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Inside Politics

Fauci Takes Fifth, Saying Paul Is "Obsessed" With Imprisoning Him; Fauci Takes Fifth, Won't Answer Questions At Senate COVID Hearing; More Than 7 In 10 Americans Say Trump Has Wrong Priorities; Approval Of Trump's Handling Of Iran Falls To 28 Percent; Now: Blanche At Capitol After Meeting With Holdout GOP Vote Canceled. Aired 12- 12:30p ET

Aired July 29, 2026 - 12:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[12:00:00]

DANA BASH, CNN HOST, INSIDE POLITICS: The ghosts of COVID past reignite an old feud on Capitol Hill.

I'm Dana Bash. Let's go behind the headlines at Inside Politics.

Today, Republican Senator Rand Paul was looking for a fight, but Dr. Anthony Fauci, compelled by a subpoena to testify this morning about the nation's COVID response, did not give him one. Instead, here's what the nation's former top infectious disease expert said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DR. ANTHONY FAUCI, FORMER DIR. NATIONAL INSTITUTE OF ALLERGY & INFECTIOUS DISEASES: The only conclusion I can reach is that the sole reason he is calling me before this committee is to get me to say something, anything that could vindicate his repeated public pledges that I end up in his words "behind bars." Any reasonable person who has followed his unhinged obsession with me would readily come to the same conclusion. Under the advice of my attorneys, I will invoke my right under the Fifth Amendment of the Constitution to refrain from answering your questions.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BASH: Republicans have spent years demonizing Fauci over the nation's response to the COVID pandemic that continued this morning, despite Fauci's refusal to answer questions.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. RAND PAUL (R-KY): The COVID lockdown, however, could never have been inflicted without you aiding and abetting the crime.

SEN. RON JOHNSON (R-WI): So, I would want to know, you know, to what extent were you involved in sabotaging hydroxychloroquine, ivermectin?

SEN. RICK SCOTT (R-FL): You force people to watch their loved ones die alone over the phone. It's disgusting.

SEN. JOSH HAWLEY (R-MO): It's because you did all kinds of terrible things. It's because during the pandemic you got rich, didn't you?

SEN. JONI ERNST (R-IA): Yes or no, Dr. Fauci, did you try to block or trap President Trump into the slow the spread, flatten the curve measures in March 2020?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BASH: Dr. Fauci invoked the Fifth Amendment more than one hundred times. The hearing took another turn when Dr. Fauci's own lawyer tried to speak, leading Senator Paul to direct security to escort him out.

I'm joined by a terrific group of reporters here at the table. David Chalian, as I said, this has long been a feud and a concern, and a lot of criticism by Republicans of the way Fauci -- who by the way worked for President Trump in the first term, the way he handled things, but specifically, it's very, very personal, and that was very much on display this morning.

DAVID CHALIAN, CNN POLITICAL DIRECTOR & WASHINGTON BUREAU CHIEF: I mean, the personal feud between Rand Paul and Anthony Fauci, as you said, it's been years and years. We've seen that play out across a whole series of hearings like this. What is intriguing to me politically to look at in this moment is what the Republicans think they're going to get out of this because it is still, as you say, this has been sort of a hobby horse and it is a motivating energizing issue inside the MAGA world.

But it is so far a field from where voters are right now and what their concerns are today. That it strikes me as not going to be particularly helpful to them to have this as a spotlight. I don't know if that trade-off, the little energy you get in the base versus something that is dealing with something six years in the past and not animating most voters right now, that to me seems like a tough political trade-off.

BASH: I think, and Leigh Ann, you cover Congress, day-in and day-out, so I wonder if you agree with me. I think that maybe a kernel of it is finding some motivating something in the base, but it's really Rand Paul obsessed with this and not wanting to let it go. I mean, this is what he just said on Monday on social media. If Anthony Fauci lies before Congress on Wednesday, as he did in previous hearings, his preemptive pardon won't cover him. This, of course, was a couple of days ago before Dr. Fauci pleaded the fifth this morning.

And this is just -- these are some examples, starting really most recently in May of 2026, a couple of months ago. Retweet if you're ready to see Fauci behind bars. July 2025, he's going to reissue a criminal referral of Anthony Fauci. May 2025, mark my words, Anthony Fauci, there will be hell to pay. Warned about launching a probe and press criminal charges against Tony Fauci back in 2024 before the pardon. And then the art -- this article that he had posted confirms truth. He said Fauci is guilty as charged.

[12:05:00]

LEIGH ANN CALDWELL, CHIEF WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT, PUCK: Yeah. I think you're absolutely right. Donald or Rand Paul has been obsessed with this since COVID happened. Dr. Fauci thinks that Rand Paul was center to the -- central to the conspiracy, what he called conspiracy theories about the origins of COVID. And Rand Paul thinks that Dr. Fauci has been lying to the country about China's role in the -- in COVID. And so, yes, this is, you know, thinking back to COVID hearings where Rand Paul and Dr. Fauci were screaming at each other in these hearings, and finally, Rand Paul has an opportunity to bring Fauci before the committee again.

But I will say that this is probably pretty traumatic for a lot of people. COVID was a time where the country has not completely recovered, where -- because of this huge disagreement in the origins of COVID, people started to lose their trust and their faith in the government and institutions, and it was really escalated a breakdown of trust. And this is revisiting that once again.

And with Dr. Fauci, I understand, you know, he says he's not answering questions because he doesn't want to be used against him to put him in jail -- exactly. And doctor -- how Rand Paul was handling this, it just really doubles down on the level of to remind people of how people don't know what to believe.

BASH: Yeah. No, that's exactly right. And look, the COVID skepticism, more importantly, the -- I would say more mainstream concern and criticism about the way that governments, federal down to the most local handled COVID, especially in retrospect, is real. I mean, I'm sure we all have mom, dad, friends who are still talking about the repercussions of kids having to wear masks. More broadly, schools being closed, and how that is now six years later still a very, very big problem, societally and culturally.

SHELBY TALCOTT, WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT, SEMAFOR: Yeah. And that's why I think I kind of have a little bit of a different view. I agree that is this going to move votes in November? Probably not, because Dr. Fauci is not on the ballot. There's a lot of news to be had from now until November. But I do actually think that this goes beyond just the MAGA, the MAHA, the Trump base, because you know, I think people are quick to forget how much COVID impacted everyday Americans.

Businesses were lost. People couldn't see their families. Young kids were not able to develop in the same ways because they weren't able to have the normal social experiences. And people are still dealing with that. And I think people have -- people, I know, I've talked to Republicans, Independents, and some of my least political friends on this planet who have talked to me this week and seen some of Dr. Fauci's diary messages and said, you know, this is crazy. They're a little bit grossed out by it, right?

And I think it reinforces this longstanding notion that there is one set of rules for the elite and another set of rules for everybody else, and that's something that really, I think resonates with a lot of Americans outside of the Trump base.

BASH: One of the Republicans who didn't just yell at Anthony Fauci made a similar point to what you're making and what we're all kind of saying here. Listen to what James Lankford of Oklahoma said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. JAMES LANKFORD (R-OK): It was uncharted territory for everyone, but I would tell you, countless families, including my own, watched a loved one die behind glass or through a screen because we couldn't get access to him. Children couldn't get to school. People miss their prom or graduation ceremonies. There are lots of things that happen that dramatically changed the future of the country.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SABRINA RODRIGUEZ, POLITICAL REPORTER, THE WALL STREET JOURNAL: I mean, I think to Shelby's point here, part of it too is, you know, looking at sort of the coverage of the diary and just seeing sort of the virality online around it. It's not just in MAGA circles that people are making comments about it. Now, I do think that in some ways it reinforces what you already thought about Fauci. I think if you were already a skeptic of him and his motivations, then everything that's come out around the diaries reinforces that.

You know, you can look at pieces of his diary. We're talking about over thousand pages. So again, you can find what you want in there, but you can find a self-aggrandizing, self-serving, narcissistic man who, you know, was publicly trying to reassure the country while had private concerns.

[12:10:00]

But on the other side of it, if you are someone who is a supporter of Fauci and thinks he -- think he handled it well, then you can see someone who was navigating a chaotic administration, navigating how to handle President Trump and his handling of it and was really a tired scientist working through everything. So, I think this sort of revisits that episode, but also just reinforces how you feel the handling was from him and from the administrations at the time.

BASH: Yeah. And unfortunately, one of you or maybe all of you said what we have now is a lack of trust in our healthcare system, and it's growing even more so during this second Trump administration for different reasons.

All right, coming up. A brand-new CNN poll delivers a gut punch to President Trump. Most Americans say he's focused on the wrong things, as his approval among fellow Republicans hits a new low. Plus, Todd Blanche's path to becoming attorney general just got a bit rockier. We have new comments from the senator, the GOP senator, who could make or break Todd Blanche's confirmation.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[12:15:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BASH: With three months until Election Day, we have a brand-new CNN poll. It shows just 34 percent of Americans approve of President Trump's job performance, and that matches his all-time low after January 6, 2021. And the news pretty much gets worse from there.

We're going to walk through some of the top lines here with our panel. You just saw the overall approval and let me just emphasize the second point that I just made, and that is on his approval rating over time. If you look at, I mean, it's never been extraordinarily high, but the lowest point was in January of 2021, 34 percent, which matches exactly to where it is now.

And just one other point I want to make, the question of whether or not the president has the right priorities. I mean, just look at that. It's like not even in the same universe, the yes and the no. Almost three quarters of these people say that the president is not listening. He doesn't have the right priorities. David Chalian, I know you've gone through this poll as our political director with a fine- tooth comb.

CHALIAN: Yeah. I mean this number is the number that jumped out at us right away. I mean, you don't usually see three quarters of agreement on anything right now in American politics, but the fact that you have three quarters of the public agreeing that he's not focused on the right things. That's a problem. It's a problem for him, obviously, but it's a problem for his party heading into these midterm elections, especially because it is so clear what the American people believe those priorities are, right?

It's the economy. It's prices, it's that -- that is inflation, the gas pump. That is what it is so clear that they have a set of priorities, and that he's not addressing it. And that they also see, and this is a tough challenge, his policies like going to war with Iran, causing more economic pain. Like that is a direct connection that voters are making that we see in poll after poll, including this one.

BASH: And specifically on the question of his fellow Republicans. This is one of those, sort of redlight moments, I would think, inside the administration and certainly inside all the Republican campaigns because it's still, you know, 88 percent was of support among Republicans. That was back in February of 2025. 78 percent is where it is now.

Now you might say, oh, that's pretty high, but not for Donald Trump and Republicans. That is relatively low for this president because he has had such a lock on his party, and that matters, Shelby, going into this midterm election season, not because we think that that other 20, whatever 23 percent -- 22 percent, thank you, is going to suddenly go vote for a Democrat, but they could stay home.

TALCOTT: Yeah, absolutely. And that's the concern that people around Trump have had and Republicans. I mean, we've heard from Republicans for months, who have been urging the president to start focusing on more domestic issues, on the economy, on the cost of gas, right? And in the president's mind, I think it remains -- he's thinking of the big picture stuff. And you've heard him talk about it publicly before, right? The argument that, you know, Iran not obtaining a nuclear weapon is more important than gas prices. It's short term. Voters are going to understand, but I think the reality we're seeing is voters don't understand because it's more conceptual, right? They're not in Iran. They're focused on, are they going to be able to pay their next bill?

BASH: And let me just add a little bit of substance from this poll to the point you're making. This is a question of the president's approval of the way he's handling Iran. All, now only 28 percent, but again among Republicans, this has dropped to 66 percent just in a few months.

TALCOTT: Yeah. And again, it goes back to the point of, I think Republicans were willing to give the president a pass and say I agree that Iran should not be able to obtain a nuclear weapon. Let's see what happens. But now this has dragged on for so much longer than the administration initially told people, and now Republicans are getting really nervous. They're saying we're hearing from voters. Voters are saying we want this to be over, end it. Focus on us.

[12:20:00]

BASH: And Sabrina, look a little bit deeper on the question of the economy, which is by far the number one issue that voters do want the president and all of their elected officials to be focusing on. His approval of his handling of the economy overall only 30 percent, inflation 25 percent, gas prices 21 percent.

RODRIGUEZ: I mean, I think one of the challenges that the president -- that Republicans overall have right now, heading into the midterms, is it's not just how Donald Trump, how the president is handling the economy. It's also the optics of what he is doing instead of handling the economy. You know, our social media feeds and voters that I talk to social media feeds are include, you know, Trump having a UFC fight at the White House is, you know, him talking about the reflecting pool and how much he wants to address that, it's him talking about building a ballroom in the White House.

And I've talked to voters who have said I wouldn't care about him doing those things, some of those things sound cool, some of those things are not a bad thing. But if they're happening at the cost of him not focusing on the economy, if he's focusing on these things and that's the attention that the president -- that's what he cares to put his attention to, and not on actually finding ways to make life more affordable for people. That's the problem.

BASH: And I'll just add one more detail to that list of grievances, and that is what the president is doing from the perspective of voters to help himself. And this poll shows -- the question was, does Trump put the good of the country above personal gain? Yes, only 34 percent, no 66 percent. This is why, after Democrats finish talking about affordability and all of the sort of parts that go along with that, they talk about corruption.

CALDWELL: Yeah. And corruption is increasingly more -- increasingly important to voters. It is polling at a higher level than we have seen in, maybe ever. I'm not sure David would know better, but it is absolutely a major concern, and it's breaking through. Republicans I talk to know that this is a problem as well. That's why Democrats are leaning into it, and that is actually why the House voted last week on a very narrow STOCK Act version. Not that this bill is going to do very much, but it enables House Republicans to say, look, we are trying to address corruption from a broader sense, not just the president, but people are also mad at members of Congress for it.

But when you see numbers of the president's party and base dropping like that, that is really confounding for Republicans whose entire theory of the case in this midterm election is to make sure that Republican voters who don't turn out when Trump is not on the ballot come to the polls. They know the president is unpopular with independents. Democrats aren't going to vote for them. And so, this is going to be a major challenge for Republicans over the next 96 days.

CHALIAN: Yeah. I would just say the piece about corruption is the reason Democrats are utilizing it is because they're attaching it. It's not living in an isolated place. They are attaching the corruption to the lack of focus on priorities, to being in it for himself and not the country, to not solve it. Like, it is one story that they're telling instead of just like, hey, look at the corruption. That at least that is what the most successful Democrats on the campaign trail who are doing quite well in the polls have been doing with that anti-corruption messaging is connecting it to you or the voters pocketbook.

BASH: Yeah, that's a very important point. All right, up next. There is very important development on Capitol Hill. Todd Blanche's nomination is in peril after his meeting with a key GOP senator was canceled.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[12:25:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BASH: Todd Blanche is on Capitol Hill right now as his nomination to be attorney general seems to be in peril. The Republican Senator from Texas, John Cornyn, who has been demanding several things, including a very important bit of information about this anti-weaponization fund that he wants to make sure is actually dead, says that he still isn't a yes. The Senate Judiciary Committee is supposed to vote tomorrow. Cornyn's meeting, which was again supposed to happen today, was canceled because he didn't get that assurance that he's been demanding on the anti-weaponization fund.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MANU RAJU, CNN CHIEF CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Are you a no? Are you a no tomorrow if this comes to a vote?

SEN. JOHN CORNYN (R-TX): Well, Senator Grassley tells me that we need to know by 4 o'clock this afternoon whether the markup is still on. So, we still got a little time, and hopefully, they now recognize the seriousness of this and will be responsible.

RAJU: But if it stands as it is now -- if it stands as it now -- if it stands as it is now, right now, would you vote now?

CORNYN: Well, I'm not prepared to vote, yes. Let me -- let me put it that way.

RAJU: Would you rather they say they responded --

(CROSSTALK)

CORNYN: I think they -- I think they -- I think they realize now that we're serious, and I think Senator Tillis is pretty much on the same page that I am. So, they better get real and there's not much time left.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BASH: OK. So, I'm having to do simple math on the fly here, but I think I got it. Three and a half hours until the deadline, that 4 o'clock deadline Eastern Time that Grassley put out there. And the fact that Todd Blanche didn't just say, OK, I'm going to stay over at the Justice Department, but still went to Capitol Hill and is parking himself at least for now in another Republican senator's office, means that these are high stakes talks as we speak to get that Cornyn vote.

[12:30:00]