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CNN Live At Daybreak
Woman's Privacy at Issue With Firefighter's Pregnancy Test
Aired September 06, 2001 - 08:09 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
VINCE CELLINI, CNN ANCHOR: A story that's unfolding in Washington, D.C.: It's about a woman's right to privacy, a city's right to protection. In the nation's capital, there is trouble ahead. Female firefighters being asked to take a pregnancy test as part of a physical, and it's making some people angry -- very angry.
The president of the American Federation of Government Employees, Kenneth Lyons, who represents the workers, in Washington with us to talk about one side of this story.
And, Kenneth, it's not just about the pregnancy test, but also word that an interim EMS official -- a woman, no less -- suggested to a 21-year-old rookie she have an abortion, because she wouldn't be able to take a medical leave for her pregnancy.
I mean, do you know anything of this or other people -- or women who have been told to have abortions to keep jobs?
KENNETH LYONS, AMERICAN FEDERATION OF GOVERNMENT EMPLOYEES: I have never heard of this occurring anywhere else but here. What we do know is that during an orientation session, the women in this particular orientation class were definitely forced to make a decision -- a personal decision, and it was made under duress and in a hostile working environment created by the D.C. Fire Department.
Again, this was a very personal choice, but they were posed with the choices of either you make that personal choice as far as whether or not you want to have a family or have an abortion or continue with your employment with the D.C. Fire Department.
CELLINI: So these women -- can you cite cases -- how many numbers of them actually that you know of actually had abortions to keep jobs? They made that choice?
LYONS: Right. Right now, we now have investigated the class, and we find that there were approximately three women who made the choice, who felt as though they were placed in the position to make this choice...
CELLINI: Well...
LYONS: ... by the agency.
CELLINI: ... well, abortion aside, should any woman be asked, who is applying for this job, to take a pregnancy test?
LYONS: Surely not. There are protections under the law that provide certain protections for these females. We feel that these basic -- very basic rights were violated by the District of Columbia Fire Department.
CELLINI: Kenneth, I'd like you to sit tight here. We're going to play a sound byte here from the D.C. mayor, Anthony Williams, on the issue of firefighters and the pregnancy test. Let's listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MAYOR ANTHONY WILLIAMS, WASHINGTON, D.C.: I'm not saying that we're going to say you can't have a job because you're pregnant. We're simply saying that you shouldn't go through training, rigorous as it is, while you're pregnant.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CELLINI: So that's it, and I'll get back to something that you briefly touched on is a choose between having a family or a child or having this job.
LYONS: Absolutely. First of all, we find the comments of the mayor, though they may be -- he may be uninformed and somewhat disingenuous. These ladies were asked to be paramedics and EMTs. Surely we do currently have women on the street working in their fifth month of pregnancy. We don't find that there is any debilitating issue here other than what the department perceives as debilitating in these women that they may consider becoming pregnant in their first year of employment.
CELLINI: All right. Again, you're one side of the story, and we want to represent the other.
This is a statement from the District of Columbia Fire EMS Department. A spokesman says: "We are currently reviewing our screening criteria for public safety positions, including firefighters, police officers and emergency medical personnel -- committed to ensuring that our policies and employment qualifications reflect appropriate life safety concerns and the rights and interests of female applicants and employees."
Do you feel like they're moving closer to addressing this issue that troubles you and the employees?
LYONS: I think that they're moving in the right direction. I think that when you consider the laws that are currently on the books to protect the rights of female employees have been there since 1968, that it's obvious that the agency has done one of two things: Either they have refused to acknowledge the law, or they have refused or taken their time in actually implementing those policies in their books to protect the rights of women. And that, to us, is something that's unacceptable.
CELLINI: Well, one final note: Ronnie Few, the police chief, given a vote of confidence by the mayor, and the woman who allegedly suggested that the woman have the abortion is still working on the job for EMS.
And, Kenneth Lyons, we appreciate your time and your discussion on this subject -- thank you.
LYONS: Thank you very much.
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