Return to Transcripts main page

Inside Politics

Switzerland Abandons "Swiss Neutrality" To Freeze Russia's Assets, Including Putin's; Russian Forces Shell Residential Neighborhood In Kharkiv; Russia's Economy In Distress As Sanctions Take Effect. Aired 12:30-1p ET

Aired February 28, 2022 - 12:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[12:30:00]

DANA BASH, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: Nevermind what the Allies have done collectively with the SWIFT central -- with the SWIFT Banking System, but much more importantly, with the sanctions in place, or at least going to be in place, on the Russian Central Bank.

I mean, there's so many things that nobody expected to happen because President Zelensky is -- has been so upfront and because of what is happening on the ground and the resolve of the Ukrainian people. Having said that, you know, when you interview somebody who is sort of at the top of the news, you don't necessarily know if they're going to answer the question.

I was kind of shocked that the U.S. Ambassador to the U.N. was so clear in her answer in saying that there will not be a no fly zone because America does not want to have U.S. troops in harm's way. There was no ambiguity. The point is, is that a lot of times when you talk to diplomats, they do intentional or they call it strategic ambiguity. There was none there.

JOHN KING, CNN HOST: There was none there because that is the adamant position of the United States right now and the NATO allies that there's a line they want to help but they can't -- there's lines they can't cross. What is striking right now, we just put this up on the screen. You mentioned President Zelensky's roles in this. And you also have to give some credit. I know there are people wanted Biden to be more aggressive with sanctions.

But they have seen this coming for months. And they have worked behind the scenes on this diplomacy that gets you this, the Swiss today, for years neutral in world affairs, studiously neutral on purpose in world affairs saying we are freezing Russian assets, the United States taking new steps today. Germany sending Ukraine weapons, not just canceling the pipeline, but Germany sending weapons to assist Ukraine, that is a giant step.

The European Union now waiting to see if it could admit Ukraine, maybe on a faster path there, Hungary as well. The global coalition here, again, we have a long to wait to see what happens to Putin. But Putin has to be surprised by the idea that the rebuke and the economic sanctions are for just about every corner of the earth. FRANCESCA CHAMBERS, WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT, MCCLATCHY: And what struck me, John, is how many Republicans and Democrats said exactly that yesterday that Putin may have underestimated both the response within Ukraine, but also from the West and the Biden administration and Germany and other countries, John. And the U.S. says they will escalate as Putin escalates, as you were talking about launching those new sanctions targeting Vladimir Putin himself, but also the oligarchs in Russia saying, look, we're going to target your yachts, we're going to target your children and your families, your kids aren't going to be able to go to college here and making it really clear that there's more that they can and will do here.

KING: And so the question is, it's a giant global test for the presidents, giant global test of the world, of the world right now. This conversation with Putin, at a time the President of the United States tomorrow night has the largest states you will have this year. And so, you know, a month ago, this was a very different speech. Now, Ukraine has to be front and center. And the President trying to convince a polarized nation, it's time to support the flag, and the commander-in-chief in a confrontation with Putin.

BASH: It's true. But again, what a difference five, six days makes. At the beginning of this conflict, one of the questions in terms of the politics of this was whether or not people in America would get it, especially at a time when inflation is high and gas prices are high, and they can't --

KING: They may go higher because of this.

BASH: And they might go higher because of this. And just in terms of the initial anecdotal response, I'm not looking at specific poll numbers on this, but the anecdotal response, it has been over whelming, to see how people are watching what is happening there, because it really boils down to a fundamental question. And Mitt Romney put it this way yesterday. And I think that this is what people are digesting, good and evil, it is good and evil. And it is as black and white as that with the way people are looking at it.

And also the fact that the administration is saying no U.S. boots on the ground, and that the America won't engage when it comes to the most precious resource. America's men and women, that that is really making a difference.

MARGARET TALEV, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: You know, the Republican Conference seemed split even a week ago about whether the U.S. is supposed to care whether Americans should care about what's going on. I think that's mostly over this argument, like you should care more about the border seems to be marginalized over to the right. For Biden, though, the challenge domestically, politically is the Republicans are unified around this argument that it was Biden's weakness rather than national weakness and national division that precipitated this. That's a political complication for the President right now. Huge stakes for tomorrow, the state of the Union address is going to be hugely important messaging to Americans and the world.

CHAMBERS: Well, we did hear that argument again from the former President Donald Trump and CPAC over the weekend talking about the border. But to your point, Dana specific polling, more than eight and 10 Americans support sanctions on Russia at this point, although they're still against the boots on the ground in Ukraine.

KING: Right, well, it's the President's opportunity as, you know, to speak to the country and to the world. And so please join us, join Anderson Cooper, Jake Tapper, they lead our coverage President Biden's first State of the Union address. Our special live coverage starts tomorrow night 8:00 p.m. Eastern right here on CNN.

[12:35:00]

Up next, the view from Russia to oligarchs break ranks and call for an end to Putin's war Ukraine. Plus, interest rates soar, the value of the ruble plummets as global sanctions slam Russia's economy.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KING: Several big events we are tracking as we follow the breaking news out of Ukraine talks just ending earlier this hour in Belarus that after the Ukrainian and Russian delegations talking for five hours. Russian state media says both sides did agree to a second round of talks in the coming days. That meeting ending as several explosions and air raid sirens were heard in Ukraine's capital. In Kyiv, some Ukrainians leaving their homes today after nearly a two day curfew, and finding long lines empty shelves at grocery stores.

[12:40:19]

Continued Russian shelling, including in second -- Ukraine's second largest city Kharkiv, suggesting Vladimir Putin, perhaps ready to launch another assault. Let's get to CNN's Alex Marquardt, he joins us now live from Ukraine's capital city of Kyiv. Alex, what is the latest?

ALEX MARQUARDT, CNN SENIOR NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Well, John, it is clear that two of the biggest prizes for Vladimir Putin's army would be the two biggest cities in this country. As you noted, we have just heard some bombing around this city. But also there has been some heavy shelling in the second biggest city of Kharkiv. Now, that is in the northeastern part of the country that is tucked up right against the Russian border just 20 miles from that border.

And earlier today, we saw significant shelling in the north eastern part of that city. We've seen video we verified this video, this happened in the Saltivka neighborhood near a supermarket. We also saw a video of a rocket booster that landed in the street, people gathering around it. City officials saying that one person was killed and more than 30 were wounded. Now, you heard earlier from our colleague, Fred Pleitgen, who has done some great reporting on just the other side of the border in Russia, watching those movements.

And he saw earlier today, that at least three multiple rocket launchers moving towards the border, which is right across, as I mentioned, from Kharkiv. Now, we've talked a lot about the stiff Ukrainian resistance that we have seen against these Russian forces that has managed to push them back and in certain cases.

And over the weekend, we also saw this happening in Kharkiv, quite literally Russian forces forcing those, excuse me, Ukrainian troops forcing those Russian troops backwards. So they are making quite good progress, you know, overall, against these Russian forces. At the same time, we have heard repeatedly from the Russian side that they will not be targeting civilian areas, that however, it does not appear to be true. John?

KING: Alex Marquardt, grateful for the live reporting from Kyiv, keep us posted. Let's get some important insights now from our CNN national security analyst, former Deputy Director of National Intelligence, Beth Sanner.

Beth, grateful for your time today. So the President of the United States right now leading a call with allies, walk us through what happens in the real world here when it comes to intelligence five days into this, how is the President's daily brief, his daily intelligence report and then his conversation with top intelligence officials? How's it different today? What options, what recommendations, what advice is the President getting today, based on what we now know from the first five days here?

BETH SANNER, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY ANALYST: Well, I think people think that probably, you know, the intelligence briefing would be all about the military operations. And certainly that will be discussed, but also the U.S. military will be providing that probably jointly. But a lot of the discussion will be going on, you know, what is going on around the world, in terms of other threats, as well as what is China doing?

For example, yesterday, we had North Korea pop off its eighth ballistic missile test in this year. And we have other things going on around the world. So there will be also a focus on making sure that the national security team is paying attention to other potential problems.

KING: And one of the big challenges here is trying to figure out what is Putin thinking? Obviously, we know from Ukrainian officials from what we've seen from our correspondents on the ground, what Pentagon sources are telling us that this is not going as fast as Moscow had hoped. And yet, you still do see Russia seizing land in southern Ukraine moving about 15 miles away from Kyiv, you just heard from -- in Kharkiv, more bombing tonight.

So you do have the Russian forces advancing but you also have, Beth, of this remarkable global support for Ukraine, new sanctions from the United States there, the European Union saying it might accelerate inviting Ukraine to join, even Switzerland notoriously neutral company -- country coming off the sidelines and imposing sanctions.

Do you think that Vladimir Putin anticipated this his view of the West is, you know, the West is fat, it is lazy, it has fragmented politics, it will not rally against me, do we think -- do you think that Putin miscalculated here? SANNER: Absolutely, he miscalculated. And one of the signs of that is that over the past few years, he has been moving Russian investments out of dollars into Euros thinking that that was going to be the weakest link. And in fact, we have had this seismic shift, just absolutely remarkable shift in the European perspective. And we have not seen anything like this since World War II. I mean, you mentioned earlier that Germany is increasing his defense spending probably about 50 percent.

But also proposing putting changes in their constitution to make sure that they're doing that defense spending and we have, you know, Sweden and Finland really moving toward NATO and Hungary. Putin has invested in Viktor Orban over this past decades his best buddy, and Orban, you know, where the Hungarians in 1956 saw the tanks, Soviet tanks rolling in, there was no way or bond could stand up to that. And he has gone against Putin. So it is a massive and universal shift. And I don't think Germany or Europe will look the same again.

[12:45:36]

KING: The question though, is what happens because of that. Putin may be knocked back on his heels a little bit, but that can be dangerous with somebody as unpredictable as Vladimir Putin who plays a longer game. He doesn't think the way we do. He doesn't score things day to day. He's been after Ukraine for 10 years. And he's back in Ukraine now.

He talked about an empire of lies today, lashing out at the West. He has seen President Zelensky. If you're in Putin's mindset and Ukraine is Russia, he believes it is his and you have Brave Zelensky saying you want my country, you're going to have to come kill me for it. How does that affect? Do you worry how that affects Putin's calculus now that five days in, he might be back on his heels a bit?

SANNER: I'm extremely worried about this. And I want to be very careful in how we talk about this because of all of this unity and this pressure on Putin, it always -- also pushes him into a corner. And I expect Putin to be doubling down now, even at the same time, they are saying they're going to be meeting again in a couple of days. But we are seeing cluster munitions. These are absolutely designed to hurt civilians being used in Kharkiv. I am very worried about the next 24 to 48 hours and what, you know, might rain down on the people of Ukraine.

KING: Beth Sanner, a sober but very important insights, we appreciate your help as we get through this in the days and weeks ahead. Thank you very much.

And when we come back, live to Moscow CNN's Nic Robertson on the streets right now. Interest rates are up, the value of the ruble down, some scattered anti-war protests. We'll get the latest from Moscow next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[12:51:51] KING: Russian President Vladimir Putin meeting with top economic adviser today and lashing out at the West for its tough sanctions.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PRES. VLADIMIR PUTIN, RUSSIA (through translator): I invited you in order to talk about the issues concerning the economy and finance. Mikhail Mishustin and I have discussed this, including the sanctions that the so called Western Community or the empire of lies as I called it in my address is trying to implement against my country.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KING: Moscow stock market did not open today. The value of Russia's currency has taken a major dive and Russia's central bank forced to more than double its interest rate to boost the sinking ruble. CNN's senior diplomatic editor Nic Robertson joins us now live from the streets of Moscow. Nic, what is the latest there?

NIC ROBERTSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL DIPLOMATIC EDITOR: Yes, John, that meeting, President Putin had not just with his Prime Minister, you saw him with there, but his first deputy prime minister, his head of central bank, his head of -- heads of other banks as well. Putin is really struggling to do what he didn't expected have to do since he last invaded Ukraine had begun investing, making preparations for future sanctions, for sanctioned toward the country in his rainy day fund.

What he didn't anticipate was that that $630 billion rainy day fund would essentially be put behind a wall. The United States not allowing him access to the dollar fund, the European Union cutting him off from the euro fund, not clear how he's going to get his -- get access to some of the gold that it invested in as well. Putin right now struggling to come up with a formula to keep the economy afloat. Tonight, though, protests across the country, many different cities, fewer people out tonight. This has been the scene of one of the protests in recent night. People have been arrested in some of the small back streets around here. This area is quite quiet right now.

Today, about 100 people arrested across the country, more than 6,000 arrested so far, more than 1,000 people arrested in Moscow of protests yesterday. It's hard to say whether this sort of anti-war movement is gaining momentum. It has taken a bit of a pause tonight. But the notion that this -- that there are many people in this country who don't want the war, that is certainly alive within a large part of a younger community in Russia, a lot of people still supporting President Putin.

But as the sanctions begin to take effect, potentially he can begin to lose support in the broader part of your community, the middle class who don't know if they can get access to their savings, their pensions. We tried to park our car here just around the corner tonight, John, guess what? Apple Pay doesn't work. It's hitting everyone here. And it's unexpected, John.

KING: Unexpected and only at the beginning, remarkable. We'll continue to watch it. Nic Robertson grateful to have you live for us in Moscow tonight.

[12:54:41]

And this breaking news from FIFA suspending Russian soccer teams from competition as the world continues to react and condemn the Russian invasion of Ukraine.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KING: Important news this hour from the sporting world, the Russian ban from soccer's global governing body. FIFA and UEFA have suspended the Russian national team and all Russia club teams from competition until further notice. The ban comes just weeks before Russia was set to play for one of the last spots in this year's World Cup.

The humanitarian crisis called -- caused by Russia's invasion of Ukraine is growing worse by the hour. The United Nations says, get this, more than a half million people have already fled Ukraine, majority you see in the pictures are women and children. Ukraine not allowing men aged 18 to 60 to leave the country. These videos from a Polish town near the Ukrainian Border. Ukrainians are fleeing to other countries as well.

These images from a temporary refugee camp near the Hungarian border with Ukraine. But as hundreds of thousands flee there are many who cannot leave. Look at these images in Kyiv, children undergoing cancer treatment in the bomb shelter of the hospital's oncology ward, one of the patients holding a sign that reads, stop war.

[13:00:20]

Thanks for joining us in INSIDE POLITICS. Ana Cabrera and Anderson Cooper pick up right now.