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Jury Selection Set To Start Monday In NY Hush Money Case; Parents Of Michigan School About To Be Sentenced; Rep. Greene Escalates Pressure On Speaker Johnson. Aired 12:30-1p ET

Aired April 09, 2024 - 12:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[12:30:00]

ELIE HONIG, CNN SENIOR LEGAL ANALYST: Do you have views for or against him that are so strong that you can't possibly rule fairly on that case? Now, they do ask that question straight up. Is there anything about your views of this case or Donald Trump --

DANA BASH, CNN ANCHOR: Yes, and we'll -- we can keep that up --

HONIG: -- he'll you from answering fairly. Yes.

BASH: We can put that up, forgive me. Question number 34, as you continue to talk, didn't mean to interrupt you, Elie.

HONIG: No, that's fine. And then there are other questions that they don't ask that you would think would be logical to ask, like, did you vote for Donald Trump in 2020? Are you a registered Democrat or Republican? But in lieu of those direct questions, they sort of ask these glancing questions, like the one you just showed, are you aligned with QAnon? Are you aligned with Antifa?

There's other sort of less out there ways that they try to get at that. They say, where do you primarily get your news? From what source? They say, have you ever been to a Trump rally or an anti-Trump rally? Have you ever worked for or against a Trump political organization?

But I'll tell you, Dana, what the lawyers are looking for. Look, the textbooks say we're looking for fair jurors who can call it right down the middle. This is a competitive exercise. The lawyers are looking for jurors who are inclined for their side. If you're the D.A., frankly, you want people who dislike Donald Trump, and if you're Trump's team, you want people who support him. I know it's about the facts and the law too, but let's be real, this is jury selection, this is a competitive exercise.

BASH: Which is always, Katelyn, a competitive exercise, no matter what kind of courtroom you're in. Even more so when the courtroom is effectively a very important campaign stop or an important campaign event.

KATELYN POLANTZ, CNN SENIOR CRIME AND JUSTICE REPORTER: Yes. And one thing we're seeing right now, Dana, is there's going to be a continued conversation, arguments, motions, very quick decisions that happens outside of the presence of the jury. So they get this jury seated. We're going to go through jury selection. We'll watch that.

But what's presented to the jury is not even the only thing that's going to happen in court. So there's going to be what Trump says to the cameras, the campaign type events of him walking in and out. We're not going to be seeing the proceedings live. We're going to be hearing about them through our reporters who are in the room watching and then there's the legal arguments, and then what the jury itself sees.

BASH: So this is going to be a taste of what's to come when this hearing starts, and that is, let's go to our reporter who was in the courtroom for that gag order appeal that happened very quickly.

Kara Scannell, I believe you were with us. There you are, Kara. What happened inside?

KARA SCANNELL, CNN REPORTER: Yes, Dana. So the judge denied this motion to stay the trial so they could make arguments on the gag order. And, you know, Trump's lawyers came in saying that the gag order is restricting Trump from defending himself in this case. And they said they're seeking limited relief.

They want him to be able to address two witnesses who have been outspoken about this case, Stormy Daniels and Michael Cohen. They also said that Trump should be able to call out what he views as political interference, one of the prosecutors this case and focusing on his ability to speak about a motion that has been publicly filed. That is when they've asked the judge to recuse himself.

You'll remember the judge had altered his gag order that he put in place to cover his daughter because Trump was focusing on work that she does for democratic groups. Now the prosecutors argued that this was much more than what they were asking for. They want to stop the trial so they can make these arguments.

They said that this is far too late. They could have brought this case up on appeal once the judge had issued the gag order even before he amended it, but they waited until now just one week before the trial. You know, how this is going to play out is that this judge denied for now, but a full panel will get briefs on whether to stop this trial based on this argument.

Now, those briefs are due on April 15th. That is the day this trial starts. There will not be oral arguments, and the judges will issue a written decision sometime after the 15th, once jury selection is underway. You know, that is the first part of this, and then they are going to still try to continue to challenge the gag order, even after this initial decision on whether the trial starts on time is made. Dana?

BASH: Kara, thanks for running out and giving us that report.

A lot of breaking news this morning so far. Stick around, we'll be right back.

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[12:37:08]

BASH: We're going to go back to the Crumbley sentencing trial. We're listening to the judge, Cheryl Matthews.

JUDGE CHERYL MATTHEWS, OAKLAND COUNTY, MICHIGAN CIRCUIT COURT: It costs her $272. It's a crime victim's rights fee of $130. You and your agents may not have any contact with the families of Madison Baldwin, Tate Muir, Hannah St. Juliana, and Justin Schilling. I will issue another ruling with regard to contact with your son, the shooter.

Excuse me. As to defend --

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MATTHEWS: If you cannot afford to hire an attorney to represent you on appeal and you request an attorney, an attorney may be appointed for you. You may request an attorney by completing the request for appointment of attorney section of the form that will be provided for you and by returning the form to this court or to the Michigan Assigned Counsel System at the address on the form.

If you wish to preserve your automatic right to appeal, the form must be received within 42 days after sentencing. If you do not submit the form within 42 days from today, you may still file an application for leave to appeal if the form is received within six months after sentencing.

To each of the defendants, I've acknowledged receipt of their appellate rights.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Claims acknowledged as receipt, Your Honor, who's completing the form as receipt.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Your Honor, my client is as well. Does the court write the forms here or would you prefer us to --

MATTHEWS: It doesn't matter, either way. Either way.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Thank you.

MATTHEWS: Thank you. I'm going to ask that everyone remain seated while the defendants are taken out of the courtroom. I think they're going to finish their appellate rights.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: They are going to -- Mr. Crumbley is going to finish his appellate rights.

MATTHEWS: All right, we'll wait for that.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Thank you, Your Honor.

MATTHEWS: I would just ask that no one stand up. It makes the deputies nervous.

[12:40:57] BASH: Major development in that courtroom. The judge sentencing Jennifer Crumbley and James Crumbley to 10 to 15 years in prison, which is precisely what prosecutors wanted the judge to do.

I want to go straight to Jean Casarez, who has been following this trial since the beginning. Jean?

JEAN CASAREZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, the judge in pronouncing this decision said, first of all, this is not a case about guns. It's not about guns in the private home. It's about repeated actions over and over and over again by the parents that amounted to gross negligence.

That the father, James Crumbley, allowed access to that gun to his son that the mother, Jennifer Crumbley, glorified it and at the school meeting that day, the morning two hours before the mass shooting, when they were shown these math drawings of bullets and blood everywhere, my life is useless, she said, is this over and just wanted to get back to work.

She said it was very stark, the non-caring aspect of this. And also when Jennifer testified that she would not have done anything differently, she said it may have been misunderstood, but it really, really had a stark, stark reaction amongst the victims. She said the guidelines were not enough. So right there, because the guidelines for these crimes were four to seven years. So you knew something else was coming.

The judge said she prayed about this. She was up nights worrying about this, thinking about the fact that. There is rehabilitation that needs to be done for these victims, but also deterrence so that no one else in this country would do something like this.

They have to see that and then she pronounced the sentence 10 to 15 years. 15 years is the maximum for this offense.

BASH: I want to go to Renato Mariotti as well on this. Renato, I know you -- forgive me, I don't think Renato is ready yet, Jean. I just want to put this in context. You have covered, unfortunately, your fair share of trials, particularly when it comes to shootings, and even and especially school shootings. The fact that the parents are being held culpable in this case by involuntary or for involuntary manslaughter.

Again, they were already convicted of that, but that they are going to be sentenced to 10 to 15 years in prison for that culpability. How significant is this moment?

CASAREZ: Absolutely so significant. Prosecutors around the country are watching this case. They are looking at this case. When I interviewed Karen McDonald shortly after the conviction, I said, do you believe that this is precedent setting for other prosecutors in this country to follow suit of what you did? Her response was, they need to ask the question, where did the gun come from? Regarding the minor child, where did it come from? That can launch the investigation right now.

And I think that in regard to gun violence, prosecutors are looking at this because someone needs to be responsible. And if you have a minor child and you have a gun in your home, knowing there's a minor child and it is not locked, it is sitting around, it is loaded and something happens.

There have been cases where there is child neglect charges for a parent, but not homicide. This is what makes this case stand out from any other case that has been brought before in this country.

BASH: OK, I think Renato is with us now. Renato, just pick up where Jean left off about the historic precedent that was just set in Michigan. And also, I mean, Jean was talking rightly about the use of the gun and what the prosecutor Karen McDonald has told her about the need for parents to be more mindful of having loaded guns when they have teenagers around.

But the other aspect that Jean was talking about, that the judge was talking about isn't just the weapon, but the apparent disregard with which the shooter's parents treated the warnings that came from the school about the behavior and the mental status of their son. I mean, the fact that that is part of a reason to convict and to sentence to so many years in prison is also pretty remarkable.

[12:45:28]

RENATO MARIOTTI, FORMER FEDERAL PROSECUTOR: It is remarkable. It is unique. I do think that this is a moment. Parents typically when they're making a choice for their child, they're not thinking about potential prison time as a consequence. And this is significant. This is not five days in prison and we're talking years in prison. I mean, it's a significant sentence, no question about it.

And I have to say, you have to think about this in the context of the broader debate that we've had as a society about firearms. There has not been is much regulation of firearms. There's been a lot of debate about that. And now you're seeing the criminal laws being used in a more aggressive fashion by prosecutors in response to that.

In other words, if truly guns are going to be more prevalent, now, the onus is going to be on parents to safely store them. If ultimately at the end of the day, we're saying that school shootings are a matter of personal responsibility, Well, if it's a minor, parents have to see these warning signs, whether it's a dark drawing like there was here, or as the judge mentioned, warning signs coming from the school itself, it's going to, I think, spark a lot more debate in the months and years to come.

BASH: As it should. Really significant day for this kind of crime, as you said, when it is a minor, but also when it comes to, first and foremost, the feelings of and the grief of the people we heard from earlier today in that courtroom, the parents of Madison Baldwin, Tate Muir, Hannah St. Juliana and Justin Schilling, the four teenagers who were murdered in cold blood by a 15-year-old in Michigan in 2021. We should continue to remember them.

Thank you so much, Renato. Jean, also, thank you for bringing us your reporting and expertise. We're going to sneak in another quick break. Don't go away.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[12:52:03]

BASH: We've had a lot of breaking news this morning outside of Washington. There's a big story developing here, too. Congress is back from recess and so are the tensions inside the House Republican Conference. In fact, they're escalating. Congresswoman Marjorie Taylor Greene is doubling down on her calls to oust Speaker Mike Johnson.

Today, she's putting all her grievances with his leadership and is scathing five-page letter accusing Johnson of, quote, "selling out Republicans" by being, quote, "in total lockstep with Democrats agenda." She's blaming him for jeopardizing the razor thin majority by not serving his own GOP conference that elected him.

CNN's Manu Raju is now with us from Capitol Hill. Manu?

MANU RAJU, CNN CHIEF CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, look, Mike Johnson is coming back into the lion's den of sorts. He has a very complicated legislative agenda ahead. Lots of pressure coming from both sides within his own conference and that threat from Marjorie Taylor Greene to call for a vote seeking his ouster.

Remember, any one member of the House can do just that. We saw that happen in historic and unprecedented fashion last year when Matt Gaetz pushed out Kevin McCarthy, speaker, eight Republicans at the time, joined with Democrats to vote out McCarthy. Will that happen again? A large part has to do with Mike Johnson's deal making to keep the government open.

But now how he will handle the issue of Ukraine aid, so central to his political future as push. There's a major push among supporters to get that done immediately. Johnson has not said how he would proceed on that as he's talking to Republicans about a different approach than the Senate.

Now, Marjorie Taylor Greene made her grievances known not just in a letter to her colleagues this morning, but also last night in a town hall back in Georgia.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. MARJORIE TAYLOR GREENE (R), GEORGIA: He's also worked with Hakeem Jeffries and the White House, not with his members. That is not what a Republican speaker of the House does. Maybe a Democrat speaker, actually. I will not tolerate a speaker of the House that I voted for to sell us out. I will not tolerate it.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

RAJU: Now the question is, how many Republicans will join her in this effort? And will Democrats actually step in and try to save Mike Johnson? There would be expected to be a vote to essentially kill this resolution to oust him from the speakership if and when that comes to the floor. Will Democrats side with Johnson? Which was not the case with Kevin McCarthy, and a lot of that has to do with how they see how he proceeds on the issue of Ukraine.

But again, Mike Johnson has not detailed how he plans to proceed, given the sharp defense (ph) within his own conference on proceeding with Ukraine aid. So he's heading in this difficult period, how he acts and how he responds to all this, still uncertain, but he has not spoken as we understand to Marjorie Taylor Greene yet, despite her threats for now the last couple of weeks.

BASH: Well, that was going to be my question. Ukraine is going to play a big role in how this potential vote to vacate the speakership goes down.

[12:55:05]

He was talking over the break about proceeding somehow. What are you hearing about that?

RAJU: Yes, this is expected to be different than the Senate's past version, that past almost two months ago. That Senate plan $95 billion for Israel, Ukraine and Taiwan aid did not have anything to do with the border security issues. Of course, Republicans had rebelled against the bipartisan border security deal in the Senate, but the Senate moved forward with this aid package absent that.

Now Johnson is trying to add to that some border security provisions, as well as narrow that Ukraine aid, potentially make that Ukraine aid a loan. And Dana, that's the question. Will Democrats be OK with that? Will they save Johnson if he moves forward with this different package? All huge questions for the Speaker.

BASH: So many questions. A lot of drama, and we really don't know how any of that is going to end. Thank you so much for that reporting, Manu. Appreciate it.

Thank you for joining this very busy day here on Inside Politics. CNN News Central starts after the break.

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