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Joy Behar Page
Interview with Shirley MacLaine
Aired April 18, 2011 - 22:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
ANNOUNCER: Coming up on THE JOY BEHAR SHOW, the legendary Shirley MacLaine dishes on her affairs, her favorite leading men, and hanging with Mafia overlords.
Then Nicholas Cage is arrested for domestic abuse and none other than "Dog the Bounty Hunter" bails him out.
And Zsa Zsa Gabor`s husband says he wants his 94-year-old wife to be a mother again.
That and more starting right now.
JOY BEHAR, HLN HOST: She is a singer, dancer and Oscar-winning actress. Her 12th book is called "I`m Over All That". Please welcome Shirley MacLaine.
I love it. I love having you here. You know, I`m a huge fan of yours. I was saying to you that I think that you`re -- I would say the top three living actresses, you are in the top three.
SHIRLEY MACLAINE, ACTRESS: Who`s the other two?
BEHAR: Well, Meryl Streep.
MACLAINE:: Definite.
BEHAR: And I can`t think of a third.
MACLAINE:: Are we talking older actresses or just actresses?
BEHAR: Actresses just in general whose careers spanned -- you know, you have to have a body of work to talk about it. We lost Elizabeth Taylor last week.
Let me ask you something about Elizabeth. She was always a movie star rather than an actress, people would say. Do you think that was true?
MACLAINE:: Well, if you knew her in real life -- she was acting. Oh, God, how do I say it? She was acting all the time, of course, since she was a kid. And she knew how to be realistically and real-life dramatic, joy. She was such a treat.
BEHAR: She was a treat.
MACLAINE:: A treat. And such a good -- for example, she needed -- she had maybe a Circe`s complex; that means that you have to have every man that`s around you fall in love with you.
BEHAR: I have that.
MACLAINE:: Sure. I don`t think you need to try.
BEHAR: Bobby`s madly in love with me, right honey?
MACLAINE:: No, it`s me now, I noticed.
BEHAR: Bobby -- he came on to you now?
MACLAINE:: Oh, he left signs.
BEHAR: Dog.
MACLAINE:: She would -- we would go to dinner. And of course all the men in the restaurant would be in love with her.
BEHAR: Of course.
MACLAINE:: Violet eyes notwithstanding. And then she would come home. And we met when I was 21 and she was 23. And I had a little dog who wasn`t house broken.
This is what she would do. We would come back to my little apartment at the beach. She`s my oldest -- was my oldest friend in Hollywood. She would see the dog had pooped on the floor. She would get down on her knees and get the -- what do you call it -- the thing that you move a poop with.
BEHAR: The scooper?
MACLAINE:: You know, the paper. And she would start to say, oh, squirrelly -- she called me squirrelly. I just want a life of a housewife who cleans up poop and cleans up the kitchen and cleans up. And the way she said it, oh my God. I believed her. Of course it wasn`t real.
BEHAR: She didn`t mean it.
MACLAINE:: She had the real sensibility -- at that moment -- ok, that`s what it was. She lived and performed her life in the moment. Best friend you could ever have. I think she acted a hell of a part in "Virginia Woolf". I mean you don`t get that --
BEHAR: Right. That`s her best role I think. Right.
MACLAINE:: Yes.
BEHAR: Because other roles that she had were so-so, I think.
MACLAINE:: well, I think they were all besotted by her beauty and the fact that she really could do most anything. But how do you supersede that beauty?
BEHAR: I know. That`s right. She`s so beautiful that there`s nothing else that people concentrate on, I think. She`s so mesmerizingly pretty.
MACLAINE:: It was amazing to watch the men in her presence. I mean I had one good friend who nearly drove his car off a cliff in Malibu because he just loved her. He really believed she wanted to be a housewife.
BEHAR: Yes, really. Well. Think again. Think again. But you know, it`s funny about Hollywood beauties. We`re talking about that. Joan Collins a few weeks ago, she made the statement that there are no beauties anymore in Hollywood. She doesn`t believe that the women who are working now are beautiful the way they used to be when you had, you know, Lana Turner, Hedy Lamarr and Rita Hayworth. Those women seemed to be above --
MACLAINE:: Well, the beauty -- I mean the priorities were different then. Now we really do exact acting talent. And that doesn`t necessarily require a beauty. I`m not good unless I have a list in front of me because I can`t remember all the people now. But there are some -- I think Sofia is quite beautiful.
BEHAR: Sophia Loren?
MACLAINE:: Oh, yes.
BEHAR: But she`s from that group. She`s an older -- yes. The younger ones she`s talking about, you know, the girls now. I think that there are some -- I know, I need a list also, but whatever.
Let`s move on because we can`t remember their names.
MACLAINE:: Who am I?
BEHAR: Now, in your book, you said that you developed asthma under the George W. Bush administration. That is very interesting. Did he give you the asthma, do you think?
MACLAINE:: I think that I was just so gasping all the time at his moves. And I reacted a little.
BEHAR: And you got yourself sick over it?
MACLAINE:: I did.
BEHAR: It was really -- those were difficult years. And everybody keeps saying, well, stop blaming Bush, let`s move on. But you know, it`s like an earthquake with aftershocks. We`re still feeling them.
MACLAINE:: And I think to myself, what is this? Did he really think he was doing what he was doing as a patriotic American? Honestly, I want to know. What was it? Or was it completely under the influence of Cheney? Did you see Jesse Ventura the other night?
BEHAR: Yes, he was here too.
MACLAINE:: Oh, was he. That would have been interesting.
BEHAR: Yes. He was very interesting.
MACLAINE:: Very.
BEHAR: I go along with a lot of the things that he says but not the conspiracy theories. Those are a little off the wall I think.
MACLAINE:: Everything he says is conspiracy theory. I think he could improve his wardrobe and his body movement and his makeup or do something with the hair. Maybe he could call Donald Trump or maybe they could run together. That`s good.
BEHAR: You want him to call Donald Trump for a hairdo? Really? Oh, ok.
MACLAINE:: Because Donald solved it, you know, by bringing it all from the back to the front and Jesse`s real.
BEHAR: Well, there is that male pattern baldness; they just grow it in the sides. And then they would -- nothing up here, so much here. It`s sad.
MACLAINE:: Well, no, but Donald fixed it. He`s got a big part at the base of his neck where the dogs feed. And he puts it -- I think it flops every now and then. That top bun must be like 25 years old. I like his ingenuity about women`s stuff.
BEHAR: What about this whole thing he`s talking about, the birther thing? What about that? Is it crazy stuff? He`s in crazy land now.
MACLAINE:: Well, he`s a performer.
BEHAR: Right.
MACLAINE:: And I think he`s performing a trial run. I really do.
BEHAR: What is it about Obama that provokes these crazy kinds of --
MACLAINE:: He doesn`t react. I do think the person who said the other day, he`s an excellent community organizer. No, he`s an excellent organizer. Leadership is a different talent. And if you are really in charge, you take -- well, Obama did go after Trump for the birther stuff.
BEHAR: Well, through David Plouffe, yes.
MACLAINE:: That`s true.
BEHAR: Saying that it was like a clown and a sideshow and all of that.
MACLAINE:: Yes.
BEHAR: So he did take him on.
MACLAINE:: He did. But it was a little, well, not too late.
BEHAR: And now Sarah Palin, another --
The asthma`s coming back, the asthma`s back.
MACLAINE:: I need my albuterol. Jesus.
BEHAR: She originally said that she didn`t think that there was anything to this birther thing and they should move on because it`s a distraction. Now she`s saying -- she`s on his page.
MACLAINE:: Oh, please.
BEHAR: You know, it`s opportunism, it`s so cynical, I think.
MACLAINE:: Be original. Say something original. The other people had to come up with it first.
BEHAR: She came up with the original; she said she could see Russia from her house. That was original. We never heard that one before.
MACLAINE:: She`s living in Alaska; you know that`s not original.
BEHAR: Now Bill O`Reilly, let`s talk about him for a minute.
MACLAINE:: Oh, dear.
BEHAR: You know, I walked off the show on him with Whoopi. Did you see that?
MACLAINE:: I saw that show. You should have kept going.
BEHAR: Yes. But I mean we came back because he apologized. And it`s not just because he`s a right-winger sort of guy. It`s because I didn`t like what he was saying about --
MACLAINE:: No, he`s a bully, Joy, he`s a bully.
BEHAR: Tell me what he did to you when you went on his show.
MACLAINE:: I called him. Because I know he`s very interested in UFOs. And he`s had the courage and guts to put some people on. And I don`t think that he actually spent a lot of time calculating and strategizing how to humiliate those people who were interested in UFOs. And I thought, well, he might try to do that with me but I have had a lot of experience with it and I could probably counteract it. We`re ready to go on and he came in the dressing room. He`s 6`9 1/2 or whatever.
BEHAR: Yes. He`s big.
MACLAINE:: And he likes to act like he`s bigger. And he uses the body movement, et cetera, as a bullying movement tactic, if you ask me. And, "Hey, MacLaine." I said, "Hello, Bill" because I`d met him socially, liked him pretty well.
BEHAR: Where, at a bunt meeting? I`m kidding.
MACLAINE:: Very funny. He turned to me at one point and said, "Well, you`re really nice. Well, you`re nice, you`re not stuck up." I thought, oh, God, come off it. So stupid.
And he said to me, I`m not going to talk about what you want to talk about. We`re going to talk about Iraq. I said, come, on Bill, I don`t want to talk about Iraq. It`s ridiculous that we`re there -- and you know, well, you think you Hollywood people know. And he went on and he went on.
And, you know, I`m from Virginia, Joy. And I`m -- I`ve got the founding fathers in my blood. I feel very patriotic about protecting what the founding fathers were on about in the first place.
(CROSS TALK)
BEHAR: Right. Right.
MACLAINE: And so as he`s talking, well, we don`t -- you don`t know anything about Iraq, you people in Hollywood. And I forgotten the first time I said no (EXPLETIVE DELETED) to him, but I did. And he kind of blinked and thought, she`s really done that. And then I said it again. And he still didn`t stop. And it was -- what I remembered was that the people who go on with him never really call him on his stuff.
BEHAR: Right.
MACLAINE: They laugh. And they giggle.
(CROSS TALK)
BEHAR: Well, he as little bit intimidating as you say. He bullies you a little bit, I think. I felt that.
MACLAINE: Well, of course.
BEHAR: When he was on with us, he turned to me, he said, listen and learn, like I`m some kind of idiot or a young girl or something. You know I`m probably older than he is. Anyway, we`re going to take a break.
MACLAINE: You could be his mother too.
BEHAR: I could be his mother?
MACLAINE: And he is -- he needs a mother like you. He needs something.
BEHAR: To smack him around.
MACLAINE: Yes.
BEHAR: Ok, we`ll have much more with the great Shirley MacLaine in just a minute.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
(EXCERPT FROM "TURNING POINT")
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BEHAR: It`s so funny. Oh my God, that was a clip from the "Turning Point" where Shirley MacLaine and Anne Bancroft have their famous fight scene.
Shirley MacLaine is back with me and we`re talking about her new book, "I`m Over All That". You know, I just love that movie.
MACLAINE: Yes.
BEHAR: Well, I just love the way the two of you worked together.
MACLAINE: Yes.
BEHAR: It was just two great actresses. Tell me how you shot that scene.
MACLAINE: Well, I was a little afraid. I knew that Herbert, the director, wanted us to fight. And she was a tiny little skinny thing.
BEHAR: Yes, she`s skinny, yes.
MACLAINE: And I was afraid I`d hurt her. Wrong. So as we were shooting it -- oh my God. And because we did it in one take.
BEHAR: Really? Did you start laughing spontaneously?
MACLAINE: Yes, that wasn`t in the script. And I just started laughing because, you know, after 20 seconds I pretty well start laughing at anything. So as I`m -- as I`m feeling her and she was extremely fragile, but that kind of wiry fragile that you know you don`t fool around with, I started laughing. And then she started laughing. And then it all broke down. And that was -- that was what the scene became about -- these two old friends who couldn`t really be mad for very long.
What was interesting to me was ballet was my world up until probably yesterday. Because basically speaking, I consider myself a dancer.
BEHAR: You`re a great dancer.
MACLAINE: In the -- in the head.
BEHAR: Yes.
MACLAINE: I`m -- I`m disciplined and I`m there. I don`t do like diva trips and stuff. And so I`m the dancer acting like I`m not the dancer anymore and she was the dancer trying to seem like a dancer.
BEHAR: I see.
MACLAINE: And I loved that juxtaposition of reality.
BEHAR: The movie is -- is very interesting because it`s basically about, you know, competitiveness. And one woman takes a road --
MACLAINE: Interesting to look at that in relation to "Black Swan"?
BEHAR: Well, "Black Swan" was a weird movie with a kind of -- there`s something supernatural about that film.
MACLAINE: Yes, though, ballet is supernatural.
BEHAR: Yes, yes --
(CROSS TALK)
MACLAINE: The pain is so intense.
BEHAR: I like "Turning Point" better as a ballet movie.
MACLAINE: Yes, it was more available to an audience in relation --
(CROSS TALK)
BEHAR: Yes.
MACLAINE: -- "Turning Point" could have been about two guys in baseball.
BEHAR: Right, it`s about two women, one takes one road, the other takes the other.
MACLAINE: Yes.
BEHAR: And the kind of -- you can`t have it all type of thing.
MACLAINE: Yes.
BEHAR: And I was wondering in your own life, I mean, you`re an actress. That was a story about two women competing. Do you have that in your own -- did you have that in your career a lot with other actresses? Competing for a role?
MACLAINE: I never feel -- no. I don`t feel competitive.
BEHAR: You don`t?
MACLAINE: I sometimes do with a man who tries to control me or something.
BEHAR: I see. I can`t even picture that.
MACLAINE: Well, try. It happens.
BEHAR: Well, I mean, were you ever up for the same role with Elizabeth Taylor or Debbie Reynolds or those contemporary people of yours?
MACLAINE: Elizabeth, yes, the year she went for her tracheotomy. That was --
BEHAR: What were you up for that year?
MACLAINE: "The Apartment".
BEHAR: "The Apartment" oh that`s another great film of yours.
MACLAINE: Yes. Debbie called me, speaking of Debbie.
BEHAR: Yes.
MACLAINE: And asked me, could she please play -- I was signed for "Molly Brown".
BEHAR: Well, the unthinkable --
(CROSS TALK)
MACLAINE: And she asked me if -- if -- oh, you always work, you`ll always have -- you know Debbie. And she said, I would love to play that part, I really want that part.
BEHAR: And you said ok?
MACLAINE: Yes.
BEHAR: Well, you had a -- you had a plethora of, you know, offers, I`m sure.
MACLAINE: But, you know, I would do it today if someone really wanted something.
BEHAR: Give it up?
MACLAINE: Oh, yes.
BEHAR: Good for you. That`s very nice. Talk to me about the Rat Pack. Now, you know. I know that you were part of the Rat Pack. You were the only woman in the Rat Pack.
MACLAINE: I guess.
BEHAR: Was Frank -- did you -- have you ever -- I don`t want to jump around too much. But I`m so excited to talk to you. But did you -- are you watching "The Kennedys"?
MACLAINE: I am watching that. I find that very fascinating.
BEHAR: It`s fascinating stuff. But they say that in that film, they`re talking about Frank Sinatra, that he basically was in bed with the Giancanas and that Joe Kennedy bought the election in Chicago. This is what they`re saying. This is why the Kennedy family will not endorse it. Because they make Joe P. look like a real beastoid.
MACLAINE: So?
BEHAR: I know, exactly. You know, cheating on Rose, the long- suffering and all that.
MACLAINE: Oh.
BEHAR: But was -- was Sinatra in the mob when you knew him? Was he associated in a deep way?
MACLAINE: What?
BEHAR: Just asking.
MACLAINE: Yes, let me put it this way. We were -- we were on location in Indianapolis -- where were we -- doing "Some Came Running". I was 20-something. And I wanted to learn to play gin rummy and Sam Giancana taught me how to play gin rummy. He was living there in the house with all of us. Well, I was in the hotel. I went and slept in the hotel. They didn`t like Martha Hyer so they wouldn`t let her come in.
I would always get the door and all the fans were around and women would periodically break down the door and try to jump on both Dean and Frank. That would have been funny if they jumped on Giancana when he would have done. That`s an interesting thought.
BEHAR: He would have shot them.
MACLAINE:: Well, anyway, let me tell this story.
BEHAR: Yes.
MACLAINE:: I think that`s what it is.
BEHAR: You might want to hold it for the next segment because I only have 30 seconds more.
MACLAINE:: I don`t know about segments and stuff. Tell me what to do.
BEHAR: I know. But let`s take a break.
MACLAINE:: Good.
BEHAR: And then when we come back, you can tell me your Giancana story.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BEHAR: I`m back with Shirley MacLaine. Ok. Tell me the Giancana story.
MACLAINE:: Not Cana. Giancana as a (EXPLETIVE DELETED), you should know this.
BEHAR: Listen, it`s -- I am what you say, Italian-American. But it`s Giancana -- Giancana.
MACLAINE:: Giancana.
BEHAR: All right.
MACLAINE:: Anyway. So I`m there, we`re playing gin rummy, I`m wearing my glasses --
BEHAR: You were playing gian rummy. Go ahead.
MACLAINE:: No, that`s your crew.
BEHAR: You`re playing gin rummy.
MACLAINE:: And he`s looking at -- I`m losing. And I`m getting to be very good because Dean and Frank have taught me how. And he`s looking at my cards through my glasses.
BEHAR: Oh.
MACLAINE:: You see and reading them upside down. And I`m thinking, how come I`m losing? I didn`t understand, the light was reflecting, he could see my cards. Doorbell rings, go to the door, there`s a delivery of cannolis. I take the cannolis and I`m the mascot butler, cleaner-upper, fix the kitchen and all that. That was my job. And so I took the cannolis from the delivery person, went to the refrigerator. There`s a toy pistol on top of the refrigerator.
Those guys were doing that all the time, throwing crackers around, jelly beans, that kind of stuff. And I recognize, just at the moment I saw the toy pistol, I took it down and I said to Giancana, I know who you are. I saw your picture on a post office wall.
BEHAR: You were kidding, of course. You were serious?
MACLAINE:: Serious. And he jumped up and he reached and he pulled out a .45.
BEHAR: A real gun.
MACLAINE:: Yes. Just at that moment, Dean and Frank walked in the room and they saw their little mascot there with a toy pistol and Giancana with a .45. They fell down laughing.
BEHAR: Sure. You could have been dead, they`re hysterical.
MACLAINE:: And then they started throwing spit balls.
BEHAR: They were just wacky guys, a lot of fun.
MACLAINE:: They were just --
BEHAR: So much fun.
MACLAINE:: They never thought about what was the kind of convenient thing to do. And boy did they care about their dress. You know, I had to hand them their shirts and make certain everything was folded. They were extremely meticulous. The trouser pleat had to be just perfect.
BEHAR: You were like their dresser, Shirley.
MACLAINE:: I was everything, but no sex.
BEHAR: No sex?
MACLAINE:: No.
BEHAR: With any of them?
MACLAINE:: No.
BEHAR: No, no, no. You were the girlfriend, you were the friend, the pal.
MACLAINE:: What was I? I was a mascot. I was better than getting a big dog. You know. And they told me all their secrets and I sat with them till 6:00 in the morning, talked about life.
BEHAR: Yes.
MACLAINE:: How they hated Vincent Manelli.
BEHAR: They hated Vincent Manelli.
MACLAINE:: He has always been -- he was always walking around. They thought he was gay. Who cares?
BEHAR: He was, wasn`t he?
MACLAINE:: Who knows, Joy?
BEHAR: Come on.
MACLAINE:: We went to the set and there was the end scene, the big ferris wheel. It was 6:00 in the morning. All the women had tried to get in the house the whole time. They were exhausted. Frank, he was ultra- clean. He had to take like four or five showers a day or something.
Anyway, so Vincent comes and looks at the ferris wheel. Instead of saying, let`s move the camera. He said, let`s move the ferris wheel. And Frank and Dean got on the airplane and left.
BEHAR: Really?
Ok. We`ll continue this in just a minute.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BEHAR: I`m back with the talented Shirley MacLaine, whose new book is called "I`m Over All That."
One time I was at a party with you, Lee Grant`s house.
MACLAINE: Oh, yes. That was about 50 years ago.
BEHAR: No, it was about 10 years ago.
MACLAINE: OK.
BEHAR: And I said to you, are you afraid to die? And you said, no, I`m looking forward to it. And I said, oh, I forgot, you`re coming back.
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: And you know, and I have to tell you, I don`t believe in any of that stuff. But I had allegedly a past life regression. You know where I went?
MACLAINE: I`m with you, I`m not real sure.
BEHAR: I was -- and I think I was just lying there relaxed and the guy said to me, OK, where are you? And I said, well, I`m a cub reporter in Louis XV`s court. That`s where I went. Now, all I say is that I was relaxed and my mind took me there, that`s all.
MACLAINE: Well, when you`re relaxed, your mind takes you to the whole reality. There`s no such thing as time when you`re really relaxed. That`s why meditation works. So I believe that the first thing -- I tell you when you know that it`s a past life of reality is when you get emotional about it. And that happened to me one of the first times I did it. And I was very aware of everything around me. I remember being aware of a fly on the screen. But I was so emotional. I won`t go into what it was. And I realized, well, geez, I wouldn`t be this emotional if it wasn`t, excuse me, true. And I found that every time I`ve done one.
BEHAR: But you get ribbed a lot for it.
MACLAINE: Sure.
BEHAR: David Letterman is merciless.
MACLAINE: He`s merciless about a lot of things. But I`ve come to admire him since he almost died.
BEHAR: Why?
MACLAINE: Because of the way he handled it. The way he`s improved.
BEHAR: He has -- new and improved.
MACLAINE: New and improved version. Of course it`s somebody else`s heart, maybe.
BEHAR: Well, whatever.
MACLAINE: Yes, whatever.
BEHAR: I want to talk to you about Jack Nicholson. I love Jack Nicholson so much. First of all he`s never available for an interview.
MACLAINE: He won`t do this stuff.
BEHAR: What`s wrong with him? Why can`t he be on a show talking like you and I are talking?
MACLAINE: He likes to be unavailable in many ways. Anyway.
BEHAR: When you did "Terms of Endearment," did you sleep with him?
MACLAINE: Of course not, are you kidding? Every morning he showed up as somebody different. He`s not my type.
BEHAR: He`s not your type?
MACLAINE: No.
BEHAR: Who`s your type?
MACLAINE: It was nice when me put his hand down my boob, that was nice, but it wasn`t worth sleeping with him.
BEHAR: But who`s your type, Shirley?
MACLAINE: Mitchum.
BEHAR: Robert Mitchum.
MACLAINE: Mitchum was my type.
BEHAR: Totally cut off, like tall, dark, silent, strong type. Is that what you like?
MACLAINE: No, he was very complicated. And as my friends always say, oh, a new project. Whenever I`m in love with somebody.
BEHAR: I see, I see.
MACLAINE: Because I love getting underneath and trying to find the real person.
BEHAR: From my readings, he was always stoned is what that was about.
MACLAINE: That was an act.
BEHAR: Oh, really? He wasn`t smoking grass all the time?
MACLAINE: No, no, not at all. He was very brilliant, Joy. Very brilliant. That`s -- nobody knows. And he was always trying to cover it up and be this big macho thing. He was, though, emotionally coward-like.
BEHAR: Did you have an affair with him?
MACLAINE: Oh, yes.
BEHAR: You did.
MACLAINE: Three years.
BEHAR: Three years? While you both were married?
MACLAINE: Uh-huh.
BEHAR: Oh, OK.
(LAUGHTER)
MACLAINE: So don`t marry Steve. Or you`ll find out all the secrets.
BEHAR: Right. OK. Any other famous person you slept with that we should know about?
MACLAINE: My God, read two chapters in the book, are you kidding?
BEHAR: Well, I want you to tell that.
MACLAINE: I don`t want to do that.
BEHAR: All right.
MACLAINE: And I`m safer and better writing them.
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: Well, they`re dead, most of them now, right?
MACLAINE: No.
BEHAR: There`s a couple --
MACLAINE: Wouldn`t matter to me anyway, would it?
BEHAR: As far as you`re concerned --
(CROSSTALK)
MACLAINE: That`s why I don`t like funerals.
BEHAR: Well, who does.
MACLAINE: Because nobody`s dead.
BEHAR: Oh.
MACLAINE: That`s why I don`t like them.
BEHAR: Nobody`s really dead?
MACLAINE: No.
BEHAR: Oh, that`s so great. I wish I could believe this.
MACLAINE: They`ve just moved on to another level of reality.
BEHAR: I wish I could believe it.
MACLAINE: Well, try.
BEHAR: I`ll try. Well, I want to show a clip from "Terms of Endearment," though, with you and Jack. Let`s show it.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MACLAINE: I`m not enjoying this!
JACK NICHOLSON, ACTOR: Give it a chance!
MACLAINE: I am going to stop!
JACK NICHOLSON (singing): Fly me to the moon...
MACLAINE: How are you? It`s not my fault, but I`m sorry.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BEHAR: Oh, too bad because that`s where he puts his hand right down your boobs.
MACLAINE: Right. And there is a little piece in here -- I`m doing a stage show, you know, where I have this whole big retrospective of my whole life. And then I work with remote control and I stop it and I tell stories.
So I tell stories about this. Because he said to me, look out, I`m going to do something. And he put his hand down my boob. And then the whole rest of the scene was about her trying to get his hand out and saying, you shouldn`t have done that, and how can you ruin everything, and I`m not apologizing but I`m sorry. And he says, I`m not.
BEHAR: The best acting comes I think between great actors who improvise in the moment. Right?
MACLAINE: That`s really true. So when you`re working with a director who doesn`t have to have complete control, you`re better.
BEHAR: Was Alfred Hitchcock a control freak?
MACLAINE: Oh, yes.
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: He was?
MACLAINE: Oh, he used to say, doesn`t matter what happens on the sound stage, the only thing important is the script and the first preview.
BEHAR: And yet he made great movies.
MACLAINE: He had story-boarded everything. He knew exactly what he was doing.
BEHAR: He loved the blondes. Didn`t he want to sleep with all the blondes who came on --
(CROSSTALK)
MACLAINE: I don`t think he slept with anybody, basically. I don`t think ever.
BEHAR: No?
MACLAINE: Frankly.
BEHAR: Well, he wanted to.
MACLAINE: Yes, he liked the -- he liked being in conjunction with ice queens.
BEHAR: Grace Kelly, Tippi Hedren, Kim Novak. All those -- he loved blondes.
MACLAINE: Yes. It was a toss-up who was icier.
BEHAR: Eva Marie Saint.
MACLAINE: She was darling. What did he do with her?
BEHAR: What`s the name of it? "North by Northwest."
OK, so will you find another man next year? A new man? Are you interested in that?
MACLAINE: I`m really not interested in that.
BEHAR: You`re not, you`re not interested in sex anymore?
MACLAINE: Sex is one thing. I don`t have a lot of time for that. Wouldn`t take much but --
BEHAR: It doesn`t take that much time. How much time does it take?
MACLAINE: Well, it used to. But it doesn`t anymore. I would say -- no, no. I`m very, very happy and kind of relaxed in my life, actually.
BEHAR: You seem very centered and lovely and interesting as always.
MACLAINE: Thank you, Joy.
BEHAR: And I wish you all the best.
MACLAINE: You`re doing a wonderful job working every minute of your life. So how`s sex with you and Steve, I have to ask?
BEHAR: I don`t have time for that.
MACLAINE: So you understand me.
BEHAR: Yeah. Maybe once a--
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: Once a millennium.
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: Shirley`s book is called "I`m Over All That." And pick it up.
We`ll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BEHAR: Prince Frederic Von Anhalt claims that he and his 94-year-old wife Zsa Zsa Gabor are trying to have a baby. Yes, using a surrogate mother. OK? The prince joins us now. Welcome, Prince Frederic, how are you?
PRINCE FREDERIC VON ANHALT, ZSA ZSA GABOR`S HUSBAND: Fine, how are you doing?
BEHAR: I`m OK. How is Zsa Zsa? Is she talking?
VON ANHALT: She`s not talking. She`s at home, she`s in bed, she`s hanging in. But she`s not talking.
BEHAR: She`s not?
VON ANHALT: So -- no, she`s not talking, unfortunately not.
BEHAR: So why do this? And why now? You`ve been married for 25 years to Zsa Zsa. What made you decide to suddenly have a baby now?
VON ANHALT: Well, I`m doing it, and I`m going to go ahead. We`re going to have a baby. Look, 25 years ago when we got married, my wife told me every so often, I would love to -- we both played polo. And she always wanted a little polo player. You know, she loved those kids playing polo. So she said, I want to have a baby, I want to have a boy, I want to have a boy with you. Let`s have a baby together.
And I was in Hollywood, I lived in the fast lane, she lived in the fast lane. We talked about it, we forgot about it. We talked, we forgot again.
So finally, six months ago when she had her leg amputated, we talked a little bit, and we had a discussion, and all of a sudden we talked about old times. And she said, remember we always wanted to have a baby but now it`s too late. I said, well, maybe it`s not too late, you know, let me see what I can do.
A couple of weeks later, I went to Beverly Hills, I went to the clinic, I asked the doctor. I said, look, this is what I want to do. Am I too old? Can I do it? He says, you`re not too old, you still can do it. So I did whatever I had to do, I gave blood, I gave sperm, everything is OK, and we`re going to go ahead, and period. And I don`t give a damn what people think. People attack me, of course. They said you`re too old, your wife is too old.
Look, you go a little bit back to history, my family, they all used to be over 90 years old. Maybe I have another 20 years to live. But you know, when children -- when you live with a child, let`s say 15 years or 12 years, that`s enough. Because after that time, children, you know, you can`t raise them anymore. They know everything already. This is a different age.
BEHAR: It is --
VON ANHALT: They all know already. You can`t teach them anymore.
BEHAR: Well, you know, but you`re 67, she`s 94. I mean, it`s logical for people to think how is that child going to be raised? I mean, the lifespan is only so much. I mean, somebody just died the other day was 114, that`s one in a gazillion people. You know, so let`s be realistic. But let`s just say another thing. Some people say that this is revenge, surrogacy against Zsa Zsa`s only child Francesca Hilton, that you don`t want her to get Zsa Zsa`s money. How do you respond to that?
VON ANHALT: Oh, no, oh, no, this is totally wrong. This is sick thinking. This is totally wrong. I`ll tell you why. This is something between me and my wife. It has nothing to do with her daughter.
Furthermore, my wife decided in 2005 who gets what, who has power of attorney. Everything was decided in 2005. My wife cannot sign anymore nothing. She doesn`t do anything, she can`t talk, she can`t sign anything. Everything is done years ago. So whatever I do now has nothing to do with her last will or, you know, who gets the money or whatever. This is sick thinking. My wife is alive. My wife is alive.
BEHAR: OK. All right. But even so, Prince Frederic, even so, you say she can`t talk, she`s not really with it anymore, she`s 94. That means that you at 67 -- you will be 87 years old when the child is 20 years old. Is that fair to a child?
VON ANHALT: Well, I think it`s fair, you know, because when the child -- when I -- when the child is 20 years and I`m still alive, believe me, they don`t listen anyhow. Even if I`m 50, they don`t listen when they`re 20. They don`t listen when they`re 15 years old. So it`s nobody`s business what I`m doing. It`s nobody`s business if I go to a sperm bank. It`s nobody`s business if I deliver sperm, and it`s nobody`s business how I got off in the sperm bank. So it`s nobody`s business.
BEHAR: Listen--
VON ANHALT: My wife isn`t involved, it`s my life.
BEHAR: I agree with you, listen--
VON ANHALT: It`s my life and that`s it.
BEHAR: I agree with you, it`s nobody`s business but yours. And I`m really happy that you came to tell me all this. Do you have a name for the baby?
VON ANHALT: Yes. If it is a boy, it`s Frederic Jr. If it`s a girl, it`s Zsa Zsa Jr. Period. That`s it.
BEHAR: OK. Good luck to you.
VON ANHALT: That`s what I`m going to do.
BEHAR: Good luck to you, sir.
VON ANHALT: Thank you very much. Thank you.
BEHAR: Thank you very much.
Here to talk about the future of Frederic Jr. or Zsa Zsa Jr., as well as some other juicy stories, are actor comedian Hal Sparks. Galina Espinoza, editorial director for "Latina" magazine, and comedian Vic Henley.
So Galina.
(LAUGHTER)
GALINA ESPINOZA, LATINA MAGAZINE EDITORIAL DIRECTOR: As a woman, I get this question?
BEHAR: How would you feel about raising a child in your 90s when you can`t talk?
ESPINOZA: You know, I really thought that the Octomom had kind of cornered the market on exploiting fertility technology. And this kind of takes it to a whole other level. I didn`t know it could get any worse, oh my God.
HAL SPARKS, ACTOR/COMEDIAN: How is it -- where`s the together part come in when she`s nonambulatory, can`t speak, it was your idea, it`s your sperm, the egg is from another woman. It`s -- you just asked your wife who can`t answer if you have permission to sleep with another woman, that`s what that was.
BEHAR: No, he`s going to go the -- in the cup route.
SPARKS: I know that. But well. Are you going to take his word for that? He just said he gave it. He didn`t say how it landed.
BEHAR: We don`t know who the surrogate is going to be. I wonder if Betty White is available.
(LAUGHTER)
ESPINOZA: He keeps saying it`s a surrogate, ignoring the fact that these aren`t her eggs, either. It`s an egg donor and a surrogate.
SPARKS: Exactly, it`s another woman with working parts.
(CROSSTALK)
VIC HENLEY, COMEDIAN: He makes Michael Lohan look dignified. He is so skeezy and syrupy, stinky, nasty, it is awful.
SPARKS: Somebody needs to put that kid in swaddling clothes and a little boat and just Moses him down the Hudson where he can be raised by people who will actually care about him.
HENLEY: A New Jersey family.
SPARKS: That`s right.
BEHAR: OK. Here`s another story. Nicolas Cage was arrested over the weekend for domestic abuse and public drunkenness. Winning!
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: Look, we`re all upset about "All My Children" being canceled, but that`s no way to show it, is it? It`s so wrong. What do you think? A New York cabbie called the cops.
SPARKS: Well, first of all --
BEHAR: Not a New York cabbie, a cabbie. A New York cabbie would not do that.
(CROSSTALK)
ESPINOZA: That`s a typical Saturday night.
HENLEY: That`s what I was going to say, public drunkenness and disturbing the peace is called walking down the street.
(CROSSTALK)
SPARKS: Nicolas Cage is asking to be arrested. And we now know there used to be no such thing as bad press, now there`s no such thing as a bad prison sentence. You can -- everything helps these days, so getting arrested is actually a plus. Especially for a guy who makes his living acting like this. There`s no point where in my career -- I have to settle down, you know what I mean? That`s his schtick. And first of all, I think he`s being arrested for "Season of the Witch" personally.
BEHAR: But you know--
ESPINOZA: You saw that?
SPARKS: I did.
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: TMZ has this video of Cage and his wife in the tattoo shop before the arrest. See that? They seem to be arguing over whether they should get a tattoo or something? What`s going on there?
HENLEY: He wants to -- I want the Mike Tyson facial tattoo!
SPARKS: Yes.
BEHAR: Now he said to the cop, he said, why don`t you just arrest me? He`s asking for it.
HENLEY: Always good. No policeman ever turns down that opportunity.
SPARKS: Again --
HENLEY: If you`re on the "Celebrity Apprentice" and you look at Donald Trump and go, I dare you to fire me, he goes, you`re fired. Same thing with the cops. You don`t taunt a cop.
SPARKS: What cheaper press can you find? I mean, movie studios spend millions of dollars trying to get this much attention for a project coming out and you can`t do it. All he`s got to do is start a stupid tight in a tattoo parlor, ask to be arrested, ding! And is this -- where is -- where did they take that picture? His mug shot? He`s like dozing off. The ceiling is behind him. It`s like up shot like god level. Did he bring in his own crew from the film to do it? Look at that. You`re seeing the rafters. Like that is not a real -- that`s a fake police station. You`re seeing the lighting ring.
BEHAR: Galina, what about this, Dog Chapman, you know, the bounty hunter, he posted $11,000 bond. Doesn`t Nic have his own money or he`s so broke?
ESPINOZA: No, he doesn`t.
BEHAR: He doesn`t have $11,000?
ESPINOZA: He`s been selling off his properties for years to pay off all the back taxes to the IRS, so -- or else his wife said, you know what, I`m cutting off access to the joint account, you can`t have it. So he`s lucky he has rich friends.
HENLEY: He called Dog in because he knew Dog would bring his wife and the other dog mutant family members, and that will sober your ass up immediately.
SPARKS: Absolutely. You might have to hang out with them.
BEHAR: What are you talking about, mutant family members?
HENLEY: Have you ever seen Dog`s family?
BEHAR: I love Dog. Don`t say that about my Dog. Don`t you say that or I`ll never have you back here. He`s a friend of mine.
HENLEY: You`re right, look at him, we take it back.
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: He goes after the bad guys. You leave Dog alone.
SPARKS: Oh, he pepper-sprays people who have too many parking tickets?
ESPINOZA: He has Nicolas Cage hair from a couple of movies ago.
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: We have to take a break.
We`ll have more pop culture when we come back. Dog, they didn`t mean it. You know I love you, Dog. Doggy, I call him Doggy.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BEHAR: I`m back with my panel. Now remember earlier this year when more than 100 people got sick during the fund-raiser at the Playboy mansion? Remember that? Well, now there are reports that the mansion`s hot tub contained the bacteria that caused legionnaire`s disease, it`s called legionella, which coincidentally is the name of one of the playmates. OK, now, have you ever been in the hot tub at the Playboy mansion?
SPARKS: I have.
BEHAR: You have, seriously?
SPARKS: Yes.
BEHAR: And?
SPARKS: And there is so much chlorine in there, I`m surprised anything could survive. Like it literally, it will burn your eyes just to look at that thing. The truth is, A, kudos to the Playboy mansion for classing up with diseases you can catch, because legionnaire`s disease, lovely. Remember it used to be the clap?
BEHAR: It`s so 1976.
SPARKS: No, well, it`s `84, isn`t it?
BEHAR: Whatever.
SPARKS: Keep track, will you? And then secondly, this was from this big media like social media and digital conference they had or whatever. It takes you about 48 hours to catch it. They caught it, everybody started getting sick about six hours after this thing. I`m guessing there was a lot of nerd rumbling around at the convention center and everywhere else that led to this. I think it ended up in that pool. I don`t think it started there.
BEHAR: But shouldn`t they be calling everyone who has ever been in that hot tub?
SPARKS: No, it`s legionnaires disease. You get a headache and a fever.
BEHAR: How many people have been in that tub?
HENLEY: More than have been in those skeevy (ph) Poconos heart-shaped hot tubs, you know? And those are a cesspool of swill and disease.
SPARKS: But that`s only because you do those two at a time, perhaps three. There`s a bulk issue at the Playboy magazine.
HENLEY: I`m surprised (inaudible)--
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: All right, let`s talk about Donald Trump, because he`s at it again, OK? He`s -- now he`s talking about Mitt Romney because Mitt is his major competition. Watch this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP: Thousands and thousands of jobs that I`ve created over the years, hundreds of thousands.
CANDY CROWLEY, CNN: You`re a better businessman, you think? That that`s a selling point for you over Mitt Romney?
TRUMP: Well, I`m a much bigger businessman and I have a much, much bigger net worth.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BEHAR: Does size matter, really?
HENLEY: I don`t know. He can`t run for president. He`s not from America. I don`t think he`s from America. I really -- Trump has never--
BEHAR: I`ve never seen his birth certificate.
HENLEY: Exactly. And that hair, have you ever seen any American ever with that thing on their head? Never. That`s not American.
(CROSSTALK)
SPARKS: Burt Reynolds in "Gator."
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: You know, he`s very touchy about jokes about his hair. Even though he let them do it on the roast. When I did a joke about his hair on "The View," he wrote something nasty about me in his book. He`s touchy about it. But maybe it`s only when a woman says it. If a man says it, he doesn`t get mad. He got mad at me.
HENLEY: Hal and I were talking earlier, though, he said, why would you slam small business owners?
(CROSSTALK)
SPARKS: He`s denigrating, literally saying he`s just a small business owner. You`re going to run for president and denigrate the most important and pertinent block in the entire country? That`s brilliant. That` a great idea.
BEHAR: That will tick off the Tea Party.
(CROSSTALK)
HENLEY: He helped plunge the Staples chain and he bought Domino`s Pizza. Those are not small businesses.
BEHAR: Yeah. He kicked off -- Gary Busey got kicked off last night.
SPARKS: Really?
BEHAR: I never thought that would happen. He`s the biggest -- he`s the biggest traffic jam, you know what I mean? Or whatever they call it.
SPARKS: But you`re never going to actually hire him to do anything for you? Let`s --
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: But that`s not the point of that show. The point of that show is to (inaudible) crazy. OK, thank you, guys. And if you`re in San Francisco, check out Hal Sparks` band Zero One playing the Cocomo (ph) on Friday, and Vic`s CD, "Live from Louis Black`s Comedy Cruise" is in stores now. And Latina.com magazine.
Thank you for watching. Good night, everybody.
END