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Sean 'Diddy' Combs Sentencing Hearing Underway; Prosecutor Accuses Combs And Defense Of "Victim-Blaming"; Shutdown Likely To Last Into Next Week As Lawmakers Remain Deadlocked; Democrats Say Threat Of Mass Firings Won't Force Them To Accept GOP Plan; Trump Sets Sunday Deadline For Hamas To Agree To Gaza Peace Deal. Aired 12-12:30p ET

Aired October 03, 2025 - 12:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[12:00:00]

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DANA BASH, CNN HOST, INSIDE POLITICS: Welcome to Inside Politics. I'm Dana Bash, and we are following breaking news. Right now, Sean 'Diddy' Combs is inside a Manhattan courtroom, waiting to personally address the judge who will decide his fate. The rap mogul already spent more than a year behind bars and faces another decade or more for two counts of transportation to engage in prostitution. The defense wants several people to speak on Combs' behalf at today's sentencing hearing, but the prosecution says no victims will address the judge.

CNN is inside the courtroom to bring you minute by minute updates that you're going to see throughout the hour. You see it now on the side of your screen. For now, let's go to CNN chief legal analyst, Laura Coates, who is outside the courthouse. Laura, what's the sense that we're getting from our colleagues inside right now?

LAURA COATES, CNN ANCHOR & CHIEF LEGAL ANALYST: A very anxious environment where Sean 'Diddy' Combs is waiting to hear his ultimate fate. Remember, he was convicted of the lesser charges back in July, of transportation to engage in prostitution. Two counts, each could be a maximum of 10 years. But the real issue here is the huge disparity of what's being asked for the defense what the prosecution wants.

The defense believes that 14 months is appropriate, which given that he's already been in jail awaiting sentencing, and the trial would get him out by the end of this year. Contrast that to what the prosecution wants 11 years from now. Then you got the probation report that essentially gives a pre-sentencing report and recommendation to the court, made by court employees, a compilation of interviews and different factors, and they tell the judge, five to seven years is the appropriate window.

The judge has accepted the report without showing his hand on what the sentence would be, but has said there might not be a need to do an upward departure from the guidelines as stated, or a lower one, which means we're still in a limbo holding pattern. But where we are right now? The prosecution has already concluded their statements to the judge, slamming Diddy for victim blaming and shaming, for having the audacity they believe to try to make himself appear as the victim when he said that he will carry the burden of domestic violence for the rest of his life. And also, that they believe that all of his statements about being a changed man, pure lip service.

Now the defense's turn is here. We're going to hear from his children. We're going to hear from Sean 'Diddy' Combs himself. And right now, they are arguing about that disparity, saying, if this judge were to give him that period of five to seven years, as recommended by the pre-sentence report, it would be a essential travesty, and one that is extreme given the actual convicted charges of transportation to engage in prostitution.

And they specifically point out they believe that this high end would assume that he actually benefited financially from prostitution. They say, as you know, he was an amateur porn director of sorts who did not get a dime from consensual behavior across state lines. We'll see if the judge buys that.

BASH: Maybe an unanswerable question, Laura, but because you have a lot of experience in the courtroom. Do we have any sense of how long this could go on today?

COATES: Normally, a federal sentencing is like an hour, maybe two. The fact that we're going on several hours now with an eye towards not even hearing him testify, we heard earlier today that we could have as late as maybe Monday, the actual decision by the judge. I would assume, though, this judge, having had the benefit of several months and hundreds of pages of letters and argument from the prosecution, defense and a report.

He has a very strong idea of where he wants to go. What he's waiting for is the key, in my mind, do you want to hear from Diddy? Is it about remorse? Is it about accountability and authenticity? That's the key question here.

And finally, Dana, it is a tension because he still has an appeal ahead of him. He will try to preserve his appellate rights. And there is no requirement that somebody even convicted of a crime has to suddenly admit to a crime that they have said they are innocent of, but that's how you factor in whether the person is remorseful or not. So, it's a bit of a catch way too for any person seeking a sentence, and also trying to establish that they want accountability, but they still presume their innocence.

[12:05:00]

BASH: All right. Laura, thank you so much. Appreciate that. Obviously, raise your hand if we should come to you, if we get any interesting updates from the courtroom behind you. Sitting here with me now are my two friends to help us through all of this, former federal prosecutor and legal analyst, Elliot Williams, former assistant U.S. Attorney for the Southern District of New York and CNN senior legal analyst, Elie Honig. Hello to you both. And I just want to remind our viewers, you can see what's on the side of your screen. That is the information coming real time from our colleagues inside the courthouse. Elie, I'm going to start with you. You practiced in New York. What are your thoughts on what we're going to see and what we are seeing currently?

ELIE HONIG, FORMER. ASST. U.S. ATTORNEY, SOUTHERN DISTRICT OF NY & CNN SENIOR LEGAL ANALYST: I'm having flashbacks seeing that entry to 500 Pearl Street, lots of times in and out of there. This is such a high stakes sentencing, in part because it's Sean Combs and there's so much attention on it. But also, because as Laura alluded to, you have such a wide range here of outcomes, right? Any defense lawyer is going to ask basically, to be let out today, essentially. And that's basically where Sean Combs' team is -- they're asking for 14 months. He's been in 13 months.

But what you don't often see is a 10-year gap where the prosecutors are asking for 10 years more. And it's notable the pre-sentence report, which is done by the probation office, a part of the court itself, comes out at six to seven years. It is really unusual to see prosecutors ask for almost double what the pre-sentence report recommends.

So, the SDNY is being very, very aggressive here. I think the risk, both with the judge and in terms of public perception, is that the SDNY be perceived as over killing this case. I mean, look, they overcharged it. That's a fact. The jury rejected the three most serious charges and convicted only on the two least serious charges. I don't think they're going to get 11 years here, but there's a wide range of outcomes.

ELLIOT WILLIAMS, CNN LEGAL ANALYST & FORMER FEDERAL PROSECUTOR: Yeah, I would say the same thing. I -- you know, it's the probation department is the -- let's say the non-partisan entity in this. They are really just crunching the numbers and saying, based on what the offense was, what the background of the defendant is, and all the other circumstances.

We think this comes out somewhere around as Laura was saying, I believe it's five to seven years or so. There's a huge difference between what, you know, the 14 months of the defense is asking for, and 135 months that the prosecution is asking for.

Now, why is that? Why do we sentence even in the first place? Are we punishing an individual for just the offenses he was convicted of, or bringing in this slurry of other things that, yeah, make him a really bad guy, but he wasn't convicted of. He was convicted merely. And I say, use the word merely of these two prostitution offenses, not the far more serious racketeering charges.

BASH: Yeah. And on that, you mentioned the government and the fact that the conviction was far less than what the government had wanted or hoped and what they went for. We heard the government say, this isn't just a case of freak offs or hotel nights. It's a case with real victims who have suffered real harm at the hands of the defendant, who because of the defendant had questioned their own self-worth and desire to live.

HONIG: I'm not sure that they can cash that check, though. The government has been sounding that theme throughout this case, and the jury did not see it that way. The jury did not find that Cassie Ventura or the other victims were forcibly trafficked. They all that they found based on the verdict, Elliot alluded too, interstate transportation for purposes of prostitution. They actually rejected the higher crime, which would have required force or coercion.

So, it's a strategy for the prosecutors to say yes, notwithstanding what the jury found. We still want to argue to you, judge, it's a lower burden of proof, and the judge can still find this. We want to argue that they are victims, capital V, Victims, but the defense response to that has been and will continue to be, not according to this jury.

BASH: Yeah. And you mentioned the judge. Let's talk about the judge, because it's all in the judge's hands. What do we know?

WILLIAMS: Yeah. So, he's a -- he's put on the bench by President Biden, although, you know, with every time we say it, I hesitate to get into the, he said, she said, of who got appointed by whom. What's important about Judge Subramanian? He did a long career as a corporate attorney, had 15 or 16 years as a partner at Susman Godfrey in a big law firm in New York, and has been on the bench for quite some time.

You know that's relevant, and also impeccable credentials from the schools and clerking on the Supreme Court and so on. So, we have every reason to believe that this is a seasoned, respected jurist, and should leave it at that.

HONIG: Just to bring the viewers up to date on the update there on the side. The Mann Act is the name of the crime that he was convicted of, named after some member of Congress years ago, Mann. And what the defense is arguing is that, typically, if you look at cases where somebody is only convicted of this crime, the sentence is going to be a year, two years. I mean, I did a few of these myself when I was brand new. They were two or three years tops.

And so, I think what the defense is doing is a standard tactic of saying, let's look at similar convictions for the same crime, and look at what those sentences are. They're going to try to argue, don't make it an outlier (Ph).

BASH: And that's what's happening right now. That's you're explaining what we're seeing on the screen.

[12:10:00]

WILLIAMS: And, you know, and again, several times the defense has made the point even when we use the term victim for the purpose of what Sean Combs was convicted of. The people that you're identifying as victims are not actually victims. Hear me on this, and because it's very sensitive--

(CROSSTALK) BASH: No, but I understand what you're saying.

WILLIAMS: But you talk about sexual assault, you know, and it's complicated. He was convicted of at least according to defense, engaging in acts of prostitution with willing, with his willing girlfriend, and paying other people for sex. All of those acts of coercion and beating Cassie Ventura and being violent, and the drugs and the firearms, at least, according to the defense, are separate from the thing that he's convicted of.

And they've gone as far in their submission saying, no, you're throwing around this term victim, and are actually going to prejudice the defendant by bringing in all this other stuff that he's actually not responsible for. So, through the course of the day, I think we will see the judge making a decision as to how much of the other things that really are pretty awful when you talk.

And you know, the judge can consider what's called relevant conduct, other things that the defendant did to bump his sentence up, exactly how much the--

BASH: Will the judge can or cannot?

WILLIAMS: He absolutely can, that is a part of sentencing. Now, if you end up sentencing too much on that basis, you might trigger grounds for throwing the whole thing out. So, it was amazing, as the other judge--

BASH: I just want to say, apparently the defense just said that Combs would not be considered a pimp.

HONIG: Yeah. Well, this is a point they're arguing that in these Mann Act, interstate transportation for prostitution cases, typically the higher sentences are for -- that's the colloquial term. But somebody who's running a ring, that's the type of cases I was doing, where they are profiting, making money off, in some cases, dozens of women.

Here, the argument is, and prosecution has conceded this, Sean Combs did not profit financially off of any of this. Now that's a fair point. It seems to be fairly uncontroversial, but it doesn't end all the other. The larger questions as to physical violence and coercion.

BASH: All right. Everybody stand by. We are not leaving this story. There's a lot happening as we were just talking about. As we speak in that courtroom, we are going to get another update from our reporters inside that sentencing hearing, including some new comments from the judge we were speaking about.

I'm also going to speak to a top Senate Democrat about our other big story here in Washington, and really for the entire U.S.A., the White House threat to fire federal employees today. Could that have any effect on the Democrats' stance? I'm going to talk to a veteran, Democratic Senator Jeanne Shaheen, after a break.

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BASH: Shutdown, day three. The federal government does remain shut down. Congress is deadlocked. Thousands of federal workers are hanging in the balance. We want to discuss this and more with Democratic Senator Jeanne Shaheen of New Hampshire. Thank you so much for being here. It's nice to see you.

So far, every time this has come for a vote on the Senate floor. You have voted no on advancing the Republican bill, which is to keep it open for seven weeks and do nothing else. The next vote, which is going to happen in an hour or so. How will you vote?

SEN. JEANNE SHAHEEN (D-NH): You know, I'm hoping that people will be able to come together around the concerns that Democrats have expressed, not just the president's announcements of layoffs and the way he's treating federal employees. But what's going to happen with the healthcare of so many Americans if we don't address the premium tax credits that are available to help people afford their health insurance?

And that's been the sticking point for me, for my colleagues on the Democratic side. What we wanted is everyone to recognize that this is a very real issue. We just heard from the Kaiser Family Foundation that even 57 percent of MAGA voters say, they want to see these tax credits extended. So, this is not a Democrat or Republican issue. It's an issue that affects everybody who needs access to healthcare, and that's been the sticking point.

BASH: You are retiring at the end of your term. You have the unique freedom to act without political repercussions, not saying that you have thought about that entirely with your votes in your storied career. But given that reality, how are you approaching what is happening differently? And I will say that you have been called the shutdown whisperer, as perhaps the person who can find some middle ground.

SHAHEEN: Well, I wish that were the case. I think, in order to find that middle ground it takes people on both sides of the aisle. And I think the good news is that people are still talking. I think the bad news is that we're not seeing the leadership on both sides really willing to sit down and negotiate, and I think that's what it's going to take.

It's unfortunate that President Trump didn't call congressional leaders together until the Monday, you know, about 24 hours before funding was due to run out, because this kind of a negotiation takes everybody at the table. And the fact that he is now talking about firing more federal employees, which he's really been doing since day one when he took office.

But that, he's talking about halting funding that's going to blue states, states that have democratic elected officials. That's not what the American people want to see. What the American people want to see is that we're going to come together, that we're going to address the challenges that face this country, and I think we ought to be able to keep the government open and provide healthcare that people are counting on to make sure they can keep their families safe and secure.

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BASH: You just said that you are disappointed with the leadership on both sides of the aisle. I'm guessing you have a more direct line to your Democratic leader, to Chuck Schumer, than John Thune, although, I'm sure you talked to both of them. What do you want them to do differently? What do you want Chuck Schumer to do differently in order to achieve what you just said?

SHAHEEN: What I want both of them to do is to start negotiating, to stop making statements in public and grandstanding on partisan issues, and to talk about where there are areas of common ground. I think one of those areas that Senator Thune talked about, and Senator Schumer has talked about, is, let's get back to a regular appropriations process.

We have bills, excuse me, eight bills that have passed the appropriations committee and the Senate overwhelmingly with bipartisan votes. So, let's bring those bills to the floor. Let's get a commitment, and let's get Speaker Johnson to make a commitment that he's actually going to take up these bills. We have three bills that have already passed both Houses, that we ought to be able to come to agreement on very quickly, if people are willing to sit down and do that. Let's get those done.

BASH: Senator, I do want to just sort of push back on, not just you, but sort of all the Democrats, on the notion of using this, this bill, to deal with healthcare. I'm not saying that you're, you know, what you're saying about the Obama healthcare subsidies is very real. They don't expire until the end of the year.

And what Republicans are arguing is that, and also that Democrats historically always want a clean CR in regular English that's to keep the government running at the levels that it already was. And they're right. That is, historically what Democrats have wanted. Why do this here now?

SHAHEEN: Because there is real urgency about those premium tax credits, because it's correct that they don't expire until the end of December. But what is not being factored in is that insurance companies are setting the rates now. November 1, the marketplace for the Affordable Care Act opens up and people start enrolling. And for the last four years, we've had record enrollment in healthcare. For the first time in this country in years, people are able to access healthcare at a cost they can afford, mostly because of those premium tax credits.

So, if we don't do something before November 1, then people are going to get their insurance rates. They're going to be unaffordable. We know that if we wait until December, we're going to have a million and a half more people who are going to kick off their health insurance. We know it's going to cost the federal government 10 billion more dollars. The nonpartisan CBO has said that to us. So, let's act now. There's no reason we need to wait.

BASH: While I have you, I want to ask you a question based on the fact that you are the top Democrat on the Senate Foreign Relations Committee. We heard President Trump say today that the Hamas must answer the Israelis and really the whole Arab world, and not to mention President Trump on this peace plan, they must do so by Sunday. Do you think that is an appropriate timeframe?

SHAHEEN: Well, first he said, they needed to answer in 72 hours. So, he's gone beyond that. The president has not gotten a lot of credibility when he talks about timeframes and schedules, because we've seen him do that with the war in Ukraine and let Putin cross--

BASH: But you want this deal to be--

SHAHEEN: --time again, absolutely.

BASH: You want this deal to be sealed?

SHAHEEN: Right. The fundamental concern is that Hamas needs to come to the table. They need to release those hostages, and we need to make sure that the Palestinians have a future in Gaza that the humanitarian aid that they need, gets to the people who need it, and that Israel stops bombing.

BASH: Do you -- we're out of time. But do you find it curious that the protesters who have been in the streets of the people we're hearing from Hollywood and elsewhere who have been so intent, understandably, on helping the people of the Palestinians, the people in Gaza, who are under bombardment and have been for some time, and who are hungry, are starving, that now that this peace plan is before Hamas. We're not seeing that same pressure on Hamas. Should they be continuing their protest, but focus on Hamas?

[12:25:00]

SHAHEEN: Absolutely, absolutely, we all should be focused on Hamas. They're the reason we're in this mess. There're a terrorist organization. Their rampage into Israel is unprecedented, and it's what set off this war in Gaza that so many people are suffering from. So, they need to come to the table. They need to release the hostages. They need to make sure that the Palestinians that they're supposed to represent, they pretend to represent, have a future.

BASH: Jeanne Shaheen, thank you so much. It's nice to see you. I'm going to go with the -- with the shutdown whisperer, and not to give too much -- put too much pressure on your shoulders, but you know, you never know. Maybe you can walk on that Senate floor and make it all happen.

SHAHEEN: Well, hopefully people are keep talking.

BASH: All right. Thanks, Senator. Appreciate it. And up next, we are tracking the breaking news in New York City. Sean 'Diddy' Combs is in a Manhattan courtroom, right now waiting to hear his sentence. More on what's going on in that courtroom when we come back. (COMMERCIAL BREAK)