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Isa Soares Tonight
Negotiations Continue Between The U.S. And Iran; Clean-Up Effort Begins In Kyiv After Russia Hits The City With A Hypersonic Ballistic Missile; Two People In Italy Now Being Tested For Ebola Virus After Returning From Uganda; Netanyahu: Israel To Step Up Attacks On Hezbollah In Lebanon; Iran: "Degree Of Understanding" Reached, No Imminent Deal; Mexico To Allow Iran To Stay In Tijuana During World Cup. Aired 2-3p ET
Aired May 25, 2026 - 14:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[14:00:00]
ISA SOARES, HOST, ISA SOARES TONIGHT: A very warm welcome to the show, everyone, I'm Isa Soares. Tonight, one step forward, one step back.
Negotiations continue between the U.S. and Iran, with officials telling CNN, the two sides are working to resolve language disputes or nuclear
issues and sanctions.
Then, the clean-up effort begins in Kyiv after Russia hits the city with a hypersonic ballistic missile. We'll have the latest on that attack for you.
Plus, could Europe have its first Ebola cases? Two people in Italy are being -- now being tested for the virus after returning from Uganda. We'll
have that and much more ahead for you.
But first, tonight, both the U.S. and Iran said they've made some progress toward a potential peace deal. But the reality is that, yet again, we are
reporting on talks -- about talks with the two sides apparently working through a process to get to a process.
Iran's Foreign Ministry says a degree of understanding has been reached between the two countries, but stressed that a deal is not imminent. U.S.
President Donald Trump says negotiations with Tehran are proceeding nicely.
Major sticking points remain, including the future of Iran's nuclear program. In an encouraging sign, a source tells CNN, Iran's chief
negotiator and its Foreign Minister are in Qatar for talks. So, a lot for us to get through.
Joining me now is CNN politics senior reporter Stephen Collinson and our Jeremy Diamond, as you can see there, joins us this hour from Tel Aviv.
Stephen, let me start with you this evening. Look, it seems from what we've heard from both sides, they seem to be tempering expectations.
But there is confusion and there's also skepticism, you know, and I think I want to start with the confusion part, because quite frankly, we are
confused because we're now hearing that President Trump brought up the Abraham Accords in passing during a call with regional leaders on Saturday
and encouraged their country to join.
But it did not raise it -- from our reporting suggests is a condition of the Iran -- of the Iran deal. So, which one is it?
STEPHEN COLLINSON, CNN POLITICS SENIOR REPORTER: Yes, the whole issue of the Abraham Accords seems quite extraordinary because the United States has
struggled to get to first base with a deal with Iran.
As you say, they're talking about talks, the leaks that have come out of those talks suggest that any deal will just be about the Strait of Hormuz,
ending the U.S. blockade, perhaps some re- unfreezing of Iranian assets to get to the point where they can talk what this is really about, which is
the Iranian nuclear program.
Introducing this whole idea as President Trump did, about an expansion of the Abraham Accords, his first-term legacy achievement with four Arab
nations, which was a normalization with Israel, introduces a whole new area of complexity that it would seem very difficult for the United States to be
able to deliver.
You know, this idea that seven Arab states would then -- and Muslim states would join the Abraham Accords as part of this Iran deal. I mean, that is
something that would be almost impossible, I think, to imagine from the political perspective of those states in Iran.
States like Saudi Arabia, which have made the resolution of the Palestinian question, or at least, a path to statehood, a condition of them joining
those, Accords. And I think it does show perhaps, that critics will question whether the United States and the President really does have a
realistic view of what the politics and conditions are in the Middle East, in the gulf after this war.
A war that the United States started, a war that many of those states didn't want, and which have created huge instability in the region and
great uncertainty.
SOARES: Yes, and we'll talk about the politics of -- the domestic politics from -- for President Trump in just a moment. Let me go to Tel Aviv and get
a sense from Jeremy, because, you know, as we were hearing there, Stephen just mentioned, you know, "we know the U.S., we know that Israel have made
the removal of Iran's stocks of highly-enriched uranium. Jeremy, a key war aim.
What this -- could this mean for Israel and for Prime Minister Netanyahu? Netanyahu, what kind of reaction are you getting?
[14:05:00]
JEREMY DIAMOND, CNN JERUSALEM CORRESPONDENT: Well, there's no question that the Israeli Prime Minister, you know, kind of started last week believing
that the U.S. and Iran and Israel were going to go back to war against Iran.
Then, he had a very tense phone call with President Trump in the middle of last week, where he told him he thought it was a mistake to call off that
planned attack and then come full circle to this weekend with the Prime Minister learning that there is this deal that is in the final stages of
being negotiated in which he was not involved and very much on the sidelines.
And so now it becomes a face-saving maneuver for the Israeli Prime Minister. And what we've seen from him so far has been, you know, a lengthy
post on social media in which he basically tries to claim that there's no daylight between the Israeli and the American position, that they're both
committed to the long-term goal of Iran not having a nuclear weapon.
The one thing that he does claim basically as, you know, a feather in his cap is the notion that President Trump greenlit Israel's freedom of action
as it relates to any potential threats, including in Lebanon, which basically would mean a continuation of what we've seen in the current
ceasefire in Lebanon, which is daily Israeli strikes there.
And basically, strikes as Israel sees fit. And that could pose a problem as it relates to the broader deal with Iran, in the same way that we saw it
posed a problem in the first days of the current ceasefire that exists between the United States and Iran.
But that's the lens through which I see this Abraham Accords stuff that President Trump is talking about. You know, it's hard to imagine that he
believes that this is feasible for Saudi Arabia and Qatar simply as a result of this mediation process with Iran to go ahead and enter the
Abraham Accords with nothing additional to be gained.
Instead, I think it makes more sense to view it through the lens of mollifying some of the criticism that President Trump has faced
domestically over this, but also basically offering up something to Prime Minister Netanyahu and his Israeli audience that he is dealing with as
well.
Basically, trying to suggest that if they, you know, you get this deal done, a deal that is very unpopular in Israel right now, then perhaps it
could lead to better outcomes for Israel long-term in the region at large. But again, that seems very unlikely, at least, in the short-to-medium term.
SOARES: Stay with us, Jeremy. Let me go back to Stephen. And like I was mentioning, Stephen, I'm keen to get the domestic aspect of this. I'm not
sure whether you saw one of the articles in the "FT" today, "Financial Times" that read, the headline was, "Iran is beating Trump at the art of
the deal".
How is this being discussed in the United States? I know that there's some -- there are some Republicans that are concerned that Trump may be about to
cave. I know Roger Wicker, if we have his tweet on X, he was talking about that this could risk a perception of weakness.
We've also heard, I believe, from the North Carolina Senator, Thom Tillis. This is -- this is Wicker, of course, Senator Roger Wicker there. That last
line, we must finish what we started. It's pass for action. A perception of weakness is the line I was mentioning.
We also heard from Carolina Senator Thom Tillis. I want to play this. Have a listen to what he said.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. THOM TILLIS (R-NC): We were told about 11 weeks ago by Hegseth and the Department of Defense that they had obliterated Iran's defenses. And it was
just a matter of time before we had the nuclear material.
Now, we're talking about a posture where we may accept the nuclear material remaining in Iran. How does that make sense at all? Also, a 60-day
ceasefire and expecting that they're going to clear the Strait of Hormuz before the terms of the deal are established also seems questionable to me.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SOARES: So, plenty of skepticism and confusion, Stephen.
COLLISON: Yes, and I think one key question that's now emerging in Washington as this deal apparently comes closer to being agreed is whether
the United States is going to get out of this enormously costly war, which has led to the deaths of 13 Americans, many more Iranian civilians, caused
massive disruption.
In any better place regarding Iran and its nuclear program and its hostility to the United States in the region, than when it went into it. I
think that is what a lot of the criticism, not just from hawkish Republicans is about, but it's coming from Democrats who have all along
accused Trump of fighting this war on poor pretenses and absolutely botching it.
And now, they think he's going to botch the outcome. Thom Tillis is an interesting case. He is a Republican who is not running for re-election,
and he has become one of the big sources of opposition to Trump on Capitol Hill on this and other issues.
And President Trump is also facing revolts over some of his domestic initiatives from Republicans right now. So, although he's recently
demonstrated great control over the GOP in primary races, his ability to force the Republicans to do what they want on Capitol Hill is eroding.
[14:10:00]
And I think Jeremy was right when he said that this talk of the Abraham Accords might be an attempt to also mollify some of these Republicans who
have been criticizing the prospect of a deal with Iran. One of them, for example, Lindsey Graham, a close Trump ally, a real Republican hawk.
He criticized the possibility of this framework agreement that was emerging and some of its supposed conditions. But he got behind this call for these
seven Arab nations and Muslim nations to join the Abraham Accords. So, I think you have a little bit of political damage control domestically going
on as well.
SOARES: Such important background there, appreciate it. Thank you very much, Stephen and Jeremy, for us there in Tel Aviv. And in around what?
Twenty minutes or so, I'll be speaking to Sina Azodi; the author of "Iran and the Bomb: The U.S., Iran and the Nuclear Question".
I'll be asking him about his take on these very negotiations and what he's hearing from those inside Iran. You don't want to miss that conversation.
Well, terrified civilians are sheltering underground. Rescue crews are frantic to help the victims in Europe is in outcry mode.
That's what's playing out after one of Russia's biggest airstrikes on the Ukrainian capital and its surrounding regions since Moscow's full-scale
invasion began.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
(BOMB EXPLOSION)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SOARES: We're hearing that at least, four people have been killed and 87 wounded in the massive weekend bombardment. Russia unleashed a hypersonic
ballistic missile, that's nearly impossible for Ukraine to stop, sparking an outcry from France, Germany and indeed from many others.
I want to bring in global affairs analyst Michael Bociurkiw; who is also Senior Fellow at the Atlantic Council and Founder of the "World Briefing
Report" on "Substack". Michael, great to see you. Great to have you back on the show.
Look, from what I understand, I'm sure you can add some meat to the bones here. Russia has only used, right, the Oreshnik missile a handful of times.
So, how significant is this, and why deploy it now, Michael?
MICHAEL BOCIURKIW, SENIOR FELLOW, ATLANTIC COUNCIL & WORLD BRIEFING REPORT, SUBSTACK: Good to be back with you, Isa. Yes, this is the third time Russia
has deployed this hypersonic missile.
Once was in Dnipro, I believe in western Ukraine, and now Bila Tserkva; a city south of Kyiv. I think this was a way for the Putin regime to scare
Ukraine to probably taunt western allies that -- and also for domestic consumption as well, Isa, to show that Russia is strong and has this
capability.
Let's not forget this is a nuclear capable missile. And I recall Mr. Putin some months ago, bragging about it, saying that when it -- when it hits its
target, it creates a temperature of several thousand degrees centigrade, can pulverize anything.
You know, it isn't only the Oreshnik missile that we're thinking about. It's actually where the missiles and drones struck. A red line has been
crossed this time. Big time hitting the government quarter in Kyiv. The cabinet of ministers building, Ministry of Foreign Affairs was damaged.
Maidan Square, the very symbolic square of Ukrainian patriotism. And also, and this is a sickening actually, they pretty much destroyed the Chernobyl
Museum in central Kyiv, after causing that nuclear disaster in 1986, after sending a drone into the sarcophagus of protecting Chernobyl, after digging
up soil at Chernobyl in February 2022, they do this horrible stuff on top of the deaths and injuries, of course.
SOARES: Absolutely, is incredibly horrible. And like you said, sickening just to see -- to see this and the magnitude of something like this. I want
to play for you, Michael, a clip from -- we heard in the last hour or so from the Ukrainian ambassador to the U.S. Have a listen to what she said.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
OLGA STEFANISHYNA, UKRAINIAN AMBASSADOR TO THE U.S.: It was not only the -- one of the most brutal attacks to Ukrainian cities. It has also -- has been
attacked with the unprecedented amount of ballistics used.
And this is done exactly because Russians account on the further shortages in ammunition we would face because of the operation in Iran. And they know
very well, you know, some of the elements of the air defense, which are un- substitutable with any other means than that.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SOARES: So, Michael, I mean, is Russian -- do you think Russia is adapting its missile tactics to overcome Ukrainian defenses?
BOCIURKIW: Yes, definitely, of the 90 or so missiles that came inward to Kyiv, only about half were downed, and the government has made it clear
that they are short on Patriot Missile Systems that could intercept these fast-flying missiles.
[14:15:00]
However, you know, it boggles the mind, Isa, that as all of this is happening right at the same time, Ukraine's so-called allies, U.K. France,
Spain, Italy, and my country of Canada have scuppered a deal proposed by the NATO Secretary-General that would have pretty much tripled annual
military aid to Ukraine from NATO.
So, it would have gone from $45 billion a year to $143 billion. It's only a 0.2 percent of GDP for each of these countries. So, you know, if you're
going to put out the rhetoric and say, this is terrible, we have to defend Ukraine.
But at the -- on the other hand, your checkbook remains closed. That's a big problem for Ukraine because it needs that money desperately to protect
itself, to protect civilians.
SOARES: Yes, especially when we heard President Zelenskyy saying today, it's vital that this doesn't go unpunished. Interesting to see how --
BOCIURKIW: Yes --
SOARES: What allies say and how allies step in. We did -- we did hear from the EU's Foreign Policy chief Kaja Kallas, who said today, Russia hit a
dead-end on the battlefield, so it terrorizes Ukraine with deliberate strikes on city centers."
I mean, is this confidence by Russia or is it pressure? Because we have seen, Michael, and speak to this, if you can. We have seen significant
gains by Ukraine on the battlefield as of late.
BOCIURKIW: Yes, she's right. And, you know, I think what has really upset the Kremlin is that Ukraine has fine-tuned its strikes into Russia, into
the oil refinery. So, it's not only hitting the outer areas, but also the guts, the very stuff that is very difficult to replace because of
sanctions.
So, I think that's very much upset the Kremlin, and they're striking back. And also, they're creating propaganda shows in occupied territories in
Ukraine. Ukraine has hit civilian structures there. But you know, Isa, I have to also point out, because one of the reasons I'm here in Canada, I've
given two talks to diaspora community here is that after being in the ground -- on the ground for so long in Ukraine, Ukrainians are broken.
They're really hurting inside. And this goes right down to journalists as well that you see every day on air. I really feel for them. So, it is very
important that this war ends soon, because I'm also worried about the demographic hollowing out of Ukraine when these big strikes happen.
But this cannot, of course, happen at any cost. Ukraine cannot give up territory, and it really needs to stick to the demands that it's put
forward to the Russians.
SOARES: Yes, the diplomatic solution was so far away from this, Michael here is hoping --
BOCIURKIW: Yes --
SOARES: Michael Bociurkiw, always great to see you, Michael, thank you very much indeed. Well, we're going to turn our attention to Europe because
Europe may have its first Ebola cases in the current outbreak.
Two people in Italy have been hospitalized after showing symptoms. They both recently returned to Italy after several months as aid workers in
Uganda. Italian officials are stressing that the risk of wider spread in Italy is low.
And all of this comes as the World Health Organization warns Ebola spreading faster than it can keep up with it in Uganda and the Democratic
Republic of Congo. Barbie Latza Nadeau is tracking the story for us from Rome.
So, Barbie, give us a sense of first, who -- if we know their names and when they left DRC, when exactly? Because we've been talking so much about
this and how there are controls, right? Flight controls to get a better sense of the timeline here.
BARBIE LATZA NADEAU, CNN REPORTER: Yes, you know, we don't have their names. And it would be a matter of privacy, I guess, as well with that. But
we know that two individuals have been hospitalized because they had what the Health Ministry is calling fever symptoms after arriving in Uganda.
We do not know when they came back, but I think telling is the fact that their family members are also being monitored, which would suggest that
they spent time with their family members. They didn't go straight to the hospital.
Now, Italy is well-equipped for containment, for monitoring, and the Health Ministry has been very clear about saying that they have got them in the
best place they can be in the Sacco Hospital in Milan, which has an incredible biocontainment unit, and that there's no -- or let's say, little
risk.
They didn't say no risk. There's little risk to the Italian public. Now, everybody is watching and waiting to try to understand if they'll be tested
positive for this or not. And that should come -- and we should have that information in the coming days.
But there's a lot that people don't understand about Ebola, and there's a lot that people here in Europe and here in Italy are just going to look at
this with fear. You know, you cannot help think about COVID and how this -- Italy --
SOARES: Yes --
NADEAU: Was the first epicenter after China when that pandemic happened. So, there's that fear, but the Health Ministry, I think important too, is
being very transparent.
[14:20:00]
We got a very lengthy bulletin from them today outlining what happened. You know, the news, all the Italian news was going wild, they right away put
out this bulletin to explain the procedures, and the emergency procedure is in operation.
There's a hospital here in Rome, there's a hospital in Pavia, and there's a hospital in Milan that have these biocontainment units. So, for what we
don't know, I think what we're trying to be assured by the Health Ministry is, there's nothing to worry about yet anyway, Isa.
SOARES: I know you'll stay across -- just a correction, of course, they arrived, the aid workers arrived from Uganda, not DRC. Thank you for
correcting me, Barbie. Good to see you, Barbie Nadeau for us.
Well, the world has been focused on the Ebola outbreak in Africa and the hantavirus that spread on a cruise ship. A far-more widespread medical
disaster has been unfolding in Bangladesh. The U.N. says there have been almost 60,000 suspected cases of measles there, resulting in close to 600
deaths, the vast majority of them, young children.
After recent disruptions in routine immunization, the Bangladeshi government has now launched an emergency vaccination campaign. We'll stay
across this story for you. And still to come tonight, a stark warning from the Vatican. Why Pope Leo is challenging Silicon Valley's so-called tech
bro culture. A report just ahead.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SOARES: Well, in Rome, Pope Leo is offering a stark warning about warfare in the age of artificial intelligence. In his first major teaching letter,
seen as a landmark for his papacy, the pontiff says control of A.I. must not remain in the hands of a few. Our Christopher Lamb reports now from
Rome.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
CHRISTOPHER LAMB, CNN VATICAN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): A pope weighing in on the debate over artificial intelligence. Leo XIV wants the church's
voice heard on what he sees as a revolution, taking the unprecedented step of personally presenting an encyclical letter on the issues. One of the
highest forms of papal teaching.
ROBERT FRANCIS PREVOST, POPE, ROMAN CATHOLIC CHURCH: Artificial Intelligence needs to be disarmed. The word is strong, I know. But
deliberately chosen because this moment needs words capable of attracting attention, awakening consciences and indicating paths forward for humanity.
LAMB: Doing so alongside Chris Olah, a Co-Founder of Anthropic; the leading A.I. firm which has been in a legal dispute with the Trump administration.
[14:25:00]
An ethical and human-centered development of A.I. is a top priority for the American pope, who is known to be tech savvy. At the heart of his plea and
insistence that technology cannot replace the quote, "grandeur of humanity, nor take the place of God or personal conscience." And that A.I. should not
be controlled by a powerful few and warning about its use in war.
Leo wants to influence those responsible for the new tech. After a ten-year dialogue between the Vatican and Silicon Valley over A.I.
(On camera): The Pope sees A.I. as raising more than just technical questions. He sees it as asking profound ones about what it means to be
human. Now, in the past, the Catholic Church has made mistakes entering into scientific debate.
But Pope Leo believes that faith and science, while asking different questions, shouldn't be in opposition, but help one another.
PREVOST: And may the blessing of --
LAMB (voice-over): This encyclical likely to be a landmark text for Leo's papacy, a pope seeking to address a defining issue of the age. Christopher
Lamb, CNN, Rome.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SOARES: And still to come tonight, the war and the World Cup. How Iran's football team is dealing with the U.S., saying, you are not welcome here.
That is next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SOARES: Welcome back, everyone. Well, there are signs Washington and Tehran are inching toward a possible peace agreement to end the war, a deal does
not appear to be right around the corner. Iran today acknowledged there is, quote, "a degree of understanding with U.S. on many issues."
That includes control over the Strait of Hormuz, but stressed a deal is not imminent. U.S. President Donald Trump says any potential agreement will be
the exact opposite, his words, of the one forged by former President Barack Obama more than a decade ago.
Meantime, the commander of Tehran's Revolutionary Guard claims Iran is stronger and better-equipped now than it was on the first day of the war.
And this just coming into us in the last few moments. Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu says he's ordering the military to step up
attacks on Hezbollah in Lebanon.
[14:30:06]
Fighting has continued for weeks between Israel and the Shia fighters allied, of course, with Iran and that's a spice ceasefire extension, so
hopes of a deal with Lebanon's government. Israeli ground troops are also occupying parts of southern Lebanon and then that's intensified even today.
We've seen Israeli warplanes across the area.
Let's say with this, joined by Sina Azodi, he's a director of the Middle East Studies Program at George Washington University. He's also the author
of "Iran and the Bomb: The United States, Iran and the Nuclear Question." Sina, welcome to the show.
Let me first get your take on this news that's coming in to us that Prime Minister Netanyahu of Israel says he's ordering his military to step up
attacks on Hezbollah in Lebanon. How do you see this move? In light, of course, of negotiations with Iran.
SINA AZODI, DIRECTOR, MIDDLE EAST STUDIES PROGRAM, GEORGE WASHINGTON UNIVERSITY: Well, I think the Prime Minister of Israel would like to see
the conflict to continue, especially since the Iranians have argued that any agreement should involve ending hostilities at all fronts and that, of
course, includes Lebanon. So, it would make it more difficult for President Trump to reach a deal with Iranians at a time when there are hostilities in
southern Lebanon.
Again, we have to keep in mind that President Trump and Prime Minister Netanyahu enjoy a special relationship, but this will not serve President
Trump's agenda, which is an end -- which is to bring an end to the hostilities.
SOARES: Right. So, what you're saying, Sina, correct me if I'm misunderstanding wrong, but this is a strategic move, you're saying, by
Prime Minister Netanyahu to scupper any sort of movement on this deal. We have seen Iran's chief negotiator, the foreign minister and central bank
governor in Qatar for talks. I mean, I take that suggests to me that they're going to try and scupper that?
AZODI: It could be. Absolutely, it could be. Because as I said, it is very important for Iranians to end the hostilities. It's not because of
ideological reasons. Their purpose is to have a clean slate where they don't -- they won't be dragged into yet another conflict because of
hostilities in Lebanon.
SOARES: Let's talk then about this memorandum of understanding. We'll talk about the detail in just a moment, but how is it being received in Tehran?
Give us a sense of the wording, of what you're hearing about this memorandum of understanding.
AZODI: There are many conflicting reports, but regardless, Iranians are portraying it as a victory for the Islamic Republic. They think it shows
their strengths. And from some of the messaging that we see from Tehran, their insistence on maintaining sovereignty over the Strait of Hormuz,
charging a toll, which they're not calling a toll, they're calling it environmental fees. It really tells us that they think they have the upper
hand, they can outlast President Trump, and they want to at least portray that they're coming to the negotiation table with the upper hand.
SOARES: Environmental fee. Well, that's interesting, for sure, Sina. Let's talk a bit more about the memorandum, because from what I understand, it
would stop the fight. It would gradually open the Strait of Hormuz, and then it basically sets off a process of 60 days to negotiate other issues,
from what I understand. That includes Iran's nuclear program.
60 days, that's it. I mean, under Obama, it required, what, 20 months of negotiation. How realistic is this 60-day timeline?
AZODI: Yes. And I will add one more quick thing, based on what I've seen. Iranians are saying that they're going to open the Strait of Hormuz in 30
days after reaching the deal, which is not something that President Trump wants. He wants it immediately.
But on the nuclear deal, as you pointed out, it will be a very tedious negotiations between Iranians and Americans, because you need technical
details to be hammered out. You have to keep in mind that JCPOA, which was signed 10 years ago, was 150 pages of technical details of Iran's actions
on the nuclear front, and the actions that the Europeans and the United States reciprocated in response to Iran's actions.
[14:35:00]
But this is not the method that President Trump prefers, as you know. He likes it very short and sweet, one-page memorandum of understandings. So,
it will be very difficult to do so.
But I think, again, if Iran and the United States reach an agreement over the principle of enrichment in Iran, which Iran insists that it must have,
I think most of the problems will be resolved, and I think peace will be at hand.
SOARES: Here's hoping. Sina Azodi, really appreciate you coming on the show. Thank you very much indeed.
Iran's World Cup team will spend as little time in the U.S. as possible during the World Cup. Mexico has agreed to allow Iran's World Cup team to
stay in the city of Tijuana, which is close to the US-Mexico border. Iran is still due to play all of its matches in U.S. cities, two in Los Angeles
and one in Seattle. But Mexican President Claudia Sheinbaum says the U.S. do not want to host the Iranian team. Have a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CLAUDIA SHEINBAUM, MEXICAN PRESIDENT (through translator): The Iranian team is going to play in the United States. I think they have three matches in
the qualifying round. So, the Iranian team's three matches are in the United States. The United States does not want the Iranian team to stay
overnight, but they are going to play three matches there. So, they asked us, can they stay overnight in Mexico? And we said, yes, no problem. We
have no problem.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SOARES: Let's go to our Don Riddell, of CNN World Support with more on this. So, Don, politics and football mixing once again. Why not host them
given that they're playing in U.S. cities anyway?
DON RIDDELL, CNN WORLD SPORT: Well, that's a very good question. But of course, there is a war going on. And we know how complicated the situation
is with the U.S. government and who they generally want coming in and out of the country. Anyway, we know that several countries' fans, for example,
are not going to be allowed to travel to this tournament. And the Iranian situation was always going to be complicated. And that was before the war
broke out.
So, they seem to have found some kind of a solution here. The Iranian team originally was supposed to be based in Tucson, Arizona, but they were
struggling to get visas. There were security concerns. And for a period of time, there was this, you know, talk that Iran might not even be wanting to
play in the tournament. And then there was talk that if they wanted to play, would they be safe and secure? That was one of the things that
President Trump had said a few weeks ago.
So, they've committed to playing in the tournament. They want to play in the tournament. It's just going to be easier for them to base themselves
somebody -- somewhere else. And as you heard, the president of Mexico, Sheinbaum, they're saying the Americans didn't want them to spend any night
in the United States. So, now they can just fly back and forth over the border.
Tijuana might actually be a bit of an upgrade geographically for the Iranian team because it's very close to San Diego. Their first two games
are in Los Angeles against New Zealand and then Belgium. Those games will be atmospheric affairs. Let's put it that way. Los Angeles is sometimes
referred to as Terra Angeles because a lot of the people fleeing the revolution in 79 moved to Los Angeles and the greater Los Angeles area.
There's around 500,000 to 600,000 Iranian people living there or Iranian American people living there.
So, it's going to be quite the occasion. And let's just see how the Iranian team can do now that they've got this figured out. The third game, by the
way, is going to be in Seattle. So, further up the West Coast, that was going to be a longer flight for them, regardless of whether they were in
Arizona or in Mexico.
The Iranian team has qualified for a fourth consecutive World Cup tournament. It's going to be their seventh World Cup tournament overall.
They've never made it out of the group stage. It would be quite something, given everything that's going on, if they could hang around in this
tournament for more than just the three group games. But one step at a time, they figured out where they're going to stay.
SOARES: Indeed, indeed.
RIDDELL: That in itself was quite an ordeal.
SOARES: I know you and I will be talking much more about this. Don, good to see you as always. Thank you. We're going to take a short break. We'll see
you on the other side.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[14:40:00]
SOARES: Well, this week we are exploring the global rise of K-Beauty as part of K-Everything, a CNN original series with Daniel Dae Kim. South
Korea has become a global beauty hub, as you know, thanks to rapid innovation and advanced technology. In this segment, Daniel Dae Kim goes to
find the source of one of K-Beauty's most unique ingredients, snail music.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
GINA SHIN, DANIEL'S FRIEND: Where are we going?
DANIEL DAE KIM, HOST, K-EVERYTHING: I don't know, but wherever we're going, I want to be wearing this hat.
I have to say it's one of the cleanest factories I've ever seen.
In Korea, you're the first person to discover this?
PARK SUNG-MIN, CEO, COSEEDBIOPHARM (through translator): We were the first to develop it in Korea. Researchers like us developing cosmetics have a
habit of applying almost anything on our skin.
KIM: Can we see?
SUNG-MIN (through translator): Yes, you can see.
KIM: Wow. Hi, guys. It's just a lot of it.
SUNG-MIN (through translator): They're gentle and they don't bite. It 's fine.
SHIN: Go ahead, Daniel.
KIM (voice-over): My friend Gina Shin and I are at a company called CoSeedBioPharm with CEO Park Sung-Min.
It produces one of K-Beauty's most iconic ingredients, snail slime, also known as mucin.
KIM: Oh, it's cold.
SUNG-MIN (through translator): Try touching it.
SHIN: Now, it's relaxing. Yes.
KIM: He likes me.
SUNG-MIN (through translator): As the days pass, day one, day two and three passes, they water they drink turns into mucin.
KIM (voice-over): Much of Korea's snail mucin is from this company, used in products like serums and face masks.
KIM: Can we see inside?
KIM (voice-over): Which help hydrate skin and stimulate collagen production.
KIM: All right. I'm going in.
KIM (voice-over): The mucin is mixed, filtered, and sterilized, then ready for the market.
SUNG-MIN (through translator): We export to 21 countries.
KIM: Wow. I can't tell the difference between this and water.
SHIN: Yes, it looks like water.
KIM: I bet you could have a health spa with a mucin bath.
SHIN: Why don't you make one?
KIM: No, seriously, if you had a tub full of this, or even just a mucin dip, one body dip, right?
SHIN: Like cold plunge?
KIM: Yes.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SOARES: Now, that's an idea, Daniel Kim. I love it. And you can stream the full series in the U.S. on the CNN app and globally on HBO Max.
And still to come right here on the show.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CARO CLAIRE BURKE, AUTHOR, "YESTERYEAR": Tradwife is just short for traditional life, but I think that the political and cultural conversation
around it has just blown up.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SOARES: Author Caro Claire Burke dissects the downfall of the all-American tradwife in a debut novel, "Yesteryear." The latest edition of our Book
Club, just ahead for you.
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[14:45:00]
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
SOARES: Joining our book club today is Caro Clare Burke with "Yesteryear." Caro, welcome to the show.
CARO CLARE BURKE, AUTHOR, "YESTERYEAR": Thank you for having me.
SOARES: This is a really riveting book. It feels like it's going to be a cult classic and I know we're ready. Lots of people are interested in this
book and we're talking, we'll talk movie in just a moment because it's really exciting. This is your debut novel as well, right?
BURKE: It is.
SOARES: So, congratulations. Can we start just for viewers, and I don't want to give too much away, but can you start by telling us what the book
is about? It's centered around Natalie. I think she's 32.
BURKE: So, Natalie Heller Mills is a woman who is an influencer. She sells a pioneer fantasy online to millions of followers. And right at the peak of
her empire building, she wakes up to find herself living in the time period that she has been fetishizing. So, the 1800s. And from there, she must
figure out what is taking place and how she will find her way out if she can find her way out.
SOARES: I think it's kind of the beginning of the book. Her daughter asks her for the meaning of tradwife. Where did this concept of, you know,
tradwife, what did you decide this was a good talking point?
BURKE: Well, tradwife is just short for traditional life, but I think that the political and cultural conversation around it has just blown up. And I
just think that every conversation about womanhood is wrapped into it. So, motherhood, how you want to work, where you want to work. Do you want to
stay at home? Do you want to work outside of the home? What your power dynamics are in your marriage? All of it is wrapped into the tradwife
conversation.
So, it just felt so ripe for fiction. And then when I got the sort of the conceit for "Yesteryear," it just felt too good to give up on.
SOARES: I mean, we see a lot of that on TikTok, on Instagram. Was that inspiration? Some of those accounts, was that part of the inspiration?
BURKE: Yes. So, I was served a lot of that -- a lot of those aesthetics, those accounts in the winter of 2024. And that was absolutely how I learned
about the term. But I think what I learned through research for my media job at the time is that these visuals have been recycled throughout
history.
So, this image of a beautiful woman taking care of her children, milking the cow, serving her husband, this has been around for centuries and it
pops up again and again. And when I learned that, that was when I sort of, you know, bit into it and couldn't let go.
[14:50:00]
SOARES: Do we know where that term, the modern version of this term has come from? Who created it? Has it been politicized? Is it from the
manosphere? I mean, I assume women haven't come up with this.
BURKE: No, I think that's the irony is that this is often viewed as a women's issue, but it was a term that was coined by men. It was a term that
was coined in these online chat rooms that we often describe as incel chat rooms. And it was a term that was coined by women, where men who are very
disillusioned by the modern world were talking about what type of woman they really need. And it was a woman that they didn't see anymore. A woman
who did everything they wanted and never complained, and did it with a smile on their face.
SOARES: Yes. And she is -- I mean, she is that, isn't she? She always has a smile. That online persona.
BURKE: Yes, on the outside.
SOARES: On the outside. And she's a complex character. She's mean, she's narcissistic at the same time. And -- but what I loved about the way you
drew on her character and how you explored her, you know, the protagonist, is there was no judgment. Why did you decide not to judge her?
BURKE: Well, I mean, first of all, I was in her head. And I think very quickly, I kind of fell in love with her. I mean, Natalie has a lot of
reprehensible qualities, but she's also so ambitious, she's smart, she's so funny. She's the funniest character I've ever written. And I just really
admired the force with which she wanted to take on the world. And so, I think because I saw those qualities in her, it was very easy for me to find
empathy for her.
SOARES: The more kind of progressive, capitalist character, and that was Reena, who was a roommate, right? I think she works in banking, she's very
driven, she's working tough hours. You also don't paint her in a particularly positive light. She's exhausted, she's underpaid. Also,
concerns with childhood here. It's almost like you can't win. How would you sum that up?
BURKE: The reason why the tradwife became appealing was because a lot of the bill of goods that a lot of modern women were sold didn't feel to be
working out. You know, it's really hard to have it all. It's really hard to afford child care in America, let alone to work and be with your kids in
any meaningful way. And so, I think realizing this pain point that women are so up against it right now and that the two options we've been given
are not acceptable.
And I think that there's a lot to find in common with those two options and a lot of common ground for women to find, as opposed to those women being
pitted against one another. I think that those women really are in a shared and mutual struggle.
SOARES: On that point, Caro, but going back to tradwife, why do you think this is relevant now?
BURKE: We are at a point socially, economically, and politically where women feel like they're at a boiling point. I think a lot of women, a lot
of families are having a lot of trouble affording very basic things, and when that happens, you start to kind of look for a way out.
You start to fantasize about an escape hatch. And I think a lot of that has to do with this fantasy of a farm and a cow and chickens, which I think we
all know would be a lot of work. I think we know that that wouldn't actually be relaxing.
But when your real life is so hard and when you are really, really struggling to make motherhood and marriage and partnership work, it's not
surprising to me that now would be a time that we're really, really fantasizing about that.
SOARES: And I don't want to politicize this, but how much is the president of the United States and the Republican Party, like, part of feeding into
this?
BURKE: Hugely, I mean, something funny is that I sold this book two years ago when we were saying, I wonder if this will be relevant two years from
now. And I think that what I kind of say is if the tradwives were kind of the shot, then this administration is the chaser. This is the consequence.
And I think that we looked at those visuals two years ago, and a lot of people thought of those as women's issues. And I think that they were more
of a canary in the coal mine than they realized.
SOARES: Let's talk about, then, the movie. Because at the end, you thank Anne Hathaway kind of for guiding you or for helping you in kind of develop
Natalie's character. At what point was Anne Hathaway brought in?
BURKE: So, I had written a first draft, and that is when I sold the book and I sold the film rights. And so, at the time, the story that you're
reading now is there. But I was spending a lot of time fleshing out the religion, the capitalism, the culture, you know, Natalie's personality. And
so, at the time, I wanted to tell them, here are my plans, here's how I'm going to expand the book.
And so, I spent a lot of time talking both to my editorial team and then talking to the film team. And we kind of just had large, overarching
conversations about what are the themes that we want to talk about, performance and surveillance and, you know, pressure. And so, that was
really what we were talking about.
SOARES: Yes, the element of self-surveillance, that is quite something, isn't it? Thank you very much for coming in. I will pass you the book.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SOARES: And it is a great read, by the way. And if you like that, you'll like what's coming up next on Book Club. Vatican correspondent Christopher
Lamb joins us with "American Pope: The Pope Leo XIV Means for the Church and the World." He tells me more about the pontiff's first year at the helm
of the Vatican.
[14:55:00]
Why Catholicism is witnessing a resurgence among young people and what it's like to travel on the papal plane. Take a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
LAMB: It's kind of a unique experience. And it's basically a mixture of being on like a school trip with the Pope and trying to cover a massive
story.
SOARES: Yes.
LAMB: And so, those of you who don't know about this, traveling on the papal plane, the journalists sit at the back in economy. The Pope sits up
at the front. And then when the plane or Shepherd One takes off, the Pope comes to the back to greet the journalists.
SOARES: Speak to the commoners.
LAMB: Yes, exactly. But he continue -- Leo continues with something that Francis started, which was to meet each reporter individually.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SOARES: And finally, for you tonight, a competition of a different kind right here in the U.K.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SOARES: Britain's annual cheese rolling contest at Cooper's Hill was quite the spectacle. As you can see, dozens of participants and onlookers braved
the U.K.'s hottest May Day on record for a wheel of Gloucester cheese.
That does it for me tonight. Do stay right here. "What We Know" with Max Foster is up next.
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END
