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Isa Soares Tonight
Ukraine Interior Ministry Officials Killed In A Helicopter Crash; U.N. Secretary-General Slams Fossil Fuel Giants At Davos; Benjamin Netanyahu In Political Trouble As Coalition Comes Under Pressure; Helicopter Crash Kills Ukraine's Interior Minister, 13 Others; Ex-Mercenary Says Prisoners Who Refused To Fight Were Killed; Netanyahu Ally Cannot Serve As Cabinet Minister; Nobel Laureate Maria Ressa Cleared Of Tax Evasion; Metropolitan Police Crisis. Aired 2-3p ET
Aired January 18, 2023 - 14:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[14:00:00]
ISA SOARES, HOST, ISA SOARES TONIGHT: A very warm welcome to the show everyone, I'm Isa Soares. Tonight, a helicopter crash kills multiple people
including children and decimates Ukraine's Interior Ministry. What we know and what the government will do next. Then the U.N. Chief slams oil giants
for business practices that he says are at odds with the future of humanity.
Climate change is top of mind in Davos. And then later, a new political trouble for Benjamin Netanyahu. We'll explain why his coalition is already
under pressure in Israel. We start though with the new tragedy in Ukraine. A helicopter crash that has killed at least 14 people. The aircraft was
carrying the Ukrainian Interior Minister and five members of the Ministry's leadership team.
It crashed near a kindergarten near a residential building, killing all six passengers and three crew as well as five people on the ground. One of the
victims was a child. Ukrainian security services are investigating the cause. There's no indication that Russia was involved. But Ukrainian
President Volodymyr Zelenskyy says ultimately, Moscow is to blame. Have a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
VOLODYMYR ZELENSKYY, PRESIDENT, UKRAINE (through translator): There are no accidents. This is the result of the war. And it's after this fire,
everything which is happening, rockets that hit our people. Civilians. What is happening with the kindergarten schools. Every death is the result of
war.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SOARES: Well, CNN's Clarissa Ward arrived in Brovary shortly after the crash and she described the scene to our Max Foster.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
CLARISSA WARD, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (on camera): You can see, I'm standing now right in front of that kindergarten. It really took a
direct hit when that helicopter, according to eyewitnesses, came flying, appear to lose control here, clipped the edge of the kindergarten there,
starting a fire and then crashed on the other side of it.
When our team first arrived on the ground, you could see a number of bodies covered in gold foil. That had been recovered. But they're saying now that
all nine people who were on that helicopter, including, as you mentioned, the Minister of Interior Denys Monastyrskyi, the deputy Minister of
Interior, the Secretary of State of the Interior Ministry, that they were all killed immediately upon impact.
And now, we know as well that the other people who were killed were a number of children and their parents. Parents dropping their kids off at
school, Max, you can imagine this is every family's worst nightmare. The question becomes how did this happen? Because this helicopter was
sophisticated, it's a Puma helicopter.
Airbus had just updated the avionics on this, and so we don't know exactly how this happened. We know that there was a lot of fog, bad visibility in
the area. Some people said that they were able to hear the crash, but they couldn't see it immediately because there was such poor visibility.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SOARES: Clarissa Ward there. Well, six officials from Ukraine's Interior Ministry died in the crash as Clarissa was saying there. As we mentioned,
they include the Interior Minister himself, Denys Monastyrskyi, the others include the first deputy minister and the secretary of state, alongside
other high-ranking officials in the ministry that you can see here.
Well, earlier, I spoke with Anton Gerashchenko, he's Ukrainian Interior Ministry adviser, and also a former deputy minister of Internal Affairs. I
began by asking him about the circumstances of the crash and if he had any more information really about what exactly happened.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ANTON GERASHCHENKO, ADVISER, INTERIOR MINISTRY, UKRAINE (through translator): The Interior Minister, together with his first deputy, they
were flying east to support flight -- defense forces. What happened, we don't know at the minute. But I can say that, Ukraine lost the whole
generation of young politicians who came together with President Zelenskyy to change Ukraine. And it's a huge grief for everyone.
SOARES: And Mr. Gerashchenko, like you said, you know, the helicopter was carrying the Interior Minister, the first deputy minister, and the state
secretary. Why was there a whole delegation, an entire delegation traveling altogether? Was there a protocol in place?
GERASHCHENKO: We didn't have that protocol in place. I think this bloody lesson will be a clear example for us that such high politicians and
ministers cannot travel altogether. But this tragedy brought to death of children, which is amazingly horrible and obviously everyone who died.
[14:05:00]
Every life of every Ukrainian is priceless.
SOARES: And sir, what impact will this have on the Interior Ministry? On the work the Interior Ministry were doing?
GERASHCHENKO: Today, the near and dear lost their children. I lost my friends. And -- but the ministry structures will be working as before and
we definitely will defeat Russians. And we now have the acting minister, president, head of the Ukrainian national police and maybe he will become a
minister in the future. All the structures will be working effectively in order to defend Ukraine and defeat Russian aggressors.
SOARES: And Mr. Gerashchenko, we heard from President Zelenskyy speaking at the World Economic Forum, and he said that the helicopter crash was not
an accident. It was caused by war. Your thoughts on those comments?
GERASHCHENKO: Clearly, president has more information than myself, that's why I cannot comment his words. Maybe he knows facts that will be revealed
with time. Now we have investigators to reveal all the facts to establish the real cause of what had happened.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SOARES: Anton Gerashchenko speaking to me earlier. Let's go now to Fred Pleitgen in Brovary, Ukraine. So Fred, I believe an investigation is now
underway. But in the meantime, what more are you learning? What you're hearing about what unfolded?
FREDERIK PLEITGEN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, it was interesting, Isa, because a couple of minutes ago -- that person said that
they were actually in one of these buildings behind me. Which is the general complex of where that helicopter then actually crashed.
It crashed on the foot of the residential building that is behind me. And that person said, they saw the helicopter coming in. And it really didn't
look as though the helicopter was out of control or something, but it was losing altitude very quickly. And then it hit at first, a kindergarten, as
was -- has been described.
Hit that kindergarten, went across that kindergarten and then finally completely crashed at the foot of that building. Now, the person I spoke to
said there was a gigantic explosion that took place, obviously -- to save anybody who was inside that chopper. The Ukrainians, you know, as we've
been talking about, they don't believe that it was shut down or this is the result of the war that's going on here.
They're looking at a lot of other options, however, they're looking at possible mechanical failure. They're also looking at the -- maybe pilot
error as well. They do say that an investigation into all this is most probably going to take several weeks. It is very complex. One of the things
we also have to keep in mind, Isa, is that the wreckage of that helicopter, we were up close to that a little while ago.
It is in a terrible state. Obviously, at first, it crashed, then it blew up. There was a big fire. It was really just a mangled wreck that was on
the ground there. So investigators are going to be spending a lot of time analyzing and seeing what is going on there. We do understand that at the
time of the crash, there was a good degree of fog here in this area, some pretty bad weather in this area.
However, there are people who saw the chopper come in, and they were obviously able to see it in the sky. So certainly, it does appear to have
been a certain degree of visibility. As of right now, what we're seeing here is that the -- forensic crews on the ground. However, as we're
speaking right now, Isa, it seems as though the clearing operations are being wrapped up.
There is little work still going on. And right now, it really is up to that investigative and forensic work. And certainly, the Ukrainians are saying,
they definitely want to get behind what exactly happened here and how something like this could happen, because, of course, as you were just
speaking there with that interview guest, this is a huge loss for Ukraine.
And certainly, the Interior Minister Denys Monastyrskyi; one of the most important people right now. Not just of course, for the police forces here
in this country, but also for the defense of this country which the police forces are involved in. And then, of course, the emergency services that
have had so much to do since Russia's war against Ukraine started, Isa.
SOARES: Yes, just a horrific tragedy for country as you've been saying, has seen so much horror already. Fred Pleitgen there for us in Brovary,
Ukraine, thanks very much, Fred. Well, leaders and diplomats from around the world are reacting to this tragic helicopter crash in Ukraine. U.S.
President Biden is now sharing his condolences.
Lithuania's president calls this incident another consequence of Russian aggression against Ukraine. The British Foreign Secretary James Cleverly
writes the Ukraine's Interior Minister was a true friend of the U.K., we are ready to support Ukraine in whatever way we can, as you can see there.
And some leaders are in Davos, Switzerland, right now for the World Economic Forum. Ukraine's president asked them to mark a moment of silence
for all the victims of the war.
[14:10:00]
Business editor-at-large Richard Quest is there at the forum. And Richard, I was listening to President Zelenskyy today, and what I heard was a call
to allies almost, urging them to hurry and not hesitate. What did you take away from that, Richard?
RICHARD QUEST, CNN BUSINESS EDITOR-AT-LARGE: I took away from it a most powerful speech. I've heard Zelenskyy speak many times. And there is a
refreshing, brutal, honesty, that always comes through. He basically tells the audience what diplomats won't tell anybody, which is the honest truth
to your face.
Today, it was, you want us to win, you want this to stop? You want this to be over? Democracy demands that you do more. And the fascinating part was,
we just heard from Olaf Scholz; the German chancellor. Who said, we will help and support Ukraine in every way. And then, he went on to talk about
armored vehicles and this missile, but he didn't mention tanks.
And Zelenskyy has been saying, I want tanks. I want tanks. So I asked the Polish Prime Minister who's got the tanks that he wants, but can't send
them because Germany won't approve it. I asked the Polish Prime Minister, just send them and ask for forgiveness after.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ANDRZEJ DUDA, PRESIDENT, POLAND: It's not only about allowing or not allowing permission or no permission. The critically important point is,
will Germans finally give their part of heavy artillery, in particular heavy and modern tanks? And this is the major question because 14 tanks on
top of 250 is not the game-changer. But if France and in particular, Germany and some other countries gave 20, 30 tanks each, then it could make
a difference for Ukraine.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
QUEST: So Isa, what the Polish prime minister is saying is, Germany, get on with it. And what Zelenskyy is saying is, everybody, stop saying nice
words to me and start actually delivering what I need. It was very powerful.
SOARES: How palpable, Richard, are these divisions within the allies, from what you have gauged there in Davos?
QUEST: There -- well, it's a very good question. I've asked prime minister after commissioner after executive, you know, what about European unity?
And they all say, oh, no, Europe is united. Europe's united. And then, I say, oh, hang on, what about Germany not wanting to send tanks?
And what about Hungary who is playing ducks and drakes with money and wanting money before they'll agree to this. And what about and so on. And
so yes, there is unity. And they've done a tremendous job holding it together. And it's deep, the unity. But there are differences. And those
differences bubble up to the surface every now and again.
And as the Commissioner Gentiloni; the Economics Commissioner said to me. These things become even greater. These differences. At a time of economic
hardship when people say, why are we helping Ukraine so much?
SOARES: Yes --
QUEST: When there are so many problems at home.
SOARES: Well, it's clear that Ukraine is front and center. And those viewers who watch "QUEST MEANS BUSINESS" --
QUEST: Yes --
SOARES: Like myself will know that every year, when you're at Davos, Richard, you would normally have a board where you gauge what leaders --
QUEST: Right --
SOARES: CEOs, how they feel --
QUEST: And --
SOARES: What are you asking your guests this year?
QUEST: I'll take you to the board. Here we go.
(LAUGHTER)
It is the worry board. Now, we deliberately took climate crisis off the table for them. Not because we don't think it's important, but because we
knew everybody would default to it. So then, we've got global recession and inflation. Ukraine and energy crisis. COVID, China reopening and
democracies, the growth of democracy as all the problems.
In a quote -- and then you could write your own, Isa. Inequality or polarization is to them. At the moment, Ukraine and energy is in the lead.
One, two, three, four, five, six, seven, eight. Here's got, one, two, three, four, five, six, seven. But you know, Isa, as one person put it to
me, it's really a moot question. Because if this happens, then this happens --
SOARES: Yes --
QUEST: And so, what most people wanted to do was put two or three.
SOARES: Yes, I bet. I mean, in many ways, I would take probably Ukraine, energy crisis. But like you said they're so interlinked --
QUEST: Oh, hang on, hang on --
SOARES: Richard --
QUEST: Oh, hang on --
SOARES: I'm not sure I'm the caliber of any of your guests to get a tick - -
QUEST: Yes, well, never mind, I've just promoted you.
SOARES: I'll go for green --
QUEST: What color --
SOARES: I'll go for green --
QUEST: Do you want?
[14:15:00]
SOARES: Green, please.
QUEST: Oh, she wants green.
SOARES: Oh, it's so demanding.
QUEST: Right, which one? Which one are you going for?
SOARES: Ukraine, energy crisis. Ukraine. The second one, number two. Because it's so interlinked --
QUEST: They are, you're now on --
SOARES: With number one and everything else --
QUEST: You're on the board --
SOARES: Richard Quest, thank you very much. Richard will join us with "QUEST MEANS BUSINESS", be back in about 45 minutes or so. Thanks, Richard,
appreciate it. Now, we have more news from Davos ahead this hour. Microsoft CEO foreshadows some tough cuts to come. And a sharp shaming of the oil
giant.
They're accused of business practices at odds with the future of humanity. But do the companies even care? And then later, if you are a procrastinator
and chocked it up to just being lazy, we have news that might prove that you might really just be wrong or might be wrong. Have a look.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SOARES: Now, Microsoft plans to lay off 10,000 employees as part of its cost-cutting measures. That is according to securities filing by the tech
giant. At Davos this morning, Microsoft CEO Satya Nadella said his company had not been immune to a weaker global economy. Have a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SATYA NADELLA, CEO, MICROSOFT: No one can sort of defy gravity. And the gravity here is inflation-adjusted economic growth.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SOARES: And with climate change high on the agenda at Davos, U.N. Secretary General Antonio Guterres had some harsh words today for fossil
fuel producers. Guterres blasted the companies and their financial backers, saying their business practices threaten humanity. And he echoed a recent
report that claims ExxonMobil knew in the 1970s that global warming was coming, but publicly cast doubt on the science.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ANTONIO GUTERRES, SECRETARY-GENERAL, UNITED NATIONS: Today, fossil fuel producers and their enablers are still racing to expand production, knowing
full well that these business models is inconsistent with human survival.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SOARES: Antonio Guterres there. Well, his strong criticism comes even as the International Energy Agency, IAEA, predicts China's re-emergence after
COVID could push world oil consumption to a record high. And science is worrying into Greenland's ice are also issuing a dire finding about just
how warm it is getting.
[14:20:00]
CNN's chief climate correspondent Bill Weir is tracking all this for us. Bill, good to see you. So, just tell us, how warm is it getting in
Greenland? And what really is the knock-on effect, importantly for all of us?
BILL WEIR, CNN CHIEF CLIMATE CORRESPONDENT: Well, Isa, it's at least 1.5 degrees Celsius above average. It's the warmest in a 1,000 years, could be
the warmest since human civilization. And this goes back way before the Greenland Vikings there as well. As a result of studies that looked at core
samples, looked at the tiny pockets of gas and all the layers of ice.
Each year, it snows and adds another layer. And they can go back, the data just gets longer and proves what a lot of these scientists have been
warning, that the planet heated up by fossil fuels now is especially cooking the top of the globe. The Arctic is warming four times faster than
the rest.
And at the current rates, just Greenland's melt would add at about 50 centimeters to global sea level rise. Which would mean re-engineering every
port city in the world. So it's just further science and yet another red flag.
SOARES: And we knew this was happening. We're looking now at video from yourself, I believe in Greenland, 2022. Because we knew this was happening,
but I suspect we didn't have the data to back it up then. Is that right, Bill?
WEIR: Exactly. Like the scope and the fluctuation kind of hides the long- term trends there. So the more data is the better -- but yes, I was up there a couple of Summers ago. And these people getting this information,
this data for us, trying to warn us, risking their lives as it melts. With every drip, that job gets more dangerous.
Kind of stuff from famed glaciologist Fella Nograsika(ph) a couple of Summers ago. But the work continues and the data becomes even more
important.
SOARES: Yes, well, meanwhile, as you pretty well now, we have leaders meeting in Davos in Switzerland. Look, I've been on -- several occasioned
to Davos to cover World Economic Forum. And I have found kind of climate change is always the talker. And I think you've probably seen this too. But
action is very hard to measure at Davos.
We heard today from the U.N. chief -- but he didn't hold back, really criticizing kind of fossil fuel producers for what he called -- I'm reading
here, peddling a lie. A big lie, i should say. What did you make of what you heard from the U.N. chief?
WEIR: Well, yes, the new study that they looked at, you know. The Exxon scientists in the '70s and '80s were really good. They had really precise
predictions as to what was going to happen and what we're seeing now. That could end up as evidence in the 20 trials against big oil in the United
States, and there are others around the world.
What's going to change the social license of this? We live in a carbon society, and most of the modern world does. It's really hard to change that
inertia. And it's much harder if the oil companies aren't helping. And what you're seeing now is a lot of green-washing, a lot of promises unkept there
as well.
But this -- climate change, the unfortunate thing for the crowd at Davos is really a class problem. It's the --
SOARES: Yes --
WEIR: Top 1 percent who consume and burn the most fuel, as much fuel as the bottom half of the globe's population. And so, that's a hard pill to
swallow for somebody who has worked to, you know, be able to get their private jet travel and all those sorts of things. So, it's a cultural
shift. But at least it's being talked about.
And a lot of folks at Davos may be thinking about the profit motive in a new transition to cleaner energy. To carbon removal. to cleaning up the
mess before it's too late. And that can hurt, every bit helps.
SOARES: Yes, I mean, the criticism from the many times I've been at Davos, I can tell you, Bill, is the fact that, you know, here we have world
leaders talking about climate change and putting an end to climate change, at the same time many getting private jets to get there, which talks
exactly to that 1 percent that you were talking about in the first place --
WEIR: Yes --
SOARES: Bill Weir, great to see you my friend, thank you very much --
WEIR: Likewise, Isa, thanks.
SOARES: Now, many of us procrastinate and beat ourselves up over it. Now, a new study says it's not because we're lazy. It says procrastinators are
probably one of these types. A perfectionist, the dreamer and the worrier or the defier, that's just to name a few as you can see there on your
screen.
For instance, are you great at planning, but dread sitting down to actually get work done? Or do you get bogged down by the what ifs and then avoid
making decisions. Well, you could be a dreamer or a worrier. Let's bring in Dr. Tara Narula for more on this study. Tara, great to have you on the
show.
Look, I'm intrigued by this study because at times, I feel like I procrastinate. But I am trying to understand why I do that. Because often,
I'm quite productive. So what is the reasoning as to why some procrastinate and others don't.
TARA NARULA, CARDIOLOGIST: So are you the dreamer or the worrier.
(LAUGHTER)
I think I'm the perfectionist, right.
SOARES: I don't know. I don't know yet, I'm hoping you could help me.
NARULA: Well, the study that we're going to talk about was actually a study of Swedish university students. They sampled about 3,000 students,
and they have them rate themselves on a procrastination scale, which is definitely something I had never heard of. And those who scored higher on
the procrastination scale, they followed them over about nine months.
[14:25:00]
Tended at the end of that year to report higher levels of mental health problems, worse economic situations, more upper body pain. So really more
negative outcomes associated with more procrastination. Now, it's unclear exactly what the link is related to, and this is not a cause effect study,
so there are a lot of limitations.
But certainly, the author suggested if we follow people longer than nine months who are procrastinators, we may see even more health effects or more
profound health effects than with this study. These associations were small. But it is interesting, especially interesting to figure out which
category you put yourself in.
They do say that most procrastinators are perfectionists, and it's really that fear of wanting to get everything perfect that holds you back. But
some of those other categories are interesting to read about as well.
SOARES: And as you were talking, we were seeing a graphic -- I'm asking my producer, Laura(ph), if you can bring it up again. That talked about really
some of the consequences. Because I found that sometimes when I'm a bit tired or they're stress-related that I tend to procrastinate more. So talk
to us about that.
NARULA: Yes, so that was what they found in the study. Those Swedish students who had those higher scores on that procrastination scale, when
they looked out about nine months later, those were some of the consequences that they also reported. So clearly, it does seem like there
are some link between procrastination and putting things off and what that might lead to down the road.
So it's important to try to identify if you do, do that and why you might do that, and then take the appropriate strategies to fix it. Some people
talk about visualization exercises to try to help you visualize the end goal game, and that might help you get there faster and more efficiently.
SOARES: I wonder if they ask a different group of people rather than students whether you would get a different result. That would --
NARULA: It's a good question --
SOARES: Have been really interesting, that would be very interesting. One thing, apparently, that I'm reading, another study that may help our mood
is being among nature. I mean, and my question was to my producer today, did we really need a study for this?
(LAUGHTER)
NARULA: Probably not. We were just talking about climate change. But this was another interesting study that took place in Finland. And In this
situation, they basically surveyed or interviewed about 6,000 individuals who lived in the three largest cities in Finland, and asked them about
their use of both green and blue spaces that were within 1 kilometer where they lived.
And those individuals that reported going to or frequenting green spaces. So meadows, parks, zoos, even cemeteries also ended up having reduction in
their use of certain medications. And those medications were blood pressure medications, mental health medications and asthma medications.
So, what's interesting here, Isa, is that just viewing nature. So if you have a view of a lake or a river, a park, did not seem to have this effect,
it actually required you to get up and go. And that's where we wonder what might the physiologic link be. Well, it's possible that just the physical
activity of going to a green space may be what is associated with the reduction in some of these medications that they reported. It may also be
stress reduction.
And so when you're in nature, you turn down your stress response, and that can have benefits on the body. And then socialization. So, when you're
around other people we know, that, that can be helpful to you. So it's another interesting study and more there to push us to get outside and get
our sneakers on.
SOARES: Absolutely, Dr. Tara Narula, really appreciate it, thank you very much.
NARULA: Thank you.
SOARES: And still to come tonight, I will be speaking to an adviser to Ukraine's President Zelenskyy about the tragic helicopter crash which
killed 14 people including the country's Interior Minister. Plus the former Russian mercenaries speaking out against the Wagner Group which he served
as a commander.
Now, he is seeking asylum, and he's telling the world why he quit. That is next. You are watching CNN.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[14:30:00]
(MUSIC PLAYING)
SOARES: Returning now to our top story and the tragic helicopter crash in Ukraine which has killed at least 14 people. Among, them six members of
Ukraine's interior ministry, including the interior minister himself.
I'm joined by Tymofiy Mylovanov. He's an adviser to President Zelenskyy, the former minister of the economy and trade in Ukraine and a well known
face here on the show.
Timothy, Great to have you on the show. Let me start first of all with this tragic helicopter accident.
What are you hearing from your contacts as to what happened here?
TYMOFIY MYLOVANOV, ADVISER TO THE OFFICE OF PRESIDENT ZELENSKYY: Tragedy and, for now, no definitive theory. Basically the three standard theories
are all being investigated -- sabotage, technical error, human error.
And although there is no immediate or preliminary indication of any foul play. So the police and the investigators, the security services of Ukraine
are asking all witnesses to come forward and provide information. But frankly, everyone is overwhelmed.
SOARES: And not surprising, given the number of people who have been killed, including a child as well. I believe, Timothy, you knew the
interior ministry -- interior minister. So my condolences for myself and the team, first of all.
Talk to us, Timothy, about him.
What was he like?
How critical was his role as the war intensified?
MYLOVANOV: As a person, he was very soft-spoken and polished but in a genuine way. This is very rare for a interior minister, at least in
Ukraine. So he was very empathetic and he was -- he would come across as a very friendly person. He made a lot of friends in politics, which is not
the case.
During the war, I don't know the inner working of specific projects which were difficult and tough. But I can -- a lot of it is classified but I can
give you a couple of examples that I have seen.
For example, in the beginning of the, war there were a lot of checkpoints. And we continue to have checkpoints throughout the country. These
checkpoints were manned by the territorial defense.
And territorial defense, they're not professional military. They're new recruits during war or immediately before the war. So as the war
progressed, there was a lot of frustration and standard issues with untrained. People started coming up at these checkpoints.
The minister of the interior softly, very smoothly, introduced police at all of these checkpoints. And all the issues disappeared almost without
instance.
And today, I'm still less afraid of a Ukrainian police officer or a territorial defense officer stopping me at the checkpoint during a curfew
than I would be of being pulled over by a police officer let's say in Pennsylvania.
SOARES: His role critically instrumental.
[14:35:00]
SOARES: Where does this leave the interior ministry?
What next for the government here?
MYLOVANOV: The challenge here, that the top officials have been killed in the crash, the minister, the first deputy minister and the state secretary,
these are the three most high-ranked officials.
Of, course there's continuity and the strength of Ukraine and the resistance, resilience. Both of the military and the economy during war is
coming from a lot of horizontal connections, a lot of leadership and proactive position, proactive behavior of people at all kinds of ranks.
So I'm confident and I'm 100 percent sure that there are a lot of talented people who will rise to the challenge and fill in the shoes. But then there
is this question of transition and also the question of institutional detail, experience and information which was a --
(AUDIO GAP)
SOARES: Yes, I'm not sure whether we still have you, Timothy. I'm just going to check with our team.
Do you still have us, Timothy?
(CROSSTALK)
SOARES: Let me ask you about what we heard today from President Zelenskyy. He was addressing the World Economic Forum at Davos. He said that it wasn't
an accident; it was caused by war.
How do you interpret what you heard?
MYLOVANOV: I agree with the president of Ukraine, that every victim today is a victim of war. Albeit the child doesn't receive proper care because
the emergency personnel and the paramedics are tending wounded.
But here, too, these guys were on a trip to the front lines to a hot spot. If there was no war, this trip would not have happened. Probably, if we
didn't have a, war there will be much more attention, much more resources devoted to maintenance.
People would have been better rested. And God forbid, if it was sabotage, it wouldn't have happened. So all three fears of a potential fear is under
the crash, they would be much less likely to happen, had it not been for the war.
SOARES: Tymofiy Mylovanov, really appreciate your taking the time to speak with us. Appreciate it. Thank you.
Russia's foreign minister says the U.S., NATO and the European Union are unfairly persecuting Russia, comparing them to the Nazis as well. Here is
what Sergey Lavrov had to say.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SERGEY LAVROV, RUSSIAN FOREIGN MINISTER (through translator): Just as Napoleon mobilized almost the whole of Europe against the Russian empire,
as Hitler mobilized, captured and enlisted the majority of European countries and deployed them against the Soviet Union, so it is the same
now.
United States have created a coalition which includes almost all of Europe, that are NATO members and E.U. members as well. Using Ukraine, they're
waging a war against our country with the same task. The final solution to the Russian question, just as Hitler wanted a final solution to the Jewish
question.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SOARES: That incendiary comment comes after he called a meeting between heads of the Russian and U.S. intelligence agencies useful.
A Russian human rights groups says security forces are cracking down on people who are honoring Ukrainian victims of a Russian missile attack. The
monitoring group of OVD (INAUDIBLE) police detained four people who laid flowers at this makeshift memorial in Moscow.
This war memorial popped up days after a missile struck an apartment complex in Dnipro, Ukraine, killing at least 45 people.
A former Russian mercenary is now seeking asylum in Norway after fleeing the war in Ukraine.
The lawyer for Andrei Medvedev tells CNN possible war crimes charges for his client is, quote, "a thought that is unavoidable," although Medvedev
denies committing any crimes. The ex soldier for hire speaking of grim new allegations about how Russia treats prisoners fighting and dying in its
war. Our Nic Robertson has the story for you.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
NIC ROBERTSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL DIPLOMATIC EDITOR (voice-over): Andrei Medvedev is lucky to be alive. The former Wagner eunuch commander says he
fled Russia in a daring Arctic escape, dodging bullets and dogs across a frozen river to Norway.
ANDREI MEDVEDEV, FORMER WAGNER MERCENARY (through translator): I've been chased. I'm afraid for my life.
ROBERTSON (voice-over): Afraid, he says, because he has witnessed the murderous atrocities in Ukraine committed in the name of his ex-boss,
Wagner oligarch Yevgeny Prigozhin, aka Putin chef and he wants to tell all. Russians killing Russians, some of them former prisoners freed from Russian
jails to fight for Wagner.
MEDVEDEV (through translator): I know cases where prisoners were demonstratively shot dead for refusing to fight or for betrayal. They were
showing fighters here, this is what will happen to you.
[14:40:00]
ROBERTSON (voice-over): He says he joined Wagner in July last year, signed up for four months for near Bakhmut and eastern Ukraine.
But when Prigozhin began recruiting former prisoners to swell Wagner's ranks, Medvedev saw a deadly change. Wanted out as his contract ended but
wasn't allowed to quit.
MEDVEDEV (through translator): Since the moment the prisoners have come to serve with us, strange things and murders of their own recruited prisoners
by the Wagner security service and foolish orders, such as sending us to die as cannon fodder started to happen.
ROBERTSON (voice-over): He is the highest-ranking Wagner fighter to flee to the West. His eyewitness account of Prigozhin's murderous practices in
Ukraine is revelatory.
VLADIMIR OSECHKIN, HUMAN RIGHTS ACTIVIST: He is really targeted for the Russian special forces or security service from Wagner group. It's a very
high risk of die.
ROBERTSON (voice-over): Human rights activist Vladimir Osechkin helped Medvedev escape. Has made sure his story gets out.
OSECHKIN: It's very important to do the international investigation about this. It's very important to open this information to the Russian people to
understand what has happened.
ROBERTSON (voice-over): Medvedev's biggest revelation will likely be the most damaging to Putin and Prigozhin's recruitment drives. Last month,
Prigozhin recorded this callous video purporting to pose in front of his dead fighters in body bags, claiming their contracts were complete and they
were on their way back home.
But Medvedev says he's seen the truth. Many fighters never making it home because Prigozhin is too cheap to pay out insurance on their death.
MEDVEDEV (through translator): The majority of the prisoners were buried and then declared missing. The insurance only pays out money to relatives
of the deceased if the body was identified and handed over to the relatives. So they were just declaring everyone as missing.
ROBERTSON: Right now, Medvedev is at a secure location in Norway, telling investigators every detail he can remember. He says he didn't commit a
crime and wants those responsible for the murders brought to justice -- Nic Robertson, CNN, London.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
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[14:45:00]
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SOARES: Welcome back, everyone.
A complication for Israeli prime minister Benjamin Netanyahu's new government. The country's top court says one of his key allies can't serve
as cabinet minister because of a conviction for tax fraud. The Shas party is a key part of the coalition. Hadas Gold joins us now from Jerusalem to
break this down.
He cannot become interior minister, according to the courts.
Where does this leave Netanyahu?
Will he accept, it or will he defy it?
HADAS GOLD, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: That's still the question everyone is asking. This was a bombshell, 10 to 1 supreme court ruling that
could have massive political and create a constitutional crisis for Netanyahu and for Israel.
This is in a country where already a battle has been brewing over the role of the judiciary in the supreme court. In practical terms they said Aryeh
Dery, who was convicted of tax fraud last year, he served a suspended sentence.
And in his plea bargain, he said he would step away from public office. So they cited that. There was actually a law in Israel that said that convicts
cannot serve in public office. But there was a bill passed in the last few weeks by the Netanyahu government called the Dery bill, essentially,
creating a caveat that was specific for him, that would allow him to serve as minister.
Yet the supreme court still struck this down.
So of course, the question is what will Netanyahu do?
Will he heed the court ruling or potentially not?
Could he be found in contempt of the supreme court?
Will Dery step down or be fired?
And will he potentially -- he could, if he wanted to, essentially destroy Netanyahu's government by pulling his party out of Netanyahu's coalition?
That is unlikely to happen. What is more likely to happen is it's only going to bring forward what we've already started to see in Israel, which
is this battle over the role of the judiciary.
Netanyahu and his government want to put forward a series of reforms, judicial reforms. One of them would essentially allow the parliament, which
will mean any party that's in power, to overturn supreme court rulings.
This has brought in 80,000 people into the streets on Saturday. We saw huge demonstrations in Tel Aviv because the opposition and those 80,000
protesters feel that these judicial changes will be essentially the beginning and the end of Israeli democracy.
The proponents of it say that its supreme balance between the three branches, that these are long needed reforms. But the opponents really see
this as a threat to Israeli democracy. But if those reforms go through, that could put the path forward not only for Netanyahu to get out of his
own corruption trial that's still ongoing possibly also for Dery to come back into power.
SOARES: Thanks very much, Hadas.
Still to come tonight, London's Met Police under fire after one of its number was omitted to dozens of sexual offenses. We will explain next.
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[14:50:00]
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SOARES: Journalist and Nobel laureate Maria Ressa has been acquitted of four tax evasion charges in the Philippines, charges she says were
politically motivated.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MARIA RESSA, EXECUTIVE EDITOR, RAPPLER: I think our victory, this victory, is not just Rappler's; it is for every single person who has been unjustly
accused with politically motivated charges.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SOARES: Her legal battles are not over, however. An additional tax charge still looms and she is appealing the conviction. Ressa, a former CNN bureau
chief, says she has been targeted because of media company and its critical coverage of the former Philippine president, Rodrigo Duterte.
Britain's home secretary says the government will do all it can to root out predatory behavior from police ranks. This as outrage grows after a
Metropolitan Police officer admitted to 49 offenses, including 24 rapes, over an 18-year period.
The condemnation is heavy, with many wondering just why it took so long for action to be taken, as part of her suggested measures, home secretary
Suella Braverman suggested all police officers in this country should be checked against a national database.
I am joined now by former Met Police superintendent Parm Sandhu.
Parm, why weren't they being checked and vetted in the first place?
PARM SANDHU, FORMER CHIEF SUPERINTENDENT, METROPOLITAN POLICE: This man, the sexual predator, who has got 49 offenses against him, slipped through
that net. Apparently he was vetted when he joined in 2001.
Then he was vetted again and he was actually given a firearm in the U.K. We don't carry firearms routinely. So he had to go through that extra vetting
he's passed. Unfortunately, what that vetting procedure does, it relies on the candidate to tell the truth.
And if you've got somebody who has got this mindset and balance, this violent behavior, they're not going to tell the truth. So he slipped
through the net. The Metropolitan Police did have nine opportunities where they could have dealt with him and arrested him, put him before the courts.
And they were all missed opportunities.
SOARES: The man you're talking about, the man who devastated so many women's lives over two decades, his name is David Carrick. He was vetted
several times.
Who does the vetting?
I was just reading from my notes, they are supposedly vetted every 7-10 years but who is in charge of the vetting process here?
SANDHU: Each force does their own vetting, so it's all in-house. And when allegations are made, as well, they are dealt with inhouse. And we need
radical reform here.
One of those solutions is going to be to take that vetting and also the complaints investigation away from the police services, so that an
independent person can look at it.
This man had a nickname and I won't repeat it on air. But he had a nickname. He would have earned that nickname, which means that the people
who were working with him knew he had some sort of tendencies which should have been picked up. Even his nickname should have rung alarm bells and it
didn't.
SOARES: Are you surprised at all this happened?
Have you seen an embedded culture of misogyny?
Have you experienced it?
SANDHU: I've written a whole book about it called "Black and Blue." I've seen it, experienced it and, unfortunately, the culture of The Met enables
these macho individuals to get away with it. They call it banter.
And when you try to challenge it, they say you can't take a joke or you're not part of the team. And it's really difficult, because you then become
the victim and you become the demonized, the intimidated individual.
SOARES: We have reported here on the show on the kidnap and rape, as well as murder of several during lockdown by then serving Met Police officer.
How much has this eroded The Met's reputation, can we still reach trust here?
SANDHU: Trust and confidence has really taken a hit and it's going to take many years for that to be restored. The problem is that another 800
officers have been identified in The Met, who have got these allegations against them.
[14:55:00]
SANDHU: At the moment, the prime minister, the home secretary, the commissioner are all in talks in how to deal with this quickly and get
these people out because they shouldn't have (INAUDIBLE) and they certainly shouldn't power over anybody.
SOARES: We really appreciate you taking time to speak with us, thank you.
SANDHU: Thank you.
SOARES: Staying here in the U.K., thousands of nurses walked out again on Wednesday in a new two day strike. Nurses from 55 National Health Service
Trust say they are short staffed and do not make enough money to make ends meet. Some say they had to turn to food banks.
They are asking for a 90 percent pay increase. The government say the demands are unaffordable but we will continue to keep a close eye on this
story on the show, as part of the wide variety of social pressures facing the U.K.
That does it for us on this hour, thanks very much for your company. Stay right here, "QUEST MEANS BUSINESS" with Richard Quest, live from Davos is
up next. We'll see you tomorrow, goodbye.
END
