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CNN Live At Daybreak

Women on Waves Hopes to Help Legalize Abortion in Ireland

Aired June 15, 2001 - 07:14   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
COLLEEN MCEDWARDS, CNN ANCHOR: There's an unusual abortion controversy in Dublin, Ireland, today. A boat chartered by the Dutch group Women on Waves is a floating abortion clinic. It sailed from Amsterdam on Monday, arrived in Dublin last night. Doctors onboard plan to help Irish women who want abortions. Abortion is against the law in Ireland, except when a mother's life is threatened.

CNN's Sheila MacVicar has more now on the boat's arrival.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

SHEILA MACVICAR, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Sailing into controversy, dismissed by some as a public relations stunt, the Dutch fishing vessel, the Aurora, docked in Dublin. Strapped to the upper deck: a cargo container; inside, a fully equipped abortion clinic. Their plan, to take women wanting abortions out to sea into international waters where, organizers say, they will operate under Dutch law.

JOKE VAN KAMPEN, SPOKESWOMAN, WOMEN ON WAVES: We give no information on whether we're doing abortions or not. And that's really one of the main reasons for that is of the privacy and the safety of our clients.

MACVICAR: But the Dutch government has not yet licensed the floating clinic. That means, say organizers, if there are any abortions, they will be carried out using the drug RU-486. That is much more than what is normally available to Irish women this close to home.

(on camera): In fact, the Irish Constitution does give women the right to an abortion, but only when a woman's own life is in danger. In practice, say abortion advocates, there are no legal abortions performed in Ireland.

(voice-over): So Irish women take the ferry ride to England, where abortion is legal. Sixty-five hundred women made this trip last year, 28 women every day. Abortion advocates say Ireland simply exports its problem.

TONY O'BRIEN, IRISH FAMILY PLANNING ASSOCIATION: You have a whole raft of laws which is designed to facilitate women leaving the country. Now, that cannot be described as anything other than hypocritical. DORENE MCCARTHY, MARIE STOPES CLINIC, DUBLIN: We pretend in this country that we don't know anything about abortion. So that's the cloak-and-dagger way it was done.

MACVICAR: Less than 10 years ago, it was illegal to give women any information about abortion.

MCCARTHY: Do you know how many weeks pregnant you are?

MACVICAR: Now a few clinics in Ireland, operating behind bullet- proof glass, provide counseling and addresses. A recent public opinion poll shows that a majority in Ireland now support at least some access to abortion.

But on this subject, the power of the Catholic church is still very strong, and the arrival of the ship has sparked renewed controversy. It has made Claire Howlett go public after more than 20 years of silence. She had an abortion after she was raped. She calls it the worst decision of her life. She wants the doctors on the ship stopped.

CLAIRE HOWLETT: What they're doing is wrong, killing Irish babies. And we don't allow babies to be killed in our country.

MACVICAR: The women on the ship say they can't change women's lives or Irish laws with a two-week stay. But they have succeeded in putting abortion back on the public agenda here, and that, they say, is what they intended to do all along.

Sheila MacVicar, CNN, Dublin.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

MCEDWARDS: And joining us now from Washington, Eleanor Smeal is president of the Feminist Majority Foundation. Women on Waves called her group to provide security in Ireland.

Eleanor, thanks so much for being here. Can you just clarify your office's relationship with that ship in Ireland? Was it just security that you're providing, or what exactly is the relationship?

ELEANOR SMEAL, FEMINIST MAJORITY FOUNDATION: Yes, we're providing security, and we're also providing information about terrorism and extremists. They were worried that we're exporting extremism from here to there. Many of our extremists are traveling to Ireland, and so we're helping them...

MCEDWARDS: Have there been any...

SMEAL: ... we have a whole team there now.

MCEDWARDS: Have there been any threats?

SMEAL: Yes, there have been very serious threats. And so we're -- they're not taking any chances, and neither are we. We agreed to go immediately. We have a very large program here to keep clinics safe, and we're glad that we could help them.

MCEDWARDS: We heard, in Sheila MacVicar's piece, some of the background as to why Ireland is being targeted in this case. What is the purpose, Eleanor? I mean, is the idea to actually change laws, or just to raise public awareness? What is it that the group's helping to accomplish?

SMEAL: Well, to change laws you've got to first raise public awareness, and they intend to do that. They want to go to other places, too.

You know, the problem of illegal abortions is very serious throughout the world; 25 percent of the world's population of women do not have access to abortion. And according to the United Nations, that's causing about 80,000 unnecessary deaths annually from women from botched illegal abortions. It's a very serious health problem. It's not just those who die, it's those who are maimed and very seriously injured.

So they want to raise the question, they want to first start in Ireland, and hope that they can start a discussion that will lead to the legalization.

MCEDWARDS: You know how controversial this is, and you know there are people out there who are going to see this and say it's reprehensible, people who believe that abortion is murder, people who maybe believe that this is just a publicity stunt. So I'd like you to respond to them.

SMEAL: Well, actually, I think when they know the truth, how many women are injured, they'll think that's reprehensible. And so this is a very big educational effort by these courageous Dutch women and by the leader, who is an OB/GYN in the Netherlands that wants information to flow.

So it's very courageous, and I'm -- we're very glad to be associated with the effort.

MCEDWARDS: Eleanor, how risky is it for women to board the ship and for the doctors onboard? Could they be charged?

SMEAL: Well, we think not. We think that they'll be safe. And we hope that everything will go very smoothly; and so that's what we're working for.

But they've already succeeded in putting this on the headlines all throughout Europe and throughout Ireland. In fact, they're doing, right now, a press conference of over 300 people. And that's what has to happen, is that the discussion -- because right now, for Irish women, it's very expensive to get an abortion. It's about 800 pounds to 1,000 pounds, much more than here in the United States.

In essence, what we've learned is that where abortion is legal and birth control is very accessible, such as a country in Netherlands -- like the Netherlands, they have the lowest abortion rates in the world. And where it's illegal, the abortion rates go up and women suffer. And that's the reason why they want to make sure that these women have better access to information. And eventually we hope that it gets legalized.

MCEDWARDS: All right. Eleanor Smeal, thanks very much for your time today.

We want to just check in with Sheila MacVicar right now, who is actually in Dublin, where the news conference has been going on, where the ship is docked.

Sheila, we know that there were to be some protests there today. Did they ever materialize?

MACVICAR: Well, Colleen, the pro-life or anti-abortion activists here are trying to keep a low profile. They think that by dismissing it as a publicity stunt and, in essence, ignoring it, at least on the part of the larger groups, they will not give as much attention to the Women on Waves ship.

We've seen a yacht sail by the ship this morning, a group of people standing on the foredeck of the boat with a big poster saying "life." One man attempted to jump onto the ship.

It's very, very isolated. Which is not to, in any way, downplay the real risks and the real threat that Eleanor was talking about.

I'm here at this dock-side news conference this morning where the Women on Waves have just announced that they will not be able to carry out any abortions, either surgical or medical, using the drug RU-486, they say for two key reasons. First off, they say they have been overwhelmed by the response, the demand from Irish women, that they are simply not in a position to be able to help all of those women. And, probably more importantly, they say that there is a last-minute hiccup with Dutch law -- Colleen.

MCEDWARDS: All right. So if they're not able to actually perform any abortions on the ship, where does the ship go next? Have they said anything about what their plans are at this point?

MACVICAR: They plan to stay in Dublin for two weeks. They have a whole series of events organized, everything from workshops and seminars, birth control counseling, all kinds of things. And they say the will be coming in and out of port, going out into the international waters, past the 12-mile territorial waters limit. The difference now is that they are saying, clearly they are not in the position to be able to provide abortions.

We know from talking to other organization who do provide counseling to women who find themselves in a crisis pregnancy in Ireland that there have been dozens, literally dozens of phone calls to these agencies over the last couple of days. Women, some of whose pregnancies have been very far advanced, who have not had the money to be able to travel to England, who were really hoping these women might be able to do something for them, and that's not going to be the case.

MCEDWARDS: All right. Sheila MacVicar, thanks very much. From Dublin, thanks for the news and for that update.

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