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Isa Soares Tonight

Officials: Nearly 1.4M Michigan Voters Have Cast Ballots; Pentagon: Iran War Spending Soars Ahead of U.S. Midterms; Train Crash in Spain Kills at Least 68; Flavio Bolsonaro in the U.S. Spain Reeling After Another Deadly Train Crash; Israel Faces Political Deadlock with Neither Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu or His Main Rival Within Reach of a Governing Majority in Parliament; U.S. Fed to Soon Make a Decision on Interest Rates. Aired 2-3p ET

Aired October 28, 2026 - 14:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[14:00:00]

ISA SOARES, HOST, ISA SOARES TONIGHT: A very warm welcome to the show, everyone, I'm Isa Soares. Tonight, Spain is reeling after another deadly

train crash that's killed at least 68 people. We are live on the scene with the very latest for you.

Then with most votes now counted, Israel is now facing political deadlock with neither Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu or his main rival within

reach of a governing majority in parliament. We'll bring you the latest. Plus, any moment now, we'll get a decision from the Fed on U.S. interest

rates.

We'll bring you that shortly with our business editor-at-large, Richard Quest. That of course and much more ahead for you this hour. But first,

tonight, Spain's Prime Minister says his entire nation is in mourning after a horrific train crash.

At least, 68 people were killed after a train that was stopped on the tracks was rear ended by a high-speed train. It is Europe's deadliest train

crash in more than a decade. At this hour, rescue workers are still combing through the wreckage.

Officials say it appears a signaling error combined with a mistake by human train controller led to the crash. Spain, as you may know, has the largest

high speed rail network in Europe, but it has now been plagued with multiple deadly crashes. I want you to listen to what Prime Minister

Sanchez had to say just a short time ago.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PEDRO SANCHEZ, PRIME MINISTER, SPAIN (through translator): If we have to strengthen safety even further in order to rebuild confidence in our high-

speed rail system, we will do so. Because what is unacceptable for a country like Spain is to suffer two high-speed rail accidents in the same

year as we have. Therefore, every measure considered appropriate will be taken.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SOARES: Pedro Sanchez there. Let's get more from the scene, Vasco Cotovio is on the scene in Urda in Spain. He joins us now. So, Vasco, I mean, the

scenes we've been seeing, absolute shock. I can't even imagine the pain and the loss being felt where you are. Truly unimaginable.

Just walk us through what you are hearing on the ground and more importantly, what authorities are saying that led to this, Vasco.

VASCO COTOVIO, CNN PRODUCER: Good evening, Isa. Well, as you pointed out, the Spain's Infrastructure Minister -- sorry, Transport Minister said

earlier that a signaling error followed by an order that allowed the Renfe High-Speed train to continue, led to this crash.

And just to bring you up-to-speed or sort of explain that signaling error led to all trains in this area to stop. And that included the area train

that you see behind me. And that was -- it ended up being rear-ended by the Renfe train.

That train, the high-speed train, was inexplicably given the order to proceed despite the red signals, and it traveled for 17 minutes, 17 minutes

without warning, without being told to slow down at maximum speed around 200 kilometers per hour, that's 124 miles per hour.

And obviously, then it led to the crash, to the scene that you see behind me. Authorities still obviously trying to understand how this combination

of errors could have happened, how this incident could have happened in a place or in a country that has, as you mentioned, Europe's largest high-

speed rail network.

A country that prides itself on its rail network, but has been plagued by accidents in the past year alone. Two in the past year alone, I should say.

Now, authorities here are still combing through the wreckage. They're still trying to see if there are potentially victims stuck underneath some of the

collapsed or some of the sort of bent-over carriages.

But so far, we understand that the bulk of the search and rescue operations has concluded. For the time-being, victims are not expected to be found.

But there is a chance they might still be stuck under the rubble.

SOARES: On that second point, Vasco, I mean, just give us -- our viewers watching right now, kind of the scale of the operation. We can see part of

it behind you there. But speak to the support also being offered to those who have been seriously injured. We mentioned more than a 100 or so

seriously injured.

COTOVIO: Yes, it's been a very sort of frantic day here with rescue efforts, with search and rescue vehicles going back and forth. The flow of

-- the incessant flow, I should say, of emergency vehicles, ambulances, fire trucks, police vehicles.

[14:05:00]

Just in the first three hours, I was here -- was beyond anything I'd seen before. We saw hundreds, if not maybe a thousand officers on the site, and

it was truly an astonishing scene. I spoke to some of the first passengers that were brought out, the ones that -- who were in a -- I guess, lightly-

injured and were able to travel.

And they themselves were in shock at the seriousness of the whole situation. They described being thrown in the air as soon as the train

collided, they described the chaotic scenes that ensued. They had to scramble by -- scramble by themselves to get out of the train for the

initial moments.

Because let's be honest, this accident happened in the middle of nowhere. There's nothing around us. And so, that chaos, that frantic rescue effort

that ensued has been playing out here for the past three -- for the past few hours, it has slightly slowed down as nightfall has come over. But as

you can see --

SOARES: Yes --

COTOVIO: Behind me, the flood lights are on and authorities are going to keep combing through that rubble throughout the evening. We understand that

most of the injured have been taken to places closer to Madrid, hospitals that are better prepared to receive them.

But the support structure is not just in Madrid, not just around here, but throughout the country, because a lot of these people were going to other

places afterwards. And so, as Prime Minister Sanchez has said, there -- no effort is being spared not just to take care of the victims, but also --

SOARES: Yes --

COTOVIO: To figure out exactly what took place here.

SOARES: Yes, and also, of course, calling like you quite rightly said, Vasco, for accountability. Important to point out election -- he faces re-

election at the end of November. Vasco, I know you'll stay on top of the very latest for us.

Of course, our thoughts and prayers are with everyone's families who have been affected in this truly unimaginable disaster and accident. Thank you

very much, Vasco Cotovio there. And as you would expect, we are going to keep across any developments on this story if you've read -- throughout the

show.

Late in the hour, in fact, I'll be joined by a railway accident investigator and safety specialist. For more, really on what's happened and

what investigators will be looking at the first round, and that will be in around, what? Twenty minutes or so right here on the show.

And we have some breaking news to bring you. Just in the last few moments in the last six minutes or so, the U.S. Federal Reserve I am being told,

has announced its latest decision on interest rates. I want to go straight to our Richard Quest, who joins me now.

Richard, what was that decision? Because I think this is the last Fed meeting right before the Midterms.

RICHARD QUEST, CNN BUSINESS EDITOR-AT-LARGE: Absolutely. The last Fed meeting, and the decision was to hold rates where they are for the time

being. That's where the Fed funds rate is three and a -- three and three quarters to 4 percent. It is a range.

And the vote was 10 to 2. So, an overwhelming majority of the FOMC, the Federal Open Market's Committee deciding to hold rates where they are for

the time being, not unexpected, but it should not deny the fact that rates will probably rise before the end of the year.

The reason they decided to leave things where they are for the time being, not the election. They would never admit that publicly. They basically say

they need more time to see if last month's rate rise takes effect.

SOARES: Right, so talk us through then what we're likely to hear from Kevin Warsh, because as your viewers will know, our viewers will know, and

as we have seen from voters and we've seen from polling, Richard, consumers in the U.S. have kind of generally soured, right? On the economy.

We're talking about expensive gas, groceries, clothing. What are they saying when it comes to inflation and those pressure points?

QUEST: Glad you asked. They said inflation remains elevated. The accumulation of more information will help the committee determine the

policy stance. What they're also worried about here is that the economy is expanding at a strong pace.

But they say job gains have kept pace. But they are worried that the unemployment rate is not coming down. This is the so-called dual mandate

that they constantly balance. Now, we know that inflation is the number one target. I mean, let's be quite clear about this.

Kevin Warsh's statement says the committee will deliver price stability. That means 2 percent over the longer term. How are they going to do it at

the moment seems somewhat difficult because of course, it seems to be entrenched. The war on Iran continues. Oil prices remain high.

This is basically the Fed saying we did last lot, let's wait and see. But by jingo, we're ready to do more if it looks like it's necessary. I

certainly believe they'll do more before the end of the year.

[14:10:00]

SOARES: Richard Quest live there from Doha. Thank you very much, Richard. Good to see you. Richard will be back with the show in about two hours or

so. And for now, there's no deadlock, as you heard me say at the top of the show with no clear winner. But as the final votes are

We'll be back with the show in about two hours or so. And for now, there's no deadlock, as you heard me say at the top of the show with no clear

winner. But as the final votes are counted in Israel, a path is emerging for the opposition to form a new government, announced Prime Minister

Benjamin Netanyahu if there's the political will.

Mr. Netanyahu isn't going anywhere yet. His right-wing bloc is projected to take 53 seats in parliament, and that is below, as you know, the 61 needed

to form a government. But the opposition bloc of his main rival, Gadi Eisenkot, has even fewer seats, only 48 so far, also far short of a

majority.

And that's where the potential kingmakers come in. Arab parties are celebrating their historic showing, projected to win 19 seats. One leader

says, quote, "we have proven that we are a political force that cannot be ignored."

And yet, for now at least, they are being ignored when it comes to forming a ruling coalition. Neither the opposition nor Mr. Netanyahu's bloc appears

ready to include them. Palestinian citizens of Israel surged to the polls on Tuesday, hoping to dismantle the Prime Minister's right-wing government.

Listen how Mansour Abbas, head of Ra'am Party, rallied supporters to get out and vote.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MANSOUR ABBAS, LEADER OF RA'AM PARTY & MEMBER OF ISRAELI KNESSET (through translator): I call on all citizens to exercise their right to vote. This

is essential to changing our situation and solving our problems that we face as an Arab community, such as violence, crime, demolitions, fines,

racism and incitement.

The vote is an important tool and means for changing the political situation. A government that came to power through the ballot box can be

removed through the ballot box.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SOARES: While one opposition leader is now urging his political allies to form a government with Arab parties. Yair Golan says it's simple math, but

also a moral obligation. He said, quote, "we have no future here if we don't stop being afraid, and if we don't stop with the racism.

Anyone who tries to raise the voices of Arab citizens is surrendering to Netanyahu and giving up on Israel." Let's come on all these threads and

developments. I want to bring in our Jeremy Diamond, who joins us now from Jerusalem.

And Jeremy, as I was saying, no clear winner for now. And I suspect the two main parties will be waiting, right? For this final vote-count before start

working the numbers, start working coalition building. First, give us a sense of when that final vote may come in.

JEREMY DIAMOND, CNN JERUSALEM CORRESPONDENT: Yes, well, every single vote, every single seat is important to the coming math that we are going to see

about what kind of a parliamentary bloc can actually be cobbled together.

It will be by the beginning of next week when the Israeli President, Isaac Herzog, will officially receive the confirmed total -- election totals in

order to make his decision about who will get the opportunity to try and form the next government of Israel.

Within the next couple of days, we will likely see the final votes tallied. Right now, we're headed to a situation where we're soon going to be

counting what's known as the double envelope ballots. These are ballots that were submitted either by Israeli troops who are serving abroad, or in

an active combat zone, or diplomats who are abroad.

Those votes are counted last. But once that process is done and the vote is certified, the Israeli President will then speak with all of the different

leaders of the parties and make an assessment of who is best positioned to form the next governing coalition.

And already, we are hearing from the Israeli President, Isaac Herzog, saying that the country must do everything we can to avoid another round of

elections, and that he says that he wants all of the party leaders to come in with an open mind about the future.

We know that Herzog, in the past has indicated a preference for a national unity government, and with the fact that neither Eisenkot opposition bloc

nor Netanyahu's governing coalition are reaching a 61 seat majority on their own, you can bet that Herzog is going to be at least broaching very

seriously the idea of some kind of coming together between the Zionist opposition and the Zionist majority to see if they -- and the Zionist

governing coalition, I should say, to see if they can reach some kind of a deal to move forward together.

SOARES: Yes, expand on that. I mean, this comment from Herzog not wanting another -- trying to avoid at least another round of elections. I mean,

what are the kind of the combinations, the paths that Netanyahu and Eisenkot will be looking at, you know, given like we were saying that Arab-

Israeli parties fare significantly well last night.

[14:15:00]

DIAMOND: I mean, it really is an extraordinary circumstance when you kind of step back outside of the bubble of Israeli politics, and you think about

the fact that there is a very clear anti-Netanyahu majority that has been elected by Israeli voters so far, even as the final numbers are uncertain.

If you put together the Eisenkot bloc, you put together the Arab parties, which had record turnout in these elections, that is a very clear majority

in Israel's Knesset. But the reality of Israeli politics right now, in particular after October 7th, is that a majority of Jewish-Israeli voters

do not want to see these Arab political parties brought into a governing coalition.

It has become politically toxic for a number of the parties in Eisenkot's opposition bloc. Other than Yair Golan; the head of the Democrats, none of

those parties are talking about bringing in the Arab parties into a governing coalition.

So, the only other option besides a national unity government, which also seems relatively unlikely right now, given the number of times that

Eisenkot and other opposition leaders said they want to see Netanyahu out of office at any cost, the only other option is a minority government that

would basically be tacitly supported by the Arab parties.

Likely they would abstain or not show up for a vote about choosing the next Prime Minister of Israel. And that could indeed move forward. But there is

then a question of legitimacy among Israel's Jewish voters, whether or not they would view such a government, which is effectively only coming into --

would come to fruition, thanks to the Arab political parties, whether or not they would view that government as legitimate.

And then the third scenario, of course, he says, one that we've seen before in this country, which is another round of elections. Remember that there

was a time between 2019 --

SOARES: Yes --

DIAMOND: And 2022 when we saw four elections take place in that short period of time. Again, that's a scenario that many here in this country

want to avoid, but it may ultimately be one that moves forward. And if that scenario moves forward, remember it's Benjamin Netanyahu who remains in

charge of a transitional government.

SOARES: Yes, very good point. Jeremy, appreciate it. Thank you very much. Let's stay with this discussion. I'm joined now by former Israeli Prime

Minister Ehud Olmert, who says Benjamin Netanyahu is on the wrong side of history.

Mr. Olmert, great to have you on the show as always. Look, let me pick out there from what Jeremy said, kind of the paths for both men right now. Let

me start with Netanyahu as leading with more than 85 -- well, with more than 85 percent of the votes counted, and is well known, of course, for his

coalition-building skills. What do you think his move will be?

EHUD OLMERT, FORMER ISRAELI PRIME MINISTER: All very much depends on what will be the final outcome. They still have to count 15 percent of the

votes, which is not insignificant. So, let's wait and see. I think that if, as it appears to be now, Netanyahu will not have in his bloc, 61 votes, he

can't form a new government unless he is assisted by one of the parties of the bloc of Change.

But I think that Netanyahu will not build up a partnership with anyone of the bloc of Change unless he keeps his traditional partners, Ben-Gvir and

Smotrich in the cabinet.

This is not something that I believe any of the parties of the bloc of Change will agree to. So, their choice is really between that which

Netanyahu may try to work out, but is not likely to happen. All the alternative is to form a coalition, a minority coalition of some sort with

the assistance -- either active assistance or tacit assistance of the Arab parties.

I think that if there is one message that came from these elections is that Arabs, is about time that the Arabs will be part of the government of

Israel. They have participated --

SOARES: Yes --

OLMERT: In a very high level in the elections, and it's time that they will become also partners to govern this country. And this is the

opportunity.

SOARES: You said, Netanyahu -- let me just double-check I heard you right. You said Netanyahu maybe have to consider a tacit assistance of Arab

parties. Do you think he will go there?

OLMERT: No, not Netanyahu, not Netanyahu. Netanyahu will not --

SOARES: Eisenkot you mean?

OLMERT: Netanyahu will consider --

SOARES: Right --

OLMERT: Everything? But I talk about -- I talk about Gadi Eisenkot and the bloc of Change. I think they --

SOARES: Right --

OLMERT: The Arab parties will not participate, will not support neither actively nor explicitly or tacitly any government of --

SOARES: Yes --

OLMERT: Netanyahu later announced in the most explicit manner that they will fight in order to overthrow this government.

SOARES: Yes, I wanted to double-check I heard it right. So, thank you for clarifying. And we did hear -- we did hear the leader of the left-wing

Democrats party urging Eisenkot to work with Arab parties.

[14:20:00]

What parties would he potentially be looking at? I mean, we played a clip there of Ra'am and Mansour Abbas. I think the last time I checked, he what

-- had seven seats, but that might not be enough. Who else do you think he would consider or they would consider to work with him as well?

OLMERT: I -- Isa, I'm afraid that I can't speak for Eisenkot, and I don't quite know what he has in mind and what his partners have in mind. This is

something that they will have to spell it out in the most explicit way.

I can say that as far as I'm concerned, as an Israeli, as someone who was Prime Minister of the State of Israel, who cares for how things will

develop, I think that there is no reason why not join in with the two Arab parties in some kind of an understanding and arrangement that they would

start by supporting actively, although outside of the coalition agreement and perhaps subsequently sometimes in the future will also become part of

the government.

This is something that can be worked out. This is something that many Israelis will prefer over running for another early elections. And this is

something that the majority of them already say that they don't want a new government of Netanyahu, Ben-Gvir and Smotrich is something that the

majority of Israelis voted against yesterday.

SOARES: Right, and look, it's hard. We don't have the final -- the final numbers. It's all political horse trading. Once we have those numbers and

coalition building -- we're trying to think of work through the paths available.

But with Eisenkot, Mr. Olmert, I just wonder, I mean, he had laid down some conditions with Arab party, I'm just going to go through them. He said

"they have to recognize Israel as a Jewish and democratic state, accept the values in Israel's Declaration of Independence, denounce Hamas as a

terrorist organization" -- although he has said this would take 18 months.

Would any of that you think first is in a position to impose terms for coalition talks? And how may those talks be received?

OLMERT: I think that the party of Mansour Abbas more or less already said it in different occasions across the period of the election campaign. So, I

think that, the wording is something that has to be, of course accepted and negotiated.

But I think it's possible that the Arab parties will make the necessary adjustments to make it easier for Eisenkot to form a government with them.

But then again, we have to draw a distinction. There is one partnership with them, fully members of the next coalition signing an agreement of

coalition with the bloc of Change, which is one way of doing it.

Or another is that, there will be an understanding that perhaps sometimes later, they will become full partners. But in the meantime, in order to

remove the government of Netanyahu, which is what the Arab parties in the most public and explicit manner say they want, they will agree to be

outside of the coalition agreement, but still supporting the -- passively, but supporting the coalition.

The creation of a new coalition led by the bloc of Change. This is the minimum that I think should be done, and I believe that most likely it may

happen.

SOARES: Yes, and look, you -- I'm not sure whether you heard our correspondent Jeremy Diamond saying the President Herzog once said that he

wanted to avoid another round of elections. But, you know, as we wait for those numbers to come in, their final numbers come in, final tally on

Friday.

Just taking a step back, I wonder whether you think, Mr. Olmert, that where we are right now, whether you think that Prime Minister Netanyahu is

running out of road. How do you see his position right now and the vote for of course, for Eisenkot and for the other Arab parties? Is that a

demonstration of what, in your view?

OLMERT: A -- I understand that according to the latest shows of outcome, which is not now, just now is on the screens in the Israeli TV, the numbers

are changing a little bit. So, I don't know, we have to wait really for every minute, everything can change.

But I think that the outcome is better than the Netanyahu probably expected because all the polls showed that the bloc of Change will be bigger than

the bloc of Netanyahu. So, he feels, certainly, he feels that he has achieved something that was against the initial expectation.

[14:25:00]

But still, the fact that 67 members of the Knesset, which is an absolute majority, opposes his government, is a big defeat. There's no question

about it. After four years of running the state and after four years, three years of which were during the war and the attack against Iran and Hamas

and Hezbollah and everything.

At the end of the day, 67 members of the Knesset are absolutely against this government, is a judgment that can't be ignored.

SOARES: Mr. Olmert, always great to get your perspective, thank you very much indeed joining us from --

OLMERT: Thank you, Isa --

SOARES: Tel Aviv at this hour --

OLMERT: Thank you --

SOARES: Thank you, Mr. Olmert, you're very welcome. And still to come tonight on the show, six days until Midterm elections in the United States.

And it's all about star power. Both parties try to rally support with the help of presidential headliners. That's next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SOARES: Two U.S. Presidents, dueling rallies on the campaign trail just six days before election day, President Donald Trump returns to Ohio for a

rally tonight where the stakes are extremely high. And in just a couple of hours, former U.S. President Barack Obama will appear in Atlanta with

Senator Jon Ossoff and Keisha Lance Bottoms, the Democratic nominee for Georgia governor.

President Trump's Health and Human Services Secretary Robert Kennedy Jr., will rally with Iowa Republicans today, and he has been facing widespread

backlash for these remarks he made about Arabs.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ROBERT KENNEDY JR., SECRETARY OF HEALTH & HUMAN SERVICES: There's 500 million Arabs in the world, and yet they don't produce science, they don't

win the Nobel Prize, they don't win(ph) the Fields Prize, they don't win the Wolf Prize. They don't produce literature.

They have created stagnant societies that do one-two things, hatred and war and victimization.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BARACK OBAMA, FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: The first Democratic doctor elected --

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SOARES: And that was part of Kennedy's tirade against Michigan's Democratic candidate for Senate, Abdul El-Sayed. A spokesperson for El-

Sayed campaign clapped back, saying, maybe Bobby Jr. should spend more of his time figuring out why we have all these food recalls under his

leadership, rather than race baiting Michiganders.

Well, Kennedy's comments were not only offensive to so many, they were also flat-out wrong and a very quick check for you. A check, so you can see

there, last year alone, Arabs did win a Nobel Prize and two prestigious National Book Awards.

Of course, this is far from an exhaustive list, but you get the message, hopefully, so will -- let's get more on all these strands, our Marshall

Cohen is in El-Sayed's backyard of Detroit Atlanta Center -- an election center, pardon me, joins us now.

Marshall, a buzz of activity I can see behind you. Give us a sense of what is happening. I was told before I came in to the studio, about 20,000 mail

ballots already being processed and counted. Talk us through what you're seeing.

MARSHALL COHEN, CNN SENIOR REPORTER: That's absolutely right, Isa. Hello from Detroit, Michigan. We're in the convention center where they have been

counting mail ballots and will continue counting mail ballots until they are all counted Tuesday night, Election Day, and as long as it takes.

You mentioned 20,000 votes have already been processed and counted. And that's an important number because it's actually bigger than the margin in

the last Senate race two years ago, which was decided by only 19,000 votes. That's all to say that the votes that have already been counted behind me

very well could prove decisive in that critical race between Abdul El-Sayed and Mike Rogers, as you mentioned.

But before the ballots even make it into this room, they need to be checked, scrutinized, verified. There are a lot of safeguards built into

the election process to prevent voter fraud. You hear a lot about voter fraud in the U.S. The truth is it's extraordinarily rare because these

systems work quite effectively, and we got a close-up look at that process earlier today. We spoke with the top election official in the Detroit

office, and I want to show you what we saw.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

COHEN: So, a very active scene here. What is happening in this room?

DANIEL BAXTER, CHIEF OPERATING OFFICER, DETROIT ELECTIONS DEPARTMENT: Well, right now we have probably about 58,000 absentee ballots that have

been returned by registered voters of the City of Detroit.

And when they come back, we do a rigorous authentication and verification process, which requires for us to go into the Michigan Qualified Voter

file, verify that these are the same ballots that we sent to the voters, and then we authenticate their signatures, sort them, and then have them

delivered to Huntington Place, where they're tabulated at our central counting board.

COHEN: So, the work being done behind us right here, this is an important part of preventing voter fraud and making sure that only eligible voter's

vote?

BAXTER: That's the crux of the entire operation. We have to verify that. And we do it for every last ballot that comes into the Department of

Elections.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COHEN: Isa, in addition to preventing voter fraud, that process and the one right behind me are an important part of getting quick results on

election night. They do all these checks on the front end so that when election night comes, they only have to press a few buttons and get quick

results, and that's something we can all root for. Isa.

SOARES: Indeed. Marshall, great to see you live there from Detroit in Michigan. Thank you very much indeed.

Now, the cost of the war in Iran to U.S. taxpayers is surging just days before those voter's head to the polls. The Pentagon told members of

Congress the cost, as of the middle of this month, had soared to more than $47 billion. The U.S. spent $2 billion on combat operations just in the

last six weeks.

And still to come tonight, right here on the show, a deadly train crash, as we've been telling you, in Spain. We'll speak to a railway accident

investigator about what may have caused it. That's after this very short break. You are watching CNN.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[14:35:00]

SOARES: Welcome back, everyone. We do continue to follow news out of Spain. That is our top story this hour, where a train crash has killed at

least 68 people and injured dozens. Right now, investigators believe a computer failure signaled for all the trains in the area to automatically

stop. The control center then took command of the system, and a decision was made to allow the train to continue. It eventually called with another

train at 200 kilometers per hour. That's 124 miles per hour. The country's transport minister says his decision, pardon me, to allow the train to

continue was, quote, "inexplicable."

Joining me now is Janos Rozsa. He's a railway accident investigator and safety specialist. Llanos, really appreciate you being on the show. Look,

the images we have been showing our viewers from Toledo are absolutely heartbreaking. And important to say right off from the onset that there's a

lot we do not know right now.

We're hoping, of course, we'll have more clarity in the hours ahead. But we did hear from Spain's transport minister earlier talking about a computer

error, this computer system failing. What are you hearing from your contacts on this?

JANOS ROZSA, RAILWAY ACCIDENT INVESTIGATOR AND SAFETY SPECIALIST: Well, thank you, Isa. And let me start with express my deepest condolences to the

families who lost their victims, lost their lives in this tragic accident. Unfortunately, I don't have the latest news on that. So, this is pretty new

to me.

So, on site, the immediate priority is saving lives on the accident side. This is really important. And all the investigations, activities comes

after that. Investigators usually work to establish accurately as possible, in such cases, how both trains were moving and how they came to occupy the

same section of track. And maybe further information comes after that.

So, as a first thing, accident investigators try to harvest the appreciable evidence such as CCTV cameras, onboard data recorders, other data recorders

from the signaling system as well. So, maybe this can help us to understand the first step of the investigation, which is understanding what happened

during the sequence of the events.

SOARES: Let's talk about that signaling system, because, look, normally, from what I understand, Spanish trains operate via centralized system. It's

called, let me get it right, LZB. But the reports then suggest at the time of the crash that the trains were operating on an alternative signaling

system called BSL.

I mean, could have been some confusion. Is this one of the hypothesis, maybe that confusion with these two trains who are to run on the two

different operators?

ROZSA: Talk us through that. In my experience, accidents rarely have a single cause. For example, it's a deal or the other -- or other issues with

the other signaling systems. But accidents usually result from combination of different contributing factors were present at the same time. So,

investigators need to examine the whole rail infrastructure, including the signaling system, the trains and the train sets themselves and the

different levels of the operational control at the same time.

[14:40:00]

SOARES: Right. But different causes. But this crash in Toledo comes about 130 miles from the site of January's train disaster that took place in

Cordoba. So, I mean, is there an alarming pattern here? Should we be I mean, should we be asking questions over? Is it speed? Is it the system

itself? I know the investigation is ongoing, but as an expert, what factors could play into this? We're talking about a human error here.

ROZSA: Human actions may form part of the whole pictures of accident causation. But it's essential to understand that it's really important

safety accident investigation to understand the circumstances in which people were working and how the overall system was designed to keep these

train apart.

And you mentioned the previous accidents as well. It's really common in the social media to try to find links between to these accidents. But accident

investigation is a very, very long process. And we need to understand the circumstances of each accident and wait for the investigation findings

before we draw the conclusions that is there any possible links on that.

SOARES: I wonder from your experience, then, Janos, I mean, these trains were going as I've traveled in some of these trains. They go at very, very

fast speed. I mean, 200 kilometers an hour, 124 miles per hour. Do -- at that speed, do drivers have time to react? What could a driver do under

these circumstances?

ROZSA: Train drivers always rely on the information that you actually have at the time of when the accident or incident happens, which means we need

to understand what -- how big was information package was available for them at the time to understand what and how they did during the sequence of

the events.

SOARES: Yes. The comms is so important, the communication between each side, the whole system itself, the centralized system. Lots of questions,

I'm sure, will be asked as we had Prime Minister Sanchez calling for accountability. Thank you very much, Janos. I really appreciate it.

And still to come tonight right here on the show, what the reelection of Lula da Silva means for climate in Brazil and beyond. That's next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[14:45:00]

SOARES: Welcome back, everyone. Brazilian Senator Flavio Bolsonaro and his family are now in the U.S., arriving early today at Miami Airport. And this

is happening just days after being defeated in his run for president against his leftist opponent, President Luiz Inacio Lula da Silva.

On Monday, Bolsonaro was ordered by Brazilian authorities to turn in his passport, but he failed to do so. A source close to him says Bolsonaro was

afraid of being arrested in Brazil, where he is under investigation for alleged corruption. An adviser for President Trump says Trump approved

allowing Bolsonaro to enter the United States. President Luiz Inacio Lula da Silva criticized Bolsonaro's leaving of the country.

Environmentalists, meanwhile, have celebrated Lula's victory, which brings hope for focus to remain on the climate agenda and to stop illegal

deforestation in the world's largest rainforest, the Amazon. About 60 percent of the Amazon lies in Brazil. The forest acts as a massive carbon

sink, helping to reduce global temperatures. Earlier this month, Brazil recorded its lowest Amazon deforestation level since monitoring began, get

this, in 1988.

I'm joined now by Claudio Angelo, the head of international policy at Brazil's Climate Observatory, for the next conversation, of course, in our

series Building Up to COP31 next month. Claudio, really great to see you there from Sao Paulo.

Look, a major surprise and a major win for Lula da Silva, his fourth term. What does this victory, in your opinion, mean for climate policy in Brazil,

which in the last few years, as we've just clearly stated, has improved under Lula?

CLAUDIO ANGELO, INTERNATIONAL POLICY HEAD, CLIMATE OBSERVATORY BRAZIL: Hello, Isa, good evening. It means that climate policy stays. It means that

the Amazon stays because this was a very dire process and a very tough election for all of us who care for climate change and who care for the

fate of the forest and its inhabitants. Because on the one hand, on one side, we had a climate denier, whose father produced in his government the

highest increase in deforestation over a single presidential term since measurements began in the late '80s.

On the other side, we have a leader in whose government deforestation reached its lowest rate ever. As a result, just in the last three years,

Brazil has reduced about 650 million tons of CO2 from the atmosphere. That's equivalent to a whole year of Australian emissions, for instance.

So, for us, what happened this year of 2026 in the Amazon, is that we have for the first time a glimpse of what zero deforestation could look like.

Because we used to lose, 20 years ago, about 30,000 square kilometers of forest every 18 months. So, it's really a huge accomplishment.

SOARES: Yes. And we saw a lot of that loss under the former president, the former Bolsonaro, right? Some of the moves there. And look, as we've seen,

climate change, Claudia, wasn't particularly kind of front and center in this election. For many voters, as we've heard, it was about corruption,

cost of living, just the economy in general.

But what did you hear from Lula's campaign that may signal whether we'll see a continuation of his policies? I did know that he had pledged to end

deforestation by 2030. Do you think that's still part of his policies with this new term?

ANGELO: Yes. And one thing to notice, it's true that no one talked about either forest or climate during the campaign. Lula did say in his latest

speech at the U.N. Assembly that, you know, climate leadership is lacking. And he was appalled at how climate change just fell from priority among

world leaders. In his victory speech last Sunday, he did mention climate change, which is something he didn't do during the campaign. So, we have

every reason to believe that the very same package of sound climate policies will still be pretty much present.

Lula is very likely to come to COP31 in Antalya. He already accepted President Erdogan's invitation to attend. And Brazil will present the

roadmap to both end deforestation and transition away from fossil fuels, the two roadmaps that were designed by the COP30 presidency. Those will be

presented --

[14:50:00]

SOARES: Right. And, Claudio, look, why we are applauding while you are applauding Lula when it comes to his green credentials, he may find let's

talk about this. He may find his work somewhat more challenges this time around because you have a more conservative leaning Congress, right, about

a third of it.

Does Lula have the appetite and the fight to take this on? And how much do you think that climate change will be used as a bargaining chip here?

ANGELO: That's our fear. We have a situation which is unprecedented in Brazilian history. Seventy percent of Congress is composed by either the

far right or the rural caucus. Even though they lost the presidency, they won big time in the parliament.

We have seen in the past two things happen. One, they try to pass detrimental legislation. The president vetoes, the vetoes are overthrown.

And two. Sometimes the environment is used as a bargaining chip for the government to get what it wants from Congress sometimes. So, there's no way

around it other than doing the thing we did to get Lula elected. A lot of pressure.

SOARES: Yes.

ANGELO: A lot of people marching on the streets and a lot of mobilization. I think that's what's going to make sure we stop Congress. But I think the

government this time around Lula is very much interested in his legacy. And climate change and the fight against climate change is a big part of that.

SOARES: It's very much always been part of his legacy. That is that is very true. Claudio, really appreciate your insight on this and your

expertise. Claudio Angelo there for us from Sao Paulo in Brazil.

We're going to take a short break to stay right here with CNN. See you on the other side.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SOARES: Welsh adventurer Ash Dykes has completed his 400-mile kayak journey through the Congo Basin, all whilst updating his 8 million fans

live on social media. But it wasn't all smooth sailing.

[14:55:00]

Just days away from the finish line, Dykes's team said they hadn't heard from him for almost 24 hours. Home to deadly disease, menacing wildlife

and, of course, volatile geopolitics, the Congo Basin is widely regarded as one of the most dangerous places on Earth. Fortunately for Dykes, it was an

issue with his Starlink that left him off the grid and he later reconnected to complete the journey. Huge congratulations to him.

And finally, tonight for you, a bear in Alaska is caught after locking itself in a car. And it managed to completely shred the interior of the

Subaru before finally being freed by police. And this video you're looking at shows an officer tugging on a rope tied to the driver's side door

handle. After multiple attempts, the door opens and the bear pokes its head out, looking both ways before exiting and walking away. It did not receive

a ticket, but it did leave the car in that state.

And a programming note, just before we go, we are now streaming for you in the U.S., Canada, and right here in the U.K. You can watch our show.

Hopefully you're watching our show. Access exclusive original programming. Read unlimited articles and more on the CNN app. To learn more, visit

cnn.com/allaccess.

Thank you for your company this hour. Thank you for watching. Do stay right here, "What We Know" with Max Foster is up next. I shall see you tomorrow.

Bye-bye.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:00:00]

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