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Now: Senate Voting On GOP Bill To Fund Govt. For 7-Weeks; No Clear Path Out Of Govt. Shutdown As Both Sides Dig In; Johnson: "There's Nothing For Me To Give" Democrats On Funding. Aired 12-12:30p ET

Aired October 01, 2025 - 12:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[12:00:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

DANA BASH, CNN HOST, INSIDE POLITICS: The breaking news this hour. Welcome to Inside Politics. I'm Dan Bash in Washington. And it is that we are 12 hours into the government shutdown. Negotiations from Capitol Hill to the White House are at a standstill. What that means, is hundreds of thousands of people are getting furloughed. Others are working without pay.

Right now, the U.S. Senate is voting on the Republican bill to fund the government for seven weeks. It's the third time Republicans have brought it up. They have promised to repeat the vote every day, and it will continue until lawmakers reach a deal.

Joining me now is a key player in all of this, the Speaker of the House, Mike Johnson. Thank you so much for coming in. It's nice to see you in person. You have said quote, there is literally nothing to negotiate. There's nothing I can do. You are the speaker of the House. There is, in fact, a lot you can do.

REP. MIKE JOHNSON (R-LA): Well, there's not actually. Let me explain that. As you noted, they're voting right now on the Senate floor. We'll see how that turns out. Last night, three Democrats -- two Democrats and independent flipped and came along with the Republicans. But it looks like and what we expect is that most of the Democrats in the Senate, again, will reject the clean CR that we sent over. It's clean.

What that means is it's nonpartisan. We didn't add any Republican priorities or poison pills or gimmicks or tricks into that at all. It's 24 pages. I mean, everybody can read it for themselves. It simply continues the Biden era spending levels that Chuck Schumer and the Democrats have already supported in the past. They just did it most recently in March, and he gave long speeches about how it was so critically important that we not shut the government down.

So, there's nothing for me to give. There's nothing to negotiate. I don't have any Republican priorities to put on the table because we sent over a clean CR, and that's why none of this makes sense.

BASH: OK. So, the Democrats argue that it's priorities, yes, that are maybe their policy priorities, but they also should be the priorities for people in your district and in Republican districts across the country. The biggest of which they argue is extending the subsidies for people who can't afford Obamacare to be able to afford Obamacare.

I understand that they don't expire until the end of the calendar year. The argument that they make is that insurance companies start to make a plan like, soon. And so, by the time they make that plan, the subsidies will be -- will expire. Isn't there something to that?

JOHNSON: No, that's a December policy issue. It's going to take--

BASH: But insurance companies have to make their decisions well before December.

JOHNSON: The benefits do not expire until December 31, and insurance companies can make different decisions, OK. There's plenty of time on the clock, that's an eternity, as you know, in legislative terms, to have three months ahead of us to do that. The reason we put a simple seven-week extension of government funding is to allow for all that debate.

The month of October is going to be very important for us to determine all these things and to have a bipartisan discussion and deliberation over that. But we have to have the lights on in the building to do it. The first and most important function of Congress is to keep the government in operation. Every Democrat who is voting no today has said that many times, we're playing the highlight reel. Just listen to what Chuck Schumer himself said until today.

BASH: So, I just want to make --I just want to be clear. You are saying hard line, red line. You will not negotiate on anything until the government is reopened.

JOHNSON: Chuck Schumer was in the Oval Office with me. What 48 hours ago. We were there the president as a strong leader. He brought all of us in, all four leaders, Thune and Schumer and myself, and Hakeem Jeffries. And the president said, make your case. What is it you want?

And Chuck Schumer repeated in that meeting. What he put on paper, the counter proposal that he filed, everyone can go read it for themselves, would add $1.5 trillion in new spending on a seven-week stop gap measure. We're not doing that. He wants to give healthcare to illegal aliens. Again, we're not doing that. He wanted to claw back $50 billion that our Republican, big, beautiful bill put in to prop up rural hospitals.

Now people say, why would he do that? I thought he was for healthcare. Well, a lot of those rural hospitals, most of them are in red states. So, I don't know. I don't know what his motivation is, but we can't do it.

BASH: You had a very spirited discussion with my friend and colleague, Kaitlan Collins, about illegal immigrants getting healthcare. I don't want to repeat that. If you want to see it, you can look on YouTube. I just want to say for the record that Democrat, that right now the law of the land is explicitly that illegal immigrants do not get healthcare.

JOHNSON: That's correct because we added that in the law got signed into law July 4. That was the Republicans big, beautiful bill. Chuck Schumer's proposal is to repeal that -- to look at, page 57 of the bill that he bought.

[12:05:00]

BASH: OK. Yeah, no. I mean, I have your -- people printed something out for me, so let's just kind of finish this, and then I want to ask you about other things. If Chuck Schumer and Hakeem Jeffries came to you and said, what you interpret as giving illegal immigrants healthcare is off the table. Would you reopen the government?

JOHNSON: Well, no, because he's put all sorts of other things. Thers's other--

BASH: OK. So, let's talk about the other things. Let's talk about the other things. So, you mentioned, $1.5 trillion.1 trillion of that is to reverse Medicaid cuts that you put in the big, beautiful bill--

JOHNSON: Medicaid reforms, not cuts. Don't take my word for it--

BASH: It's less -- It's less spending. You can call it what you want.

JOHNSON: The CBO, Congressional Budget Office, which everybody cites and CNN does all the time, is the neutral arbiter of all these things. They came out with a report on October -- August 25, just several weeks back. And they said, you know what, what happened in that big, beautiful bill? This is what we project. It's going to save Medicaid. It's going to strengthen Medicaid.

Why? Because they're CBO, not Republicans. CBO said, 2.3 million improper enrollments are involved in Medicaid right now. What is that? Illegal aliens, young, able-bodied men without dependents, who are riding the wagon and should be working instead. Our legislation strengthens Medicaid because we kick those people off. They were not entitled. Medicaid is intended for U.S. citizens who are young, pregnant women, disabled or elderly, not these other categories.

BASH: But once this goes into effect, which is after the midterms, people will feel cuts who are not necessarily--

JOHNSON: Yeah. Those young, able-bodied men who said, they're not playing video games. No, that's a big portion of it.

BASH: Not just them.

JOHNSON: Look at the studies. Look at the studies.

BASH: So, but when you see that $1 trillion that they do want to put back into this. You don't think that what they are doing is politically palpable for even a lot of people in your district?

JOHNSON: There's one reason and one reason alone, they're marking this argument. BASH: Because they will see cuts to Medicaid.

JOHNSON: Here's the motivation. Let's just cut the chase. Chuck Schumer is doing this. The reason he switched his position, he's had for 30 years, right now, and doing the exact opposite that he said in March of this year as recently as March, is because he is in political jeopardy. He's afraid he's going to get a challenge from his left flank and AOC, or someone else will run against him for his Senate seat. So, Chuck Schumer has to put up a fight and pretend that he's fighting the president, fighting Republicans.

BASH: I've been in town, in this town, maybe even longer than you, and so, I've seen politics played on all kinds of things.

JOHNSON: No, that's fair. But I'm telling you what's happening right now. Yeah.

BASH: I do want to -- I want to talk about something you said this morning about Chuck Schumer you said Schumer has now handed the keys to the kingdom to the executive branch, and that a shutdown can provide an opportunity to, quote, downsize the government. I just want to be clear. Do you think that the OMB, the executive branch should use this shutdown as an excuse to permanently fire federal workers?

JOHNSON: Well, I can tell you right now, the president has been a benevolent president. He is mitigating the harm right now. OMB has not come out of the blocks and fired a bunch of people, that's know--

BASH: Which you think they should?

JOHNSON: Well, it provides an opportunity. Chuck Schumer has provided the Trump White House with an opportunity to downsize the government on priorities and policies and personnel that they deem to be non- essential. Now, Chuck Schumer has very different priorities about federal government--

BASH: What's your priority? You're the speaker of the House. You can say--

JOHNSON: I certainly want to downsize the size and scope of the federal government.

BASH: So, you think that the people who are maybe furloughed right now, or even, you know, working without pay, should be on the chopping block for permanent dismissal?

JOHNSON: No, I wouldn't. I wouldn't say that, because the people that are furloughed right now are hardworking American federal workers.

BASH: So, who should be fired during the shutdown?

JOHNSON: I don't know. You'd have to show me a proposal of what is--

BASH: I don't have a proposal.

JOHNSON: I don't have it either, but I have a conference call with Russ Vought at OMB in about two hours, and we're going to ask him about the details of that. But I'll tell you right now--

BASH: So, this is happening.

JOHNSON: Well, I don't know. I'm going to find out what his plans are. But I will tell you this right now, who's being harmed are women, infants and children. Their nutrition program is stalled. Veterans who are not getting their services right now. And very important services like suicide prevention, that's a day-to-day thing.

BASH: Yeah. No question. I mean it's horrible.

JOHNSON: FEMA is not funded right now--

BASH: It's horrible. That is temporary. So, I just -- you're going to talk to Russ Vought, and obviously, we're going to ask what happens after that. But last week, he sent a memo directing agencies to start drafting plans.

JOHNSON: Yeah. That's his job.

(CROSSTALK)

BASH: But you have a point of view. Can you on that phone call say with him, please don't do this. This is not appropriate.

JOHNSON: No, because look, if Russ Vought -- Russ Vought has to make tough decisions. Whoever is the director of the Office of Management and Budget in a scenario like this has to make tough choices. They have to decide, they're tasked under law. They must decide what are essential services and what are not? What are policies and proposals should their priorities?

BASH: No, but it's usually tech priority under a shutdown. We're talking about permanently firing people.

JOHNSON: Well, I'm not sure that hasn't happened before, but if, if the authority is there and he sees a program that is wasting taxpayer dollars. You and I could both agree that government doesn't do everything in the most efficient matter.

BASH: Isn't that your I mean, constitutionally, that's your job. Article One, that is your job.

JOHNSON: It is until Chuck Schumer decides to hand the keys to the president, which is literally what he's doing. If he makes the decision to shut the federal government down, he's shutting down the legislative branch, and he is giving the authority to the executive. That's how the system works, and he's made that decision. So, is it foolhardy for him to do so? Of course, it is. Put it backfire, fantastically. Yes.

[12:10:00]

BASH: It just -- it's -- I'm little surprised that you are OK with that.

JOHNSON: No, it's part of our system, Dana. It's part of our constitutional system. The president and his team are--

BASH: There's nothing in the constitution that says, if there's a shutdown.

JOHNSON: No, no, it's not, no, because the founders couldn't have foreseen such a foolish thing that's happening right now. They would understand, and they implied what Congress's first role is to make sure the government operates, right? But in a scenario like this, if the Congress's hands are tied by the minority party who will not do the right thing, then the power shifts to the executive. That's not Mike Johnson doing that. That's Chuck Schumer doing that.

BASH: I want to shift gears just a little bit and ask you about something that the president said when he delivered a very lengthy speech speaking to the nation's top military leaders. Let's listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF UNITED STATES OF AMERICA: It's really a very important mission, and I told Pete, we should use some of these dangerous cities as training grounds for our military National Guard, but military.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BASH: You're comfortable, or are you comfortable? Is the question with the U.S. military using American cities as, quote, training grounds.

JOHNSON: For what? I don't know, what's being implied by that. I can tell you what's in the president's mind and heart, because I talk to him all the time, daily about this. He's very proud of the fact that we have brought crime down in Washington D.C. You could go from your car to the studio today without fear of somebody jumping you and stealing your purse.

BASH: Training ground suggests hearing from the commander in chief, speaking to the highest-ranking military leaders on the planet, that these troops are going to be in U.S. cities and use their time in U.S. cities to do military training. That's an actually--

JOHNSON: Well, sure. I think that's been very beneficial for the National Guard.

BASH: So, it's OK?

JOHNSON: Have you seen the National Guard troops walking these streets? They're keeping the city safe, and the people of D.C. greatly appropriate--

BASH: And that's inappropriate wait for them to train in American cities on U.S. soil?

JOHNSON: It's a win-win scenario because National Guard's men are proud of their duty that they performed, and they brought crime down dramatically in D.C., and all of us are safe. Our staffs are safe. They're not walking in fear right now. I think we should do that in every major blue city, run by Democrats who aren't serious about crime.

BASH: But it seems very antithetical to sort of the notion of America--

JOHNSON: The law and order.

BASH: Well, no, no, I'm not talking about law and order.

JOHNSON: No, because that's what they're restoring law and order.

BASH: No, I'm talking about the U.S. military, how they're used.

JOHNSON: If a city is out of control and it's beyond the scope what the municipal police department can handle, which is what happened in D.C. by the testimony of the Democrat mayor, not Republicans. She needed help. She welcomed the help. And you know what? It brought the crime rate down and we have peace in the city.

This is the greatest nation in the history of the world. We have the most beautiful Capitol in the history of the world. It should be safe for visitors and families and school children who come here. The National Guard troops heroically have provided that. I think that's a great thing, and the president does as well. And I think the American people do as well.

BASH: Just real quick. You're talking about one side of the coin. I'm talking about another, which is, using this deployment on American soil in order to train U.S. military. I just want to--

JOHNSON: I don't understand why that is such an offensive notion. Of course, National Guard's men train once so -- once a month, unless they're actively deployed for a mission. That's a good thing. They're working together. I've talked with a lot of these guardsmen. They're having a great time. They're working together, serving together. They're proud of their country, proud of the nation's capital. Everybody should applaud that. I don't understand what the controversy is about that.

BASH: You're going to bring the House back anytime soon?

JOHNSON: House is coming back next week with Yom Kippur's tomorrow. There's no votes. Friday would be the first opportunity the Senate will do the CR again. They'll keep voting. Leader Thune said. And the House will be back next week, but we hope that we'll have something to do. I surely pray that this shutdown doesn't last more than a few days, and we can all get back to work.

BASH: Yeah. Well, we all do. Thank you. Thank you for being here, Mr. Speaker.

JOHNSON: Thank you.

BASH: And when we come back, we'll take you inside the Democrats, risky shutdown strategy. And later, icon, legend, actress and activist Jane Fonda calls this moment in America the most frightening of my life. We'll ask her why, later in the hour. (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[12:15:00]

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BASH: Welcome back. You're looking at live pictures of the Senate floor. And we wanted to bring this in because you may have just heard my interview with Mike Johnson saying that there's nothing to negotiate right now and that he's going to meet in a few hours with the head of the OMB about permanently cutting federal jobs, while the shutdown is happening.

But what you're looking at is a vote in the U.S. Senate. It's on a bill to keep the government open. It is not yet passed, and it might not pass, just as it hasn't for the last three days. But there are people talking. You're looking at -- they're not formal negotiations, but they are discussions happening by people who could keep the government open.

So, we're going to keep that up, and we're going to talk to our panel here. And Marianna, I know that you have been talking to your sources. You're usually on Capitol Hill. You came in here for this about what is actually going on, what we're looking at.

MARIANNA SOTOMAYOR, CONGRESSIONAL REPORTER, THE WASHINGTON POST: Yeah. So, it's grown into a pretty significant sizable group of senators, but it really started with a very, very smaller, a much smaller group, it's a bipartisan group. Senator Durbin, Cornyn, Rounds, that's just a couple of the people. Cortez Masto, who has supported the Senate bill last night, also Senator King.

[12:20:00]

It's significant because at least Senator Mike Rounds is the only Republican right now, but he has been talking with Democrats. His offered maybe being OK with voting for a one-year extension of these Affordable Care Act subsidies. That is where the discussion seemed to be. Senator Mark Kelly came off the floor, told one of my colleagues that negotiations are starting and that is significant, simply because nobody was talking and nobody knew when those conversations will start.

BASH: OK. I want to go to Kristen Holmes at the White House in one second. But Jeff, I wanted you to -- you wanted to weigh in on something that we were talking about before the break. Hold that thought, Kristen, hang on. About some of the senators who are retiring and how they play into this, Jeanne Shaheen of New Hampshire and others.

JEFF ZELENY, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: Right. I mean, one of the ways out of this, the easiest way out of this is for the Senate to find about four more democratic votes to approve the CR, four more negotiations. And Jeanne Shaheen, we know the Democrat retiring of New Hampshire is also engaged in discussions with Republicans. Now, we should point out that this is nowhere close to being resolved, but the fact that they are talking on the floor there is certainly significant. We should listen to the majority leader, perhaps.

BASH: Let's see if he's done. Jamie, hold on. OK. We're going to go to Kristen while we see what's happening. And we do know one thing, and that is, for the third time in a row, this bill that what they call the clean CR, the bill to keep the government open for seven weeks did just fail.

So, they didn't get enough Democrats to vote, yes, as expected. But again, the discussions are happening. Kristen, you are in a key place at the White House. What are you hearing from your sources there about the engagement of the president?

KRISTEN HOLMES, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, he is very engaged. But of course, as we know, Russ Vought is the mastermind behind all of this. And I do want to point to something that just happened in your interview with Speaker Johnson, which he essentially said that vote would be presenting to them, his proposal for essentially mass firings and mass eliminations. This is something that now we know is moving forward.

The Office of Management and Budget had sent a memo to various agencies, essentially asking them to identify various programs that would stop getting discretionary funding on October 1 because of a shutdown. And essentially the idea behind it is that they would use the government shutdown to eliminate permanently programs and jobs that don't align with President Trump's agenda.

So, now we know that this proposal is going to be brought to these House Republicans later today. But it's not just this idea of these mass eliminations, the White House is really both ramping up the retaliation and the pressure.

I want to show you a tweet here from the director of OMB, Office of Management and Budget, Russ Vought, who essentially is now lashing out at New York because of the shutdown, saying that they are pausing roughly $18 billion dollars in New York City infrastructure, putting it on hold, and they're saying, it's because they have concerns over in constitutional -- unconstitutional DEI principles.

But let's talk about New York for a second. Who are representatives from New York? Well, it just happens that the minority leader from both the House and the Senate, Democrats, Hakeem Jeffries and Chuck Schumer, both represent New York, so this would directly impact their constituents.

So clearly here, they're using every lever they can to try and push these Democrats into voting for this CR, into keeping the government or reopening the government here. I think really where our eyes should be on is what they intend to do long term to federal employees and federal programs using this opportunity here. And it didn't sound like from your interview with the speaker, there was going to be much pushback, when it came to whatever Vought was going to propose.

BASH: Not at all. I mean, that was really -- I wouldn't call it stunning, but I think it's instructive. Kristen, thank you so much. I just do want to put back on the screen and maybe keep it up if we can the Senate floor, because this is good for the American people to see. Even though we are rightly saying that formal negotiations are stalled, there are still senators working. They're not voting. The voting is done, but still standing around in the Senate, and that is a place that discussions tend to happen.

I do want to say, Jamie, that what Kristen was just reporting that Russ Vought, who is very, very powerful, the OMB director, the fact that he is saying that they might take away infrastructure in New York for that to happen just, you know, hour, an hour or two after an incinerator shaft collapsed, and a public housing apartment building in the Bronx is something,

JAMIE GANGEL, CNN SPECIAL CORRESPONDENT: Yeah, memo to Senator Schumer. So, can we just look at this politically big picture for a moment? There is an old expression in politics. You can't play chicken with someone who is willing to crash their car. And that's in effect what happened here. Donald Trump, Russ Vought, they are not scared of this shutdown, especially because of what we just heard Kristen say, they're looking at this as an opportunity to turn furloughs into firings. So, they are not scared of this.

[12:25:00]

The other thing is, this is about messaging, messaging, messaging, messaging, and yes, voters will blame both sides. A pox on both their houses. But right now, senior Democrats on the Hill acknowledge to me that they are losing the messaging war.

BASH: I don't fully understand. It's so interesting to me, because we could have all -- it's not just because we've been around for a couple of years, taking you out of this Marianna. We could have all -- this is like, so predictable that they would feel that way. We don't know if that's going to be the case when this is all said and done, because we literally don't know how this is going to is going to end. But was it just worth it to them to fight the fight as their base wants so badly?

ZELENY: Well, sometimes having the fight is as important in the short term as the outcome of the fight, but the short term is the key point here. If this goes on and on and on, obviously, that wouldn't work for Democrats. But the big difference is, as we watch the Senate floor, the way out of any type of morass like this, is a gang of six -- a gang of eight. The reality is, there are so few senators who would even take part in such a gang now.

The senators who voted in 2019 to end that shutdown. They no longer serve in the Senate because they were defeated. They were Democrats in red states, so that is why the margins are so thin. However, the retirees on the Democratic side are the potential way out of this, but Democrats need to fight this.

A former senator told me last evening, when I was talking to him, he said the shutdown has different stages, like stages of grief and fighting, is at the beginning, but perhaps going into next week, that is when it negotiates. So, it's a messaging war still, but it is interesting that the Senate is at least trying to have conversations.

BASH: Yeah. I mean, those images are really fascinating because we have all been in the gallery and, you know, what it's like in person to watch them have these discussions. Don't go anywhere. We're going to keep watching the Senate floor. Keep in touch with our sources.

And up next, we're going to look at how a shutdown could hurt every American's wallet, especially if it continues. Plus, she was on President Nixon's enemies list. Will Jane Fonda's new project land her on President Trump's list. The legendary actress and activist joins me live.

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