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Joy Behar Page
Eva Longoria`s Divorce Drama; A New Tiger Woods?
Aired November 18, 2010 - 21:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
JOY BEHAR, HOST: It is a very special day at THE JOY BEHAR SHOW because one of my guests is a TV legend. Can you guess who it is? Huh? Huh?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Coming up on THE JOY BEHAR SHOW another famous athlete, another cheating scandal. Actress Eva Longoria has filed for divorce from NBA star Tony Parker after she reportedly found hundreds of texts on Parker`s phone to a teammate`s wife.
Speaking of unfaithful sports stars, as the one-year anniversary of the Tiger Woods meltdown approaches, Woods tries to rebrand himself by joining Twitter.
Plus, long live the king; the legendary Larry King stops by to talk about some of his favorite moments from his 25 years on TV.
That and more starting right now.
BEHAR: The lovely Eva Longoria has filed for divorce from her husband of three years, basketball star Tony Parker. Longoria reportedly broke off her marriage after finding hundreds of texts between her husband and his former teammate`s wife.
Here now with more on this is Jennifer Williams, the wife of former NBA star Eric Williams and co-star of VH1`s "Basketball Wives"; Ian Kerner, sex therapist and relationship counselor; and Terri Seymour, correspondent for "Extra".
Terri, let me start with you. Now, Eva Longoria actually spoke to "Extra" and she reportedly said she found hundreds of text messages from his former teammate`s estranged wife on his phone. But do we actually know if he cheated on her? And follow-up, why didn`t he delete them? That`s how Tiger Woods got caught. Remember?
TERRI SEYMOUR: I know. These guys you would think common sense they would just delete the messages right?
BEHAR: Yes.
SEYMOUR: But they don`t seem to. The one thing, obviously Mario and Eva are very, very, very close, very close friends and the one thing that Eva did say to Mario was, you know, she wants her fans to know that she is absolutely devastated because she, you know, was madly in love with Tony and is just devastated this happened. But she found hundreds of text messages from Erin Barry on his phone. And as you know, Erin Barry is the wife of Tony`s former teammate. For her that was just the end.
BEHAR: That`s terrible.
SEYMOUR: And Joy, it has been -- it`s terrible, isn`t it? And it has been reported in the past, you know, it`s never been proven true, but there have been rumors before that he was unfaithful to Eva at the beginning of their marriage. So who knows if he`s done anything in the past?
BEHAR: I see. But, Jennifer, does this surprise you? Your husband was in basketball. It seems as though it`s an epidemic in sports.
JENNIFER WILLIAMS, CO-STAR, "BASKETBALL WIVES": There is definitely a trend with cheating and athletes. However, when it`s with another wife that is definitely very surprising --
(CROSSTALK)
WILLIAMS: -- because we sort of -- yes, we have this sisterhood of women and we all understand what it`s like to be married to an athlete. So when you have another wife cheating with your spouse that, I mean, that is really just a low blow.
BEHAR: Yes. Terri, this is not the first time there have been allegations. Tell me a little more about that.
SEYMOUR: Well, like I said, nothing has been proven but I don`t know if you remember, I think it was towards the end of the first year of their marriage. It was rumored that he had been seeing a girl and he continued the relationship with her on Facebook.
And again, it was never proven that there was anything sexual but Eva found stuff on Facebook that they were still in touch.
BEHAR: And she stayed with him.
SEYMOUR: And she stayed with him. But this time, you know. You can`t (INAUDIBLE) him forever, can you.
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: Yes. Maybe not this time. Not this time. Not with hundreds of texts. Is this a problem?
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: Ian, is this a problem on class athletes? I mean it seems as though these guys are traveling on the road all the time.
IAN KERNER, SEX THERAPIST: Yes.
BEHAR: The temptation is there.
KERNER: Yes. Well, I think men in general -- I don`t think you have to be a world class athlete -- I think when men cheat they tend to cheat opportunistically. What I mean is that, if they`re at a party and their inhibitions are lowered especially if there`s any kind of alcohol involved and there is an opportunity, guys are much more likely to cheat than say women.
But we also have to remember that we live in a society where women are starting to cheat as much if not more than men.
BEHAR: Yes.
KERNER: It`s just a different kind of cheating and --
BEHAR: What is the difference?
KERNER: I think, like you said, the guys are really cheating like here is a beautiful woman. Maybe I`ve had a few beers. Opportunity arises. Wife isn`t around. They go after the opportunity.
You tell me if this is true or not because you`ve been at these parties whereas if a woman was at that same party and there was an opportunity, I don`t think she would act on it. I think guys cheat very opportunistically.
BEHAR: Well, she might act on it if her husband wasn`t there.
KERNER: I don`t know. I think when a woman cheats --
BEHAR: Jennifer, what do you say to this?
WILLIAMS: You know what? I feel like it all depends what state your relationship is in. If you`re in a happy marriage I feel like --
KERNER: A guy will cheat if he`s in a happy marriage.
BEHAR: Or a woman.
KERNER: Again, opportunistically; if a woman is in a happy marriage, I don`t think she`s going to --
WILLIAMS: No.
KERNER: -- even if she has had six glasses of wine.
BEHAR: Well, we had an anthropologist on the other night Helen Fisher and she said that --
KERNER: I know her well.
BEHAR: Yes. She said basically that women and men are cheating under 40 years old in equal numbers at this point.
KERNER: Yes. But I think, again, men can go out and cheat and come home and love their wives and absolutely want to be in that relationship. I think when a woman has cheated very often she has mentally and emotionally checked out of the relationship. She`s already out of there. And I think a guy is much more likely to have a one night stand or just, you know, cheat once whereas a woman is going to more likely pursue a passionate affair.
BEHAR: Should women who marry athletes know the score basically that it`s going to happen?
WILLIAMS: You know what? I don`t know if you know the score but I want to say you definitely, you know what you`re getting involved with. And these guys are on the road, a lot of the times in basketball there is 82 games, 41 of those games are on the road. You have these women that know what hotels they`re staying in, know what restaurants they frequent, and they`re looking to land one of these guys. So, I mean, I think it really starts with the foundation of your marriage because if it`s not strong, it will definitely crack.
BEHAR: But according to what you`re saying, these guys who are out there and what you`re saying, they`re out in these hotels, these little predatory females are coming on to them. How do you trust your husband?
WILLIAMS: You know what? It`s just -- it`s definitely difficult. It`s nothing you can do, really. It`s like -- my whole motto is that I can`t control anyone but myself. So honestly, if someone breaks your trust, it`s very hard to regain that. But these guys, they sort of do what they want to do.
BEHAR: Ok. Now Longoria tweeted yesterday. Everyone is tweeting.
KERNER: Yes. Well, that`s -- the technology is part of the big problem.
BEHAR: I know. It is. And she said that it is with great sadness that after seven years together Tony and I have decided to divorce. We love each other deeply and pray for each other`s happiness. Is she really saying that or is she saying, you know, I hate him and I pray he gets a horrible rash? What do you think is the truth? I mean she`s being nice or is she setting herself up as the good girl so that the lawyers can move in for kill? What do you think?
KERNER: I think that, you know, that`s probably just a press statement but I think she feels genuinely betrayed, you know, especially with the technology it`s a very powerful sort of emotional affair. If he sent out hundreds and hundreds of texts, a lot of guys don`t understand that that`s a form of cheating. You know? It may not have included the sex or it may be leading up to the sex but she probably feels emotionally betrayed.
BEHAR: Right. Of course. I think it`s worse. Now, Terri, there is some controversy over the filing of the papers. Parker reportedly wanted to file first in Texas but Eva ended up filing first in L.A. So, was this a PR thing or community property? What is that about?
SEYMOUR: Well, at the beginning, early on in the week there were all of these rumors that Tony actually filed for divorce but it was definitely Eva that filed for the divorce.
BEHAR: Yes.
SEYMOUR: And then don`t forget Brent and Erin, I believe they filed for divorce on October 29th so there`s another twist to the story.
BEHAR: Ok. So, Ian, let me ask you something and maybe you can answer this. A lot of these women are beautiful women. I mean these are gorgeous women. You hear it all the time.
Halle Berry had trouble with this. Who is more stunning than she?
KERNER: Yes.
BEHAR: What is this about men cheating on beautiful women? Is there a specific reason that they will cheat on a beauty?
KERNER: No. I mean you probably heard the phrase -- it`s not a fabulous phrase -- but show me a beautiful woman and I`ll show you a guy who is bored of sleeping with her.
BEHAR: Why?
KERNER: Well, I think --
BEHAR: What about that song when you`re in love with a beautiful woman you know it`s hard.
KERNER: Well, you know what, I think from --
BEHAR: You know that song? I love that song, yes.
KERNER: I think that men are very driven by visual novelty. And I think --
BEHAR: So they have the visual right in front of them.
KERNER: I think you get used to the visual novelty and I think for a lot of guy they seek out more visual novelty. Novelty is inherently new; it`s not the same.
BEHAR: So the new penny who`s beautiful is what they`re looking for. Go ahead Jen.
WILLIAMS: I definitely -- I think first of all with athletes their egos are huge. They`re very competitive and they feel like they`re invincible. So I think part of the reason is they see a pretty woman and it`s like a competition thing; like I can get her, even if it is another player`s wife. They are very competitive. So I think that has a lot to do with it as well.
BEHAR: Do you -- are you happy --
SEYMOUR: And I think they see --
BEHAR: Go ahead, I`m sorry -- I was going to say are you happy that he`s retired no, Jennifer? At least you know where he is.
WILLIAMS: Yes, and no. Honestly I`ve heard like statistics that when they get retired it`s worse because they don`t really have anything to do and they`re, you know, getting used to not having that whole lifestyle so - -
KERNER: So they`re looking for groupies more than ever?
WILLIAMS: So I hear.
BEHAR: Terri, you have the last word before I go. Go ahead.
SEYMOUR: I was just going to say, they`re with their teammates and they see them getting away with it so I think, you know, when you`ve got your teammates have away with it -- and saw their wives staying with them they think they can get away with it too.
BEHAR: Yes ok. All right. Thanks Terri. Now, you two are staying right here.
KERNER: Ok.
BEHAR: Because we have much more on this topic of infidelity when we come back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Coming up a little later on THE JOY BEHAR SHOW. Legendary talk show host Larry King drops by to look back at his remarkable career. Now back to Joy.
BEHAR: I`m back discussing Eva Longoria`s divorce with basketball- wife Jennifer Williams, sex therapist Ian Kerner and joining the conversation is Belinda Luscombe, editor-at-large for "Time" magazine.
So let`s start with a new poll that says that four in 10 people say marriage is becoming obsolete -- four in 10 people. Belinda, what does it say about marriage now that it`s -- is different from -- from let`s say 20 years ago or 30 years ago?
BELINDA LUSCOMBE, TIME: Well, at "Time" -- at "Time" magazine we took a survey in the `70s, you know, just near when divorce was nearing its peak and asked people who -- who thought, at this time a very high divorce, who thought marriage was becoming obsolete. And at that stage only 28 percent of people thought that way.
So now it`s 40 percent. It changes, though, depending on who you ask. More young people think that. More women think that marriage is becoming obsolete.
BEHAR: That`s interesting isn`t it, Jennifer?
WILLIAMS: It is.
BEHAR: -- that women don`t think marriage is a good thing anymore.
WILLIAMS: Well, you know what, I think that has to do with women getting their education and being able to stand alone without a man.
BEHAR: Yes.
WILLIAMS: So I think that they feel like why have a man if he`s going to make me miserable? It`s true -- I mean --
BEHAR: Exactly.
LUSCOMBE: It`s totally, that whole women getting their education has totally transformed the way that marriage works because now men are actually marrying women who are like them -- who have their educational equals and therefore they -- those -- it used to be that doctors married doctors --
BEHAR: Right.
LUSCOMBE: -- and nurses and businessmen married their secretaries and then they divorced them and married the next secretary and the one after that.
BEHAR: Right. And now?
LUSCOMBE: And now business guys want to be part of a power couple they want to marry another executive.
BEHAR: And then the trophy wife is the secretary.
LUSCOMBE: Right. And then -- and the doctors have one of the highest rates I believe was in marriage, you know, the -- the cancer specialist marries the liver specialist.
KERNER: But you know what`s interesting --
BEHAR: Really? That`s odd, yes go ahead.
KERNER: But -- but you know what it`s interesting too --
WILLIAMS: That`s weird.
KERNER: That women -- woman are getting more educated --
BEHAR: Yes.
KERNER: -- and they are making more money and their having more careers but then there is this -- this -- this tipping point at like 35 or 36 where suddenly a lot of women say, all right. I also want to have the kid, too. And certainly some women are pursuing it on their own but then all of a sudden there are a lot of women who suddenly do feel a pressure to get married or at least to find somebody to co-habitate with and have a kid.
BEHAR: Yes.
KERNER: And -- I mean I see that here in New York all the time just walking --
BEHAR: Well, you know, we were saying during the break -- Jennifer and I -- that I lived together with a guy, well, he didn`t even move in until we were together about 20 years.
KERNER: Yes.
BEHAR: You know, but then we moved in finally together.
WILLIAMS: Right.
LUSCOMBE: Well, because -- because you`re Swedish really I think.
BEHAR: Because I`m Swedish?
LUSCOMBE: You`re Swedish, one -- one of the -- one of the sociologists did this -- found this amazing statistic that -- that a -- a - - a child who is living with Swedish parents who are not married, a child in Sweden was living with parents and not married like your situation is --
BEHAR: Yes.
LUSCOMBE: -- is actually less likely to have his family disrupted than a kid in America living with married parents.
BEHAR: Is that so?
LUSCOMBE: That`s -- that`s --
BEHAR: Wait until I go home and tell Sven all about this.
This was surprising. The survey says that men need marriage more than women.
KERNER: Yes.
BEHAR: Now, why is that?
LUSCOMBE: Well, who knows exactly why it is but what the survey seems to show is that men who have been married before, for example, divorcees or widowers, when you ask them would you like to be married again twice as many of them say, yes, I`d like to be married again than women who are in the same situation.
KERNER: Right.
BEHAR: Now, why do you think that`s true -- Ian?
KERNER: Well, you know, I think that -- in talking about the data I think there`s a lot of cynicism too here about sort of the -- the fate of marriage but I -- I`m married. I love my wife. I`m happily married.
BEHAR: How long have you been married?
KERNER: Close to ten years now. We have two kids. And having kids is challenging. But I think, you know, when you -- when you fall in love I mean, you still sort of want to -- I mean, people still do fall in love. They want to merge with somebody.
BEHAR: They want to have --
KERNER: They want to express -- I think especially for a man that -- that matters, that feeling of sort of, hey. I`m not the son anymore. I`m the husband. I`m the father.
BEHAR: I know. Ok so then, what about all this cheating that we keep hearing about?
KERNER: Yes. Yes.
BEHAR: Is it that the guy wants the nest, the wife, the kids, and the little nooky on the side?
KERNER: Well --
LUSCOMBE: I think I -- I personally think that`s, this is going to sound weird, but I think that`s a lot to do with like work life pressures that -- that the home, because women are working and they are bringing home as much bacon and sometimes more than the men and the men have not really, people have not really adjusted to the idea.
BEHAR: -- that women make that much money.
LUSCOMBE: Yes, also that women are not all going to cook the bacon as well as bring it home.
BEHAR: Right.
LUSCOMBE: And that all has to be split.
BEHAR: Yes.
LUSCOMBE: And studies consistently show that women are doing so much more work than men.
BEHAR: And the -- and rich are marrying other people with money. More rich people are getting married according to the survey.
WILLIAMS: Right.
BEHAR: Now you and your husband have money. Right?
WILLIAMS: Yes.
BEHAR: You -- you have some nice cash. I`m sure.
LUSCOMBE: Just tell us exactly how much.
BEHAR: Well, she was married to a very, she is married to a famous basketball player.
KERNER: Yes.
WILLIAMS: Right.
BEHAR: Everybody knows they have enormous salaries. So tell me. Does -- do you think that the money that you have helps or hurts your marriage?
WILLIAMS: You know what? I think it definitely hurts because I just feel like when you have a lot of money, first of all, as far as cheating goes, I feel like you can definitely cover it up much better.
When you have a lot of money, you can just fly these girls wherever -- I call them like import/export. Like you can export them wherever and you can go there and, you know, you might have a business trip or whatever. So I think it`s just easier to cheat when you have more money.
BEHAR: That`s probably true.
KERNER: And it might be easier to cheat but it`s harder to stay married when you don`t have money. I mean, I think the -- one of the reasons people are splitting up a lot are -- I deal with a lot of couples stuck in sex ruts and not having the money year after year and arguing about it and dealing with the stress of dual incomes has taking a huge toll.
LUSCOMBE: Exactly.
BEHAR: It`s killing their sex lives.
KERNER: It`s killing sex lives and just taking a huge toll on marriage.
BEHAR: So do you think when people have money they have better sex?
KERNER: You know there was a study that the "The Wall Street Journal" did a couple years ago that showed that people who have more money end up having more leisure time and getting to go out more and do date nights and end up having better sex lives.
LUSCOMBE: It would not surprise me because people with money can outsource all the really dreary task of running a house.
BEHAR: The dreary ones --
LUSCOME: You know, they can have someone else do their laundry. They can have someone else do their cleaning and nothing, I think, we know this, all at this table, is less good for your libido than cleaning.
BEHAR: Maybe marriage has just gone the way of the Edsel. It`s gone
(CROSSTALK)
LUSCOMBE: Marriage works better than the Edsel.
BEHAR: It does? How about bipartisanship?
Thanks everybody. We`ll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BEHAR: Where has the time gone? Thanksgiving will mark a year since Tiger Woods drove his SUV, his career, and his marriage into a tree. Twelve months after the debacle the once-private Woods is opening up on Twitter, on the radio and in "Newsweek" magazine. So what gives? Is Tiger really examining his life or launching a new PR effort?
Here now to discuss this is publicist and brand strategist, Marvet Britto. Ok Marvet. He just announced he has joined the Twitter world and he -- one of his first tweets was "I think I like this Twitter thing. You guys are awesome."
A little late isn`t it? Everybody is on twitter.
MARVEL BRITTO, PUBLICIST: It`s late but it`s also a departure for Tiger. Tiger`s not someone who really allowed much access and now all of a sudden, he is really becoming this relatable guy. So he is shedding the elitist persona that Tiger Woods really built his brand around and now he`s becoming personable, more humble, more relatable.
And really, I`m not surprised because Tiger Woods is the first billion dollar athlete. He made a billion dollars in endorsements.
BEHAR: A billion.
BRITO: Billion dollars. And 90 percent of that was in endorsements; 10 percent of that was really what he made on the golf course. He is probably at home during the busiest advertising season not getting any phone calls and thinking, I need to repair my brand. I need to recalibrate and really become likeable because consumers really, corporations leverage brands that have equity. And consumers only relate to individuals and celebrities that they find humble. And people that they can relate to. So brands leverage brands that are relatable and Tiger Woods isn`t right now.
BEHAR: Not right this minute. So he needs to reverse that. But this morning he did an interview with ESPN Radio. Listen to what he said about this past year.
(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)
TIGER WOODS, PROFESSIONAL GOLFER: I`m so much better now because of this past year. Obviously it was very difficult on a lot of people, especially those closest to me, but it`s been the best thing for me.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BEHAR: Buy it?
BRITO: Yes, it is the best thing for him. The best thing for Tiger is to admit that he is in a difficult place and I think we`ve really never heard that from him before.
While he`s owned responsibility, now he is coming forward. The beauty of this is for the first time we see Tiger Woods being proactive instead of reactive. He is coming out first. He is really positioning himself for people to see him in a different light. I think it`s a great step for him.
BEHAR: But he took a big fall. So did Michael Vick.
BRITO: Absolutely.
BEHAR: Charlie Sheen, I don`t know. Maybe. He is still back on the air.
BRITO: But the difference with Tiger Woods and Charlie Sheen is that Charlie Sheen`s persona is very much a bad boy image.
BEHAR: That`s right. His was a good --
BRITO: Tiger Woods was a wholesome image.
BEHAR: What about Michael Vick though? He had a bad rep with the dogs.
BRITO: He did but Michael Vick also wasn`t the most celebrated global athlete in the world the way that Tiger Woods was. Tiger Woods was in a completely different sphere; again he`s a billion-dollar athlete.
BEHAR: I know. But you think that his game is a little off since the whole scandal? Whereas Michael Vick`s game is up. I even know that.
BRITO: And a large part of Tiger, like I said the last time I was on your show talking about Tiger`s brand, is that most of this is due to the fact that his A-game hasn`t come back. So Tiger`s play, he has gone from the number one athlete to number 42 in the rankings. It is a big difference. He is not really -- he has very little equity in his brand.
BEHAR: So, if his game doesn`t come back, the tweeting and all of this PR campaigning is not going to matter.
BRITO: Will not matter -- absolutely.
BEHAR: Right. Ok. Thanks very much Marvet.
We`ll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BEHAR: Well, there`s been a lot of talk this week about a future king of England, but we`ve got an American king who will be abdicating his throne after 25 years. Talk show legend, Larry King, has been in more homes than Randy Quaid and his wife. And tonight, I wanted to have him in mine. Larry, mi casa es su casa (ph).
LARRY KING, CNN ANCHOR: I made this for you.
(LAUGHTER)
KING: We may do. I may do.
BEHAR: I know that.
KING: I anointed you.
BEHAR: I know.
KING: I remember the first time we booked you on. Joy Behar. I love her. From "The View." We`ll ask her questions, and you tried to dominate.
BEHAR: I did not.
KING: And it was a plan. You had a plan.
BEHAR: The whip was a give away.
KING: You had a plan. I`ll tell you what the plan was.
BEHAR: What was the plan?
KING: I`m going to get my own show. Either this guy is going to fall over, I`ll get his show. If I don`t get his show, I`ll get over on the other side.
BEHAR: And it worked.
KING: Yes. I go to Holland (ph).
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: But you know what? They`re talking about you like you`re a legend. Is that weird to be called a legend?
KING: It`s weird. I was talking about that today with somebody. I`m still, I tell you the truth, I`m still a little Jewish boy in Brooklyn.
BEHAR: I know.
KING: I still feel that. I mean, I left Brooklyn, but Brooklyn never left me. So, all of these things that have happened to me, a lot of it`s luck, a lot of it`s skill, and you got to admit you have talent.
BEHAR: You`re very good.
KING: Thank you. But I still, you know, I can`t believe it. I can`t believe it.
BEHAR: You`re like a kid.
KING: Yes.
BEHAR: Still a kid. But that`s what makes people have longevity in the business, I think. People who remain who they are and keep in touch with their inner child and their self.
KING: There got to be something.
BEHAR: Yes.
KING: I was at a party, and Sinatra was there and people were talking as they were putting down Presley. Elvis Presley and Sinatra say, hey, there`s a lot to be said for longevity.
BEHAR: Exactly.
KING: Don`t dismiss longevity. Somebody had to like you.
BEHAR: That`s true. But Elvis died young. He didn`t have such longevity.
KING: (INAUDIBLE)
BEHAR: Yes, but how old is -- he was young, wasn`t he?
KING: Forty something.
BEHAR: Forty something, yes. Sinatra certainly had longevity. He is alive on Sirius radio too.
KING: He`s alive everywhere.
BEHAR: Were you scared of him when he -- you interviewed him?
KING: The first time I interviewed him, a moment of fright, but he was a delight. The joke is, you know, you don`t want to have frank not like you.
BEHAR: Absolutely.
KING: Yes. As Tony Bennett tells a great story. He was in a plane once and they hit turbulence and they looked p and said, why didn`t I call frank?
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: Well, you know, his mother was in a plane crash in Palm Springs.
KING: I know.
BEHAR: And everybody died in the plane. And a friend of mine said, if they hadn`t -- the pilot hadn`t died, Sinatra would have had him killed.
(LAUGHTER)
KING: Whatever happened to the guys who kidnapped his son? You ever hear from them again?
BEHAR: That`s true. It`s like Gotti, the guy who hit Hearst`s kid, gone all of a sudden. Bye.
KING: I wonder where they went. You know what I like, though, one thing about the Mafia, they`re definitive. You know what I mean? They don`t go halfway.
BEHAR: That`s true. It`s not like Congress where they pretend to be good guys.
KING: I almost had the mafia, this is true. I was just met my wife. We were dating and there was this guy she dated previously who was stalking her, and it was really bugging me.
KING: It wasn`t you.
KING: No. I`m dating her.
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: OK. Yes, go ahead.
KING: You learn from Barbara. OK. So, I`m sitting at breakfast (INAUDIBLE). I`m sitting with this guy who is a mafia guy. We hang around (ph), he`s a mafia guy and a couple of my friends. And I`m talking about this guy stalking Shawn, and this guy says, want us to take care of him? Free, for you. I say, what? Free for me?
What are you going to do? Couple broken legs. I say, you`re really kidding? No, I`m not kidding. A couple of broken legs. I said, well, how will I know? How will he know it came from me? And he said, he`ll know.
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: Wow.
KING: He`ll know.
BEHAR: They`ll throw a pair of suspenders on him. He`ll know.
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: Listen, you didn`t take him up on that?
KING: No. I almost did. There was a moment where I wanted to take him up. And one of my friends said, are you crazy?
BEHAR: This is the difference between a Jew and an Italian. I would have said do it. Seriously. You`re stalking somebody I care about, I love? Take care of him. I`m a vigilante.
KING: It`s in your bone.
BEHAR: It`s in my DNA. Seriously, there`s no other way to deal with people. A restraining order. That`s a joke.
KING: You know how many people think you`re Jewish?
BEHAR: I don`t care. It`s fine. Jewish, Italian, it`s all the same.
KING: You`ll never be a WASP.
BEHAR: Never. Who wants to be a WASP? Why would I want to be a WASP?
KING: What did they do, WASP?
BEHAR: I don`t know. They gulf. You know, I always think of your - I have learned a lot from your interviewing techniques. I must tell you.
KING: Thank you.
BEHAR: Because I think a lot of people say that, you know, you`re easy on people. I don`t think that you`re easy on people.
KING: I`m not.
BEHAR: You`re not. I think that your philosophy, tell me if I`m wrong, is to let them hang themselves.
KING: I`m curious and I ask short questions. I don`t dominate. I don`t have an agenda.
BEHAR: No.
KING: And I`m bad to learn.
BEHAR: That`s right. But you let them hang themselves like, you know, like Ahmadinejad, you were with him, right?
KING: I let him, yes.
BEHAR: Let`s see the anti-Semitic thing that he is, you know, and you showed it.
KING: And I had Wendy walker on.
BEHAR: Yes, what about her? She`s an anti-Semite?
KING: No, no.
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: Where did you --
KING: She booked on it.
BEHAR: Oh, yes. I know. She`s coming on the next day.
KING: She`s sharp, yes.
BEHAR: But, I mean, what about Mel Gibson, another famous anti- Semite? Would you be interested in interviewing him?
KING: Oh, you know, I did a great interview with him once before the --
BEHAR: Yes.
KING: Last night, I had the woman on who`s his girlfriend.
BEHAR: Oksana Grigorieva.
KING: Yes, Oksana.
BEHAR: Yes.
KING: You got it right.
BEHAR: Yes.
KING: Never heard --
BEHAR: Was she attractive? Did you find her attractive?
KING: Yes, Russian -- Eastern European look. Very. Yes.
BEHAR: That mobster thing the Russians have.
KING: She never heard him say an anti-Semitic thin. And she never saw him drink. All his anger. He was never drunk.
BEHAR: That`s even worse that your anger is not even propelled by the booze.
KING: I asked if there are two Mel Gibsons. She said there are. So, he was delightful. When I had him on, he`s a delightful interview. Great actor.
BEHAR: Yes, he`s good actor.
KING: And a terrific director.
BEHAR: Yes, yes. I know.
KING: "Brave Heart," pretty good movie.
BEHAR: Yes, we`ll give it to him. Well, listen, you know, you separate the art from the artist. You have to do that.
KING: Sometimes, that`s hard, isn`t it?
BEHAR: It`s very hard to do. You know, Ezra Pound, the great poet was hated Jews also.
KING: Anti-Semitic.
BEHAR: And people still read his poetry.
KING: People play Wagner.
BEHAR: That`s right. And Hitler loved Wagner.
KING: Hitler loved Wagner. He`d sit back at night with his dogs and just listen.
BEHAR: Enjoy. I had a shrink who used to love vodka. She was Austrian. She fly to Seattle just for a Wagnerian concert.
KING: I don`t think they play them in Israel.
BEHAR: No?
KING: I don`t --
BEHAR: I don`t blame them, do you?
KING: No, no.
BEHAR: What about -- this is the other thing about your job over the years, and I`m relating to it now is to get. You got to get the get.
KING: Let`s see. I`ve never been -- I`ll help out a lot. They`ll ask me sometimes to (INAUDIBLE). But I`m not a "get" person. I`m interested in the person I`m doing.
BEHAR: Yes.
KING: I`m curious at that moment. I`m very into them, and then I go on to the next thing.
BEHAR: Oh, yes.
KING: Producers, they have a get mentality.
BEHAR: Yes.
KING: And that`s their job. They`re very good at great staff -- and once you got them, once he`s there, got to get tomorrow. You could book God and get halfway through with God (INAUDIBLE).
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: That`s true. It`s a Kleenex industry, television.
KING: Oh, my God. And where do they go with it?
BEHAR: I don`t know. But don`t you think people in television have ADD? I think we all have a little ADD on TV.
KING: Really?
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: But like Barbara Walters and Diane and Katy and -- they`re all very, very competitive about getting.
KING: There`s a vulturous aspect to it. I don`t know that I`ve ever --
BEHAR: You`d be competing with women if you were in that business. But you`re not really in it, you said.
KING: No, I`ve never had that. I`m glad my producers have it if you want to be competitive.
BEHAR: Yes.
KING: It`s just that I`m not --
BEHAR: I think that a lot of -- Barbara says that her secret of her success over the years is that she never goes to the bathroom. So, that while other people are in the toilet, she is on the phone. She doesn`t have to pee, she says.
KING: She`s never been to the bathroom?
BEHAR: She doesn`t go to the bathroom. That`s a secret if you ask her. You know, Diane has to pee, maybe. Barbara doesn`t.
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: You know what I`m saying?
KING: That`s the title of her next book "I Never Had To Pee."
BEHAR: "I Never Had To Pee."
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: Now, you know, this Pierce Morgan, this Brit is replacing you.
KING: I met him once. He`s very nice.
BEHAR: Very nice, yes. But you wanted Ryan Seacrest. What is it, his hair you`re enjoying?
KING: I like Ryan Seacrest.
BEHAR: OK.
KING: He`s a nice guy.
BEHAR: Very nice.
KING: I think he is a future, not future a. It`s making more than you and me and this building combine.
BEHAR: That`s for sure. I know.
KING: He`s very successful.
BEHAR: Yes.
KING: He`s very good. And he`s going to be the next, if he`s already the next Dick Clark. And he`s got a great generalist attitude. He`s curious about a lot of things.
BEHAR: Yes.
KING: And he needed a night job. Mornings, got afternoons, the entertainment --
BEHAR: He wanted it?
KING: I never said, do you want it, but I would bet he would have taken it. So, I recommended him. He`s my friend.
BEHAR: Why didn`t you recommend me?
KING: Because you`re here. Wait a minute.
BEHAR: I got the gig because of you. I have to thank you again because I tried to thank you on "The View," but I`m thanking you here.
KING: You tried to thank me on your own show?
BEHAR: I did. I tried it. I tried it.
KING: You couldn`t get it in?
BEHAR: I couldn`t get it in. It`s very hard to get it in over there. You know?
KING: It`s your show, Joy. I mean, you`re one of the four, five panelists.
BEHAR: I know, but you`re vying. Talk about, you know, competition. You`re vying to get your two cents in --
KING: Do you think men talk with work?
BEHAR: No. The women in day time have no interest in what men have to say. We`ve already checked (ph) this out. I got to take a break. I love how you do it. You`re just like, OK. We`ll be right back.
KING: You need more than that?
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GEORGE BUSH, FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: The reason we`re doing it is great confidence in you. And you`ve always been fair. Asked some tough questions over the years but it`s always from the heart, straight, no curveballs and we respect you and love you and that`s why we wanted -- I don`t do this kind of thing anymore.
KING: I know. I thank you.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BEHAR: That`s a sneak peek of Larry King`s upcoming interview with George and Barbara Bush. Larry is with me and joining us is Wendy Walker, his senior executive producer and author of the new book "Producer: Lessons Shared From 30 Years In Television." Welcome to the show, Wendy.
WENDY WALKER, SR. EXEC., PRODUCER, "LARRY KING LIVE": Thank you, Joy.
BEHAR: It`s good to see you.
WALKER: Thank you.
BEHAR: Is that in the can? That`s in the can that interview already?
KING: Yes. It`s going to air Monday.
BEHAR: Did he compare, did you compare him to his son at all?
KING: No. I didn`t do that.
BEHAR: You didn`t do that?
KING: We talked about his son.
BEHAR: What is he going to say? Was it great? That, you know, what`s he going to stay about his son?
KING: He said he liked him.
BEHAR: Yes, I mean, you know?
(LAUGHTER)
WALKER: His son actually did a tape currently. They watched.
(CROSSTALK)
KING: It was very nice.
WALKER: It was.
KING: Did you read his book?
BEHAR: Part of it.
KING: It`s a great book.
BEHAR: I can`t read the whole book.
KING: I was really impressed.
BEHAR: Well, you know, I`m talking to Wendy about -- I`d be interested to know what you have to say to young women out there who want to be producers. The name of the book is `Producers," the lesson. What`s the one thing they should know if they want to get into television?
WALKER: I think that if they really want it, they can do it. That`s the lesson that I think because when I started, I was started as a secretary. You just have to work harder than the other person.
BEHAR: But you have to get in. How do you get in?
WALKER: I applied and became a secretary. And the funny thing is that Katie Couric that I started on the same day at ABC News.
BEHAR: Oh, yes?
WALKER: In 1979. And so, she was a desk assistant, and I was the secretary, and Stone Phillips was on the assignment desk. It`s pretty amazing that if we had doubt it -- Katy had said at that time, you know what, I`m going to make history. I`m going to become the first female anchor of -- I`m going to take over from Dan Rather. You know, we would have had a pretty big laugh.
BEHAR: Nobody ever knows. I mean, I was the receptionist at "Good Morning America."
WALKER: You were?
BEHAR: Yes.
WALKER: Yes. They get in and work harder than the next person.
KING: And take any job, right? Take any job.
BEHAR: Get your foot in. Interns is a good time to go to when you`re in college.
WALKER: Absolutely.
BEHAR: You have to be there on the premises. That`s what people need to know because they don`t really advertise for jobs.
KING: No. More people want in.
BEHAR: Yes. That`s right. Now, your book is causing quite a stir, you know, because here`s a British comic, Russell Brand, on an upcoming episode of "Larry King Live." Let`s watch Russell.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
RUSSELL BRAND, COMEDIAN: Yes.
KING: Of which you have a copy?
BRAND: What a fine book it is by Wendy. And what a looker. Whooa. Don`t mind if I do. The center fold is good.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BEHAR: He`s funny. He`s very funny.
KING: Funny. It airs Friday night.
WALKER: We would have kept him on another hour.
KING: I said at the end, I have had many guests, kings and queens, presidents, thieves and honest people.
WALKER: Yes.
KING: Every day people and famous people.
WALKER: Yes.
KING: You are the craziest person and one of the brightest, right? He`s a borderline genius.
WALKER: Yes. When you`re a comedian, you can`t sometimes -- comedians aren`t funny, right? I mean in real life, you know?
BEHAR: Well, not everybody is on 24/7.
KING: He is.
WALKER: He seems to be.
BEHAR: Yes.
WALKER: But he doesn`t drink, so he had three glasses in front of him like a Red Bull and Dr. Pepper.
BEHAR: Hype himself up.
KING: He`s whacked.
BEHAR: Who is the funniest comedian you`ve ever interviewed, Mel Brooks? When he jumps on the table? You love it. You start laughing.
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: Singing, dancing in the dark.
(SINGING)
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: You know, you two, is Wendy the longest relationship you`ve had with a woman?
WALKER: Without sex.
BEHAR: Without sex. Maybe that`s the secret for you.
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: Did you ever think of that, Larry?
KING: You know, first, first, I never fool around on the job, ever.
BEHAR: No.
KING: So, even if she threw herself at me --
WALKER: Which I have so many times. Let`s confess now. It`s been really hard.
KING: But on December 17th, watch out.
BEHAR: Is that your last day?
KING: Oh, yes. But I got to do specials.
WALKER: That`s right.
KING: Forget it. Forget it.
BEHAR: You don`t want to do them?
KING: No. I want to do them, but I can`t have --
BEHAR: That`s over. Forget about it. You know what, you`re in enough trouble.
KING: My wife is one of our best friends.
WALKER: Yes, I love Shawn. Her picture is in the book.
BEHAR: But you like blondes?
KING: Great pictures in the book.
BEHAR: Were all you wives blondes and gorgeous blondes, the (INAUDIBLE) blondes?
KING: If you can explain, can you explain why you`re attracted to someone? That`s impossible to explain.
WALKER: That`s right. I don`t think I can.
KING: You can, can`t you?
BEHAR: No. Well, as Woody Allen says, the heart wants what the heart wants and then he went after his daughter. But anyway, I digress. Go ahead.
(LAUGHTER)
KING: I told you, you got to have a show.
BEHAR: Now, how do you feel about guests walking off the show, the two of you?
KING: I`ve had it happen.
BEHAR: Yes, a couple times, right?
WALKER: It didn`t bother me.
BEHAR: Did it bother you when they walk off? Carrie Prejean walked off.
KING: Carry Prejean and the doctor.
WALKER: The doctor.
KING: I tell you why it don`t bother you. First --
BEHAR: Yes.
KING: It ain`t brain surgery. This hour will end when it ends. There`ll be another hour. Also, she`s saying, I`m going to make hay out of this.
WALKER: No, no.
KING: I`m going to get 14 guests to discuss this.
WALKER: But when it happened, I got a call from Atlanta and they said, well, just go on to another subject and I said, no, we`re going to re-rack the tape and we`re going to talk about it, and we had people, other reporters there.
KING: Because you used (ph) it.
WALKER: Well, yes.
BEHAR: You used it?
WALKER: It didn`t even upset me. Other things, it upsets you when you have a guest that`s not good like your impression of that one guy.
BEHAR: Who was that? Robert Mitchum.
WALKER: Robert Mitchum.
BEHAR: Robert Mitchum.
KING: The guy that topped him was the guy accused of killing the little baby in Colorado.
BEHAR: What about him? What did he do?
WALKER: Oh my --
KING: The guy supposedly confessed.
WALKER: Oh, I remember --
KING: What was the name?
WALKER: Ramsey.
BEHAR: Doesn`t matter. Oh, JonBenet Ramsey.
(CROSSTALK)
KING: The guy who had confessed. They picked him up in another country. They brought him --
(CROSSTALK)
KING: We got him. OK. We`re going to tape him in the afternoon. 4:00.
WALKER: No, he was live.
KING: No. He`s at the plane (ph) that night. We tape him at 4:00. I know --
BEHAR: All right. These details are wasting time. Come on.
KING: OK.
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: Come on. Get to the point.
KING: So, I`m about to start.
BEHAR: Yes.
KING: Here we go. He`s -- you got him. You got him. I`m just, OK, camera, ten seconds, nine, eight, seven. He goes oh, one thing. I don`t want to discuss JonBenet Ramsey.
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: That is a good story. I`m glad you ended there. Thank you, guys, very much. Buy the book. We`ll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BEHAR: He has interviewed countless celebrities and famous personalities as the host of the "Dick Cavett Show" in the 1960s, 1970s and 1980s. After getting a start writing for Jack Paar and Johnny Carson on "The Tonight Show" here with me now is the author of "Talk Show," the legendary talk show host, Dick Cavett. You are the original, Mr. Cavett.
DICK CAVETT, AUTHOR, "TALK SHOW": Am I?
BEHAR: Well, the particular type of format, yes.
CAVETT: I like that better than legend which means you must be at least 109 years old.
BEHAR: Exactly. Exactly.
CAVETT: I mean, Abe Lincoln is a legend.
BEHAR: But you still look good, and on the cover of your book, you`re quite the hot wasp (ph). There, I just say.
CAVETT: Well, I like that expression. Is that the new smart talk?
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: You know, you have a chapter in this book called, oh, what a lovely mess about what happened at the tonight show this year. You called it the NBC`s Hindenburg disaster. Tell me why.
CAVETT: You remember what a mess it was.
BEHAR: Yes.
CAVETT: They managed to take a situation where they had a man who was successful in the show and another man who was successful in another show and alienate everybody involved, damage their careers, ruin viewership for a lot of people, and I was on Larry King at the height of it, and I pretended I could see NBC at this botch they had made and said oh, they`re just putting out a banner. It says, mission accomplished.
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: It was a mess. It was a mess.
CAVETT: It was awful.
BEHAR: I mean, in your day, when you were, you know, at the height of your talk show success, did people act crazy on your show in those days?
CAVETT: Often, they did. Partly, because I started in the late 1960s and early 1970s and they would have parts in the pharmacopoeia in their systems --
BEHAR: They were stoned.
CAVETT: Stone, that`s the word I couldn`t take care of. Yes. I never went to college.
BEHAR: Yes, you did.
CAVETT: Oh, I did. That`s right.
BEHAR: Yes, you did.
CAVETT: So did you. But, yes, there were some crazy behaviors and at the beginning of the show, when I first started, I was so nervous that I didn`t really know what to do much about anything.
BEHAR: Well, this one show that you id, where you were interviewing Norman Mailer. It`s really my favorite moments of ever, forever. And he told you to look at your question sheet and ask you a question in this rather condescending Bill O`Reilly kind of way, OK? To which you, which you replied, why don`t you fold it five ways and shove it where the moon don`t shine?
CAVETT: Oh, wait, wait, no, no, no. And put it where the moon don`t shine.
BEHAR: OK and put it with --
CAVETT: Shove it would be vulgar.
BEHAR: I`m sorry. OK. And put it where the moon don`t shine.
CAVETT: Yes. Yes.
BEHAR: He didn`t walk off, did he?
CAVETT: No, he did not. Other people did. I`m not sure he could have at that point because he had stopped at several bars on the way over there.
BEHAR: Exactly.
CAVETT: (INAUDIBLE). And I noticed in the New Yorker piece just out about me and talk shows, the man said, what followed that line, I don`t know where it came from, Nebraska tribal memory, what, was also good. And I had forgotten it was, Cavett, after I said fold it --
BEHAR: Yes.
CAVETT: Cavett, is that something you`ve had canned for years? I mean, is that something you`ve been keeping and waiting for an opportunity to say it? Tell me on your word of honor. And I said I should have to tell you a quote from Tolstoy?
(LAUGHTER)
CAVETT: Well this, got an even a better laugh. Norman was angry. He`s a brilliant writer.
BEHAR: He`s a great writer.
CAVETT: And a lot of humor was left out of him.
BEHAR: Dick, I want to thank you for coming by. You`re my idol. You`re my role model.
CAVETT: My God. I`d have been here sooner if I`d known.
BEHAR: Thank you so much.
CAVETT: We go way back.
BEHAR: We do. We do. Oh, yes. That`s another story.
Thank you for watching everybody. Goodnight. Goodnight, everybody.
END
