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Trump DOJ Abruptly Fires Epstein Prosecutor Maurene Comey; Trump Tries To Shift Blame To Democrats As GOP Splits Over Epstein; Today: Bondi Visiting Alcatraz Prison As GOP Splits Over Epstein; Democrats Far More Motivated Than Republicans To Vote Next Year; Record-Low 28% Have Favorable View Of Democratic Party; Senate Dems Walk Out Of Hearing On Trump Judicial Nominee Emil Bove. Aired 12- 12:30p ET

Aired July 17, 2025 - 12:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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DANA BASH, CNN HOST, INSIDE POLITICS: Today on Inside Politics, not turning the page. The Epstein outrage cycle shows no signs of letting up after the Justice Department fired a top prosecutor in the Epstein case, who also happens to be the daughter of a man near the top of the president's enemies list.

Plus, they're fired up and ready to go. We have brand new CNN polling that shows Democrats can't wait to vote in next year's midterms. It's an enthusiasm advantage that could pay dividends for the Democratic Party, except for another unusual finding in our poll. We're going to explain what that is.

And will Bert and Ernie have to get a third roommate to help cover the rent. The Senate just cut off funding for public broadcasting, and certainly it helps the president execute what Republicans have been trying to do since the 1960s.

I'm Dana Bash. Let's go behind the headlines at Inside Politics.

President Trump spent days, trying to get his party and the country to move past the Jeffrey Epstein files. He's pleaded with his supporters. He's bargained with them. He's called them privately on the phone. He's publicly rebuked them so far to no avail.

And the Justice Department's abrupt decision last night to fire Maurene Comey, one of the lead prosecutors in the Epstein case, whose last name certainly rings a bell. It doesn't seem to be doing the trick either. She got no explanation for her removal, but the timing is odd, to say the least.

Last night in an interview on a right-wing network, the president repeated his frankly ludicrous claim that the Epstein story was manufactured by Democrats as a way to get him and that perhaps federal investigators would look at it from that angle.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF UNITED STATES OF AMERICA (voiceover): I think they could look at all of it. It's all the same scam. They could look at this Jeffrey Epstein hoax also, because that's the same stuff, that's all put out by Democrats. And, you know, some of the naive Republicans fall right into line, like they always do. They just don't have the -- they don't have the sustainability. They don't have -- there's something, they don't have that stick to it like glue.

The Democrats, you know, they have bad policy, they have bad candidates, they have bad everything, but they stick together. I think it's in the case of Epstein, they've already looked at it and they are looking at it, and I think all they have to do is put out anything credible. But you know, that was run by the Biden administration for four years. I can imagine what they put into files.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BASH: Just to emphasize, there's no evidence of any -- about what the president just said about the Democrats. Let's talk a lot more about this and learn more from a terrific group of reporters. We have here at the table, CNN's David Chalian, Sabrina Rodriguez of the Washington Post, Zolan Kanno-Youngs of The New York Times and CNN's Paula Reid.

David Chalian, I'm going to start with you. It's really remarkable to continue day after day to see President Trump try to squash this, and the more he tries, the worse it gets with his very own base.

DAVID CHALIAN, CNN POLITICAL DIRECTOR & WASHINGTON BUREAU CHIEF: Yes. And when we say base, this isn't even with necessarily his base of voters, but this very powerful vocal influential group of MAGA communicators, right, that throughout Donald Trump's entire time leading this movement --

(AUDIO GAP)

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ZOLAN KANNO-YOUNGS, WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT, THE NEW YORK TIMES: -- broader warning about the dynamics right now of our government. We've talked often about how much retribution is at the center of this administration's policies as well. And here that that singling out that word of fear here. I find that to be -- to be interesting and something to track here.

Again, we're going to be looking for the exact reasoning of this. We know that in her firing, Article Two was mentioned, and that that obviously goes straight to the powers of the president as well, which is something to keep an eye on as well.

SABRINA RODRIGUEZ, NATIONAL POLITICS REPORTER, THE WASHINGTON POST: We're also seeing, you know, Democrats try and capitalize on this moment that has been really interesting. You know, we've seen them in the last six months of the Trump administration, try, whether it was with his arguments and his public fights with Elon Musk, whether it was with the attack on Iran, them trying to sort of capitalize. But here is a moment that just yesterday, talking to Democratic strategists, they were saying, wait. We have an opportunity here because this is organically online everywhere. So, this is a chance for us to really push on this point and really touch on this sensitive point to see these huge influencers not in the president's corner on this.

BASH: Yeah. We're going to -- I think that is so fascinating, Sabrina. We're going to talk a little bit more about the Democrats decision to jump in as opposed to staying on the sidelines. But just kind of again, back to the question and the discussion and the reality of how much this story has penetrated into pop culture and to just culture. And it's the thing that people are talking about, if there were still water coolers that people would be talking about around --

CHALIAN: Water coolers?

(CROSSTALK)

BASH: OK. It just filters water. Yeah. Let's listen to what Shane Gillis, who was a comedian, said at the ESPYs last night.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SHANE GILLIS, COMEDIAN: Actually, there was supposed to be an Epstein joke here, but as it got deleted, must have probably deleted itself, right? Probably never existed, actually. Let's move on as a country and ignore that.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BASH: And by the way, Shane Gillis is not known as a lefty liberal.

CHALIAN: No, but good comedy, right?

BASH: Yeah, of course.

CHALIAN: I think that play in the headlines. I think one of the most interesting aspects to me is that one of the hallmarks of this Trump administration has been from the very beginning that he knows his way around the office. Now, right, he's far more comfortable in the job than he was in the first term. He's far more comfortable and knowledgeable about what levers of power to pull and any staff in a way that was going to be committed to him being comfortable with that.

And this is -- this is the first time in these six months, I think that we see him not comfortable. He's off his game. So, I think that's why we see him go into the well of -- its Barack Obama and Hillary Clinton and Jim Comey, like he is off his footing here.

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BASH: And I'll add another dynamic that he may be an old trick that has worked for him in the past, which is the art of distraction. Just for some examples, the ex-FBI director, the father of the man or of the woman we're talking about, and ex-CIA Director Brennan are suddenly under investigation by the Trump Justice Department. That's according to CNN reporting right when this was really blowing up over the weekend.

The president put a long post out about revoking Rosie O'Donnell's citizenship. I mean, that's really a deep cut, as the kids said, going back, what, 10 years. And then he's talking about whether he would fire Jerome Powell or not. Now, that's actually something that is a real policy issue, but getting it out there is certainly something that people can talk about without talking about Epstein.

And today, Paula, his attorney general is going to Alcatraz, real Alcatraz.

PAULA REID, CNN CHIEF LEGAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: The original Alcatraz. Yes.

BASH: The original Alcatraz, not alligator Alcatraz. I think it's only a conservative media outlet that was invited to go. Yes. And, you know, they have been talking about reopening it, but that's not what this is about.

REID: No, this is clearly an effort to distract, right? What's the shiny object that will maybe get people to look away from this? Now I'll give the attorney general some credit. She appeared at a press conference earlier this week. She took questions. She did not answer them, including mine, about Epstein, but she took about half a dozen questions. So, she's not hiding.

But they are trying to play this out, hope that people will just forget it and they can deflect. I don't know if that is going to work, though. That is -- that is a really big gamble. President Trump has done this repeatedly, successfully. This time is different.

BASH: Can we just talk just real quick about the Pam Bondi of it all? Because the fact that he has not turned on her, just the opposite. He is so supportive of her in the face of so many calls from so many people he listens to, generally for her to resign, or at least to act. What does that tell you as somebody who's covered him for a while?

KANNO-YOUNGS: Yeah. Well, Pam Bondi and Dan Bongino had this, had this heated clash, you know, in the White House in front of Susie Wiles just last week. The reporting shows that after that, I mean, Pam Bondi accused Dan Bongino of leaking to the press to make her look bad in this situation. The chief of staff, the reporting shows, actually came out of that meeting, wanting Dan Bongino, you know, to turn to -- basically turn on the volume, turn out the temperature on this, right?

And you've seen the president the days since, really go out of his way to defend Pam Bondi. Now you have this trip, the Alcatraz, which is, I mean very much, playing to an audience of one of the president, too. So, actions like this, you can see at least in part, also an effort to stay on the -- in the good graces of the president.

BASH: Yes. But I think that it seems as though Donald Trump needs Pam Bondi to stay in his good graces. This is a -- I mean, President Trump is -- understands how -- everybody understands how transactional he is. This is to watch this relationship play out in the face of everything that's going on.

CHALIAN: It clearly still sees value in her for him right now, right?

BASH: You're right.

REID: And why don't he not and everything that he wants her to do, and she doesn't do anything outside of his approval. So, he owns this as much as she does.

BASH: Yeah. And the question is, why would he not, but why is he. All right. We have to leave it there. Coming up on Inside Politics, Democrats have rarely been so motivated to vote in the midterm election. That's what a new poll shows us. But they've also never been as unpopular as they are right now.

You got to see this new poll. It really has amazing new data. And you're looking at Democrats, trying to generate some fireworks on Capitol Hill. They walked out of a Senate committee hearing. We'll explain that as well.

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BASH: 16 months out from the midterms, Democratic voters are as energetic as ever. They're ready to go to the polls, even as the party as a whole has never been less popular. They are two really interesting takeaways from CNN's latest poll on the fight for Congress in 2026. If we have a poll, guess who we have here. The one and only, David Chalian. So big picture. What are we seeing about the Democrats?

CHALIAN: So, overall, just in terms of the overall population here, extremely motivated to vote for Congress. Back in October '24, we saw 61 percent of the population extremely motivated to vote in the presidential. You see almost as a motivated population to vote in these midterms.

BASH: Right.

CHALIAN: How does that break down by party? Well, advantage to the Democrats here. So, among Democratic and Democratic leaning independent voters in our poll, 72 percent say they're extremely motivated vote, that compares to 50 percent of Republican and Republican leaders. That 22-point advantage is not nothing. That's the opportunity for Democrats.

But as you said, what we see in the brand-new poll is the challenge for Democrats as well. Overall favorability. This is just basic popularity among Democrats -- among Americans, Democrats are at a 28 percent favorability.

BASH: Its stunning.

CHALIAN: Now, Republicans are not that much better. They're at a 33 percent favorability rating with the American public, but that 28 number for Democrats, that is a record low in the history of our polling. And it's largely because Democrats are sort of unhappy with their own -- Democratic voters are unhappy with Democrats more so than Republicans view their party less favorable.

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BASH: And the fact that it is the Democrats own, as you say, partisan supporters who are unhappy and driving the poll numbers of their leaders down. I mean, what does that tell the leadership about what to expect --

CHALIAN: Yeah. I mean, we asked folks, do Democrats? And this is, again, this is going to be among Democrats and Democratic leaning owners. We asked the Democrats, do your members of -- do Democrats deserve reelection? Overall, 66 percent say yes. But what you see, Dana, is the generational divide inside the Democratic Party that we've been talking about for quite some time.

Under 45 years old, if you're a Democrat, Democratic leaning under 45, 52 percent, roughly half say, Democrats deserve reelection. If you're over 45 years old, 76 percent of those older Democrats say Democrats deserve reelection. But this is that generational divide that we will continue to watch.

Here's the other opportunity for Democrats and warning sign for Republicans. The country is not happy with unified Republican control of the House, the Senate and the White House. 65 percent of independents, critical swing voters, of course. 65 percent of independents say that's bad for the country. Only 35 percent of those crucial independent voters say that's good for the country. So that's an opportunity for a potential change election in '26, Dana?

BASH: Thanks, David. See you back here at the table in a second. Appreciate it. Zolan, I want to talk about this all-time low that David mentioned and look at it. Look at the numbers in the context of years past, and we put it there up on the screen. He mentioned, 28 percent is an all-time low favorability of Democrats.

And if you kind of look and people understand, maybe some of the historical importance of some of these dates, these are dates in the past going back to 2006 where there were moments in history where Democrats weren't exactly popular. And yet, right now, they're lower than any time since 2006.

KANNO-YOUNGS: I mean, I think it's something that's built up, you know, over the years. And this is based off reporting, talking to political analysts, voters, including during the last presidential election. People feel as if members of the party aren't in touch with them, don't represent them. And that's beyond just demographics, you know, or I should say that's across a range of demographics, right, age, race, class as well.

And on top of that, I mean, the last presidential election factors into this. It really does. When you have somebody that for the most of the race was at the top of the ticket, that voters were screaming out that they did care about Joe Biden's age and felt that they were not heard, right? So, there's a problem about where the party -- for the party of just listening to voters as well and listening to the concerns of voters.

Then you add in this current period that we're in where people -- that were Democrats are seeing a president, a leader in the White House that they feel are, in many cases, assaulting their civil rights. In other cases, putting forth policies that will undermine their way of living, and don't see leader of the party that can fight against that, and we still don't have a clear leader of the party.

BASH: OK. So, I want to go back to something you mentioned in the last segment because I think this really could speak to how democratic leaders are trying to listen to their voters, and that is being part of the noise. And I'll just read something from Bulwark, which I thought was really telling about what Democrats are doing right now with Epstein, which they didn't do before.

There's an old saying, never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake. This past week, the Democratic Party has ignored this sage advice. They're not avoiding interrupting Donald Trump as his presidency becomes subsumed by the Jeffrey Epstein saga. Instead, they're interrupting routinely, gleefully, and in remarkable unison.

RODRIGUEZ: I mean, that's true, Dana. What's happening right now is not something we've necessarily seen very much of in the last six months. Democrats have struggled with, you know, Democrats always trying to be proper and do things the right way, by the book, have gotten themselves into this situation now where, you know, with them being in the minority in Congress, it's not that they can derail votes. It's not that they could stop the big, beautiful bill from happening. They recognize that.

So, when you go out into the rest of the country and talk to folks, they're saying, what exactly are Democrats doing? All this bad stuff is happening that we disagree with, Democratic voters disagree with. What are they doing to stop it? So, in some ways, we know we recognize some of the performance of it all. But for a lot of folks at home, they're saying, OK, yes, say something, do something, stand up for people. And that's where that we do see some of that resonating.

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BASH: So, it's maybe stand up for people do something, but it's also -- there's a whole conversation happening. Let's take Epstein as the example right now. And it is true that it used to be for most of our time covering politics. That was the kind of the North Star of strategy, which is, if somebody is imploding, get out of the way and let them implode. But that was before this time and place that we're in where, if you're not part of the conversation, you're not, you know, you almost don't exist.

CHALIAN: Yeah, is attention economy, right? I mean, that is the attention economy, and they're trying to learn how to be in that because the Republicans have been more successful in that space. And it's like what you guys have been saying here. Democrats, I think, have been seen in large part, as protectors of the status quo at a time when Americans are not happy with the status quo, and so the Republicans in the Trump era have been the disruptors.

And it may not be disruption that everyone likes, and everybody can have their own flavor of disruption. But they were the disruptors, and Democrats were then in this position as defenders of something that nobody -- no American wanted defended. And then add on the credibility problem that they had in the last election with Biden, and that massive disconnect that he was having with voters of what they were looking for in a candidate and that just compounds the problem.

And so, that's why I think what is so intriguing is that these low numbers for the Democrats is largely driven by Democrats. Republicans are much more pleased with their leaders than Democrats are with theirs. And that's so -- it's a problem they have to solve, sort of inside the House.

BASH: I do want to go back to something that we showed going to break, and that is, what happened at the Senate Judiciary Committee meeting this morning, where they did vote to advance Emil Bove's nomination to be a Third Circuit Court of Appeals judge. By the way, he was formerly President Trump's personal attorney. And here's what happened on the Democratic side of the dais.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. CORY BOOKER (D-NJ): This is outrageous that you're not allowing senators to have their fair say before a controversial nominee. Is being done with all appeals to past jurisdiction and past president. Why are you doing this? This is outrageous.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This is a kangaroo court. That's what we have here, Mr. Chairman.

BOOKER: This is law to violate your own rules without going by the mandate of the parliamentarian. This is wrong, sir. And I join with my colleagues in leaving. You're better than this.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BASH: OK. That was performative, but that's the point.

KANNO-YOUNGS: Yeah. Right, right. It's a sign of fight, right? A sign of pushing back. And Booker also had those marathon remarks, you know, in recent weeks too, so we've seen him move ahead with that. They know that that's going to go viral. It sends a message out. I don't think it answers a question, though, that I hear often from voters and Democratic voters, which is, OK, fighting against the Trump administration is one thing. What are you offering? What is your alternative agenda that you are offering here as well?

RODRIGUEZ: But I think one of the things that they're trying to accomplish here is to make sure that people know these things are happening. That's a judiciary hearing. You know, people are not paying attention to that, but that scene is more likely to go on TikTok. You're more likely to see it online. We're talking about it here now, and the optics of it, the imagery we wouldn't necessarily have if that hadn't happened. So, I think they're starting to figure out that, wait, we need to find ways for people to actually tune in, and things like that do get people at least to tune in.

BASH: Yeah. That's such a good point. All right, everybody standby. Coming up on Inside Politics, the big win congressional Republicans are about to hand President Trump. That's more than half a century in the making. We'll explain.

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