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Joy Behar Page
Mel Gibson`s Meltdown?; Interview With Bret Michaels
Aired July 13, 2010 - 21:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
JOY BEHAR, HOST: Tonight, one of Mel Gibson`s friends says Mel went to therapy to work on his troubled relationship with Oksana Grigorieva. I wonder, is punching a woman in the face Freudian or Gestalt? Then, even with legislative victories like healthcare and financial reform, a new poll says President Obama`s approval ratings are the lowest ever. You know, this guy definitely needs a new press agent. And in the past year, Bret Michaels had an appendectomy, diabetes, a brain hemorrhage and a minor stroke. Thank goodness it didn`t affect his headband. My buddy, Brett the rock star, joins me. That and more right now.
Well, Mel Gibson has gone from the A list to the [bleep] list faster than he can say the `N` word. RadarOnline has posted yet another audio tape where Mel Gibson is lashing out his ex-girlfriend, Oksana Grigorieva. Oksana confirms it`s her voice on the tape and claims the other voice is Gibson`s. Listen.
(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)
Male: Don`t you dare [bleep] complain to me [bleep] I can hear you. You don`t [bleep] count. You`re a [bleep] using [bleep]. What are you talking about you [bleep] ignorant [bleep], I don`t understand you. You`re saying stupid [bleep]. How dare you [bleep] insult me with some of the stupid reasoning you have. You`re logic sucks because you`re a [bleep] deprived idiot.
(END AUDIO CLIP)
BEHAR: Sounds like something from the Soprano`s, doesn`t it? We all know what he`s done, we just don`t know why. Should he be on the couch, on lithium or on lockdown? With me now is Debra Opri, family law attorney, A.J. Hammer, host of HLN`s Showbiz Tonight and Jeff Gardere, Clinical Psychologist and host of VH1`s "Dad Camp". Let me start with Jeff.
JEFF GARDERE, CLINICAL PSYCHOLOGIST: Yes.
BEHAR: Does this guy sound like a batterer? Whoever this is, we`re not going to confirm that it`s his voice until they do a voice print.
GARDERE: It sounds like someone who has been involved in domestic violence, because, if nothing else, we hear that he threatens her physically, says very nasty things and so, if nothing else, is a verbal batterer and promises, to some extent, that, if he were with her that he would hurt her physically.
BEHAR: But he also says in other tapes, I mean we`ve listened to all of them at this point, I think there`s more coming out by the way.
GARDERE: Oh yes, oh sure.
BEHAR: He says, "I own you." He also said she needed a bat to the side of her head.
GARDERE: Yes, yes.
BEHAR: The verbal abuse in these tapes is off the chart, no?
GARDERE: Off the chart.
BEHAR: Off the chart.
GARDERE: It`s unbelievable. And quite frankly, if it`s not Mel Gibson, give this person a development deal. I mean, seriously, what an unbelievable impression. But again, we can neither confirm nor deny that it is Mel Gibson.
BEHAR: It`s like Frank Gorshin reincarnated.
GARDERE: But it`s just frightening. And we`ve had to play them on our shows each and every day. And it`s the kind of a thing, you know we stay a little removed from a lot of what we talk about and what we cover, but when I hear this voice saying these things, I`m shocked every time.
BEHAR: I know. You never quite get inured to all of it. Let`s listen to another part of the audio from RadarOnline. Listen.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
Female: You almost killed us. Did forget?
Male: The last three years have been a [bleep] gravy train for you.
Female: You were hitting a woman with a child in her hands. You. What kind of man is that, hitting a woman when she is holding a child in her hands, breaking her teeth twice in the face? What kind of man is that?
Male: Oh, you`re all angry now.
Female: You know what? [bleep] you`re going to answer, one day, boy, you`re going the answer.
Male: What, what, what, are you threatening me?
Female: Nothing, nothing. I`m not the one to threaten.
Male: I`ll put you in the [bleep] rose on you.
Female: What kind of man is that? What kind of man is that?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BEHAR: It`s poetry really, her part. Her part.
GARDERE: Well, it`s also very interesting because she is aware that this tape is being made.
BEHAR: Of course she is.
GARDERE: She knows her voice was being recorded. I think she sounds a little verbose for somebody who doesn`t know. And he`s certainly smart enough to know that there may be something going on and that it may be recorded, he`s a public figure. So why continue to do that? But this is someone who`s got a --
BEHAR: He`s so crazy. He`s not aware of it at the time.
GARDERE: Yes. He`s having a meltdown and he even starts laughing and acting like a child. He`s primal. He almost starts barking at some point. He`s completely, completely lost it, whoever this person may be.
BEHAR: Let me get Debra in here. Debra, he tells her she deserved getting punched in the face. He has no remorse whatsoever, right?
OPRI: No, this is a classic batterer syndrome. He`s going to make himself into the victim here. But frankly, I want to ask you something. Would you tolerate a relationship like this?
BEHAR: No.
OPRI: No. She`s the mother of his child and he`s threatening her with damage to her face, he`s calling her every emotionally abusive word in the book. If I represented Oksana, I`d say to her, you push this to the limit. Get custody away from him. Get him into a treatment center.
BEHAR: Which she did.
OPRI: Well, the bottom line is this. She --
BEHAR: I read somewhere that she was offered $10 million, which she turned down because she didn`t want to share custody with him. She did do her best to keep custody of the kid, right?
OPRI: Well the other thing is, these tapes, we have evidentiary problems, but these tapes are already out there. And if you really look at what he`s doing on these tapes, this is not a man who is ranting and raving one time. This seems like a standard operating procedure with this woman. This woman should be nowhere near him --
BEHAR: Yes, it does.
OPRI: He should be nowhere near the child. There should be no custody.
BEHAR: Should she be frightened of him since those tapes are out now?
OPRI: Yes.
BEHAR: Should she be more frightened that he will --
GARDERE: In other words, will he put her in the garden for sure?
BEHAR: Yes.
GARDERE: I think what he may end up doing is threatening even more and using every resource that he has to go after her, or even perhaps pull information to start making her look bad. So I think she should be fearful of that. And there is a restraining order in place and next week they`re going to get before a judge to see if that restraining order should hold up. I`m guessing it`s going to hold up, based on what we`re hearing.
OPRI: It`s going to hold up.
BEHAR: It`ll hold up. But you know, People Magazine reports that Mel sought therapy earlier in the relationship. Did it work?
GARDERE: I don`t think it worked at all and I think they need to fire that therapist, if the therapist didn`t fire themselves. This is something, these sorts of relationships, not quite like this one, I work with all the time in couples` therapy. And what we see is, when it gets to that point where they are physically verbally threatening, that`s the time that you just say, okay, everybody take a break or just completely dissolve this relationship, because there is no hope that it will work.
BEHAR: Right. Now, what really fascinates me about some of the domestic abuse cases is that the man in these cases often is the victim. I mean, it`s fascinating how they turn it around in their psychosis, you know? This is a quote that we don`t have on tape. [bleep] you -- they`ll bleep me.
GARDERE: I hope so.
BEHAR: I so [bleep] do because you hurt me so bad. You insult me with every [bleep] look, every breath, every [bleep] heartbeat, every selfish [bleep] heart beat you have. He`s the victim.
GARDERE: Well, that`s what we see typically in these domestic violence cases, that the person who is the oppressor, the one who is causing a lot of the damage, the only way they can justify that is to say, well, you pushed my buttons. You made me do this, that or another.
BEHAR: Right.
GARDERE: Listen, at this point, if this is Mel, this is someone who I can call the `N` word, narcissist. This is a guy who really believes --
BEHAR: Very lard to cure.
GARDERE: That`s right. If you cannot be there for me 1 million percent in the way that I need you, then you are the enemy.
BEHAR: And I own you. I own you. Isn`t it typical, Debra, for a batterer to see himself as the victim, you know, in your cases?
OPRI: Well, this batterer, if it is authenticated to be Mel`s voice, which at this point in time we have to assume it is, he`s looking at two to four years if he`s convicted of a felony. Terrorist threats, domestic violence, he is a danger to her and those immediate family members. That`s in the Code section. And he gets no visitation.
BEHAR: How much time could he get?
OPRI: Two to four years.
BEHAR: Two to four years, domestic violence, child endangerment, assault with a deadly weapon. Those are the three possible charges.
OPRI: Terrorist threats.
BEHAR: Terrorist threats did you say? Did you say terrorist threats?
OPRI: Yes, terrorist threats. Terrorist threats.
GARDERE: Here`s the thing. If he did in fact punch her in the mouth, allegedly she was holding the baby at the time. So we`re talking about possible damage to the child physically because she may have dropped the child or could have dropped the child, but even worse, that kind of violence being perpetrated in front of a child to the mother.
BEHAR: But he says, Jeff, he says in his response to all this, maybe you know this, that she was shaking the baby and he was trying to protect the baby.
GARDERE: Well, that`s a good way to protect the baby, by punching the mother in the mouth so she could possibly drop the baby --
BEHAR: Exactly.
GARDERE: -- into his arms and he could have caught her. I don`t think so.
BEHAR: Now what is this fixation with --
OPRI: I`d like to see that physical evidence.
BEHAR: Yes. What`s with the fixation on oral sex?
GARDERE: There`s a lot of that in there.
BEHAR: There`s a lot. He goes -- I`ll read it to you, then you respond to it. Shut -- I love to read it -- the [bleep] up. You should just [bleep] smile and blow me because I deserve it. And then he says, I`m going to come and burn the [bleep] house down, but you will blow me first. I never heard of arson as foreplay.
OPRI: That`s sexual assault. That is sexual assault threats.
GARDERE: Yes, well he`s hot, evidently. But I think part of what`s going on with that oral sex is, again, when we see that narcissistic personality, that you are nothing more than a tool that will service me and there is nothing else that I need you for. It`s not even real sex. I told you how scared I am, or how scary it is when you actually hear the words coming out of whoever`s voice this is, reportedly Mel Gibson.
BEHAR: You keep hearing that, you can`t just --.
GARDERE: I`m protecting the family, Joy.
BEHAR: Okay.
GARDERE: But honestly, hearing you say it it`s funny because we chuckle. We laugh hearing you read this, because the transcript reads unbelievably like this isn`t possible, this is a script. But it is real.
BEHAR: Right. I`ve never seen such rage. And the hyperventilating, unless he has emphysema, I don`t know what`s wrong with the guy.
GARDERE: And you mention that he reportedly went into therapy. The idea of this therapy, according to the People.com report, is so he could extricate himself peacefully and calmly from this relationship, because reportedly he had the therapy back in January, they split up in March.
BEHAR: Okay, thanks very much, everyone. Up next, we`ll try to figure out why Hollywood isn`t speaking out against Gibson. It`s interesting, stick around.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BEHAR: Well, Mel Gibson can`t keep his mouth shut, but the rest of Hollywood hasn`t been this quiet since the silent movies. Mel rants and raves and punches, and not a peep from other actors, directors or producers. What`s up with that? Joining me are people who actually Will talk. Manager Producer Howard Lapides, Roy Sekoff, Founding Editor of HuffingtonPost.com and Marvet Britto, President and CEO of the Britto Agency.
Okay, Roy, let me start with you. This is uncontrollable anger and rage. He`s a big movie star and yet no movie stars will speak out against him. Producers are silent. Are they afraid that he is going to regain his power base or something? What is that about?
SEKOFF: Here`s what it is. There`s a couple things that work, but the biggest thing is Hollywood is a town that never wants to close the door completely. They know that he`s 99.9 percent done, but you can see the meeting. They`re going, maybe he might have Passion of the Christ 2. You know, the Messiah`s back and he`s really pissed. You never want to take the chance that he`s got the next Avatar.
BEHAR: Oh my God. All right.
SEKOFF: You know what I`m saying? So they don`t want to do that.
BEHAR: Howard, is this an example of closing ranks? Do you agree with that?
LAPIDES: I agree. It`s a town that is run by money and if there looks like there could be money, look out, we`re going to go there and try to reap it. But it`s a shame. Somebody that has a public persona and then does things that are pretty well documented -- I mean, we don`t know, was that really him on the tape with his girlfriend? I don`t know.
BEHAR: Listen, if it rants like a duck and raves like a duck, it`s a duck.
SEKOFF: Either that or Rich Little is hanging out with his girlfriend.
BEHAR: Go ahead, Howard, finish your thought.
LAPIDES: Joy, you know, Will Jordan had a good Ed Sullivan. I mean, who knows?
BEHAR: Well you know, it`s fascinating to me, because Hollywood is not the Republican party.
LAPIDES: Right.
BEHAR: It`s run by a lot of gays, a lot of women, a lot of black people -- African-Americans and a lot of Jews. And yet, this is -- he hates all of them.
SEKOFF: Right.
BEHAR: So what the hell? I mean, what is it going to take for them to say, listen, the guy is a racist, he`s a homophobe, he`s an anti-Semite? I mean, how much more will it take, Marvet?
BRITTO: Well, it`s also a town where there are skeletons in many people`s closets. So, no one wants to open that door so that they could ever open up their own life for criticism, similar criticism. So, while he`s made repeated, habitual racial slurs towards various segments, I think people are being quiet about it because it`s really not their problem. And particularly this case with Mel Gibson, he`s had a quarterback, and a very powerful quarterback in Ed Limato, who`s been his long-time agent for over 32 years.
BEHAR: Well, can I put out that Ari Emanuel, at the William Morris Endeavor Agency, fired him. He got him out of the agency.
BRITTO: But he didn`t do that until Ed died a week ago. So, Ed served as the buffer --
BEHAR: Ari recognizes, I think, that after the anti-Semitic thing, they gave him a little bit of a pass because he was drunk. But now --
SEKOFF: But at the time though, don`t forget, Ari was one of the few people in Hollywood back then who came out and said something. He wrote on the Huffington Post the day that it happened and no one else kind of followed suit.
But the other thing that`s happening, Joy, is he`s doing such a marvelous job of self-destructing, anything is piling on. No, it`s kind of like, what can you say? It`s like saying that you`re against cancer, yes. What are you going to say? Yes, I`m against saying bad things about black people and punching a woman in the face when she`s holding her baby. I mean, what are you adding by saying that? Everybody knows that already.
BEHAR: I don`t know. What do you say to that, Howard?
LAPIDES: But it does fascinate me. It fascinates me about this town, that the town will come back some time and give this guy another opportunity or another chance. Me personally, forget about it. I mean, I was out on the highway thing, and I`m a Jew. Once the highway thing happened, forget me.
BEHAR: You don`t have to be Jewish, Howard, to be upset by this stuff.
LAPIDES: Oh I know.
SEKOFF: At this point we`re talking about misogyny and violence and threatening to kill somebody. He`s says, "I can put you in the rose garden, I can do it." I mean, that`s just mad rage.
BEHAR: Right. And the language that he uses against her. The misogyny, the hatred of women.
SEKOFF: He hopes she`s being raped.
LAPIDES: And my God, our children are looking up to this man. Is this -- I mean, can`t we just tell him to take his billion dollars, get out of our business, get off our screens, just go away, or get yourself some help.
BEHAR: Yes, go ahead. Even his allies are not -- I mean, like Jodie Foster said no comment. Danny Glover said no comment. Let`s see, Robert De Niro said, "I hope Mel gets through it." What`s up with Robert De Niro?
LAPIDES: I hope he gets through it. Hoping he gets through it means hopefully maybe he gets some help from someone. So that comment, there is --
BEHAR: Are you shocked that Danny Glover doesn`t have a comment?
BRITTO: I`m not shocked at all. Again, it`s really difficult for people. They don`t know the inner workings. They really don`t know what`s going on, so they`re seemingly trying to be a Hollywood community and band together by not speaking against Mel. But again, this is a slur after slur, it`s just really to the point where he needs help and someone really needs to step up, more of them having those influences in his life and get him some help. And maybe if another actor spoke up they would help him.
BEHAR: Maybe. Go ahead, Howard.
LAPIDES: He needs some serious help. He needs some serious help. It`s like taking him through a car wash and getting him the carnauba wax and then maybe he`ll come out on the other side okay.
BEHAR: Right.
LAPIDES: But right now, this guy needs help.
BEHAR: Pretend he has a new carburetor.
SEKOFF: And then, at the end of the day, if you you`re Danny Glover and you`ve done ten Lethal Weapon movies, you make millions because of this guy that comes to you, don`t you say, "Listen, I`ll let Al Sharpton, I`ll let Jesse Jackson handle that. I`ll take a pass on this one."
BRITTO: He didn`t always offend African-Americans, so it`s not about Reverend Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson, they`ll just speak up and defend every issue. They`re very meticulous. This isn`t about one segment, this is about him offending communities and very specific people. So the Hollywood community really should be speaking up and really speaking up to try to get Mel some help. That`s what this is really about.
BEHAR: Well whatever they have to say. I mean, I would hate to have been a Jew in Germany in the `30s when nobody spoke up. Harvey -- what am I saying, Harvey -- Marvet, Howard, thanks. Roy. Who`s Harvey? Sit tight. It`s the imaginary rabbit that he attacked.
SEKOFF: He didn`t like them either.
BEHAR: I know. Sit there, though, Roy, because I want to get your take on President Obama`s approval ratings are dropping. What`s the matter with that?
[Commercial Break]
BEHAR: Iraq is winding down, we have our allies back, the auto industry is moving again and Wall Street is hiring. Yet, President Obama`s approval ratings are in the tank. Back with me to discuss this is Roy Sekoff, Founding Editor of HuffingtonPost.com. Okay. Now, 60 percent have lost confidence in Obama to save the nation.
SEKOFF: Yes.
BEHAR: So, what do you make of that?
SEKOFF: Well, I look at some other headlines. What you have there is right, but I look at the other headlines that the unemployment is still 9.5. That`s 26 million people who are unemployed or under employed. Millions of people are still losing their houses. Iraq may be winding down, but Afghanistan is escalating. It`s looking more and more like Vietnam every day, right? So when we have these countries -- and BP, I`ve got to say, it`s still gushing. It`s still gushing down there in the Gulf.
BEHAR: I know, but what would the country like him to do about unemployment? What could he do?
SEKOFF: Well, he could aggressively say, I have a jobs program. I`m going to go for a second stimulus package and the government is going the start providing some of these jobs just to keep us going again.
BEHAR: But then the Republicans call him a socialist.
SEKOFF: But then he`s stuck in this nowhere`s and where he`s not pushing -- his biggest mistake was not being aggressive and thinking that he could be the post partisan President. It`s hard to be the post partisan President when is other side is trying to be as partisan as possible. So they`re doing this congressional chaos theory. Anything he says, they say no. They`re trying to distract. They`re name calling. Anything like this, just to keep the subject off it. And you know what, it`s working.
BEHAR: Yes.
SEKOFF: It`s working because -- you remember, since Reagan was President, what did he say? He said, "government is the problem, it`s not the solution." So when government doesn`t work, when we can`t extend unemployment, the Republicans go, "See? We told you it didn`t work." It fits their DNA. Democrats have to get things done, you know?
BEHAR: Do you think that the Republicans have any point to make when they say he shouldn`t have bailed out the banks, or bailed out Detroit or anything?
SEKOFF: No. No, I think that -- listen, I think his problem was that he should have done what he needed to. There was a crisis, people were not sure where it was going. But he didn`t put any strings attached, Joy. They said, "Here`s the money, and we hope you`ll start lending."
BEHAR: Why did they do it like that?
SEKOFF: Well, I think if we look at the people surrounding him, there are people in his economic team who are very Wall Street centric. It`s in their blood. Robert Rubin, who is one of his economic advisors.
BEHAR: Timothy Geithner.
SEKOFF: Tim Geithner, Summers.
BEHAR: Summers, yes.
SEKOFF: They all have this connection where, in their universe, Wall Street is the center of the universe. Main Street is a far, far away galaxy.
BEHAR: So, what`s going to happen in November? Are people going to really not be Democrats and not going to go to the polls in large numbers, like they did for him in the election?
SEKOFF: Well, here`s the good news, first of all, for Obama. He`s not running for re-election in 2010.
BEHAR: No, but he could lose the House.
SEKOFF: So I`m saying his numbers are down, but Congress` are even worse. And you know who has the worst ratings of all, the Republicans. 72 percent. So 60 percent didn`t have confidence in Obama, 72 percent don`t have confidence in the Republicans.
BEHAR: So, why do they keep saying, including Robert Gibbs, that they`re going to lose the House in November.
SEKOFF: Well, I think there`s an anti-incumbency feel. And I think what you have to look at historically, since 1994, the worst, the absolute worst re-election rate for incumbents was 90 percent. So even if it`s the worse that it`s ever been, it may be 84 percent is what they`re predicting.
So yes, I think there`s going to be a shift, but I don`t think there`s going to be blood in the streets. I think they might lose control of the House, but they won`t lose control of the Senate. And the real key is, are they going to be able to turn this economy around.
BEHAR: Yes.
SEKOFF: It`s still the economy`s stupid, right?
BEHAR: So, some of the economists who said he should have put more money in the stimulus were right maybe.
SEKOFF: Yes. He absolutely should have. That`s the situation right now.
BEHAR: Okay. He needs to read the New York times. Thanks very much, Roy, always a pleasure to see you and you`re so smart.
SEKOFF: Love it.
BEHAR: Up next, rocker Bret Michaels stops by to discuss his near- death experience, his new show and a whole lot more.
[Commercial Break]
BEHAR: In the last three months, Bret Michaels has survived an emergency appendectomy, a massive brain hemorrhage, a mini stroke and a discovery of a hole in his heart. And yet, he won Celebrity Apprentice, put out a new CD and began a world tour. Why he doesn`t clean up the Gulf or wash the feet of the poor in his spare time is anybody`s guess. His new CD is called "Custom Built." I`m happy to welcome back to my show, the invincible, Bret Michaels.
BRET MICHAELS, SINGER: Thank you very much.
BEHAR: OK, Bret.
MICHAELS: I`m working on those other two by the way, I`m going to get to them.
BEHAR: I think you should be down in the Gulf now plugging up that hole.
MICHAELS: Me and Jimmy Buffett.
BEHAR: Yes.
MICHAELS: We`re going to fix it together.
BEHAR: Well he`s stoned.
MICHAELS: I know but he`s a lot of fun. I was on stage with him the other night and we had the best time. We did margaritaville together.
BEHAR: Of course. What else would he do?
MICHAELS: Yes, it was great.
BEHAR: He is really parlayed that margaritaville into restaurants and everything and everybody sings it.
MICHAELS: It is unbelievable. And he is just funny. He gets to go on stage. I thought, I`ve been working way too hard. This is a fun, may have been part of my hemorrhage problem. I work way too hard. Jimmy Barefoot, out on stage, pulls up with the band. He goes, hey Bret, oh excuse me a minute. He is literally talking to me, walks out and he is playing on stage. And I`m like, this is a good gig. That`s a good gig.
BEHAR: Sure, did he go like man?
MICHAELS: Uh huh, that`s exactly right.
BEHAR: OK, now -
MICHAELS: Only for medicinal reasons, of course.
BEHAR: Of course, of course. Now in this new reality show you have on VH-1, you`re basically trying to balance being a rock star and a family man. Now aren`t those two mutually exclusive?
MICHAELS: Yes, pretty much. That`s why the show is a great train wreck.
BEHAR: Yes.
MICHAELS: You know, a little different than the other rock of love, the other rock of love debauchery which was also a drinking, partying and suck face train wreck. This is a different train wreck. And it shows that I can do -- I think "CELEBRITY APPRENTICE" was a great opportunity for me to do because it gave me a chance to find a show. Not only raise money and awareness for a great cause but also shows another side of me.
BEHAR: Yes.
MICHAELS: But this one is finding balance between life on the road and my daughters. My daughters are here in New York with me right now.
BEHAR: How old are they now?
MICHAELS: They are ten and five. You know and --
BEHAR: And what are their names?
MICHAELS: Rain and Georgia.
BEHAR: Rain and Georgia.
MICHAELS: Rain Elizabeth and Georgia Blue. Yes.
BEHAR: Oh that`s so cute.
MICHAELS: So they`re a lot of energy. And being a dad, I love being a father. And it`s an amazing feeling, but balancing both, and then finding that balance of being out on the road. I spend seven or eight months, you know, out on the road. And that`s what makes it tough.
BEHAR: I don`t know how you`ve been doing that with all these ailments?
MICHAELS: No, I`m working on that, too. I figure out that --
BEHAR: What`s left?
MICHAELS: I don`t have many organs left. I figure once the big one goes, then hey, they just pull the plug.
BEHAR: Let`s start with the head, the brain is good now.
MICHAELS: We think the brain is good. I have a little setback. And what happens is when I got the bleed, when I had the original bleed, the brain hemorrhage -
BEHAR: Yes.
MICHAELS: That was -- for me -- and all the things I`ve been in my life, I would never bet I would have a brain hemorrhage. And it`s this arachnoid hemorrhage which it`s much more difficult to describe because if you have an aneurysm, they go in, they find the exact spot and fix it.
BEHAR: If they catch it in time.
MICHAELS: If they catch it in time.
BEHAR: And that`s a time bomb too.
MICHAELS: That`s a ticking -- and the subarachnoid hemorrhage is just as dangerous, the problem is they don`t always detect the bleed. And that`s why I spent so much time in ICU. They didn`t, at first they didn`t know the source. And that`s why they kept - I said, I am running out of groins. I mean they keep going up with the angio tube. I`m running out of space down here. So --
BEHAR: Yes, yes.
MICHAELS: But they went -
BEHAR: Didn`t they -- isn`t this what killed Gary Coleman?
MICHAELS: That`s exactly what killed him.
BEHAR: Yes.
MICHAELS: And Natasha Richardson, same thing.
BEHAR: Oh my god.
MICHAELS: I think the -
BEHAR: But hers was from a bang. Yours - I mean she fell on her head on the ski slope.
MICHAELS: But I think Gary had the same thing. You know what it is - -
BEHAR: Yes, he fell.
MICHAELS: You can have the same bleed. You can have the same bleed, it is just detecting the bleed. I think in the faster because I`ve been diabetic my whole life really, really in tune with my body, what`s going on. And so as soon as it happened, I knew it wasn`t a pinched nerve. I go, there`s something bad just happened.
BEHAR: Yes, well you were -- who was with you when that happened?
MICHAELS: I was at my house. And it was Cristie (ph), my girlfriend and our two daughters and she was back in bed with them and I was literally sitting on the couch. I was making fun of - I was watching. But let`s just say I was watching TV.
BEHAR: Yes.
MICHAELS: And all of a sudden boom, I just felt this -
BEHAR: What were you watching? I have to know.
MICHAELS: Do you really want to know?
BEHAR: Yes, I do.
MICHAELS: All right, here is the truth. The girls had went to bed. Right, so I was just channel surfing and I was watching -- I`m a sports fanatic. Watching a little MLB, I`m watching a little "Sports Center" then I got to the movie channels and found a little "Busty Cops 3 To Serve And Protect."
BEHAR: A porn flick.
MICHAELS: It was a terrifically awesome porn flick.
BEHAR: Really awesome music?
MICHAELS: Yes, terrific music. I`ve never heard better theme music in my life.
(LAUGHTER)
MICHAELS: And then when they exposed the protecting and the serving is about when the hemorrhage happened. And --
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: Maybe there`s a connection.
MICHAELS: Oddly enough, there is a connection. Don`t laugh. There`s a connection.
BEHAR: Seriously?
MICHAELS: To ejaculation and a hemorrhage. I don`t know what it is but I -- that didn`t happen. What happened was I went back to "Sports Center" luckily, no I didn`t. But anyway, I did not want to bleed out. And my biggest fear was not only my daughters finding me collapsed on the floor but possibly that movie repeating in the background. And that`s the only thing that saved my life.
BEHAR: OK, so now let`s work down your body. The hole in the heart. What`s up with that? Don`t get BP to plug that up.
MICHAELS: No, no, they`re not. Trust me, we`d be here for years. But they -- what happens with the hole in the heart, it`s called PFO, right, a patent foramen Ovali. Right, I went in and I had this morning stroke - this sounds ridiculous talking like -- after a while I`m like rat boy the medical experiment. You know what I mean, how many more things can we? But it is - I went in there and they went in looking for something again wrong with my head. And they do this air bubble test. So you`re laying in bed, they`ve got the I.V. in you. You turn this way, now all my life as a diabetic, they tell you to get the air out of the syringe.
BEHAR: Oh really.
MICHAELS: They`re pumping air into my veins, I`m thinking, isn`t this going to kill me? Like I`m thinking are you just going to end it here for me. And I look over and I have - you know you`re hooked up, your heart, and you look over at the ultrasound. And you literally watch the air come up, it comes up through the vein, gets to my lungs and goes through my heart in a hole that`s in my heart. And I`m looking at everyone. I`m always joking around. I`m joking and no one else is joking any more. They are like, yes, we have a problem here. Then all of a sudden there`s like ten people in the room. So that gets operated on in the early morn.
BEHAR: OK, so brain hemorrhage, heart hole, diabetes, what is the other one? There was something else that I missed? What was the other thing you had wrong?
MICHAELS: I`m sure there was something. I just can`t remember it. I`m sure there`s something we can throw into the mix.
BEHAR: There`s something over here --
MICHAELS: Oh the appendix.
BEHAR: The appendix.
MICHAELS: That`s old news.
BEHAR: That is it.
MICHAELS: The appendix -
BEHAR: Well it was peritonitis, right?
MICHAELS: Yes, I had --
BEHAR: You have had every single thing you had could kill you instantly, except the diabetes, I guess.
MICHAELS: Here`s what I truly - no, they`re working on that. But here`s what happened, too, when I was on tour, all this stuff that had happened -- I try to explain to people. If they would have left me out of the hospital two days or a day after I had the hemorrhage and I was OK, I would have left because I hate being in the hospital.
BEHAR: Yes.
MICHAELS: I`ve seen so many of them my whole life.
BEHAR: Right.
MICHAELS: And so the strange thing is when I had the appendicitis or the emergency appendectomy in San Antonio, it made me go home otherwise I was looking at the schedule. We would have been on the road somewhere, possibly you know at a truck stop at 11:00 at night after a show and had I not got to the hospital in time to barrow, there`s a good chance it would have killed me. So it is just strange how the effect all happened within that what almost two-month time period.
BEHAR: Unbelievable. I had a near death experience one time a long time ago.
MICHAELS: Right.
BEHAR: And it changed me a lot. For one thing, I let my hair go natural.
MICHAELS: Yes, you look beautiful.
BEHAR: Thank you.
MICHAELS: It looks great.
BEHAR: No this is not my natural hair. I went back to this because it`s a while now. You know I got over the near death.
MICHAELS: I didn`t know, you look great. You look great.
BEHAR: Anyway, how did it change you? Seriously, it changed me emotionally. I got a divorce after that, in fact.
MICHAELS: Right, I`m not -- should I ask? Anyway, I know what the -- I`m just saying did that cause it?
BEHAR: No, I`m just saying it changes you, it focuses you on the rest of your life, whatever`s left. You say hey. And I started to be a stand- up comic because I thought how bad could it be to die on stage? I almost died.
MICHAELS: Right. Literally.
BEHAR: So how did it change you?
MICHAELS: Here is how it changed me. For me, I`ve always tried to live life since I`ve been 6 years old being diabetic, I always feel that I lived my life to the fullest. You know I`ve always felt like I`m out there --
BEHAR: Oh yes, I saw the tapes.
MICHAELS: You saw "Rock Of Love."
BEHAR: Oh, yes, baby.
MICHAELS: And other things. But I`m good to people, I hang out, I party with people.
BEHAR: You are a nice guy, everybody loves you.
MICHAELS: Yes, I love to party. And the thing is too, like, backstage I`m passionate about making music. So I have a lot of friends/family who hang out, have a great time. I think what happen for me what put it in perspective for me was when I had - the not so much the appendectomy, the hemorrhage - that immediately -- Cristie, my girlfriend, Cristie.
BEHAR: Long time right?
MICHAELS: Yes, long time. On and off, put up with me. Strong woman. And went into this relationship eyes wide open, knowing I`m going to travel and do stuff. And she and my daughters were the first -- that was absolutely the first thing I thought about.
BEHAR: So you thought family, relationship.
MICHAELS: That`s it, you know when they say that one thing - that one thing you think about. You don`t go, man, how many more days I can I do on the road or what guitar or whatever.
BEHAR: How many more orgies can I do?
MICHAELS: That was the second thought. You know -
BEHAR: I mean after a certain age -
MICHAELS: I`m lying that would have been the third thought. The second one was get busty cops off the TV while I`m -- and then the orgy.
BEHAR: Then the orgy.
MICHAELS: But family first. Then orgy.
BEHAR: So that`s what happened. That`s good. That`s good. How did Cristie take -- I saw "Rock Of Ages." How did Christy take all those you know --
MICHAELS: The "Rock Of Love."
BEHAR: "Rock of Love" I mean, Rock of Ages? I have myself in the cemetery here. But I mean, I saw that. So you know -
MICHAELS: She didn`t -
BEHAR: There were many groupies on the tour. You`re doing some, you know, wacky behavior.
MICHAELS: Wacky?
BEHAR: You know what I mean.
MICHAELS: Yes, I do.
BEHAR: How did she take all of that?
MICHAELS: You know what, a lot better than I would if I get to say this when we broke up right before we did turned it down. I turned down VH-1 the first time it came because I`d never done anything like that before you know what I mean? And but honestly, when it came back around, I said, look, if you let me go in and date and party and have fun, I said, but we can use everything that is mine, I just don`t want to use the house. You know as long as we can go somewhere and get a house, let`s party and date, and I think the reason the show worked was it was very real. It was very fun. We went in I told the girls right up front, listen, I don`t know if anything`s going to come out of this at all other than just partying and having a good time.
BEHAR: Yes.
MICHAELS: Let`s see what happens. And I think that`s the reason why the show was VH-1`s number one show three years in a row.
BEHAR: Yes.
MICHAELS: After the third year, I was good.
BEHAR: You were good.
MICHAELS: I`ll date. Because I realize they`ve now learned all my lines. It sucks. Once you expose yourself, you`re screwed. Meaning literally I`ve given away my best stuff. And the weirdest thing is they make you date. It is not like you would date one on one. I`d be laying good stuff on you. There`s two other people listening to you. So then you go that didn`t work. Listen, have I told you this joke, you just switch over. And you`re like, holy crap. I already heard this like three minutes ago. It`s awful.
BEHAR: OK, honey, sit right there, we will have much more with Bret Michaels.
MICHAELS: I`ve only got a couple organs left. I`m fine.
BEHAR: When we come back we`ll see what else he`s got wrong with him.
MICHAELS: Nothing.
BEHAR: You look good, I`ll tell you, you look very good.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What profession your father is.
MICHAELS: He`s a music dude.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He`s a musician?
MICHAELS: Slash rock star extraordinary slash party king.
UNIDNETIFIED FEMALE: Rock -
MICHAELS: That must be spelled partay.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BEHAR: I`m back with Bret Michaels. Bret I must talk to you about "CELEBRITY APPRENTICE." You won.
MICHAELS: Yes, it was absolutely - "CELEBRITY APPRENTICE" was absolutely great. For me it was such a great turning point in my life. First of all, Donald Trump is an amazing guy. You know what I mean, and people have such a different impression than the one I got. I know he`s tough. But he`s very funny.
BEHAR: He`s very funny.
MICHAELS: You know what I mean, I look back into his life. I did a little due diligence before I got in the show. He`s like the rock star of real estate, but there`s got to be other things that he did or liked. And it turned out that music was one of his big passions. Just a lot of people didn`t know that.
BEHAR: He likes sports too.
MICHAELS: Yes, sports and I love sports and music. So it was - and I think he saw that I come from Pittsburgh, I come from a very blue collar family. You work real hard. There`s no self-pity. And you get it done. And when I got a chance to do the show -- and I want to watch how I word this -- not that there`s any time to get a brain hemorrhage is a good time but getting sick couldn`t have come at a worst time in my life. And this is why. I already knew that I`d been in New York and fought so hard to get to the finale of "APPRENTICE," but obviously there`s a break -- before you get to the --
BEHAR: We weren`t sure if you`d get there.
MICHAELS: Yes no, we -
BEHAR: We were talking about it all the time.
MICHAELS: And I was pretty sure I wasn`t going to get there. But I was determined if I won or not win. If I knew that I was going to be in the final two, I was going to do everything I could to get back after I got sick. And then I already knew I was doing "AMERICAN IDOL" and I was doing a tour. In fact, I was in the tour when it happened. And that`s the thing for me, you -- there`s a song by Tim McGraw, a friend of mine wrote, it is called "Live Like You`re Dying."
BEHAR: That`s right.
MICHAELS: That`s the way I live my life. I cannot, I played shows, broke my finger in the morning, played a show that night, got sick, played a show. And I just learned from my family that self-pity for me doesn`t work. Now I laugh, I said if I had a job or boss I hated or a job that sucked -
BEHAR: Yes.
MICHAELS: I would have probably milked it for two more years. You know what I mean, literally would have said I can`t get out of bed. But I couldn`t wait to get out of the hospital.
BEHAR: Now was it hard to compete on the show, with you know, against Holly. She lost.
MICHAELS: Very hard.
BEHAR: Do you think you got the sympathy vote?
MICHAELS: I`m going to say this, she did the hotness dress vote. Did you see the dress she wore?
BEHAR: OK, you both -
MICHAELS: I`m telling you, I was like, I didn`t play the sympathy thing. When I get out there, I`m playing the sympathy thing. Because she was all low key. Bret, I`m going to go out with this. And then she came out with that bam dress on.
BEHAR: She did.
MICHAELS: I see what you`re doing here. And then so I came out and I plopped down at the table. And acted like I couldn`t breathe.
BEHAR: Oh it was brilliant.
MICHAELS: It was great.
BEHAR: I would like to do that show. You think I can play the menopause part?
MICHAELS: exactly. Think about this. If you play the menopause card, yes -- let me tell you what -- talk back about getting sick. When I won "APPRENTICE" because I worked so hard being a lifelong diabetic and my daughter is borderline, getting sick -- I barely talk about "CELEBRITY APPRENTICE." like I won it and I want to do this big campaign. But I`m one of the few people that -- I got to say this -- with diet Snapple and I made that drink so it didn`t suck, it tastes great. And so now we`re actually going to roll something from "APPRENTICE" to roll out this drink and I`m going to represent the Trop Rock and diet Snapple brand so it`s going to be unbelievable.
BEHAR: That`s great so you have a new career in a way.
MICHAELS: Yes, diet Snappleiciouness.
BEHAR: I love that. You know as a rock star you can look at Mick Jagger. He is - I mean I went to see them in Jersey, the Rolling Stones. They - first of all, they sell out --
MICHAELS: Everywhere.
BEHAR: -- handicapped parking, like that.
MICHAELS: Right, because I was in that handicapped parking.
BEHAR: So you can go on forever is what I`m saying.
MICHAELS: Absolutely. And that`s what I`m saying all the shows, everything we`re doing right now is all sold out, whether it is Solar or when I`m out with the band or out with Poison. I mean it has been a great career. And I think that`s the reason so many fans know -- they know I`m a fighter. But the bummer, like I said, being sick, when you get sick is sometimes it takes over. But the recovery, I think, in the middle of all the horrific things going on right now, I think occasionally feel-good story, I`m lucky. I`m one of the few knock on wood under glass.
BEHAR: Do you think you`re pushing yourself a little too hard?
MICHAELS: Maybe, but I don`t feel like it. Being in ICU is really depressing. And I feel -- listen, I didn`t work so hard to live to go out there and die. And if I feel sick, I`ll stop.
BEHAR: Right, OK, so as soon as you feel sick you should --
MICHAELS: Yes, I`ll be done.
BEHAR: You`re in touch with your body. Now what about "AMERICAN IDOL," they`ve been talking about you replacing Simon Cowell. You`re too - really not like him at all.
MICHAELS: No I was -
BEHAR: You are sweet, he`s not sweet.
MICHAELS: Here`s the thing, Simon Cowell, what happen was, that night no one had talked to me at all about being a judge on "AMERICAN IDOL".
BEHAR: The night you were there, yes.
MICHAELS: The night I was there. We got done. I felt like it was a great performance. We cut the song in half because I wasn`t quite all there yet. But the performance was great. The only standing ovation we got of the night, which was a killer. And what happen was Simon Cowell made a really nice comment after the show. He just said Bret would be a great replacement. He`s lived this life. He has lived this life.
BEHAR: Yes.
MICHAELS: And listen, I think the biggest mistake "AMERICAN IDOL" can make whether they choose me or not, Simon Cowell is an original. Brutally honest but an original.
BEHAR: Yes.
MICHAELS: He made that show great.
BEHAR: He did and I don`t know if it can survive without him.
MICHAELS: And I`m telling you I feel they won`t survive without him if he try to replace him with someone that`s a knockoff of Simon Cowell. I think if they put someone on that show --
BEHAR: Do you want to do it?
MICHAELS: I would love to do it.
BEHAR: You would.
MICHAELS: I would really bring it to the table.
BEHAR: Well you`re saying it here, so --
MICHAELS: Yes, I`m saying I would love to do it. I think I love - I passionately love music. And watching people perform and play I could --
BEHAR: What would you say to somebody like that Hung kid, Bill Hung?
MICHAELS: Yes, the one that was kind of a joke right?
BEHAR: Yes, the joke.
MICHAELS: Yes, here`s the thing I would say exactly - dude that is (EXPLETIVE DELETED).
END
