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Joy Behar Page
Interview With Phil Collins; Interview With Rick Springfield
Aired December 27, 2010 - 21:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
JOY BEHAR, HLN HOST: He`s one of the most successful singer/songwriters of all time with over 250 million albums sold, an Oscar and eight Grammy awards. His new album is called "Going Back" and it`s out now.
Please welcome to my show, the great, Phil Collins. Come on.
PHIL COLLINS, SINGER/SONGWRITER: Thank you very much. Glad to be here, Joy.
BEHAR: It`s so nice to see you, Phil. I`m a huge fan. You know my daughter loves you. Everyone in my family, we love your music.
COLLINS: Well it`s very nice of you to say so.
BEHAR: I love your "Tarzan" album.
COLLINS: Yes.
BEHAR: That was a great one.
COLLINS: Yes well the film was great to make. But I`ve reached, I think, the musical on Broadway, I really had such a great time on that movie, wrote a lot of new songs. And I was proud to have my name on Broadway.
BEHAR: But the music is beautiful. It`s so touching, a lot of it, you know.
COLLINS: Well when you`ve got kids, that`s what happens.
BEHAR: Is that what happens, you get more touched?
Touched. You know, you, Paul McCartney and Michael Jackson are the only musicians who have sold over 100 million albums, both as solo artists and separately as members of a band. What`s it like being a musical god?
COLLINS: My garage is stocked full of records. I can tell you that. It doesn`t seem to work, does it? It doesn`t seem to fit.
I mean I`ve heard this kind of figure and you know, there`s McCartney, he`s a Beatle; there`s Michael Jackson, and then there`s me. And it just doesn`t work.
BEHAR: You`re much too modest. And I see you`re a self-effacing type of guy --
COLLINS: Well you know.
BEHAR: And it`s wrong of you.
COLLINS: It feels great, Joy. I feel so superior. No, I don`t think of it. I don`t think of it.
BEHAR: I know you don`t. You don`t think of yourself that way. You`re shy about yourself.
COLLINS: I am.
BEHAR: And you shouldn`t be because you`re fabulous. What`s this I hear about you being adored by rappers and punks? They think you are cool now so what`s --
COLLINS: Yes well I don`t know. The hip-hop kind of world and rap guys have for quite awhile. You know when I did "Sussudio," I think that was the first cross over record to hit the R&B stations as well. And then "Easy Lover" for Bailey --
BEHAR: Love.
COLLINS: It`s a great record. And I think they became aware of what I was doing around that time and yes, they kind of come out in my defense sometimes. I mean you know because some of the other critics, the white critics -- put it that way -- don`t go for it that much. But the hip-hop guys have been very loyal to me.
BEHAR: What exactly does "Sussudio" mean? And where do you come up with it?
COLLINS: It doesn`t mean anything. I just -- well. It popped out of my mouth when I was writing the pop song. I mean it`s a bit difficult to record a song even. It`s kind of a good idea with a nice horn riff. But I tried to find a word that scanned as well a "Sussudio." I improvise words, you know. And I couldn`t find one that worked as well as so I stuck with "Sussudio" and then invented a name. You know a name of a girl or -- my daughter had a horse called "Sussudio."
BEHAR: Oh after the song --
COLLINS: After the event.
BEHAR: After the song. It`s kind of like scatting in a way.
COLLINS: Yes.
BEHAR: Just make it up as you go along.
COLLINS: Yes, I see it on a number of plates you know. It goes like this. Somewhere there are probably poor children called "Sussudio."
BEHAR: Called "Sussudio," I know. I know, OK, it sounds like an Italian name Sussudio mange (INAUDIBLE).
COLLINS: Yes.
BEHAR: Or something like that. That really has a ring to it. I don`t think of you as Motown and R&B.
COLLINS: No, no. I think it`s all those years with Genesis that you know, kind of put the two pictures together and don`t seem it -- doesn`t seem to make sense. But for me, apart from the Beatles when I was a teenager, 13 onwards, I was listening to Motown and Atlantic, you know like Sam and Dave and Otis Redding and people like that.
For me, Motown had a magic. They`re great songs, great musicians in band and great sound. And people like the Four Tops and Martha and the Vandellas are like -- they`re heroes.
BEHAR: They were great. They were great.
COLLINS: So it`s always been in my blood. I`ve been thinking about it, you know, because I`ve talking about the record. And I joined Genesis when I was 19. And at that point, we didn`t do anybody else`s material, we just did Genesis material. So I kind of never got a chance to work through the pub, kind of circuit playing your own songs and playing a few hits.
BEHAR: I see. The other thing about you that`s interesting to me in particular is that you said something interesting. You said that if you hadn`t broken up with your first wife, you might have been a nobody.
I sort of -- not that that I would have been a nobody -- I sort of understand it. It`s like it catapulted me out of the cocoon and into the career. Did you -- tell me about that.
COLLINS: In my instance, it pushed me -- not push me -- I ended up writing songs. Whereas before that event, I would have -- it was more and more music, more drumming than singing than writing. And I had a lot of things obviously I needed to get out of my system. I did that on "Face Value", which was the first album.
And so my life changed at that point. And it`s not that I regret it or it would have been great if it never happened. But then we wouldn`t be here sitting here talking. I wouldn`t have five kids. You know, none of that would have happened. And so you have to look differently at life once that happens.
BEHAR: You have five children with three wives, right?
COLLINS: Yes.
BEHAR: That`s OK. You`re only in the middle of your career. God knows what`s going to come up the pike next week.
COLLINS: Yes.
BEHAR: But the thing about you that I read, I just can`t believe it - - is that you pay over 40 million pounds in alimony. Who is your lawyer, Sarah Palin? I mean who`s your lawyer?
COLLINS: Well, you know, if that is the eye of the law, then the law is a hash, as Charles Dickens wrote. That`s the law. You know, that`s the way it is. And I don`t think of it like that. If they -- you know, they can only -- they leave you with half.
BEHAR: And you`re friends with all of them?
COLLINS: Yes.
BEHAR: Do you like have parties together? Not tea parties but like - -
COLLINS: Sleepovers.
BEHAR: I mean dinner parties.
COLLINS: No, no, it`s not quite like that. I just think it`s great. And I`ve got five kids from 38 to 5, you know. And it`s great for the kids to see mom and dad get on.
BEHAR: Yes.
COLLINS: And that`s finally happened. I think that`s the most important thing. And I -- we are great friends. You know, not necessarily each with each other. But certainly me and my ex-partners are great. And Dana is a jewel. You know --
BEHAR: The three wives also are friendly with each other or Dana is friendly with them. Each one --
COLLINS: Dana is friendly with them. I can`t guarantee that the other chemistry is quite the same. That`s not -- you know.
BEHAR: Uh huh, so like when you first got divorced, I`m sure it wasn`t as friendly. It`s never friendly --
COLLINS: No, no, it never is.
BEHAR: That`s a horror, that first year.
COLLINS: Yes. Because there`s -- your corner, my corner; your friends, my friends.
BEHAR: I bet you kept all the friends. Because you know, you`re famous and you`re rich. So are they at this point though. Thanks to you.
COLLINS: Exactly, you see. No, you know, it is always the taking of positions. I just think that it`s -- to get over that as soon as possible. And I`ve gotten over it.
BEHAR: And for the children.
COLLINS: Yes it`s fantastic for the kids.
BEHAR: You know your career is interesting. You were a child actor. You did an extra part, 1964 in "Hard Day`s Night." How did that happen?
COLLINS: Well I went to drama school and they just got the call. You know, send 50 kids to the Scarlet Theater which was in Charlotte Street. It`s not there anymore. No one knew what they were going for. We just turned up. And so did every other drama schools and 50 other kids. And we just turned up and walked in. There was the Beetles` drum kit.
They walked on stage "She Loves You." Everyone went nuts. I`ve seen my friends in it and I`ve seen it hundreds of times. But I`ve never seen me. But 30 years later they made the making of "A Hard Day`s Night," to celebrate to anniversary.
BEHAR: Yes.
COLLINS: And Walter Shanksman (ph) who had produced the film had heard this story and gave me the out take. So -- and I found me eventually.
BEHAR: So were you getting residuals?
COLLINS: And everybody -- it was a shame -- I feel sorry for the kid -- there`s a kid that does a river side scene with Ringo.
BEHAR: Yes.
COLLINS: And everybody thinks that`s me now. The kid`s one moment of fame. He`s probably in obscurity now. That wasn`t me. I was not even in the film.
I was there listening. The little still that I found when I watched the outtakes was me like this. Because I just wanted to -- just shut up and listen to the music, you know.
BEHAR: So you had your calling. I always say that people know what they should be in life. If you look back at when you were 10 years old, what did you want to do at 10 years old? That pretty much tells you what you should be.
COLLINS: Yes, I was just playing drums when I was five years old. I never wanted to be anything else; you know, never a train driver, never an astronaut, never a racing car driver.
BEHAR: Always a musician and a singer.
COLLINS: Well no, I never wanted to be a singer. I was just -- or a musician, just a drummer.
BEHAR: Well the drums, that`s an interesting story, what happened to your hands? That I read something --
COLLINS: Yes. I don`t know what happened. But long story short is that I don`t really have -- I can`t feel the end of my fingers, which means playing -- I don`t have the strength in my fingers that I used to have.
So when I made this record, I had to tape the stick to my left hand, which was a very different sensation after having played since I was 5 years old. But I -- we finished the record ok, but you know --
BEHAR: Yes but you had to tape the -- that`s interesting.
COLLINS: Yes, I don`t know whether there`s going to be either right itself or not.
BEHAR: I see.
(CROSSTALK)
COLLINS: Now, we`re philosophically adjusted to the idea.
BEHAR: Ok what`s this I hear about you being obsessed with Texas and you`re writing a book about the Alamo? What is that about?
COLLINS: Yes well, again, when I was 5 years old, Fess Parker. And Disney`s --
BEHAR: Davey Crockett.
COLLINS: Yes.
BEHAR: Yes.
COLLINS: And it caught my imagination and stayed with me. And then I started, you know, 15-odd years ago, I started collecting documents because I came across a letter by Crockett, written by Davey Crockett. And I thought, my God, I never realized this stuff might still exist.
So I started collecting and I`ve got a lot you know cannons and I`ve got rifles and knives from the Alamo.
BEHAR: I see.
COLLINS: And I`m writing a book about the collection.
BEHAR: That`s interesting. From a Brit, I guess you`re just interested --
COLLINS: Yes, well there a lot of Europeans at the Alamo. You know this is real train spotter stuff. You know --
BEHAR: Is that where they got the term I reckon? Because I see it all in British movies, they use the term, I reckon.
COLLINS: I reckon.
BEHAR: And then so do the West --
COLLINS: Yes probably -- probably the immigrants.
BEHAR: Ok I have questions from viewers now.
COLLINS: Ok.
BEHAR: They -- they tweet and they ask questions because they`re so interested in you. Will there be a Genesis reunion with Peter Gabriel? He`s also a great -- a great musician.
COLLINS: Yes, yes. No, he`s fantastic. I love Peter.
BEHAR: Yes.
COLLINS: And they are, you know -- that has been talked about for quite a few years now. And -- and with the advent of this problem with my hand, my job would be as drummer.
So that`s out.
BEHAR: Oh that`s out.
COLLINS: Yes.
BEHAR: Ok. I can`t tell you how I`ve enjoyed seeing you Phil.
COLLINS: It`s nice to see you again, Joy.
BEHAR: It`s been just delightful you and you know just brilliant. Everyone thinks you`re the best.
COLLINS: I`ll come to see you again.
BEHAR: Come see me again.
COLLINS: Yes.
BEHAR: Well, you`re seeing me now.
COLLINS: Happy first anniversary.
BEHAR: Come and see me and we`ll talk again.
COLLINS: I will.
BEHAR: Ok, check out his new album, "Going Back".
We`ll be back after a quick break. Thank you Phil so much.
COLLINS: It`s good to see you.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BEHAR: Rick Springfield`s 1981 smash hit "Jessie`s Girl" was the anthem for a generation of teens that helped launch the Grammy winning singer into America`s hearts. He was also TVs original hot doc on ABC`s "General Hospital." His memoir, "Late, Late at Night" reveals the highs and lows of fame in his lifelong battle with depression.
With me now is Rick Springfield. Welcome to the show Rick.
RICK SPRINGFIELD, SINGER: Thanks.
BEHAR: You are a rock star, a soap star and quite -- quite a ladies` man, according to this book; a lot of sex in this book. How many women are we talking? On a scale of one to Warren Beatty.
SPRINGFIELD: I don`t know how many Warren Beatty has had.
BEHAR: Oh a lot, a lot.
SPRINGFIELD: I -- it`s been a lot.
BEHAR: It`s been a lot. But yet, you`re still married, you`re married for 25 years.
SPRINGFIELD: Yes because I`m married to the -- to the right -- you know, I mean, she -- I exist by her good grace. She`s an amazing woman. She`s not -- she didn`t, you know, sweep things under the rug and say we won`t talk about that. She met the issues head on with me. And we you know went to therapy.
And we actually --
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: You worked it out.
SPRINGFIELD: -- a couple of times thought ok, let`s -- let`s break up. And but -- we -- we -- we know that we`re better together than we are apart. And that`s -- that`s the heart of it.
BEHAR: That`s nice. What does she do? Is she in the biz?
SPRINGFIELD: She runs the house and has always run the house. She`s a rock, than ever -- she is -- I mean, she`s not a professional woman, but has all these doctors, women doctors and women lawyers that like flock around her because she has this thing.
BEHAR: She`s a mover and a shaker?
SPRINGFIELD: Absolutely, a mover and a shaker.
BEHAR: And children. You have children?
SPRINGFIELD: Yes we have two boys --
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: Two boys --
SPRINGFIELD: -- 21 and 24; Liam and Josh.
BEHAR: That`s nice. So you now dated -- I was reading that you dated Linda Blair from the "Exorcist."
SPRINGFIELD: That`s a lie.
BEHAR: It`s not true?
SPRINGFIELD: No I`m kidding.
BEHAR: You put it in the book.
SPRINGFIELD: It`s just you know, any cops around?
BEHAR: Well because you were 25 and she was 15.
SPRINGFIELD: I was 25 and she was 15.
BEHAR: That could make your head spin.
SPRINGFIELD: Well, it`s -- yes.
BEHAR: So isn`t that illegal at the time -- it was illegal then?
SPRINGFIELD: It was the `70s and it was not considered that big of a deal. I mean people said it kind of raised eyebrows, look what the hell is going on.
But now, I`m sure with everybody, you know, that this -- there would be some -- some issue about it. But honestly, I -- I have friends who have daughters who date, 16, there was one was dating a 30-year-old. You know it`s not -- I`m not advocating -- you know if I had a daughter I`d be -- I`d be there at first --
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: See.
SPRINGFIELD: Like I`m just saying, there are relationships and there are that aren`t predatory, you know my relationship with Linda was absolutely not predatory.
BEHAR: It was mutual?
SPRINGFIELD: I mean, we`re still -- she was older than me really up here. I was -- I`ve always been a bit of perpetual adolescent. But you know, her mom -- really I loved her mom. Her mom really liked me. And we`re still -- we`re friends to this day.
BEHAR: I know but not to be rude, but isn`t that considered statutory rape? Ok.
SPRINGFIELD: Can we move on now? No I mean --
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: I mean even he`s saying --
SPRINGFIELD: -- we`ve talked about it --
GREGORY: -- the girl is 15 dating a 30 year old guy now he could go to jail for that.
SPRINGFIELD: Yes. You know it was a real relationship. I mean I went to the -- I -- they -- they saved me, really. I have -- it was a thing about her family. I loved connecting with her family because I`m a family person. I was from Australia and was missing my family deeply. And I had nothing that happened with me. I was -- I was really struggling as a musician.
BEHAR: And you were immature and she was mature.
SPRINGFIELD: Yes, yes, but I mean, you know -- she -- it was, you know honestly, you know she came on to me.
But I was -- but she`s an amazing person. And -- and I, like for my - - my birthday, where you had fans instead of buying me presents, we sent money to her dog rescue. And we have that in common we`re --
BEHAR: Ok.
SPRINGFIELD: -- we are passionate about dogs.
BEHAR: All right. All right. You`re off the hook. You know it`s -- you attempted suicide when you were 17 years old. That is astounding, I mean you -- you tried to hang yourself.
SPRINGFIELD: I -- I did hang myself it just didn`t -- the rope came undone. I was in the hold. I used to build guillotines and I was a very, very -- a very, very odd teenager, puberty was not kind to me. And I was - - and I was very adept at making hanging nooses.
And -- and I was very lonely and -- and just hit a point where I wasn`t good at school, I wasn`t popular at school. I stayed home a lot. I realized I was failing my first public thing, which was school, you know being in -- being in school.
And -- and I had incredible self-loathing. And one day, I just -- I just wanted it to end. And I went out and put a rope around my neck and tied it around the -- the beam of the shed. I`m back there at the shed and kicked away this box that I was standing on and hung there for about 15, 20 seconds and the rope came undone. The rope that I tied came undone.
BEHAR: So then what did you do? You just decided to change your mind. You changed your mind?
(CROSSTALK)
SPRINGFIELD: Yes. I mean I had a big rope around my neck and felt, truly felt like something had changed in me. And I`m not you know with all the teenage suicides now, what I -- my view is, you know, give it -- if you are feeling that -- give it a day or give it a week or give it another year.
BEHAR: Right.
SPRINGFIELD: Because things will change. I mean, look what I would have missed out on in my life.
BEHAR: Your career.
SPRINGFIELD: A career, my family, my two sons.
BEHAR: All those women loving you on "General Hospital" --
SPRINGFIELD: Sex with Linda Blair.
BEHAR: All the sex you had. Rock and roll.
SPRINGFIELD: I`m going to hell.
BEHAR: And then, this is interesting to me, too. At 17 -- we`ll take a break quickly, but we`ll come back. I want to hit on a couple of other things.
SPRINGFIELD: I bet you do.
BEHAR: I do. At 17 you tried to kill yourself and then at 23 you do something odd. More with Rick Springfield on the way.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SPRINGFIELD: How did you find out about Stacy?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You haven`t figured it out? You were lying next to her in your bed.
SPRINGFIELD: What are you talking about?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I called your apartment and Stacy answered the phone.
SPRINGFIELD: No. I was in the kitchen --
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Don`t worry about it Noah, I hung up before I said anything.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BEHAR: Yes. That`s "General Hospital`s" Dr. Noah Drake played by my guest Rick Springfield. We`ll talk about that in a second.
But I wanted to ask you. At 23 you had some plastic surgery. So at 17 you tried to kill yourself, and then at 23 you wanted to look better and feel better. So what happen between that?
SPRINGFIELD: No it was, first of all, after hanging myself, I realized that I was here for a reason. That reason, to me, then, was that I had something to offer, you know, to share. I think it was music. I went to America and got into a band, had success, had hits in -- had hits in Australia. Then went to America and had a hit in America. But got caught.
BEHAR: Became basically became a pop super star.
SPRINGFIELD: Well a teen idol. You know, which honestly, I had one hit in the `70s -- 1970 over here. Then all the magazine`s started putting -- teen magazines started putting me in there because I was cute.
BEHAR: You`re cute.
SPRINGFIELD: I was like the first Paris Hilton. I mean I was famous for nothing. Really, I would go to Disneyland and you know all these young girls come up asked me to sign an autograph for them. And I`m sure they had no idea what I did.
BEHAR: Yes.
SPRINGFIELD: They just recognized me from the magazine. So I started, you know, my depression started talking to me. I refer to him in the second person, as Mr. D.
BEHAR: Mr. D.
SPRINGFIELD: He, you know, was saying, I was quite a bit older. I was already 23 or 24 by this time. And all the kids, all the other guys Donny Osmond was 16 and 17. I started, you know, worrying about thinking - -
BEHAR: Oh, looking younger.
SPRINGFIELD: I don`t look young. You don`t look young enough.
So I stupidly went to Australia and looked at this you know, plastic - - Australian plastic surgeon. I had no bags, no lines; 23-year-old puffy young face. I said can you help me? He said I think I can fix those lines and those bags.
BEHAR: Oh boy.
SPRINGFIELD: So it was a very big mistake.
BEHAR: Now, you are still touring at your age which I think you say it in here, don`t you?
SPRINGFIELD: Yes.
BEHAR: You`re 61 now.
SPRINGFIELD: Yes, I am.
BEHAR: And I always find it interesting that rockers and pop stars in their 60s are now going strong. Ringo Starr I think just turned 70. And the Rolling Stones, I just saw them in a concert last year, they were fantastic. They are up there now too. I mean, how long do you think you`ll go? And do women still throw their underwear at you?
SPRINGFIELD: They do, actually. There`s not a lot of training bras anymore. It`s a good sign. Good sign. Life is good. Yes, it`s great.
Our show is very energetic. I have an amazing, powerful band. And we play the songs -- it`s a rock and roll show. People that haven`t been before are usually very surprised by the energy and the audience reacts to that too.
BEHAR: So you just keep going.
SPRINGFIELD: Well I`ll keep going until --
BEHAR: Keep going. You are actually so charming and lovely. It is really nice and fun. Thanks for doing this.
OK, his book is "Late, Late at Night".
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BEHAR: Miss Shannen Doherty played a bad girl in "Beverly Hills 90210," a witch in "Charmed," and now, she`s a badass, which she explains in her new book "Badass: A Hard-Earned Guide To Living Life With Style And The Right Attitude." Welcome to the show, Shannen.
SHANNEN DOHERTY, ACTRESS: Thank you.
BEHAR: IN your book, you talk about the abuse you took online from people who said some very hurtful things about you. Why do you read that crap?
DOHERTY: I don`t read it any more just because it would tear me up. It tore my self-esteem down so low. It was insane.
BEHAR: Yes.
DOHERTY: And you read it and you believe it and you take it to heart. And eventually, you just have to say, I can`t read any of it. I can`t read the good, I can`t read the bad.
BEHAR: That`s right.
DOHERTY: All that I can do is be happy with who I am. And you know, the people who want to put you down, it`s their own issue.
BEHAR: And they`re out there.
DOHERTY: It`s there`s some problem. It`s their insecurity with themselves. Maybe, they don`t like how they look. It makes them feel better to put somebody else down.
BEHAR: That`s right.
DOHERTY: And in truth it`s what, you know, 13 to 50 people`s opinion out of how many millions and millions and millions in the world.
BEHAR: The once who are negative actually do more of the writing.
DOHERTY: Of course
BEHAR: Yes.
DOHERTY: Well, because, usually, the ones who have something positive to say are too busy living an actual life.
BEHAR: Yes.
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: Good point. That phrase "get a life."
DOHERTY: Get a life.
BEHAR: It`s great phrase for the 20th century. Let`s talk about badass.
DOHERTY: Which should be the name of your book.
BEHAR: Get a life.
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: I like it. OK. Now, top badasses in your book.
DOHERTY: Right.
BEHAR: By the way, before we get to that --
DOHERTY: Did you see your name? It was number 11. And they cut it because they said I could only have ten.
BEHAR: Who did that?
DOHERTY: Random House. You should really take it up with --
BEHAR: They have got some (EXPLETIVE DELETED) nerve over at Random House.
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: I like Hyperion better. But you know, I happened to turn to this lovely poem that you wrote when you were 7 years old. Listen to this, guys. She says -- I want to read a little bit of it. "I feel the rocks under my feet and the wet sand oozing between my toes." I guess you`re on the beach. "When I`m at the beach, I feel God`s presence as I walk on the wild side." You were 7 years old, and you`re a badass already.
DOHERTY: I was predicting my life at 7. Wow. Self-fulfilling prophecy right there, huh?
BEHAR: Yes. Can you remember what you were thinking in the second grade? And you won first place, by the way. DOHERTY: I did. I do remember. I was living in Palace Verde Estates at the time. We just moved to California from Tennessee. And there was this poetry contest at my school. And I was down on the beach at Malikka Cove, walking, and my parents and I always went to the beach. We lived right there. And I was like, mommy, I have my poem. And I, you know, sat down and started saying all these things. My mom was like, OK, I`ve got some crazy kid. That`s amazing.
BEHAR: Did they put you on medication after that?
DOHERTY: Immediately. Immediately. And then I went off when I was 19, and we all know what happened after that.
BEHAR: Yes. We do. We do. We don`t have to rehash all of that. Read the book. But, in the book, you do mention some top badasses.
DOHERTY: Yes.
BEHAR: The ones that didn`t get cut off the list by Random House.
DOHERTY: Well, you`re in the second book.
BEHAR: Oh.
DOHERTY: Yes.
BEHAR: "Badass 2."
DOHERTY: There`s like chapters on you.
BEHAR: You have Madonna, Angelina, Lucille Ball, Drew Barrymore, Oprah Winfrey, Sandra Bullock, Katharine Hepburn, Tina Fey and Reese Witherspoon. Oh, I adore her. She`s such a great little actress.
DOHERTY: Classic.
BEHAR: I love her.
DOHERTY: Yes.
BEHAR: So, what do these women have in common?
DOHERTY: Well, I think that they have an inner strength that you can see in all of them. There`s a confidence, there`s a strength, but there`s also, you know, a sense of humor, and there`s also sort of this -- it`s like they`re in on it constantly. They know what they`re doing, and they don`t take themselves too seriously. What they do is just a job, and they enjoy life and embrace it and are compassionate.
BEHAR: Right. I think Angelina takes herself seriously.
DOHERTY: I mean, you know, I think she probably takes her humanitarian work very seriously.
BEHAR: And Madonna. Madonna does it (ph), too.
DOHERTY: Madonna is a badass because that is one of the longest running careers ever, to be relevant for that long of a period of time, to constantly evolve and change.
BEHAR: She reinvents constantly.
DOHERTY: It`s amazing to be.
BEHAR: Yes. She`s like Thomas Edison.
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: I like your helpful tips in here also. I like how you get out of a speeding ticket. Tell me what you tell the cop.
DOHERTY: Well, I mean, if I was really speeding and I really need help out of that ticket, I will look at him and be like, I have diarrhea. I have to go.
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: Does that work with the LAPD?
DOHERTY: Sometimes. On occasion, it has worked. You know, honesty also has worked. Dude, I got be honest, I`m just turning to them and saying, you know what? I`m an idiot.
BEHAR: You`re an idiot.
DOHERTY: I`m an idiot. Just call me an idiot. And I think cops respect honesty. But they also respect a sense of humor. So, when you turn that diarrhea line out, it can work.
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: OK.
DOHERTY: My mom`s going to be like I cannot believe you were talking about that on CNN with Joy.
BEHAR: Oh, so what?
DOHERTY: That`s great.
BEHAR: It`s fun. Let`s see. I only have a minute left in this segment. But I want to know, you say that commitment is not for everybody. Now, you`ve been married twice --
DOHERTY: Well, technically once. I was annulled.
BEHAR: Which one was annulled? You were married to --
DOHERTY: RickSalomon was annulled. Rick.
BEHAR: Rick was annulled.
DOHERTY: Yes.
BEHAR: He`s the one who made the sex tape with Paris Hilton. Did you ever see that thing?
DOHERTY: That`s what he is famous for, yes.
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: Did you ever see it?
DOHERTY: I watched about a minute of it, and not by choice. It was - - I actually flew into New York to do press for something else, and I got asked about the tape. And I had no idea about it. And I was sort of -- you know, bombarded with this and was clueless. And a publicist at the time took me aside and said, I have it. Do you want to see it? And I was like what? Like, I really think you should see it. And I maybe watched ten seconds and got instantly ill and said please --
BEHAR: What made you sick? The acrobatics?
(LAUGHTER)
DOHERTY: I think the two people starring in it, you know, might have had something to do with it. My husband at the time. It`s, you know, not exactly what you want to see.
BEHAR: It`s not George Clooney and Angelina Jolie.
DOHERTY: Right. Right.
BEHAR: You know, it`s these two.
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: He did that behind her back, too.
DOHERTY: There`s two sides to every story. I`m not defending him for anything in the world, but there is always two sides.
BEHAR: There`s always two sides. All right. I have Twitter questions for you. Your fans are out there, your legions of fans. Number one question, would you pose for "Playboy" again? Please? One said.
DOHERTY: Please?
BEHAR: Yes.
DOHERTY: No, I wouldn`t.
BEHAR: You wouldn`t do it again?
DOHERTY: No.
BEHAR: How old were you when you did that?
DOHERTY: Well, the first time I did it, I actually didn`t know I was doing it. It was for a coffee table book, and then, I showed up on the cover. And it was like, hot, that`s interesting, I guess I should get paid.
BEHAR: What do you mean it was for a coffee table book?
DOHERTY: It was for a coffee table book for -- and all the money was going to AIDS (ph).
BEHAR: Oh.
DOHERTY: And so, I thought it was for a really good cause. And then, ended up being in "Playboy," and I was a little flabbergasted by that, needless to say. And then, the second time I did it and because I got to pick my photographer and the paycheck was great, I`m not going to lie. And it looked like, to me, Italian "Vogue." You know, you saw less in my "Playboy" than you do in Italian "Vogue."
BEHAR: Aha. So, you don`t want to do it again?
DOHERTY: No.
BEHAR: Why not?
DOHERTY: Well, I`m older.
BEHAR: So what? You can pull it off.
DOHERTY: I`m older, you know.
BEHAR: Do the words "air brushing" ring a bell? You know?
DOHERTY: Yes, but you know, it`s always scary if somebody doesn`t air brush you.
BEHAR: Well, they always air brush. Those girls are not so perfect.
DOHERTY: True. But, you know what, I`m now at the age where I want kids and I want kids sooner rather than later. So, I would rather that be a little bit further in the past in my children`s lives than so in the present.
BEHAR: Do you have a guy or a sperm donor?
DOHERTY: I do. Both.
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: Do you? I like when they`re both in one package, don`t you?
DOHERTY: Oh, is it supposed to be in one package?
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: So much more convenient.
DOHERTY: Yes. He`s right over there, actually.
BEHAR: Is he
DOHERTY: Yes. One package.
BEHAR: Come over here. Let`s see who he is. Come over here. Let`s see what look like. Everyone wants to see what you look like. He looks like a lumberjack. All right. Plastic surgery, would you ever consider it?
DOHERTY: Yes.
BEHAR: You would? Of course.
DOHERTY: Maybe eventually, yes. Maybe, I would. You know, maybe a tummy tuck after I`ve had, you know, four kids and I can`t lose the weight.
BEHAR: Four?
DOHERTY: Or three.
BEHAR: Are you ready for that, sperm donor?
(LAUGHTER)
DOHERTY: He wants six. That`s scary.
BEHAR: He wants six?
DOHERTY: Yes. My brother has seven. So, I think maybe they`re trying to compete or something. Yes.
BEHAR: OK.
DOHERTY: So, yes, I think that there`s a time and a place for everything. To me, there`s something slightly unnatural about it, and I would never mess with my face.
BEHAR: No.
DOHERTY: Because this is me.
BEHAR: Botox, nothing?
DOHERTY: No, not yet.
BEHAR: No Botox.
DOHERTY: Not yet.
BEHAR: No, not yet. I`m not saying yet now.
DOHERTY: Maybe.
BEHAR: Believe me, you will.
DOHERTY: Yes, of course. Of course.
BEHAR: It comes to all of us.
DOHERTY: You know what? Yes. I mean, it`s there. I`ve had people suggest that I get it.
BEHAR: Now? No, no, no. You`re perfect now.
DOHERTY: I just ignore it.
BEHAR: You should ignore it. You`re beautiful. You don`t need it right now. Do you still talk with your ex-husbands?
DOHERTY: No.
BEHAR: Well, one of them was annulled. Rick Salomon, we know what a jerk he is.
DOHERTY: Right. No. There is no reason to --
BEHAR: And what about the son of George Hamilton, you were married to him?
DOHERTY: Yes, I mean, you know, super short, and I was incredibly young. And I don`t -- you know, we don`t know each other. We didn`t know each other then much less now.
BEHAR: That`s usually the case. All right. Shannen, was this fun for you?
DOHERTY: It was really fun. I was like, oh, it`s CNN. It`s going to be so serious.
BEHAR: Oh, please.
DOHERTY: This is Joy.
BEHAR: This is HLN.
DOHERTY: This is when she`s going to really --
BEHAR: This is news and views, baby.
DOHERTY: I love it. I`m here whenever you need an extra guest.
BEHAR: OK.
DOHERTY: Somebody drops out, I`m here. I`ll bring my sweats.
BEHAR: Thank you. The book is called "Badass." We`ll back in a minute.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BEHAR: As feisty as she is glamorous, Joan Collins is the grand dame of divas. She`s perhaps best known for playing the scheming Alexis Carrington on the 1980s hit "Dynasty." Take a look
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JOAN COLLINS, ENTERTAINER: Take your hands off me, Crystal.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This is not until you`re out of here. I want you out of my house.
COLLINS: Your house? This was my house while you were living in a shack somewhere.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Alexis, if you don`t go down those stairs and out that door, I`ll throw you out myself.
COLLINS: I wouldn`t want you to exert yourself, my dear. I`m leaving.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BEHAR: With me now is the fabulous Miss Joan Collins. Joan, you know, you started giggling when you see those clips.
COLLINS: Yes.
BEHAR: Why, they`re funny?
COLLINS: The dialogue is so camp and witty.
BEHAR: It`s very camp.
COLLINS: I mean, it really is funny, I have to say. I started watching the show this summer because it`s airing constantly in Europe. And no wonder people liked the show. It was very funny.
BEHAR: It is very funny.
COLLINS: Yes.
BEHAR: And you show a lot of those clips and you show it --
COLLINS: I do.
BEHAR: Saw your show, and you`re having a good time there?
COLLINS: I`m having a great time. One night with Joan and you see everything about me. And you see my clips, you see my -- oh, my God, it`s on now. You see family pictures. You see movie film. You see home movies. You see one of my husband`s nude.
BEHAR: Which one was that? Which husband was nude?
COLLINS: Let`s see if it will show.
BEHAR: I did see it.
COLLINS: The back part of him when I`m singing the song.
BEHAR: Oh, yes. That`s right. You`ve had a lot of husbands.
COLLINS: I have, yes.
BEHAR: This is number five, right, the one you have now?
COLLINS: Yes, but this is the one, the one, the one. I`ve kissed all those frogs, and now I`m with my prince charming.
BEHAR: You didn`t say that about any of your other husbands, this is the one.
COLLINS: Well, first of all, I`m 18 when I married the first one which is what I say in the show. I was a virgin, you know, and he took my virginity which in those days was a -- the second one, you know, I wanted to have children. And it was perfectly fine except that he was having quite a lot of affairs with quite a lot of ladies.
BEHAR: Was he famous, the second one?
COLLINS: Anthony Newly.
BEHAR: Oh, Anthony Newly.
COLLINS: Yes.
BEHAR: Well, that was number two.
COLLINS: Yes. And three --
BEHAR: (SINGING) What kind of fool am I? That`s Anthony Newly.
COLLINS: That`s it.
BEHAR: Yes.
COLLINS: Yes. Well, you know, you`re going to have to come and see the show. You remember it, though.
BEHAR: I do, yes.
COLLINS: And then, the number three was wonderful. And I had my second daughter, but unfortunately, he got into -- can I say this? Drugs? You know, and that is something that is very hard to beat. And that is why I am like the biggest anti-drug campaigner that you can ever find.
BEHAR: So, so far, the first one was a thief, he took your virginity. The second one was a philanderer, and the third one was a druggie.
COLLINS: Yes,
BEHAR: So, what about number four?
COLLINS: Number four was an idiot and Swedish.
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: An idiot and Swedish.
COLLINS: Just refer to him as the Swede. We don`t even talk about him. That was big, big, big mistake.
BEHAR: And number five?
COLLINS: Number five is Percy who I`m married to now. Perfect Percy from Peru, who is just absolutely wonderful, kind, loving, clever, smart, good looking and the only thing, of course, is that he`s a few years younger than me. When people ask me about that, I say, well, if he dies, he dies.
BEHAR: Larry King says that about his wife, too.
COLLINS: He stole that from me, Joy. He stole it from me. I`ve been saying this since I first did the show which was like two years ago.
BEHAR: He stole that line from you?
COLLINS: Yes, yes.
BEHAR: He`s 32 years younger than you.
COLLINS: That`s it. Yes.
BEHAR: That`s a record for a cougar.
COLLINS: Is it?
BEHAR: Yes.
COLLINS: OK. Good. I like breaking records.
BEHAR: Yes.
COLLINS: Why not?
BEHAR: Yes. I mean, tell me about that. My guy is seven years younger, but that`s nothing compared to --
COLLINS: No, I know, but it doesn`t bother us. I mean, people do not make a big thing about it when they see us together. They don`t seem to think --
BEHAR: Because you look good.
COLLINS: Yes, I guess, I do. Yes. And he does. And I guess, I look a little younger and he looks about his age. So, it`s like, you know, people don`t really -- you know something, Joy, people have hardly commented on it since we got married. In fact, even the newspapers and you know what they can be. Yes. Pains in the A.
BEHAR: How did you squeeze Warren Beatty into -- and I heard that you were engaged to Beatty. When was that?
COLLINS: I was. I was engaged to him for about a year. That was after husband number one and before husband number two.
BEHAR: Well, number two was a philanderer and Warren Beatty was a major philanderer.
COLLINS: Not when I met him. He was 21, and I was a couple of years older. And he was just terribly sweet and innocent, and he didn`t know anybody in Hollywood. I mean, I met him with Jane Fonda. He was dating Jane Fonda, and then, he started calling me. And then, we started going out together like almost immediately and then we got engaged.
He gave me the -- he gave me the engagement ring, he said, I need some chopped liver? Did we have some chopped liver because we were living together in New York. I said, yes, I think I bought some, you know, I bought some. So, I got out and he said, can you spoon some out for me. So, I spooned it out. And there is this massive gold ring encrusted with - -
BEHAR: In the chopped liver.
COLLINS: In the chopped liver. So, good thing, I didn`t swallow it. No, I couldn`t. It was huge. And then I wore it all the way through this silly movie that I did call "Esther and the King," which we have a clip of that in the -- one-woman show.
BEHAR: In your show?
COLLINS: Yes. I wore the ring. And now, I`m wearing Princess Diana`s ring.
BEHAR: It looks like that.
COLLINS: It does look like that.
BEHAR: Is this a copy of that ring?
COLLINS: No, it is not a copy.
BEHAR: It looks similar, the sapphire.
COLLINS: I`ve had it like 25 years.
BEHAR: What do you think of the marriage between Middleton and Prince William, because you`re a Brit, right?
COLLINS: Oh, I`m a Brit are you kidding me? I am so excited about that, Joy. I think it`s the best thing that has happened to the monarchy since Princess Diana. And I mean, I`m sure you remember that wedding. She was the absolute, most gorgeous, fabulous thing. I loved her so much. I thought she was absolutely wonderful. I met her several times. You know, she was always so sweet and kind and giving. And I think these two together are going to be fantastic.
BEHAR: Well, people are saying that this looks like a love match.
COLLINS: It is.
BEHAR: As opposed to, you know, Charles and Di, which was not a love match.
COLLINS: Yes, being a broodmare.
BEHAR: But this guy, this bishop of Willesden, this guy named, Bishop Pete Broadbent, he says he`s giving the marriage seven years.
COLLINS: Well, he`s a fool. And I think bishop has absolutely no right to come out with comments like that. How dare he?
BEHAR: He can say whatever he wants.
COLLINS: Yes, you know something, we can say whatever you like. Well, I`ll say he`s a schmuck.
BEHAR: OK.
(LAUGHTER)
COLLINS: Is that all right?
BEHAR: Well, at least, say he`s a bishop schmuck.
COLLINS: A bishop schmuck.
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: Yes, but you know, he said that. He feels as though it`s just shallow. He said it`s a shallow relationship.
COLLINS: Yes. Well, I think I read something about that. And I think he`s a celebrity-hating bishop. That`s what these people have known each other for nine years.
BEHAR: Yes.
COLLINS: And I think that their relationship is built on friendship which is what mine is build on with Percy. And I think that he knows -- he`s seen it all, you know, Prince William. And he`s told her, obviously, and I think they know what they`re getting into. And I`m sure he will be a fabulous king.
BEHAR: OK. We`re going to take a break. We`ll have more with the fabulous Joan Collins when we come back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COLLINS: You are a common workman. That basement looks like it`s been scrubbed and polished.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: But I`m making report that (INAUDIBLE).
COLLINS: Yes, 7:00 in the morning. Do you have a flop for the night?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What?
COLLINS: You really are new at this, aren`t you? A flop is a place to sleep.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Oh.
COLLINS: Well, there`s a vacant room at the place where I live for $2 a week. If you want to, I`ll take you there.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BEHAR: Is it me or Shatner (ph) leering at you. That was the beautiful Joan Collins in a classic 1967 episode of "Star Trek." He was like leering, wasn`t he?
COLLINS: Yes. It was first time that Captain Kirk ever fell in love. He fell in love with her. Unfortunately, she died.
BEHAR: I`m sorry. You know, you said that you think Angelina Jolie is beautiful. She`s a beautiful woman. I agree with that, but she was also -- she`s very thin. And then I read somewhere else that you said that you were very thin only eating 850 calories a day. Now, what is this with the anorexia in Hollywood?
COLLINS: Oh, God, well, I don`t do that any more.
BEHAR: No.
COLLINS: I did that for a particular scene. You saw it. When I had to take off all my clothes in that scene in the stud (ph), you know, I was --
BEHAR: You were scared.
COLLINS: I was scared and skinny. So, I only did that for about two weeks. It was hell. I don`t know about anorexia in Hollywood. I think that actually the producers and the directors want their women to look really thin. And I heard about a director recently who saw two girls for the same role and the girl that was much more suitable they said, no, no, you can`t have her, she`s too fat.
She weighed like 122 pounds. The other one was like 116. I think it`s out of hand. I think it`s gotten out of hand, because not only are they so thin, but they`ve got these sort of tiny watermelons stuck up there, too.
BEHAR: I know. They`re more like peaches.
COLLINS: Oh, peaches. Tiny peaches.
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: But I think that she`s a gorgeous girl also. She`s on the cover of "Vogue" this month. She really is stunning. You know who else is a beauty of the period is Charlize Theron.
COLLINS: Oh, gorgeous.
BEHAR: She`s a beautiful girl also.
COLLINS: And a fabulous actress.
BEHAR: She`s wonderful.
COLLINS: She did a wonderful movie in which she took off all her makeup and she looked hideous. It was --
BEHAR: And she won --
COLLINS: And she won the Oscar. Yes.
BEHAR: Of course. I take off my makeup and people are adjusting their radios.
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: Beyonce is another beautiful woman in the business, I think.
COLLINS: Yes.
BEHAR: She`s a --
COLLINS: I love her body. I love her body. I love Jennifer Lopez. I like women who look like women.
BEHAR: Me, too.
COLLINS: And I certainly know that my husband does and all the men that I know do except perhaps those in the fashion industry.
BEHAR: Now, we`ve gotten a couple of tweet questions, Twitter questions. I`m going to give you a couple really fast. Who in Hollywood would you bitch slap if you could get away with it?
COLLINS: God. If you told me this before, I would have thought. I never bitch slapped anybody except on screen.
BEHAR: OK. Let`s say politics. Let`s say Sarah Palin or Nancy Pelosi?
COLLINS: Oh, Sarah Palin.
BEHAR: Oh, you`d bitch slap her. OK.
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: Have you been watching "Dancing with the Stars" where Bristol Palin keeps winning, and my theory is that the tea party is voting for her.
COLLINS: Yes, I think they are. Apparently, I had something yesterday that they stay up and they do three, six, 800 votes at a time. I haven`t really watched it because I`m doing my one-woman show.
BEHAR: That`s right. At Feinstein`s.
COLLINS: Yes.
BEHAR: It says here you`re a bit of a germaphobe. This is a question, how do you handle that when I`m sure everyone wants to touch you. That`s a Twitter question.
COLLINS: I have now started actually saying to people, I`m sorry, but I don`t shake hands because that is like the way to get a cold. I am going to London next week, and I`m starting rehearsals for a very grueling show in Birmingham, actually.
BEHAR: So, don`t touch anybody.
COLLINS: No. Only your husband.
BEHAR: Lovely to have you here, Joan.
COLLINS: Thank you, Joy.
BEHAR: Goodnight, everybody.
END
