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Inside Politics

DOJ Probe of John Bolton Focuses on Notes in His AOL Email Account; Former Special Counsel Jack Smith Defends Trump Prosecutions; Kansas Democratic Representatives Could Lose Job if GOP Re-draws State Map; Trump Tariffs, China's Retaliation Hit Agricultural Export Markets; California Governor Candidate, Katie Porter, Apologizes for Viral Videos; Florida Judge Bans GOP Rep. Cory Mills From Contact With Ex-girlfriend; Active-duty Troops Getting Paid Today During Shutdown; Congresswoman-elect Grijalva Presses Speaker Johnson to Be Sworn Into Office. Aired 12:30-1p ET

Aired October 15, 2025 - 12:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[12:30:00]

KATELYN POLANTZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: That's been something that has gone on for a long time. It is complicated. There is meat to it. There is pages and pages of probable cause and search warrants that's largely redacted. But we do know that part of this is the U.S. intelligence got information about what was in Bolton's accounts, because they were looking at a hack from a foreign adversary. And then it leads to this part about the AOL account.

The other thing is, it's not the thing Trump is mad about with Bolton. The thing Trump is mad about is what he wrote in his book in 2020, that also could potentially become part of a case, but it's not the driving force of this investigation.

DANA BASH, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT AND ANCHOR OF 'INSIDE POLITICS': Yeah. But Trump's not mad about James Comey lying -- allegedly lying to Congress. He's mad about other things.

Fair point.

BASH: But this is where they could get him. But I understand your point. Also, tell me you're a boomer without telling me you're a boomer, the AOL account. Sorry, mom and dad. I know you both have them.

David Chalian, let's talk about Jack Smith who was the Special Counsel appointed during the Biden administration by Merrick Garland, who doesn't speak out a lot but he has now.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JACK SMITH, FORMER SPECIAL COUNSEL: The idea that politics would play a role in big cases like this, it's absolutely ludicrous and it's totally contrary to my experience as a prosecutor. The problem is not prosecuting high officials who did something wrong when you do it according to the processes of law in your country, it's the retaliation, that's the problem, and that's the thing that we should be preventing.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BASH: David?

DAVID CHALIAN, CNN SENIOR VICE PRESIDENT, WASHINGTON BUREAU CHIEF AND POLITICAL DIRECTOR: It's like everything you want to believe about the justice system, and you want to hear from a prosecutor, right, that politics should not have a role in it. What we see in our modern day environment in the Trump administration, politics has everything to do with the way in which justice is being carried out right now. And I don't even think -- that's not even an attack. I just think it's like the reality.

I think Pam Bondi and President Trump are not hiding that fact in any way whatsoever. I think President Trump repeatedly says he sees his management and oversight over the Justice Department as part of his prerogative of what he wants to pursue a part of his political agenda.

BASH: Yeah, no question.

PHIL MATTINGLY, CNN CHIEF DOMESTIC CORRESPONDENT AND ANCHOR: It's -- can I just say to David's really great point.

BASH: Yeah, please.

MATTINGLY: It's explicit, it's planned. It is part of their theory of the case and the executive authority by which they believe he has in the Oval Office. It is the kind of ultimate version of the unitary executive theory, and it is intentional. And I think, to David's point, there is a belief about the norms and the kind of guardrails and things like that. They hate all of them. They don't consider any of them. They've run right through them, and they believe they have the legal grounds and authority to do so.

And they also believe they have the political rationale to pursue retribution. There's no question. You know, as well as I do, you talk to any Republican, some who are never big Donald Trump fans, and the degree to which their support for him or their embrace of his current agenda is based on, look, man, they did that to us, and so we're going to get them back.

BASH: Yeah.

MATTINGLY: And it's just -- it's -- it's pervasive.

BASH: Yeah.

MATTINGLY: -- within the party and it's real.

BASH: I mean, as you're talking, I'm thinking of what Mitt Romney told me a couple of weeks ago, not that he's supportive of political retribution with the Justice Department, but that he went -- during the Biden administration, went to the White House saying, can you consider a pardon because this is going to come back to haunt you. TIA MITCHELL, WASHINGTON BUREAU CHIEF, THE ATLANTA JOURNAL- CONSTITUTION: Yeah. And again, I think what Phil's point, it's -- I'm surprised Jack Smith said that because there's so much evidence, like you can't -- your eyes aren't lying to you when you see a social media post from the president telling the attorney general who he wants to prosecute --

MATTINGLY: Accidental, to be fair.

(LAUGH)

MITCHELL: You know, the accidental --

BASH: Allegedly.

MITCHELL: The alleged accidental DM gone public.

(LAUGH)

MITCHELL: But at the end of the day, it was public and we all read it. We've seen prosecutors be removed and that there are indications that they were removed because they would not make decisions that the president wanted. So, the evidence to Phil's point is there. And I think a lot of Americans, if you ask them, don't want it to be that way. They want it to be the way Jack Smith described, but I think a lot of Americans don't believe it's that way.

BASH: All right, everyone, we're going to have to take a break. Katelyn, your reporting on this has been absolutely spectacular.

Up next, top Kansas Republicans are at the White House today. They're under pressure to draw my next guest out of a job.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[12:38:51]

BASH: Today, GOP leaders from the Kansas legislature will be at the White House. While President Trump's effort to gerrymander his way to a new GOP congressional seat is not on the official agenda, the meeting does come only a day after the Kansas legislature approved over $400,000 to conduct a special session where it could consider new maps. Joining me now is the only Democrat in the Kansas congressional delegation, Congresswoman Sharice Davids. Thank you so much for coming in. It's nice to see you.

REP. SHARICE DAVIDS, (D-KS) AGRICULTURE COMMITTEE: It's good to see you, Dana.

BASH: I mean, the obvious first question is how worried are you that Republicans will do just that, draw you out?

DAVIDS: You know, I would say more so than being worried, I'm frustrated like a lot of Kansans are. I am -- I think there's a lot of us who are actually just like really angry about this because the, first of all, voters should be choosing their representatives and not the other way around. And this is absolutely cutting against that basic -- that basic fundamental value that we have. And then, the Republicans in Kansas have already gerrymandered the maps.

[12:40:00]

They did it three years ago. And now, because Donald Trump is telling them to, they are taking on this mid-decade redistricting in an unprecedented way because -- I mean, we all know that Donald Trump knows that they're not going to be able to win in the midterms unless they cheat.

BASH: You mentioned the redistricting in 2022 which was after a census, which is when generally you're supposed to redistrict.

DAVIDS: That's right.

BASH: And it was, there was gerrymandering that happened. But you still won by double-digits.

DAVIDS: Yeah, I think there's a few different -- there's a few different reasons for that. One, I would say, and what I've been sharing with anyone and everyone, not just in the Democratic Party, but across the board, is you got to show up. You got to listen to folks and learn from them about what is impacting -- what's impacting their day-to-day lives. And I think that people really respond to that.

They want representatives who are listening to them. They definitely don't want representatives that are trying to silence their voice at the ballot box, which is exactly what the Kansas Republican legislature is attempting to do right now.

BASH: You just said a moment ago that voters should choose their elected officials, not the other way around, which is definitely a --

DAVIDS: It almost seems like it doesn't need to be said, but here we are.

BASH: -- sense that make sense. However, you well know that this is a bipartisan problem. And by this I mean gerrymandering and that in the states where Democrats have control and have the ability to gerrymander, they have done so in a pretty aggressive way -- Maryland, Illinois, and beyond. So, what do you say to that? I know that those states didn't do it mid-decade, but they have definitely worked the map so that they, the elected officials, do choose their voters.

DAVIDS: Yeah. I have been pretty clear on this, actually since I got to Congress and was running for Congress, that from my perspective and from, I would say, the perspective of most Kansans, that redistricting should be based on the numbers. It should be based on the census. It should be based on the needs of a community. Johnson County, which is in the eastern part of the state, has different needs than folks out by the Colorado border in the western part of the state.

And I have supported legislation, in fact, some of the earliest legislation I supported was, in part, would stop partisan gerrymandering. Unfortunately, that didn't go anywhere in the Senate, but I would like to see that legislation be reconsidered. And the other thing I would say is, this whole thing that we're talking about right now, with this mid-decade redistricting got kicked off because the president is more concerned about holding onto power by any means necessary, including silencing the voices of Kansas voters.

BASH: As you well know, in California, they're trying to sort of answer that by doing their own redistricting. Do you support them doing that or should they not do it because of the argument you just made?

DAVIDS: Yeah, I mean, I know that the -- that issue is going to go before the California voters.

BASH: OK.

DAVIDS: And I wish that we weren't in this situation at all, that Donald Trump hadn't kicked this whole thing off.

BASH: I do want to quickly ask you about some really important policy issues in your state, particularly agriculture, which is obviously very important in Kansas. The impact of the cuts here in Washington, but maybe even more importantly, the trade policies that the president has in place. What have you heard from farmers?

DAVIDS: Farmers like a lot of Kansans right now, are actually struggling to make ends meet. Folks are struggling with higher costs on everything from gas to groceries. And farmers have been dealing with higher input prices, things like fertilizer and seeds and that sort of thing. And the uncertainty that has been caused by Trump's, frankly, reckless approach to tariff policy has only exacerbated all of those issues.

We've got farmers, especially, Kansas is one of the highest producing and exporting states for soybeans. And right now, even though we absolutely need to be competitive with China, but they are a huge consumer of Kansas soybeans.

BASH: Yeah. And you can't -- right. And you can't sell those.

(CROSSTALK)

DAVIDS: And market, it takes sometimes decades to build up these markets.

BASH: Yeah.

DAVIDS: And just like that, Donald Trump has called into question the ability of so many of U.S. farmers, including Kansas farmers, to be able to sell their products internationally.

BASH: Sharice Davids, nice to see you, thank you so much for coming in.

(CROSSTALK)

DAVIDS: You too.

BASH: Appreciate it.

DAVIDS: Thank you.

BASH: And up next, anger management.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KATIE PORTER, (D) CALIFORNIA GOVERNOR CANDIDATE: Get out of my [expletive] shot.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[12:45:00]

BASH: Katie Porter, who is the front runner to be the next California governor, at least on the Democratic primary side, she says she will do better after viral videos showing her exploding at a reporter and an aide surfaced. We'll explain after a break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BASH: Tapping our Political Radar, I'm sorry, Democratic candidate for California Governor, Katie Porter, says she could have "handled things better" when it comes to two videos of her that went viral.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PORTER: I don't want to keep doing this, I'm going to call it. Thank you.

NIKKI LORENZO, HOST OF "INSIDE CALIFORNIA POLITICS," KTLA: You're not going to do the interview with us?

PORTER: Nope. Not like this. I'm not, not with seven follow-ups to every single question you ask.

[12:50:00]

LORENZO: Every other candidate has answered our follow-ups.

PORTER: I don't care. I don't care. I want to have a pleasant, positive conversation, in which you ask me about every issue on this list. And if every question, you're going to make up a follow-up question, then we're never going to get there.

LORENZO: Ms. Porter --

PORTER: And we're just going to circle around.

LORENZO: I am an investigative reporter.

PORTER: I have never had to do this before, ever.

LORENZO: You've never had to have a conversation with a reporter?

(CROSSTALK)

PORTER: To end an interview -- to end an interview.

Out of my [expletive] shot.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BASH: In an interview with KTLA's "Inside California Politics" that aired last night, Porter said, "I think I'm known as someone who's able to handle tough questions, who's willing to answer questions. And I want people to know that I really value the incredible work that my staff can do. I could have done better, but I'm in this race to make sure that we have a governor who's not going to sit back, who's not going to sit quietly."

And a Florida judge has ordered Republican Congressman Cory Mills not to have any contact with his ex-girlfriend. Lindsey Langston has accused the Congressman of threatening to release sexually explicit images and videos of her after the relationship ended in February. Langston filed a police report in July and a restraining order in August. The judge also banned him from posting or referencing his ex on social media. CNN has reached out to Mills' office for comment. Earlier this year, Mills released a statement denying any wrongdoing.

And it is Day 15 of the government shutdown. Hundreds of thousands of federal workers are furloughed or working without pay, but members of the military will get their paychecks today. President Trump ordered the Pentagon to move money from a research and development budget to make payroll for over a million active-duty troops. But the White House says it can't promise they'll get paid in two weeks if the shutdown hasn't ended.

Speaking of the shutdown, Congresswoman-elect Adelita Grijalva is pushing back again on Speaker Johnson's assertion, he won't swear her in until the government reopens. She says she deserves "all the pomp and circumstance everyone receives."

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ADELITA GRIJALVA, (D-AZ) CONGRESSWOMAN-ELECT: Now is the time for Speaker Johnson to perform his duty and swear me in without further delay. I don't need bells and whistles. I don't need pomp and circumstance. I just need to get to work for Southern Arizona.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BASH: CNN Chief Congressional Correspondent Manu Raju is on Capitol Hill. Manu, what is happening right now? It looks very, very quiet at the Capitol.

MANU RAJU, CNN CHIEF CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yeah, it most certainly is, not just for the -- any negotiations which are happening to avoid a government -- to reopen the government. There are no negotiations that are happening at all. And also that vacant seat in Arizona that Adelita Grijalva won a few weeks ago in that special election to fill the seat of her late father Raul Grijalva. But the Speaker of the House is making very clear, he does not plan to swear her in until after the government reopens.

He's had a bit of shifting explanations through all of this. Initially, he told me last week when I asked him about this, that he'd swear her in as soon as she wants, and then he changed to moving it to until the government reopens and also indicating that he would not swear her in, in what are known as pro forma sessions, which are what the House is doing every few days. Gaveling, gaveling out, no actual legislative business happening.

He said he wouldn't do it then even though he is had a couple of Republicans members he swore in, in the similar pro forma sessions, in their own special elections just a few months ago. Now, I caught up with some other Republicans about whether they support what the Speaker is doing. And even some swing district Republicans like Nick LaLota of New York, indicated that he's very much behind the Speaker's play.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

RAJU: So, you're OK with the Speaker's handling of that?

REP. NICK LALOTA, (R-NY): I think the speakers doing --

(CROSSTALK)

RAJU: Not swearing her in during this (inaudible).

LALOTA: The Democrats are taking hostage the American people. Is it right to reward a hostage taker? It was -- it wouldn't have been right years ago when some rogue Republicans were doing it. It sure ain't right just because 99 percent of Democrats are doing it right now. You can't reward the hostage takers. You can't give in to them.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

RAJU: And it just shows you just how polarized this debate has become on Capitol Hill, that Democrats are saying seat her now as any other members have been seated. The Speaker of the House is saying, not until the Democrats agree to reopen the government or vote for the Republican plan, specifically to reopen the government. And right now, Dana, there's no end in sight to this crisis. It could certainly drag on for weeks, potentially even longer.

BASH: And this is an issue because she was elected and she's not yet been sworn in. But it's also a numbers issue for the Speaker Mike Johnson because it looks like with her in office, the Democrats and some Republicans would have the votes to force the release of the Epstein files or at least have that legislation or that resolution pass.

[12:55:00]

RAJU: Yeah. And I've asked the Speaker this directly, if this is part of his calculation. He denies that that's the case. But the reality is that she would become the 218th signature on this effort to force a vote in the full House to call for the release of all the Epstein files that can -- that would circumvent the opposition of Mike Johnson, who's been fighting for some time and the president too, to prevent that vote from happening.

So if she signs this, Dana, that means a vote in the House. It probably won't pass the Senate, but it would put all those members on record, something the Speaker hopes to avoid.

BASH: Yeah. All right. Thank you so much, Manu.

And a quick programming reminder, tune into the "CNN Town Hall" tonight, "Shutdown America." Senators Bernie Sanders and Congresswoman Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez is -- they're both going to be taking questions from audience members. Kaitlan Collins is going to moderate. That's at 9:00 p.m. Eastern, only here on CNN.

Thank you for joining "Inside Politics." "CNN News Central" starts after a break.

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