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79-year-old Trump Pushes Back Against Scrutiny Of His Health; Jack Smith Grilled For Eight Hours In GOP-Led House Deposition; Investigators Zero In On Cause Of Deadly Swiss Bar Fire. Aired 12- 12.30p ET

Aired January 02, 2026 - 12:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[12:00:00]

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PHIL MATTINGLY, CNN ANCHOR: President Trump starting 2026, with a social media post, an interview and a threat. I'm Phil Mattingly, in for Dana Bash. Let's go behind the headlines in Inside Politics.

And we begin with the story, snapping Washington out of vacation mode. President Trump's remarkably candid interview to the Wall Street Journal about an issue, he doesn't really like talking about, although, to be fair, who does, his age. He talked about his aspirin use, the hand bruising, and why he doesn't like to work out, even on New Year's and more.

But today, he once again, looked to shut down questions on the topic posting on Truth Social the White House, doctors have just reported that I am in perfect health and that I aced quotations meaning was correct on 100 percent of the questions asked, that's his clarification, for the third straight time, my cognitive examination something which no other president or previous vice president was willing to take.

I'm joined by a terrific group of reporters who are going to explain all of that, including the run on sentences, the punctuation, the quotations, all of the things. Guys, thank you very much for joining. Welcome, Happy 2026. Tolu, how are we doing, my friend? Let's -- let's start with -- with kind of the way this became a thing, which is, there have been a lot of questions, a lot of concerns. He is an older president, will end up being the oldest, I believe, by the time it's all said and done.

We just finished with an older president who had a lot of questions about age. There have been, I think, acute concerns related to bruising, whether or not he's falling asleep during meetings, and the Wall Street Journal story, which is very well reported and which he cooperated with, with this interview, lays out that there are some concerns inside the White House about some of these issues.

What was your read about kind of how this is all rolled out?

TOLUSE OLORUNNIPA, STAFF WRITER, THE ATLANTIC: Well, President Trump often likes to talk in hyperbole. He's in perfect health. He aced every exam. There's nothing to see here when it comes to his health. We saw with the Joe Biden presidency that that is not the way to go about dealing with the issue of aging in office.

The President has shown signs of aging. We've seen him falling asleep in the Oval Office. We've seen the bruising on his hands, and people are talking about things that are happening behind closed doors, and that is starting to filter out into the media. And so he did something different than what Biden did when reporters started to pick up on this and started to do some investigative reporting, and he picked up the phone and talked to them and tried to put some of this to bed.

Now he still talked about things that he's doing that is not in line with what the doctors are telling him to do, like taking extra high doses of aspirin and also eating a diet that is not going to really help him at the age of 80, a lot of cheeseburgers and McDonald's, but -- and also not exercising. But he did engage, he is more transparent with the press. He is showing himself more and allowing the American public to make their own judgment.

But there is still a big question about how his health is doing behind closed doors, what the doctors are seeing, why he went for that CT scan, which he called an MRI, but was actually a CT scan. And what actually is behind some of these concerns that we're starting to hear, and that is part of the reason why this issue, as much as the President wants to put it to bed, is going to continue into 2026.

MATTINGLY: Yeah, look, age is undefeated. I mean, I think as far as I know. I don't know Seung Min --

SEUNG MIN KIM, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: Unless you know something I don't know.

MATTINGLY: Yeah, exactly, I mean who knows, A.I. and all these things, anything can possibly happen. But this is a reality. And I think that kind of is the backdrop of all of this to Tolu's point like, good for him for actually engaging on it. I think if you learn any lessons from the four years prior, it's that engaging on these issues is really important, one way or the other.

Alayna, Tolu mentions the aspirin taking, and we talked about this like there's this quote in the Wall Street Journal story, which is one of the better quotes I've ever read in my entire life, where they ask him about the fact that he's taking more aspirin than is recommended. And he says, quote, they say aspirin is good for thinning out the blood, and I don't want thick blood pouring through my heart, Trump said, I want nice, thin blood pouring through my heart. And then he asked the reporter, does that make sense?

I asked the doctor about this last night, and doctor said it doesn't make any sense at all. Actually, it is completely not sensical. And yet this -- so why is he doing it?

ALAYNA TREENE, CNN WHITE HOUSE REPORTER: Well, I also love that he said, and I mentioned this, that he's superstitious, because I actually was reading about this too, and I was randomly talking to my grandmother about some of this yesterday, and she's like, that's like, an old thing that people would do was take aspirin, thinking that that would help them prevent heart attacks.

Except now the science has changed, and clearly his doctors are saying, take a lower dose. Take the Baby Motrin, or the Baby Advil, or whatever it is. And he's like, nope, I'm going to stick with my 325 milligrams a day, despite the doctors not saying that.

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And he is a superstitious man, so I just found that part of this funny. But look, with all of this, he actually did kind of reveal some things that we didn't know, the Aspirin thing, but also this idea that, you know, his doctors recommended he wear compression stocks. That's partly because he has what we all now know, because his doctors have said this as he has chronic venous insufficiency.

It's basically a blood circulation issue that makes him, his leg swell, his hands swell, something that we've all noticed for people who cover him and those great photographers at the White House. So all of that to say, what I found so interesting, which you guys bring up is that good on him for doing this interview with the journal. But part of it too is this is such a sensitive topic for Trump.

He gave the Wall Street Journal an impromptu interview. They essentially laid it out in the story that they weren't really seeking one. They were -- had all this reporting. They went to the White House like reporters do, and then Trump decided to call them, because this is an issue he cares so much about. He is very sensitive to any comparisons to Joe Biden.

He is very sensitive to anyone arguing that he might not be physically or mentally fit to serve as president, and that's why he wanted to go on the record with the Journal to defend himself, and why he's posting about it today. Regardless of all of that, though, it still is one of the most extensive conversations he's actually had about his health with journalists, which make it in itself, a really great piece.

MATTINGLY: Yeah, and providing clarity too, on the scan, a CT scan, said it had been an MRI. We weren't totally sure what the imaging was, ended up being a CT scan.

TREENE: He also said he wished he didn't get it done.

MATTINGLY: That he wished he didn't get it done.

TREENE: (inaudible) more scrutiny.

MATTINGLY: Because it actually raised questions. Do you think he's put this to bed?

MIN KIM: Of course, not. Because, well, first of all, he's turning 80 this June. 80 is kind of like this mental marker. It reminds me of when President Biden turned 80 in office. It really was like a point where -- another flash point where you could really examine his age and the fact of aging in office. But it's also not going to go away, because, as Alayna said, he is so sensitive about it. And another, you know, so many great quotes in that Journal piece. But

when he, you know, impromptu, called up the reporters, he said something like, well now, like I've talked to you about my health for the 25th time, and you could see how this has been getting under his skin ever since that major New York Times story came out about his schedule.

Because he had incessantly talked about it. He had incessantly posted about it. You could tell it really did bother him. The White House went out of its way to, for example, to provide his private schedules, to show what he exactly he was doing behind closed doors. But you know he is -- he is just factually aging, whether he's up to the job is up for the voters to decide, but it's -- or for the American public to weigh in on, but it's -- it is certainly not a question that's going away anytime soon, despite their efforts at transparency and despite the efforts of the White House to show how engaged and how engaged he is.

MATTINGLY: His thin, easily bruised skin, he acknowledged that, that's not me. Tolu, just with the limited time we have left, this is going to continue to be an issue. Again, we saw this in the last president, so we're going to see it here. What do you think happens next here?

OLORUNNIPA: Well, reporters are going to continue to dig. The 80th birthday is obviously an opportunity for more coverage of his age. People are going to be talking about what's happening behind closed doors. And I think if he's showing signs of aging the way President Biden was showing signs of aging behind closed doors, it's going to get out.

And so he probably would do well to be more transparent and more up front about what actually is happening instead of saying everything is perfect, he's in perfect health. He's acing everything and just talking about aging as it's actually happening, and being transparent with what issues he's dealing with, I think that will be the next step in this process.

MATTINGLY: Clear eyed self-awareness. I am totally expecting that to be happening at some point soon. All right, guys, much more to come. For the first time, we're hearing from Special Counsel Jack Smith as he details why he charged President Trump with a crime.

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JACK SMITH, FORMER SPECIAL PROSECUTOR: The attack that happened at the Capitol, as part of this case does not happen without him.

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MATTINGLY: Much more from inside the eight hour deposition when we come back. Stay with us.

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MATTINGLY: Newly released video shows the eight-hour grilling of former Special Counsel Jack Smith. Smith sat for a deposition for the House Judiciary Committee led by Republicans, dead set on casting his investigation of President Trump and January 6 as a weaponization of the justice system. In that interview, Smith forcefully pushed back on that characterization.

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SMITH: The decision to bring charges against President Trump was mine, but the basis for those charges rests entirely with President Trump and his actions as alleged in the indictments returned by grand juries in two different districts. Our investigation developed proof beyond a reasonable doubt that President Trump engaged in a criminal scheme to overturn the results of the 2020 election and to prevent the lawful transfer of power.

The evidence here made clear that President Trump was, by a large measure, the most culpable and most responsible person in this conspiracy. The -- these crimes were committed for his benefit. The attack that happened at the Capitol as part of this case does not happen without him.

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MATTINGLY: My panel is back with me now, and there's a lot to dig into on this. But to start with, if you want to know how well this went for Republicans and for the White House, acknowledge the fact that it was released on January 31 late in the afternoon, and we have not seen anything on the President's street social account or from any of his allies over the course of the last 48 hours, since.

MIN KIM: Right, right. I mean, it was kind of a classic, you know, news dump on a holiday when obviously everyone had tuned out for other matters.

MATTINGLY: To be clear, Alayna and I were here.

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MIN KIM: OK, you guys are working hard. We were just sitting back and relaxing. I found -- I found so many parts of that interview really interesting, but especially, obviously the quote that we just played here about how he -- like how the riot does not happen without Donald Trump, according to the Special Counsel's retelling.

But I found his argument that what made his case so compelling were the Republicans who testified to him or who spoke to him for his investigation. These were his other erstwhile allies who would have -- who wanted to help Trump, but knew that it was ultimately not the right thing to do that.

MATTINGLY: Can I play the sound real quick? Actually, it's a perfect tee up. Take a listen.

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SMITH: One of the strengths of our case and why we felt we had such strong proof is our witnesses were not going to be political enemies of the president. They were going to be political allies. We had numerous witnesses who would say, I voted for President Trump. I campaigned for President Trump. I wanted him to win. The Speaker of the House in Arizona, the Speaker of the House in Michigan.

We had an elector in Pennsylvania who is a former congressman, who is going to be an elector for President Trump, who said that what they were trying to do was an attempt to overthrow the government and illegal.

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MIN KIM: Yeah, I thought that was actually really compelling. And had this criminal -- had this criminal process continued. You know, obviously, had the President not been re-elected, I think that really would have been a focal point of Jack Smith's case.

MATTINGLY: What stood out to you?

TREENE: Look, I was actually just going to put it more in context. I mean, of course, from the substance that he talks about, it's interesting, but I think the fact is that this would have been so different if Trump didn't end up running for re-election, as you kind of pointed out. I mean, I think, you know, I traveled throughout the President's campaign. I was following Trump on his 2024 campaign.

I talked to people on the ground, and they fully believed that what Jack Smith was doing with each of the investigations was inherently political. And I think that what Trump's really good at was, you know, framing it as such, that really, people didn't start to pay attention to what the allegations were, to what, you know, the investigations were showing up. They were taking it into what is the broad reasoning for this happening.

And I think that is the question as well of you know, did potentially, the Justice Department under Merrick Garland wait too long to appoint Jack Smith, and did he take too long? I mean, I can't, you know, I think, you know, I'm not a legal expert. I never worked in the Justice Department. I think for a Special Counsel, he actually moved very quickly but the timing of it is really where, I think a lot of you know, the reaction and response to all of this has been, it kind of sealed its fate with -- with Jack Smith, you know.

MATTINGLY: Yeah. And also, I think, totally the ability for the President and his team to kind of commingle the Letitia James case, the Alvin Bragg case, which were two very different cases like you talk to people who understand this stuff, and by the way, that testimony, that deposition, had nothing to do with the classified documents case which Jack Smith could not talk about, did not talk about, is still under seal at this point, but the ability of the Trump team to merge all of these things together, which were two very different issues and entities, I think, was probably the most effective thing they did during the campaign. OLORUNNIPA: Yeah, they seized on one word, weaponization, and they

used it as a broad brush against everything that was going on with the Department of Justice and with these other various prosecutions that were against then candidate Trump, and it does raise the question about the timing of this, because Jack Smith did have a pretty compelling case.

He talked about having Republicans and people who supported the president who are going to be his top witnesses. We didn't hear from those witnesses because of what happened with the election and because of the way the timing played out. And so there are a number of Democrats who are now asking themselves whether or not the Justice Department should have moved more quickly to bring these charges in the first place, because these acts were acts that took place in 2020 and we didn't start to hear a lot of this evidence until late into the campaign for 2024.

And so there is a question in hindsight, especially as we see President Trump and how he is operating the Justice Department, though a lot of Democrats do not like the way he's doing it, but no one is going to accuse him of moving slowly to do what he wants to do. And so I think there's a lot of second guessing about the way that this was handled and whether or not things moved as quickly as they should have.

MATTINGLY: Yeah. No, there's no question about it. Just a couple days away, by the way, the anniversary of January 6, which has been completely rewritten in a very absurd way. Tell people, why don't you go back and watch all that. All right, well, coming up new information about what started that deadly fire inside a bar at a Swiss Ski Resort. We'll have it next.

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MATTINGLY: It's a stunning image, the moment that Swiss officials say the deadly fire ignited inside a Ski Resort basement bar. You see there as staff hold champagne bottles with sparklers, all within a tightly packed crowd, and just above them, sparks igniting the flames in the ceiling.

Other images show more closely staff wearing helmets as they hold those sparklers. CNN has reviewed and verified multiple videos that show the moments that followed. Now, as you watch, I do want to warn you, they're disturbing.

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Video is shown of chaos and terror inside Swiss bar.

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MATTINGLY: Now there are additional verified videos then showing the chaos unfolding panic in the bar as patrons search for an escape, and the desperation as the fire grows larger. At least 40 people died, and 119 were injured. Officials say that many of those are fighting for their lives. CNN's Nic Robertson has been on the ground. Has been following the latest there at the scene in Switzerland. Nic, what are officials saying about the effort to locate those who are missing?

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NIC ROBERTSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL DIPLOMATIC EDITOR: Yeah, they're still try -- trying to identify all the dead. There are still six people who are alive in hospital of those 119 that are hospitalized who remain unidentified, and that's the priority the police say for the families. We've seen a father of one of the missing today, literally on the ground here in the street, on his knees, uncontrollable grief.

There were -- his brother was at his side, trying to help him. There were strangers, quite literally, trying to give him comfort on the street. But he was overwhelmed by grief. He's not alone, and when you listen to some of the witness testimonies of the ferocity of the fire, of course, these families now have heard those testimonies as well, and this all plays into their pain. This is how one man described the scene outside here, last night in the aftermath of the fire.

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EDMUND COQUETTE, WITNESS: You saw the young people who were totally burnt in the face, who missed some fingers here laying on the streets. And the first -- the first aid was given to these people. And then you have to -- what was the worst is the screaming of these young people, the screaming of pain.

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ROBERTSON: And that just gives you an idea of why it's so hard now for the authorities to identify everyone. The bank just over there opened its doors to sort of for triage, for medical rescue workers who were quickly on the scene, and my colleague, producer Jeff Federman (ph) was speaking with one of the doctors helping treat them, and the doctor was telling him, look, we were trying to make sure that everyone we were passing on that was being evacuated away, that we had their identification.

But of course, it was so busy, so chaotic, that didn't happen in every case, and that's what provides for the pain and suffering of some of these families right now. And European countries also stepping in here. About 50 of these severely burn injured victims have been taken to other European countries for treatment. We know, as well -- as well as the 71 Swiss who are injured, 14 French, 11 Italian, four Serbian, Bosnian, Bulgarian, Polish.

It's touching so many countries here. Phil?

MATTINGLY: Nic Robertson, you and your team have been doing incredible work the last couple of days on this really horrific story. Really appreciate your time. Thank you. Well, still ahead on Inside Politics, Kara Swisher gives her

predictions for technology in 2026. Stay with us.

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