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Joy Behar Page
Divorce Bombshells; Big Winner; Tax Plan IN Peril?
Aired December 15, 2010 - 21:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
JOY BEHAR, HLN HOST: "Time" magazine named Mark Zuckerberg their "Person of the Year". By the way, I finished 83rd, right behind ex-flight attendant Steven Slater and the smoking baby. Take that, Mrs. Shendel of the third grade. Ok?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Coming up on THE JOY BEHAR SHOW, it`s the holiday season of Hollywood splits. The recent rash of celebrity break-ups begs the question what is it about the holidays that pushes relationships to the brink?
And infamous Facebook founder, Mark Zuckerberg is named "Time`s" "Person of the Year". Joy, will take a look at who got snuffed.
Plus, the new winner of ""The Biggest Loser"" Patrick House is here to talk about last night`s victory and keeping the weight off over the holidays.
That and more starting right now.
BEHAR: Right before the holidays, a number of celebrity couples have called it quits. Scarlett Johansson and Ryan Reynolds announce their divorce after two years of marriage. Michael C. Hall, who plays Dexter, and Jennifer Carpenter, who`s on the show with him, they got divorced. And Zac Efron and Vanessa Hudgens also split up.
Someone please tell me that things are ok between Siegfried and Roy.
Now lots of Americans will call it quits before the New Year, the question is why.
Here now to talk about this are Mary Jo Eustace, author of "Divorce Sucks". Her ex-husband, Dean McDermott, married Tori Spelling. Remember that everybody.
Bradley Jacobs, senior editor of "Us Weekly" is here and clinical psychologist and life coach for "Shape" magazine, Belisa Vranich.
Bradley, what do you know about these break-ups? Come on.
BRADLEY JACOBS, SENIOR EDITOR, US WEEKLEY: Well, let`s talk about Ryan and Scarlett first because that was a big story for "Us Weekly". This week we broke it.
This was in the works for months. Scarlett was very unhappy. She was the one who pushed for the separation.
They were very different people, you know. Ryan Reynolds is a person who likes to write poetry for his girlfriends, whereas Scarlett was a really realist. She grew up here in New York City. She has publicly questioned whether monogamy is for real or not, whether it`s -- so they were just different.
This relationship -- also, they`re both A-listers. It`s hard to have two stars in one marriage. As someone once said, somebody has to be the flower and somebody has to be the soil. Here you have two flowers in one marriage. It was just too difficult.
BEHAR: The wind beneath my wings and all of that.
JACOBS: That`s right. There was no wind.
MARY JO EUSTACE, AUTHOR, "DIVORCE SUCKS": Exactly.
BEHAR: Yes. Mary Jo, these couples were married. The ones I just mentioned, Scarlett and Ryan, and Michael and Jennifer, they were married for two years. Is that like the new seven-year-itch, two years?
EUSTACE: Well, a few things I wanted to say. About three weeks ago, I saw Ryan Reynolds in a cafe. And he`s Canadian, very reserved. He looked very depressed. So I knew three weeks ago something was up. This marriage was on the rocks.
I know, big tip.
I sort of equate it to this way, in Hollywood, one year of marriage is like dog years -- it`s seven years. So I think that if you`re married two years in Hollywood, it`s like 14 years, you know. I think that it`s just so much harder to be married in that environment because these people are so entitled and so catered to that I think that they -- to take that into the relationship and actually have to work at something would probably be pretty challenging, I would imagine.
BEHAR: Maybe it`s just because they`re all gorgeous and people are coming on to them all the time. It`s like, why be with one when I can have great sex with the next one? You know, monogamous -- what do you call it - - serial monogamy.
EUSTACE: Serial monogamy.
BEHAR: Well, you know, not that they`re sluts, I`m not saying that. I`m just saying, you know, I did it with you now for two years. Enough. Next.
(CROSSTALK)
EUSTACE: It`s 14 years, Joy. It`s 14 years.
JACOBS: But also, don`t forget distance. I mean these people have been working on sets. They`re all over the country. There are high demands on -- there`s not a lot of time -- down time together. Relationships can be hard sometimes, even when you`re living in the same city, living in the same house.
BEHAR: Why don`t they learn from each other, in that case.
What do you think, Belisa?
BELISA VRANICH, CLINICAL PSYCHOLOGIST: Well, I have to tell you, what Bradley said about there has to be a flower and there has to be a stem. Often people, I think celebrities tend to marry people that look good with them or just as beautiful. Not necessarily people that complement them. And I think that`s what we had --
BEHAR: But that`s who they meet. Beauties meet other beauties. Dogs meet dogs. That`s how it works. I hate to --
EUSTACE: But that`s the universe, though, right? That`s the university that they live in. I mean it`s like Joy said, it`s total access 24/7. They can get anything they want at any time.
So what is the motivation to stay in a relationship really, if you can get the next best thing all the time? It`s very surreal.
BEHAR: They`re really not like the rest of the world, you know.
JACOBS: No, no.
BEHAR: They`re just not.
JACOBS: They live by different rules. It`s sort of interesting that they also still have to lead by the rules of a marriage. That`s why so many of them don`t work out.
BEHAR: Yes.
VRANICH: And it`s not about dating. If you think about -- you don`t hear about people dating for the normal amounts of time or being engaged for the normal amounts of time. So really that combination of years, how it translates into different amount of dog years or cat years, that`s it.
EUSTACE: Right.
BEHAR: Ok. Now, let`s talk about the holidays because we`re in the middle of the holiday season and all these celebrity couples -- I mean I have a list of them from previous times.
Like Reese and Jake, they broke up in 2009, in December. Sean Penn and Robin Wright, they filed for divorce in December 2007. Jessica and Nick, remember those two, Thanksgiving, 2005. What is with the holidays? Tiger Woods and Elin`s big break-up fight was on Thanksgiving 2009.
Ok. Belisa, is there some significance to this.
VRANICH: Absolutely. There is -- holidays are a time when you evaluate how you`ve done and you plan for the future. So it makes sense that right before the holidays, you start looking around. You start adding things up and say, this doesn`t working for me and I don`t want to fake it anymore.
BEHAR: But these just include Easter -- what about, you know -- I mean Christmas. What about Easter, what about all the holidays? Flag day?
VRANICH: No, they don`t include Easter. Flag day, no.
(CROSSTALK)
JACOBS: There`s all this pressure at this time of year. It`s a family and fun time. But there`s also a lot of stress involved. Travel and you`re seeing family members that maybe push your buttons a little bit. And if your relationship is already sort of teetering on a breakup, this time of year might push it over the edge. And I think that that`s what you see.
VRANICH: It is the tipping point. It is. It`s that tipping point moment for a relationship where they have to decide, is this going to work for us or is this not going to work for us for the coming year?
So yes, you`re going to see that.
EUSTACE: It`s also expectations right? It`s the expectations you have of the holiday season. But for Hollywood, maybe December is like a clearance month, you know, to get ready for the New Year and the awards ceremony. And just so many kind of ship it out and you know, you bring something new in January, right? That makes sense.
JACOBS: New Year, new you.
BEHAR: Well, according it a recent study conducted by Facebook, which is not a scientific study -- but they asked a lot of people -- two weeks leading up to Christmas show a rise in breakups.
VRANICH: Yes.
JACOBS: Yes.
BEHAR: So, the holidays. Shouldn`t people wait until after Christmas, especially when they have kids. I don`t think Scarlett has any children.
JACOBS: No children there.
BEHAR: A lot of these people don`t have children so it`s really all bets are off if you don`t have children and it`s not working out. Who really suffers?
VRANICH: And one of the things is --
EUSTACE: You should wait for your gifts though.
BEHAR: You should wait for the gifts.
VRANICH: I think that`s part of it. It`s the gifts. You don`t want to give gifts to someone you`re not getting along with. So I think that there`s a little practical element in there too.
BEHAR: But also, you know, if there`s a third party involved, the third party -- this is for real people now, not all these movie stars, it`s for us. If there`s a third party involved, that third party wants you there for Christmas. You have to tell -- a lot of cases like this, you have to tell the wife and kids, look, I`m not coming home for Christmas because I have to be with her. That`s really lovely.
JACOBS: Joy, there is a famous one that you didn`t mention.
EUSTACE: That`s an excellent point actually.
JACOBS: What about when Brad Pitt and Jennifer Aniston went away for New Year`s, they went to a warm resort in Mexico and that`s where they decided to break up and they came back and announced it? It was famous.
(CROSSTALK)
VRANICH: Good point.
BEHAR: Jennifer Aniston -- tell me that. Tell me this again.
JACOBS: Remember that one?
BEHAR: I don`t remember. Refresh my memory.
JACOBS: He wore that famous trash T-shirt when they were walking on the beach, him and Jen. It was one of the last photographs ever taken of them. And they came out back and they announced that they were separating amicably at that time around January 7th.
BEHAR: Well, a vacation is a bad time to go away with someone when you`re on the rocks because then you`re alone with them. And there`s no distraction. You say, oh my God, I can`t believe I have to be stuck with this person.
(CROSSTALK)
VRANICH: The distraction is something, but I think people choose the holidays because they`re distracted by other things that are happening so people do not focus on their relationship breaking up. There`s too many other things going on. So that`s one of the reasons they may choose that.
BEHAR: But Mary Jo, do you think if there are children involved, they should postpone it until after Christmas? Wouldn`t that be nice?
EUSTACE: Yes. Yes. I mean, you know, actually I think that really in consideration to your children, you shouldn`t break up your marriage at Christmas. It sort of, you know, sets a precedent for every year.
BEHAR: yes.
EUSTACE: Actually, when my marriage imploded, it happened right before my son started school. There was ten talk of telling him the night before school. I said that`s not going to happen. In the real world, you have to make better decisions than that for your family. You celebrate Christmas as a family and then you ease the family into it. It`s not a good time.
BEHAR: But if you can`t stand each other, how are you going to look at each other over the yuletide thing?
EUSTACE: Be an adult maybe.
BEHAR: Being an adult, yes.
EUSTACE: Yes, fake it. We`re all used to faking it, let`s face it.
BEHAR: I know. What about the recession we`re in? Supposedly we`re in a down time economically. Doesn`t that play into it? I mean can people afford -- I`m not talking about Scarlett now.
I`m not talking about Zac Efron also. They`re kids. Maybe that was a problem.
JACOBS: Right. That relationship ended because they met when they were 17 and 18 years old. They just grew up and grew apart. I mean, listen, how different are you at 17 than at 22? I`m amazed that these two lasted as long as they did.
BEHAR: I got married when I was 22 and it lasted 16 years. Yes, it did. It can work. It didn`t it work for 16 years. It only worked for a year. Thanks, everybody.
EUSTACE: That`s the problem.
BEHAR: We have to go.
I know.
We`ll be right back. I hope people stay together for Christmas though. It would be nice.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Coming up a little later on the JOY BEHAR SHOW, Facebook founder Mark Zuckerberg is named "Time" magazine`s "Person of the Year". And the latest on the feud between Rush Limbaugh and Michael Moore.
Now back to Joy.
BEHAR: Once upon a time doctors told the 400-pound Patrick House he was a ticking time bomb with only five years to live. Well, this story has a happy ending because on last night`s season finale of "The Biggest Loser" he proved to him -- himself and obese people everywhere that you can lose the weight and turn your life around.
And Patrick is here with me now along with Bill Germanakos -- Germanakos -- "The Biggest Loser" winner from Season 4our, and the Cheryl Forberg "The Biggest Loser" nutritionist. Welcome to the show.
Patrick, congratulations.
PATRICK HOUSE, "THE BIGGEST LOSER" SEASON 10 WINNER: Thank you. I appreciate it.
BEHAR: What does it mean to you to have lost all that weight?
HOUSE: Oh this means the world to me. You know, I have such a special family. My wife and my two boys, Colton is four and Caden is two. And I just know that I`m going to be able to be around for them longer now and be able to play with them and not tire out after just a couple of minutes. It`s just a special night for me last night. And winning "The Biggest Loser" I mean, it`s fantastic.
BEHAR: Your wife must be happy too.
HOUSE: Yes she is and I`m -- I`m really proud of her too. You know while I was on the ranch, she lost a little over 50 pounds. She went from a size 14 to a size 4. So she`s come a long way as well.
BEHAR: That`s pretty good.
HOUSE: Yes ma`am.
BEHAR: And you were 400 pounds.
HOUSE: I was, yes, ma`am.
BEHAR: And but you`re 6`2".
HOUSE: Yes, ma`am.
BEHAR: But how -- well, why did you get to that, do you think?
HOUSE: Oh you know, I played -- I played football in college at Delta State University. And I got hurt playing football. I ended up having to have back surgery for a couple of ruptured disks. And you know I ate a lot and I have a special diet to maintain that weight to playoff end of line. And unfortunately when I got hurt, you know I lost the exercise and I lost the football practice --
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: And just kept eating.
HOUSE: And the eating habits stayed the same. And so over the course of four or five years, you know 20, 25 pounds a year, here you are at over 400 pounds.
BEHAR: That`s a lot.
HOUSE: Yes, ma`am.
BEHAR: The doctors said you were going to die.
HOUSE: Dr. H. On the show told me that I was five years away from a major heart catastrophe.
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: A heart attack.
HOUSE: And that`s at 28 years old. Yes, ma`am.
BEHAR: So this was -- that was your wake-up call?
HOUSE: That`s when I -- you know you always see in the paper, you hear somebody, oh so-and-so, 33 years old, heart attack and died. But you never think it would be you. But hearing those from Dr. H. on the show, it really opened my eyes and knew that -- just how dangerous -- just how dangerous the situation was for me.
BEHAR: Right. There`s diabetes, heart attack, cancer; all sorts of things that could go wrong.
HOUSE: Yes ma`am.
BEHAR: Cheryl, how common is this among overweight obese people that they really have to get a wakeup call. You`re going to die if you don`t lose it?
CHERYL FORBERG, NUTRITIONIST, "THE BIGGEST LOSER": It`s -- it`s not unusual. And can I just say congratulations, Patrick. I -- I wasn`t in L.A. to see the finale last night but I`m so proud of you.
HOUSE: Thank you.
FORBERG: Yes and -- but I`ve been with the show since the beginning, Joy. And it`s -- it`s been very common each season. I see the same symptoms over and over again. The contestants come to the show often with weight-related type 2 diabetes, high blood pressure, high cholesterol, sleep apnea, fertility issues. It`s a whole slew of weight-related --
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: Right.
FORBERG: -- issues. And -- but -- oh, I`m sorry, go ahead.
BEHAR: No. I was going to say, Bill, did you have those issues too?
BILL GERMANAKOS, "BIGGEST LOSER" SEASON 4 WINNER: I did, you know that`s a commonality amongst all of us. And like Patrick, I was a collegiate athlete. I played lacrosse, I tore up my knee and you know kept eating the way I had before. And you know, I think there`s a little depression in there too that we kind of -- I was -- we were taught -- I was taught on the ranch by our psychologist, that hey, listen, you know, you might be replacing your -- what made you the man before, sports and such, with food.
You know, so it was explained to me that I had an addiction and it made me feel -- I was medicating with food. A lot of times the athletes who retire early or get injured have that same sense.
BEHAR: That`s -- it`s interesting that you`re replacing -- it was kind of like food is an addiction too. So usually people have an addiction they replace it with another addiction. Hopefully it`s a good addiction like exercise.
GERMANAKOS: Well, thanks to someone like --
(CROSSTALK)
HOUSE: Like working out.
BEHAR: Yes, like working out.
GERMANAKOS: -- someone like Ms. Forberg on the show, she taught us how to be addicted to more healthy food.
BEHAR: Like -- how did you lose it? Tell me how you guys lost it. What did you do?
HOUSE: You know, I mean, for me going home, losing on the ranch, on the ranch it`s a -- it`s a great place, you know, to start weight loss.
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: You have help.
HOUSE: With Bob and Jillian and you`ve got the help. Going home was where the real challenge for me. And you know, getting into -- coming home, I was fortunate that you know my wife had already made those changes with her taking the junk food out of the house and already starting to prepare healthy meals. I came home into a changed household. And that really helped me just propel my weight loss and continue. You know I lost 60 pounds at home. And that really helped me to get the edge and get on top.
BEHAR: That`s important, don`t you think Cheryl, to have somebody helping you with the food. Because you have to prepare stuff, it`s very difficult.
FORBERG: It`s very difficult. It`s a vertical learning curve in the beginning for most of the contestants because typically they`ve had a history of skipping meals. Sometimes getting enough calories from their beverages alone to meet their daily needs because they don`t know what their calorie requirements are. Not having enough fruits and vegetables. Not drinking much water and -- and certainly not having a lot of exercise in their daily plans.
So it`s all about finding a new learning curve and moving forward with that and implementing all the changes at home as well.
BEHAR: Right. So -- so as a person watching at home, what would you say to them? What should they do? Let`s say they have to lose 30 pounds.
(CROSSTALK)
HOUSE: You know --
FORBERG: Ok.
HOUSE: -- like I said, whether you have to lose 30 pounds or like me a 180 pounds, you have to take that first step, you know. And -- and just changing your diet is not enough. You`ll lose some weight -- especially at 400 pounds -- you`ll lose some weight when you change your diet. But you`ve got to incorporate exercise and you`ve got to get out there --
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: How much exercise, though? Realistically, how much can a person who works a 9:00 to 5:00 job do in -- in the course of the week?
HOUSE: Well, you`d be amazed that what you can do just by changing small things. Like when you go to the grocery store and parking at the farther parking spot and walking in. There are small things, taking the stairs when you go to work instead of the elevator. Things like that.
You can get in an exercise without actually having to take yourself to a gym and work out. And those things add up, that`s calories burned and weight loss is calories in, calories out.
BEHAR: Ok, so incorporate the exercise in your day. We hear this over and over again but it`s very hard for people to get this into their heads. Drink more water. That seems to be crucial, right, Cheryl? The water seems to be very, very important in losing weight.
FORBERG: That`s right. And there are a number of -- of reasons for that. One is that when we`re changing the eating plan here, we eat a lot of fresh fruits and vegetables, whole grain. The -- this eating plan, the distinction here is that the quality of the calories is just as important as the quantity. And when we`re having four cups of fruits and vegetables a day and a lot of whole grains, we`re increasing our fiber intake. And when you do that, you need to have a lot more water as well.
BEHAR: Right. See, that`s the thing. You have to have all these fruits and vegetables and all of this water. Somebody has to be there to give this to you if you are working all day. That seems to be the hardest part.
Now, let me ask you something, you two were unhealthy. Why didn`t you just go for one of the surgeries instead of going through all of these, the gastric bypass or the banding?
HOUSE: You know, for me that was like the last option. And before I made "The Biggest Loser" in February of this year, I lost my job in January and February came around. That was kind of my -- I was looking at, maybe now is the time to take that step and have a lap band surgery. But fortunately for me, "The Biggest Loser" came around at the time that gave me the opportunity to lose this weight on my own.
BEHAR: But if it didn`t, would you have done it?
HOUSE: You know that`s a decision I probably would have made with my family. I`m not sure if I would have or not. At that point I was looking at my career and my family, my (INAUDIBLE).
You know, obviously it`s tough to get in there, go out and get a job. The interviewing process is hard. I worked in sales. And immediately when you walk in the door in a sales job, it`s tough when you`re 400 pounds trying to sell a product.
BEHAR: Exactly. That`s another thing.
Ok. We`re going to talk some more after this break. So stay right there.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HOUSE: To see that your work has paid off, you know. I mean, we`ve all burned it up in here. The first step was seeing that number, you know, just kind of fuels the fire to just keep it going.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HOUSE: Big guy, huh?
BEHAR: I`m back with my panel. I didn`t recognize you.
HOUSE: Yes, ma`am.
BEHAR: It`s amazing how the face gets out of shape too when you gain a lot of weight like that.
HOUSE: It is.
Let`s talk about the holiday season, Cheryl. It`s upon us. Everywhere I go there`s food now, you know. And there`s hors d`oeuvres, which are killers. Because you eat the hors d`oeuvres and then you say, let`s have dinner, you know. And there`s booze. What are we supposed to do?
FORBERG: Well, I actually have a nice blog about holiday cocktails on the show`s Web site, and how you to navigate that. But it`s important going into the holidays to not just make that assumption that I`m going to it gain ten pounds or five pounds or whatever like I do every year.
It`s not enough to say, I`m going to start January 1st. Begin today. Just start off with a little bit of exercise and gradually build up. And knowing that you`re going into the holiday season with all of these indulgences everywhere around you, it`s really important.
And if you`re going to a party, for example, try to make something, prepare something or take something along that`s healthy so you know there will be at least one good choice there.
BEHAR: I see. Well, a lot of people say you shouldn`t eat at the cocktail party. Make a decision to either have one drink or eat one hors d`oeuvre or don`t eat anything or don`t drink anything and plan the dinner, a step stiffer. What do you think about that, Cheryl?
FORBERG: That`s a great idea.
BEHAR: Too stringent?
FORBERG: No, I think it`s a great idea to eat before you go and just plan on socializing. That`s what it`s all about anyway.
BEHAR: That`s right. Just network and socialize.
Now, Bill, you`re a fitness instructor.
GERMANAKOS: I am a group fitness guy. I do speaking engagements for health and wellness.
BEHAR: How much does willpower play in all this?
GERMANAKOS: Well, as opposed to willpower, we just say, try to keep your goals in mind. People say well, how do you stay motivated? And for me, I mean I haven`t hit my goals yet. My goals are to walk my two little girls down the aisle one day. My youngest is only 11. So I still have to work towards that goal.
And every time someone says, well, come on. Have a brownie, have something. Just have one. It will taste great. I say, it`s not going to be as great as -- taste as great as me walking them --
BEHAR: Well, I don`t understand what you mean. You could walk them down the aisle right now if they were of age.
GERMANAKOS: If they were of age but, you know, in 20 years will I still be able to I do so? This is why I`m motivated to keep going.
And you know, when people say motivated, you know, everybody gets up and brushes their teeth first thing in the morning. We get up and brush our teeth and go to the gym. We`ve just changed our habits a bit now.
BEHAR: Right.
GERMANAKOS: And on holiday mornings, why ruin an entire month of working out just for one holiday?
What`s great is if you eat correctly and you stop drinking, people will see you`re doing that, they might take the lead from you and try to be better themselves.
BEHAR: Do you have a last thing to say to the audience to encourage them?
HOUSE: Yes, ma`am. You know, I`m excited with the question about the holiday eating. My first blog on my Web site is going to be about holiday eating and weight loss tips. My Web site launched last night. It`s at www.biggestloser.patrick.com.
And I`m excited about that. And just, you know, you have to get out there. You have to take that first step. Get out of your comfort zone. And you know, I mean Bill and I, we`re not superheroes, we`re just normal guys.
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: Stop it. You`re both superheroes. And so are you Cheryl.
Thanks very much for joining me tonight. Congratulations Patrick. Be sure to tune in to the new season of "The Biggest Loser" January 4th on NBC.
We`ll be back in a minute.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
JOY BEHAR, HOST: "Time" magazine has named Facebook founder, Mark Zuckerberg its Person of the Year. I`m shocked. My money was on the "don`t touch my junk" guy. With me now to talk about this and other stories in the news are Rebecca Dana, senior correspondent for the Daily Beast, fashion designer, David Meister, and Tia Carrere, actress and singer who was recently nominated for her fourth Grammy. Congratulations to you, Tia.
: Thank you.
BEHAR: Rebecca, Facebook has been around for a while.
REBECCA DANA, SENIOR CORRESPONDENT, THE DAILY BEAST: It has.
BEHAR: And the "Social Network" made him seemed like a jerk, frankly.
DANA: Yes. I mean, not that that`s autobiographical in the slightest. But yes, it made him seem like a jerk. He gives some money to the New Jersey school system. Facebook is kind of a big deal, but --
BEHAR: One in ten people on the planet is on Facebook. That`s pretty big. That`s probably what it was.
DANA: Yes, it`s not insignificant. And I think, also, like, Julian Assange, who are these other people? My other (ph) question is who cares? Why does "Time" magazine`s Person of the Year still exist? Like, Adolf Hitler, all right, I get it.
(CROSSTALK)
DANA: That`s a man of the year, but Mark, it`s like why? It`s so anachronistic. It`s such a bizarre --
BEHAR: Well, who would you --
DANA: I don`t. I don`t.
BEHAR: Would you have put Sarah Palin on the cover?
DANA: No. I think nobody. I think this is like a stupid thing to do, in the first place.
(LAUGHTER)
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: Just have a blank page. It`s brilliant.
DANA: I mean, this is what "Time" magazine has been doing for the last five years. They did you which had sort of like mirrored covered. I just don`t even know why this thing exists. Why do we need to have a Person of the Year?
BEHAR: Well, you know, the other thing is that Zuckerberg is 26 years old. He`s the second-youngest person. Charles Lindbergh was the first in 1927. He was 25. Do you think maybe they`re trying to go for the younger demographic, David?
DAVID MEISTER, FASHION DESIGNER: I think absolutely. You know, I think it`s a very safe choice as well.
BEHAR: Who? Zuckerberg?
MEISTER: Zuckerberg. Everybody knows the Facebook. The thing that I find ironic is the fact, you know, the internet is stealing so much business away from the magazines at this point. And a magazine is actually picking someone from the internet as their man of the year. I think there`s something little ironic there.
BEHAR: Why do you think they did that? They want to get those people to read their magazine.
MEISTER: And I think again, the younger demographic is absolutely true.
DANA: Well, the truth about this thing is also is that they`re really just naked commercial gambits. Like, part of the reason they chose Mark Zuckerberg is because Mark Zuckerberg gave them an interview, and they want to sell magazines and not a lot of people get interviews with Mark Zuckerberg. I`m sure, it`s like, I don`t know, Gaddafi gave them an interview that was really great. Maybe, Gaddafi would be the man of the year.
TIA CARRERE, ACTRESS: But don`t you think he really deserves being Person of the Year. I mean, he`s changed the way that we communicate, for better or for worse. I mean, we have followers. We have virtual friends. I mean, we don`t even know how to communicate on a deeper level due in no small part (INAUDIBLE) Facebook. You know, it`s like the greatest hits. It`s an upsizing of our lives. This is the way we approach every relationship now.
BEHAR: That`s true.
CARRERE: I mean, I don`t like it, but you know, my father was able to find three friends that he knew in childhood in the Philippines from Facebook, and they got together and did the three-part harmonies.
BEHAR: Oh, isn`t that sweet?
CARRERE: Yes. You know, so, it works.
DANA: I think there`s no question that Facebook has completely revolutionized the way we socialize, the way we interact, the way we live online. I`m just not sure why this year as opposed to five years ago when he started --
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: Rebecca, only five women, individual women in all the years that they`ve been doing this, which is how many years -- hundreds and hundreds of years, whatever. I don`t know how many years. Corazon Aquino, you said that you`re part Filipino.
CARRERE: Yes.
BEHAR: And Queen Elizabeth II. General and Madam Chiang Kai-shek, but she came with the husband. Hello. And Wallis Simpson. Remember, that was the one that King Edward gave up the crown for Wallis Simpson. She must have done something really good.
OK. Moving on. In related news, Sandra Bullock who left her cheating husband, Jesse James and is raising her adopted son, Louie, as a single mom was just named "People" magazine`s Woman of the Year. OK. What do you make of that? Tell me.
DANA: I make exactly the same thing. I mean --
(LAUGHTER)
DANA: I don`t understand why these things exist. I`m sorry to be such a killjoy with all of this. But also, I mean, people -- like Sandra Bullock did a cover hoisting up her beautiful adopted child for "People" magazine. Elin Nordegren is also on their list, also gave an exclusive to "People" magazine. Like, it`s wonderful to celebrate these great people.
And Mark Zuckerberg is a visionary, and Sandra Bullock, who doesn`t love Sandra Bullock? But, you know, we might as well acknowledge what`s going on here which is that everybody`s scratching each other backs, which is fine. But that`s what it is.
BEHAR: Well, you know what, it`s all about the cheating guys. I`m thinking of giving Steve Ashley Dupre`s number. Then, I`ll be on the --
MEISTER: You`re in the cover (ph).
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: Yes. She was not exactly a controversial choice this year, Sandra. Everyone loves her. She`s America`s sweetheart. She happens to be a lovely person, it seems. So, it`s no big deal.
CARRERE: What`s the underdog story that we love, you know, the woman who prevails against a cheating husband. I mean, country songs have been written about it.
BEHAR: Yes.
CARRERE: And you know, she`s beyond reproach. And like you said, it is a little bit of blatant consumerism who doesn`t love her, who`s not going to pick up the cover of this magazine.
MEISTER: I think the one thing that`s great about her is through all the press and the paparazzi and through all these horrible things, she`s had a great year and she`s had some sucky things. She`s never once really sunk to any low level. She`s always just gone about her life and done her thing.
BEHAR: Right. How do you like the way she dresses, David?
MEISTER: She`s stunning.
BEHAR: She`s stunning.
MEISTER: She can go from glam to rocking.
BEHAR: Did you like my top?
MEISTER: You look fabulous, and that color is great on you.
BEHAR: OK. Thank you, David.
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: Pay him later.
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: OK. Hollywood seniors -- this is a good one -- Betty White and Ed Asner got rowdy during the photo shoot for the "Hollywood Reporter". And Betty actually grabbed Ed Asner`s crotch. Unfortunately, he`s so old, he just turned his head and coughed.
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: OK. Now, what do you think of senior citizens acting in these ways? Because, you know, (INAUDIBLE) grabbed her boobs.
DANA: I hope when I`m Betty White`s age, someone`s grabbing my boobs like that.
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: What if they`re fake, and someone grabs them, and you know, they`re fake, is that the same jollies than an old guy is going to get? I don`t know.
MEISTER: I don`t know. At that age, they`re going to be hanging. I don`t know.
BEHAR: No, they won`t be. Everything will be hanging, but they will be perfect.
MEISTER: Perfect. You`re right.
CARRERE: Oh, my goodness. But Betty White has always been that way, though, hasn`t she? She`s (ph) invited that anyway.
DANA: Yes. I think it`s wonderful.
BEHAR: I`m so surprised at Ed Asner, didn`t you?
DANA: I don`t know.
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: He later threatened Larry Hagman, another older guy, with his cane. And Hagman said, I had a colonoscopy yesterday, so I can take anything, he said. Whoa. TMI, Larry. OK. Let`s do another story. In what is becoming a trend for powerful Republicans, Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell choked up during a farewell speech to retiring Senator Judd Gregg of New Hampshire. Take a look.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MITCH MCCONNELL, (R) SENATE MINORITY LEADER: Now, to say that I tried to convince Judd to stay is an understatement. But he knew it was his time to move on. And to write the next chapter -- next chapter in his life. When he walks out of this chamber for the last time, he`ll leave an enormous void behind.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BEHAR: What can you say to this?
DANA: I have two words for you, Glenn Beck. These people are not stupid. And they are learning from a master populist here. I would not be surprised if all of this is orchestrated, first of all. Second of all, I wouldn`t care if they were crying all the time if they were also getting something done. But instead, they`re just crying all the time.
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: All the Republican guys are crying historically or all the Republican women are out shooting animals. It`s like a role reversal.
DANA: Yes.
MEISTER: You know, I`m all for a little man emotion, but this is crazy. It`s like Senate floor, slippery when wet. I mean, of all the things we could be crying over, of all the real issues to cry over this country, the things that they`re crying over, it`s like come on, guys. Suck it up.
BEHAR: But where are the Republican tears for the unemployed and uninsured? Oh, he`s retiring.
MEISTER: And this is the same guy --
BEHAR: Give me a break. Emotionally unstable. I don`t think it`s a put-on. I think they`re really sick. Something`s wrong with them.
CARRERE: I wonder if they have a change in the middle of life the way women do. I`m wondering if there`s a hormonal imbalance.
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: I know. Well, when Glenn Beck starts to fan himself --
(LAUGHTER)
DANA: Then they have chalk boards (ph), then we`ll know for sure, but I wouldn`t be surprised if this is in some measure calculated.
BEHAR: But they can`t stop. I mean, if they start to filibuster, it`s going to be a tsunami.
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: I mean, can they lead in this particular emotional state?
DANA: Yes. I mean, can they lead in any emotional state?
CARRERE: I`m just happy that it breaks up the monotony of C-span. Let`s be honest. You`re sitting there -- it`s like Charlie Brown`s (ph) picture, and then, hey, at least, they`re crying. I`m waiting for full frontal nudity next. That`s what I want.
BEHAR: John Boehner, let`s see what you`ve got. Man up. What have happened to man up? That only goes for Democrats?
CARRERE: Republican women, apparently.
BEHAR: For republican women. Man up. Grow some hair on your lip. Thanks, everybody. We`ll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BEHAR: The Senate approved President Obama`s tax plan today, sending it on to the House for final approval, but President Obama appears a bit worried that it may not pass now that the new opposition is springing up from the right. Listen to what he said today.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I know there are different aspects of this plan to which members of Congress on both sides of the aisle object. That`s the nature of compromise. But we worked hard to negotiate an agreement that`s a win for middle class families and win for our economy. We can`t afford to let it fall victim to either delay or defeat.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BEHAR: Here now to talk about this is Stephanie Miller, host of the "Stephanie Miller Show" and Tara Wall, conservative commentator and contributor to the Daily Caller. OK, Tara, let me start with you. First, we saw democratic opposition. Now, it looks like the GOP are fracturing. What`s going on?
TARA WALL, CONSERVATIVE COMMENTATOR: Well, I think, you know, many of those in the GOP who are essentially looking at potential runs in 2012 know this is going to be an issue that this is going to be the can that`s going to be kicked down the road, if you will, on this, because 2012 is when, you know, some of this the tax relief expires.
And I think they`re positioning themselves, probably, legitimately so to raise a very real issue about what happens next when the tax relief expires, when we don`t address the deficit and other very real issues that some believe have been -- are posed with this tax deal. It is a compromise. It is bipartisan. There is something for everyone in it, but I think there are some legitimate issues that are raised.
BEHAR: Let me ask you, Stephanie, do you think that some of the people in the GOP are really against it now because it makes Obama look good?
STEPHANIE MILLER, RADIO TALK SHOW HOST: Of course, yes. I mean, that`s exactly it. Look, the one reason to be for it now, Joy, is that Rush Limbaugh and Sarah Palin are against it. That`s a good enough reason. But, I mean, you know, I was wondering when they were going to start to wake up to the -- you know, they just ran on reducing the deficit, but they`re fine adding tax cuts for the rich. They`re going to add the huge vault of these deficits. That`s what they`re fighting.
BEHAR: You know, Tara, let`s get a little specific. What is the main complaint from the right on this now? I mean, they got their beloved tax cuts on the right. What are they complaining about?
WALL: OK, First and foremost, it`s not -- I don`t believe it`s all the right (ph). Again, you have select folks like Sarah Palin, like Mitt Romney who are running essentially. Of course, they haven`t announced, but you know they`re positioning themselves for positions down the line and for potential public runs. I`m not saying that doesn`t make the arguments legitimate.
I think the fact is we have very real issues with our current tax code. It is a monstrosity. And I think the conservative who rightfully raise the issue of, number one, how we`re going to lower the deficit. Number one, why we`re adding to the deficit when you talk about things like a payroll holiday, you know, when Social Security is going to be insolvent, and this increases the time in which it`s going to be insolvent.
Those are very real issues when you talk about, you know, tax relief being temporary and going back to penalizing, if you will, those who contribute to society, whether they`re small business owners who are deemed wealthy, and for that very reason alone are taxed. The fact that we have unfair corporate tax rate by President Obama`s own deficit reduction commissions admissions. Those are very real issues that still have to be addressed outside of the current tax plans.
BEHAR: Democrats are still in charge at this moment. And 59 percent of Americans support the plan. So, what are they going to do, really? What are Romney and Sarah Palin really doing? Stephanie, want to answer that?
MILLER: Well, Joy, first of all, I can tell you why they don`t like the bill because it`s not mean enough. You know, you have to remember, Joy, this is a party that just against health care for 9/11 responders. They voted to let --
(CROSSTALK)
MILLER: Right before Christmas. Right before Christmas. I mean, if there was a bill about slapping food out of orphans` mouths, they would vote for that. If there was a bill about pushing old ladies down the stairs for fun, they`d vote for that. I mean, they`re not going to grow a sense of decency in January. I think this is the best deal we can get, Joy.
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: Tara, let me ask you.
WALL: Attack Sarah Palin and Mitt Romney are not voting for anything because they`re not elected officials. I think they are raising the conversation, they`re raising the discussion which is very real and very legitimate. And at this point, it`s a moot point in regard to the fact --
MILLER: Right. But they don`t like because it doesn`t hurt poor people enough.
(CROSSTALK)
WALL: That`s just -- that`s rhetoric.
MILLER: Not tax cuts for the rich. They love those.
BEHAR: You know, Tara, you have to admit they`re concerned about the unemployment benefits going on, but to add to the deficit, but tax relief for the rich, they don`t seem to be concerned about that. She does make the point.
WALL: Listen, the concern about the tax for the rich is who are we defining as rich? You know, that bar has changed from one level to the next over the past two years under the current administration.
MILLER: The average income in the United States is 44,000. $250,000 is rich.
WALL: If you let me finish my thought. I didn`t interrupt you, so let me finish my thought. I think when we talk about the wealthy, you`re talking about a span of people that includes small business owners, that include black farmers, that include people who feel like they`re getting pinched out of the system. And it still does not do anything to address the very real issues that we had with our current tax code --
MILLER: But the senate voted down --
WALL: And the president`s own bipartisan commission talked about how convoluted it is.
(CROSSTALK)
MILLER: Chuck Schumer put forth a compromise up to $1 million a year. Republicans voted that down. It`s not enough. Nothing is enough for them. They`ve got to protect the very, very rich.
WALL: First of all, the top 5 percent that we`re always talking about, pay the bulk of taxes, pay the fair share, more than the fair share of taxes in this country, over 60 percent, almost 60 percent of taxes.
BEHAR: Tara, what do you say to people -
WALL: I don`t think that`s a fair system. I think what Republicans, what conservatives are talking about, are a fairer, more flatter system --
MILLER: You`re making (ph) the most historically low tax rates we have.
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: Tara, stop it.
(LAUGHTER)
WALL: It`s your show, Joy, go ahead.
BEHAR: Just let me ask you a question. Let me ask you a question. What do you say to people that the very, very rich, their money really doesn`t circulate in the country and doesn`t really get the economy going, whereas people who are collecting unemployment insurance put it back into the system? People who make under $250,000 spend their money. The very rich don`t spend their money. They just invest their money. What do you say to that?
WALL: I say, the more you tax them, the less that they`re going to spend. I think that`s part of the problem.
BEHAR: Really?
WALL: Yes, really. Really. I think that`s part of the problem. I think when you put a tax on someone who is contributing to society, it causes them to hold back. I think when you also feed into a system that is not fair, it is contributing --
(CROSSTALK)
WALL: Yes. That is the question. Where are the jobs? Where are the jobs? Where are the jobs, and why are we also rewarding those who don`t even pay into the tax system at all? It is not a fair system. If we had a flat tax -- what`s wrong with a flat tax? Then, everybody pays their fair share.
BEHAR: That`s not fair.
WALL: What`s wrong with that?
BEHAR: A flat tax, I don`t think, is fair.
WALL: Why is that not fair?
BEHAR: It should be graduated because then people are jus t paying the same amount. The rich are paying the same amount as the poor. It`s not really fair.
WALL: Sure it is.
BEHAR: The rich should pay more, don`t you think?
WALL: If you`re making more 50 and 10 percent of 50,000 versus 10 percent of 5,000, that`s a much fairer system than the small percentage of people paying 60 percent of taxes.
MILLER: If you`re making 40 grand a year, you can`t afford 25 percent.
WALL: It`s a hypothetical.
BEHAR: We have to take a break. We`ll be back in a minute with more of this political panel.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BEHAR: I`m back with my political panel. Michael Moore announced yesterday that he was posting 20,000 of his own money to help bail out WikiLeaks founder, Assange, who is in custody on suspicion of rape. Well, Rush Limbaugh got wind (ph) of this and not so surprisingly had something to yell about. Listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
RUSH LIMBAUGH, HOST: It`s so heart warming to see a bunch of high- minded people out there on the left. You know, the no labels crowd coming out of the woodwork and pay the bail of the serial rapist, Julian Assange. Who knew that they were such fans of serial rapist out there, my friends? Of course, they would help a thousand rapists if it would mean one America hater might go free.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BEHAR: OK. You know, Tara, he`s calling him a serial rapist. He hasn`t really been convicted of anything yet. Isn`t he innocent until proven guilty, just asking?
WALL: Well, yes. He is innocent until proven guilty.
BEHAR: OK. Well, then, what is he yelling about? And why does he say - specifically, he goes he -- he should say he when he says, they would help a thousand rapists, it would mean that one American hater might go free. Who`s they? Who are the theys? I`d like to hear who these people are. The way he just indicts the entire left wing of the country like that. Stephanie, doesn`t that offend you? I find it offensive.
MILLER: Yes. I thought it was just given we`re all serial rapist lovers, Joy.
BEHAR: Yes.
MILLER: You know, and secondly, as you said, there hasn`t been a trial, but you know, what the word is that his condom broke, which is what`s considered a sex crime in that country. So, it`s hardly -- I mean, it`s a different kind of WikiLeak is all I`m saying. We`re talking about here, but, you know, I find it amazing.
They want to execute this guy or maybe invade a country to get him, Joy, you know, back when they were leaking Valerie Plame`s identity. You know, leaking classified stuff wasn`t so bad, I guess. And now, it`s, you know, worthy of executing someone without a trial.
WALL: Who`s the they in this case? I mean, who`s the "they," Stephanie?
MILLER: I`m talking about the right wing.
(CROSSTALK)
MILLER: He`s not even an American citizen. They`re saying we should invade a country that he`s in. Where were you when, you know, they were leaking classified information about Valerie Plame?
WALL: I think that, you know, the collective obviously, you know, Rush Limbaugh is taking liberties at the collective day as he does most of the time with his show. You know, I think the appalling view here should be why Michael Moore, you know, wanted to make this obvious statement by bailing out what could be potentially a rapist, an alleged rapist.
So, that is a very real issue. And if you want to talk about the "they," where are they, the liberal feminists or any feminists from the right or the left that are out talking about how serious an issue this could be, should this man be found guilty of a very, very serious crime, and the alleged victims that he, in fact, could have -- may have assaulted.
MILLER: Could have, may have or he could have been set up because he`s leaking information a lot of people don`t want out there.
WALL: He was arrested. He was in jail. And I think it`s a very serious issue that shouldn`t be made light of.
BEHAR: I think that Michael is probably contributing money for the freedom of information. I think that`s where he`s at.
MILLER: Yes.
BEHAR: I mean, maybe the guy is a rapist, we`ll find out, and then, we`ll go after him.
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: One a time.
WALL: What message does that send to his -- to his alleged victim? What message does that send to his alleged victim, whatever statement --
(CROSSTALK)
WALL: About WikiLeaks or anything otherwise?
BEHAR: Well, I would like to know if the guy is guilty --
MILLER: He hasn`t been convicted yet. And his point is we might have avoided the Iraq war if WikiLeaks had been (ph) around, if lot of information that was true has been out there at the time.
WALL: I think a potential rape kind of trumps that right now.
BEHAR: OK. Got to go. I`m going to go to black. Thank you very much, ladies. You were terrific. Goodnight, everybody.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
END
