record as a senator and saying, you know what, I struck deals, I reached across the aisle and I can get things done. Well, that hasn't really panned out much on Capitol Hill. It did obviously with the infrastructure bill, that that sort of -- haven't talked about that and touted it and, you know, it hasn't panned out with BBB, and trying to get Build Back Better passed and get his party on board.

And so, you know, to hear him say, I'm going to stop talking about being a president senator, it almost was an acknowledgement what he's doing isn't working. He talked about needing to go out and talk to the American public more. So, what he has gotten done and, you know, it's just again a reminder that this build back better bill he was promising the American public saying they would get paid leave, you know, pre-pre-K, expanded Medicare, expanded Medicaid hasn't panned out yet on Capitol Hill.

PHILLIP: And the other thing we wonder about naturally is who is going to be the liaison to the Senate. I mean, Rachel, you're hearing some frustration between Senator Joe Manchin, one of the most important senators right now and the president's chief of staff.

BADE: I mean, that's exactly right. One of the reasons why Build Back Better hasn't come back together and talks haven't taken off yet is because Joe Manchin is frustrated with the chief of staff of the White House, Ron Klain, because the White House came after him personally when he walked away from the table, to sort of question does he keep his word and that angered him.

So, you know, these talks have taken off again. It's been a month since the bill was frozen and that's a real problem for the White House right now especially as they look to sort of potentially reset, try to get something done before the midterms, time is really running out, and they don't have a main guy they need to vote on this bill in their corner to try to get it done yet.

PHILLIP: In the meantime, Asma, one of the problems for the Biden administration is sort of they're in a tough spot. They tried to address a problem they thought they had at the beginning and turned into something else.

Here is "The New York Times" editorial board. The discomforting truth is that the United States last year faced a choice between a projected period of economic pain and an economic recovery whose benefits are temporarily attenuated by high inflation. Mr. Biden made the right choice but it came at a real price economically for the nation and politically for him.

We're heading into a midterm election year, Asma. How does the White House make Americans feel better about their economic position in time for them to want to go and cast a ballot for Democrats come this fall?

[08:10:05]

ASMA KHALID, NPR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: That's a real significant challenge for this White House especially given that the primary economic concern that most families are feeling right now is inflation. And, you know, it is a truthful statement to say that the president, any president has limited powers to actually curve inflation. That's under the power of the Federal Reserve.

So what can Biden do to make people feel better? I would say they need to, the president and his administration needs to signify they understand that economic pain but I think part of this is tied to the COVID fatigue that folks have been feeling for a really, really long time. You know, you heard that in the "New York Times" focus group. It's real and something you've heard.

The other thing I want to say, Abby, I think there is some level of economic pain that folks on the progressive end of the spectrum feel the president hasn't done enough to address that he could have dealt with through executive order.

You know, at that press conference, the final question asked was by my colleague about forgiveness of $10,000 in student loan debt. That's something that the president pledged he would do during his campaign and something you've heard from progressives trust progressives frustrated he has not done, given he could do it unilaterally.

PHILLIP: And you hear that from voters all the time. They're wondering -- I mean, that's something that is directly hitting their pocketbooks. Where is that student loan forgiveness? It's an important question, Asma.

But coming up next, the latest on the situation unfolding in Ukraine. It could be the most dangerous moment for the United States and Russia relationship since the Cold War.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[08:16:03]

PHILLIP: New developments on the crisis in Ukraine. The United Kingdom is accusing Russia of plotting to install a pro-Moscow government in Kiev. Vladimir Putin's government denies the claim even as it amasses more than 100,000 troops along Ukraine's border. President Biden yesterday met with his national security team while at Camp David to discuss the latest intelligence.

And the U.S. has warned that an invasion could be imminent though the Russians deny that, too.

Jeff is back with me and Susan Glasser from the New Yorker joins the conversation, as well.

So, Susan, there is a lot of talk about an imminent invasion. You're hearing that from Capitol Hill, especially among Republicans. Do you see an invasion as imminent?

SUSAN GLASSER, STAFF WRITER, THE NEW YORKER: Look, it is clearly the assessment of the U.S. and allied intelligence services that this is a very real and increasingly real possibility. Right now, we're looking at 127,000 troops and counting on the border according to the latest numbers from the Ukrainian military intelligence. You have these new reports about destabilizing activities, cyber attacks, all the things you might see in the run-up to war.

Generally speaking, you don't put 127,000 troops on your neighbor's border unless you're planning to do something with them.

PHILLIP: Yeah, I think that's right. I mean, there is also that report that we were just talking about from the U.K. that Putin is considering putting a puppet government into Kiev. What is the game plan for Putin? Is that something in lieu of a physical invasion or in addition to? What do you see as where he is headed with all of this?

GLASSER: Well, look, first of all, Putin may not have made a final decision. That's important to note and his system is the lone decider. But this is the playbook. It's a playbook that's not theoretical, the playbook that the former Soviet Union ran many times.

I've been thinking a lot this week about, you know, Hungary or Prague in 1968. I mean, you know, the idea of a coup very much is consistent with the military buildup and a military invasion. Those two things may go together. It's not uncommon that you would see a situation where you destabilize or seek to overthrow the government in Kiev and then a new pro-Russian government might invite, say, the military forces in.

You know, serve as the basis for the pretext for some kind of invasion. These things unfortunately are very consistent with the military piece we've seen and observed.

PHILLIP: There was a lot of attention this week about President Biden's gaffe at the press conference as it relates to, you know, a small incursion into Ukraine. But I want to put up what's been done from a military perspective, in terms of aiding the Ukrainians. The U.S. gave the okay for anti-tank and anti-aircraft missiles, helicopters, patrol boats, ammunition, 200,000 pounds of lethal aid arriving in Ukraine on Friday.

But, and Ukraine -- President Zelensky is saying what he actually wants now is sanctions right now, before, not after Russia does something. Susan, what grade would you give the Biden administration in terms of

how they handled this overall?

GLASSER: Well, look, Abby, you know, it's a lot easier to go back after the fact when we know what happens and see. I think that, first of all, they have been very clear and taking a very interesting course of being very transparent, you know, getting out in front and they were the first to issue these warnings loudly. They had to go around actually Europe in December and talk to the allies and say, no, this is serious, this is really potentially happening.

So they were the first to pull the alarm to try to expose what Russia is doing when the military buildup was just beginning.

[08:20:00]

So that's an interesting technique. They don't want to be surprised. It was very embarrassing to the United States in 2014 when Putin managed to pull off his annexation of Crimea, and this was a shock to the United States and the West. So, I think -- you know, they get a good mark for making sure that doesn't happen again. Nobody is going to be surprised this time, but the goal here is not just to avoid surprises, to avoid a democratic country being taken over or subject to a major military attack by its neighbor.

PHILLIP: Right. And, Jeff, I mean, foreign policy really doesn't care about the timing the presidents like to have. There is already Afghanistan really something that's damaged the president standing at home and abroad.

What are the stakes here for Biden politically when it comes to this particular crisis? He clearly cannot afford another, you know, any sort of ground incursion into Ukraine at this particular moment in his presidency.

ZELENY: Look, the stakes are incredibly high for Biden. It's a major test for him on the world stage. Everyone, of course, watching -- China and North Korea, et cetera. But he also has a little control, in fact, no control over what Vladimir Putin decides to do.

There are not going to be new sanctions we don't believe until there is some type of invasion or incursion. There are have been multiple sanctions already, of course. But, look, this is a major test for President Biden who sought to reset the relationship with Russia.

It was only six or seven months ago that he was standing in Geneva with President Putin trying to get a new chapter in this relationship, and I think President Biden is not naive about this, at all. I mean, he's been watching Vladimir Putin for a long time. But there's not much he can do at the moment.

The interesting thing, of course, will be keeping the NATO allies together. When he did make the gaffe, if you will, at that press conference, he was sort of speaking the truth in the sense as we've been saying, is because there -- some of the NATO allies are not on the same page. A minor invasion, cyber attack is not the same as a major ground invasion.

But that, of course, is the White House has been moving on beyond that. But this is a huge test for President Biden and what President Putin does is going to affect his presidency and he knows that, of course.

PHILLIP: Yeah, I mean, he comes to the job with more foreign policy experience than most presidents.

ZELENY: Sure.

PHILLIP: And I think voters are looking to see how he handles this latest challenge to his presidency.

Susan Glasser, thanks for joining us. We'll have more with Jeff coming up.

But coming up next, President Biden's agenda stalls on Capitol Hill, but top progressives say it is time to deliver.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[08:27:14]

PHILLIP: Exactly one year ago on this show, Senator Elizabeth Warren told me why progressives like herself were excited for the Biden administration.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. ELIZABETH WARREN (D-MA): He acknowledges right up front that we're in the middle of a pandemic. We're in the middle of an economic crisis. We have just suffered through an insurrection and we are in the heart of a racial reckoning. And President Biden is saying he's ready to go. He's doing everything he can to respond to that, and I think that's exactly the right approach.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PHILLIP: Last year's COVID relief plan he include several important progressive priorities, like a bigger child tax credit and also direct payments to families. But most priorities from a minimize wage hike to police reform do remain unfulfilled.

So, Astead, a year ago, progressives were excited. They were willing to give Biden the benefit of the doubt about what he would be up to in his first year. What do you think the mood is right now?

HERNDON: I think the mood is exasperation. I think it's, frankly, resignation to an idea this is not going to be the first couple years in which the kind of fulfillment of progressives dreams comes to fruition, and you might say that was going to never happen because, obviously, President Biden is someone who is not naturally on that side of the ideological spectrum.

But there was real hope around that, particularly around that time you mentioned with Senator Warren, around -- after that COVID relief plan, I remember doing a story talking to members of the White House and some allies and they were saying that they have really cracked the code. They thought they were able to kind of walk that tight rope between going big and that the pandemic had given them a window to convince moderates to go along with that.

And that just hasn't panned out as we got further and further through the year, negotiations kept getting longer. Those senators kept rebuffing a little more and I think at this point, we're universal frustration.

Noting back to the convention where you had Bernie Sanders and John Kasich right to next each other say this new president will be able to fulfill both those sides of the spectrum. What we're seeing now is that both sides are a little disappointed.

PHILLIP: Bernie Sanders and John Kasich, I mean, that's --

HERNDON: Right.

PHILLIP: That's a really amazing thing.

But to that point we're already hearing, enter Mitch McConnell, right? He's signaling clearly how Republicans are going to try to box Biden in by saying this guy has gone way too far to the left. He's turning into Bernie Sanders.

And here is how Joe Biden responded to that at the press conference.

[08:29:49]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Well, I'm not Bernie Sanders. I'm not a socialist. I'm a main stream Democrat and I have been.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PHILLIP: So, who is right here, Asma? Did Biden go further to the left or is he still in the center where he has been actually, frankly, for most of his political career?

ASMA KHALID, WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT, NPR: I mean, so far in terms of the legislation he's been able to pass, I would say it's been fairly centrist.

I think, you know, the other comment we did hear from the president though in his press conference remarks is the fact he's got the backing of 48 of 50 of the Democratic senators and what is notable there is that he and Bernie Sanders have been aligned on most of the legislative priorities. It's two more moderate senators, Manchin and Sinema who he's not been able to align with.

One of the things I think that's been interesting throughout the year is that certainly, there are progressive activists from the outside who have been frustrated, exasperated and who've been voicing those concerns. I mean there was a lot of hope that the Biden White House would accomplish more than it has in its first year.

That being said, you know, I am struck by some of the pragmatism of some of the progressive leaders we've seen whether they're in the Senate or the House. Someone like, you know, Jayapal who's been willing to I think renegotiate --

PHILLIP: Yes.

KHALID: -- move sort of her standards of what's allowed and accomplish in her view in order to accommodate some of these more moderate voices.

PHILLIP: And to that --

(CROSSTALK)

KHALID: To me, what's been striking is the lack of pragmatism we've seen on the other side.

PHILLIP: Yes. I mean to that point, in many ways, it is the progressives who are saying let's get back to the table. Here is Bernie Sanders telling our reporters on Capitol Hill that, "We lost the enormously important vote last night," he's referring to voting rights, "and Build Back Better which is enormously popular with the American people. It's what they want us to do has also been sabotaged. I think it's time to move in a very different direction."

He is effectively in the same place as Biden which is to say, Jeff, he wants to move forward with something. Take a different strategy but working toward the Biden agenda.

ZELENY: Because Senator Sanders knows well as does everyone the clock is running out. I mean the window of time for passing a scaled-back Build Back Better plan, part of the president's economic agenda really, you know, time is running out. This is a midterm election year, no question.

So I think one of the things is the expectations now from both sides should be sort of in check. The majorities that President Biden is operating on in the Senate and in the House it's incredibly narrow. People know that, we've known that for a long time but that has not sort of lowered the expectations or tempered the expectations.

So in the coming weeks, I'm told, the Biden administration is going to be looking at more specific things on Build Back Better, talking about the health care, child care and climate. They're going to focus it on that.

And also look for them to be pressured to do more executive actions on voting reform. So that is where this is going in the short term but controlling those expectations has been a major challenge for this White House. It's a tough needle to thread.

PHILLIP: Yes. And Rachael -- I mean on voting, the big voting packages did fail last week but there is some bipartisan movement on a more narrow Electoral Count Act action. What are you hearing on the Hill?

BADE: Yes, I mean these talks are going to be continuing. Moderate Senate Republicans Susan Collins has basically been organizing these working groups where they're trying to see if there's something they can pass on the Electoral Count Act specifically.

This is something that would, you know, in theory address the issue that we saw on January 6th where you had President Trump putting a lot of pressure on his allies to try to throw the election to basically give more certainty saying you can't just do that.

And so that in and of itself, you know, would be significant if they can actually get something done. I mean talking Republicans, they don't actually have a lot of incentive right now politically to work with Biden given that his poll numbers are down and they're facing some good prospects in the midterms and you sort of see, you know, positioning themselves is not helping the White House at all as something that could good for them politically. But this is one area where perhaps you actually see some sort of movement.

So far the White House and Democrats have sort of, you know, downplayed the Electoral Count Act, saying they are not good enough, they're not good enough but look, that bill -- the bigger voting bill is not going anywhere. We've known this all year.

(CROSSTALK)

PHILLIP: And also, Rachael, I mean we should say, Republicans don't maybe want to come to the table on this because out in the world, Republican candidates are literally running on an attempt to steal the election. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BILLY LONG, SENATORIAL CANDIDATE: I'm running for Senate to stop the insanity. Stop the wokeness and stop the Democrats from stealing another election.

LINDY BLANCHARD, CANDIDATE: Fight for election security. The election was stolen from Donald Trump and now we're paying the price.

BERNIE MORENO, CANDIDATE: President Trump says the election was stolen and he's right.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PHILLIP: So Astead, I mean President Biden got a lot of grief for talking about the election and seeming to imply that he didn't think it could be fair if there were attempts to overturn the election. But at the same time, that is what is the reality out in the world in terms of what Republicans are running on in this country.

[08:34:54]

HERNDON: Yes, it is a massive disconnect between the issues that are dominating the kind of Washington agenda and what we're seeing already develop as the midterms campaign agenda, specifically the issue of election integrity, stop the steal, the big lie, whatever you want to call what emanates from Trump's mouth but the falsehoods of the 2020 has become frankly a litmus test for Republican candidates.

They're tripping over one another to go further and further in terms of giving that red meat to the base because they know this remains a Donald Trump party.

And so it is a challenge, a political challenge. It's a democracy challenge first and foremost. It's also a political challenge for Democrats because this isn't the same -- this isn't the same playing field as they're talking about here.

You know, even when we talk about in previous segments -- we see a Biden that wants to go out and talk more about inflation, that wants to talk more about COVID relief. Certainly important issues but this is also an important issue.

PHILLIP: Right.

HERNDON: And you're going to have to have Democrats meet Republicans on this front because they're creating a base that's motivated by this.

PHILLIP: And the test for the moderate Republicans in Congress is can they put themselves on the line to do something about that and prove that they are not in line with frankly the crazies who are out there pushing election lies.

But coming up next for us, the January 6th committee is getting a treasure trove of Trump White House documents. And that includes a draft executive order for the military to seize ballot boxes.

[08:36:22]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PHILLIP: Lawmakers investigating the January 6th insurrection are combing through nearly 800 Trump era White House documents this weekend after the Supreme Court ruled that investigators can see records that the former president tried to block.

And they are documents like this one. A draft executive order that would have allowed the military to seize ballot boxes to search for fraud.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. JAMIE RASKIN (D-MD): It indicates that there was one more line of possible attack, which was something like a military coup that was being planned before January 6th. The military seizure of ballot boxes and essentially a military takeover of the election process.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PHILLIP: Rachael, there is potentially so much in these documents that include notes, handwritten notes, messages, things like that. What is the January 6th committee looking for and what else could be in there?

BADE: Look, I think we're just starting to see, you know, this is just the tip of the iceberg. The fact that they are going to be getting all these documents from the White House that Donald Trump has been trying to sort of shield from them. You know, this is a huge win for them from the Supreme Court in allowing them to get these documents.

I mean, clearly, this document, this potential draft executive order allowing the military to basically take over election systems, which my colleague Betsy Woodruff Swan wrote about this weekend.

I mean frankly it's terrifying to have, you know, the military physically seize an election and put out this draft where they said they would have 60 days to sort of research things and come up with a recommendation that would have kept Trump in power past Biden's inauguration.

It's just another example of a way, you know, showing that the ex- president was so desperate to keep power that he was even looking at these extremes. And just to sort of remind, you know, listeners, Pat Cipollone, the White House counsel who was with Donald Trump, you know, through and through -- through both impeachments, you know, through the Mueller report, et cetera was pushing back on this idea in the White House.

And so it will be interesting to see what the January 6th Committee comes up with and comes up who wrote that document, who knew about it and also as defense secretaries of old including Republican defense secretaries were telling the White House and telling the administration, the military should have nothing to do with elections.

PHILLIP: And we're also learning, I mean, this week about an attempt to submit fraudulent electors that was backed by the Trump campaign.

Asma, this week has brought a lot of developments for Trump that are pretty damming and potentially foreshadow some legal trouble ahead. In New York, the attorney general is probing his businesses. The Trump campaign officials, as I was just discussing, were overseeing these fake electors. And then the Fulton County DA is looking in to attempts to tamper in the Georgia election, as well.

But at the same time, I mean, I think probably no one expects that this will change Trump's calculous in terms of whether he runs again, right?

KHALID: No, not at all. I think that there is really no indication as Astead has mentioned it earlier. I mean we've already begun to see the midterms be this litmus test for many candidates who want to run to show that they support some of the not-true statements that the president -- former president, sorry -- made about the 2020 election, his ability to hold power.

And look, just the other week he did an interview with my colleague Steve Inskeep in which he was again reiterating some of these things that are not true at all. And despite, you know, I think the legal challenges he's facing, despite the fact that the Supreme Court really I think suffered him a huge blow in showing that a number of these documents now need to go to the January 6th Committee, you don't see the former president relenting in any of these things (ph).

PHILLIP: Yes. I mean, Republicans though it looks like based on this new polling are maybe willing to start stepping away, more Republicans now saying that they are loyal to the Republican Party than they are to Trump.

Jeff, quickly, what do you think that this foreshadows for Trump's hold on the GOP?

ZELENY: Look, I think at least in terms of primaries in the 2022 midterm elections, his hold is quite significant. Everyone wants his endorsement.

But I think we have to look at 2022 separately from 2024. We have no idea if the former president is going to run again. You talked to many people around him. Actually a lot think he will not, some think he will. But that is separate and apart from 2022. He's very much still driving the train here in terms of primary candidates in a lot of these races.

[08:44:58]

ZELENY: So you know, there were a ton of headlines this week. I'm not sure any of them affect any primary races. People still want his endorsement because he's popular with the base.

PHILLIP: Yes. I mean the truth doesn't seem to affect his political calculus at all or his standing with the Republican base at all.

But coming up next for us, fed up Arizona Democrats are censuring Krysten Sinema. What does that mean for party unity and for her future?

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PHILLIP: And topping our political radar, this weekend marks the 49th anniversary of Roe versus Wade, the Supreme Court ruling guaranteeing abortion rights in this country.

But after the court's decision on a Texas law that is restrictive towards abortion, some experts are predicting that the right-leaning majority may overturn the landmark ruling this summer. Some conservatives are already celebrating.

[08:50:02]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MIKE PENCE, FORMER VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We may well be on the verge of an era when the Supreme Court sends Roe v. Wade to the ash heap of history.

And the day will come when the right to life is the law of the land in every state in these United States. (END VIDEO CLIP)

PHILLIP: So Asma, a sizable majority of the country, 69 percent of Americans, want to keep Roe versus Wade as the law of the land. And yet the Supreme Court that now tilts to the right seems poised to overturn half a century of precedent.

KHALID: You're right, Abby. And that disconnect I think does present an opportunity for Democrats. I mean historically we've seen that Republicans really galvanize in election years around this issue of abortion. And I think we saw this in the 2020 election and it certainly continues on today where Democrats are really concerned.

You know, the Democratic voting base is concerned about some of these protections being taken away. That being said, I mean we've already seen some of these rights chipped away in a state like Texas. And that's where (ph) when you talk to Texas activists, there's been a concern that the rest of the country has kind of moved on from what's happened there.

So I will say, Abby this is an issue in particular where I think I'm just really unsure as to what the electoral implications --

(CROSSTALK)

PHILLIP: Yes.

KHALID: -- what the electoral implications may be as we move on.

PHILLIP: Exactly. To that point, Rachael, I mean what are you seeing potentially as we go into a midterm election?

BADE: I mean there's a debate about this right now on Capitol Hill. We saw the DCCC which is the campaign arm of House Democrats basically pick this issue up and run with it a few months when it really started to percolate both fronts (ph) with fundraising, trying to raise money off of it, but also attacking Republican candidates specifically for their pro-life positions -- or anti-abortion positions.

And you know, there were a lot of frontline Democrats who frankly were not comfortable with that and thought that if they go after Republicans in their districts on this issue that they could repel swing voters they need to keep their seats.

And so, you know, it's not just a black and white issue for Democrats. A lot of frontliners they are pro-abortion rights, but there is a (INAUDIBLE) situation. They don't know how to talk about it and they frankly don't want to talk about it right now which puts them at odds with other folks in the party who do want to make this a central campaign issue.

PHILLIP: It puts the court right at the heart of a major political issue in a midterm election year.

But on another topic, Astead. There was another shooting in New York City this weekend. This time, one police officer is dead and another is wounded.

And here is what the newly-installed Mayor Eric Adams had to say.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MAYOR ERIC ADAMS (D), NEW YORK CITY: I'm the right person for this moment. This is a battle between the killers and New Yorkers. And we are not going to lose that battle, and we're not going to be divided by their violence.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PHILLIP: Eric Adams, a former police officer himself, is he right? Is he the right person for this moment?

HERNDON: This was certainly the promise of his election campaign, and specifically on the issue of crime kind of seeing the salience of that issue to voters. But on being a kind of central figure here, not only as a former police officer having those inroads with more moderate communities, but also as someone who vocally talked about police reform, telling communities that, hey, he's also going to going to be open to kind of pushing police departments in the direction that we saw coming from last summer.

He thinks he's uniquely positioned on these issues. The question is whether progressives and others are going to invest the time to work with him.

Let's also talk about the other side. When I was profiling Eric Adams over last summer, it was the police department who were some of his most vocal critics because they thought that some of the rhetoric from his time on the force was not acceptable.

So he's really going to have to walk a tight line here, but this is the one he wanted. And so I think it's right to say this is the moment -- this is a moment that he thinks he can step up. It's a matter of execution now.

PHILLIP: All eyes are always on New York, but they will continue to be especially on this issue.

Jeff, before we go, the Arizona Democratic Party released a statement saying that they were censuring Senator Kyrsten Sinema because of her, quote, "failure to do whatever it takes to ensure the health of our democracy". This is about her opposition to getting rid of the filibuster for voting rights.

Is this all symbolic or is there real potential trouble ahead?

ZELENY: I think at this point it is symbolic. Any time there's a sanction (ph), we've certainly seen many of them on the Republican side from the Republican Party for Liz Cheney, et cetera. It's less common on the Democratic side.

But look, I mean there is no doubt she's going to have a primary challenge in 2024. Congressman Ruben Gallego is already talking about it extensively and others may get into the race.

[08:54:46]

ZELENY: But Senator Sinema so far has played her politics pretty much down the middle. She's absolutely agitated those on the left. We'll see if it's too far or not.

2024 is a long ways away. But there is no doubt that she's also importantly this week losing the support of some key groups on the left, I believe like Emily's List and others. So that is going to be a challenge for her.

But it's only 2022, thankfully. So we'll see what happens by 2024. But she obviously has work to do back home to repair, you know, some of the damaged and frayed relations with Democrats.

PHILLIP: And it is notable that the other senator from that state went the other way on this same issue.

(CROSSTALK)

ZELENY: Right. And he's up this year, of course.

PHILLIP: And he is up this year. So we'll be watching that.

And that is it for INSIDE POLITICS SUNDAY. Join us back here every Sunday at 8:00 a.m. Eastern time and the week days show as well at noon Eastern time.

And don't forget you can also listen to our podcast. Download INSIDE POLITICS wherever you get your podcast.

Coming up next on CNN, "STATE OF THE UNION" with Jake Tapper and Dana Bash. Dana is in the chair today with guests that include the Secretary of State Antony Blinken, Republican Senator Joni Ernst, Independent Senator Bernie Sanders, and as we were just discussing, New York City Mayor Eric Adams.

Thank you again for sharing your Sunday morning with us. Have a great rest of your day.

[08:56:05]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)