Return to Transcripts main page

CNN Live At Daybreak

Census Figures Stir Racial Debate

Aired August 13, 2001 - 08:07   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
CAROL LIN, CNN ANCHOR: We've got some new information on the census, as the numbers begin to trickle out. It turns out that whites are still the largest racial group in the United States. The blacks are closing the gap. The black population is up 16 percent, but still there is segregation.

For example, two Midwestern towns are the most racially segregated among cities with populations of 100,000 people or more. Census 2000 says 97 percent of those living in Livonia, Michigan, listed their race as white. And in Gary, Indiana, 85 percent of residents reported they were black.

We are joined by two journalists from those respective towns. Dave Varga is community editor of the "Livonia Observer." And by telephone now, Richard Grey, he is the Northlake County editor of the "Gary Post Tribune."

Good morning to both of you.

DAVE VARGA, "LIVONIA OBSERVER": Good morning.

LIN: Dave, let me begin with you. What is Livonia like?

VARGA: Livonia is a suburb of Detroit. It grew up from white flight from Detroit. It's a great town. There is -- has lots of wonderful attributes, but it is, you know, 95 percent white. And there is no denying that.

LIN: Well, when the people of Livonia hear these numbers, and now confirmed by the census, is this something that concerns them?

VARGA: I don't think it surprises them, because we have had the census figures out for a while, and we have reported in our newspaper. I think some people are concerned about it. There are efforts being made to try to counteract and try to become more welcoming toward minorities.

But it is an older community. And in that sense, there are probably a lot of people, who maybe won't say it publicly -- we get some letters -- anonymous letters say to our newspaper that people would be, you know, supportive of the community remaining white. It has doubled its black population in the last -- since the last census, but it's still less than 1 percent so.

LIN: I want to get back to some of the points that you're making about how people in Livonia feel. But first, I want to go to Richard Grey. He is Northlake County editor of the "Post Tribune" there in Gary, Indiana.

Richard, when the folks in Gary, Indiana, hear that they are predominantly African-American, what are their feelings about that? How do they read that?

RICHARD GREY, "GARY POST TRIBUNE": Well, I don't think they read anything into it. I mean, you know, if you are black, you realize that. We have reported -- as Mr. Varga said, we have reported before that Gary is the more segregated city in the country -- one of the most segregated cities in the country, so that they already knew.

LIN: Well, Richard, do people in Gary, Indiana, do they strive for integration? Is this something that they want to see happen? Or do they take pride in the fact that they are mostly African-American in the same way that Livonia takes pride in the fact that they are 95 -- 97 percent white?

GREY: Well, it changed over the years. And what happened was after Richard. G. Hatcher became mayor in 1968, Gary -- there was a white flight from the city, and it was then at that point majority white. And progressively -- you know, very quickly at that time, but progressively over the years, there has been white flight. And it is not something that people strived for or wanted, it is something that happened.

LIN: So, Dave, when you take a look at the community in Livonia, and you say that people though perhaps unspoken, not spoken of openly, but they take pride in the fact that they are predominantly white. And yet, the town has established a human relations commission. What concerns, if any, do they still have about race, and what are those concerns?

VARGA: I don't think I said that the whole community takes pride in it. I think there is a level of concern. The city does have a human relations commission that opposes racist issues -- gives out awards. They have been giving out awards, say to our paper for speaking out against it -- or in favor of diversity.

There is a group called PLAID that supports a Martin Luther King day celebration, which a lot of the suburbs don't have. There is an elected school board member, who is African-American. There is a housing commission that places minority -- or lower income, I should say, residents in homes -- rented homes throughout the community.

LIN: Well, let me ask you this. How are African-Americans treated in Livonia?

VARGA: I think that the people in the community treat them the same way they treat other people. I think there are probably some concerns about in some situations, where, you know, you may have -- you know, there is talk of, you know, stops -- police stops and those types of things. We don't have any -- you know, I don't have any figures or documents or anything like that. But I think in general, Livonia residents treat the other residents the same, I guess, is what I am trying to say.

LIN: Yes. You know, Dave, the fact that we sort of have to dance around words sometimes, you know, tells us a lot about the sensitivity of this subject. Richard, in fairness, I need to ask you as well. Gary, Indiana -- how are Caucasians treated in a predominantly African-American community there?

GREY: Well, you have to remember that -- one of the things you have to consider is that the white people in Gary are the ones that have been there -- for the most part have been there all of their lives. They haven't so much moved into the city as opposed to grew up in the city.

That means that for the most part they are a working-class people. They live in pretty much the same neighborhood out by the beach in Miller and are doing -- I guess you could say are doing much better than the average resident in the city. And Gary experiences what you would expect to experience in a city that has a heavy minority population.

Over the years, it has depended heavily on government assistance, and that government assistance has not made the city better. It has kept it right where it was or made it worse, and that is up until 1995, when we got -- an influx of crack cocaine was introduced to the city. But we also got at that same time two casino boats. So it helps tremendously in terms of...

LIN: Revenue -- yes, revenue coming in.

GREY: Right.

LIN: All right. Thank you very much, Richard Grey, Gary, Indiana, Dave Varga of Livonia, Michigan -- interesting report out of the census today.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com.