Return to Transcripts main page

Inside Politics

Hegseth Pins Decision To Launch Second Strike On Special Ops Admiral; Today: Surprisingly Close House Race In District Trump Won By 22; AOC, Al Gore Join Call To Support Tennessee Dem Candidate; Bipartisan Questions Over Legality Of "Double-Tap" Boat Strike. Aired 12:30-1p ET

Aired December 02, 2025 - 12:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

PRISCILLA ALVAREZ, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: We also haven't seen, correct me if I'm wrong here, Natasha, what that second strike, the video of the second strike, they've put out multiple videos on social media in the wake of these strikes, but that one we haven't seen yet.

And this isn't just something that lawmakers are asking a lot of questions about. They're asking for briefings to get more clarity on this. We had them on the air this morning saying that there has been very little visibility on all of this, despite what they would otherwise be privy to. But it's also what other countries in the Western Hemisphere are watching.

I have been speaking to my sources about Mexico, for example, which has been a country, what lawmakers will say, fentanyl has flowed through --

DANA BASH, CNN ANCHOR: Yes.

ALVAREZ: -- and flowed through the border. And they're watching this very carefully, because as you heard there from Secretary Hegseth, they are keen on this. And the more that they -- the lawmakers and others press them on what about the drugs that are in Mexico that we know about, Mexican officials are bracing for the President moving or shifting his wrath on them.

So this is something that is very volatile, not only for Venezuela and the Caribbean, but also for these other countries in the hemisphere who are watching and carefully trying to navigate the situation with the President and the Defense Secretary, which has become very unpredictable.

BASH: Jeff Mason, I want you and our viewers to listen to something from John Yoo. He -- for those who don't remember, I know you remember because you and I were covering this at the time, he was an attorney under the Bush 43 administration who drafted controversial legal guidance used to justify waterboarding, enhanced interrogation techniques, and also drafted memos authorizing warrantless wiretapping.

And yet here's what he told Laura Coates about the potential for illegality in these strikes.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOHN YOO, FORMER DEPUTY ASSISTANT ATTORNEY GENERAL: Laura, I worked on very difficult, I think, 9/11 issues when we're facing a terrorist organization. There are a lot of difficult questions to answer when you're involved with the laws of war, but this is not one of them.

There are no legitimate arguments at all to fire upon the wounded and to fire on those who are mere survivors and are out of the action and no longer fight. That is a clear rule that's drilled into everyone from a private all the way to our highest commanders.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

JEFF MASON, WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT, REUTERS: So a couple of things. Number one, I think people will probably listen to his words with the paradigm of what you said before.

BASH: Yes.

MASON: A lot of backlash against the decisions that were made during the Bush years about -- that he was obviously involved in. That said, he knows about the laws of war. He's referring to that. And those are the same -- that is the same language that Karoline Leavitt was using at the podium yesterday when describing the Trump administration's justification for what they're doing.

And there's a contradiction there. And, in fact, that's been something that the White House and the administration broadly has not been able to explain to lawmakers, to the public, to the reporters who are asking about it from the very beginning. What is the legal justification for what they're doing?

And throwing around laws of war or international waters, those are both things that Karoline Leavitt spoke to about yesterday, is really sort of to your point about an earlier discussion raising more questions than it's answering.

BASH: Real quick.

AYESHA RASCOE, NPR HOST, "WEEKEND EDITION SUNDAY" AND "UP FIRST": Yes, I mean, look, I think when you hear Pete Hegseth saying he's behind the commanders, I'm sure they would rather he be in front, right? Like that's the issue. You're pushing them out and saying, oh, I'm behind you.

It's like, well, this has never been an administration where the buck stops with me. It's always been kind of like, well, look at him over there. And it seems like if I were a commander, that's the way I would be feeling right now.

BASH: All right, everybody stand by. As you can see, that is a live picture of the President still in his Cabinet meeting. We are going to continue to monitor that. But it is actually election day today, at least in Tennessee, in Tennessee's 7th Congressional District. Why are Republicans nervous about a seat that they've held very comfortably for more than four decades? We'll explain after the break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[12:38:48]

BASH: Today, a competitive congressional contest in the heart of Trump country. The President won the 7th district by 22 percentage points last year. The retiring Republican won by almost that much in the last two elections. But now as voters head to the polls to fill that now vacant House seat, Republicans are pulling out all the stops to keep it red, including a telerally with the President and a visit from House Speaker Mike Johnson on election eve.

Eva McKend is there. Eva, you spoke to the House Speaker while he was there last night. You were at a polling booth now. What are you seeing?

EVA MCKEND, CNN NATIONAL POLITICS CORRESPONDENT: Well, Dana, the people that we have been speaking with are excited and really surprised to see their district receive this level of attention, a steady stream of voters all day today at this polling site in Nashville. And I can tell you this really cuts both ways.

I spoke to a Tennessee woman and she said that her friends in Pennsylvania have been reminding her to get out and vote today. And she feels excited about Aftyn Behn, about the affordability message, and really that a Democrat can win, she feels like, in a community like this one.

But this is very different on the Republican side. It's also a motivation there. I spoke to a man in his 30s. He doesn't vote in many elections. He said he voted for Obama in '08 and Trump last year in 2024. And it's all the ads that he have seen from Republicans elevating Behn's past comments that got him to come out today and vote for Matt Van Epps.

[12:40:18]

Meanwhile, I asked Speaker Johnson about all this. Here's the exchange.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MCKEND: Is this a warning sign for the GOP that you are barnstorming the state the first day back from Thanksgiving recess in a state that went 20 points for Trump and you have to be here campaigning so hard?

REP. MIKE JOHNSON (R), HOUSE SPEAKER: No, ma'am, I did this all last year. We live it all on the field, no matter where the race is. He just happens to be the only race in the country right now, so he got my full attention.

(END VIDEO CLIP) MCKEND: But listen, Dana, Democrats are looking to flip the script in this community. Even if Aftyn Behn loses this election, but not by much, Democrats hope that it means that they can elevate a different type of candidate in a community like this one, in purple communities or red districts, someone who has the background of a progressive organizer. And maybe not necessarily a moderate centrist, which typically is the type of Democrat that they run in races like this one. Dana?

BASH: All right. Eva, thank you so much for that reporting. Appreciate it.

And my smart reporters here at the table are back with me. Just before we start discussing, I want to hear what President Trump said when he called into the telerally last night.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I won your state by 22 points. I won the area by something I think even more than that. So if it's like two points less than that, they'll say, oh, that's terrible. I guess Trump's losing his magic. But he's -- I think, Matt, I want Matt to do better than me, even.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

RASCOE: He always does the analysis for us, right? Like he's like getting in there. I mean, look, I mean, he's exactly right. If this is close, right, that will look bad on President Trump. And I think part of the reason that people will attribute it is to what he called the Democrat scam of affordability, right?

That people are not feeling good about their pocketbooks. They're not feeling good when they're going, like, you know, when you're going out Christmas shopping and things seem more expensive. And like that gets to people and they may, that may play out in this race. And so, yes, I mean, on that, the President is exactly right. People will be looking at it.

MASON: I think he's underplaying, though, how big of a disaster it will be for Republicans if that margin is not bigger. I mean, he says if he loses by -- or if he's down like 2 percent compared to the 22 percent that Trump had, then the headlines will be bad.

Well, the polls show right now that he's only ahead by 2 percent. That's within the margin of error. He could still win. But if he has to squeak out a win --

BASH: Yes.

MASON: -- that is absolutely a bad sign politically for Trump and Republicans.

BASH: Yes, I mean, and in fairness, Republicans I'm talking to who are involved in this race say -- they say a win is a win. And it is, you know -- MASON: True that.

BASH: -- an embarrassment and a narrative doesn't allow for an extra seat in the House of Representatives --

MASON: Right.

BASH: -- which is what they really want. Having said that, you're right, this is absolutely much closer than it should be. And one of the many fascinating dynamics going on here, Priscilla, is that the Democrat, even though this is obviously a red district, a little bit less so because they redrew it and put some more of Nashville into it, which we'll talk about in a second.

But she is not moving to the middle. She's playing the progressive populist playbook hard so much that she even had AOC come and campaign for her.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. ALEXANDRIA OCASIO-CORTEZ (D), NEW YORK: The very fact that we are here today and this race is so tremendously tight is a testament to how the American people are feeling in this moment. And I genuinely believe that we are at a time where people are increasingly recognizing that our fights are not left and right, but they are top and bottom.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ALVAREZ: OK, but what's also been at the center of these populist messages, affordability, which ties in nicely with how we started the show and what the President said about affordability being a Democratic scam. That has been a message that the Democrat in Tennessee and this district has been pushing. It's something that we saw in New York as well.

And so this -- it's almost -- the Speaker said that he's been watching this closely and that that is part of the message that they are probably also watching is how much does that resonate in addition to everything else, right? It's the various other issues and the left's position on them.

But the affordability piece is so critical and crucial. And we have seen that play out in other races this year. And this is going to be another test on that.

BASH: I just want to get to one other dynamic here, which is redistricting, which we've talked about --

ALVAREZ: Yes.

BASH: -- so much and the attempt by President Trump to and, you know, we'll see if it's successful in Texas and other states, to redraw the maps in order to make more Republican districts.

[12:45:09] To do that, you have to dilute the really, really red districts. Well, guess what? That's exactly what Tennessee did in this district. It was like plus 30 something before. If you see that, that you see the way that they changed it and they -- sorry, plus 43 before.

Now, because they redrew it and they added a little bit more of Nashville, it's plus 22, which is a huge GOP margin still.

MASON: Sure.

BASH: But it just shows the danger in what is known lovingly as dummy mandarin.

MASON: I hadn't heard that one. I mean, it's just the irony of the redistricting push, potentially backfiring on President Trump and Republicans is huge. California's we've already discussed has gotten it through. Texas is now a question mark.

I thought it was really interesting in the last week that an Indiana lawmaker, after seeing the the way that President Trump used the word that is a derogatory word that he decided to vote against redistricting, that was really fascinating. In general, there are a lot of pieces here that may not be going President Trump's way, including what you're just referring to.

BASH: OK, we're going to have to sneak in a quick break. Thank you all. Don't go anywhere.

Up next, we're going to talk to one of the men leading a bipartisan probe of that Venezuela boat strike or strikes. Senator Jack Reed will be here next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[12:51:08]

BASH: More now on our top story. Lawmakers from both parties are pressing the Trump administration for answers over the legality of a follow up strike on an alleged drug boat in the Caribbean. The question is, did the U.S. commit crimes? Who is responsible?

If so, joining me now from Capitol Hill is Senator Jack Reed, who is the top Democrat on the Senate Armed Services Committee. Thank you so much for being here, sir.

It was really interesting to see over the weekend the statement that came into my inbox from you and the Republican chair of the committee, Senator Roger Wicker, together vowing to investigate these strikes. First, what are you hoping to get? Tapes? Transcripts?

SEN. JACK REED (D), RHODE ISLAND: Well, we've requested previously, both Roger and I, for a whole litany, beginning with the videotapes, going to the after action reports, the exorts. Many of them are required by law to be given to the committee, and they've avoided that law. They've ignored it. So we need information because we have to make a judgment of whether this operation is legal, not just the individual strikes, but the whole operation. And then, of course, the attention is now being focused on one of the strikes and the possibility of criminal activity.

BASH: Senator Wicker, the chairman, said this morning to Manu Raju that he expects that the committee will get full access to everything that you just discussed. Do you share his optimism?

REED: Well, I hope so. Again, the chairman has taken a very thoughtful and, in many cases, courageous step to insist that we get this material. One of the reasons why I'm so confused that they won't release the material is that if they have video of the entire operation of all these strikes, then they could essentially and effectively dispute the allegations that have already been made. So I'm very suspicious that they've never shared that tape with us and that they are consciously trying to cover up what took place.

BASH: Why do you think that is?

REED: Because I think there are serious issues of legality under United States law, under the Uniform Code of Military Justice, which governs military personnel, and under international law. And I think that is, you know, one of the factors that they're considering.

BASH: Senator, I want you to listen to Pete Hegseth. He is in a Cabinet meeting currently with the President. And he had a chance to speak, and he spoke to what is going on in the operation and specifically kind of this controversy. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PETE HEGSETH, DEFENSE SECRETARY: We've only just begun striking narco boats and putting narco terrorists at the bottom of the ocean because they've been poisoning the American people. We've had a bit of a pause because it's hard to find boats to strike right now, which is the entire point, right?

Deterrence has to matter, not arrest and hand over and then do it again, the rinse and repeat approach of previous administrations. This is meant to get after that approach. And I will just end by saying, as President Trump always has our back, we always have the back of our commanders who are making decisions in difficult situations.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BASH: What does that tell you?

REED: Well, it tells me that he is still propagating the line that this is a critical and decisive and effective way to stop drugs coming in. And first of all, drug trafficking is a law enforcement issue.

[12:55:05]

We currently have the Coast Guard and others who are operating in the Caribbean disrupting the trade. That could be enhanced. And rather than spending millions of dollars doing that, we -- they're spending it on military activity.

And he forgot to mention that we have a carrier task force group in the Caribbean. We have multiple destroyers. We have a Marine Expeditionary Unit. That does not have anything to do with drug interdiction. This is, I think, an -- just an incredibly challenging situation in the fact that it's bad strategy, it's bad law enforcement, and it could be a serious crime in the law of war.

BASH: Effectively, what -- it sounded like he was saying is that the ends justify the means, that there are fewer boats coming because they're scared, because people are getting killed.

REED: Well, first of all, let's put it into perspective. Fentanyl is the number one drug that is killing Americans. It does not come from Venezuela.

BASH: Right, this is --

REED: It comes from Mexico.

BASH: -- apparently mostly cocaine.

REED: This is mostly cocaine. They are transit points for cocaine shipments. S great -- many of those shipments go to Europe, as well as the United States. And, you know, knocking off a speedboat with perhaps a ton of cocaine is not going to decisively disrupt the cocaine trade coming out of Venezuela. More intensive interdiction with increased Coast Guard participation would be a better approach.

The other issue, I think, is that, you know, one of the factors that drives use in the United States is demand. And most naco traffickers are not in those boats. They pay people to do that. And usually people are not significantly involved with naco trading. It's the way they make money.

And rather than doing that, we should spend a lot more resources on law enforcement in the United States. They're actually cutting that back in terms of federal intervention. And also medical care and therapy that will get people off drugs and prevent them from dying because of drug addiction.

BASH: Senator Jack Reed, thank you so much for being here. Please let us know, obviously, as soon as you get those tapes and that information --

REED: Yes.

BASH: -- that you can share with us because a lot of people have the questions that you have.

Thank you so much for your time, sir.

REED: Thank you, Dana. Thank you very much.

BASH: Thank you.

And thank you for joining Inside Politics today. CNN News Central starts after the break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)