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Joy Behar Page
Commitment Phobia?; The Crafty Amy Sedaris
Aired December 22, 2010 - 21:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
JOY BEHAR, HLN HOST: You know, one of the nice things about hosting your own talk show is that sometimes celebrity guests send you thoughtful holiday gifts.
Miley, you shouldn`t have.
BEHAR: Rocker and reality star Bret Michaels, the perennial commitment-phobe, asked his on-again/off-again girlfriend of 16 years and the mother of his two kids, Kristi Gibson to marry him on the season finale of his VH1 show this week. Watch.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BRET MICHAELS, REALITY STAR: I want you to be my wife.
KRISTI GIBSON: Are you sure?
MICHAELS: I`m sure. Just say yes because rejection will kill will me right now if you reject me.
GIBSON: Of course I will.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BEHAR: Kristi waited 16 years for Bret. If Steve is 16 minutes late, I start eating without him.
So why marry now after so many years? Here to discuss commitment- phobes of all kinds are Diana Kirschner, psychologist and author of "Love in 90 days"; and M. Gary Neuman, mental health counselor and author of "The Truth about Cheating: Why men stray".
Gary, why now? He proposes after 16 years. Why do you think he did it?
M. GARY NEUMAN, AUTHOR, "THE TRUTH ABOUT CHEATING: WHY MEN CHEAT": I think he did it just because of the kids. I think men kind of catch up to this later than mothers. And when they start seeing their kids, especially going to school, and see the kids have other friends, it`s a society thing of giving them some stability, your name, making them feel as normal as they can be.
BEHAR: The kid is 10 years old. Why did he wait until she was 10? She should have felt normal when she was three, no?
NEUMAN: No, you know I think -- again, I think, one of the differences between lots of men, especially the commitment-phobe ones and women, is that women have a natural sense of what their children need even before they`re pregnant, surely upon having them. Men very often develop relationships with their children as they get older and they started to see them as real human beings who have real feelings and real needs out there. Sometimes it hits them late.
BEHAR: Or in the case of Woody Allen, he marries them.
NEUMAN: Oh dear.
BEHAR: Oh dear.
Diana, let me ask you a question. How much of this decision he made - - Bret Michaels, he`s a lovely guy by the way -- we`ve had him on the show many times. I really do like him.
How much of this decision relates to his near-death experience? You know, he had a brain aneurysm, a stroke.
DIANA KIRSCHNER, AUTHOR, "LOVE IN 90 DAYS": Yes, yes. He`s really been through the mill health-wise recently. And I think that that is a stronger variable than the children. Because when you go through you that kind of health crisis, what happens is both people in the couple get incredibly scared.
They have this experience that they could lose each other. And fear of loss is the most powerful dynamic that helps you to appreciate each other and to really pull together.
BEHAR: That`s true. I know, one time I lost my Blackberry and I was so upset.
KIRSCHNER: You loved your Blackberry.
BEHAR: I loved my Blackberry; fear of losing my blackberry. A homeless woman found it and made my life so much easier. It was wonderful to find that, yes.
Gary -- you know, it`s almost Christmas and I`m a little loopy.
Bret, a good friend of the show, I hate to dish him -- he did have an alleged affair with Miley Cyrus` mother. So, if you`re in a long-term relationship, not married, and you cheat do you feel that there`s some motivation to get married so that you`re not a bad boy anymore. To control yourself from being bad little boy to the woman you`ve been with and who is the mother of your children?
NEUMAN: Sure. There are men who, by the way, mistakenly think that by simply getting married, somehow that will tether them more to their wives and reduce the impulse to cheat. It`s obviously not medicinal in the way that they think it`s going to be.
BEHAR: It doesn`t work, is that what you`re saying?
NEUMAN: It doesn`t work. Right. Sometimes it works as far as the fiancee or the woman that you`re living with feels, "Well, now that you`ve done this, I need a real commitment, I need the marriage." But again, that`s just paper, unfortunately.
BEHAR: You agree with that, Diana?
KIRSCHNER: Well, yes. I think that that`s true. But there was something that happened. What I read about with Bret is that he said he felt so amazing after he proposed. And that tells you a lot. Guys can be dragged to the altar, they can be dragged to propose but there`s a lot of resentment and there`s a lot of problem in the relationship.
When a guy feels like he`s actually choosing to propose, he`s choosing that woman and getting over his fear, his fear of being intimate, there`s that great feeling that he has. They could move to a new level of intimacy, to a new level of commitment.
BEHAR: That`s a very good point, I think. That if he makes the decision, they have a better chance of staying together.
KIRSCHNER: Yes.
BEHAR: Because a lot of times the women push it. With the ring and I want to have kids.
(CROSSTALK)
KIRSCHNER: And then the guy walks out on the wedding day sometimes, you know.
BEHAR: Go ahead, Gary.
NEUMAN: I don`t know that -- as far as men being impulsive and cheating, I don`t know that whether the choice that they make to get married or not really weighs into it. Surely research doesn`t indicate that. So I think, of course, whenever you make a decision to go forward you don`t feel squeezed into it, it`s better.
But again, I think it`s kind of fairy tale to kind of believe that the proposal and the Hollywood moment, that somehow -- that works for about a week or a month. But long term, it becomes very iffy. Because whatever your issues are, they`re not being resolved and really dealt with on a deeper level by this kind of stuff.
BEHAR: Well, do you think -- what exactly Diana -- you`re a psychotherapist. What is commitment phobia? What is it about?
KIRSCHNER: I see three common commitment fears in men. One of the most common is the fear of being controlled, of being smothered. And this has to do with the fact that -- think about it, men were raised in their early childhood -- they were raised by women. It was a woman who was all controlling.
This woman`s happiness -- your very survival depended upon this woman`s happiness. And yet to define yourself as a man, you had to be separate. You had to be different. You had to do guy things and risk not making her happy.
So there`s an issue of -- you know, this is projected onto your romantic partner. There`s an issue about is she going to take control of my life.
BEHAR: Ok.
KIRSCHNER: Number two is the issue of being used. Now, guys like Bret, who have celebrity and money, of course, they can be very frightened that they`re going to be used. They`re not loved for themselves, they`re just going to be used.
Number three is the --
BEHAR: But what if you`re not a celebrity, you still feel like you can be used?
KIRSCHNER: You can have that fear.
BEHAR: She might ask you to paint the apartment.
KIRSCHNER: Well, no. You can have that fear --
BEHAR: I`m trying to relate to the average person here.
KIRSCHNER: For the average person -- you know you can meet a guy who tells you that he was really used and abused by his ex. A warning sign would be that he tells you, you know, I was really victimized. She took me for all I was worth, my ex, you know what I`m saying. I`m afraid of that.
BEHAR: One of Madoff`s clients. Go ahead.
KIRSCHNER: Anyway, so number three --
BEHAR: What`s number three?
KIRSCHNER: Number three is the fear of settling. A really high- powered guy, of course, has a lot of different choices, a lot of different women. They have that fear that they`re going to make the wrong choice. The grass is greener.
BEHAR: Oh, that -- who cares -- who needs that type?
KIRSCHNER: Well that type --
BEHAR: Forget about it. Right, Gary? Women should stay away from men like that.
KIRSCHNER: The picky type.
BEHAR: Who think, there`s always something better coming down the road. There`s nothing better coming down the road.
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: There`s a car that`s going to go into you in a second. That`s what`s coming down the road.
NEUMAN: That`s right. Those guys don`t change. That`s the issue. I think a lot of times, it`s so interesting, a lot of women say, how do you know?
A lot of times the guys tell you how commitment-phobic they are. You hear from them, I didn`t want it. I didn`t say I want it. They were never clear about it. There are little signs you can tell that men are not going to commit to you.
I always tell people, listen, if he doesn`t have a dog or gold fish and he gets anxiety getting a monthly magazine subscription, he`s not marrying you any time soon.
BEHAR: Or plants.
NEUMAN: I mean, they give away --
BEHAR: Do you that I`m commitment-phobic because I`m with a guy 28 years and still haven`t gotten married.
KIRSCHNER: No. This is the modern version of true love Joy.
BEHAR: But 28 years ago it was not modern.
KIRSCHNER: This is the modern version of true love. Let me tell you, more people are living together now than are married.
BEHAR: I know. But don`t you think that at some point -- go ahead, Gary.
NEUMAN: Also -- am I incorrect, you married and divorced before?
BEHAR: Yes. What, are you writing a book?
NEUMAN: You brought up your life.
BEHAR: I`m kidding you.
NEUMAN: Last week you asked me about my wife, so I thought I could go there.
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: I was married for 16 years and I have a daughter.
NEUMAN: All I`m saying is that sometimes you might come out of that - - it might be different because, you know, marriage and divorce might have had a bad taste for you. Sometimes that happens.
BEHAR: Hello. Hello, yes.
NEUMAN: Therefore, being it together, you say, it`s not so much about the marriage, it`s about the love. You want that to be pure.
BEHAR: I understand. But, you know, here`s how I feel, Diana -- should I lie down? This is how I feel.
KIRSCHNER: Yes.
BEHAR: I fell like, if it isn`t broke, don`t fix it, number one. And number two, I`m afraid that I will turn on him if there`s a paper involved.
KIRSCHNER: That`s fantastic.
NEUMAN: But why? Why would that be?
KIRSCHNER: That`s fantastic. Because what happens often when people are living together is that dynamic that one could walk out much more easily than if you were entangled with all the money and legalese.
BEHAR: I know, but that`s a fantasy.
KIRSCHNER: No. That keeps you on your toes with each other so that it can be actually sometimes much, much better. It can be much, much better. You don`t take each other for granted. Not like the old --
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: That`s true.
KIRSCHNER: It`s not like the old show -- the old shoot.
BEHAR: So -- so is the upshot of this conversation that I should not get married and neither should Oprah and Stedman and Johnny Depp and his French girlfriend and Goldie Hawn --
(CROSSTALK)
GARY NEUMAN, MENTAL HEALTH COUNSELOR: Listen, listen --
BEHAR: -- and Kurt Russell?
KIRSCHNER: Well, you said it. If it isn`t broke don`t fix it.
BEHAR: So that -- yes go ahead.
NEUMAN: Please -- please --
BEHAR: Go ahead -- go ahead Gary, you have the last word.
NEUMAN: Ok, hold -- ok hold on. Listen, right -- I`ve been married 23 years. I mean, I love marriage. I think -- I think the idea of the commitment and let`s remember that a lot of people -- not everybody is getting married in Vegas by Elvis, right? A lot of people use the clergy. They`re -- they want to add some sense of spiritual component, that we have something bigger that we`re building there in a family, not just about the two of us.
So I -- I think the beautiful thing about marriage is of course it dictates a certain commitment. It`s just not that what people might or used to think, which is just because we`re married, we`re going to stay in love. Getting married sometimes is the easy part. Staying married and in love, that`s where the real work begins.
BEHAR: I know. It`s like having another job. What, am I collecting tolls on the Jersey turnpike? I have two jobs already. I mean, it`s always work, more work. All right, thank you guys.
KIRSCHNER: Thank you.
NEUMAN: All right.
GREGORY: Speaking of commitment issues, comedian Amy Sedaris hasn`t had a date in years and lives with a rabbit, ok? She`ll explain next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BEHAR: Are you a crafts person? Are you dying to make a papier-mache puppet of your mother but can`t afford the glue?
Well, I`ve got good news, comedienne and actress Amy Sedaris has the perfect book for you "Simple Times: Crafts for Poor People." Please welcome comedienne Amy Sedaris. Welcome to the show, Amy.
AMY SEDARIS, COMEDIENNE/ACTRESS: Hi. Thanks for having me.
BEHAR: Before I get into your crafts book, which -- which is very, very dense --
(CROSSTALK)
SEDARIS: Crafty.
BEHAR: -- and crafty. You`ve got so much stuff in here. I want to - - I don`t really know too much about you. Are you a married lady?
SEDARIS: I`m single. I live with a rabbit.
BEHAR: You live with a rabbit?
SEDARIS: That I`ve had had for eight years. An imaginary boyfriend, Ricky, who I`ve been seeing for --
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: Oh I`ve heard about that.
SEDARIS: -- yes, it`s like 23 years or something. We work.
BEHAR: So are you ever going to get married?
SEDARIS: No, I have no -- no. I`m not even, I don`t even date.
BEHAR: You don`t date?
SEDARIS: No, I don`t -- no, nothing. For ten years, I haven`t been in a relationship.
BEHAR: Really? So just you and the rabbit?
SEDARIS: Just me and the rabbit.
BEHAR: All righty. What about children? You never want to have kids?
SEDARIS: I never wanted -- I never wanted kids. I`m really -- I grew up in a large family. But I just don`t have that -- you know, if I see someone with a baby, I`m like, oh wow, look at the little carrots on her shirt. I don`t even notice the baby.
BEHAR: I see. Ok, all right.
What kind of family did you grow up in? And how many people are in your family?
SEDARIS: Six kids and then my Greek grandmother and then my parents, my mom and my dad; so nine of us.
BEHAR: And -- and David Sedaris is your famous brother?
SEDARIS: My older brother, yes. Yes.
BEHAR: Well, he`s -- he`s -- is anybody else famous besides you and David?
SEDARIS: No, we`re the only two that get in front of an audience.
BEHAR: What do the rest of them do?
SEDARIS: Oh, well, my older sister -- she`s a teacher. And then I have another sister who works for the parks. She designs parks. And my little brother has a hardwood floor business. And then my other sister, my youngest sister, I don`t know what she`s doing right now. We -- we don`t know what she -- what she does.
BEHAR: Is she like a runaway or something?
SEDARIS: Oh she`s -- we just don`t communicate much with her. But you know so we don`t really know what she`s up to.
BEHAR: Something is wrong with her.
SEDARIS: But she`s really smart and really talented. She could do anything. But I don`t just don`t know what that is, that she does for money.
BEHAR: Ok. So now the book, "Simple Times: Crafts for Poor People." Why do you care about poor people doing crafts?
SEDARIS: I don`t care about poor people. No, well, the title came from just you know, just being resourceful and working with inexpensive materials.
I love like cardboard and -- and safety pins and making your own glue. I`m just not one who`s going to run out to a crafts store and buy things. I`ll figure out you know, it`s 3:00 in the morning. And like, how can I make this?
BEHAR: I see.
SEDARIS: You know so it`s thinking fast on your feet and you -- you know, you just got to find the materials to make it.
BEHAR: Well, it`s like Picasso with his found objects. He had to go through the streets and find stuff and then make a brilliant sculpture out of it.
SEDARIS: Yes.
BEHAR: It`s kind of like that?
SEDARIS: Yes. Everything is an idea, you don`t throw anything out. Because you think you can use it for something and sure enough, you know. We were raised that way. My dad --
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: So you`re kind of a hoarder?
SEDARIS: Well, kind of a hoarder, yes. I`ve gotten better though, you know, it`s hard for me -- it`s hard for me to throw out a good box. If I get a good box --
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: Yes, what do you do with it?
SEDARIS: I save it. And then I`m afraid to give it away, because then, you know it`s such a great box. You have to give it to the person who`s really going to appreciate it. And there aren`t that many people on my list who would appreciate a really great box.
BEHAR: I know that`s the problem, that`s probably why you don`t want to get married.
SEDARIS: Yes.
BEHAR: You can`t find a guy like that. What are you going to do?
SEDARIS: Right.
BEHAR: Yes. Now, you say that ugly people craft and attractive people have sex. Is there a connection here that I`m not seeing?
SEDARIS: No. It`s true.
BEHAR: Ugly people craft --
SEDARIS: Yes, ugly people are crafting and good-looking people are out. They do other things. You know, they -- they`re making love, you know.
BEHAR: I see, so you don`t consider yourself an attractive person then?
SEDARIS: I never craft, Joy. You`re a big crafter? No, I know, I just -- you know, it`s just true. You know how people who like to be by themselves you know and they are real homey. They like to stay home and be by themselves and craft.
BEHAR: I see.
SEDARIS: And usually, they`re unattractive.
BEHAR: I know a lot of crafty people who are very attractive.
SEDARIS: Really.
BEHAR: Martha Stewart, for example.
SEDARIS: He`s not bad looking but you know.
He has a lot of people who make the crafts for him, though, I have to say.
BEHAR: Who, Martha?
SEDARIS: Yes.
BEHAR: Yes. You say he. Is there anything I should know?
SEDARIS: Oh yes, well, he`s got a deep voice.
BEHAR: Yes.
Ok, so now, you have some holiday gift ideas in your book. You have - - the first one is gingham bottoms. Who were these for? There`s a picture of them --
SEDARIS: That`s if you`re dating somebody 18 years younger than you are. If you`re a guy and your girlfriend is 18 years younger I think gingham panties are an excellent gift.
BEHAR: Ok.
SEDARIS: To give somebody.
BEHAR: And what about the Jesus wooden spoons? Are these for everyone or just Christians?
SEDARIS: Well, that`s just -- I have a chapter called crafting for Jesus. I love like craft about Jesus and this girl painted those wooden spoons. I love those spoons.
BEHAR: Those are quite nice. You didn`t do those yourself?
SEDARIS: I guess perfect for fudge. No, no, I didn`t.
BEHAR: Can you give those to Jewish people? Or are they offended?
(CROSSTALK)
SEDARIS: Absolutely.
BEHAR: They`re not offended by it?
SEDARIS: I don`t think so. I mean, they could think it`s you know, Melissa Etheridge or something. I don`t know.
BEHAR: Tin can characters.
SEDARIS: That`s a lot of fun.
BEHAR: What are those?
SEDARIS: You just dress a can up. You know, you can add things. I love tin cans anyway, I like them playing or like when you wrap tin foil around them, I love tin foil. It`s -- I wish I had more tin foil crafts in the book, I have to say.
BEHAR: Well, maybe the next book can be just that.
SEDARIS: Maybe. Space helmets.
BEHAR: Yes, oh.
SEDARIS: Yes.
BEHAR: Now you`re talking.
SEDARIS: Now I`m talking.
BEHAR: Now this last one is confectionery, Mexican sugar skulls.
SEDARIS: Oh yes.
BEHAR: Now, what is this about?
SEDARIS: That`s like Day of the Dead. And actually this girl Lauren Smith made those for me. She lives in San Francisco and they are really pretty aren`t they?
I think you have to get the mold someplace, like maybe online. Like one of those Day of the Dead sites.
BEHAR: That costs money.
SEDARIS: Yes, it does. You need steal them. You need to --
BEHAR: So some of your crafts are for rich people.
SEDARIS: Yes, rich ideas.
BEHAR: Now, what are you doing for the holidays with your family, by the way?
SEDARIS: This year I`m going to be by myself. I`m really excited about it because I just finished a big book tour. And I just can`t wait to be by my -- well, my rabbit. I`m putting up a little tree tonight.
BEHAR: Your rabbit has a kind of a long life span?
SEDARIS: I know, eight years, can you believe it?
BEHAR: Most rabbits are dead like in a year.
SEDARIS: Yes.
BEHAR: Is he on life support or something?
SEDARIS: You know, I think it`s all the love I have for her. I think that`s why she`s lasted for so long.
BEHAR: Sure, a rabbit is her but Martha Stewart is him. We`ll have more with Amy Sedaris in just a moment.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BEHAR: I`m back with the charming Amy Sedaris. And we`re going to do some crafts here. What is it that you`re doing right now?
SEDARIS: I`m applying fake -- I hate crafts right now. I`m sick of them.
BEHAR: I thought you loved them.
SEDARIS: Not anymore. And I shot that in my apartment.
BEHAR: You did a whole book about it. During the commercial, you hated them.
SEDARIS: I hate crafts now. Because I just did a whole book on it and it overtook my whole apartment. So now, to make it entertaining for myself, I wear fake fingernails and then I craft. Because you can`t do anything with long fingernails, you know.
BEHAR: I see. Except Barbra Streisand. It`s like a condom. It prevents you from endangering yourself with crafts.
SEDARIS: Exactly. Just like a condom.
BEHAR: I see.
SEDARIS: They still make condoms? I`ll leave my pinky off because it`s taking so long. Aren`t they nice?
BEHAR: Yes. Beautiful. Really nice.
SEDARIS: I`m going to teach you how to make a twist tie, ok? Because twist ties cost a lot of money. You take a piece of tape. Usually, when I do a movie or TV show, I steal tape from the grips. Ok. Hold on. How long is this show?
Then you take a piece of wire. When I did Martha Stewart`s show, he gave me two pairs of scissors, one for fabric and one for paper. I had no idea they made so many different scissors. So if he found out I was cutting wire, he would kill me.
BEHAR: Aren`t you scared of Martha Stewart?
SEDARIS: Yes.
BEHAR: She could be very mean.
SEDARIS: I`ll say. I`m really scared. Then to shake it up, I put a different color, two-tone. And then you take it and tape it right on top of the wire.
BEHAR: It seems like a lot of work just to preserve a bag of cheese doodles.
SEDARIS: You can pull your hair back. Just wait and see. You`re going to take it back.
So there, look, took already my nails off. This is why it`s hilarious. Man, this is funny. Ok. Then you cut off the ends with the Martha Stewart scissors. And then you`ve got your own twist tie.
Let me tell you why this doesn`t work. It doesn`t work because I`m using more of an artist tape and it tears. You just need to find a sturdier tape. First one`s free.
BEHAR: So what do I do, just twist this?
SEDARIS: What do you do?
BEHAR: I don`t know what to do with it.
SEDARIS: You can use it as a bookmark. You can pull your hair back. You can take that bag of Cheetohs.
BEHAR: I don`t think so. You can`t pull your hair back with this.
SEDARIS: Well, if I made it longer.
BEHAR: Can I just say this is a flop?
SEDARIS: Well, because I was rushed. And I had on fake fingernails.
BEHAR: You`re supposed to twist it and twist it.
SEDARIS: It`s a twist tie.
BEHAR: Oh, you twist it and then you can -- I see. You twist like a little braid. I got it.
SEDARIS: If you wanted, there`s lots -- I think a bookmark. And another one I love is this. If you`re reading the Bible --
BEHAR: I need another one on this side.
SEDARIS: Give me 20 minutes and I`ll whip one up. These are great if you`re reading the bible or an instructional book and you want to weigh the page down. You just put pennies in between two pieces of packing tape. It`s really hard to make. Once you lay the tape down, it disappears, you can`t see it. And then you`re supposed to put pennies on it and something you can`t see and then you have to line it up evenly, which is impossible.
So that`s really hard, especially when you have nails on.
BEHAR: Why do you want to torture poor people?
SEDARIS: Poor people get punished all the time for not having any money, you know.
BEHAR: That`s right.
SEDARIS: If that book doesn`t sell, have a big orange sticker or magic marker price on it. You buy a toy in the store and they take that one pretty medallion off of it because they`re poor.
BEHAR: Yes.
SEDARIS: You know, they`re always --
BEHAR: So maybe you should give some of this away.
SEDARIS: No way, man. Some people steal.
BEHAR: All right. Apologies to Mr. Martha Stewart. The book, "In Simple Times: Crafts for Poor People". We`ll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ANNOUNCER: 2010.
A year that will be remembered for all those men who behaved badly. Some, very badly. Like Mel Gibson, whose rants captured by Radar Online captivated a nation.
MEL GIBSON, ACTOR: I deserve to be (EXPLETIVE DELETED) first before the (EXPLETIVE DELETED) Jacuzzi.
And Jesse James who turned his back on America`s sweetheart for a young maiden named, Michelle "Bombshell" McFee.
And let`s not forget Charlie Sheen, whose naked drunken hotel rampage left a "Two and a Half men" start talking to extra and begging for our forgiveness.
CHARLIE SHEEN, ACTOR: It was one bad night and everybody goes insane and panics. And, you know, I`m not panicking. So, what people should be excited about is tonight`s episode of "Two and a Half Men."
(END VIDEO CLIP)
JOY BEHAR, HOST: In 2010, Mel Gibson showed he could not only do drama and comedy, but he could do anti-Semitism, homophobia and (INAUDIBLE) too. What a rage. He`s a regular Laurence Olivier. Radar Online has the rant that started it all. It really is his finest work. Listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I don`t walk around. I don`t walk -- I don`t walk around in tight cloths. I stay at home most of the time.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You go out public and it`s a (EXPLETIVE DELETED) embarrassment to me. You look a (EXPLETIVE DELETED) on heat. And if you get raped (EXPLETIVE DELETED), your fault. All right? Because you provoked it. You are provocatively dressed all the time with your fake boobs you feel you have to show off.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BEHAR: Can I just say, what`s the point of having fake boobs if you don`t show them off?
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: I mean, really. With me now to talk about the rants heard around the world and other crazy pop culture stories from 2010 are Rob Shuter, AOL`s PopEater columnist, comedian, Judy Gold, and Clinton Kelly, co-host of "What Not To Wear" on TLC, and the author of "Oh, No, She Didn`t."
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: Really, how to do that? (ph) Oh, no, she didn`t. Now, rob, there`s been speculation that Mel has a mental illness. What do you say?
(LAUGHTER)
ROB SHUTER, COLUMNIST, AOL`S POPEATER: Hello.
BEHAR: He`s been diagnosed -- in 2008, there was a documentary where he said that he has been diagnosed with bipolar disorder.
SHUTER: There`s something to this. He`s terrified that he might actually have to take some sort of psychological test with all this lawsuit that`s going on at the moment with the baby, but clearly, these tapes are not good.
BEHAR: Can that be excuse, though, mental illness? Give me a break.
JUDY GOLD, COMEDIAN: You know, first of all, I heard that he`s starting a new reality show called "Goose-Stepping with the Stars."
(LAUGHTER)
GOLD: But I mean, really, who goes into show business when they hate Jews? I mean, pick another career.
BEHAR: It`s a very bad idea.
GOLD: Right.
BEHAR: To do that.
GOLD: Yes.
BEHAR: I agree with that. You know, Clinton, things went from bad to worse when Oksana Grigorieva accused Mel of hitting her. Listen to her.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What kind of man is that, hitting a woman when she`s holding a child in her hands? Breaking her teeth, twice in the face. What kind of man is that?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BEHAR: That`s a good question. What kind of man is that?
(LAUGHTER)
GOLD: A man who hates women. He is just the worst human being ever. I just -- and I thought he was cute when I was younger.
BEHAR: We all did. "Brave Heart" and all that.
(CROSSTALK)
GOLD: And he`s a Nazi.
BEHAR: Yes.
GOLD: I mean --
BEHAR: What kind of Nazi is that?
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: So, Clinton, people were accusing Oksana of being a gold digger. Do you think she`s a gold digger?
CLINTON KELLY, CO-HOST, "WHAT NOT TO WEAR": Please, she`s got gold digger written all over her. These guys crank (ph) me up. I don`t know she was a gold digger. She got the fake books and she wears skin tight cloths. My favorite part of the rant is when he`s like you wear these tight clothes and you sashay around. You can`t use the word sashay while ranting.
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: What kind of man sashays?
(LAUGHTER)
GOLD: You know, that`s probably why he was attracted to her in the first place. And then, he gets mad at her for doing that, you know.
BEHAR: And the fake boobs and the whole thing.
GOLD: Right.
BEHAR: And anyway, even if she is a gold digger, no excuse, right?
SHUTER: No excuse. No excuse. And I think that they`re trying, the Mel`s team, are really throwing this at her that she`s after his money, but it doesn`t matter even if that turns out to be the case. I think there`s no excuse for this.
BEHAR: No. And also, he said he`s religious. He has his own church.
GOLD: Oh, yes.
BEHAR: What religion talks like that?
GOLD: Well, he`s actually doing a movie where -- about Jesus` life, but he comes back as a non-Jew.
(LAUGHTER)
GOLD: Because Jesus --
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: Turning, turning. OK. Now, do you think his career will be resuscitated at all, ever?
KELLY: You know what, this is America.
GOLD: Yes.
KELLY: And it wouldn`t surprise me if he, you know, did have a comeback. Not right away. It`s going to take a little while, but he`ll have a big movie in a few years.
BEHAR: He`s got the beaver. Not only is he an anti-Semite, but he uses the beaver as a puppet. Now, he`s ventriloquist, too.
(LAUGHTER)
SHUTER: Beaver thing?
BEHAR: Yes, it`s a movie with Jody Foster.
(CROSSTALK)
GOLD: She loves him, and she loves beaver.
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: Can we (ph) take that out?
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: OK. Here`s another bugging we talked about over the years -- the year, actually. In October, Charlie Sheen was found naked and drunk in his trashed hotel suite at the Plaza with actress, Capri Anderson or as I like to call but dame (ph) Capri Anderson.
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: Hiding in the locked bathroom, OK? All right. So --
(LAUGHTER)
SHUTER: The best part of this -- can I just say -- he was seen at Mary Poppins the night before. Like, he went to -- came to New York to see Mary Poppins with his kids.
BEHAR: No wonder. It all fits together now.
KELLY: They`re having a family day. Let`s pick up an eight ball, you know, some Jack Daniels and a prostitute. Nice family vacation.
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: Have you ever been on a date like that, Judy?
GOLD: I haven`t really. I have not been on a date like that. I do want to repeat my joke that I did say about Charlie that he really did put the ho in hotel, OK?
(LAUGHTER)
GOLD: And he put the ho in the room next to his wife. I mean, what is wrong with him? He said, I don`t have -- whatever.
BEHAR: Let`s take his side for a second. He blamed his bizarre behavior on an allergic reaction to some medication. I thought cocaine was hypoallergenic.
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: No, really, do you buy that?
SHUTER: Not at all. I think everybody knows that Charlie has serious issues. And this was just an instant when we found out about it. Sources have been telling us at Pop Eater for a long time that he`s had troubled behavior for many, many years. However, when he`s in L.A., he can do it in the privacy of his own home and nobody ever gets to find out about it.
When you have this sort of trouble in a hotel and police get called, that`s when we hear about it. So, this behavior is not new.
BEHAR: No.
SHUTER: It`s just that we`re hearing about it.
GOLD: Well, he needs to get a place here. And then, he can just do it here.
(CROSSTALK)
GOLD: And he`s the highest-paid TV actor.
BEHAR: I know.
GOLD: It`s unbelievable.
BEHAR: Oh, they`re just all --
SHUTER: And the ratings went up.
BEHAR: I know. The ratings were up.
GOLD: The ratings went up.
BEHAR: When the ratings go up, he can do whatever he wants.
SHUTER: Yes.
BEHAR: Oh, yes.
GOLD: Yes.
BEHAR: Finally, shortly after winning an Oscar, America`s sweetheart, Sandra Bullock found out her husband, Jesse James, was cheating on her with a tattooed stripper named Bombshell McGee or as I like to call her Dame Bombshell.
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: OK. Rob, isn`t it great that men cheat on beautiful women?
GOLD: Right.
BEHAR: It`s so great.
SHUTER: No, it`s not good.
BEHAR: I know. It`s not great.
SHUTER: It`s terrible.
BEHAR: I`m just saying.
SHUTER: It`s terrible.
BEHAR: It`s like all the women who are not beauties think, oh, if I was just as beautiful as Sandra bullock, then he wouldn`t -- and then he does.
SHUTER: Right.
BEHAR: Elin -- what`s her name? Elin Nordegren.
GOLD: Right.
SHUTER: Tiger Wood`s wife.
BEHAR: Tiger Woods, another one.
SHUTER: You know I think that this is just such a sad story. And I think what made the story so big was it was a total surprise. Nobody knew this. There hadn`t been rumors about them. When she got her Oscar, she looked him in the face from the podium and thanked him.
BEHAR: Oh, I know.
SHUTER: I think we really wanted this couple to be the real deal. And it turns out that they weren`t
BEHAR: You know, but they shouldn`t be thanking their spouses.
SHUTER: No. But when you win in public --
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: Thank you, piano teacher.
(LAUGHTER)
KELLY: I mean, look, this guy`s ex-wife is a tattooed, drug addicted former porn star. I mean --
BEHAR: Those are good points.
(CROSSTALK)
KELLY: If that`s your husband`s ex-wife, I will just run away from that. That`s saying (ph) that this guy doesn`t have the best taste in the world.
GOLD: I thought it was so refreshing that she left him, and there was no press conference where she was standing next to him going -- standby. It`s just, you know, -- that`s what I really respect her for.
(CROSSTALK)
SHUTER: Sandra still hasn`t done it. She`s getting offers from everybody to sit down and do that big Barbara Walters-type interview and she said no.
BEHAR: She doesn`t want it to.
KELLY: She`s classy.
GOLD: And the best part is she adopted that baby, and the baby looks nothing like Jesse James.
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: The baby is African-American. But will bombshell be the step- frau? That`s what we want to know.
GOLD: Yes.
When we come back, the year in reality TV. Did you know that Snooki has a book out she wrote out (ph). And Pauly D. is getting his own TV show. I think it`s called "Law & Order STD."
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: We`ll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ANNOUNCER: The year 2010 found many of our most popular reality shows struggling to cope with reality, like "Dancing with the Stars" which this season redefined the word dancing as well as stars. And "Jersey Shore" which through (ph) record audiences by celebrating the lifestyle of gym, tanning and laundry, and assault.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (INAUDIBLE)
ANNOUNCER: And let`s not forget Oprah who made headlines by announcing that she was leaving her slow and that she was not lesbian.
OPRAH WINFREY, HOST: I`m not lesbian. I`m not even kind of lesbian.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BEHAR: I`m back with my panel talking about the top pop culture stories of 2010. One young lady who could not stay out of the news was Miley Cyrus who took every opportunity to remind us she`s not a kid anymore like this TMZ video of her smoking salvia from a bong. Take a look.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You`re going to (EXPLETIVE DELETED) a brick when you see this. Oh, yes.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Oh, no.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Oh, yes. Girl, get it.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I want more of that (EXPLETIVE DELETED). I swear.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BEHAR: But, you know, it`s really hard to blame her. The poor girl started so young. Watch.
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: He`s down to four packs a day so -- OK. So, now, Rob, let`s talk about teen experimentation. Is she, first of all, PR wise, is she making a mistake or is this a move as good move for her?
SHUTER: Oh, no. I think it`s a mistake that she got caught doing this, but I think its mistake too that -- she should look at her friends. This was at someone`s house. It wasn`t in public, but a friend sold this video at the TMZ.
BEHAR: But she looks like she knows all about it.
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: She looks right at the camera.
SHUTER: She knows that she`s being filmed but still doesn`t think (ph) about selling it or anything sort of -- what was smart was her reaction to it, which really was like, so what? Who cares?
BEHAR: Is that what she did?
GOLD: No kidding.
BEHAR: OK.
GOLD: I find it odd that a child star would do drugs.
BEHAR: That is shocking.
GOLD: That`s very unusual.
(LAUGHTER)
GOLD: But was it her or was it Hannah Montana that was doing the drugs?
BEHAR: You know, but she is a Disney star.
GOLD: Right.
BEHAR: Clinton, you know, she`s a role model to these little girls. Isn`t it wrong of her to shock them this way?
KELLY: No, are you kidding? I think she`s a great role model. She shows them how to use a bong and keep her lipstick intact.
(LAUGHTER)
KELLY: I think it`s fabulous. She`s (ph) done that before.
BEHAR: It`s just fabulous. By the way, this is the gayest panel, so I have to add --
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: Not you, of course, Rob.
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: You`re fooling no one with that pink sweater. Listen, "don`t ask, don`t tell" just passed. Aren`t we excited about that?
GOLD: I just filled out my application.
BEHAR: Oh, you joined --
GOLD: Yes. Marine.
KELLY: I cannot wait to kill someone.
(LAUGHTER)
KELLY: Now, I have a right to do it.
BEHAR: OK. Let`s see. Let`s move on. 2010 will be remembered as the year of the offensive reality show. From the stereotypes of "Jersey Shore" to Bristol Palin making it to the finals on "Dancing with the Stars," it all made me want to shoot my TV. Now, the "Jersey Shore" cast mates who are among Barbara Walters` most fascinating. Why do you think -- she thinks or anybody thinks that they`re fascinating?
SHUTER: Because their right into huge (ph). Like, you know, it`s the biggest show that MTV has ever had, not just this year, the history of MTV. Nobody has watched any more shows than this show. There`s something about it. It`s almost like train wreck TV. You can`t turn away.
BEHAR: Yes.
SHUTER: And I think the combination of all these fools together in one house makes it addictive.
BEHAR: But do you think that this show is train wreck TV? This one.
(LAUGHTER)
KELLY: I haven`t seen you puking once. Maybe not.
BEHAR: That`s for sweeps, OK?
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: I`m saving that. Now, what about her mother on "Dancing with the Stars" Sarah Palin --
GOLD: Oh, God.
BEHAR: And that whole thing about "Sarah Palin`s Alaska." That`s a reality show.
GOLD: They`re actually changing the name of that show to "Reading is Fundamentalist."
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: You know what I told you before about the red carpet when they ask you what you`re wearing and I said, chicos. They asked her what are you wearing, and she said, Bambi.
(LAUGHTER)
GOLD: Oh, God.
BEHAR: Whatever.
SHUTER: But the show is such a hit. They`re talking about doing season two. Sarah signed up for eight episodes. So, they`re renegotiating doing another season. And the reason it hasn`t been signed yet is Sarah wants double the money. So, she`s not -- because she`s a hit. So, they got her, I think --
BEHAR: I heard the ratings went down.
SHUTER: They went down from a huge number. So, it`s like still in the top ten shows on TLC. Is TLC your channel too?
KELLY: It is my channel.
BEHAR: What do you think?
KELLY: What do I think?
BEHAR: Yes.
KELLY: You know what, look, I`ll be honest with you. I wasn`t thrilled when I heard that Sarah Palin had an eight-hour info commercial, you know, on my network.
GOLD: Right.
KELLY: Because she basically stands for everything I don`t stand for or I`m against. So, it`s a little bit rough. What bothers me the most about her is her hypocrisy, and you know, I`m trying to be funny, but I can`t think of a joke.
BEHAR: That`s OK. You don`t have to --
KELLY: Look at nature. Look at this beautiful Alaska.
BEHAR: Yes.
KELLY: Look at how beautiful everything is. Let`s go kill something because we need some meat in the refrigerator.
BEHAR: I know. As if anybody in New York City can relate to this.
GOLD: And also, why do you pick a fight with Michelle Obama about obese children? I mean, shut up.
BEHAR: To put herself on the cover of magazines.
GOLD: Right, exactly.
BEHAR: That`s it.
SHUTER: But she`s been on more covers this year than any other celebrity. (INAUDIBLE) Angelina Jolie. Sarah Palin has had most covers of the entire year.
BEHAR: She`s doing something right.
KELLY: Well, she should be a celebrity --
GOLD: Right. And not a politician.
KELLY: Not a politician.
GOLD: She does not know --
BEHAR: Can I just say something? If she takes herself out of the political game, no one will be interested in her as a reality star. It`s only interesting because she thinks she`s in politics.
KELLY: Right. She thinks --
SHUTER: You`re right. Anne Coulter told me that she`s not going to run. That she thinks Sarah is sort of pretending that she`s going to run to keep us all interested in her.
GOLD: Wait a minute. You talked to Ann Coulter?
BEHAR: Ann Coulter is on my show.
GOLD: I know, but you know.
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: OK. Finally, after 25 years on the air --
GOLD: She`s not my favorite.
BEHAR: After 25 years on the air, Oprah Winfrey launched the final season of her show in September, and she had a special surprise for her audience as usual. They reacted with quiet dignity. Take a look.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
WINFREY: We`re going to Australia!
(CLAPPING AND CHEERING)
WINFREY: You, you, and you, and you are going to Australia!
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BEHAR: John Travolta was in that plane with Carrie Fisher.
(LAUGHTER)
GOLD: Yes, she`s a flight attendant.
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: Now, she`s leaving television, Oprah. I mean, she`s going to her own channel, knowing own (ph) --
GOLD: Right.
BEHAR: But, you know, is that the same thing as having this big thing on channel 7?
GOLD: Well, I heard, you know what she`s giving away to the entire audience for every remaining show?
BEHAR: What?
GOLD: Cable.
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: That would be smart.
GOLD: I know.
BEHAR: But I mean, I don`t know what she`s going to do after this. One thing I know she`s not going to do, lesbianism. Remember that?
GOLD: I love that she said -- I mean, it`s fine to deny. just -- to say, I`m not even kind of lesbian. First of all, it`s not an adjective, OK?
BEHAR: I know.
GOLD: I`m not even kind of lesbian. I don`t know where that came from at all.
BEHAR: But why are people obsessed with her sexuality? Why?
GOLD: I don`t know.
KELLY: She`s got a very deep voice.
GOLD: She has?
BEHAR: I think that I`m much more butch than she is.
GOLD: She`s not married, and she has this best friend who she`s obsessed with.
SHUTER: Everyone is interested in celebrities` love lives and the fact that she`s been with her boyfriend for so long and she`s not married. We know so much about Oprah with this that one little thing that we don`t know which is about --
GOLD: But I think she would have said -- I mea, she seems like someone that would have said it.
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: Rush Limbaugh said after "don`t ask, don`t tell" was passed. He said, oh, now, Mrs. Clinton can go into the army. Do you know he said that?
SHUTER: That was mean.
BEHAR: That is mean.
BEHAR: But as I said before, I don`t know why we`re obsessed with Oprah. That doesn`t make sense. She`s very fem.
GOLD: She is fem. She seems -- she seems straight.
SHUTER: There`s something about it that --
BEHAR: You`re a lesbian?
GOLD: Oh, my God. My God. My son is here.
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: When we come back, the most annoying person of the year. Guess who it`s going to be? You don`t know.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BEHAR: OK. So, 2010 was chockfull of people who got on my nerves. So, I figured what better way to round out the new year than crowning 2010`s most annoying person. Here are the nominees. First, we have John Edwards` mistress, Rielle Hunter. I don`t mind that posed with puppets, but that she`s in her Frederick`s of Hollywood underwear is over the top. Isn`t there a law against muppedophilia (ph).
Second, a half governor, Sarah Palin, the Alaska hockey mom turned almost VP turned reality star. It`s that hopy-changy thing I can`t stand. I`ll like to give her a smacky-wacky.
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: And number three, on my hit parade is Mel Gibson. Here`s a refresher. If you haven`t seen them off.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
(EXPLETIVE DELETED) I`ll let you sleep. I should have woke you up and said, (EXPLETIVE DELETED).
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BEHAR: I love him.
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: All right. So, let`s battle it out, OK? What do each of the nominees have going for them? Rielle Hunter is the most annoying.
SHUTER: She`s the most annoying because she has no dignity. She should have kept her mouth shut, don`t know interviews, and stayed out of the press. What she did was bad enough.
BEHAR: OK, what do you think?
GOLD: Rielle Hunter is real annoying. Now, here`s the reason. She poses without any pants on with a bunch of stuffed animals and then is shocked that there`s a picture of her without any pants on with a bunch of stuffed animals.
BEHAR: Exactly. OK. And you?
KELLY: Annoying because she believes she has a soul connection with the liar, John Edwards. That drives me crazy.
BEHAR: They`re very in love and everything. OK. Sarah Palin?
SHUTER: Sarah Palin is the most annoying because she`s fake. She doesn`t know if she wants to be a politician or a TV star and that`s annoying.
BEHAR: OK.
GOLD: Sarah Palin, I mean, there are so many reasons that she`s annoying. I mean, she`s really annoying. I mean, you have to be really annoying if Karl Rove hates you, OK?
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: That is the nadir.
GOLD: And she is starring in "Wicked" now as herself.
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: That`s Christine O`Donnell.
(CROSSTALK)
GOLD: I like that.
KELLY: Annoying because, you know, she uses that don`t retreat, reload thing like it`s our new favorite catch phrase. That drives me crazy. That incessant tweeting. I`m sick of these politicians tweeting all the time.
BEHAR: OK. And Mel Gibson?
SHUTER: Mel Gibson is annoying because we thought we knew this man. And I hate it when you love somebody and they turn out to be the opposite of who you think they are.
BEHAR: OK.
GOLD: Well, I don`t want to pass over, Mel. Get it, Passover?
(LAUGHTER)
GOLD: But I find him more evil than annoying. You know, I find him just a really bad person.
BEHAR: Yes?
GOLD: Yes. I mean, he`s annoying, but, you know, Sarah Palin is really --
BEHAR: I find that a man who provokes a woman to say "what kind of man is that" constantly is --
(LAUGHTER)
KELLY: I just annoyed that I sat there about seven minutes of his rants. I mean, that annoyed me, that I wasted seven minutes of my life listening to it.
BEHAR: OK. So, let`s vote. Is it Rielle Hunter, because I only had time to be free(ph). Is it Rielle Hunter, Sarah Palin, or Mel Gibson?
SHUTER: Sarah Palin.
GOLD: Sarah Palin, baby.
KELLY: Sarah freaking Palin, baby. Most annoying. Maybe the most annoying of all time.
(LAUGHTER)
GOLD: Yes. Maybe, yes, -- the most --
BEHAR: You have me so (INAUDIBLE) because I was going to vote for someone besides Sarah Palin.
GOLD: Who are you going to vote for?
BEHAR: I thought Mel Gibson was the most --
(CROSSTALK)
GOLD: You`re allowed to have your opinion.
BEHAR: But I feel insecure about it now.
(LAUGHTER)
GOLD: Why, because the gays picked Sarah Palin?
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: We know who`s annoying.
GOLD: We know who`s annoying.
BEHAR: But I voted for Mel Gibson. But anyway, make sure to catch Judy Gold, "Unhatched by Two Chicks" on Sirius XM radio, Saturdays. For 1:00 to 3:00 p.m. Goodnight, everybody. Wasn`t this fun?
GOLD: It was fun.
(LAUGHTER)
END
