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Joy Behar Page

Reporter Attacked; Doctor in the House; Dr. Phil on "Hot Sauce" Mom

Aired February 16, 2011 - 22:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

JOY BEHAR, HOST: Dr. Phil is on my show tonight. You know, I`m a big fan of therapy. Hey, maybe he can help me with my negativity and my sarcastic attitude. Yes, that will happen.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Coming up on THE JOY BEHAR SHOW, after suffering a brutal sexual assault at the hands of an Egyptian mob, CBS News correspondent Lara Logan is recovering from her injuries. But how will she heal from the emotional scars? Joy will ask that and find out about the dangers women face covering trouble around the world.

Then, Dr. Phil gives his expert advice on the day`s biggest stories from Billy Ray Cyrus` regrets about Miley to the infamous "hot sauce mom".

And firebrand presidential reporter Helen Thomas talks about the controversial comments that cost her, her job.

Plus Joy will find out if at age 90, she has any plans to retire.

That and more starting right now.

BEHAR: Amid all the jubilation in Egypt last Friday, something terrible was happening to American journalist Lara Logan. The CBS News correspondent was, in the network`s words, "the victim of a brutal and sustained sexual assault by a mob of men". She was saved by a group of women and Egyptian soldiers. She is back in the United States recovering from the traumatic attack and reports suggest she will be back at work in a couple of weeks.

But the fact remains that there is an added element of danger for all female foreign correspondents.

Let`s talk about it with Kelli Arena, a journalist and women`s advocate who has worked extensively with women in Egypt, plus Hala Gorani, anchor and correspondent for CNN International. Welcome, ladies.

Hala, you were also in the mob Egypt during the uprising. Did you have any clue that something like this could happen to one of you?

HALA GORANI, ANCHOR AND CORRESPONDENT, CNN INTERNATIONAL: I was absolutely shocked when I heard about it, especially because the attack against Lara Logan occurred after the pro-Mubarak mobs deliberately targeted journalists. This happened, according to CBS, the night Mubarak stepped down, when these carnival-like scenes, you know, were unfolding in Tahrir Square.

I was absolutely shocked not just at the attack itself but the nature of the attack. That it was sexual in nature and I found it really terrifying to read about for all of us female journalists in the field.

BEHAR: So did that confuse you, the fact that Mubarak was gone, there was more jubilation and then this horrible thing happened?

GORANI: Yes.

BEHAR: Again, confusing, the timing of it, isn`t it?

GORANI: I was very surprised, to be honest, at the timing of it. We don`t know the exact details of what happened, whether she was targeted because someone recognized her or whether it was an opportunistic attack. We don`t know any of those details but I would be very, very interested in knowing what exactly happened to her and who targeted her.

BEHAR: Right.

Now, you know this is such a sexist thing but a lot of people are saying she is a beautiful blonde woman and she shouldn`t be over there reporting in dangerous places. I mean, how do you ladies respond to that?

KELLI ARENA, JOURNALIST: Oh, Joy --

BEHAR: I know.

ARENA: I hear that and it makes my skin crawl. You know, Lara Logan there was doing her job as a journalist. I have -- I have spent a lot of time in Cairo in another position, actually training women, young women in Cairo and I was sexually harassed just walking down the streets.

I mean, this is -- this is a culture that has gotten worse and worse over the years. I mean, just this past November, there was -- during the Eid celebration, a Muslim celebration, a group of young women, they were all covered and very appropriately dressed for the culture and they were attacked in much the same way that Lara Logan was attacked right out in the middle of the street.

They, too, some people came to their aid as well, but this is something that has been bubbling for a long time.

BEHAR: Exactly. I mean, I hate to even put it this way but nuns are raped, old ladies are raped. It happens to everyone. Ok.

GORANI: Yes.

BEHAR: Right. Now, Kelli one more question about that. What does it say to you that Egyptian women were partially responsible for saving her? I know that you worked with a lot of Egyptian women?

ARENA: That is not a surprise. That is not a surprise to me. The women are as a whole are really becoming very frustrated with their situation. They are now speaking up in ways that they haven`t before. They are forming advocacy groups. They are establishing hot lines in the country to report sexual harassment.

They are very eager to have a voice in this whole process as Egypt is moving forward. The fear though is that they won`t. You know, they were out there on those streets protesting.

BEHAR: Yes.

ARENA: They were out there getting the word out and organizing the protests and unfortunately, they don`t have a very big voice right now at the negotiating table. We are not hearing from them. Are you? I haven`t seen them being quoted anywhere.

BEHAR: No, not right now. No, maybe they will emerge later.

But Hala, as a female journalist, are you always on guard when you are to out there?

GORANI: No, maybe I should be. I mean it is something that you kind of shut off, otherwise you are constantly living in a state of fear. And when you are confronted with a threat and danger, which doesn`t happen every day when you are on assignment, that`s when your sort of natural, I guess, defenses kick in. And you try to think, I speak Arabic, so I speak Arabic with people in the street. That kind of thing, whatever.

My biggest fear, Joy, is that network executives, the people in charge of deploying journalists might look at this attack and think twice about sending a female journalist in a dangerous situation. And I really hope that doesn`t happen because I have sort of read reports that some are reconsidering perhaps the deployment of female journalists. And the only way to change attitudes is for women to always be there when big stories unfold.

BEHAR: But you know, I have to ask you, how is a journalist such as yourself, Hala, supposed to protect yourself against a sexual assault anywhere you are? I mean, you`re out there.

GORANI: Anywhere and whether I`m on assignment or not, whether I`m in the Middle East or Europe or the United States, that is always something that women and men in Egypt, by the way, because many of the brutal torture videos that were leaked onto the web years ago by bloggers that were then harassed by the government involved men. So it is important also to note that rape happens and sexual assault happens against men in some of these regimes.

ARENA: Look, Joy, I have to say something, I was right here in the nation`s capital, Washington, D.C., many years ago, in 1995, covering the million-man march. I was on my way to a live shot to cover that convenient and I was harassed by a group of men, thrown on the floor, they were saying the most awful sexual things to me.

Another man came into that situation to help me. He was there with his son, and help me. But that happened here, in the United States. I mean this is that whole mob mentality, you know? We are -- this is 2011, yes, but that still exists when you have a group of men that are together and they all get that mentality going, they`re all revved up and often -- this is around the world. This isn`t just Egypt. It is not just -- in other words it is here, too, in the United States.

BEHAR: Yes, I remember that case in Central Park where those young guys were wilding, remember and they assaulted that woman brutally. Same idea, mob mentality.

Now, for Logan -- let me ask you, Kelli -- for Logan, do you think it makes it hard that news of this assault is out in the public? I mean, does it make any -- does it hurt or help?

ARENA: You know --

BEHAR: For her?

ARENA: I think that the more light we shed on any situation, the better off we are. And I think that it is very difficult for her to go through this as publicly as she has to go through it. But the reverse side of that is that you do get support from arenas that you wouldn`t necessarily expect to get support from. And I hope that that`s coming her way.

But I do think that we need to talk about these issues. These are not things that we can shove under the rug. These are not things that we could say are one-time incident. Yes, I surely hope this won`t become a defining moment for what happened in Egypt. Clearly that is a much bigger story.

But harassment of women and sexual assault of women, this is something that we need to -- not just women but as world populations need to discuss and we need to put a stop to it.

BEHAR: Right. Exactly.

Now, Hala, do you think they are ever going to get caught, these guys?

GORANI: I don`t know how much of a sort of -- if they are able to find them and I know there was video shot before the mob separated Lara from her crew, if an investigation in the current -- sort of under the current military regime is going to actually go ahead. And it will identify people who are responsible.

I don`t know. I can`t answer that question. I think it`s become public enough that it might lead to some sort of prosecution of some elements who were responsible for this.

BEHAR: Right.

GORANI: Yes. So I hope so. I hope so.

BEHAR: Ok. We hope for the best for her and for all of you. Thank you for what you do, really.

When we come back, Dr. Phil will tell us how someone recovers from a trauma like this.

Stay there.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Coming up a little later on THE Joy BEHAR SHOW, controversial presidential reporter Helen Thomas tells Joy how she`s still motivated to work at age 90.

Now back to Joy.

BEHAR: Well, we`ve been talking about CBS correspondent Lara Logan, who was attacked by a mob in Egypt this week. She is beginning to physically recover from the assault but how does she move on emotionally?

Joining me to discuss this and other things is Dr. Phil McGraw, host of "The Dr. Phil Show." Hey, Dr. Phil, how are you? Good to see you.

PHIL MCGRAW, HOST, "THE DR. PHIL SHOW": Hey Joy, good to talk to you.

BEHAR: Ok.

You know, how does Lara recover from something like this emotionally, do you think?

Well, Joy, first off, you -- you cannot overestimate the seriousness of what she`s been through.

BEHAR: Right.

MCGRAW: We don`t know a lot of the details about it, but what we do know is that it has been described as brutal and sustained. And having worked with victims of sexual abuse and rape over the last 30 years, I can tell you that the emotional scars will long outlive --

BEHAR: Yes.

MCGRAW: -- the physical scars here and I just really wish her the best. And I have -- I have absolute belief because I have such a relationship with CBS that they will step up and do exactly what they need to do to get her the proper support, the proper counseling --

(CROSS TALK)

BEHAR: Yes.

MCGRAW: -- and the help that she needs.

And she`s talking about going back to work right away, which everybody responds to it differently and that maybe a highly therapeutic thing for her.

BEHAR: Ok. Well, we -- we all wish her the best and hope for the best for her it`s a terrible, terrible thing that happened to her.

Ok, let`s switch gears now and talk about something that actually happened on your show. This very -- this very interesting thing that happened there I mean, I have been talking about it for weeks already and it all came from you.

MCGRAW: Right.

BEHAR: Let`s watch this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Close your mouth. Did you swallow it? Go ahead. Do you lie to me?

Why are you getting a cold shower?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Because I`m --

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You pulled three cards --

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BEHAR: You know, I have to tell you something. There are people who work here who cannot listen to it. It is so distressful to watch that and the terrorizing that that woman did to that child.

Now, I can`t believe that she actually sent you this video thinking, what? What was she thinking by sending this to you?

MCGRAW: Well, you -- you wonder sometimes and -- and my wife, Robin who`s in the audience each day had the same reaction. She just couldn`t look at it and she -- she just looked away.

And you know, I -- I think she sent it because she is desperate. I think this is a woman that said I -- I need help and I`m going to be honest about it. I`m going to quit hiding what`s going on here and so she sent this tape in.

And of course, you know, Joy, I take these things very seriously. We -- we accept home videos like this from people and sometimes we put cameras in the home because we want to see what`s actually going on. And in this case, I saw that tape about midnight the night before we did the show the next day and we have a -- a very blue ribbon advisory board at the "Dr. Phil Show". We`ve got the top minds in psychology, medicine, sociology --

BEHAR: Yes.

MCGRAW: -- nursing and other professions so I immediately reached out to the advisory board and said, look, guys, take a look at this, it`s obviously very disturbing, we need to make a decision whether this rises to the level of criminal in terms of child abuse. And shockingly enough, under Alaska law, which we immediately researched, it does not climb to a - - a clear abuse situation.

It is clearly horrible parenting and clearly traumatizes this child and mother, for that matter. She was at her wits end.

So, what we did is the intervention and got her to agree to stop this, got her to agree to open her home and have complete monitoring --

BEHAR: Yes.

MCGRAW: -- and sent her immediately for evaluation and treatment along with the son.

And the good news is that she has done everything she said she was going to do. It`s been investigated by CPS. It`s been investigated by Russian immigration and -- and their authorities. And they have deemed that the situation is not one that warrants taking the children out of the home.

So, she has taken the help and she has changed her behavior --

BEHAR: Well, good.

MCGRAW: -- but that was very, very disturbing.

BEHAR: Well, I`m happy that she`s changing her -- her way. But you know, there was a poll -- I believe it was on one of the morning shows. They did a poll and they found that 33 percent of the people -- people who responded thought that this hot saucing was an appropriate way of disciplining children. I mean, what -- what kind of thinking is that?

MCGRAW: Well, you know, of course, I -- I never had that because I was a peachy child and never created any problems for my mother, but I -- I think that a lot of people equate it to washing your mouth out with soap. And -- and when we got into the legal investigation of this the thinking was, look, this is approved by the FDA as a consumable food substance and it doesn`t create any type of tissue damage.

BEHAR: What?

MCGRAW: And so for that reason, they said, you know, as -- as disturbing as this is, it`s not actionable.

And you`re right. I saw two or three polls that said over a third of the country says --

(CROSS TALK)

BEHAR: Yes.

MCGRAW: -- you know, saucing, as it`s called, is ok.

Look, it may not be -- it may not rise to the level of criminal child abuse but that is not good parenting. What do you learn from that?

(CROSS TALK)

BEHAR: Oh, it`s terrible, it`s terrible. I`d like -- the only thing you learn is that my mother or father did that to me.

Now what about the cold shower? That is where the real --real trauma is also because the child is in there crying and scared of his mother. And -- and why would you put a child in an ice cold shower? I mean, that`s -- I think that she should -- her children are still with her. Do you think they should have taken her children away from her?

MCGRAW: Well, I`ll tell you, I don`t. And you know, if you -- if you react to the story, you say get in there and get those children out of there. She has six children in the home, some of them adopted. This boy is a twin that was adopted with his brother from Russia.

And you know, Robin and I are national spokespersons for the Court Appointed Special Advocates program and I can tell you that in many ways the foster system is broken. So you can react and say we need to get those kids out of there where are you going to take six kids?

(CROSS TALK)

BEHAR: I know and --

MCGRAW: Where are you going to put them? You`re going to break them up.

BEHAR: -- and with all the -- all the budget cutbacks you really are going to have a bigger problem coming up I think.

But you know what, you stay right there, Dr. Phil, because we`re going to have more to talk to you about.

But first, a quick note, check out my interview with Rosie O`Donnell tomorrow night at 10:00. Here is a sneak peek.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ROSIE O`DONNELL, ACTRESS: After I was off "The View" --

(CROSS TALK)

BEHAR: Yes.

O`DONNELL: -- Suzanne Somers called me up and said you know, I have a feeling that some of your rage is bio-identical hormones.

BEHAR: Really?

O`DONNELL: I`m like, are you kidding me? She`s like, no really why don`t you try this and then I went to one of her doctors and I`ve been putting that cream on me --

(CROSS TALK)

BEHAR: Yes.

O`DONNELL: -- for the last four years and I feel 1,000 percent better.

BEHAR: And the rage is gone?

O`DONNELL: Kind of.

BEHAR: Really.

O`DONNELL: It depends.

If you put me in a certain situation, I`m not promising. You know.

BEHAR: I don`t know about that.

O`DONNELL: Do a split-screen here. We will see what happens, ok Behar. That`s all I`m saying.

BEHAR: You never know what`s going to happen with you.

O`DONNELL: You never know.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DR. MCGRAW: What has happened that`s caused you to actually fear for your life? Has he threatened your life?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He has texted -- before I changed my phone number -- he has texted me and told me if I can`t have you, I will make sure nobody can or if you don`t talk to me, I will kill myself. And during arguments he has told me, you make me so mad, I just want to kill you.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BEHAR: I`m back with Dr. Phil. You know, you have a program called "Respect Works" which helps teens in abusive relationships like that girl was just saying. Tell me what are the warning signs that your child is in an abusive relationship or might be?

DR. MCGRAW: Well, Joy this is something -- this is something we really want parents to be educated about and that is a program called "Respect Works". We are partnering with Break the Cycle and Hazelton Publishing actually. And we are putting a program in the schools were we are going to try to get to the young men before they become abusive.

We are going to try to get to them and teach them how to problem solve, where the boundaries are, what is not ok. Teach the young girls how to set boundaries and recognize when they are being abused.

And the warning signs are -- the number one tool of an abuser is isolation and if you see your daughter in a relationship that is so intense that she is dropping her friends, she is pulling back from family, not being involved in church activities or other hobbies that she may have had had that is a big warning sign.

If you see her begin to drop her friends, if you see her controlled in terms of her cell phone use, if the boyfriend is picking her up from school, taking her to school, just with her every minute, then those are bad signs. And of course, you need to look for bruises or torn clothing or destroyed property, whether it`s a notebook or a cell phone or something --

BEHAR: Yes.

DR. MCGRAW: -- because this rage and it is not explainable, then your daughter may be in the midst of this. And the problem this is a very high at-risk group from 16 to 20. Our goal with "Respect Works" is to have this program in a thousand schools in the fall impacting a minimum of one million kids just in the fall.

BEHAR: How does a teenage girl get out of an abusive relationship though? She is afraid -- that girl seems to be scared.

DR. MCGRAW: That is probably the most articulate young woman who I have had on the show in nine years and she had such courage. And you ask such a good question because there`s something known as separation assault and the likelihood of being killed or seriously injured in the four to eight weeks after you break up --

BEHAR: Yes.

DR. MCGRAW: -- with an abusive partner goes up dramatically so you really have to take seriously the risk and you`ve got to do the restraining orders. You have got to monitor the situation and be sure that she doesn`t get alone where they can be run off the road.

We had a story in the show of a young girl who had done exactly that and the boyfriend ran her off the road, emptied a shotgun into the car, killed one of her friends, shot another one in the head and simply ran out of shells so he chase her down a field and bashed her head in with the rifle, so -- with the shotgun.

So these are not just cases that you read about. This can happen to your daughter so you need to pay attention.

BEHAR: I will say.

I mean what about sending someone to scare him? That`s what I would do. I come from Brooklyn. We would send Nuncio down there to break a couple of legs.

DR. MCGRAW: Yes. And of course that`s what you want to do and that`s what every father and parent wants to do but that`s the comfort zone many times for these abusers.

BEHAR: Right.

They want to get down to the base level of violence and handle it on that level because they are so immature. You`re much better off to try to get them some help, counsel them, but most importantly, protect your daughter, get her out of harm`s way whatever you have to do.

BEHAR: Ok, thank you, Dr. Phil. You do a good job.

(CROSSTALK)

DR. MCGRAW: Thank you so much. Talk to you soon.

BEHAR: Ok. And you can see him on his show every weekday, make sure to check your local listings for times.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

A.J. HAMMER, HLN HOST, "SHOWBIZ TONIGHT": Tonight on "SHOWBIZ TONIGHT", a "Showbiz Tonight Newsmaker Exclusive", "Real Housewives of Beverly Hills" star, Camille Grammer brings big news to us at 11:00 p.m. Eastern and Pacific on HLN.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BEHAR: Helen Thomas has covered the White House for 50 years, but it only took a matter of days for the 90-year-old White House reporter to step down from her job last year after her controversial remarks about Israel went public. But Thomas was not out of the game for long. She is back at work as a columnist for "Falls Church News Press."

With me now is Helen Thomas. Welcome to the show, Helen.

HELEN THOMAS, FALLS CHURCH NEWS PRESS: Thank you.

BEHAR: OK, before we talk about Israel because we are going to talk about that -- I`m sure you`re looking forward to that.

THOMAS: Oh, yes.

BEHAR: But -- I have to tell you that, you know, I admired you, many -- I admire you even now, for the many things that you did in those press conferences, how you stood up to presidents, how you spoke out, particularly on the Iraq war, which I was vehemently against myself. And one of the reasons that I liked Obama was that he was against the Iraq war.

THOMAS: Almost.

BEHAR: Well, he was against it. I mean, I think that he ran on that.

THOMAS: Well, you know, let`s see it fulfilled.

BEHAR: Well, you know, I think he was handed something, too. So let`s -- let`s -- I always expect the best from him.

THOMAS: I never have sympathy for presidents. They aren`t handed -- he could have walked out the day after he took the oath.

BEHAR: Well, I guess so, but I don`t know if -- you know, what happened to if you break it, you have to fix it, you know?

THOMAS: It was broken.

BEHAR: It was broken. So we had an obligation to stay there, no?

THOMAS: No, you just get out. How did he go in?

BEHAR: Well, he didn`t go in. It was George Bush who went in.

THOMAS: Yes, he is, but he -- he didn`t have to stay there.

BEHAR: OK, well, that`s something -- another conversation we could have. But, you know, but how did you do that? How were you able to speak out the way you did without feeling, you know, uncomfortable about it?

THOMAS: Because they are only presidents, and they are elected by us at the behest of the American people. So I don`t feel they are kings or they`re emperors, and we don`t have to pay any more homage to them, but just plain respect.

BEHAR: Right. OK. All right, I mean, so --

THOMAS: I don`t have to be cowing to them.

BEHAR: You don`t have to kowtow to anybody, especially somebody who is a public servant, which is the president. I agree with that.

THOMAS: We pay them.

BEHAR: That`s true. But the downside of being outspoken is sometimes you get in trouble. I can relate, because I have gotten into trouble over my career also.

THOMAS: Congratulations.

(LAUGHTER)

BEHAR: Yes. Thank you. I mean, you know, when you have a big mouth, you are going to get in trouble. And my mother used to say, good luck with your mouth.

THOMAS: That is called freedom.

BEHAR: It is called freedom of speech and I use it every day.

THOMAS: And you pay the price.

BEHAR: You pay the price. OK. And you did pay the price, OK? So, like those Israel remarks that you made, and I want people to see what it is we are talking about, so let`s watch.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Any comments on Israel? They are arresting everybody today. Any comments on Israel?

THOMAS: Tell them to get the hell out of Palestine.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Oh. Any better comments?

THOMAS: Remember, these people are occupied, and it`s their land, not German, it`s not Poland.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So where should they go? What should they do?

THOMAS: They`d go home.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Where is home?

THOMAS: Poland. Germany.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You think Jews should go back to Poland and Germany?

THOMAS: And America and everywhere else.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BEHAR: So when you look at that, when I watched that and when I saw it in the first place, I thought to myself that that is an insensitive remark, that Poland and Germany are the exact places that the Jews were put into concentration camps and that at the very, very least --

THOMAS: We fought World War II. I had two brothers, many relatives--

BEHAR: Right.

THOMAS: There hasn`t been that persecution since that, since World War II. You don`t take other people`s land.

BEHAR: But -- so -- but do you see the insensitivity of the remark that --

THOMAS: No, I didn`t realize it would ring that many bells because they have been free ever since.

BEHAR: I know, but Germany and Poland, you didn`t pick -- you didn`t pick, you know, Alaska, you picked Germany and Poland.

THOMAS: I should have said Russia, too.

BEHAR: Well, Russia had its share of anti-Semitic pogroms also.

THOMAS: They also had 25 million who died in World War II.

BEHAR: That`s true. But I`m trying to--

THOMAS: More than that.

BEHAR: Yes, so I mean, Germany, Poland, you know, Dachau, Auschwitz. We`re talking about--

THOMAS: And the United States.

BEHAR: And the United States what?

THOMAS: I said they -- he said, where should they go? I mean, they didn`t have to go anywhere, really, because they weren`t being persecuted anymore, but they were taking other people`s land.

BEHAR: You`re talking about the Israelis?

THOMAS: Of course.

BEHAR: Do you consider yourself anti-Semitic?

THOMAS: Hell no.

BEHAR: You do not?

THOMAS: I`m a Semite.

BEHAR: You`re a Semite yourself.

THOMAS: I have background--

BEHAR: I know, you have Lebanese background, right. But you`re not Jewish?

THOMAS: Well, what does that mean?

BEHAR: Well, no, you say you`re -- I`m just trying to clarify.

THOMAS: They are not Semites. I mean, they are -- most of them are from Europe.

BEHAR: The Jews?

THOMAS: Yes.

BEHAR: Well, OK. But I`m trying to see -- if you had a chance to redo the comment, what would you say now?

THOMAS: Why did they have to go anywhere? They are not being persecuted anywhere.

BEHAR: The Israelis?

THOMAS: Mm-hmm.

BEHAR: OK. Why did they have to go anywhere?

THOMAS: The Jews. The Jews.

BEHAR: The question was, any comments on Israel. That`s what the question was, and you said tell them to get the hell out of Palestine.

THOMAS: Right.

BEHAR: And then the rabbi who was interviewing you said "any better comments?" And you said, "remember these people are occupied, and it`s their land, not Germany`s, not Poland`s." "So where should they go?" he said, "what should they do?" And you said go home.

THOMAS: Why do they have to go anywhere? They aren`t being persecuted. They don`t have the right to take other people`s land, under international law. Occupied land should not be annexed.

BEHAR: But then maybe you should have said, I`m not putting words in your mouth, but maybe you should have said, well, they really -- the Israelis should stay in Israel. But you said they should go back to Poland and Germany. That`s what got you in trouble, Helen.

THOMAS: No, he said "where should they go."

BEHAR: Yes.

THOMAS: Well, maybe it did get me in trouble. Everything is distorted, but I don`t care.

BEHAR: You don`t care at this point?

THOMAS: No. Hell no.

BEHAR: OK. All right. Well, you got a lot of criticism for it. How did you deal with all of that criticism?

THOMAS: We have organized lobbyists in favor of Israel. You can`t open your mouth. I can call the president of the United States anything in the book, but if you say one thing about Israel, and you`re off limits.

BEHAR: Well, that`s what happened to you?

THOMAS: Yes.

BEHAR: I mean, the Society of Professional Journalists retired the Helen Thomas Lifetime Achievement Award. They said, "No individual worthy of such honor should have to face this controversy. No honoree should have to decide if the possible backlash is worth being recognized for his or her contribution to journalism." Are you offended by that?

THOMAS: By what?

BEHAR: The fact that they will not give this award to anybody in your name?

THOMAS: Well, I mean, that`s their decision, but I think it`s stupid. It has nothing to do with my views about Israel. My achievements in journalism are a little separate.

BEHAR: So you have no regrets about what you said, even though they - -

THOMAS: I have regrets that everybody has misinterpreted it and distorted it. And you had the Ari Fleischer and Abe Foxman distorting everything. So I should have -- I certainly knew that and I should have kept my mouth shut, probably.

BEHAR: OK. But -- you still don`t feel that it was insensitive in any way?

THOMAS: No.

BEHAR: No.

THOMAS: I`m sensitive about the Palestinians being pushed around, knocked on the door at 3:00 in the morning, get out of this house in 24 hours. Three generations in refugee camps.

BEHAR: OK.

THOMAS: Pushed from their homes.

BEHAR: I see. But you see the other side of it. The other side of it is that the Jews are sensitive because of the history they have in the 20th century.

THOMAS: Well, everybody is sensitive when they are being pushed out of their homes.

BEHAR: Well, but the 20th century was particularly cruel to the Jewish population.

THOMAS: Yes, it was. And I --

BEHAR: In Europe. In Germany, in Poland.

THOMAS: My family went through World War II. We were very sensitive. All of us were there. Every American was there.

BEHAR: But did your family go to a concentration camp?

THOMAS: No.

BEHAR: No. Well, that`s the difference. That`s the point.

THOMAS: The difference is that count how many thousands of Palestinians are in jail now, thrown from their homes, a million refugees. Is that sensitive?

BEHAR: Everybody`s got sensitivity points here.

THOMAS: You`re right. You`re right. I would like to point that out.

BEHAR: OK. We are going to take a break. When we come back, we will talk a little politics and about your new job, OK, Helen? All right. Stay right there.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BEHAR: I`m back with Helen Thomas. OK, let`s talk a little politics about current things that are happening.

THOMAS: OK.

BEHAR: I mean, President Bush, W. Bush, just had to cancel a trip to Switzerland because they were going to -- they were saying they would prosecute him for war crimes. I mean, do you think he deserves to be prosecuted for war crimes?

THOMAS: I think that he certainly should not have started the war against Iraq. There was no reason. And they were based on falsehoods. All the -- and thousands and thousands are dead, Americans and Iraqis. You have to have some blame for that.

BEHAR: And his cohorts, Rumsfeld and Cheney, were at the CPAC thing the other day, and people were yelling war criminals at both of them. Do you think that they are war criminals?

THOMAS: It is not for me to judge. I think that they made terrible mistakes that were so costly for humanity.

BEHAR: OK. So you are not going to say that they are war criminals? You wouldn`t say that?

THOMAS: I don`t think that`s my judgment.

BEHAR: OK. Well, it was somebody`s judgment, they yelled it out right there.

THOMAS: Yes.

BEHAR: At a conservative --

THOMAS: Thank God they have the right to yell.

BEHAR: That`s right. Basically, Cheney shut them down with be quiet, shut up.

THOMAS: I think that nobody should take us to war on falsehoods.

BEHAR: Now, you have covered the White House for 50 years. I mean, first of all, you were there when JFK was president. I wonder, did people know about all of his shenanigans, all of his carrying on with other women that we know now?

THOMAS: In those days, only men talked to men. The Secret Service knew and there were all kinds of rumors, but journalism was different then. You didn`t really harp on anyone`s personal life unless it really affected the national affairs and their public office.

BEHAR: They kept it quiet in those days, but look at what they did to Clinton because of that Monica Lewinsky thing.

THOMAS: Well, the world has changed. I mean, the whole sex revolution of the `60s changed everybody`s mentality, no holds barred. We have tabloids. Even if the mainstream press would have avoided the story, they would write it, and you would have to jump on it.

BEHAR: Things have changed. And President Obama, do you like him? Do you think he is doing a good job? We started out the conversation before about it a little bit.

THOMAS: I think he lacks courage.

BEHAR: He lacks courage?

THOMAS: And he is not a liberal. I had hoped he was. I suppose I thought he was, because he was black, I thought he would automatically be--

BEHAR: Well, that was your mistake.

THOMAS: That was my mistake. I thought he would be a liberal.

BEHAR: Can`t judge a person by the color.

THOMAS: Absolutely. You are so right. But I really thought that he would have an empathy for all the (inaudible), what they had gone through in life.

BEHAR: Well, I think he does have empathy, but he is up against a Republican machine, and he has to get reelected. You know, I mean, he`s in a tough spot. Doesn`t he have to get re-elected? He needs the middle, doesn`t he?

THOMAS: You take a stand on something in your life. You should have principles and stick to them.

BEHAR: OK. Now you have got this new job where you`re writing for this newspaper. Let`s see this, "The Falls Church News Press" in Virginia. How did that come up?

THOMAS: I gave unsolicited advice to press secretaries, and the new one.

BEHAR: Jay Carney. How do you think he is going to do as press secretary?

THOMAS: He will do well in the first two days.

(LAUGHTER)

BEHAR: And then what will happen?

THOMAS: God knows.

(CROSSTALK)

THOMAS: Then they get mad at the press, even though he has been a member of the press. They become -- take it all very personal.

BEHAR: They get a little hostile. Who was the most hostile one, Ari Fleischer?

THOMAS: He was one of the worst.

BEHAR: One of the worst. And who was one of the best?

THOMAS: Jerry terHorst. He lasted one month.

BEHAR: Who did he--

THOMAS: President Ford. He was President Ford`s--

BEHAR: President Ford.

THOMAS: Yes. Two of his friends came to the White House and said, we understand that President Ford has sent an emissary to San Clemente to give a pardon to Richard Nixon. It was denied at the White House, and he couldn`t handle that because he had great integrity and credibility, and felt he had lied to his--

(CROSSTALK)

BEHAR: Do you think Nixon was the worst president of the 20th century?

THOMAS: No, I think Bush was.

BEHAR: George W. Bush? Well, that`s--

THOMAS: That`s 21st century.

BEHAR: Well, he went into that one. That`s right, 21st, right. But Nixon was the worst of the 20th? And so far, you think George W. is the worst of the 21st century?

THOMAS: Mm-hmm.

BEHAR: OK. You heard it here, ladies and gentlemen. Helen Thomas. We will be right back. Thank you, Helen.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GREG GIRALDO, COMEDIAN: We are lucky, spoiled and gluttonous in this country. I was at a restaurant recently, the waitress said, "hey, did you leave any room for dessert, did you leave any room for dessert, did you leave any room for dessert?" How gluttonous a concept is that? Did you leave any room? Is there more space in your fat, distended, bloated body cavity for more? Any chance you could put more in there? Is there any room, any space? Is there any possibility for more being crammed in your fat head? Any chance at all? Any room? We have got to lunchers (ph) who will come out and cram food in your bloated esophagus.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BEHAR: That was the late Greg Giraldo, who died this past autumn after an accidental overdose. Joining me now is Greg`s wife, Maryann McAlpin-Giraldo and Greg`s good pal, Colin Quinn.

All right, let`s talk about Greg for a minute. Now, he suffered from depression. Was he self-medicating, do you think? Because he had an overdose on prescription medication, I understand.

MARYANN MCALPIN-GIRALDO, GREG GIRALDO`S WIFE: Right. I think so. He definitely struggled with depression. And I think he used alcohol to -- and other things -- to help him with that.

BEHAR: A lot of people do that.

MCALPIN-GIRALDO: Yes.

BEHAR: What happened that he passed away from it? Too much?

MCALPIN-GIRALDO: Yes.

BEHAR: A lot of people try. They mix things up.

MCALPIN-GIRALDO: Yes.

BEHAR: That`s too bad.

MCALPIN-GIRALDO: And I think when you do that for so many years, obviously it doesn`t get better with years. It gets worse.

BEHAR: It`s so heartbreaking that -- such a funny guy. We hate to lose comedians, right, Colin?

COLIN QUINN, FRIEND OF GREG GIRALDO`S: That`s right.

BEHAR: Whenever I hear a comedian dies, a little something in me dies. Even when Paul Lind (ph) died -- you know, right--

(LAUGHTER)

BEHAR: Now, now, supposedly Greg suffered from fear of failure, which I -- who doesn`t suffer from fear of failure? Don`t we all suffer from that a little bit?

QUINN: Sure.

BEHAR: Do you?

QUINN: Well, I`ve failed many times and succeeded very few in my life. I don`t know if you noticed, the effort, I don`t know if you noticed the Herculean effort I`ve put into this business, and they keep trying to reject me and I don`t like it. So--

BEHAR: I know, well--

QUINN: I really don`t take failure -- I don`t consider it failure. I`ve gone past that point to psychosis.

BEHAR: I`m glad to see you`re not bitter.

(LAUGHTER)

BEHAR: Now, Greg was called the comic`s comic. Which -- what does that mean exactly to you?

QUINN: Well, a comic`s comic is, you know, the guy that comics like. You know, where people go in the room to watch him because he always had funny stuff that worked for the crowd, but it worked for the comedians, too. And he`s always doing -- he always had a lot of new material, which made new material funny like that was really something to watch.

BEHAR: I always thought that Larry David was considered a comic`s comic.

QUINN: Get away from me.

BEHAR: Because he would do -- he would have a breakdown if they weren`t laughing. So -- but the comedians loved that.

QUINN: That`s right.

BEHAR: We would wait for him to have the breakdown. You know, so that was -- but he`s obviously a brilliant guy. And also Gilbert Gottfried was like that, too.

QUINN: Yes, that`s right.

BEHAR: He was another one. And so Greg was like that, where the comedians would make an effort to go to make sure they saw him.

QUINN: Right.

BEHAR: OK. So now what`s this fund? Oh, you also you guys did something at the Beacon the other day.

MCALPIN-GIRALDO: Yes.

BEHAR: Which my daughter went to--

MCALPIN-GIRALDO: Oh, really.

BEHAR: And she said it was very funny. Were there any women comedians there?

MCALPIN-GIRALDO: Well, Judy Gold was supposed to be there, but she --

BEHAR: I said women comedians.

(LAUGHTER)

BEHAR: No, she wasn`t there.

MCALPIN-GIRALDO: She was in the theater, so she couldn`t make it, and Colin was as well, but he did make it.

QUINN: Yes, I did and Judy didn`t. Which is not a reflection on Judy. I rushed over from my show, but apparently Judy`s busy. Theater, what`s she doing?

BEHAR: So there were no women comedians there?

MCALPIN-GIRALDO: There were no women.

BEHAR: Do you regret that?

QUINN: Judy canceled! Do you understand what happened?

(CROSSTALK)

BEHAR: Wait a second, I don`t want to start a fight with you. How many comics were actually in this thing?

QUINN: 16.

BEHAR: 16. And--

QUINN: No, eight.

BEHAR: Only eight.

MCALPIN-GIRALDO: No, no, only eight. So the problem was that there`s too many people that needed to be there at the end. So that`s where the conflict came up.

BEHAR: OK. So now you have a fund. Tell me about the fund, that you`re going -- that`s why you`re here, to talk about that.

MCALPIN-GIRALDO: Yes. So the fund was created to turn, you know, my family`s tragic situation into something good for children, because in my opinion, children are the ones that really have suffered the most with addiction and alcoholism. And we`re creating this fund to raise money to, you know, to create programs for children to go and have support and have consistent adults in their life, and possibly at some point to do a summer camp where they could, you know, get to know other kids that are going through something similar so they can support each other.

BEHAR: I see. That`s good, that`s good. You have a kid yourself, right?

MCALPIN-GIRALDO: I have three children.

BEHAR: How are they doing?

MCALPIN-GIRALDO: They`re fine. They`re OK. It`s a tough year of course, they just lost their father four months ago. So it`s a tough time, but they`re doing OK.

BEHAR: It`s a hard thing to tell children, isn`t it?

MCALPIN-GIRALDO: Yes.

BEHAR: Very hard thing.

MCALPIN-GIRALDO: Yes.

BEHAR: And so, OK, that`s great.

MCALPIN-GIRALDO: Yes.

BEHAR: We have some kind of a banner here to tell people where to go.

QUINN: Which street is this supposed to be?

BEHAR: This street behind me? The Empire State Building.

QUINN: I know.

BEHAR: Do you recognize it or--

QUINN: Yeah, but I`m saying, which street is this building supposed to be?

BEHAR: What are you talking about?

QUINN: I`d say it`s supposed to be about 23rd Street.

BEHAR: No, no, no, this is the Upper West Side. Look at--

QUINN: No. Look at the Empire State Building`s position.

BEHAR: I know, that`s over there. Over here is the Upper West Side.

QUINN: No, this must be about 23rd and 7th.

BEHAR: How much longer are you going to be on Broadway?

QUINN: Maybe -- I don`t do it for me at this point, Joy, it`s for the crowd, but I`m probably just --

(LAUGHTER)

BEHAR: How much longer?.

QUINN: With this show, three weeks. But who knows what the future holds.

BEHAR: Three more weeks? They extended you.

QUINN: Billy Eliot (ph) has got something coming up. What`s that?

BEHAR: They extended you.

QUINN: Yes, extended twice. Doesn`t matter, I don`t (inaudible) the ego.

BEHAR: It`s called "Long Story Short." And it`s at what theater?

QUINN: The Helen Hays. So it`s not -- yeah.

BEHAR: The Helen Hays. So people might want to buy tickets. They can still see it.

QUINN: If they want to buy tickets, they can.

BEHAR: Yes. All right.

QUINN: Or telecharge (ph). I don`t want to make a big production. It`s Helen Hays, every night at 8:00, 3:00 on Saturday.

BEHAR: Yes, he`s exhausted. He`s exhausted. You never worked so hard in your life.

QUINN: When you give, you`re exhausted. And that`s -- I give every night.

BEHAR: Give and give and give and give. All right, thank you.

(LAUGHTER)

BEHAR: All right, you guys, thanks for stopping by.

QUINN: Thanks, Joy.

BEHAR: For more information on the Greg Giraldo fund for families living with addiction, go to nationalyouthrecovery.com.

Good night, everybody. Say good night, Gracie.

QUINN: Good night.

MCALPIN-GIRALDO: Good night.

END