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Joy Behar Page
Dick Cheney Criticizes Obama Administration; Director Kevin Smith Kicked Off a Flight
Aired February 15, 2010 - 21:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
JOY BEHAR, HOST: Tonight on THE JOY BEHAR SHOW, former vice president Dick Cheney is on television again, so if you missed the last season of "True Blood" on HBO, here`s your latest fix.
Then Director Kevin Smith is kicked off a flight for being too fat. Let me get this straight, Kevin Smith is a safety risk, but the crotch bomber walks right on? Ok.
And a 7-year-old leads a parade of sexually charged samba dancers in Brazil`s carnivale? We`ll get in to that.
That and more start right now.
Alabama professor Amy Bishop-Anderson has been charged with capital murder for allegedly killing three colleagues, but did she murder her own brother back in 1986? His death was ruled as an accident.
Anderson was also a suspect in a 1993 pipe bomb attempt on a Harvard Medical School professor. So how was this woman able to avoid jail time, let alone keep her job?
With me to sort out all these details is Jean Casarez, correspondent with "In Session" on TruTV. Welcome Jean.
JEAN CASAREZ, CORRESPONDENT, "IN SESSION": Thank you.
BEHAR: So this alleged University of Alabama shooter kills her brother in 1986 but she was never charged with murder. Why not?
CASAREZ: You know. This is amazing. I was able to get the final report from Massachusetts, and it has some things that are very strange in it.
BEHAR: Like what?
CASAREZ: And we can say she shot her brother, because she admitted it. Ok.
She was 19, her brother was 18.
BEHAR: Right.
CASAREZ: She`s upstairs. She decides she`s going to get her father`s gun --
BEHAR: A shotgun.
CASAREZ: Because she wants to learn how to load it, although she also tells police she was always scared of it, so she had never gone near it. So she loads the gun in her bedroom. It goes off. One shot into the wall.
So then she goes downstairs with the shotgun, and here`s where the story diverges. Her mother told police that she walked straight into the kitchen with the gun, said, can you help me unload this gun? Brother walks into the kitchen, she flings it up, shoots him dead, it`s an accident.
The other side is that Amy herself said, 19 years old, that she walked to the edge of the kitchen, her brother was walking through the dining room, they spoke -- she asked her brother how to unload the gun, then they both walk into the kitchen. He says to hold it up, she does and she kills him.
She ran out of the house when it happened. She left the house after it all happened, but the inconsistencies of the stories between she and her mother, the fact that you would shoot the gun into the wall in your bedroom and really not say anything about it, just come downstairs and say how do I unload the gun? And to even take the gun out of your parents bedroom when it`s in the gun case and the shotgun shells were in another are.
But here`s the strangest thing of all, the police asked her at the time, did she reload the gun? We know two shots went off, right?
BEHAR: Right. She said she was unloading the gun.
CASAREZ: But she also admits she loaded the gun, because she wanted to see how it worked. She wanted to be able to load it for personal protection in case anyone ever came in the home and burglarized the home.
BEHAR: Ok.
CASAREZ: But here, the police asked her, did you reload the gun before the final time when you show your brother? She said, "No, not that I remember."
Not that I know about shot guns, but I know a little bit about shot guns. There`s a time of shotgun called a bolt-action, that you have to reload every time you shoot, it only takes one shot --
BEHAR: Is that what she had that time?
CASAREZ: We don`t know. The report doesn`t say what kind of shotgun, but they may reopen this case. In fact, word is they possibly are going to re-open this case. It was determined to be an accident. The report said it was based an accident because of interviews with the family members and especially the mother that said my daughter just walked into the kitchen, was asking me and all of a sudden.
BEHAR: So that was one thing she did. And then in 1993 she and her husband was suspected of sending a pipe bomb to a Harvard professor.
CASAREZ: Right.
BEHAR: A letter bomb, maybe? I don`t know.
CASAREZ: Two pipe bombs, you`re exactly right.
BEHAR: Yes, pipe bombs.
CASAREZ: This was when she was getting her doctoral degree, and the pipe bombs came in the mail to this professor. She and her husband -- she was already married at the time -- were questioned, because he had given her a negative grade, a negative commentary on part of her doctoral work. She was never charged. No one was ever charged.
BEHAR: They couldn`t prove it.
CASAREZ: The bomb didn`t go off.
BEHAR: Bummed luckily.
CASAREZ: Luckily and so --
BEHAR: But she continued to have a teaching career, which brought her to this position, where she`s been charged with capital murder.
CASAREZ: She`s a neuroscientist, PhD. I mean, the work she has done at the University of Alabama with cell cultures, working on Alzheimer`s, but you`re right, you have three counts of capital murder.
BEHAR: How come someone like that was allowed to just continue to teach and be in the world like that? They couldn`t violate her civil rights by saying you can`t do your job, because they couldn`t prove anything. Is that it?
CASAREZ: You`re right. You`re exactly right.
BEHAR: But it looks as though -- this is one of those if it looks like a duck and it walks like a duck, it`s a duck type of story?
CASAREZ: Maybe it goes back to 1986. It was found to be an accident. And if something is an accident, maybe it`s negligent behavior but it`s not criminal behavior.
BEHAR: So she was never charged with manslaughter -- negligent manslaughter -- any of those things that they do for those cases?
CASAREZ: Nothing.
BEHAR: There was no intent to kill her brother. Was there a fight between her and her brother in 1986?
CASAREZ: The report says that her father, when questioned by police, said I had left to the house to do something, by my daughter and I had an argument before I left the house because I didn`t like something she had said.
So that does show that there was stress and tension in the home, but she admits that the gun went off once in her bedroom.
BEHAR: Yes.
CASAREZ: So you can say it`s reckless to then bring a loaded gun down and then flip it up sort of like "The Rifleman"?
BEHAR: But this particular thing lately, it sounds almost like the Columbine sort of case, where they just opened fire because they`re ticked off at whatever.
CASAREZ: And that`s why prosecutors will probably want this as a prior bad act to come in, showing a modus operandi of how you operate when things don`t go your way
BEHAR: Well, this is a story I want to continue to watch this week because it`s an interesting story.
We`re going to continue to follow this story but we`ll be back in 60 seconds with another story.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BEHAR: A porn star named Joslyn James claims she was knocked up twice by Tiger Woods. Of course, neither pregnancy made it to term, so there`s really no way to prove whether the claim is true or if she`s just making it up to get attention. In which case I was knocked up by Ben Bernanke; go ahead, prove it. Prove I wasn`t. You don`t know.
So is this legit? Or is she looking for her 15 minutes and maybe a big fat check? Still with me is Jean Casarez, correspondent with "In Session" on TruTV and joining us is Jim Moret, chief correspondent for "Inside Edition" and comedian Jeff Pirrami.
Ok. Let`s start with Jeff. Couldn`t anyone say they had sex with anyone if there`s no way to prove it?
JEFF PIRRAMI, COMEDIAN: I do it all the time. I do it all the time.
BEHAR: Do you really?
PIRRAMI: No, but don`t you think -- I mean if she wanted to cash in, though, I think she would have kept the baby, don`t you think?
BEHAR: No, she`s a porn star. She`s not the -- she doesn`t have maternal instincts.
PIRRAMI: Yes, but you have to think about your retirement no matter what job you do, correct?
BEHAR: I don`t know about that, but she couldn`t prove it, right Jean?
CASAREZ: Well, you know I was thinking what can give her credibility? If you come out and say this I want to have some credibility behind me. If she had a miscarriage -- I don`t think you can prove it`s Tiger`s but if she had a miscarriage, there`re medical reports, privacy concerns, but she`s the patient -- she can release them.
BEHAR: And abortion.
CASAREZ: She can release the abortion records.
If she had a three-year affair as she said she did during the time that Tiger`s wife was pregnant with their two children, if there are pictures and things, she could show some credible things to corroborate what she already said.
BEHAR: But she doesn`t have DNA. She can say it`s Harry (INAUDIBLE) knocked her up.
PIRRAMI: What`s she going to do for it, right.
BEHAR: Exactly. Well, ex-porn star Joslyn James whose real name is Veronica Siwik-Daniels says that her affair with Tiger resulted in two pregnancies. Listen to what she told "Inside Edition".
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JOSLYN JAMES, ALLEGED TIGER WOODS MISTRESS: First one was when she was pregnant with Sam and the second one was when she was pregnant with Charlie. I didn`t tell him.
JIM MORET, CHIEF CORRESPONDENT, "INSIDE EDITION": Why?
JAMES: Actually, the day that I was going to tell him, I ended up having a miscarriage.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
BEHAR: Now Jim that was your interview. Do you believe her about the pregnancies? Her stepmom she`s a compulsive liar.
MORET: I did believe her. And I wasn`t the only person in the room. There were about ten of us in the room, and we all found her to be credible. She was sitting alongside her attorney, Gloria Allred. Gloria has been approached by --
BEHAR: Shocking -- Gloria Allred is her attorney? I can`t believe it.
MORET: And Gloria has been approached by several other alleged mistresses and she`s turned down many of them, but she took this case. And I`ll tell you something.
What was interesting was she has a great deal of empathy for Elin. She said that she had the abortion -- she never brought this up to Tiger. She never asked him for money, Tiger asked her and she did quit her job as a porn actress, because she said he became jealous.
I`ll tell you what`s interesting, a lot of these women are coming forward not because they`re necessarily looking for money, but because they`re angry because they thought they were the only other woman. This woman asked Tiger repeatedly, is there anyone else you`re seeing I`m fine being you`re mistress I don`t want to be Mrs. Tiger Woods. He said you`re the only one and she feels, in her words, like an idiot.
BEHAR: Go ahead Jeff what do you want to say?
PIRRAMI: Well, I know and I read it in "Sports Illustrated" that it can`t be true, because Tiger always puts covers on his clubs.
BEHAR: One of them.
PIRRAMI: In his clubs he does --
BEHAR: Now -- but why is she -- Jim -- if she never told him in those days, why would she start telling it now? I mean, what`s -- the timing is a little suspicious, isn`t it? Is it because she`s pissed off because there`s other woman, she`s a porn star, you know, she`s not exactly Mother Teresa here.
MORET: Yes I understand it. No, and she doesn`t present herself as Mother Teresa.
BEHAR: No.
MORET: You`re right, Joy. Although, she -- she says he was outed, if you will, as his mistress by a Web site, then she retained Gloria when there was somebody trying to sell golf balls with these various mistresses` pictures on them. She felt that that promoted violence against women. I don`t really agree with that.
That`s why she came forward. She says that since she was outed by this Web site she`s received numerous threats on her e-mails; she shut down her Facebook account. She`s lived in hiding. She just wanted to come clean and tell these stories.
Look, if there`s a book in it, she just blew the headline, so I don`t think there`s a great deal of money for her in her future.
BEHAR: You know there is always an alternative to keep your mouth shut, you know what I mean?
MORET: Yes.
BEHAR: You always have that alternative. All right, let`s change the topic.
Film director Kevin Smith was apparently kicked off a Southwest flight this weekend for being too fat. So much for the lighter side of the news, Kevin? Southwest has since apologized to Smith, but did they have a legitimate beef? Oh, there`s no end to the puns.
Was he a safety risk? I mean, the guy was in his seat, he was not on the pilot`s lap, ok? So where is the safety risk in this particular case?
PIRRAMI: Joy, I really wasn`t here for the porn star, was I? I`m the fat bastard on the plane, right?
BEHAR: Well, I don`t know.
PIRRAMI: I can`t believe it --
BEHAR: You were, why not --
PIRRAMI: I just came back from Detroit, Joy, I flew back twice, three times last week --
BEHAR: Yes.
PIRRAMI: -- not a problem. I get a seat belt extender. I`ve got to be 150 pounds more then him. Maybe they threw him off because his movies are terrible? Do you think that maybe or not?
BEHAR: Well, I know but that`s an interesting that you bring up his movies.
PIRRAMI: There`s something`s wrong --
BEHAR: -- I don`t know if they are terrible enough but one is coming up right now and one of the producers is very paranoid here. And he said, maybe it has something to do with that.
JEAN CASAREZ, CORRESPONDENT, "IN SESSION" ON TRUTV: Well, as a lifetime member of weight watchers, I want to be biased for him.
BEHAR: Ok.
CASAREZ: But he purchased a ticket for two seats on an earlier flight --
BEHAR: Right.
CASAREZ: But he decided he wanted to go on the later flight.
So that shows, as an attorney, that shows his knowledge that he knew of the policy, wanted to adhere to the policy believed he needed to adhere the policy, then he wants to take the later flight. So he was on standby, one seat is left, he takes it because he wants to fly earlier, but then maybe he fits.
So then you have an issue --
BEHAR: But, but --
CASAREZ: -- so they have booted him off --
BEHAR: Yes.
CASAREZ: -- if he actually was able to go inside the two hand rails?
BEHAR: But if there are so many seats available on the plane, what is it to them? Why can`t they just leave it alone then?
CASAREZ: Well, then they say their policy is they refund the second seat, if it`s not a fully booked flight.
BEHAR: I see, I see, well, you know --
PIRRAMI: Once -- once I had though, and they got to extend it and put me in an emergency row I had sit by a mistake, because I wore an extender, I had to leave my seat, because they didn`t think I could help people. I said, well, I`ll throw them off the plane and I`ll get them off.
BEHAR: So there is that issue, so when you fly now Jeff, do you buy two seats?
PIRRAMI: No, I don`t buy two seats, but I just hope I don`t get in trouble that they put me on a no fat-fly list for coming on this show.
BEHAR: They could, ok, thanks everyone.
Up next, I`ll chat with the daughter of the newly-minted Senator Scott Brown. I hear she`s available, you know that cute daughter? Yes, we`ll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BEHAR: First her father told the world she was available on TV no less; then there was the Facebook picture of her and her sister in bikinis. So she`s launching a music career and playing basketball at Boston College, she`s no stranger to the public eye. And when your dad is Scott Brown the new senator and a dishy senator from Massachusetts, even more limelight is coming your way.
Ayla Brown, welcome to the show, my dear.
AYLA BROWN, DAUGHTER OF SENATOR SCOTT BROWN: Thank you.
BEHAR: Your father is very cute. I have to tell you.
BROWN: Well, I will let him know that you said that.
BEHAR: I think he knows it already.
BROWN: Does he?
BEHAR: Oh yes.
BROWN: Have you told him that I don`t know about or --
BEHAR: No, no but I think he knows that he`s cute because he posed in -- you know.
BROWN: He did when he was quite young, he did.
BEHAR: Yes, we`ll get to that in a second. But a lot of people are surprised by what he said at the victory speech. So let`s watch that.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. SCOTT BROWN (R), MASSACHUSETTS: And as always, I rely on Gayle`s love and support and that of our two lovely daughters, so I want to thank Ayla and Arianna for their help as well. And just -- and just in case anybody who`s watching throughout the country, yes, they`re both available.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BEHAR: Ok. So that made big headlines, because it was actually --
BROWN: It did.
BEHAR: -- it was rather amusing, actually. And what was going through your head when he said that? Were you humiliated or not?
BROWN: I was in total shock, to be honest. Like I had no idea, I was looking at the prompter the whole time, just because you know, it`s hard to look at all the people and the crowd staring right at you. So I look at the monitor a bunch of times. None of that was in the script.
So when he said that, literally my face just dropped. I`m like, oh, my gosh I cannot believe he just said that I was single. It`s true, I`m single --
BEHAR: You are?
BROWN: I didn`t want the whole world to know it, but that`s just my dad being dad. And I think every daughter could relate to how I was feeling in that exact moment.
BEHAR: Yes.
BROWN: Yes.
BEHAR: And -- but he`s kind of wacky -- you`re father in that way then?
BROWN: I mean, he is a dad. Aren`t dads all a little wacky at times?
BEHAR: Oh, yes, oh much wackier than him. So did you get a lot of offers after that?
BROWN: I did.
BEHAR: Yes.
BROWN: Some really creepy ones --
BEHAR: Yes.
BROWN: -- definitely a lot of Facebook messages. And I tried to get back to everyone who said congratulations, but there were just some on Facebook who were just a little out of line. So I (INAUDIBLE).
BEHAR: Well, that`s what you have to worry about when they put you out there like that.
BROWN: Yes I mean, it`s definitely been kind of different. I mean, let`s just say I didn`t have a Valentine yesterday, but you know someday I will.
BEHAR: You`ll have a Valentine.
BROWN: Someday I will have a Valentine but not with any of the people that are trying to get at me on Facebook.
BEHAR: Now, your father also, you know, years ago he posed nude in "Cosmo". So how does it make you feel to see that picture of your daddy?
BROWN: There he is.
BEHAR: I mean, that has got to be deep.
BROWN: I mean, honestly --
BEHAR: Yes.
BROWN: -- it happened when I was so young that I don`t even think about it. It`s kind of like a part of our --
BEHAR: Before you`re time really --
BROWN: Exactly.
BEHAR: But you were already born when he did that?
BROWN: No, I wasn`t.
BEHAR: Oh before you were born?
BROWN: He was in law school.
BEHAR: Oh, ok.
BROWN: I wasn`t even a thought in my dad`s mind yet.
BEHAR: So -- what if you wanted to pose nude for "Playboy", let`s say. How would he feel about that? Because you know, he can`t say, "Hey you can`t do it."
BROWN: Well, exactly, he`s actually --
BEHAR: Yes.
BROWN: -- commented before and said that if Arianna or I we wanted to pose nude, then he couldn`t judge us for it because he`s done it. So I`m not saying Arianna and I would want to, I think the bikini picture that you`ve seen is racy enough.
BEHAR: Let`s see that. Let`s look at the Facebook picture that made the rounds, popping up on the huff post. We`ll get to that.
There you are.
BROWN: There it is. Look at us.
BEHAR: There it is. There you are.
BROWN: You know that was for my grandma`s surprise 70th birthday.
BEHAR: Grandma?
BROWN: Yes. My grandma. That`s our house up in New Hampshire.
BEHAR: Whose idea was it to have your grandmother see you in a bikini?
BROWN: Well, I mean it was just me and my sister`s idea -- my mom had a Hawaiian beach theme, so we being innocent girls, decided to put on the actual bikinis, and walk around.
BEHAR: It was a perfectly innocent picture.
BROWN: It was only family that was there.
BEHAR: How did that get out, anyway?
BROWN: It was posted on Facebook. Someone had taken it from my Facebook and immediately put it out to everyone.
BEHAR: When you put it on Facebook you didn`t realize it was going to go out to the world.
BROWN: I did not realize. And ever since that aired, I had to make all my pictures private so no one can really see it anymore.
BEHAR: You learned a lesson.
Sit tight, we`ll be back with more from Ayla Brown in a minute.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
(AYLA BROWN SINGING)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BEHAR: That was Senator Scott Brown`s daughter, Ayla Brown. While her father is beginning his career as the nation`s newest senator, she`s starting her career as a professional singer.
Let`s check out her latest music video for "Pick it up" from her new "Circles".
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
(AYLA BROWN`S MUSIC VIDEO)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BEHAR: Did you write that?
BROWN: No, I did not, actually. I co-wrote three out of five songs, but this was not one of the ones that I wrote.
BEHAR: You were on "American Idol" in season 5.
BROWN: With Taylor Hicks and Katharine who you just had on your show the other day.
BEHAR: Yes, Katharine McPhee. And how did you do?
BROWN: I came in 13th overall --
BEHAR: That`s good.
BROWN: Got eliminated right before the top 12. At the time I thought it was the most devastating moment in my life, but in reality I was still going to be a basketball player and I didn`t want to give up my dreams of going to college. I think that`s really important. Because a lot of (INAUDIBLE) -- they didn`t even go to school after, because they`re like, "Oh, I`ll just get a record contract."
But I think it`s so important to get your education. So regardless, I would have gone to college, no matter what.
BEHAR: How did they treat you? How did Simon treat you?
BROWN: Simon treated me ok. I mean, at the end, he came around. The last song that I sang "Unwritten by Natasha Beddingfield, he actually said really good things about it.
BEHAR: He did?
BROWN: He did.
BEHAR: Have you been watching it this season?
BROWN: Of course.
BEHAR: What do you think about Ellen going over there?
BROWN: I think that she`s really, really funny. I`m interested to see how she does live because it`s really different. I mean the way that they edit it, you can just tell, but I`m a big fan of Ellen. I think that she`ll do a good job.
It`s nice to see a different ear being a judge. You could have the most experienced, but when people are buying music and you`re listening to music in your house, you know what you want to hear or listen to. That`s what Ellen is there for.
BEHAR: So you`re going to have a music career, your father is in the senate now, you`re a political daughter. What do you think of someone like Megan McCain, who is out there. She has to speak, you know publicly about politics. Are you going to do that?
BROWN: I mean, I`m obviously going to support my dad no matter what he does because I`m so proud of him.
BEHAR: Even if he killed somebody.
BROWN: What? That is so outrageous.
BEHAR: You can`t just say I`m going to support my father no matter what he does.
BROWN: What he did for the Commonwealth of Massachusetts was very, very rewarding for my family. And I will be there to support him.
BEHAR: Were you surprised -- was the family shocked that he won?
BROWN: At first when he was running, we were like, you`re kind over your head, this is a liberal state, very Democratic.
BEHAR: And him being a Republican in many ways. He`s pro-choice, right?
BROWN: You know, I`m not going to talk about policies with you.
BEHAR: Oh no? Ok. I know he`s pro-choice.
BROWN: But he -- yes, he`s pro-choice, I guess, but that`s what -- he was just a great spokesperson for the people of Massachusetts. You could tell the momentum was really, really changing in Massachusetts the week and a half before the election. And it was obvious. It was obvious that he was going to win. But before that we weren`t really sure.
BEHAR: His opponent was not that good, part of the problem, Martha Coakley.
BROWN: Many people have said that, but I think where she went wrong was by running negative ads constantly. You couldn`t turn on the radio or the TV without seeing a negative ad about my dad. It just was counterproductive on her part.
BEHAR: Well, good luck to you in your music career. Good luck to your father. Good luck to everybody.
BROWN: Thank you.
BEHAR: Ayla Brown. Her new EP "Circles" is out now on iTunes.
Up next, did "Family Guy" cross the line with a Trig Palin joke? Ann Coulter weighs in.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BEHAR: Well, today is Presidents` Day where we honor our leaders by buying linens half off. But it feels more like its Vice Presidents` Day as Dick Cheney and Joe Biden are going at it lingua a lingua. While VP want to be Sara Palin is never more than six degrees from a headline. Well, Cheney continues his verbal assault on the Obama Administration, Joe Biden has begun returning fire. And this is anything but a bore war.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JOE BIDEN, FORMER VICE PRESIDENT: The thing I learned from watching this process unfold, though, was that the administration really wasn`t equipped to deal with the aftermath of an attempted attack against the United States, in the sense they didn`t know what to do with the guy.
DICK CHENEY, VICE PRESIDENT: He`s entitled to his own opinions. He`s not entitled to rewrite history. He`s not entitled to his own facts.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BEHAR: Joining me tonight is Ann Coulter, Conservative commentator and author of "Guilty Liberal Victims and Their Assault on America." I have trouble even say it. And Hillary Rosen, CNN political contributor. Hi, guys.
So which VP won the weekend? Ann, you can start.
ANN COULTER, CONSERVATIVE COMMENTS: I must say that seeing Joe Biden on TV is the one thing that makes me always feel sorry for President Obama. I mean this is like having Lyndon Larouche as our Vice President. He`s just this crazy -
BEHAR: Lyndon Larouche.
COULTER: Crazy things all the time, including with both he and Obama having ferociously oppose the war in Iraq, ferociously opposing and voting against the surge, Biden announcing, I think our success in Iraq is going to be one of the great accomplishments of the Obama Administration.
BEHAR: Well he`s ending, well, they`re ending the war. So I think they can take credit.
COULTER: That is a crazy statement. Obama would not have said that.
BEHAR: I know. It`s something you would say. Okay, Hillary? Hillary.
HILLARY ROSEN, CNN POLITICAL CONTRIBUTOR: I`m not sure what - what show Ann was watching. First of all, I think President Obama`s lucky to have Joe Biden there. He`s actually been to Iraq 17 times or something like that in the last several years, certainly more than Ann`s been there.
COULTER: Of course, but a virus has been there more often. That doesn`t make it a good Vice President.
ROSEN: What he said about Iraq was really important, which was our success in Iraq is because we are successfully transitioning to an Iraqi police force and Iraqi security force. He also said that it was still a war we shouldn`t have been in that cost resources and took our eye off the ball. And then Dick Cheney in some never-never land that his operating in said that President Obama should be thanking George Bush because that Obama is going to have success in Iraq. It is just nuts that Cheney would still believe that. And that you`re repeating that is even nuttier.
BEHAR: Ann, you are not exactly the pinnacle of uncomplicated statements and crazy stuff. You said, it almost is kind of effective to send out this, quote, "drunken Irishman to respond to Dick Cheney, it is like sending out the White House dog." Biden doesn`t drink. Why would you call him a drunken Irishman?
COULTER: No, you`re right, I will take that back. I count among my friends some fabulous --
BEHAR: Who is this -
COULTER: Drunken Irishmen, and I apologize to them, I meant to say delusional nut case on a par with Lyndon Larouche. Let`s go through some of his statements during the campaign about how we`ll wheel together with France, joined hands and drove Hezbollah out of Lebanon.
BEHAR: Uh huh.
COULTER: Can we review that insane statement by Joe Biden?
BEHAR: Well there`s a lot of crazy things -
COULTER: Hezbollah is in Lebanon, it`s one of the two major parties.
BEHAR: Okay but we`re off the track. We are talking about this now.
COULTER: Okay but this is the Vice President, and we`re all acting like this is a CRU statesman.
BEHAR: What Cheney said about the underwear bomber, the thing I learned was that the administration wasn`t equipped to deal with the aftermath of an attempt of attack against the United States and I sensed that they didn`t know what to do with the guy. Now isn`t Cheney, Hillary, isn`t he doing a disservice to his country by telling everybody it`s weak and vulnerable and all that? That`s not very smart to do. I don`t think.
ROSEN: Particularly since, you know, we deal with all apparel bombers the same way. We, when the shoe bomber was dealt with the same way, he was questioned in a civilian capacity and then by the military intelligence services. And that`s exactly what the Obama Administration did with the underwear bomber. So the idea that somehow we are changing policy or acting weak on suspects is just nuts.
COULTER: That`s a totally false history that keeps being repeated. And I would like to correct it. Yes, Bush immediately after 9/11 had issued an executive order requiring military tribunals for terrorists, Democrats denounced him, Left-wing lawyers started suing. We had to have two laws passed by Congress. We had to have two Supreme Court cases working their way through the courts. The first military tribunal because of Liberals cater walling did not take place until 2008.
At that point the process was ready. At that point any terrorist who came here should have been put on a military tribunal. Obama didn`t have to deal with that because the Bush Administration reflected these liberals.
(CROSSTALK)
ROSEN: What`s the beauty of a military tribunal versus a civilian court? I mean the reality is, despite the rant, that you know, three people have been tried in military courts.
COULTER: Under Bush.
ROSEN: Under Bush.
COULTER: Right.
ROSEN: Two of them are on the streets now, based on Bush`s military tribunals, where several hundred have been tried in civilian courts and are still in prison. This is a complete misnomer that somehow under civilian courts systems that people are going to be treated less harshly.
COULTER: I don`t believe the numbers, but I`ll tell you the difference is.
ROSEN: It`s true.
COULTER: You don`t have to be Mirandized. You don`t need a search warrant before going into Khalid Shaikh Mohammed`s cave and taking his computer. I don`t know how you can use any of that evidence in a civilian court. You don`t have to worry about a speedy trial. You don`t have to worry about a fair trial, with the President and everyone under him going around saying oh he`ll be convicted, he`ll be convicted.
The point is we`re not trying to catch people after they commit crimes, put together a case for a court like it`s Martha Stewart being pursued for insider trading. You want to stop terrorists from acting again. This is not like a bank robber.
ROSEN: You`re actually angry over nothing. Because nothing you just said has done one thing to stop any terrorist investigations. There`s complete confidence in evidence coordination and convictions.
COULTER: I don`t care about the investigations. I care about terrorist attacks.
BEHAR: All right let`s switch topics, okay?
COULTER: Yes okay A.D.D has moved on.
BEHAR: I have too much A.D.D for that topic. Let`s switch to someone who almost became our Vice President, Sarah Palin. Last night "Family Guy" made a thinly veiled reference to Palin in an attempt to be funny. Watch this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED: Are you going to be rude all evening? You haven`t asked me anything about myself.
UNIDENTIFIED: Oh, um, sorry. So what do your parents do?
UNIDENTIFIED: That`s better. My dad`s an accountant and my mom is the former Governor of Alaska.
UNIDENTIFIED: That`s cool.
UNIDENTIFIED: It`s real cool.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BEHAR: What is that about? What do you think about that? Did they cross the line on "Family Guy"?
COULTER: Yes, I think "Family Guy" is better when they`re ripping off "The Simpsons" and Trey Parker and Matt Stone. When he does stuff on his own, not so funny.
BEHAR: Do you think that was defensive? I mean basically they`re saying, they seem to be, this is what I gleaned from this whole thing is that that that character is supposed to be slightly retarded, I guess, and they`re making fun of Sarah Palin`s kid, right? Is that right?
COULTER: Hillary is that right?
ROSEN: I think that`s right. That`s clearly what they were doing, although --
COULTER: The fact that Sarah Palin is involved I think isn`t what makes it offensive in my opinion. It`s offensive just on its face.
ROSEN: In a bizarre way, though, as a you know, an out of the box defense of artistic freedom here, the character is actually a fairly strong, assertive character and you know it wasn`t a terribly insulting portrayal. Having said that, Sarah Palin herself is terribly politicized the situation with her own children and I think it should all be off- limits.
BEHAR: She`s the only one who keeps mentioning that child. The left doesn`t even mention the child. Meanwhile --
ROSEN: Well with "Family Guy" here.
BEHAR: Well we don`t know if they`re Left - what their politics are over there. We don`t know. They`re cartoonists.
COULTER: No, but they brought up this retarded kid and said my mother was the Governor of Alaska. That`s not Sarah Palin bringing it up. And I think it`s totally unfair to say a candidate coming out at the convention to give her speech doesn`t bring her family on stage? That would be freakish and weird. Every other Vice President around the country
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: Oh the it`s ridiculous at the Republican Convention, one after another after another.
COULTER: What are they supposed to do? Drop it?
BEHAR: No, you don`t have to pass the baby around so much.
ROSEN: Well I think the whole issue with Sarah Palin`s child got really out of control, and she overstepped the line when she said it was okay for Rush Limbaugh to say -
BEHAR: Right.
ROSEN: You know, to accuse people of being retarded, which, by the way, is not an accusation. That`s just a fact of life.
BEHAR: No but she said that Limbaugh got away with it.
ROSEN: And that she said it`s okay if Rush Limbaugh said it but not okay if Rahm Emanuel said it.
BEHAR: Right and the reason Rush Limbaugh -
ROSEN: Because he crossed the line.
BEHAR: Was okay was because she said it was satire, now this supposedly is satire too. So we are all waiting to see what`s Sarah`s going to take on her Facebook.
COULTER: Now, I will agree with the two on you, I think Republicans make a mistake when they try to play this politically correct game of this word and this word are not appropriate. I think she got herself -- she stepped into a mess with that.
BEHAR: She did.
ROSEN: She did. We agree.
BEHAR: So while Sarah gets beaten up by the Left, Obama is taking it on the chin from the Right. Apparently some religious people are praying for his death. How is that okay? Here`s the little prayer that we -- that they did -- may his days be few, may another take his place of leadership, maybe his children better fatherless and his wife a widow. It`s religious people praying for his death?
COULTER: These are not religious people, they are not Christian. They can call themselves whatever you said.
BEHAR: Pastor Wyle Drape, Arizona preacher Steven Anderson.
COULTER: There`s no Christian who would say that`s acceptable prayer. We are a country of 300 million people and A few of them are going to be nuts. Oh, well.
BEHAR: Well I don`t know about that.
COULTER: This isn`t a movement. I`m a Christian. No Christian would say that a Christian can pray for another person`s death. You can pray for someone to come to God but you don`t - that`s why they are called Evangelicals, you evangelize -- you do not.
BEHAR: During the Tea Party things, I saw a lot of signs that were sort of implying that they should kill Obama.
(CROSSTALK)
COULTER: The ugliest signs that got traced back were Larouche-it, the Left Wingers.
BEHAR: Are you dating this guy Larouche, I`ve heard you mention his name four times now.
COULTER: They were - the Obama and Hitler sign that was a Larouche- ite.
BEHAR: Uh huh.
COULTER: It was all over the news as -- he`s a Left-winger.
ROSEN: No, no, no.
BEHAR: Come on.
ROSEN: Sorry, Ann Coulter is the author of the famous "Mein Kampf" article where you know she accused President Obama of being Adolf Hitler too.
COULTER: I don`t think I accused him of being Adolf Hitler, but I would recommend everyone go to anncoulter.com and read my columns.
BEHAR: What did you say. What did you say?
ROSEN: Yes -- you said his policies were no better.
COULTER: No, I didn`t. I said nothing like that. I had a review of his autobiography. And I said you know, people have read "Mein Kampf" they might have known too. It was making fun of his autobiography.
BEHAR: Oh you know, once you bring in Hitler, you are in trouble all ready.
COULTER: Oh that`s like Sarah Palin and the retard remark if you people are going to pull that on me.
BEHAR: Thank you, ladies.
Up next the controversy surrounding Brazil`s carnival queen who happens to be 7 year old girl.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BEHAR: A lot of people are talking about a 7-year-old Brazilian girl named Julia Lira, a third grader, chosen to head a samba group, in Rio Carnivale. The kind of a sexually charged position usually reserved for seductive actresses and bomb shell fashion models. So is this child exploitation? Or are people just overreacting? Here now to discuss are a pageant moment whose daughter Eden is featured on TLC`s "Toddlers and Tiaras" Mickie Wood. Child Psychologist and parenting expert Laura Markham. And syndicated advice columnist for the "Chicago Tribune", Amy Dickinson. Let me start with you, Mickey. Should a 7-year-old -
MICKIE WOOD, PAGEANT MOM: All right.
BEHAR: Should a 7 year old child be put in this position, do you think?
WOOD: Well, from everything that I`ve read and the pictures I`ve seen, I think probably this is quite an honor for this little girl. It`s my understanding there`s been thousands of children that auditioned and, you know, the child`s father is very involved and I believe had a hand in making sure that her costume was age appropriate. And as far as the sexually charged part, I think the headliners are Beyonce and Madonna, maybe, you know, since dad`s involved and they`re trying to add a new aspect and maybe bring something in for the kids. And like I said, it`s my understanding this little girl beat out, you know, thousands of samba dancers, so you know -- this is --
BEHAR: But it is reported -- it is reported that the little girl broke down and cried when she was put in front of the reporters with cameras. Dr. Laura, isn`t this a sign it may be too much her?
LAURA MARKHAM, CHILD PSYCHOLOGIST: I think it`s a clear signal. This was just the reporters and the cameras. And you know, you put her out there in front of thousands of people, what`s going to happen to her inside then?
BEHAR: Right.
MARKHAM: Even if she keeps dancing -
BEHAR: Right.
MARKHAM: What`s going on inside emotionally?
BEHAR: Well Mickey, your daughter has been in pageants since she was 15 months old. Why did you put her in so young?
WOOD: Well just for that very reason. So she would be used to being up in the public or in front of the people, even if nothing ever came from the entertainment instrument or she didn`t want to be a stage performer, or even do pageants, at least that gave her that early exposure to being up in front of the public eye. And even if it was just for a book report in seventh grade, I can remember going back in my memory and just trembling you know when I was in junior high at the fact you had to get up in front of your peers in a biology or science class and give a report. It was just horrifying to me. So --
BEHAR: Well, there`s another way to training you to public speaking. I mean there are book reports you could give without little tutus on, I mean let`s face it. That`s the way I got over it when I was a child. What do you think about this, Amy?
AMY DICKINSON, SYNDICATED ADVICE COLUMNIST, CHICAGO TRIBUNE: This is outrageous. And for this mother, frankly --
BEHAR: Who Mickie?
DICKINSON: Yes. For Mickie to you know she`s doing nothing but training this child to sort of serve this parent -- it`s always about parents. Let`s just start there. This little samba taught, it`s all about her parents getting what they need. It`s not about her at all. This is an incredibly sexual event. Last year --
BEHAR: Just a minute, go ahead, Mickie, you can respond that. Let her answer that.
WOOD: But what makes you think -- how do you know this people. How do you know that this is all about the parents? That`s just like saying that you know me. This is -- I had a life. I was 40 years old when I had my child. I had sang in clubs, I done things in musical theater, I had sang in bars, my goodness, you know you don`t know me to make that blanket statement. Yes, yes, there are people out there that are doing exact that, and I think that a lot of time that we blanket everybody into that stereo typical mold, and it`s an honor to me for, you know the Brazilian holiday of Carnivale, that`s like you know the Rose Bowl to us in American. It`s an honor.
BEHAR: But you know, you know, yes Mickie, just I think these women are concerned of sexual exploitation. You know 15 percent of sexual assault and rape victims in this country are under 12 years old. And I think that maybe the costuming and the moves are kind of provocative. What do you say to that? That men are ogling the children?
WOOD: I agree that a lot of the children are sexually abused, but I think that the statistics show it`s usually by someone they know, a relative, or, you know, a -- I mean -- there are per vertebrae and six people in Walmart. They are everywhere. That`s where us as a parent comes in. And it really upsets me that someone who does not know this family in Brazil has not, you know, been with their family - you don`t know that that`s what they`re to their child, you don`t --
BEHAR: Uh huh go ahead Amy, let Dr. Laura jump in, okay Dr. Laura let`s hear what you think.
MARKHAM: You know I`m a child psychologist.
BEHAR: Right.
MARKHAM: We always look at what`s in the best interest of the child. I don`t think there`s any way that you can say, no matter how much you love your child it`s in her best interest to stand up in 104 degrees heat Fahrenheit and dance for hours. There`s just no way that would be good, starting there. Forget the exploitation sexually.
BEHAR: Well even if it`s not something like this, even in a pageant like your daughter was in Mickie -- if the child loses that`s kind of going to be traumatic for a young kid under the age of five or six years old.
MARKHAM: Under the age of -
BEHAR: Three.
MARKHAM: Let`s talk about -
BEHAR: If they lose the pageant, just that alone, forget about the sexual part of it, just the fact that you know -- the disappointment and rejection is very hard for children. How do you address that?
WOOD: Isn`t that what life is all about? That`s what we as a parent have to do. We have to -- whether it is winning a football game or getting an "A" or having a successful job interview, that`s where the parent -- the parenting comes in. Good grief, that`s what America --
BEHAR: We have to take a break. Don`t go anywhere. We`ll be right back in a moment with more.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BEHAR: I`m back with my panel. You know the girl`s mother said that she put her daughter on a special diet to handle all that excursion in Rio`s 100 degrees temperatures. Isn`t that disturbing to you Dr. Laura?
MARKHAM: Yes because clearly there is a risk factor here.
BEHAR: She`s just a baby.
MARKHAM: The mother is trying to manage it. But actually not managing it, she`s saying yes against her better judgment, clearly or she wouldn`t have brought this issue up. She`s saying yes and the definition of parenting is that sometimes you have to say no when it`s against your better judgment to say yes, you don`t say yes.
BEHAR: Well I think that Mickie`s point is that it is not against her better judgment to say no. Her judgment is that it`s a good thing for the kid. Right Mickie? Wouldn`t you agree with what I just said.
WOOD: Well I think with anything, you have to use some common sense. I mean, at least the mom is looking ahead and realizing you know the strenuous heat and vigorous activity that this child is going to be going through for however long.
BEHAR: Would you put your child in that position? Would you put your kid in that position?
WOOD: If -- I think it goes, again, with the parenting. It`s whatever -- that is the thing in Brazilian culture, to be chosen. You know, it`s kind of like the Miss America Pageant or the pro football player. Just think of all of the two a days that all over America that football boys from junior high on even up to college --
BEHAR: Well, that`s a little different.
DICKINSON: It`s different because we are not putting them up and judging them solely on their looks. We are not sexualizing them. You know Mickie, you take a lot about parenting. What kids need is for parents to be heroes in their live, mentors in their lives. They don`t need their parents to exploit them. And, frankly, I understand your child has her own TV show now and that is --
WOOD: Yes.
DICKINSON: -- really frightening.
BEHAR: Why? Why is it frightening?
WOOD: Yes, why is it frightening.
DICKINSON: Well I`ll tell you why. Because the child turns into the family bread winner. And it`s all about what you as the parent want and not about what she wants.
WOOD: Well, I understand that in a lot of cases that that is exactly the truth. But you know her dad and I both work. We have always worked. We have -- I have a good mom and dad that, you know, I was very fortunate. Let`s just put it that way. Eden is maybe a little different because she came along so late in our lives that we do have a little bit more to offer her at any time. No matter what it is, if she does not want to do a pageant or sing a song or you know ten years from now, it`s --
DICKINSON: This is about consent.
WOOD: No, no, no. I understand what you are saying but let me make my point. We have lessons. I teach school. If anybody, you know -- I`ve taught school for 23 years. I know exactly what you`re saying. I`ve seen the child stars one right after another. I mean, this is not our life. This is not really what I set out to have happen. It`s almost like it just happened and we`re having to roll with it. So --
BEHAR: All right.
DICKINSON: But the daughter is 4 years old. She didn`t create this.
WOOD: Let me finish -
BEHAR: The child could not make a decision at 15 months when she started.
WOOD: I understand that. Oh, I understand that very well. I mean, you know you don`t have to be a roll scholar to know that.
BEHAR: Okay, we`ve run out of time. Thanks very much, ladies, for joining me. The season finale of "Toddlers and Tiara" is this Wednesday at 10:00 p.m. on TLC. You judge for yourselves. Good night, everybody.
END
