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Lawmakers Call On Biden Administration To End Russian Oil Imports; Russia Escalates Assaults On Ukrainian Cities; UN: One- Million-Plus Have Fled Ukraine Amid Russian Attack. Aired 12:30-1p ET

Aired March 04, 2022 - 12:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[12:30:00]

GEN. GEORGE JOULWAN (RET.), FORMER NATO SUPREME ALLIED COMMANDER: They had a battalion go in the -- with me to Bosnia and helped in that situation. They've also been involved in what I call this Partnership for Peace arrangement and they have a liaison officer at my headquarters that shape. So there's been a lot of in 25 years ago and there's been a lot of work done. And I think they have the proficiency to be able to do that.

JOHN KING, CNN HOST: We'll watch the NATO sessions later today and see if anything shifts at the moment though. You say you think it might change. At the moment, the NATO Allies say no, that no fly zone. General Joulwan, grateful for your time and for your insight, sir. When we come back, over a million Ukrainians desperately fleeing across the country's borders as the Russian attacks intensify, the vast majority of those flee, women and children.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: How do you feel now?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I feel bad really. I love my Ukraine and --

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[12:35:38]

KING: Just moments ago, the U.S. Ambassador to the United Nations calling on Russian President Vladimir Putin to quote stop this madness. That after Russian forces attacked and took control of Europe's largest nuclear power plant in Ukraine. Today, the plants operators are working at gunpoint, Russian troops to control after a rapid assault shelling it sparking a fire. In northern Ukraine, look at this pile of dirt and rubble, a single standing wall used to be a school. It was hit by Russian rockets this morning. And this unbelievable video, a Ukrainian man in Kharkiv speaking into a cell phone when interrupted by a Russian military strike.

And more sadness here, CNN's Clarissa Ward going inside Ukraine's largest children's hospital, patients are sheltering in the basement, as the Russian troops close in.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CLARISSA WARD, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Is this dangerous for them this situation?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, and not only because we have a war these conditions is not suitable with brain surgeries.

WARD (voice-over): For now, nonessential procedures are on hold, 11 year old Jaroslav's (ph) sutures should have been removed. But the risk of infection is too high. His mother Ludmilla (ph) tries to comfort him. I will massage you and everything will be OK, she says.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KING: This horrible crisis causing of course, understandable juggle at the Biden White House. We'll hear from the President any moment. He wants to talk about making things in America building things that America again, there was also some very positive news for the president on the domestic front earlier today, a report showing gangbusters job growth last month.

But there's also a giant day to day jump in gas prices and the President now because of Ukraine facing mounting bipartisan pressures to do something that could send those gas prices even higher. What this lawmaker want is for the President to issue an outright ban on importing Russian energy.

With me to share the reporting and their insights, Karoun Demirjian from the Washington Post, Zolan Kanno-Youngs from the New York Times, that is the challenge of any president, but when it comes to this issue about Russian energy, bipartisan growing courts now lawmakers saying, yes, Mr. President, it might hurt people here at home, but do it.

KAROUN DEMIRJIAN, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: Yes, I mean, that is a significant groundswell of support that you've seen, and the impetus is because there is this fundamental concern about the hypocrisy of how can we be keep condemning the Russian onslaught in Ukraine, and yet effectively helping fund it a bit by still buying their oil. You know, their sanctions on banks, but it doesn't go to completely cutting off all of those financial transactions if that's still coming.

And the question is, you know, will there still be this the same sort of bipartisan coalition of support for the move once it happens, because it will engender blowbacks at the pump, and with other commodities crisis at home?

KING: And so I'm going to read a little bit from the piece in "The New York Times" about this, because the administration standpoint is we're being very tough, but it's absolutely critical to keep all of the Western alliance together. And if we go beyond where other countries are, go, Putin then sees a crack. So you have to do this incrementally and smartly, in unity. Senior

White House officials designing the strategy to confront Russia have begun quietly debating a new concern that the avalanche of sanctions directed at Moscow, which have gained speed faster than they imagined, is cornering President Vladimir Putin and may prompt him to lash out, perhaps expanding the conflict beyond Ukraine.

So it's every one of these decisions, do you add more, do you grab for the oligarchs, do you now ban Russian oil imports? The question is, what do you get for the unpredictable Putin?

ZOLAN KANNO-YOUNGS, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: And how does this end at some point, right? I mean, each the strategy thus far from the White House has been one to have the NATO allies and the Europeans take the lead, you saw that with Nord Stream 2, you saw that with some of the aggressive actions that normally neutral nations and allies such as Germany have been doing, and then the White House coming out usually the next day and backing it up with their own sanction. That is not just a way to have NATO lead, but it's also a tranche system where you can have something in reserve if Putin was going to continue to escalate.

The issue here, though, is the strategy thus far as the White House says these sanctions are not a punishment, but it's rather a strategy to try and get Putin to back out of war. Thus far initially, we've only seen his reaction be to continue to escalate and continue to have an aggressive advance. So now you have this cornered Putin problem, according to these administration officials, were how do you continue to use these economic penalties to try and discourage Putin from advancing but at the same time, how do you identify a certain way out and off ramp for him to get -- to actually back out of this war? We don't see that option at this point.

[12:40:20]

KING: You don't see that option, which is what you do see is remarkable coordination General Milley, the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs traveling to Europe, Secretary Blinken in Brussels at NATO right now. General Milley in part focusing on those smaller democracies who are most threatened, they line up right along Russia's border, they get the history more than most Americans do and they are nervous.

Secretary Blinken saying for now, and keeping the allies on the idea that we cannot have a no fly zone over Ukraine, because that essentially means you have to enforce it. And then you end up either a U.S. or NATO plane gets shut down or a Russian plane gets shut down. But you keep hearing just talking to General Joulwan a few minutes ago, he says maybe something will come about. Is that wishful thinking?

DEMIRJIAN: I mean, it's going to be very hard here to split, basically, of saying, we're not going to protect non-NATO territory, which is Ukraine. And then, you know, maybe have people take their official badges often there's volunteers going. I mean, there's all kinds of, you know, ways you could massage it to have people who know how to do these things in the country helping Ukrainians do these things. But under whose auspices, under what flag, the President's been pretty firm about the line stopping at the border, because you don't want to provoke a Russian response.

And, you know, this is all designed to create some sort of change of heart and Putin. But remember, he doesn't really care what the West thinks of him. He cares about looking strong at home. He cares about remaining legitimate at home. And we will just kind of be feeding that narrative in many ways if we send official units across the border to enforce no fly zone, and it'll be look, they're attacking us.

KANNO-YOUNGS: And that's the issue as well, when it comes to any sort of kind of trying to get away out for Putin. He's not going to probably take it at least this is a concern from administration officials. Unless it makes him look like he actually had a win here.

KING: Unless it makes him. Well, this is why it's a fact. Appreciate the reporting because it is so complicated. We'll be right back.

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[12:46:41]

KING: An emerging picture today of Vladimir Putin's brutality, sheer terror. Look here. First person view, the moment of Russian missile strike hits a building in Kharkiv. This another dramatic example of Putin's blatant disregard for life for Ukrainian school in Zhytomyr. Its concrete folded over like dominoes. Classrooms caved in by artillery.

Joining our conversation, CNN national security analyst Steve Hall, he's the former CIA, Moscow bureau chief. Steve I hate to put it this way but as you see these pictures, schools, apartment buildings, and more, you have seen this gruesome movie before the word grozny comes up. What is your concern, as Vladimir Putin now continues accelerates of this attack on Ukrainian cities?

STEVE HALL, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY ANALYST: Well, yes, first of all, John, as you were talking about the grozny is a perfect example. You hate to see if that's -- this is the plan carpet bombing, you know, of all Ukraine that would be pretty horrific. But, you know, I think in your previous segment, it was sort of a what do we do about this situation?

And I don't think necessarily, it's going to be the oligarchs, because they're just -- they just launder money. What we really need to be looking at is the siloviki. This is this military security elite type of guys that might be coming on comfortable, with what's happening and what's happening to Russia as a result. Those are the people who have real -- exert real influence over Putin.

KING: Do you believe it's the coup theory, that the people, whether it's the citizens of Russia or the security apparatus, as you believe is crucial in Russia, get so disgusted by this that they revolt. I mean, that's how Gorbachev was run out. But he was trying to dissolve the Soviet Union. Putin is trying to make Russia strong again. You still believe that's a possibility?

HALL: Yes, because with Gorbachev, the reason that the coup plotters under Gorbachev really got going and really started moving against him was because Russia was falling apart. The Soviet Union at the time was falling apart. Well, what's happening in Russia right now, all of these sanctions, all of the stuff that's happening, this isolation, this North Korea like prospect for them in the future, that's what the siloviki, these security guys, might be more concerned about than anything else.

KING: You've studied Putin a long time and you know his game is to be a bully. One of the statements for him today is he talked to his friend, the president of Belarus, which is landlocked right here. Russian troops obviously have gone into Belarusian and into Ukraine from Belarus and Putin saying he agrees with Belarus's desire to get access to the Baltic Sea, which is over here that would either mean along highway up through Russia and out or it would meant, I believe, to intimidate Lithuania, Estonia, Latvia. That's Putin's game, right, bully, scare.

HALL: Yes, I think so. And Lukashenko is the perfect bully. He's completely under Putin's control. And yes, you're going to have a bunch of really nervous NATO countries bordering Belarus if they go in that direction in an aggressive fashion.

KING: Steve Hall, grateful for your important insights as we continue to follow this increasingly horrific drama in Ukraine.

[12:49:17]

When we come back more than a million Ukrainians have fled the escalating hardships of war and escaped to neighboring countries. We'll give you a firsthand look after the break.

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KING: Today a new crisis for Europe, you can see it right here on the map. Ukrainian refugees overwhelming borders, already more than 1 million people have fled Ukraine. And UNICEF warns the police the problem will only get worse, predicting a quarter, a quarter of the Ukrainian population that's 10 million people will ultimately become refugees. This, the CNN Hungary where trains carrying Ukrainians who escaped the violence now arriving every day, another emerging issue in this new war is foreign fighters flocking to Ukraine now to support a military under intense pressure.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We picked up a few guys and we're ready to join the fight. Because I was, yes, I was a sniper in Afghanistan twice. And I went against ISIS as well in 2015 so it's my second time as a volunteer. And we just met up at the airport and we need to push a lot of people at the front very quickly.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[12:55:02]

KING: If you want more information about how you can help the humanitarian efforts underway in Ukraine go to cnn.com/impact. And this just in a source telling CNN, the White House now planning to send the Vice President Kamala Harris to Poland. Vice President Harris spoke by phone with Poland's Prime Minister earlier this week. The President of the United States spoke to his counterpart in Poland just today. The trip by the Vice President would come on the heels of her international travel to the Munich Security Council, where she met with allies and partners including Ukrainian President Zelenskyy.

Appreciate your time today in INSIDE POLITICS. Stay with us as our breaking news coverage continues. Ana Cabrera, Anderson Cooper pick up after a quick break.

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