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Zelenskyy Coming to Washington to Meet with Trump; Trump Meets with British PM for Talks on Ukraine; Trump, UK PM Starmer Meet as Trump Splits with Allies on Ukraine; Fired USAID Workers Get 15 Minutes to Pack up their Desks; Musk on DOGE Cuts: "We will make Mistakes". Aired 12-12:30p ET

Aired February 27, 2025 - 12:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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DANA BASH, CNN HOST, INSIDE POLITICS: Today on "Inside Politics", a special relationship tested. Donald Trump is welcoming the British Prime Minister to the White House this hour for crucial talks on the future of Ukraine and broader questions about the role of Trump's America in Europe.

Plus, it's a brain bending equation. The speaker and the president say they won't cut Social Security or Medicare or Medicaid. So how can they pay for the multi trillion-dollar Trump agenda? I'll discuss it with a key GOP lawmaker this hour.

And the Tate Brothers are right wing influencers. They're also accused of rape and human trafficking in Romania. So why did the government there let them fly on a private jet to Florida this morning? We have new details. I'm Dana Bash. Let's go behind the headlines and "Inside Politics".

And we start today at the White House, where the British Prime Minister Keir Starmer is expected to arrive any moment. His mission is to convince Donald Trump to move away from Vladimir Putin talking points and allow security guarantees for Ukraine. It won't be easy, and the global stakes are, of course, tremendous. CNN's Jeff Zeleny is at the White House, Jeff?

JEFF ZELENY, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: Dana, the special relationship certainly will be tested a new here as the British Prime Minister has his first meeting with Donald Trump as President. They have met before. They have talked on the phone previous times, and they met down at Mar-a-Lago.

But this moment, this day, is certainly different. If you think about this week in a play in three parts, the first act on Monday, when the French President Emmanuel Macron visited the White House to urge the American President to not accept an easy deal with Vladimir Putin.

The British Prime Minister, is reinforcing that message today and then tomorrow, the Ukrainian President is also scheduled to be here, so a very high stakes weeks of diplomacy, but there are still questions hanging over this potential agreement about security guarantees.

President Trump was very clear yesterday; he does not see it as the U.S.'s role in his view. He said it's Europe's role to provide security guarantees for Ukraine that, of course, is very worrisome to leaders throughout the Western alliance, because they simply fear that Vladimir Putin will do the same thing he did and invade Ukraine all over again.

However different at this moment is this deal that is underway, still being worked out between the U.S. and Ukraine over rare earths minerals. Let take a look at a few points of what is in the deal and what isn't in the deal. One thing that we're told they have agreed on is that investment fund between both the U.S. and the Leaders of Ukraine.

This would establish a Reconstruction Investment Fund. Ukraine has agreed to contribute 50 percent of new natural resource revenues, but this would not include revenue from resources already developed. The short answer for that is that the U.S. will not be getting some $500 billion in resources that they first asked for. But important here again, no commitment to fund additional war fighting that is also worrisome to some in the Western Alliance, as well as no U.S. security guarantee.

So even as this deal has not been officially worked out, the British Prime Minister here for a meeting with the president to amplify the point that the U.S. should not accept any deal from Vladimir Putin without some type of concessions. So, this meeting will take place shortly, and the two leaders are set to have a press conference here later this afternoon Dana.

BASH: All right, Jeff, thank you so much. Appreciate it. And Starmer's White House visit comes just a day after President Trump all but ruled out the very thing the prime minister came to discuss.

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DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA: Well, I'm not going to make security guarantees beyond very much. We're going to have Europe do that because it's in -- we're talking about Europe as their next-door neighbor, but we're going to make sure everything goes well.

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BASH: Lucky to be surrounded by a really terrific group of reporters today. Josh Dawsey, now with "The Wall Street Journal", Laura Barron- Lopez of the PBS NewsHour, Leigh Ann Caldwell, a Puck and CNN Zone, Alex Marquard. Hello, everybody.

As we were kind of looking at the screen that Jeff was reporting on this deal, Alex, you and I were kind of looking at each other about the details of it, because it really looks pretty one sided, and it looks like the United States is it just at least in the framework is getting a lot.

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But Ukraine, for Ukraine and for Zelenskyy himself, this is existential.

ALEX MARQUARDT, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: It really is, and it's also really vague. It's a framework, and we should emphasize that it's essentially a deal that sets up discussions for another deal. It's quite specific about the structure of this fund, this jointly owned and operated fund that they're establishing.

But they're not talking in any real detail about specific minerals, where they are? How much they're -- how big the deposits are? And how hard they could be to reach, many of which I understand are in the eastern part of the of the country war torn in Russian occupied areas.

So, Zelenskyy is going to come here, and he will have struck a deal with Donald Trump, which I think is a win. He gets to give Trump a deal, and that makes Trump feel good, and hopefully looks and after that, he looks upon Zelenskyy favorably.

Zelenskyy also gets a meeting with Trump before President Putin, and that was a major question. We've heard President Trump saying that he will meet with Putin at some point. There was a rumor it could happen this week obviously that's not happening. So, Zelenskyy gets that first position.

But he is not likely going to walk away with any kind of security assurances. There's nothing about security assistance or security guarantees in that deal, and that is what Prime Minister Starmer is trying to push forward today. Starmer has talked about the need for an American backstop to really reinforce the deterrence that the Europeans hope to put in place in Ukraine if a deal is struck.

They talked about troops on the ground. President Trump has ruled that out. So, Starmer is coming here to get is tangible American elements that could really help reinforce that if there is a deal to be put in place, what that looks like? We don't know, and we have not heard positive signs from the Trump Administration.

BASH: And on Starmer in particular, some of us were at the British Embassy last night here in Washington, and the Prime Minister was there and gave brief remarks. And it's really interesting to hear a Labor Prime Minister, somebody who is not conservative, use some talking points that he clearly is intending as an Olive Branch, plus, plus to Donald Trump.

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KEIR STARMER, UNITED KINGDOM PRIME MINISTER: Because what $1.5 trillion invested in each other's economy. Our trading relationship is not just strong, it's fair and balanced. Taking out a chain saw isn't quite my style, but we are stripping away red tape and bureaucracy. We are reforming permitting, getting things built, reducing barriers to investment and growth.

(END VIDEO CLIP) BASH: Josh?

JOSH DAWSEY, POLITICAL INVESTIGATIONS REPORTER, THE WALL STREET JOURNAL: Well, I think you're desperate to try and have a good relationship with him, right? I mean, all of these world leaders, you see, Trump, have come out -- you know, threatening tariffs left and right on traditional allies, talking about trying to take other territories, making some pretty bold comments in his first month of presidency.

And they look at the United States, where Republicans control the House, Republicans control the Senate. He seems to have more at the apex of his power. And I think world leaders are trying to whisper to him, to kow-tow to him, because I think they don't know what he's willing to do right now.

I mean, with terrorists, for example, you saw in his first couple of weeks, Trump says, OK, I'm going to put all these tariffs on our allies. Sets off a mad scramble. These countries calling, begging -- you know for him to stop basically, and that's what he likes to do.

So, you see the U.K. today, for example, like coming in right now in this moment, I'm sure they find probably some of his policies distasteful, some of the things he's done quite frustrating already privately. But what are they going to do? They've got to deal with him right now, because he is -- he is sort of at the top of, top of the heat.

LAURA BARRON-LOPEZ, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: No, it's striking to Josh's point, also just on the Hill, the way you've seen Republicans, who traditionally were so much behind -- so far behind Ukraine, and really supported helping Ukraine. And the shift that has occurred, there are still those that are on the Hill, still Republicans that support it, but it just shows you how much Trump has moved the party.

I'm going to be interested to see if Starmer kind of like Macron a few days prior, ends up correcting some of the record in front of the public the way Macron did.

BASH: Yes. And I mean, that's a good point. There was a story in the Atlantic where the reporter Elaine Godfrey called members of Congress and their offices on the Republican side, asking every Republican two simple questions, a few straight answers, the response on 19 out of 271, only some of them were yes and yes.

And the question was, did Russia invade Ukraine? Is Putin a dictator? Having said that there are some people who still see that the sky is blue and that facts are facts. And I want you to listen to some of those Republicans.

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REP. MIKE MCCAUL (R-TX): We all know the historical record. That's not accurate. I mean, Russia invaded Ukraine, there's just no question about it.

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SEN. THOM TILLIS (R-NC): Putin continues to be a murderer and responsible for the kidnap, rape, torture and murder of tens of thousands of Ukrainians. I consider that an aggressor.

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BASH: Leigh.

LEIGH ANN CALDWELL, CHIEF WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT, PUCK: Yeah, there still are those people on Capitol Hill who are -- who are willing to speak out on this issue specifically, but the wave of the party is shifting. One thing I'm going to be paying attention to is public opinion and what they believe on the facts of the origin of this war.

Because Donald Trump has a real gift of saying things -- false things over and over and over again, and then his supporters start to believe it. Look at you know, the 2020, election has won the January 6th rioters who are peaceful protesters. Public opinion polling has shown that over time, more and more people agree with those statements.

And so, when I was talking to Thom Tillis about this last week, he said, look, I'm not worried yet. I not worried. This is just a new transition -- you know new administration getting its footing. If this is still the rhetoric in April, he says, then I'm going to start to worry about it. And then I think that there's a lot of damage that can be done optically as well in the next couple months, if he continues that.

BASH: What does this matter Alex?

MARQUARDT: Well, there are major concerns about the concessions that the Trump Administration has already given to the Russians. The Europeans have accused Trump of that. The top EU foreign policy official has accused Trump of appeasement. We're hearing a lot of that among Democrats and some Republicans.

He has been echoing Trump has been echoing Putin's talking points, and he has already said things like, no U.S. troops in Ukraine, no Ukraine membership in NATO. Those are things that many would argue should still be on the table and part of these negotiations.

So now you have this parade of European officials here this week, Macron on Monday, Starmer today, Zelenskyy tomorrow. They are all working together to try to pull Trump back away from the Russians and telling him in a unified voice, you cannot, you have to be tough with Putin. You cannot give in to his positions. And there's a lot of hope that, of course, the last people in the room that Trump is listening to are the positions that Trump will take.

BASH: And he did say, yeah, the president did say yesterday that Russia would have to make some concessions. We don't know what those are. We'll see if that actually happens. Thank you. Don't go anywhere. Coming up, they worked to provide food and vaccines across the globe, and now they're out of a job. CNN is live at the USAID Headquarters as Team Trump dismantles the agency. That's next. (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

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BASH: 15 minutes, that is how long fired USAID workers have to pack up their desks today. This comes as the Trump Administration is taking further steps to dismantle that agency, announcing it is terminating more than 90 percent, 90 percent of USAID's foreign assistance award. Arlette Saenz is outside USAID Headquarters here in Washington, with the latest Arlette?

ARLETTE SAENZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well Dana, over the past four hours, we have seen USAID workers streaming out of the Headquarters here in downtown Washington, D.C., after they had the opportunity to collect their belongings, many of these staffers were either terminated or placed on administrative leave.

And they've been given certain a few hour windows to come get their belongings from their work spaces, and they need to do so in a 15- minute increment. Now, as they've streamed out, we've seen people with suitcases, carting boxes and also tote bags of their belongings, and they are greeted outside by supporters who are here to applaud them for their service.

As you can see behind me, there is a wall of thanks that people are coming to write to send messages to those USAID, workers who have been impacted. Now we had the chance to speak with one, a young woman named Juliane Alfen. She's 25-years-old. She was participating in the Presidential Management fellowship within the USAID, that's a program that was terminated by President Trump via executive order just last week. Here is how she's described the experience as she now no longer has a job.

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SAENZ: What was it like coming back here today?

JULIANE ALFEN, FIRED USAID EMPLOYEE: Heart breaking, locking in the building and seeing all the pictures of our projects being taken -- that were taken down work like getting children vaccines or providing food aid, things that really matter being treated as if they're nothing. It's really hard to see.

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SAENZ: And Dana, I want to show you one sign of protests we've seen here today. There was actually black tape that was covering the USAID logo outside of the Headquarters, there was one terminated worker who told me that they wanted to rip this down as they believe that the mission of so many workers at USAID still exists, just a sign of the very palpable frustration that many people who have worked with the agency are feeling in this moment.

BASH: All right. Arlette, thank you so much for that report. I appreciate it. And my panel is back here. And Josh, you know, we're seeing this particularly at USAID. And you know, more broadly, we're seeing cuts across the federal government. Of course, we've been talking about that non-stop.

But just to kind of play the devil's advocate here, we know a lot of the reasons why USAID exist. A lot of these programs exist, and they have for Republican presidents, Democratic presidents soft power on and on.

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The way that the Trump team is spinning it is and arguing to their voters and to Americans more broadly, is that this is taxpayer dollars wasted on programs abroad instead of paying for things here. So given that kind of square those politics with what we're seeing today.

DAWSEY: Well, it's interesting. One of the reasons they started finding those projects that they thought American voters would really not like to see is because they got such backlash from Republican a lot of some Republican Congressmen and Senators on the Hill at the beginning. who were frustrated with the U.S. aid cuts.

And they were saying, OK, we've got to make a better public case for why we are doing this. And they went through and found different programs in the budget, but they thought they could use sort of as a public spectacle. I mean, it's sort of a systematic defenestration of lots of parts of the government the Trump people are doing.

I was talking to Debbie Dingell yesterday, a long-term Congresswoman from Michigan. Who was saying to me, she's never seen federal workers are scared. She said, in the -- her decades of being in Washington, she's never seen the culture of sort of the government, the White House, kind of taking on its on branches of government.

I mean, Republican presidents traditionally have always said we're going to cut spending when it cut spending. But Trump's first term, when they would try to get him to cut programs like this, people would come in and they would talk him out of it, and they would sort of do the House of protests, and eventually they would go back in the budget.

And I don't think, I mean, he certainly ran on making a lot of cuts like this. He ran on running Elon do this. I mean, this was a big part of his campaign. So, people should not be that surprised. But I will say the different thing is here -- you know, it's gone even further than a lot of his people thought it with his own advisors.

BASH: Well. And then you mentioned Elon Musk. I'm not so sure we knew that he was going to have the kind of like access that he has now.

DAWSEY: No.

BASH: But - yeah, but he, yeah, but he definitely, the president ran on making a lot of cuts. This time yesterday, Elon Musk was in the Cabinet meeting, and I want you to listen to one of the things that he said, suggesting that they made a mistake with regard to cuts in USAID for Ebola prevention that they reversed.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) ELON MUSK, TESLA CEO: We won't be perfect, but when we make mistake, we'll fix it very quickly. So, for example, with USAID, one of the things we accidentally canceled very briefly was Ebola prevention. I think we all want Ebola prevention, so we restored the Ebola prevention immediately.

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BASH: "The Washington Post" is reporting that he's wrong, that there are lots of USAID Ebola prevention efforts that are still halted because of the work that DOGE has done, that they move to gut global assistance, and the agency around it frees its outgoing payments. The team that contracts would be -- the contractors would be deployed to fight an Ebola outbreak. They've been dismantled.

BARRON-LOPEZ: Yeah, teams across the board have been dismantled, whether it's the Global Health under USAID, whether it's the humanitarian assistance Department under USAID. I mean, my reporting shows that as well, it matches the post, which is that every USAID worker I talked to, whether they were a Foreign Service Officer still abroad had to be recalled. Are here in the U.S. is that the system is not working.

So even though Secretary Rubio signed waivers because they tried to immediately reverse what they stopped in terms of Ebola prevention or PEPFAR drugs for HIV, that medicine and that aid is not getting where it's supposed to be going because DOGE messed with the payment system and because there's no one around to make sure it gets there.

And in terms of why Americans should potentially care, or at least why Secretary of State Marco Rubio used to care about USAID, he had many floor speeches supporting it over the years. Is because when you -- USAID is part of the American officers that respond to Ebola outbreaks abroad, like ones in the Congo, like ones in Uganda.

And I was talking to a foreign service officer who just got evacuated from the Democratic Republic of Congo, who said, sure, you can maybe save 10 million right now by cutting the Ebola prevention program, but then you're going to pay three times that when Ebola hits Atlanta or New York City.

BASH: Yeah, exactly. And the theme, more broadly, and everything that we're talking about here is just chaos and confusion, some of it intentional, some of it not intentional, just some headlines way beyond USAID the FDA moved to rehire medical device food safety and other staffers who were fired just days earlier.

EPA, employees fired and then told it was a mistake. USDA people who are in charge of making sure our food is safe, accidentally fired officials working on bird flu. We know that's a very big problem right now. And then we all know about what happened with the people working on nuclear weapons to protect them.

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Leigh Ann, in your newsletter this morning in Puck, you asked a question about what the purpose is? And you can see right on the screen to break S, H, blank, T, this person said, simply enough. Yes, DOGE wants to save some money and rid the government of woke programs, but the real goal is to dismantle what America First philosophers, there was definitely some sarcasm there, like Russ Vote have called the administrative state potentially beyond repair.

I think this is so key, because as much as we hear about, oh, this was a mistake. That was a mistake. What is not a mistake is that this is intentional. And there are a lot of people, particularly in this universe, who are just fine with it.

CALDWELL: Yeah, absolutely. And one of the conversations that's happening on Capitol Hill in this budget funding discussion, where the government funding runs out on March 14th, is whether these cuts should be codified or not? Because it's really Congress's job to implement these cuts.

And so that could also lead to a government shutdown, which will create more chaos and more problems. But absolutely chaos is they want the administrative state broken the parts that can't be broken that they realized later, maybe they're going to try to put them back together. But you're right. It is intentional.

BASH: All right, everybody stand-by. Coming up, the difficult math for the GOP Republicans promise not to touch Medicaid to pay for the Trump agenda. But do the numbers add up. I'll talk to a senior House Republican appropriator after the break.

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